Is A New US-China Trade War Brewing - Over Batteries? | Insight | Full Episode
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- čas přidán 15. 06. 2024
- Lithium has been called “White Gold”. It is a critical component of the future of power storage, and a prized possession in a potential trade war - a battle over batteries. Batteries will be the heart of the world's post-fossil-fuel future.
Right now, China dominates the battery market, from raw materials, to research, to manufacturing. Wary of Chinese supremacy, the US and EU want to break Beijing's grip on the battery market. Can they do it? And what impact will the brewing battery battle have on all of us?
00:00 Introduction
01:19 Rising demand for electric vehicles
04:12 How China left the world far behind in battery race
09:00 US’ Inflation Reduction Act challenges China's clean energy dominance
11:46 Heavy metal 'gold rush' in Australia and Indonesia
19:43 Darker side of nickel mining in Indonesia
26:22 China leads the race for EV battery patents
34:11 EU's anti-subsidy probe into Chinese EVs
37:02 How US, China rivalry provide opportunities for new EV, recycling firms
40:55 Could batteries become the next sector of the trade war?
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ABOUT THE SHOW: Insight investigates and analyses topical issues that impact Asia and the rest of the world.
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It took China over 20 years to make the battery industry competitive. Not an easy job. Many companies died on the way and those survived are the best.
Nor clean. China has terrible environmental standards that this and future generations will pay for. As an un-mandated regime it doesn't face the people at elections or in law courts which it controls.
Chain has the best LoL
What are you talking about bunch of Sanlu and Polusion
@@tiefblau2780 even tesla use chinese battery now, ignorance fool
@@tiefblau2780Please get your spelling right.
>> It took China over 20 years to make the battery industry competitive.
I just came back from a trip to Tianjin, China. The city air is great. The streets are quiet because almost all vehicles are electric. The electricity comes from wind.
Okay, Winnie the Pooh.
I miss the girl 😍 in DongGuang train by Taiwanese.
But now all gone.
Work in SZ for 8 years, more and more like Singapore.
Fascist robots@@glicerioacosta957
>> I just came back from a trip to Tianjin,
@@tooltalkBecause u live in a non industrialized suburb
When China burnt fossil fuel to run vehicles, the world complained China was polluting the world. When China refined Lithium to make EV batteries and EVs to keep its pollution down, the world worried China domination. The lesson is: WTF, do what’s right for your own people 😅
So true.
And that's why the USA needs to tell China to "go pound sand". They have stolen, cheated their way to economic prosperity and we let them do it.
haha big bang
China emits a third of the world's CO2, uses the world's dirtiest coal and most backward regulations in its manufacture practices. It then exports these finished so called 'green' goods that would have been far greener if they had been manufactured anywhere else. Some estimates put the intensive output of CO2 in Chinese electric vehicles and related materials manufacture so high it would take ten years of use to cut even with that CO2 produced in a Chinese EV, anyway yet many such cars won't even have a ten year lifespan. By contrast, a hydrogen car produced outside China under better regulations would be a much 'greener' choice.
* PoohTube, end your down-vote system, allowing CCP regime lackies too much negative input on your platform.
😂
No one is worrying about their processor, operating system, browser, social media, and messaging apps are all from one country. But if the battery is from China, oh no😱
Good point !
No one in the west is worry. China is certainly very worry as it had started putting in restrictions many years ago on the entire internet.
@@magnetospin Give an example of China regulating internet outside of China
@@magnetospin Rubbish! Everyone knows that US uses the internet for propaganda, misinformation, hate mongering, coercion, spying, theft, etc
@@PeizxcvIt doesn't. On the same token, the US is not regulating things in China either.
I always feel that it is unfortunate that english language reports is always talking about global dominance and competition. China developed battery and other technology because China and Chinese needs the technologies for a better lifestyle, nothing to do with US/EU
No... The CCP saw route to global dominance in transport through electric vehicles, at a time when they were way behind in gasoline vehicle technology - and invested massively to bypass the old technology and lead in the new. A smart move, but certainly planned with a global view!
@@KevinPughCM i was in China a few weeks ago. Almost all vehicles are electric. The air quality in cities is very good and noise level is very low too. If this is China's plan for the world, its a good China
>> China developed battery and other technology because China and Chinese needs the technologies for a better lifestyle, nothing to do with US/EU
@@cityofgardenerssg318it seems like you just had clear weather. Its so polluted over there its crazy, cannot even really see the sky on like 150 days a year or so
Chinese make crap, stop cheerleading 😢
They are saying China dominated batteries because of huge demand in china.
That means, US attempts to cripple China's semiconductor industry with sanctions will only backfire.
Because it is already causing a huge demand for domestic brands in china.
no problem with that. China consume there own product since the world see there product as....
And yet the PRC is the biggest or second biggest trade-partner of 75% of the world country's.
Gai Behind 🚽
superb product. cheers from Indonesia@@vtuldague5468
Battery and semiconductor are totally separate industries. But yeah the point still stands, US tech embargo is good since it gives CN and the rest of the world incentives to develop alternative tech tree. More development of RISC-V ecosystem is one of the good things coming out of the tech war for example.
@@hikashia.halfiah3582 no, this is the reason domestic alternatives struggled to develop in china. Because there was never demand for them, foreign brands absolutely dominated Chinese Market, making it difficult for domestic brands to thrive.
Now that foreign brands have been sanctioned, and have left a massive void in China's semi conductor market, this has created huge demand for domestic brands.
A big opportunity for Chinese companies to develop and grow....
5:30 Sun Tzu (Art of War) says "Fight where the Enemy are not."
Applied to car industry: "Do not compete in ICE cars where the competitor is strong; compete in EVs where the competitor is weak."
所以美国军方禁止了'sun'
China: I have batteries
USA: I have money to buy your crap so you can afford your rat and bat soup
Jobs: Don't do it better. Do it differently.
@@Paccekabuddhayou mean the US can borrow more money
@@yunko9369 i meant two or three perspectives you only have one
Your restriction means “national security”; Chinese restrictions means “economic cohesion”. Trade is mutual agreeable exchanges! If you think unfair, don’t trade! No other reasons!
More competition is good, whatever happens, it is good for human race, it is better to compete on economy than on battlefield.
>> More competition is good,
Competition will benefit customers..but sabotage like what the west is doing..will be a self inflicted wound.
Some might disagree with that. Battlefield might be better overall, since it reduce inefficiency by reducing human population (within certain limit) and other excess. Moreover, war seems to accelerate tech development. Brutal? Yes. Irrational? Not really.
@@hikashia.halfiah3582well, as long as you are not sacrificed in the war.
@@hyuxion Can only leave that to luck. In the end, some things are beyond one's control.
Batteries are the new oil. Except their control is not given by geography. It is given by supply chain management, technological excellence, technical investment and market size.
I think in a way it's still geography. Very few places in the world is commercially viable to mine and refine lithium, nickel, cobalt and rare-earth metals. Comparatively, oil reserves are actually far more spread out in the world. Both the world's largest production of lithium and rare-earth metals are located in China, and now with the world's largest production capacity for batteries, they basically got everyone in the world by the balls if EVs become the primary mode of transportation.
Mining is geographically specific.
They are not the new oil. Batteries are not an energy source.
@@hyphen2612 Basically China is a processor of rare earths because the process is dirty and terribly polluting but the CCP can leverage the absence of Democracy and environmental standards to pollute and corner the market.
Right, China only leads in rare earth refining because they're willing to sacrifice their water and agricultural security to be there.
In China the government rolled out red carpet to give preferential treatment for Tesla to build a Giga EV factory in Shanghai. The government removed all road blocks to allow Tesla to build a Giga Factory in less than a year while giving Tesla all the incentives and subsidies enjoyed by any other Chinese EV makers. This happened when China's EV Industry was relatively quite weak. But Beijing was not shying away from American competition. Today, half of esla's global EV revenue comes from the Shanghai Factory.
Now in the US, they are doing everything they can to block anything from China! Dsicounting the incredible amount of profit Tesla has made for the past 10 years from the support from China!
Where is the spirit of free market competition which is one of America's core values? The distinctly difference in behaviors of the two superpowers have not been lost in the eyes of the rest of the world. The US is showing classic signs of the decline of a once great country where free market capitalism roamed free. Now it is grabbing at the straw.
There shouldn't be trade wars. Also, any war, once started can not be stopped easily. Trade is win-win voluntary, then why weaponize it with sanctions?
-- The Chinese perspective.
因为美国无法从军事上战胜中国，所以它们选择了经济制裁
I power my whole tiny house with a lfp pack the size of two cartons of beer, it only has 100wh per kilo of energy density but it is still amazing, 4 years later and I can get double that for the same weight and space for less money. Nearly double that density again is already available at the high end with even higher densities coming into mass production in the near future. With everything going on in the world being almost all bad energy storage and solar is one of the few very positive things to emerge.
1-11-2023 Buffett’s think tank Munger: China’s economic prospects in the next 20 years will be better than those of any other major country
A super documentary without taking sided and telling it how it is 🌟🌟🌟🌟
Very informative, thank you
amazing report !
Economic wars has been going on for thousand of years so we should expect this.
Look like CNA received October month salary on the time!
Excellent documentary - good overview of battery industry, touching on politics but not over emphasis like other reports. A diverse opinion of experts and avoidance of social proof and group think by dominant individuals.
Among all the homework submitted to achieve the goal of net zero, China has done the best.
BYD name came from Yadi Rd in Shenzhen where the company was once making stuff like batteries for consumer products.. Not from 'Build Your Dreams'. They just added a Bi in front of Yadi to be nearer the top of the alphabet.
Of the 10 largest EV battery manufacturers, 6 are Chinese accounting for over 62% of the world's production. CATL and BYD are the top 2 battery manufacturers, their combined output is 52% of the world's total. The remaining companies in top ten list are 3 Korean and 1 Japanese manufacturers.
The Chinese also dominate in the manufacturing of cathode and anode materials. They supply 90% of the cathode and 70% of the anode materials. These are vital in the manufacturing of the EV batteries.
CATL has a factory in Germany to supply EV battery to Tesla Berlin and other German auto manufacturers. It has also set up a factory in Hungary.
These Chinese battery companies control most of critical patterns too.
Indonesia is smart. Trying to learn to process the raw material unlike Australia which too lazy to do anything apart from exporting the raw material. Iron Ore and wool is one of the prime example.
Indonesia needs to crack down harder on enforcement though. One of the complaints that my Indo colleagues mentioned was how much China was taking out raw nickel ore instead of domestically refined nickel as had been agreed on.
The world should really focus on getting the battery minerals from the nodules on the ocean floor. Plenty there and with a lot less destruction than is associated with mining on land.
cost a lot to retrieve from deep ocean and damage ocean eco system.
dumb idea
确实，现在人都忘了海底结矿石
Lithium conversion process requires economy of scale to be efficient and profitable and it’s not environmental friendly, hence the reason why it moved to China, the dirty factory for the west. As China grows economy and no longer need to trade environment for income, there is a movement toward sodium ion battery which is more abundant, cheaper, longer life and environmentally friendlier than lithium. Both BYD and CATL have started producing sodium ion battery and BYD just rolls out Seagull, a small entry level EV, with sodium ion battery option. Dongfeng also pioneered similar offering. The importance of lithium may become like dependency on coal, decreases as technology advances.
>>. environmental friendly, hence the reason why it moved to China >, there is a movement toward sodium ion battery which is more abundant, cheaper, longer life and environmentally friendlier than lithium.
Nope lithium is here to stay. CATL has announced developing 500w/kg battery while their sodium is 250w/kg.
Lithium will still be important in weight-sensitive applications like cars, but at least things like facility power backup systems won't have to compete for that lithium when sodium ion batteries hit the market.
excellent report👍
Chinese manufacturers are the runaway leaders in batteries and EVs. Given the scale of production already achieved, it’s next to impossible for any other country to catch up.
The demise of the traditional mass market ICE vehicle manufacturers is already written on the wall
you do realize - their governments gave them the investment capital to do this. So its not a like for like comparison. Also - EVs are 100% not the only clean fuel tech. Lithium / Cobalt used in batteries are very limited in supply so Honda Toyota GM and co are all looking at alternate fuels. And MANY will not buy an EV because they are too expensive + depreciation is high
>> Chinese manufacturers are the runaway leaders in batteries and EVs.
I believe in EV power, but it still has it's flaws. Extreme temperature hurts the battery performance and they can not do well in pulling heavy things. Big trucks, trains, ships, and planes need to still be on oil
it seems like china is always one step ahead of the world.
Great details, few points had miss out. Both country had put in huge investment in batteries manufacturing.
During 2021 China had new road map till 2025.
Battery production would double of 2023 compare to previous year and 2024 would be further increase and 2025 would double capacity of 2023 as whole combine.
This number really scary as the amount raw material required so huge. In China they not focus on EV, other product gadgets, toys batteries production been expending rapidly.
Another is local equipment/machine battery manufacturing been developed rapid for high demand of batteries maker.
😢😢 If there is enough market, we can also increase production tenfold in one year!
We love the sound of money bags, save us!
>> Great details, few points had miss out. Both country had put in huge investment in batteries manufacturing. > This number really scary as the amount raw material required so huge. > Another is local equipment/machine battery manufacturing been developed rapid for high demand of batteries maker.
Note: China has stopped all subsidies since Jan 2023, because the EV market is already mature and competitive enough (Fierce competition in domestic market cross dozens of brands).
The EU keeps targeting China about subsidies, which is not fair (cuz they have been doing more heavily subsidies 😂, check France)
Also because there's a glut of EVs that China is trying to dump abroad before their not so stellar build quality as cars catches up to their brand reputation. Domestic consumers aren't snatching them up as quickly anymore because their consumer confidence cratered on top of issues like lack of working chargers and legal parking spots.
>> Note: China has stopped all subsidies since Jan 2023,
Yeah, you are spot on. To add, the EU heavily subsidises its agriculture sector and make its produce very competitive in the African market, which resulted in challenges to small scale African farmers. However when China subsidises its EV industry at its nascent phase, EU bureaucrats cry foul. What EU does not say out loud is that they are desperate to protect their internal combustion engine vehicles industry supply chain, although they always exhort all kinds of climate change rhetoric. The EU has become an organisation in cognitive dissonance, really.
@@tooltalk I see you in many comment sections, how much are you paid to smear China? You think people don't search for data? Just listening to you in here bala Bala
Amazing insights and exchange of education, this is the way forward in cultural relationships....you are defining how international relationships and environmental education relates and is important to us all. You are doing a very good thing being an ambassador in this field...much more important than the people that rule and cause world problems i.e warring and dividing nations hell bent on causing war and division..
May Great almightly universal spirit shine through you.❤🙏
have yet to see them do an in-depth report on unjust extraction of raw mineral energy resources from African nations by the Imperial Collective West for their own benefits, for decades if not centuries
i hope mining in indonesia dont destroy the envirentmont and can make the people of indonesia prosper
bissmillah we as people will guide it thank for CNA
please expose more of things like this in indonesia we indonesian thanksfull for that
we want to be defelop country but by not destroying our land and people
Muito engraçado ver Br falando inglês. Tu reconhece na hora.
O legal é que as questões ambientais não foram levantadas na Austrália..
At this rate, China will dominate vehicles and batteries by 2030. The EU, US, Japan are too slow because they want to protect the interest of the old, ageing companies of decades ago. I've seen passenger cars from China that are good at a cheap price. It is just a matter of time for Chinese companies to expand car sales in other countries
Chjna should stop the need to try and be the best at everything. China's success has only been for the last 20-30 years. I applaud their success, but much of it is inflated by the CCP. All their stare released numbers are totally false. Just like they claim to be the world leader in Green Tech, while polluting more than every other country put together. It's a smokescreen to pump up sales and boy do they need sales. If China continues on this CCP course, their future is more grim than their present.
Already dominates batteries, wind turbines, PV, chip production,... science, research, engineering and construction in general.
Asia,Africa, South and Central America as well as Slavic countries are way more relevant partners to China than the USA and Western Europe...who still suffer from the delusion of grandeur to be competitive.
That's what laws are for.
not a fan of ev where you need to charge, battery swap like Nio is way better solution
It is not just about technology but ecosystem. China has built up the most complete manufacturing supply chain and ecosystem to design and build batteries and EVs. Go visit the modern Chinese factories and you would be shocked by how automated and digitalized they are. As a result, the Chinese will be able to produce goods that are cheaper, higher quality and also do that in a more flexible way.
>> China has built up the most complete manufacturing supply chain and ecosystem to design and build batteries and EVs
Hope so!
Thanks for this film.
Its not surprise if one day we will be a part of the battery for full stretch of our long life on the medical alternative .
I just got test drive the huawei' wenjie M7 SUV (ADS 2.0 auto diving system) in China last month ,it beat every EV including Tesla's .that is the really tech breakthrough
Electrifying
It's awesome to watch the US desperately trying to keep up with China!
But you will never catch up with someone who is running even faster
Really? The ignorance LOL
America could if they wanted to. They are still richer than china
Battery Tech isn't hard lol. Lithium batteries have been around for a long time. Its a commodity unlike semiconductors and it's tech.
@@rv8804 The tech itself could be not as difficult, but the production chain that can produce positive cash flow is on a different level. Logistics, upstream and downstream, raw materials, and so on, these are not things that can be built in a day.
China is very strategic and thinks long term. It's dominance in key industries is only going to grow. Not only is it dominating the new energy vehicles but it's also dominant in ship building. You can't have world trade and supply chains without ships. Everywhere you look China is dominant. I should start learning Chinese.
Once China gets hold of a tech, there is no stopping them. This is done, US won't be able to compete. AT best they can stop Chinese from selling the battery within US, but their own production will be costly and inefficient. eg., the recent CATL plant is 90% automatic.
50 cents
@@Waverlyduli who listens to such retarded music? Gadha.
It's bully.
when only one side(U$A) can change the rules.
NOT a competition .
Just like your classmate(U$A) use his family power to force the stationary shop(ASML) not to sell stationary to you(China).
--> Huawei , IC chip , ...
We should make cow-dung batteries 😂😂😂
hope it’s worth it
BYD is in trouble. This video is already out of date
Problem is the US has neither the scale, speed, low cost structure, political agility, nor labor expertise to compete against a well greased manufacturing giant that’s 5 times bigger.
lol - your 100000% WRONG
in the meantime, US has no desire to relinquish its control on chip related products, software, and machines to China.
🤗👏👏👏👍💪🙏 regards from 🇲🇾 with ❤️
Very good. Gs
Batteries is a dirty business. Is this really a cleantech revolution?
Where did gunpowder, silk, and noodles come from?
China is still stuck in 2000BC.
1:30 True salesman.
Batteries will be the new commodity.
Fascinating how all mining pollution worldwide is caused by Chinese financed battery miners, while mining for oil by companies based in the "free 😅" world are totally without effects.
It’s called Historical amnesia
Bullshit.
@@RickL_was_here Nope!
Speak facts, you're spewing bullshit and you know it.
@@RickL_was_here Curious about which point you disagree with? You think oil exploration is completely innocuous environmentally? 😳😳😳
Thank you Jerry for Discover, the rich countries ugly plan
Hope that oneday our 20um/50um Nacl salt or Na2co3 powder could become a common material for Na-ion batteries.
Why not use and develop high-brid capacitors.
Australia has hung its hat on a falling star -- USA.
I just had my first EV and it was a choice between Tesla model S, Hyundai Ioniq , BYD and MG4, VW ID.3 I chose MG4 long range. Iti s fun to drive (almost like driving an audi/bmw) and the price is reasonable. The software is bit buggy as expected among Chinese cars but it is not a big deal. Tesla is of course, better in this but when buying an electric car, the most important is Range , Battery longevity, Charging points and bang for the buck. It depends really on your preference.
Over batteries, over chips, over toilet paper, over settlement currency, over China's not buying Treasuries, over China's relative influence in Middle East and Africa, over everything. For the US dispute is a way of life.
Agree 💯
Warren Buffett has sold his BYD shares. The company looks good on the outside, but there is more to it. Same for Tesla.
Not all batteries with potential can be used, the technology has to be economically feasible.
We all knew these years of peace in SEA is because that empire busy in Middle East for 20years.
Empire focus on Middle East , BOOOOM !
Empire focus on Europe , BOOOOM !
Now that Empire focus on Asia ...😨
Brilliant!!!
- The West: Climate change.
- China: Sure. EVs, Solar Panels, etc.
- The West: You dominate batteries and Solar PVs!
- China: ?
Green energy is a scams though 😅
😂
Transportation of metal industry from space planet
Planet of space mental.
So Singaporeans are worrying about the threaten imposed by China's battery industry which are damaging American potential dominance over EV industry?
I'm from SG. I'm sorry. My English is too poor to understand what you are trying to ask. Singapore has always had neutral stance regarding China and America. It doesn't matter who wins so long we can continue to do business so that she can continue to survive and thrive. This is broadly similar to the rest of Asean with the potential exception of PH.
@@Highwind79 Most of news about China from CNA are biased and negative, is CNA the mainstream news media in Singapore?
If you choose to see the positive, then its positive. If you choose to see negative, then its negative. You are right to your opinion of cos.
There are also pieces where other's complain they are too pro China. Even in this piece, you can see there are some that says we are pro China.
If you have people complaining on both sides almost equally ( it's almost impossible to be equal all the time), I think we are ok.
Soo BYD is warren buffet backed EV.
Now i see why Wallstreet is fully "on board" with muh electric.
Warren just sold his stock in byd 😂
@@rv8804 so WW3 is on the table?
One country domintae the social media, finanace, armies
Sliver titanium and other metals need for industry
I personally do not think honda and toyota and eu brands will want to be losing in this game. They will come out wt new battery
Posted on 31st May 2023.
10.30 That lady talk BS. Which country practise economic coercion most.
Cowards fear level field competition.
It is good from environmental considerations.
why did you question china's domination in the battery industry? why do you never question US dominance in printing money causing world economic crisis? Bias
printing money? lol ignorance excuses no one.
@@vtuldague5468What do you think US does and how do you think they fund over 850 military bases in not by printing money?
@@DineshTwanabasu all countries prints money but not to the point of recession. Go back to your economics 101 boy
@@vtuldague5468 Learn world economics man. US prints $$ which must be accepted around the world else you know what happened to Saddam and Gaddafi.
US prints $$ and wold has to accept which means they donot have to sell anything to get $$. Other countries have to sell either goods or give service to get $$$ as $$ is the world reserve currency.
India prints indian rupees which they cannot use to buy goods from around the world.
So learn first, you are at elementary school regarding world financial system.
@@DineshTwanabasu read again my comment boy, I think you have a problem on comprehension. Goggle is open lol
You call that anonymity?
super capacitor batteries will take over in my opinion
Why don’t these countries fight over job creation, better quality of life, better housing, better health care, … instead a oil-power-car super power fight over other battery-power-car industry from oil-power-car industry…
Chinese should work on their public bathrooms those things are a disaster. I thought NYC subway bathrooms were the worst until I unfortunately went into one in Beijing out of desperation.
Recently, China bans graphite in retaliation of US enhanced chip ban. For any country wanting to make battery, it needs a few years to manufacture graphite for their batteries, however for neodymium and praseodymium , it could take them 5-10 years to research, process and enrich these rare earth for their magnets.
Space planet industry...... bring to the metal to earth
So much electronics just get thrown away . Even just like aa battery's. I'm sure there are just huge lithium deposits of recyclable material in our own trash pits .
⭐
Chinese battery good quality ? Last time i try buying a few of them they are all terrible, lack of capacity, fail quickly, ended up gping back to using LG CHEM battery
What competition?.. Havn't you hear about Nio trip of over one thousand kliks( kilometers) on one full charge. The game is over !.
Battery/energy storage, chips, AI, fast network connectivity and throughput-
This all leads to the marriage of advanced machine learning and robotics.
This will eventually lead us to singularitym
American crying they cannot make battery 😂
Lol they cry every time China excels at anything.
Thick yanks
USA will never meet zero carbon by 2050 because gasoline is so cheap. Half the cost of EU.
I remember bought a sony li battery at price of 200$ for my 8MM video recorder at the year 2000. And When chinese begin making li battery, It cost Only 20$.
Success in producing the best batteries requires hard work, innovation, facing environmental and industrial problems. China had gone through all these so also if US wants to compete, she has to accept these sacrifices and not dump on others.
Lol they speak about climate change driving the transition and the need of batteries, they should show what is going on in Indonesia for the extraction of minerals for these batteries
Why is everything described as WAR today 🤔 its getn ridiculous
Farming factory building is 100 floors with ai robot autoseeding and auto water drop and so on
What are other countries doing like Germany, UK,france,USA.
Water is key to running the automobile industry hahahahaha