How Narcissist, Borderline Morph Into Each Other

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  • čas přidán 26. 04. 2024
  • CIAPS Appointment Letter / c6oggsom2af
    Debate since the 1970s: NPD vs. BPD: progression or reaction? (Kerbnerg, Grotstein)
    WATCH Borderline=Failed Narcissist: Intermittent Mother, not "Dead" (EXCERPT) • Borderline=Failed Narc...
    Othering failure is a defense against the risk of acknowledging the superiority of other people.
    By introjecting-incorporating idealized versions of others, the narcissist accomplishes two psychodynamic goals: 1. Self-idealization (self-idolatry); and 2. Avoidance of narcissistic injuries and mortifications, assertion of control and utter self-sufficiency, amounting to efficacious self-regulation (avoidance of the underlying Borderline Personality Organization).
    Covert narcissism is an adaptation toa state of collapse, but the narcissistic dynamics and structures remain intact.
    BPD is a failure to develop these narcissistic defenses. So, the Borderline is acutely dependent on other people for self-regulation (external regulation).
    Being grandiose, s/he is also much more vulnerable to narcissistic injuries and mortifications.
    Ironically, her constant emotional dysregulation is the outcome of her desperate attempt to avoid emotional dysregulation by depending on other people, her external regulators.
    Find and Buy MOST of my BOOKS and eBOOKS in my Amazon Store: www.amazon.com/stores/page/60...

Komentáře • 79

  • @thatbuskerguy
    @thatbuskerguy Před měsícem +27

    Man. You are hilarious. We love you Sam. Thanks for existing. Your work is so so so valuable.

  • @maryvera123
    @maryvera123 Před měsícem +42

    I often wondered how narcissism and borderline were two sides of the same coin,
    but you explained this beautifully. Congratulations on your extension at CIAPS!

  • @KunDziki
    @KunDziki Před měsícem +40

    This thumbnails are getting better and better... 😆

  • @Donken98A
    @Donken98A Před měsícem +50

    Best explanation of the relationship between Borderline and Narcissist. Prof Sam Vaknin Prophesies the most accurate information

  • @user-vi5ps4cb1g
    @user-vi5ps4cb1g Před měsícem +39

    Thanks a lot, dear Professor! By the way, have you been following the streamlined trial in Kazakhstan? There has been an open process on the murder case, the accused is a Narcissist (he admitted to be one) who beat his wife to death and was indignant how dared she die and give him so much trouble. The peculiar thing about the case is that the murderer is a former minister of Economy of the state, K. Bishimbaev. Would be great if you cover that case as the jury + the judge are to make a decision and it's highly likely he will try to escape justice somehow

  • @diamondedevil
    @diamondedevil Před měsícem +35

    hi sam, i just wanted to say that in part thanks to your lectures and what you always say, that the only way to deal with a narc is to go no contact, i am doing just that. before i found your information i never thought it was possible, that i would be forever stuck in that situation, but now everything is different so i am forever grateful for this accesibke information that u constantly put out

  • @lisafoster9190
    @lisafoster9190 Před měsícem +12

    Amazing! The narc I knew would say exactly this. He would say he was having conversations with me in his head, he would always talk about the false self and how he idealised me and would then devalue me. He would tell me that he was my lord! The repeated explanation from you today Sam helps me truly understand this finally. He also forever told me stories where he was the hero.

  • @lyndiacurtis2065
    @lyndiacurtis2065 Před měsícem +12

    This was explained so clearly, thank you Professor Vaknin !

  • @brandontylerburt
    @brandontylerburt Před měsícem +26

    Congratulations on your continued professorship at the Institute. It seems like you're really thriving there, and the administration recognizes all you bring to the teaching role.

  • @gintarematulaityte525
    @gintarematulaityte525 Před 13 dny +1

    Great job merging the egos of the psychiatry schools:) It's true that a borderline parent will dysregulate a child, but so will a narcissist parent. I think we dont need to argue that narcissistic people are extremely emotionally dysregulating. Narcissistic parent can cause a borderline defense in child, and borderline parent can cause a narcissistic defense in child too.

  • @stevenday5448
    @stevenday5448 Před 8 hodinami

    Absolute genius insight. Again. 🙏🏼
    And yours is the best humor currently on internet imo.

  • @LorraineMorsch
    @LorraineMorsch Před měsícem +12

    This makes perfect sense, I have seen this for myself with a family member, decompensate and regress to a borderline. Thank You Professor Vaknin.

  • @jamiebordelon7941
    @jamiebordelon7941 Před měsícem +9

    This is groundbreaking!! Keep up this necessary work!!

  • @cubanadiense
    @cubanadiense Před měsícem +12

    I’m diagnosed as borderline, but I don’t understand this attribution that I supposedly feel and emptiness, I never feel lonely or bored , like I feel very entertained in my own company just as much as I enjoy others, like it feels fun if I’m alone and even better if other ppl I like are around. Could I be misdiagnosed or maybe my bpd is mild? Also I don’t engage in self harm and avoid the things that are bad for me like the plague. How can I know if my bpd was accurate or not?

    • @glenyshill72
      @glenyshill72 Před měsícem +4

      @cub....
      Maybe ask for things to be revisited diagnostically,
      or get a second opinion.
      Diagnostic knowledge is changing all the time.

    • @cubanadiense
      @cubanadiense Před měsícem +2

      @@glenyshill72 most def. Looking for a second opinion

    • @samvaknin
      @samvaknin  Před měsícem +7

      Schizoid PD, not BPD.

  • @annjohnson8437
    @annjohnson8437 Před měsícem +3

    This really helped me further understand narcissism and borderline. Thank you for posting this! ❤

  • @serfnterf5444
    @serfnterf5444 Před měsícem +19

    Excited to learn about this! It could explain so many things about my ex that baffled me for years!

  • @tinasbeans
    @tinasbeans Před měsícem +2

    I’m always reminded of the song How To Disappear Completely by Radiohead when thinking about narcissists as well as the flip side, their victims

  • @awomen1072
    @awomen1072 Před měsícem +24

    Thanks for the info and my daily dose of emotional armour. Almost free🎉🎉🎉

  • @user-il6lh3oq7t
    @user-il6lh3oq7t Před měsícem +8

    ‏כדאי למחוק את הכתובת שלך מהמכתב. אתה יודע יותר טוב מכולנו איזה משוגעים יש בעולם, בעיקר ברגע הזה… באהבה ❤

    • @vibra1562
      @vibra1562 Před měsícem +2

      It’s an c/o address for his publications :)

    • @samvaknin
      @samvaknin  Před měsícem +7

      It is not my address. It is the address of my publisher.

  • @marnienowicki4077
    @marnienowicki4077 Před měsícem +1

    Mazel tov Professor! 🙌🏼
    The explanation of emotional dysregulation and how it pertains to both personality disorders makes sense and I thank you so very much for the continued education I receive at your trusted school of mind. I am grateful for the insight/wisdom and seeing how it connects to my life is quite powerful. I will be very aware and able to verbalize my experiences with a therapist as I have never had any counseling, though I need it and I am ready. Thank you 🙏🏼

  • @user-ju8fn8fu9s
    @user-ju8fn8fu9s Před měsícem

    Thank you so much Dear Professor Sam Vaknin❤

  • @felou8369
    @felou8369 Před měsícem +5

    Just wow!! Thank you

  • @highlandsmokery8421
    @highlandsmokery8421 Před měsícem +9

    I'm dealing with this situation right now- Vaknin, you seem to read my mind! Aaaaarrrrrggghhh

  • @robertjames7859
    @robertjames7859 Před měsícem +17

    Another professor vaknin classic

  • @Imskyhighy
    @Imskyhighy Před měsícem

    Crazy you helped me understand my own album 😭a dead place where I’m the only one alive just made everything make sense

  • @user-yi8cs5sb7f
    @user-yi8cs5sb7f Před měsícem +4

    Thank you, Sam❤️ As always, in great detail)
    Please tell me, if the borderline was unable to form a narcissistic defense in early childhood, will it be able to form it as a physically adult person due to the severe pain experienced? and how long will it take for her to return to the borderline state or will the narcissistic defense remain with her forever and she will be able to return to the borderline level only after a collapse? (this question is related to the fear of losing partial empathy forever)

    • @samvaknin
      @samvaknin  Před měsícem +9

      Borderlines revert to narcissistic and secondary psychopathic self-states, but these are transient.

    • @user-yi8cs5sb7f
      @user-yi8cs5sb7f Před měsícem +1

      @@samvaknin Thank you) ✨

  • @rk_777
    @rk_777 Před měsícem +1

    How does this come into play when the narcissistic son’s mother is also narcissistic? Both are borderline? It’s like the mother & son are both emotionally married to each other - they form their own inner circle as husband & wife…stalking others even after 10 years, lying beyond imagination, belittling everyone, vengeful attitude claiming God “punished” the other person (who figured them out & left) for betraying the narcissist.

  • @deepsoulsurfer
    @deepsoulsurfer Před měsícem

    Congratulations professor.

  • @ineseverza1737
    @ineseverza1737 Před měsícem +2

    I'd rather suffer aaaaaall the insuffferable pain than become "Him/Her"....
    P.S. Good luck to all of us, whoever we are.. 🌌

  • @nighteyes5852
    @nighteyes5852 Před měsícem +8

    Professor Vaknin, do you know if a traumatic birth can lead to development of BPD traits/emotional dysregulation? Thanks for all the info you share in your videos, it really helps to make sense of things.

    • @samvaknin
      @samvaknin  Před měsícem +11

      BPD has a hereditary component. Search the channel for "brain".

    • @glenyshill72
      @glenyshill72 Před měsícem +5

      I wish my late husband and I had
      had knowledge of all this.

    • @teresadvorak6145
      @teresadvorak6145 Před měsícem +5

      A child can be born under the spirit of rejection or unwanted pregnancy.❤❤❤

  • @izabelacyrwus7534
    @izabelacyrwus7534 Před měsícem +3

    Thanks. Now I known 💚

  • @lucertola123456
    @lucertola123456 Před 19 dny

    Thanks, I understand this and I agree. This is why a narcissist prefers to stay and narcissist instead of choosing to 'become' a borderline. As a narcissist yourself, on which basis would you choose to let go of your narcissist defences? Or better which would the reason that would take you to constantly choose to let go of your narcissistic defences?

  • @viktorgornistov9836
    @viktorgornistov9836 Před měsícem +2

    The hands are very beautiful

  • @roberthazard5269
    @roberthazard5269 Před 27 dny +1

    Professor Vaknin, I have a dear friend who is clearly Borderline. And she is constantly Hoovered by her Narcissist male "friend" in an on and off relationship. My experience with her leads me to believe that she may also suffer from Bi Polar Disorder. Is this possible? Thanks, Bob Hazard

  • @HadleyMeredith
    @HadleyMeredith Před měsícem +6

    Love you Sam. What is love? Similar interests? Pheromones? Spirit? Pleasure? Peace? Entertaining stimuli? Loosing control?
    Parallel universe, I effectively heal through meeting you. Current universe, powerless.

  • @CampChoctawVacationGirl
    @CampChoctawVacationGirl Před měsícem +6

    Question Doc, when the collapse is intensional, and the covert Narcissist self-regulates. Is separating from every external object a way to push pause? Acceptance of others, but avoiding using others by choosing to be alone? Healthy, or not so much?🙂

  • @PaulKellermanGiovanni
    @PaulKellermanGiovanni Před měsícem +1

    Prof. Sam Vaknin, how do you translate that into behaviours? how do you recognize that the person is not interacting with the others but with just his internal objects or introjects?

  • @miguelags9514
    @miguelags9514 Před 22 dny

    Narcissism is usually an adaptation to a very competitive enviroment. It is easy to see in show business (Diva behaviour) because they have to compete for gigs and roles very often. That forces them to pretend to be the best all the time.

  • @danmeck5978
    @danmeck5978 Před měsícem +2

    Are narcs aware of why they behave the way they do? ie all of the Dr's videos.

    • @samvaknin
      @samvaknin  Před měsícem +1

      Search the channel for "aware".

  • @aalves9453
    @aalves9453 Před měsícem

    Would histrionic personality disorder and antisocial personality disorder be different adaptations to the borderline base, or is it just borderlines and narcissists who share an initial borderline foundation?

    • @samvaknin
      @samvaknin  Před měsícem +1

      Only narcissism and borderline.

  • @alexandriablack8042
    @alexandriablack8042 Před měsícem +1

    Maybe it's because I do have some emotional regulation that younger people wanna see how I blow off how I get punked
    Mostly I inspire them and so musicians adore me
    People say I am a queen but I don't wanna rule them
    They can grab a leash on themselves
    All life lives in my head
    Lotsa minds overlap mine
    We are all real

  • @polyjb1
    @polyjb1 Před měsícem +7

    Dr....Look it up!

  • @gadohimself
    @gadohimself Před měsícem +2

    How to treat or at least manage narcissism then.. 😢

    • @samvaknin
      @samvaknin  Před měsícem +2

      Watch the therapies playlist.

  • @user-dk6ro9bj2o
    @user-dk6ro9bj2o Před měsícem +2

    Can you get adult adverse circumstances causing problems too like this,or is it only during the brain development stage.

    • @samvaknin
      @samvaknin  Před měsícem +3

      Only ACEs (Adverse Childhood Experiences). Watch the From Child to Narcissist playlist.

    • @user-dk6ro9bj2o
      @user-dk6ro9bj2o Před měsícem

      Thanks Mr vaknin. I've been watching your work for quite a few years now.

  • @JulieGottman-yh3of
    @JulieGottman-yh3of Před měsícem +9

    Under this theory, wouldn’t it stand to follow that a collapsed (“borderlined”) narcissist could be treated by DBT? Seeing as how outcomes seems to show that people with BPD have a high remission rate even in the absence of treatmentment. Would it be that once one has gone as “far” down BPO that narcissistic remnants linger only to rebuild themselves again following collapse (narc. scar)? I remember in a different video of you that (please correct me if I’m wrong) that DBT in a way gives people with BPD some narcissistic defenses to combat the emotional dysregulation?

    • @samvaknin
      @samvaknin  Před měsícem +8

      No. Search the channel for "mortification".

    • @JulieGottman-yh3of
      @JulieGottman-yh3of Před měsícem +2

      @@samvaknin I’ll brush up again on that subject. Thanks professor.

  • @anazalohar9754
    @anazalohar9754 Před 15 dny

    I don't understand one thing clearly enough. The part where borderline becomes narcissist. Is this a regression for the borderline or not? Because if I understand correctly if a narcissist collapses he regresses to the borderline state which indicates that borderline is a more regressive state than narcissism?

    • @samvaknin
      @samvaknin  Před 15 dny +1

      The narcissist starts to emotionally dysregulate like the borderline and the borderline becomes dysempathic and grandiose like the narcissist. These are transient reactive conditions.

    • @anazalohar9754
      @anazalohar9754 Před 15 dny

      ​@@samvaknin So who is more evolved: a borderline or a narcissist? Is a narcissist = borderline + narcissistic defences (false self)? Does that mean a narcissist is more evolved because he has developed a false self? Does borderline not have a false self? Does he develop one when he becomes narcissist even if it is just transient? Or does he for a period of time lose his real self? He does have one right? How about a narcissist? He does have a false self. When he collapses to a state of emotional dysregulation, does he develop a real self even if it is just for limited period of time?

  • @CarolineBolivar-ir5uz
    @CarolineBolivar-ir5uz Před měsícem

    What do you think about Netflix movie Baby raindeer ? Is this an example of both cluster Bs ???

    • @samvaknin
      @samvaknin  Před měsícem +2

      Among other mental health issues. It is not a movie, it is a series.

    • @CarolineBolivar-ir5uz
      @CarolineBolivar-ir5uz Před měsícem +1

      @@samvakninyes I stand corrected - the series - is it a good example of narcissists , Borderline and narcissistic abuse dynamics ?

  • @Nihal-oy2nf
    @Nihal-oy2nf Před 28 dny

    can you be a borderline to a narcissist and a narcissist to a borderline at the same time?

  • @chriskahlson
    @chriskahlson Před měsícem +6

    CONGRATULATIONS PROF DR VAKIN ON THE LETTER OF APPOINTMENT 🎉

    • @chriskahlson
      @chriskahlson Před měsícem

      Here is a psychological thriller movie I think you would enjoy (if you have not seen it already) en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Snake_Pit

  • @KN0132gman
    @KN0132gman Před měsícem +8

    (INTERPERSONAL) disregulation personanaltity disorder!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

  • @vmw0710
    @vmw0710 Před měsícem +6

    Wow

  • @inkbunnybunny
    @inkbunnybunny Před měsícem

    western political philosophy is explained in the middle of this video i will let others come to the conclussionw aht this means by themselves.