Rocky Mountain Element Review: The Salted Chocolate Chip Cookie
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- čas přidán 13. 06. 2024
- The Rocky Mountain Element is a lot like a salted chocolate chip cookie. At first, it sounds like an odd combination. But once you’ve had it, you realize that the two go together extremely well. Except in the Element’s case, we're not talking about salt and sugar. Instead, we’re talking about all-mountain geometry and cross-country feeling suspension. It has the long and slack geometry of a much bigger bike and the suspension feel of a quick little XC whip. So does it meet in the middle as the perfect trail bike? Or is it just a hot, gooey mess? Stick around to find out.
0:00 Intro
1:45 Ride Highlights
4:48 Element Review - Uphill
7:18 Element Review - Downhill
10:31 Comparisons
12:39 Who is it for?
As always you can find the written review on our website - www.bebikes.com/the-hub/rocky... - Sport
I went from a Scott spark with a Fox 34 Fork (down countried). The Element is not only faster in almost all trails, but I don’t feel like I’m going to die on big tech features or drops. The bike is a unicorn.
What gen spark? the new hidden shock one or last gen? trying to decide between a spark 130/120 or element 130/120
The mountain bike trends have lead many people into purchasing bikes that are clearly over-biked for the vast majority of local trails - I jumped on the big travel boat myself thinking the big bike has me covered for everything, later realizing it really worked best for small sections (15%) of most trails - Continuing to be the perfect trend follower (thank you CZcams) I’m riding the Revel Ranger w/130mm Pike and now have the perfect bike for 85% of the trail with a bike that’s lighter and faster (thank you Strava) all the way around - I’m guessing the Rocky Mountain Element has nailed the perfect bike for the next several years - excellent review as always
Spot on. My go to is my 21 Stumpy. I have a Devinci Troy as well but it’s more work to ride so mostly I ride it at the parks.
Where do you ride?
Great review of an unusual bike! Mine just came in after waiting 7 months! Thanks!!
I was originally hunting for Ripley AF but the shop happen to have one more left Element A30, decided to pull the trigger on it, loving it.
Great timing for this video so thanks for posting. I love my 2022 C70 but have been trying to decide where it belongs since my enduro is being repaired suddenly. Our trails in Texas are punchy both up and down and this bike seems to work perfectly for that but definitely won't find it in a bike park.
Love the videos you helped me find the perfect mountain bike
Glad I could help!
Coming from a V2 Ripmo, I agree that the Element is almost as good as the Ripmo going down, but it climbs WAY better. However, I disagree with the playfulness comment. My Element feels even more lively than my Ripmo, especially on flattish trails where the Ripmo felt dead. Burlier tires went a long way in making the Element a more confident descender too. Best bike ever.
The Element feels livelier than the Ripmo on flattish stuff because of the pedal efficiency, but as far as popping off stuff, feels a lot like the Ripmo. The Ripmo is not particularly poppy nor is it super planted, it kinda sits right in the middle. Most Rocky Mountain bikes are way poppier than the RIpmo
I have a ‘20 Whyte S-120 with very similar geometry and suspension setup but with a 120 Fox 34 SC. Whyte was only in US for one year, so I never see them. Makes it hard to know how it would compare to the Element. May have to throw my leg over one to find out. Thanks for the review.
This was one of the bikes I was looking at when shopping for a new bike last year, great bike and perfect for my location. Ended up with a similar bike in the Optic with a bit more travel and setup a bit poppier with the SDDH than the Element. Great review yet again.
The optic is a pretty cool bike. Far more aggressive than this one. Don’t think it stands a chance on the climbs though against the element.
@@bikersedge Oh no doubt, the Optic was lower on my list but it was the only bike I could get my hands on early 2021. Loving it on the downs but slower on the ups. Looking at 99spoke the geo's between the 2 bikes are pretty much the same which is interesting, 65 HA and 76 STA. Great reviews.
@@dimimtb I almost went with an Optic, but found a good deal on a Ripley AF. I sure wouldn't mind putting the OEM Optic shock on the Ripley, though.
@@NoBrakes23 The Super Deluxe is a great shock I don't have a lot of experiences with others to compare. I was also looking at a Ripmo that was in stock but had the Rocky and Ripley on my list as well. I think the Optic and Ripley are very similar bikes from what I read. You really can't go wrong with most new bikes now a days, they're all pretty great.
Love this bike. Super light, threw on some burlier tires and is just awesome.
A couple of folks have asked about Element vs. Trail 429. I'll preface what I'm about to say with the caveat I'm a shit rider compared to BE, but I've got time on both, soooo... Trail 429 feels sportier under power, and the suspension platform doesn't give up as quickly as the Element's does when you stop spinning and start mashing. The Pivot gets into a corner a little snappier, the Rocky feels more stable through the corner. Both bikes allow you to adjust your line as needed. I ride Mediums in both bikes, and unlike the XL, I felt the cockpit for the Element was more compact than the 429's in the saddle, and they felt pretty similar, reach-wise, out of the saddle. BE's thing about endurance riding was what juuuust tipped me to choose the Element over the 429, as it has more stable geo, as well as the ability to run two full-size bottles in the frame. And because I'm so mediocre on the downhills, I appreciate the Element's geo is more aggressive, keeping me calmer when I drop into rough sections of the trail.
Thanks for posting this. Really informative, and highlights the pros and cons of both, depending on your local terrain. Luckily, as many have said, there's no bad answer between the two.
@@bdhpxd you're welcome! Like you said, a lot of it is terrain-dependent. I wish the RM had a little more platform under pedal load, but for me its upside completely outweighs that criticism on balance.
This bike sounds like my bike from 2019. Whyte 120C RS V3. Even though this new bike has 0.5 slacker HA and 1 degree steeper STA the rest of the bike sounds extremely similar. Living with the bike for 3 years I can tell that it's a great bike for most things. It's a downhillers XC bike so to say. If you live in a flatter pedally place but want to be able to do the bigger features and more demanding trails with confidence this bike is great.
Spot on Review! I would agree with most everything that was said and add my experience with my Element. My one word review would be "Zippy". It just responds so well to pumping corners and berms! I sold my Ripley because the Rocky did everything better, in just about every way, with exception of jumps. Element is very firm, but has so much traction on the Steep loose climbs and corners. I felt the Element was more active on the really steep climbs than the Ripley. I am running mine in the position 3 (neutral) which gives it a 65.5 degree HTA. When things get really steep on the climbs, I feel the length but also feel it provides incredible traction. This bike likes to jump, but as a 200 pound rider, my Rallon is a far better tool for that. I have a C50 in a size large. Stock weight prior to pedals or any changes was 28.04 pounds. I added wheels, XT 2 pots, Wolftooth Dropper, XR4 front tire and a Handlebar. Not sure what the weight is now, as I am not a weight weenie. The bike is a good choice for Endurance races. It did better on the El Doce course than I did. Spot on review Connor and Zach, love your Shop and Channel!
Thanks! It’s such a fun bike to cover a lot of ground very quickly.
@@bikersedge Have had one since January and it's nice to have a review that puts into words how I've found mine, too, spot on! Cheers
Element climbs better than the Ripley??
@@Jasongristick My Ripley was an AF. Yes, my Element climbs a bit better in every situation I have been in. The traction on the Element is really good. I usually leave it in the "open" position all the time.
Great reviews on here as always!
I'm very curious about RM bikes! I been on a V1 Ripmo for a few years now and would love to get a backup bike. RM might be it!
Element goes uphill faster than the Ripmo? Is that correct? That's a bold statement! The Ripmo is a Rocket ship uphill! Maybe that's due to less travel/weight? Although the Ripmo is something else!
Is this Element the Alloy or Carbon version in the review?
How would the Element compare to the Instinct? Thanks!
I have a C70 on the way and a Ripmo AF that I just got a month ago. Will be interesting how similar (or not) they feel from a the perspective of rider technique and input. Hopefully with these two bikes in the stable I'll have a bike to cover pretty much any terrain! Great review!
That's my stable currently...they feel super similar. I don't have a period of adjustment swapping between the bikes at all like I did with my old XC bike. As expected the Ripmo plows much better but the Element is so much more snappy and nimble.
@@SkiRidesMTB Nah, the Pivot Trail 429 did. The Element is too slack and long, not agile or maneuverable enough, and the suspension is nothing special. The proof is that less than a year later, people aren't really talking about it much anymore. Like the Spur, if your trails are straight up and down and not windy with a lot of turns and switchbacks, sure go for it. But most of the best trails aren't like that.
@@REB4444 Agree to disagree. People stop talking about bikes all the time when they aren't constantly being refreshed and reviewed on youtube. It's an absolutely amazing bike that can do anything from XC to light bike park days with the right tires. I'm super happy every day I get to ride my element.
Thanks for the review. I'm loving the trend of tweener bikes that hold their own uphill and down, they're good for us old fat guys that still want to play. I think you meant to compare the Element to the Trance 29 as that bike is way closer in travel numbers to the Element? The Trance X 29 is 150/135 with almost identical wheelbase and almost as slack steering. I ride a Trance X 29 because of your review and love it, it would be interesting to see you put this Element up head to head against the Trance X 29, Occam, and Ripmo (and Esker Rowl too, but I know you guys don't sell them), just to see hard numbers uphill and down. Cheers!
No I meant the Trance X. In my mind I was thinking of driving descending capability and the element it closer to the Trance X than it is the Trance 29.
This year I,'m going full suspension ,riding mtb since late 80s.Ordered a Rocky Mountain alloy 30...I hope it shares the same ride qualities...I know Alloy 30 is a heavier bike more travel..Anyway good videos you guys make very informative...You should review Alloy 30...
Great review, unfortunately finding these in c50 is incredibly difficult. When are the mid level build going to become available?
Jensons has some in stock right now or soon (9/15)
does it make sense to take an "enduro" bike geometry, in a short travel option with lightweight components? Yep
I think especially with the way UIC races are becoming much more technical and chundary with more elevation, the difference between XC and Trail I think now is just $$$ associated to more carbon and more titatium lol
Good Review. I built up a new element this year. After being on Pivot's and Revel's for the last several years, it felt a little different to be back on horst link. How would you compare this bike against the Trance you reviewed in the spring?
Hey thanks. Check the comments. I’ve made that comparison a few times in there.
I'd love to see you compare the Element with Banshee Phantom V3/V3. 2 and maybe even throw in a Pivot Trail 429 (even though that one is carbon frame only)
Unfortunately we won’t be able to make it happen. We don’t have access to either of those brands at the shop.
Which bike is better: Ibis Exie (non-usa deore build $5k) vs. Rocky Mountain Element (C50 build $5k)??? No xc racing, but will be doing marathons and 100 milers. Ride mostly 'blue' trails, fair amount of green as well, just a touch of black. My weight is 120lbs.
This bike is amazing. I was lucky enough to grab one early on and have been riding it for about a year now. It's a straight up Lycra wearing race winning beast that you can ride at the bike park the next day. I came from a twitchy 100mm XC race bike to the Element and I PRd all my climbs and downhills. If the bike is a little too down country for you you can always swap in a $35.00 120mm air damper to steepen the head tube angle.
It’s pretty solid. Great climber and descender. Doesn’t seem to make many compromises.
Could you review the commencal meta tr 29? Or any commencal bike? Love the vids.
Hey thanks! As a bike shop we don’t have access to direct to consumer brands. Won’t be able to make it happen.
Man, great video, I really like your channel, quick silly question, if you HAVE to take either the element or the Spur to a bike park which would be ??
Neither one is really ideal for that but I’d grab the element for rough trails and terrain.
@@bikersedge thanks 👍
I do agree with you, the Element feels a LOT like a Ripmo in terms of riding position. My main bike is a Ripmo and I demoed an Element, the Element's riding position felt almost identical to the Ripmo, and on that same note so did the Altitude. As for riding, once I realized that you can't lean on a Rekon front like you can an Assegai haha it basically ride like a really nice trail bike, that pedals incredibly efficiently. Very stable and confident on the downhill, though strangely was not poppy as you said, it also resembles the Ripmo in that aspect of not being super poppy. Which struck me as odd since its big brother the Altitude is extremely poppy and playful.
Is owning a ripmo and the Element too much overlap? I have the 2022 Element and a ripmo frame new in the box. The Element is not poppy in the first part of the travel because it has a relatively linear leverage ratio in the first half of the travel.
@@hotdealwire If you were going to run a 2 bike quiver with a Ripmo as the big bike I think the Element would make a good small bike. Though I would probably run an Altitude as the big brother to an Element if I didn't already have a Ripmo. The Ripmo is also very linear out back in stock form, as compared to the Altitude which is VERY progressive (maybe not Knolly level progressive, but definitely more progressive than Ibis or Transition).
Good Review! Where are you riding? The scenery is awesome!
Hey thanks. Park city and little cottonwood canyon.
How does this stand up against the Ripley AF?
Thanks for the review.
The Rocky seems a lot like the Alchemy Arktos ST (which is sort of a small brand Ibis - I understand ex-Ibis guys started Alchemy).
The Arktos would be a great review. Maybe you could review it in all of its iterations (with the conversion kits) to see if it actually works.
Cheers.
Unfortunately we don’t have access to alchemy bikes at the shop. Won’t be able to make it happen.
@@bikersedge Good point, I forgot they were DTC brand.
I picked up this bike to turn into a XC race bike, I'm hoping to get it around 26lbs. I live and race in Denver Co, we can get a wide range of XC courses. I've been racing a XL Lynskey Live Wire Ti bike. Being 6'6" tall this frame was long enough to fit me, also turning 60 this year and wanted a full suspension bike to take the edge off.
Nice. Enjoy!
Curious how this element would compare to a ripely af? Love your content!
They’re similar. The Ripleys wheelbase is quite a bit shorter despite having a similar reach and HTA. I think that makes it a bit less stable. I think the element pedals much more XC than the Ripley. That one feels more like a trail bike on the climbs.
What a great review, thanks! Any idea of bike weight (with pedals)? Thanks.
Go check out the written review. It’s in there.
@@bikersedge will do, thanks!
Great review. Very Accurate description. You didn’t mention the Ride-4 which is a sweet feature. Had mine since Dec 2021. I also have a V2 Rimpo.
The Element has much faster Strava times than the Rimpo on most of my green, blue and black trails here in PA. That said, the Rimpo is a way easier, safer and a faster bike if you ride mostly gnar on the downs and hit big drops.
Rocky Mountain lists the Element as a Cross County bike. Curious. If you put a Fox 34 120mm fork on the Element, how do you think it would compare to traditional XC Race Bikes? Lux, Oiz, Spark..ect.
True. I spent the majority of my time in the slackest setting. I personally don’t think I’d run it otherwise. The beauty of the bike for me is in how slack and long it is for the category.
I don’t think it would hang against the true XC race bikes when it comes down to it. Unless it’s a race like BC bike race or True Grit.
Your comparison with the ripmo prompted a question for me. With the enduro bikes you just reviewed that feature better climbing and these slacker, more capable short travel bikes out there(spur, element), do you think the all mountain trail category is becoming redundant?
I think the all-mountain category is probably the most relevant one out of the bunch. It's the best for people who want to ride a wide variety of terrain and trails. Its the jack of all trades group.
I just bought two of these, one for the GF and myself...a big part of my rational was that the Element can be had in aluminum/Deore spec, meaning I got both our bikes (AL 30, on sale) for the same price as what I was going to spend on a single entry level carbon bike for myself. ***I'd actually love if reviewers could mention whether the lower end specs on these bikes have any serious compromises that would change their perception of the bike relative to its similarly priced competitors...or does this rig make a ton of sense at 25lbs in full carbon but way less sense at 32lbs with an entry level fork?? My other thinking about the element was that it has almost all of the positive sides of an xc bike - lighter weight, increased efficiency, better match for the trails we ride (not being over biked) - but while also giving some extra confidence/capability on the rough downhills and in the occasional "oh shit where are we" moments...I'm hard pressed to really call the extra downhill capability much of a "tradeoff" but maybe that just means its a good fit for what we're looking for.
Rad! The Element is easily one of our favorites. As far as addressing lower quality builds, I've always thought that the vast majority of what makes a bike ride the way it does is the geometry, frame design and suspension design. The components bolted onto it make up such a small piece of the ride quality, especially in the big picture. Thats' why I don't talk about exact builds or components in my reviews, I focus on the bike itself. Buy the one that best fits your budget.
Is the rough granite stuff at Alta? AF? Looks fun
It is.
This bike looks so cool!!!
Sure does.
Considering this for stage races like Swiss Epic next year. Good stage racer?
If that’s anything like BC Bike Race then yes.
Check out the all new ARC8 Essential, or ARC8 evolve fs. Like your content. 👍🏻👍🏻👍🏻👍🏻
Hey thanks for the kind words.
I would be OK with the Element being even slacker---say 77* STA and 64* HTA. I want a lightweight, efficient pedaling and climbing , fast rolling, almost XC-ish bike, but I also want a fast stable descender. While I love the climbs, I love the descents also. The Element and Canyon Spectral 125, which also has very slack geo for a short travel bike, are some of the best bikes currently made. I've been hoping that Ibis will update the carbon Ripley soon with slacker geo. One of my biggest complaints about the current crop of Downcountry bikes is that they just aren't long and slack enough. A size large mountain bike needs at least a 1230mm wheelbase and an even longer 1240+mm wheelbase would be just fine with me.
There is something to be said about a slightly steeper bike on mellower terrain though. The handling is just way more responsive and fun. And this is coming from a guy who rides a 63.8 degree HTA on the daily.
@@bikersedge Is that bike attached to heavy aggressive slow rolling tires and gooey squishy long travel suspension? I suspect that is stealing the fun from mellower terrain, not the geo.
I just mean I’m a guy who likes slack bikes but I can appreciate the ride quality that comes from a steeper bike. The handling is different regardless of tires or suspension.
The 2022 Trail 429 is the one for you. I'm a huge fan of Santa Cruz & Ibis, but when I went short-travel and wanted fast, maneuverable, great climber but also able to handle 95% of downhill trails I chose the 429 over the Ripley because its a little more planted (not as twitchy), as capable as the Transition Spur downhill (this Element sounds like it's similar to the Spur), but way more maneuverable in fast, windy, flowy trail.
Comparison to the ripmo is super interesting. The ripmo is my first long travel bike after years on shorter travel bikes. The plushness is addicting but weight means I don't really want to ride the bike unless I'm seeking out super rough trails. I've always found the suspension to be the limit of these shorter travel bikes. I really like the tunability of the x2 and fox 38. I'm putting some faster rolling tires on the ripmo and listen it up a bit and see how it fares
Great review! Curious what area of the country you're riding in?
Hey thanks! We are in northern Utah.
@@bikersedge Thanks! Your review helped me decide to purchase a Rocky Mountain Element Alloy 50; being delivered tomorrow :)
Awesome. Stoked it helped!
I would love to know how this compares to a Pivot 429
We don't carry Pivot so I don't know.
In terms of climbing efficiency, how does the Element compare to the Instinct?
Element blows it out of the water.
How does the element compare to the carbon Ripley as far as climbing and descending??
It’s closer to a Ripmo than Ripley on the DH. Fast on the climbs like a Ripley but fits big and handles like a Ripmo.
Can you guys test the Rocky Mountain slayer only rocky full sus you haven’t done
If I can get my hands on one I will.
Trek Top Fuel with a 130mm fork is the closest to the Element IMO
Want it!
Am I hearing creaking during the climb (2:30 ish). What’s your experience with pressed-in BB’s?
Yeah there’s a little. I don’t think I’ve had a single bike not develop a creak at some point. Too many exposed and moving parts for it to not happen. I don’t have any data but I don’t think a PF BB is any more prone to creaking than a threaded. They just require more expensive tools to install and replace.
@@bikersedge My gf and I demoed the Element at Outerbike Moab and both of our bottom brackets creaked. They were the only bikes we demo'd that creaked and also the only bikes with PF bottom brackets. Really hope Rocky considers going threaded in the future because this is a deal breaker for me.
Did you record this with a new cam. The picture jerks a little bit. Like stop and go
Nope. Same setup as before. I’m not seeing the jerky picture on my end. Weird.
so which Rm would you ride everyday Instinct or this.. ie which is more of quiver killer ?
For how I like to ride a bike I'd take an Instinct. But that's going to vary by person, terrain and riding style.
What tire pressure do you normally ride with?
Depends on the trail, bike and tires but I usually run between 25-30.
Any pedal strikes with the somewhat low bottom bracket?
No. thats not something I normally have issues with though.
Stellar review especially considering the stem isn’t straight 😮
Maybe your eyes are crooked.
Would you compare it to the Specialized Epic Evo?
Not sure. Haven't ridden that. On paper, that one looks way more traditional XC with steeper and shorter geo.
Element vs Instinct for my 16yr old son, he’s 6’2-6’3 and currently running cross country so pretty fit. Live outside Durango, 3hrs or so from Moab. Thanks for any info
Just depends on how he likes to ride. If he wants more of an XC bike go element. If he wants a more well rounded bike that pays a bigger penalty on the climbs go instinct.
@@bikersedge thanks 🙏 we watched the Instinct video too. Love that Bobsled run, I need to get back up there and ride it! I’m just leaving the decision up to him but i think he’s leaning towards the Element.
Would you take this bike or the spur if you also have a bigger bike? Does your opinion change if you live somewhere else?
I see this and the Spur as pretty close to being interchangeable. Very similar bikes. I’d take whichever one you can get your hands on at the moment.
Tough to say what I’d do if my daily trails were different. I always think the Spur and Element would be a good compliment to a long travel bike.
How tall are you, just trying to gauge sizing. I have an XL Megatower now but I was wondering if I could squeeze on to a size large Element?
I’m 6’2” and also rode an XL mega. I think I this bike is designed to be long. Downsizing would negate a lot of the benefits you get from this bike being long.
@@bikersedge that's kind of what I figured, thanks for confirming!
What XCis similar bike would you go wtih for plushier ride and what setup? (especially if you enjoy technical uphill but want safetey on downhill)
I mean XC bikes by nature aren’t plush. They’re made to be efficient so they are fast uphill. I’d get a trail bike of if I wanted what your talking about. Something like the Tallboy, Spur or Occam SL come to mind.
@@bikersedgethank you! What if your goal is also to just go super fast is tall boy food enough?
@@kevinmanzo862 fast uphill? No the tallboy isn’t the fastest climber. You’re always going to make compromises with bikes. The tallboy is a confident descender for a small bike. It’s not the fastest climber though.
No mention of the Norco Optic? Surely you’ve seen that geo 😀.
Geo is similar but that bike ride way more aggressive than this one. Not even close on the climbs.
What would be one or two of the poppiest, playful bikes in this category?
I don’t find this category to be all that poppy. They place more of an emphasis on speed and climbing in my experience. If you consider the Tallboy in the same category then that would have to be my recommendation.
How do you think this compares to Ibis Ripley?
Check the comments. A couple other people have asked. You can find my quick comparison there.
How would you compare it to the Pivot 429 or the new Yeti SB120?
Haven’t ridden either of those. We don’t carry pivot so that one won’t happen but we have a 120 on the way so I’ll know soon.
@@bikersedge THX!
What would you think about an Element super light built with a 34 stepcast 120mm upfront?
It’s not something I would want to ride. The beauty of that bike is how capable it is. If you want super light and more XC there are better bikes - Exie, BC40, Blur
@@bikersedge how would you rate the element on climbing compared to the bikes you mentioned?I’m looking for a bike to train on climbs but, coming from trail/enduro bikes I tend to appreciate a lot the fun part going downhill, I tested the bike and I found it amazing, the set up was on the steepest position but it was difficult to understand if it was performing in line with my expectations uphill, it has to be said that the bike was on good alloy wheels and ardent tires
@@emanuelecamozzi2336 those bikes will climb faster. They’re more suited for climbing. You’ll give up quite a bit on the DH though.
@@bikersedge thanks a lot for your help, I think I will go for the fox 34 normal version and eventually I will play around with tires to have it lighter, the Ardent I had were a fantastic set up but maybe a bit too much..I agree, having tested the Blur that it is faster uphill but Element is in a completely different league DH and as handling in the rough stuff..do you have a suggestion for a tire combo light enough but not too sketchy to ride?
Thanks again for your time and your competence!
What if…you change the shock out to. New Float X?
Personally I think swapping shocks doesn’t make as big of a difference as people give it credit for. The rear suspension is largely determined by the frame/kinematics and not so much by the damper you decide to use. It’s still going to be an Element regardless of the shock you put on it.
all good
Curious if this is similar to an exie
Similar maybe, but the Exie is a lot more XC.
So it rides like how you would ride a super slack super long hardtail. This is why it's hardtail riders love hardtails but you are exchanging rear grip for more fun and being able to pump better and being able to jump way better but it's just as capable but you need to be on your A game.
Yeah. Pretty similar idea I guess.
So there is a bike called the Ripley, that is the ibis you should be comparing the element to
I'm well aware of the Ripley. It's been a long time since I've ridden one so I don't think I can make a fair comparison. Plus, their geometry is pretty different. The only thing they really have in common is travel numbers.
@@bikersedge that’s fair. Back to back testing would be optimal but in a perfect world I could try every bike before I buy
Thumbs up on the into alone 😅
There's an argument to be made that these short travel bikes don't need to be so slack, as the geometry ends up being more capable than the suspension. You also lose that nimble feeling which makes these bikes more fun climbing or on twisty, slower terrain.
I'll always find the bottom of the suspension on my Ranger long before the geometry makes me feel unstable. It's also good to have that different geo feel to remind me that I'm not on my 170mm bike and probably should use the brakes a bit more while descending.
I mean you do make a good point.
@@bikersedge definitely agree with your comments on the BC bike race..it's suited for and XC race on steep trails.
Agreed. That's why the Spur and Element, with the longer wheel base aren't the best short-travel trail bikes. They need to be agile & maneuverable and not just fly straight up and plow straight down. The Element & the Spur are just all-mountain bikes with lighter components and less burly frames. They are too long & slack to be agile & maneuverable. There are other bikes with better, more sophisticated suspension that are more balanced like the Ripley or Trail 429.
How does the Element compare to the v4 Ripley?
I think its a longer more stable ride than the Ripley.
@@bikersedge 10/4
Thanks
MTB YUM YUM has a comparison video
How does it compare to the new giant trance?
That one feels more XC than this one.
@@bikersedge wow that’s surprising thanks
Need an element vs spur comparison
Rad! I’ll see what I can do.
Connor, does the Element's existence creep enough into Rocky Mountain Instinct territory as to make Instinct redundant? Does Element "provide enough bike for enough riders" to make a bike between itself and Altitude unnecessary? Don't get me wrong, I LOVE my Instinct, but your comments about Element punching way above its weight makes for an interesting discussion.
I think it’s very different than the Instinct. That bike is far closer to the altitude than it is to this.
I am wondering this as well. I have a 2014 instinct that I love but am looking to buy something with newer geometry to try. The instinct has gotten bigger then my 130/130 instinct. The element is just a bit smaller. I have been going back and forth the last few days.
I am getting older but still ride some tough terrain but the instinct feels like it might be too much bike in the new version, while the element I am worried might not be enough.
I am not the fastest rider either. Which do you think matches a more cautious speed technical rider, instinct or element?
There’s two ways to look at it. You’re going to feel more comfortable and confident on the instinct even if it’s overkill part of the time. On the other hand, the Element may be more suited to your terrain but you’ll need your A game to ride difficult trails.
@@jeremiemiller9165 I haven't ridden Element at all, so no opinion there, but being a very similar rider to you, I can say that the Instinct (mine is a '20) is brilliant on everything. From what I've seen and heard, the later Instincts are even better with 150mm front (vs 140 on mine) and more contemporary geo. I ride everything from flow, to lift (VERY poorly I might add, through no fault of the bike), to Moab and Southern Utah mesas (Gooseberry, Guacamole, Wire). Instinct has never disappointed me, it only makes me giggle. One caveat - it's not the best climber. My brother's Rascal is far superior on that front. Another tremendous bike in the Trail category.
I picked up an Element this year and was gonna get an Instinct as well. I met someone at the Trail who had one and we traded bikes for a 2 mile lap. To me the Element climbs much better than the Instinct. The Instinct jumps better, goes downhill better, and is less firm. But the two felt too similar for me to own both. The Element's suspension is interesting. It is quite firm but has a lot of traction when you want it going uphill in loose and semi-bumpy sections.
dude im literally eating Tate's Bake Shop Salted Caramel Choco Chip cookies haha unreal
What trails is he riding in this?
Road to WOS and a bunch in little cottonwood.
@@bikersedge thanks!
What is the weight on the XL 90?
Not sure. This was a custom build. I answered the weight in the comments earlier. Don’t remember off the top of my head. Somewhere around mid twenties.
Ah ok. I just saw the factory suspension and instantly thought C90. I would like to stay Santa Cruz but I don’t think the new Tallboy is going to get any lighter. In my opinion I think SC has a hole in their line up that could be filled by a variant of the Blur (I don’t think the current TR compares to this) but that is at least a generation away. The Tallboy is just too heavy, at most it would be 1.5 lbs lighter than my Megatower. That’s the reason I sold my 5010, the MT was actually faster as a trail bike.
Santa Cruz tends to put more emphasis on traction and control rather than efficiency and lightweight. It makes for great overall climbers. Weight and efficiency aren’t everything, but it would be nice for SC to have something similar to the Element.
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Are you on an XL?
Yes. I’m 6’2”
So am I! That’s why I asked thanks!
This review was so dope
Hey thanks. Glad you liked it!
Nice bike but going to hold out for the Tallboy gen 5. I believe the TB5 is right around the corner.
Man I hope you’re right.
@@bikersedge I like a little more plush ride.
Dang! I wish I hadn’t watched this. Now I feel like I need to demo it, which usually leads to a purchase. Anyone interested in a large Evil Following V2?
Can confirm you’ll want one after riding.
Should have been compared to the Norco Optic, same angles and almost the same amount of suspension
On paper they look similar. Out on the trail they feel so different though. Not even close.
Element feels lighter and faster on the climbs?
Staaaaaahp… don’t make me regret not getting one
It’s not too late…
@@bikersedge it is… I spent that money elsewhere
Gotta be the first to comment now ey, publish 1 minute ago!
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What the heck happened between BE guys & the Ripley? You compare this bike to the Ripmo with no mention. And you say the new 5010 climbs better than Ripley on technical! A 27.5 rear! Head scratching!!
This bike is closer to a Ripmo than it is a Ripley. That’s why we didn’t compare it to the Ripley.
@@bikersedge Understood, but didn't you prefer Ripley to Tallboy?
For fast efficient climbing I did. For downhill not so much. It all depends on what you're looking to do.
Comparison to the tallboy?
Just watch the video. Its in there.
Bike of the year?
Should be a contender at least.
It's definitely NOT an xc bike, it kinda pedals like trash. Maybe my expectations were too high but I would rather pedal my ripley af against a c70 build all day. It doesn't have the pep I expect from a bike of this travel. I will say, the geo is legitimately amazing though. Reach, and body position are incredibly well sorted, and descending is a blast! I would rather ride an altitude though haha. Oh regarding pedaling position, I slammed the hell out of the saddle and it was a great climbing position traction wise.
I might not he the best guy to comment on the ripmo comparison but I ride my Ripley af everywhere from Squamish to bike park to xc single track in my home town, it's built up with a 140 fork and beefier tires but I honestly think it's a more well rounded bike than the element. The element's strength is definitely in it's aggressive geo, but that's also the weakness when it comes to climbing, slower single track and xc stuff. I honestly don't know who its for, but it's not for me.
I don't think it's an XC bike either. It's really hard to categorize.
geometry doesn't seem much more radical than a Tallboy, Optic or a Spur. There have been bikes like this for a while.
It’s close to a degree slacker and quite a bit longer than the Spur and Tallboy. When you compare how quickly it climbs and how efficient the suspension is to those bikes it’s a pretty unique/radical combination.
@@bikersedge almost identical to Tallboy except for .7 degrees slacker head tube angle, and identical to the Optic except for 6mm longer chainstays. Slightly longer but radically different?
The radical part isn’t only the geometry. It’s the geometry paired to much more XC feeling suspension than the Tallboy and optic.
Was also curious about this comparison. Useful info!