EDH Archetype Tier List | What are the Best Archetypes in Commander?
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- čas přidán 23. 07. 2024
- Which EDH archetypes are the best and most fun, and which ones fall short? We rank every deck style we could fit and threw them all in a tier list!
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We are back with another tier list, and this one is ranking the archetypes of commander; all the different decks you can play, whether it be artifacts, life gain, chaos, infect, or tribal and everything in between! This also doubles as a nice resource for people looking for a list of edh archetypes.
Music:
"Digital Lemonade"
Kevin MacLeod (incompetech.com)
Licensed under Creative Commons: By Attribution 3.0
creativecommons.org/licenses/b... - Hry
I have a friend that uses a group hug deck that actually tries to win and I respect it. His whole deck is built around giving everyone a ton of resources, but giving himself more. His commander let's everyone either draw a card or play a land at the end of his turned, but he does both. It's a lot of effects like that. He makes it difficult for his board state to be threatening enough to justify policing him so we all just attack eachother, and then he uses his insane amount of resource advantage to suddenly stomp us faster than we can react. It's not the most powerful deck ever, but it's fun to play and play against as well as not seeming pointless.
Do you know the name of his commander, it's sounds so fun
@@alancastro8418 Its Kynaios and Tiro of Meletis!!!
I'm literally building and playtesting him now, while listening to this in the background. Casually reading the comments. @evanshaner991s explanation of this commander is perfect! It's only 'group hug' as a camouflage!
Mill is super easy, barely an inconvenience.
Honestly its not bad as a sub theme like my lazav dimir master mind deck can mill out people but is not primarily a mill deck its not hard to mill 1 or 2 players and kill a 3rd it is hard to mill 3 if your only milling
Especially if you're playing something like Muldrotha.
Fair enough
Oh wow wow wow wow youtube references are tight!
Secret monster holes are tight
You've forgotten Aristocrats, Spellslinger, and Groupslug.
Aristocrats were mentioned at 0:17:00 as part of graveyard archetypes.
I'm not sure I understand groupslug. I honestly only ever hear about it when people bring up group hug.
@@Ironic_daemonic Group Slug are kinda like stax decks, but group slug is more concerned with damage -- particularly repeatable effects that deal damage to every opponent.
Mogis, God of Slaughter is a classic group slug commander as he provides one of those "lose life or something bad happens" effects that group slug loves.
And stealing
@@timeskip16 so like group grief cards like preators or painful quandry?
Kind of missing Storm/Spellslinger from this list, maybe this falls under Combo, but I think the archetype is more about critical mass than most combo decks.
mehatestuesdays they are both very close combo
@@NitpickingNerds very late i know just found this vid looking for a vid with list of archtypes for a friend but storm and combo are very different, combo decks are more of two cards interacting with each other to win wheras storm decks tend to be more of an engine than a hard combo where your trying to reduce the cost of things with enough drawing to get fuel for the storm count then doing somethinh with the storm count. storm decks can have combos but a typical combo deck will not see a storm count.
The list is a good idea, but I disagree with 90% of yalls placements
Matt Atlas which ones 🙂
Same these guys are crazy slivers and vampires alone get s tier Edgar was banned 1v1 4 a reason
@@NitpickingNerds just starting from the top, artifacts I would put at a C. Yeah it's fun, but it gets so stagnant, plus they are all pretty much the same. Lands C. Big mana A. Good idea again, I just respectfully disagree
seemed more of like a "is it fun to play against" or "play" tier list lol
@@Y0kAiS yeah, they said that in the opening.
Joe you broke my heart when you said +1/+1 counter cards are poop. My favorite deck is my all foiled out Reyhan and Tymna deck and it wins games 😥
Turn 2 Ugin my goal isn’t to break hearts but to give my honest opinion no matter how many hearts it breaks lol
My Reyhan + Ishai deck absolutely slaps!
Love Reyhan
I'm a ghave player -all I do is make tokens and +1/+1 counters
One of my favorites Mimic / Copy / Beat you with your own cards type deck should be on your next ranking.
I remember when kedena came out in 2019 and I built a fairly powerful and fun morph deck, there are a fair amount more niche hidden morph cards and support than people think. I think, at least since kedena came out, morph should mid to high D tier.
Quin that’s a fair argument
I love these tier lists. People have different criteria, but so far, many I have read are well thought and their positions well defended with logical reasoning.
Flicker isn't only creatures, look at brago or the new blue white companion, those flicker any nonland perminents.
Or Aminatou, the fateshifter. It paired with Oath of Teferi and you can blink your whole board infinitely.
I'm going to say that Shrines has helped to give the Enchantments theme a good win con. As for lands I'm suprised you guys did mention Ob Nixilis as a win con.
crovax 13 yeah ob is another solid way to get there on lands
Thoughtrender Lamia, Doomwake Giant and Agent of Erebos have won me many a game.
I agree with almost all of these but knowing that my friends list is basically this flipped I've learned that everyone kind of just hates everything
Nath of the Gilt Leaf would beg to differ about discard. It's hard to win in multiplayer but one on one, it shines.
Yeah discard is way better 1v1 we are just talking about four player in this video
Tribe Teir list
That could be another way to go, delve into it since that’s such a huge pool of decks
I didnt know I wanted this video until it landed in my sub box, excellent topic!
We knew you wanted it
Remember Gitrog is a lands matter commander and has plenty of wincons like desert to ping for infinite damage. Its also a great cedh cmdr.
Chainveil teferi is also a very strong deck.
Great vid guys! I'd swap tokens and lands on this list. Lands matter is more fun than effective and tokens are so much more broad.
Can you tier the color combinations?
It's a nice video, congratulations. But I think you forget the stomp archetype, what you think about him? (like Ruric Thar Commander)
Anyone have a reccomendation for spellslinging red/blue deck for commander? Am new to the format and it seems like fun but am not sure of a commander for it. Was thinking between Veyran, Vadrik, or Mizzix
Do you need to focus on just one archetype to have a strong deck?
I play chishiro and I'm currently running a lot of equipment and enchantments. Should I double down on one of em?
I agree wholeheartedly on most of this, especially chaos and group hug. The one i disagree most on is morph, Ive had a very fun slinking sorcerer morph deck.
Land decks do have a win con. It is called Maze's end. I have it in my only land matters deck and golos is my commander for it. There are more lands matters cards in other colors that aren't green and most land commanders can't play them because they focus on green mostly. Zendikar rising gave us alot of cool land matters options that aren't just for green decks and it really made my golos deck so much stronger overall.
Lands matter is insane :) A or even S Tier. Let me educate you on wincons :D Also let's assume that a lands matter deck spews out lands ;) Creature based: Avenger, Multani Yavimaya's Avatar
, Titania Protector of Argoth. Wincons that are insane in lands: Genesis Wave, Villainous Wealth, Finale of Devastation
and other X Spells are most abusable in lands. Lands lands wincons: Rude Awakening
, Field of the Dead
, Dark Depths
. The amount of INSANE synergy cards in lands is only matched by artifacts and I think if we're talking pure synergy lands wins out by a landslide. Tatyova is one of the strongest lands commanders ever.
Lands payoffs: Oracle of Mul Daya
, Lotus Cobra
, Tireless Tracker
, Sylvan Safekeeper
, Scapeshift, Splendid Reclamation
, Life from the Loam
, Crucible of Worlds
.
Fetchlands as combo enablers for Korvold lands. The Gitrog Monster
or Tatyova combo cEDH Decks. All the extra land drop cards like Exploration & Azusa, Landfall cards and big beefy boys like Nyxbloom Ancient, Craterhoof Behemoth & Ulvenwald Hydra.
Lands has a insane toolbox with easy tutors for Bojuka Bog
, Strip Mine
/ Wasteland, Urborg / Cabal Coffers, Thespian's Stage
, Glacial Chasm
, Maze of Ith
, Kessig Wolf Run
& Volrath's Stronghold
!
All this is lands matter. All this is pure gold
I'm playing more mass land destruction is needed to combat these land decks 😝 They don't feel fun to play against.
@Sam Smith Nice shout out 😊
They’re not that fun to play against. But I love playing them. Zendikar rising was a big boost to lands matter
I have a Kami of the Crescent Moon deck that has many win conditions all about "drawing matters". Lots of no maximum hand size cards. Lots of options, super fun to see drawing effects stack and do insane effects for having big hands.
I definitely think aristocrats should have been it's own item, BUT I loved this
Top 10 video: "Atraxa is the 5th best commander ever."
This video: "counters are poop tier."
With the crazy cards released in the last year, now would be a good time to remake this video.
Where would you place Mogis? Group slug is that chaos? Its not stax but it punishes for doing certain things ie take dmg if you do x.
tier lists are fun with y'all ; your talents in articulating organized thinking gives your viewers an easier time by shewing them digestable cognitive tools >nomnomnom< for when they wanna think about commander times
I understand aggro isn't very effective or used that much in commander but myself and two friends have been getting regularly clapped by our 4th friends' Winota, Joiner of Forces deck. What archetype would she fall under? Tribal/stax?
Marshall she is tough to categorize
I'm pretty sure you can't scapeshift into field plus vesuva you need the field already in play right?
You guys kind of touched on it, but Arcades decks can be so insane if he sticks. Sure walls are 'bad' without him but so many of them are overstatted and have nice etb effects to make up for their lack of power. Once you don't have to worry about them all having 0 power they become big beefy creatures with some pretty great effects.
This video was suspiciously free of tears. No one was crying at all!
You never saw us behind the scenes...
I actually really think you guys did a good job on this list you didn’t mention goblins though when you were talking tribal krenko can be a pretty strong deck nice video guys
would fall under tribal
Tier list of edh player stereotypes 😂
Oh wow that’s a good one. Any recommendations?
"Just gonna throw a dice don't wanna make any enemies" for the whole of the game
@@NitpickingNerds people who play distracted
Those might be shoe-ins for poop tier right there
@@NitpickingNerds it is midnight and I am very tired
To play the devil's advocate for control, the one control deck I absolutely love playing is a spin off Curiosity Control which utilizes Thrasios and Vial Smasher to turn all of your counters/removal pieces into cantrips with curiosity/keen sense on vial or by activating Thrasios. My list doesn't run any infinite combos, but it's big finish is either a copied Villainous Wealth for 30+ or something crazy or the Vesuva + Valakut combo with a Scapeshift that may or may not be copied. So, I can definitely see if the deck would fall more-so under a slow combo, land matter, or big mana deck in terms of you guys' rankings. I can also see why it wouldn't be fun for people to play, but I love playing removal and drawing so it's perfect for me. Also, my friends seem to enjoy playing against it since when they ask "do you have something for what they are doing" or "can I swing at you with my xyris," the answer is usually yes lol.
Overall love you guys and the video and the concept tho! Keep up the great work!
@Volrath Yeah that's why I generally use the terms proactive, adaptive, and disruptive to describe decks since I feel they are better descriptors than combo and control. I only said it cld be considered slow combo because in the video they said that control had no win con if you are just removing other ppl's pieces, so I thought that maybe they didnt consider decks that had a slower combo wincon that needs control to back it up as control. I still consider it control, but I cld also see both sides. I feel like the waters get kinda murky since nowadays we have compact wincons like consult/oracle which allow more slots for removal/interaction.
Nice video! I’m having a hard time right now picking a new commander. I would like to invest in a deck that can win any given game but is also fun to play, any ideas? 😀
I'm running Baeloth Berrityl//Raised by Giants, voltron supported by goad. Having both the voltron target and the voltron buff in the command zone feels totally different than any sort of traditional Sram-style shenanigans. Global goad seems better used to prevent blocks than as a win-con in itself anyway. The deck's meat and potatoes get to be "Big Mana", because there's no risk of a blow-out. Definitely worth looking into for someone interested in Voltron's ease while mitigating some of the weaknesses. Ramp and recast as necessary with a 10/10+ that never goes away.
Wouldn't Tool Box be at archetype and what type of archetype would Yarok be. Key word or like Value good Stuff?
What about D&T? Or is that just a soft control/stax variant?
My roommate has a brutal milling deck, how many he makes you mill doubles each turn. It took him three turns to mill me out once he started the milling process. Before that he had just been building things that were minor things I wasn't worried about I was winning until he pulled out his commander. Suddenly my deck is disappearing going from milling 14 to 24, to 48. Any card I could use to fix the problem is going into my graveyard.
Im a bit confused. What is the artifact win con? Or rather what is artifacts as an archetype. Artifacts do everything same with enchantments
Something that would be cool would be the best basic land art, like one for each type to make it easier to watch and record?
I think you should have made two lists one for the fun Part and one for the strengt out of your view.
love these guys
once theyre old itll feel like that old radio show car talk
i think aristocrats should have been its own category, storm already mentioned, weenies, cycle, clones, theft. I also think enchantment shouldn't be that low but that is just my opinion.
is that an Elspeth Conquers Death scroll in the background? that looks pretty boss.
It is, exactly that 🙂
I really like the tier list videos!!
Thanks! More positive feedback like this will keep them coming!
Does Turbo fog count as control? My O kagachi turbo fog deck is undefeated. 20-0 baybee. All i had to do was add The Wanderer and some minor grave recurrance like regrowth. It basically forces the forging of allies at little risk to me AND has the added bonus of wearing my opponent's mental state down. There are ways to out its main loops, but, combat damage means nothing to me. Which is nice.
Infect got a major injection of options with one of the newer sets. Adding a toxic mechanic made a huge impact. Adding proliferate makes it easier pay it off.
Could "Battle Cruiser" / Good-Stuffs be an archetype?
PieGuyDudeMan they both could
I'm running the new march of the machines cavalry charge precon with £200 upgrades and it's pretty good. It's apparently a power 6-7 but it does alot of +1's, flying, vigilance, Remo and and boardwipes. How to upgrade it further hmm I'm thinking fetch lands 😂 and more board wipes
@34:36 begins one of the funniest interactions between them I’ve seen. I’ve watched this like 15 times😂😂
I like the tiered approach more than the 1-10 model that has been most popularized. I win a lot with my lifegain Ayli deck. I am currently building Ezuri Infect Counters and I think it will be a solid deck for my meta.
boynoshoes like we said any of these decks can be cool and fun just a look at the average one
I enjoy Poison, Half of my deck puts poison counters and the other half proliferates them since War of the Spark gave us a LOT of options to do that and I usally do it so fast that people can't kill me in time so I've won a fair share of games. Finally, I'm playing Atraxa so not only my commander adds more poison but she is also a Phyrexian so I get the flavour win. Thanks for placing my favourite deck last on the Poop tier =3
Make a tier list for the best ramp cards in each color!
I can tell you the green ones...
is discard that bad? like just a weak type or because it causes feel bads?
Feels bad mostly
can u do a tier list for card the works around +1+1 counter or something like this
Updated version of this tier list? :)
I was just thinking about Spellslinger, where is it?
You've pointed out something that I tend to struggle with. Finding a cool engine for the decks but needing to find multiple ways to pay them off. I will sometimes borrow from multiple archetypes to find a clear path to victory. Tokens are free assets for aristocrats. Life gain is constantly restocks your ammo if you can use your life as a weapon. You want tokens to die (assuming that you're ready) they are easily destroyed or scarified--just make sure you hve death triggers in place,,,
What about Aggro/Tempo and Spellslinger?
I love how "counters" is in D tier, but it's actually middle of the pack. There are 12 archetypes that are better and 12 archetypes that are worse.
- context. I like counters decks.
I have a marath counters deck, let me say that my friends can't give me to much space otherwise i win the game by turn 7 or 8 with no combos
Not sure if this was out yet when this video was made but I think the Ozolith and Sluurk have made counter decks way more viable. Just spamming proliferates can make it super easy to kill someone with a menace/flying commander through commander damage alone, and you don't have to worry as much about your big creature being sniped coz the Ozolith can just transfer their counters, and Sluurk gets to throw an extra counter on things anyway. A bit more of an aristocrat-y way of playing it
I’ve seen some very strong wall decks any board wipe can reck any creature deck normally.
How about sacrifice for pt. 2 list?
My poop tier deck is avacyn, angel of hope. It's a control deck/ board wipe tribal that also features Armageddon. It's the deck I pull out if someone pulls out a stax deck
I was expecting storm hahah but I guess that falls under combo 🤔
My Estrid enbantment deck is one of my strongest decks. You don't have rocks? fine, Carpet of Fowers, Burgeoning, exploration. combos? Solemnity/Decree of Silence, Humility/opalescence, Opalescence/Parallax wave, Enchanted evening/Opalescence, Academy Rector/Omniscience, Omniscience/Molting Skin or Broken Fall/Any Encantress/Physic corrosion. Also Walkers is the f-ing Best.
This is all great can someone tell me what EDH stands for?
“Infect is the most difficult thing to reprint ever” and “infect I would describe as completely TOXIC” are sounding real funny now that ONE prerelease is next weekend 😂
Watching this is 2023 and hearing you guys talking about how infect won't recieve more support and how infect is toxic is quite humerous! Hahaha
Im a fan of the tier lists even if we have differing opinions on some things. Also Kirby is awesome like the new set piece.
Kirby is a cute universe eating guy!
Volrath shapestealer infect can be fun if your table is cool with it
With the printings off Tergrid and Tinybone's, Discard has become a much more powerful archetype
with lands matter you can usually just use your large amount of mana to win. examples such as exsanguinage and torment of hailfire. If you don’t have friends you can do something with jakulhaups and world shaper remove everyone except you from the game
07:40 I'm not sure if I agree on combo in A. If we're talking power-level, then it is an easy S+ tier. If we're also talking fun however, then I would dump it into C or D-tier.
25:20 The First Sliver is incredibly powerful, probably the strongest tribe deck. However that doesn't mean it is more fun. Tribal tends to become incredibly linear in both gameplay and deckbuilding.
Great video! I only miss Theft and Group Slug as archetypes, like Lazav, Mogis or Torbran.
Does group slug kind of fit into stax?
@@NitpickingNerds When you play stax, you won't let your opponents do anything. They won't be able to untap their lands or even search their libraries. You try to slow the game down long enough until you found your combo pieces. Group slug on the other hand doesn't deny your opponents any ressources. Instead, you deal damage to every player (including yourself) to speed up the game while trying not to die by your own triggers. Therefore i wouldn't count group slug as stax, although I'm not a fan of either.
Maybe you could make a list of decks/archetypes which are the most fun to play against? I'm actually more interested in having a good time while playing EDH than just trying to win the game ;)
The only "mill" deck i have is my 5 color gods/enchantments. And mill is only like, a side win con. I run psychic Corrosion because synergy (enchantments) and with the amount of enchantresses it mills for a good amount. Then i run Phenax, because gods, and he can pull off a surprise win with like, the world tree or something. But at that point im not too scared of a titan or a nexus of fate just because i have so many effects on board that my opponent is gonna slowly die anyway.
Great vid
TIER LIST YES PLEASE BOYS BRING ME ALL THE HAPPINESS
I'm a diehard control player in 1v1.
I fully agree with the poop tier in commander
Perhaps a set mechanic tier list? Mentor, vehicles, energy etc
Might be a decent way to go. Maybe best keywords for edh or something
How are Morph and Keywords categories, but not Storm?
Spellslinger and storm probably should have been on there. Seeing combo must have thrown us off
I think some of the items should not be separate categories. For example, should there be a distinction between artifacts and combo? Something like a Isachron that's a artifact going infinite with other nonland permanents, would that be considered artifact or combo? At the same time, the overall best combo in the game ( thassa's oracle into demonic consultation or tainted pact) decks typically run a shit ton of artifacts to make it fast and consistent. The two might not be that different. I think in almost all Cedh decks, there are always going to be strong artifacts, and they are generally always going to win by combo out by turn 1-4. Another thing I want to point out is stax. A pure stax deck might not be powerful, and stax has been losing favour (at least from what I've heard) in the Cedh community, it is still a very powerful control piece that sees vital inclusions in many powerful decks. Example may be winters orb, stasis orb, tangle wire, defense grid, stony silence, trinisphere, cursed totem, etc. Wheels is another point where it is difficult to say. Wheel of fortune, windfall, timetwisters all sees considerable play in some of the most powerful decks. Consultation Kess is something that really comes to mind. Speaking of Kess, I think she makes a point that graveyard decks would definitively be one of the strongest decks although she doesn't even need the graveyard to win, it just helps her out a lot.
“Was there more to your sentence?”
“Nope.”
Lololol
my slimefoot, the stowaway counter deck begs to differ
Joe has anyone ever told you that you resemble Chase from good mythical morning. I do believe you two are doppelgängers of one another.
Woah collab incoming!
have you revisited this topic recently?? mill got some good cards, and infect got HUGE upgrades in ONE
My initial guesses is that the emoji would be Wasitora or one of the legendary Ikoria beasts like Nethroi
natureboy95 wrong lol
The emoji, it’s lord windgrace.
R3-D000 nailed it
Just curious is Stax listed lower because it’s not fun to play against or is actually a viable strategy?
It’s pretty unfun to play against but can be viable
Ok. Thanks for clarifying. So playing stax essentially becomes archenemy.
Kind of, I’ve definitely seen and played in games where killing the stax player was mandatory if you wanted to play magic but that just meant the stax player was doing their thing
5 words: long and drown out game
Id like a sliver tier list
Hey Catapult Fodder I guess solved your Toughness problem, it can sacrifice a creature to make an opponent lose life equal to its toughness. It + Tree of Perdition/Tree of Redemption can kill a player now. Doran specifically has specifically gained quite a few good creatures without defender later(i.e. Unhallowed Phalanx a 1/13(13/13), that only downside is entering tapped) as well as a couple other Doran effects so you don't have to rely on him as much, such as Ancient Lumberknot and soon E. Honda. Shadrix is also a card worth mentioning, card draw on a 2/5(5/5) double strike beater.
I personally play Mono Colorless Stax/Affinity or a Serra Avatar/Chandra's Ignition combo. My commander doesn't actually matter in either deck so it changes. Instead of building a deck around a commander I build a commander around the deck.
Playing Artifacts usually ends up playing very toolboxy its fun if thats what your looking for, and their fun, my main EDH is a glissa the traitor artifact deck. My back up is Naya enchantments/tokens/counters deck, rn im working on building a mardu vampire aristocrats deck.
How is control poop when it’s one of the main cedh archetypes...
Whats about good old Aggro as an Archtype?
Aggro is so tough to pull off in commander :(
Enchantments is a little underrrated here. I’ve won a lot more games than Ive lost play8ng Selesnya Enchantress deck run by Karametra. Other than that it is a great video fella; very informative
James Kelly Same here! They are a lot more resilient than Artifacts and Creatures and if you put some money into it you can win very quickly if that is your goal.
Great list but disagree with counters...when in Simic. Good commander options like Zegana (Prime Speaker),Vorel, Ezuri etc Then there’s the good hydras (Mana, Kalonian, Primordial etc), Doubling season/Branching Evolution, Mana dorks like Incubation Druid/Rishkar etc who pump out a lot of mana, lots of specific spells/creatures to bolster/protect things with counters like Herald of Secret Streams and Inspiring Call. It can get out of hand quickly. It’s certainly not S tier but I’d put it in high C maybe B.
Golgari handle the -1 counters reasonably too.
Whoever says that counters are not good or fun never stringed Ramos into an Animar with Master Biomancer on the board and then won with Simic Ascendency on their Sage-of-Hours-extra-turn.