Arcane Maelstrom Precon: $50 Budget Upgrade | Precon Power-Up
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- čas přidán 30. 07. 2024
- Looking to upgrade your Arcane Maelstrom precon deck from c20? This video has everything you need, from upgrades to cuts!
Link to our decklist:
bit.ly/UpgradedTemurDecklist
Link to ONLY the cards we added to the precon:
bit.ly/ArcaneMaelstromUpgrades
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We're back with another Precon power-Up from Commander 2020. This time around we are tackling the Arcane Maelstrom deck helmed by Kalamax, the Stormsire. He wants us to cast and copy instants as many times as we can, so that's what we're doing in this temur upgraded deck with the $50 budget we have given ourselves. let us know what you think in the commentsand how you'd build the deck!
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Nitpicking Nerds
Music:
"Digital Lemonade"
Kevin MacLeod (incompetech.com)
Licensed under Creative Commons: By Attribution 3.0
creativecommons.org/licenses/b... - Hry
The Remand back and forth got me to sub, you guys are great lol
Glad you did this guide .
I have been using the precon and found it super slow and not easy to use.
100% agree the commander is good but the other choices are not great.
This is the deck I was most excited for this time. I was so sad wen we finally got a fork commander with Lutri but he got banned, but then they printed this and its in green too! I'm also super excited 2 build a budget Haldan and Pako deck. A man and his dog as commander, I've never related to a magic card so much!
They say a man is a dog’s best friend! I’m glad you loved this deck, it’s cool that Kalamax works so well with the green ramp like harrow!
I love this one, its like a weird combination of big spell slinger and the classic King Macar shenanigans
King Macar is the original backseat driver
Just found this channel. Love it!
I went the not as budget route and found it very easy to get nearly infinite turns w time warp effects.
Great video really helpful
Glad to hear it!
Fury Storm might actually have a home in this deck. As crazy as that is.
Guttersnipe is "cast". It does not count copies normally (for instance, copying a spell on the stack), unless you're exiling cards to then cast. It's definitely still an include, but it's not a copy twice, deal 6 damage effect.
Krosan Grip has split second so it cannot be copied on the stack
Return to Nature is likely a good alternative for Krosan because it also has graveyard interaction (which the deck currently doesn't have much of).
Thousand Year is good, but has the same problem as Guttersnipe. It's not counting most of the copy effects. It's a whale of an enchantment card at 6 mana and can lead to being 2 for 1ed, so I generally stay away from the card.
Snap is pretty good - It becomes a Return 2 Target Creatures, Untap 4 lands with Kalamax. (Net 2 mana per copy)
Wilderness Rec seemed like a pretty good choice as well here, so that you can dump mana into a big spell on your turn and then still get mana to respond on other's turns.
And, Mischevious Chimera seems like a pretty good include if you're going in on the Glademuse/Wavebreak Hippocamp route (I'm not sure if that's worthwhile, even in this deck). You're not getting card draw with the Chimera, but you are getting 1 damage and more importantly Scry 1.
I also like Signal The Clans here quite a bit. A 2 mana tutor for a random of three cards isn't that great when compared to something like Worldly Tutor; a 2 mana tutor where you do that twice is quite a bit better. A random Rashmi, Wort, or Melek choice is going to get you something you're okay with playing. Alternatively, if you get Glademuse, Hippocamp, Guttersnipe, you're in a similar situation where any of those cards will likely advance your board state.
Hey thanks for commenting! Just a few quick notes, Krosan Grip is still copied with Kalamax because it is a triggered ability (players can't *activate* abilities). Snap and Fury Storm were both cards we added; they are awesome, and we were surprised Wilderness Rec was already in the precon. We thought Guttersnipe was worth it because it's doing as much damage as Ral who we like a lot, and with Mizzix's Mastery it goes completely insane and kills everyone (hopefully!)
@@NitpickingNerds Cool cool, thanks for the response. DIdn't realize that Krosan didn't exclude triggered, but I don't know why I didn't realize that.
Here I am waiting for the Jeskai one! Finger crossed is the next one ✌
It IS in fact the next one! These should all be coming out back to back so we aren’t making you wait TOO long 😁
Depending on the modes you choose they can "get you" with mystic confluence.
2021-03-19: If you choose the first and/or second modes but all of the targets become illegal before Mystic Confluence resolves, the spell won’t resolve. If you also chose the last mode once or twice, you won’t draw any cards. If at least one target is still legal, the spell will resolve but will have no effect on any illegal targets.
This will likely only come up when copying the spell. Which is what we want to be doing.
If you copy the spell and choose mode 1 once and mode 3 twice. The original spell will not resolve if the spell you targeted is countered by the copy.
It's probably safest to choose all 3 modes when casting the spell when you want to make sure you can counter the spell and still get both copies to
resolve. Just try not to target a player with sac outlets with mode 2.
At least that's how I read it anyway.
Copying spells is confusing lol.
Apologies if someone already covered this in the comments.
Really like your videos.
I hope you will do a deck tech for the partner commanders.
We appreciate the kind words
I showed Brallin and shabraz my son, he imidiatly wanted to revamp his Niv mizzet parun Deck.
Cuz skysharks 😬
how do you dare to hate hallimar depths. is one of the best common lands in history of magic
Booooooo!
It really isn't that bad of a land. I almost stopped watching when I saw their reaction it. Been playing edh for several years and there's nothing wrong with a Halimar Depths. To go after that card in particular makes me question their card evaluation skills.
It's not a fantastic land and often gets cut, but to hate on it like that made no sense. It's a perfectly acceptable budget card.
EDIT: No mention. Of the actual worst land in the deck, Temple of the False Gods
Christopher Belanger The reason we dislike the card is that it provides no real advantage and comes in tapped. The hating on it has become a joke on the channel. It is a card that we would never play personally.
Same. I don't think its amazing. But reordering the top of your library for free isn't bad.
Dont know how i missed this one. Seems like a no brainer commander for someone named Rodzilla :)
We forgive you! Now you have the tools for the instant dino deck
You should have a theme song for Precon Upgrades: Take me out of the precon, take me out of the deck.... that’s as far as I got.
Maybe next year we could put something together! Having cheesy jingles for segments and videos could be sweet and is definitely up our alley
Buy me some signets and talismans, I don't care if I trash a locket.
Chris B THIS!!! ALL OF THIS!!!
Lavabrink Floodgates could be great in a Sevinne, the Chronoclasm, Ruhan of the Fumori, or a Gerrard, Weatherlight Hero deck...I think. Also, I didn't see any mention of CMC reducers like Goblin Electromancer, or Jace's Sanctum, do you not think they're good in Arcane Maelstrom? Twinning Staff is by far my favorite card in this deck. Saskia Human Tribal w the Ruthless Regiment deck seems great to me, I love that precon. Can't wait for the Cycling deck vid, love the videos guys!
I thought we mentioned a Goblin Electromancer in our video, we also have Primal Amulet in the deck too
Nitpicking Nerds you totally did 😪 I’m sure there are a bunch of comments like that where you addressed the comment in the video already haha sorry for adding on
It’s not a problem 😂 I’d rather everyone who needed a little extra clarification comment so we can straighten things out if need be!
no additional fork effects? boy... those are cheap and make kalamax just insanely fun! I upgraded my kalamax a few days ago once it finally came and added 3 fork effect cards and is so fun to simply fling kalamax and kill someone in one turn lol.
I'm new to mtg so can someone better explain the expansion Ral combo? I don't get how Kalamax can copy expansion since there needs to be an instant cast before expansion for expansion to target. Am I missing something?
It's harder in this deck, usually you need mutliple copy spells with Ral, like play Cultivate then Expansion, then Twincast expansion to go infinite. Really the only sorcery is Mizzix's Mastery, but if you cast that then Expansion it, you will go infinite on copies. hope this helped, this deck is confusing lol
Does copying the x spells work that way I was under the impression that copying a x spell didn't do anything because of the cost
I “doubled-back” to this video for ideas to upgrade my Riku deck. Yeah, I doubled-back for ideas to help me double-up!
I was under the impression copied spells did not activate on cast triggers. How does Mizzix's Mastery work with Niv-Mizzet, Parun?
Typically they don't, because most copy spells work on spells that are already on the stack and copy those spells directly -- so no casting. Mizzix's Mastery however, copies the cards and then let's you cast those card copies for free, so you do actually get cast triggers for that one. So with Niv you would get to draw a card/ping for each.
You can tell the difference by looking for the word "cast" in your copy spell's text -- Mizzix's has it, but Reverberate for example doesn't.
Is there space for Lightning Bolt?
Why does everyone forget Paradise Mantle and Reality Shift? Also Tunnel Vision and Mizzix's Mastery? Sphinx-Bone Wand?
This was a budget upgrade of the deck, so Mantle didn't really fit but you could totally play Reality Shift it's only a dollar
I think you misread Mizzix's Mastery. it copies the cards not the spells, so Ral triggers on the cast part not the copy part
Copying big spells with green ramp? Seems like a good combo to me!
Yes it does! We need more Harrows to be printed now
yayyyyy, if it isn't my favorite duo!
The commander precon and $50?
Nitpicking Nerds J&B, im not much of a precon upgrader myself...
We are kidding of course, we know we are amazing
@@NitpickingNerds as you should
can we get that list of outs please
My favorite sorcery is brainstorm.
i put lavabrink floodgates in my Obuun Enrage deck, but it hasn't seen play yet
No wilderness reclamation? And clear the mind might have a place in this deck too?
Wilderness Rec was in the precon so we couldn't add it, and I don't think we need to shuffle things back too badly, we want them in the grave for a huge Mizzix's Mastery!
the djinn can't do the thing with crop rotation because you can't pay the replicate cost with the lands that aren't on the battlefield yet. You can pay as many green mana as you would like to replicate it as you cast it, but once you have cast the spell you can't go back and pay extra replicate costs to copy the spell because the stack just doesn't work like that
Right if we said it out of order we definitely misspoke
Y’all realize half the stuff you listed doesn’t trigger on copies right? Unless the card says otherwise you don’t cast copies
Is there anywhere to find a list of ins and outs
Totally, there's two links in the description, one is for the whole deck the other is just the cards we added! We don't have a list of outs posted anywhere, but if you need it we can post it here
Nitpicking Nerds If that is not a problem that would be great (so I can write it down on a peace of paper) but if not then that’s ok!
Got my hope ups thinking we would get another maelstrom Wanderer creature.
They really like using Maelstrom with Temur aligned cards don’t they?
I don’t think niv or guttersnipe trigger off copies rap does because he says when u cast or copy but niv says when u cast but idk
Yeah if you don't cast the copies, they won't trigger, but like with Mizzix's Mastery, you DO cast the copies so they will trigger
I would like to shout out a card for this deck, Sorcerer Class. Play it and get it to level 2 now any of your creatures are many dorks for instants and sorceries.
fyi krosan grip doesnt go well in the deck. Kalamax cannot copy it because his trigger cannot go on the stack
Actually split second only blocks activated abilities and casting spells, not triggers -- so luckily it would get copied!
does copying count as casting though?
Some spells that copy say cast, but most if not all in this deck don't say that
If a spell simply says "copy target spell", the copy isn't cast, so for example guttersnipe won't trigger for the copy, but if a spell says "copy a spell, then CAST the copy" then yes you are casting a (copied) spell, so guttersnipe will trigger. Ral works because he pings both when you cast and copy a spell
I have ordered one I have added a bit of Voltron just in case I need to kill people with commander damage
What cards have you added for that?
@@NitpickingNerds well the two cards I am going to add is sword of sinew and steel and stell because it gives protection from black that is known for targeted removed and red and targeted damage effected and any plawswalkers and artifact I can destroy and hadanes climb so if I need to I can double up the power of kalamax and give it flying one that I might add is shadow spear so that kalamax has trample that works with I big kalamax can get and it also has lifeline so if I need to get out of non commander damage range I can the life that I will need by the way love your videos great channel and keep up the fantastic work
Xyris a worse version of Nekusar? boy you are insane if you think that.
Argument in Favor of Nekusar:
1. Black Color identity.
2. Notion Thief.
3. Zombie Wizard are both very relevant creature types.
Arguments Against Nekusar:
1. You give players extra cards without control over it.
2. Struggles to attack in.
3. Can lack board presences.
4. Higher weakness to Single Target Removal.
Argument for Xyris:
1. Green Color Identity.
2. More control over card draw.
3. Tokens are better than Damage.
4. Skullclamp.
5. Ashnod's/Phyrexian Altar.
6. Single target removal doesn't remove your snakes.
Arguments against Xyris:
1. Snakes don't have Haste.
2. Snake Leviathan isn't as Relevant of creature types.
Edit: oh, a fair point I forgot in Nekusar's favor is Curiosity. Yes, this is a fair point. But I also forget Enchantments removal that green offers which is also a good point and beastmaster's ascension.
Lilith Geisler Thanks for the well thought comment. When I said that it was more of a in the moment thought than a well thought thing.
In green we have" keen sense" and "snake umbras" which do the same as "curiosity"
BOOYA
#3 is out! 😎
just spent 5 minutes looking for that Djinn in the deck... don't think it came with it though haha
found it haha
The commander only copies the first spell you cast. It can only go infinite trying to copy an opponents spell since your spell needs a target and needs to be the first spell you cast.
Ral and Expansion plus our commander will still go infinite, not sure if that is what you are referring to?
ya pretty much. Joe says @9:48 you cast a spell then cast expansion on it, but expansion wouldn't be copied then only the first spell. I just thought you have to cast expansion on an opponents spell to copy it.
The commander only copies the first spell you play a turn. Expansion can't be the first spell you play because it needs a Target and you can't cast a spell to Target because then that's the first spell and the first spell is copied not expansion. Ral will let you copy a spell but you activate him at sorcery speed and it says the next spell you cast so it's still the first spell. What I'm saying is you need an opponent to cast a copyable spell then it's infinite because EXPANSION MUST BE YOUR FIRST SPELL to be copied by the commander. Your 2nd cast spell doesn't get copied.
If you target an opponent's spell then yes infinite.
Anyway sorry for the long explanation, I just felt we were on the wrong page and you missed that 1st spell thing.
Colin Hofer I think we just touched on the Ral combo (not the Kalamax combo) but we might have skimmed over it too fast. You’d need two copy spells and an original spell with Ral. In a normal deck you can just cast a sorcery then instant to win with kalamax, but we only have the one sorcery (that usually wins by itself anyway)
@@NitpickingNerds OMG I thought it copied your first instant or sorcery. Yep I get it now. Sorcery then expansion on it works. So does 2 copy cards from hand. Casting an Instant then expansion doesn't tho.
1:24 Talking about Melee?
Sometimes I have no idea what we’re talking about...
I made an atraxa infect deck "engineered" to spread the plague! 👌💀
Post the link if you want so people can see :)
Yes, please do. I'm working on Atraxa currently.
I dont understand the infinite loop cause im a noob lol.. anyone able to explain?
With Ral?
This took me a while to understand so I will try to help another person in my shoes.
Kalamax is tapped
1. You or your opponent casts a Sorcery spell, or they cast an Instant spell
2. Assuming Kalamax is tapped, you play your first instant card of the round (which is what triggers Kalamax) allowing him to copy the spell
3. To go infinite, the instant you played must be a copy spell (Narsets Reversal, Reverberate, Twincast)
4. Pay Attention> Now, Kalamax allows you to copy that instant (since it is the first of this turn and he is tapped),
you copy with Kalamax the copy spell (Reverberate), Kalamax's copy resolves and he gets a +1/+1 counter
Next the stack goes back down to Reverberate (your first instant spell cast this turn while Kalamax is tapped)
Triggering Kalamax again
you copy with Kalamax the copy spell (Reverberate), Kalamax's copy resolves and he gets a +1/+1 counter
Next the stack goes back down to Reverberate (your first instant spell cast this turn while Kalamax is tapped)
Triggering Kalamax again
you copy with Kalamax the copy spell (Reverberate), Kalamax's copy resolves and he gets a +1/+1 counter
Next the stack goes back down to Reverberate (your first instant spell cast this turn while Kalamax is tapped)
Triggering Kalamax again
you copy with Kalamax the copy spell (Reverberate), Kalamax's copy resolves and he gets a +1/+1 counter
Next the stack goes back down to Reverberate (your first instant spell cast this turn while Kalamax is tapped)
Triggering Kalamax again
And this goes infinitely, UNTIL, with Kalamax's copy ability, you target the original Sorcery or Instant spell that you copied with Reverberate, ending the cycle
5. So let's say you copied the Reverberate 500x and ended it by copying the original Instant/Sorcery. Now Kalamax has an attack/toughness of 504/504
6. Now that you have a 504/504 creature you find win conditions to end the game. I'll list some out -
A. Fling - sacrifice Kalamax and do direct damage to your opponent
B. Alter of Dementia - Have them discard their entire library
C. Ral, Storm Conduit - Direct damage to any target while the infinite goes off (kill multiple players)
D. Burning Anger, Chandra's Ignition - More direct damage
What about to add some magecraft cards?
Veyran
You guys are hilarious. I love your banter. However, you should do some research before you record. Copy and Cast are two different things and they have different triggers.
Wish harrow got some love its pretty busted in this deck.
I was siting on my couch, eating chips, and Then u say no combate tricks and now i am sad, i buy berserk temur battle rage and become inmense Just for this deck, i m so sad i Just look for my phone for tell how sad i am
Lol. Feel free to still play those cards and smash people! Protect Kalamax and get em'
I don't have temur battle rage and found on my old box of cards a Psychotic fury and was so much fun, also for combat tricks I highly suggest Fists of Flame, both cards have a Draw card effect so it's just good as well if you can't do anything else in a turn.
Why does no one say ban fire for this deck omg 😩
It's a decent X spell but there are a lot of options!
On lands mystic sanctuary
3:45 Joe 🍒 first head turn trying not to laugh. check it!
Also, we have not even thought about that card a single time since making this video lol
*** once and future is epic in this deck btw...
replaces Surreal Memoir
Solid way to add some recursion :D
@@NitpickingNerds 4 for 4 feels good.
the dino is cool and probably better, but Riku is cuter
He is giving me land before time vibes
Copies do not trigger "on cast" effects...
yuri mantchev they do if the the spell copying says you may cast those spells.
@@NitpickingNerds 😮
Basically , you turned Temur deck into one non-original Izzet spellslinger deck? :D Boring route...just play izzet then or grixis
But...that's clearly what he's for. Jamming green onto the izzet spellslinger archetype.