DEEP DIVE | Sydcarmy and The Problem With Claire
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- čas přidán 16. 07. 2024
- #TheBear #Sydcarmy
The Problem with Claire and The Potential of SydCarmy, Let's discuss.
The Bear Season 2 was fantastic but let’s discuss Claire, the romance between Carmy and Claire, and the relationship between Carmy and Sydney. Saying “Claire is annoying” or “you just hate Claire because” doesn’t really get to the crux of the issue with how Claire was written. Also let’s discuss Sydcarmy since it’s on the defense 99.999% of the time.
Chapters:
0:00-3:12 Where they went wrong with Claire and right with Sydcarmy
3:13-5:25 Pixie Girl and Male Fantasy
5:26-8:03 Foundation of both relationships
8:04-10:17 The writers intentions
10:18-17:13 Understanding the power in Sydcarmy’s dynamic
16:14-19:38 KEY MOMENTS TO NOTE!!!! - Zábava
"Like a dead wife in a movie." HAS ME SCREAMING.
😂
🤣🤣
She is soooo dead wife coded fr😅
Forever lost to us… oh well 🤷🏽♀️😮💨🤣
he's immortalized an image of her 😏
Claire is the "perfect" girlfriend, she's
like a mirage, an escape for Carmy, she has no real substance and she doesn't know who Carmy really is. I think the writers did this intentionally to show how what Carmy thought he wanted isn't and it's not what he needs either. BTW when she said "Because you're the Bear," I cringed.
You put it perfectly! She IS a mirage and an escape for Carmy!
I didn't really care for her whole subplot tbh. It works well for character development for Carmen,but I just found her kinda bland?
She represents the beef, something he wanted badly and the easy way out but ultimately wasnt for him and something he earned is better for him in the long run. Claire is easy for him to be with but sydeny is fucking frustrating but she and carmy have earned eachother
Her character was almost distant and her depth was so shallow because it’s from carmy’s perspective. He’s always repeating to her how he missed so much about her life and college and he doesn’t know her really. He knows as little as possible besides her quirky little one liners so he can project whatever he wants on her.
He can hardly handle a relationship even when it’s treated like an idealized escape from his dysfunctional life. I don’t know if he can saddle anymore hard truths with the way he struggles already.
How would he deal with the less than perfect Claire? The Claire that might cry or get snappy after a stressful shift, a Claire that struggles to balance the demanding role of working in the hospital and dealing with her erratic high school crush?
I think it’s intentional that we don’t even bother to get to know her personal life, her family, something tough she went through…we don’t even get a last name.
She’s a mirage that phased into his life that he sabotaged so he can repeat his self loathing cycle because he’s so anxious to attach to anything besides the chaos and perfection of the kitchen.
@@surette2012 This, ALLLL of this..
It’s crazy, I feel like I understand Ritchie’s ex wife that’s barely in the show more than Claire.
exactly
Oh Brittas in this?
Honestly
every time claire was on, i just thought to myself "why? why am i being subjected to this?"
Lol same...they tried so hard to make her perfect she just ended up being so ìncredibly annoying
EXACTLY! I prefer the crazy, complicated, and unsettling women from Shameless except for the mom of his kid at the end any day. Hated every second of boring Mid Claire.
lol
I recently rewatched the show in anticipation for s3 and I skipped every single scene with her in it or discussing her. It was bad enough the first time
@@chisomo8088I watched it for the first time and instinctively skipped ALL her parts. It literally took like 2 seconds after they met for me to already disregard that storyline altogether. I was getting so emotionally invested during the 7 fishes episode just for miss perfect guilt trip by the whole cast now main character backtracking all his progress fkery!!!!!!
I loved how you addressed the panic attack scene. It was so intentional. I can't believe ppl just brush pass it.
Some reviewers straight up ignore it too which is funny but annoying in retrospect.
There was one that said that the panic attack scene was only to highlight WHAT was said, not WHO said it. Then they ignored the table scene altogether. All I could do was SMH.
@@daffieapple CLOCK THAT TEA! They love to ignore the table scene, it's actually funny in hindsight. Why y'all so scared?? They love to ignore Sydney if they don't have to talk about her. Most of them barely even talk about Carmy's flakiness and the impact it has on their partnership.
@@kimberleywilliams7802So for a long time there was this trope in media where if there's a main duo cast of opposite se x, then they must become a couple.
There's a lot of backlash to that trope today though. Rightfully so a lot of times.
But this is not one of those cases. I feel like a lot of people are just so into the "main characters CAN be just friends in 2024!!!"
Like, we know. But these two CLEARLY aren't. Ask the table!
@@user-in2cs1vp6o The table saw all of that and couldn't even LEAVE- Third wheeling and everything.
One major thing I noticed is that when Carmy hurt Clair he didn’t try very hard to amend it. Clair was the one who would initiate the conversation of amending a wrong that carmy did. Whereas Carmy sought to fix things with Syd himself. He initiated the process to fix things with syd and make her feel secure in their relationship. He didn’t do this with Clair. We can see this in the scene where Carmy says to Syd that he should focus on her and that his attention shouldn’t be split. Shouldn’t come at the cost of Sydney.
I feel like a large reason for this is the fact that they run a business together, and like his uncle says, he needs to give is all to the business which means giving his attention to his business partner. Just something to consider
@@nikkiu.2148That's crazy because everyone else keeps trying to downplay Sydney as a mentee and is wondering why she acts like she owns the place though Carmy calls her a partner. The reasoning switches up everytime 😂.
@@nikkiu.2148 No it both he loves her and they are business partners, he said under the table he does not want or could not do it without her.
@@nikkiu.2148 I agree, but I'm still in shock when he said "You deserve my full focus". I'm like Carmy it's not her, but The Bear that deserves your full focus. I find it odd that he said she deserves his attention and not The Bear. Maybe it's a writing error on the writers part. I get that she's his partner, but in Carmy's eyes it seems like Syd means alot to him. He's not even aware of the words he's actually using during those vulnerable moments with her. Not to mention the table talk is emotional cheating. Emotional connection to Syd while in a relationship with Claire 😭😭😭😭😭 So much drama
@@livingbyfaith1 i think the implication was "you deserve my full focus on this project" or at least that's how I interpreted it
13:40 just wanna highlight the fact that the lighting background in the close up scene with sydney is an actual sunshine through the window, whereas the one with claire is from the lamp inside a fridge. which is a nod to real/warm vs. artificial/cold thing you discussed.
You're right !!!
You ate that.
I do believe the superficiality of claire's character and her relationship with Carmy was intentional… maybe even to highlight how much deeper his connection with Syd is?
I think so too, they put too much effort into making her a narrative foil to Syd for it to be a coincidence, from her claiming to be a poor driver, when Syd drove for a living when she worked at UPS, to her telling Carmy her mom was thriving and very much alive, while Sydney's mom is dead, to Claire telling Carmy "never apologize" to Sydney telling him "okay, so don't be" when Carmy said he didn't want to be shitty, Claire wants to understand things, not necessarily fix them (the story with the girl's broken arm, notice how Carmy's face fell when she said this and how he gave her a wrong number afterwards), while according to Carmy, Sydney, "loves taking care of people" etc. The contrasts between Claire and Syd are a mile long, but they aren't flattering to Claire in the least bit - Claire is Sydney's narrative foil. I believe Claire highlighted Sydney's importance to Carmy emotionally and the hold his family has on him mentally/emotionally in his desire for their approval (especially Mikey's approval) that is in conflict with his own desires/needs and wellbeing.
@@currymanganese 👏🏼👏🏼👏🏼
@@currymanganesethis analysis is chefs kiss
@@currymanganese i think youre so right that she is a foil and i think its still a sexist decision on the writers regardless, bc it makes claire out to be "the wrong type of girl" who never asks carmy to apologize and is mindlessly quirky all by herself instead of making her a round character too. like sure she can be annoying and quirky, but why is she like that? claire as a character only makes sense if youre already thinking about women in archetypes and tropes
@@lalalooopsy1234 I get what you're saying, and I also would've prefered if Claire didn't feel so flat as a character, but at the same time, tropes and archetypes aren't inherently bad, it's just the execution of said tropes can sometimes rub us the wrong way. Especially since nothing in Season 1 would've lead us to believe a manic pixie dream girl was in the offing for a relatively grounded show like The Bear. But at the same time, making a character like Claire serve as a foil for Sydney, and making her as, let's say....unappealing..as she was to some of us viewers makes perfect sense narratively if the real romantic pairing that the creators want us to invest in ultimately is Syd/Carmy.
After all, the disposable girlfriend/boyfriend is a staple in stories (not just in the romance genre) for creating tension within the main characters' relationships. Another thing that the writers/showrunners would've been considering too (if they really did not want to make Claire as sympathetic as possible) is that they invested a lot of energy into depicting Carmy in a sympathetic, almost 'everyman' light, so much so that in Season 1 they cut a scene that shows up in a flashback during Carmy's breakdown in the walk-in (where he throws a stock pot at the wall of the kitchen in anger) for fear that it would've made him too unsympathetic if they included it in the series pilot. Since they're that careful with preserving viewers' goodwill for their protagonist, and since Carmy would've come off in a worse light than he already has post season 2, if he were to break the heart of a more endearing version of Claire, then it's no surprise that Claire left as much to be desired as she did.
However, I do think her depiction was sexist, but not just because she was a foil for Sydney, since foils aren't necessarly a bad thing e.g. Richie and Marcus are used as foils for Carmy at times, but because she spent most of her screen time trying to pump validation / closeness out of Carmy for reasons that remain a mystery to us viewers, beyond being "told", but not shown that she loves him. Like OP said, "Why does Claire like this guy anyway?" - we don't get her read on Carmy at all beyond the superficial, "You're really shy..."
I reallyyy realllllyyyyyyyyy wanted to like Claire, I was even willing to overlook the awkwardness and insensitivity in some of her lines in her car conversation with Carmy in Pop "speaking of dead brothers" etc. But the thing that sealed the deal for my dislike for her as a character is her actions towards 2 out of the 3 women she is shown dealing with in Season 2:
1. Her friend, Kelly, has a five year relationship end and is drunk and distraught at a party, and Claire invites Carmy along to said party - not seemingly for him to have fun and cut loose a little....but to seemingly score brownie points with him....by taking care of "sad, drunk people" like she tells him that she knows he has had to do (presumably with Donna) as well? She also uses Kelly's lament over her ex, "he never cooked for me" to gain sympathy from Carmy / prime him to cook for her later on by turning the conversation on herself "no one ever cooked for me either"...And she eventually leaves her drunk friend alone in the company of an unknown man at the party when the opportunity to go off alone with Carmy presents itself "I think Kelly's found a new boyfriend!"
I just started watching S2 of The Bear today, and Claire's introduction was so off-putting to me that I immediately took to the Internet to see if anyone else felt the same way I did, which is how I found this video!
I think you did a really great job highlighting exactly why Sydney and Carmy's relationship works so well!
I feel like a huge difference between Sydney and Claire is showing vs telling. We get to see Sydney earn her place in the kitchen, be an important part of the kitchen, work alongside Carmy and we get to see her backstory, her family etc. On the other hand, Claire pops up out of nowhere but we're TOLD she's perfect for Carmy (by Richie and Michael), we're TOLD they were friends when they were kids, we're TOLD she's amazing, but we don't really get to see it. What we see instead is Carmy neglecting the kitchen because of Claire, we are told about Claire's family and backstory but very briefly and not in a way that would make us care about her as a character. She's more of a hinderance to Carmy and the kitchen than a perfect girlfriend Richie makes her out to be.
The fact that they showed Sydney being jealousy makes me think that they are going to end up together in the end. So much compatibility and chemistry. Thanks for talking about this !
you could read it as jealousy or more of her being pissed off that carmy is being distracted by claire and not focusing on the bear (and helping her because they're business partners!!) i personally saw it as both lol
@@boozeeyit’s the same as with Will Byers in Stranger Things. You don’t know whether he was jealous of Mike because 1) he didn’t play with him or because 2) he had a partner that wasn’t Will. Writers could easily roll with both scenarios. Here as well, writers in The Bear can easily go “platonic soulmates” route or “slowburn” route. I think they will choose the second option but you never know.
@@meri5173 yea totally, it’s leavinf it open ended which is super exciting
I agree. I’m Happy to know I’m not the only one feeling this way. I don’t how to feel about Sid/Carm. If they had real relationship how would that affect the show? There is definitely a chemistry there. I confused ! Clair ? No!
@@boozeeyagree. I really don’t think this is meant to be romantic, more dedication and precision and the goal of being at Carmy’s level.
What’s frustrating is when people try to chalk it up to ayo and Jeremy having chemistry that flows over into Syd & Carmy or that certain things are just coincidences (I mentioned once how Carmy’s fidgets with his fingers when he’s alone with Syd under the table and in the alley in s1 and someone said oh the actor’s hand must have been tired 😅)
Chris storer and his crew are intentional about EVERY detail in this show. Why would they allow their lead actors to run amok?? They would reel it in if they didn’t want Jeremy and Ayo doing too much. Like it’s almost insulting to the show runners when people suggest these things just because they don’t want to acknowledge the elephant in the room
Even if Syd and Carmy never get together, the writers WANT you to think about it. They WANT you to talk about it
Like!! This show is so nuanced and intentional, and literally every second counts!
I 100% agree. I personally don’t want them to end up together. But I see how the romance could be there.
Just a lil tea, Sydney is based off of Chris Storer's wife. She played Richie's ex in Fishes.
I’ve seen people say this but where is it coming from? From an interview Chris storer did or do people just think that Sydney and Gillian Jacob’s are similar ?@@kimberleywilliams7802
@@kimberleywilliams7802 you just gave me so much hope lol, i heard people say that the story is a bit autobiographical
all those shots of her like a dead wife in a movie LOL exactly!!!
i was really pissed at carmy for suddenly deciding he cant have a girlfrend after sleeping with her...but then i remembered, she asked him for his number and he gave a fake one. she tracked him down anyways. she pursued him despite having any hint of his willingness to commit. dumb.
I didn't like her from the beginning for that exact reason! He gave you a fake number, take the hint but she just forced herself into his life anyway. She's constantly forcing herself in. Even in the last scene, you don't just walk into a restaurant kitchen if you're not staff. Like, nobody asked for you!
@@krazykaye8843 cause if it was me i would never track someone down that clearly doesn’t want you to have their number
@@tashayaharris5490 Exactly, and if I were Carmy I would have been immediately turned off by her for that.
@@krazykaye8843 literally immediately cause that was weird asf. Like what do you mean you asked around for my number after I purposely didn’t want you to have it. She would’ve been blocked so fast
I think "tracked him down" is misleading. She's known to the Berzatto family and close with the Faks, as seen in Fishes. The number was only one digit away, so it's plausible for her to think it was a mistake. That being said, I do think Carmy is like the broken leg she wants to understand.
Its so funny to me how people will go on and on about how friendships should be at the foundation of a romantic relationship and yet can't see how Sydney and Carmy are building one of the strongest foundations for any relationship whether it be business, platonic or romantic on the show. The way these two have been working on clear communication skills, setting proper boundaries and a willingness to learn to forgive and move forward is truly admirable. But here comes Claire is who basically the personification of Carmy's dysfunctional past in wide eyed manic pixie clothing and people can't seem to see how this is a poor match from jump.
Claire can't take a hint, doesn't respect boundaries, and will only pull Carmy back to the chaos of his upbringing. She's a familiar fantasy that may not even be his to being with and wildly unhealthy for a man trying to be and do differently with his life.
Richie being so pissed about him hurting her feelings was another red flag. He seems invested in still keeping to old ways and people tied into their progress even if its not appropriate. Claire is still a tie to their past.
I don't know why EVERYONE fails to see this. I feel crazy.
I literally pointed this out and i feel like no one sees it but me, THANK you for validating me
Yep! Richie wanting her for Carmy was the first red flag for me. That guy is too tied to old habits, it's toxic
the way i saw it, richie getting mad at carmen was because carmen was pretty obviously self sabotaging. it didnt really seem like it was about repeating old patterns to me. carmen that whole episode was in a spiral of self sabotage, with him not fixing the fridge door, and then claire, and then lashing out a richie. he was even admitting this to tina that he was self sabotaging.
Sydney and Carmy are meant to be ❤
I feel like writing Claire like that had to be intentional, with how tied with his family and past she is and everyone from his past basically telling him how to feel and act, it's very obvious she was not his choice, it's theirs, it's what he is supposed to want according to them. It's sad to see but a great way to make us not want this relationship to work in the end. Sydney & Carmy's relationship is clearly the one that matters the most, it's so important that she's the only one in the show that has no ties to his family or past. She can and is already helping him deal with his trauma and be better. She doesn't treat him like a baby (like Claire does sometimes) and holds him accountable too, more healthy points!
Their dynamic is everything and I really hope they announce S3 soon. I NEED MORE.
Yes this! When his brother and Fak are stressing to him how he needs to get with Claire and how first he gave her a fake number. He’s trying to please his family even though they’re dead/absent.
I'm so mad I just found this video cause I said all of this on twitter and I felt like I was the only one who saw this.
I don't know. Can't imagine having MIL like Carmy's mom. She's a dealbreaker.
this was my thoughts exactly…the conversations between claire and carmy felt so infantile and uninteresting. nice, because he deserves something nice after what he’s been through, but just not real. not deep like with sydney and carmy. also i just cannot fathom how you can analyse the panic attack and table scene as platonic. honestly this is driving me insane ahaha
Carmy as a character is still riddled with anxiety and still has not worked through his childhood trauma. I will never understand why the writers felt the need to push a romantic interest for Carmy in the second season unless they are playing the long game with him and Sydney. Claire was about as interesting as a piece of sandwich bread. Along with the panic attack scene where Carmy thinks of Sydney, there was another moment where I think Carmy was maybe on the brink of a panic attack and he was having thoughts of his brother, but there was a shot of Sydney put in there too. It happened really fast. I'll have to rewatch and find the episode, but I agree with your point that they want to have the option of a possible relationship with Carmy and Sydney.
The scene you're thinking of happens in Braciole, the season 1 finale when Carmy wakes up from his nightmare IIRC
@@currymanganese That's the one! Thank you!
@@HazelDell no problem!
You just pointed out my two main problems with the Clair subplot. It feels very forced and the character is not interesting. It feels really unnecessary. All their moments together were so rough to watch that I sometimes skipped them. Clair feels like she fits more with one of those crappy rom coms
@@lunavioleta001 The way I was on twitter during her scenes.
Great commentary. And the song during the panic attack scene "these words, you will be mine" it was going backwards in the beginning of the panic attack.
YES like the song is jumbled and backwards showing Claire and his past until Sydney appears and everything makes sense!!
i noticed that too! its definitely intentional
Great video, I agree completely with your points. The panic attack scene always makes me emotional. In the shitshow of his life, Sydney is his joy and solace. It's not the ""perfect girl"" that brings him peace, but the woman who chose him, knowingly, because of everything he is and isn't, and those are the exact moments he remembers. I love their love!!!
I think Clare represents that perfect thing you always wanted, and when you finally get it, you realize it doesn't fill the void. It's not really what you expected it to be. I think she is attached to childhood memories, she has a familiar appeal, but it's just not meant to be. I don't dislike her character, I think she is a lovely girl, and the actress did a good job.
But I guess it was necessary for Carmy to reunite with the girl who got away just so he could finally let her go.
I agree with this assessment
15:22 - THIS!!!!!!!!!!!!!! It's intentional and the editing shows it! Sydcarmy is a slow burn.
You are so on the money with all of it. The Bear plants little clues all throughout the season for future plot points. Everthing is very purposefully done. I do think that Claire was intended as a red herring distraction to show Carmy that he gets to choose his own fate rather than go along with things that are decided for him. Unfortunately, I also think we were meant to like her and they missed the mark with the mani Pixie Dream girl trope. If it had turned out later in the season that Claire didn't actually have it all together, I would have related to the chatacter more but there is absolutely nothing interesting about the perfect woman who's cool and quirky and endlessly understanding of the protagonist. I honestly dont care to see Claire again, shes incredibly frustrating. The SydCarmy relationship has has so much groundwork laid out for it. There are too many parallels in their personalities, past and their passions to just be coincidental or indicative of just any old friendship. The writing for their dynamic has been so careful and considered that it just doesnt make sense to ignore the potential for romance. I also agree that we can disregrd anything the writers or showrunners say, they can and will lie to throw the audience off the scent.
Case in point: “SharpWin” from _New Amsterdam._
The show runner/head writer swore up and down that relationship was never getting out of the FriendZone with the “Who are you going to believe: Me, out your lying eyes?” gaslighting, even in printed interviews, only for him to do a total 180⁰ turn.
Since then, yeah, I don’t believe a word out of the mouth of their mouths😂
I do think the actress had something to do with that. Something about her face in this role was annoying. She just seemed so smug. And the writing certainly didn't help.
I'm so happy you brought up the memory sequence because I explained this to my bf too. I don't think anyone else whom I've watched regarding this ship, talked about the memory sequence, and that's what planted to Sydcarmy seed for me.
I havent even started to watch The Bear yet, but listening to you makes me much, much smarter
❤ For real, she is just eloquent and well-spoken.
the claire thing has to be intentional, i remember being so shocked with how she was written and portrayed, i started googling if there were female writers on the team 😂
Are there any?
hearing your take on this with your experience in post production makes me feel so validated bc I was like I cant be the only one seeing all this
same, watching this video was cathartic
You explained it perfectly, that's how I felt. Claire came out of nowhere and seemed forced and a little dislikeable, her tone was almost always sarcastic. Sydney since the first moment was introduced was positive and made carmy better and more focused. The last episode of season 2 when he thinks of Sydney she gives him peace. He finally has a person in his life that brings peace in his life. Claire on the other had when she was first mentioned he became irate and stressed, from the beginning she was introduced as another stressful and uncomfortable relationship he has to cope with.
Perfect description omg
there were 2 instances/crumbs of sydcarmy in the show that had me shook actually regarding this matter. the first one was the end of the 3rd last episode of season 2, i think, when carmy says that he gotta call his girlfriend and then it is shown that carmy is in his apartment preparing something for claire perhaps and them making out too, etc. and then ONLY SYD IS SHOWN in between their scenes, for what reason idk, scrubbing the floor and travelling by the train(watching coach k videos maybe lol), etc. the other instance was the very next episode with claire and carmy having adult fun time and then the scene of syd trying out uniforms and all, is instantly shown. like, why show only sydney like that in between and just after carmy and claire’s scenes like that? it was deliberate for sure.
Yesss this and the close up of Sydney's tattoo intercut with shots of carmy and Claire hooking up.. I took this as a visual reveal that Sydney has feelings for Carmy?? But I never see anyone mention it!
After the panic attack Carmy seems somehow different to me. He has to understand that it's not right that his girlfriend does not calm him down. She is a part of the past and he has to let go and grow. Idk, after that he almost seems ready to break things off with Claire, ready to make things right, also fix the fridge. And he seems to be very intent on making it up to Sydney and making sure she knows she has all his focus and that is what he wants. I love the scene where Syd tells him that her mother is dead, it seems that they are finally getting back to where they left off(last time they were chatting like this was in his flat, no? before he ditched her for Claire). And then the scene under the table? Who could doubt that there will be something romantic between them after that? They were both so open and at ease, yet it was tense and Carmy rather flees in the end lol. My man was giving Sydney hungry eyes when she walked out in that uniform he gave her. And Sydney really is part of the family now: Richie told her so, and her relationship with Natalie was organic and gradual as well.
claire represents the beef, something he wanted badly and the easy way out but ultimately wasnt for him and something he earned is better for him in the long run. Claire is easy for him to be with and Sydney is fucking frustrating but she and carmy have earned eachother
It's funny how Sugar barely coughs in Claire's direction or mentions her at all while her and Syd's relationship gets better this season.
haha! this was incredbily authentic and hilarious. i appreciated you talking about the manic pixie girl problem/male gaze because it is so accurate and frustrating- especially when it comes to claire, so you were spot on! subscribed :)
For me the least believable thing of Claire 's character is her lack of medical fears kicking in. I thought the set up in the fridge was meant to show her fears that her fucking boyfriend could die freezeing. Everyone was taking him in the fridge like an inconveniente, I thought her would approach the situation as a doctor. I don't know, sorry for my writing, English is not my first language
that's a great point!
You would think, but they forgot to give her a character 😭
Syd is the only one who truly understands Carmy and his passion for food.
I loved this commentary! "This could've been the beginning of a slasher movie!" IKR! I honestly think Carmy x Claire is a riff on Preston x Amanda in Can't Hardly Wait (1998). Their first kiss was basically a mirrored version of Preston and Amanda's and the song that plays over the credits in Pop/the end credits in this movie/Carmy and Claire's first kiss is the same, Fak's favourite song: Can't Hardly Wait by The Replacements 😐. Claire felt like she stepped out of a different genre or an alternate dimension from the rest of the cast right from the beginning.
I sincerely hope she's a one off character/plot device to demonstrate the hold Carmy's family still has on him mentally / emotionally because he let her and his fam violate his boundaries and essentially peer pressure him into being with her. It was so laughable how Mikey/Richie/Claire made it seem like she was Carmy's childhood friend when by Carmy/Claire's own admission they never really talked much in highschool. So all this hullabaloo / oxygen in the plot was dedicated to Carmy's random childhood acquaintance / former crush turned newly minted girlfriend, it was so forced.
Like, Manny and Angel don't even have last names yet as far as I'm aware and they barely have speaking lines, there's still so much of Syd, Ebra, Carmy, Gary, Tina and Marcus' etc. lives we don't know....Marcus is most likely gonna be newly bereaved in S3 AND they need to open and repay Jimmy back asap.....I'd truly be baffled if they bring Claire back to continue to be a spanner in the works for Syd and Carmy's budding relationship when there's so much that hasn't been explored in the show otherwise, and with characters viewers were already emotionally invested in since season 1! The show is named 'The Bear' not 'The Bear & Chicago Medical' or w/e hospital Claire works at. 😔
P.S. Here's Preston/Amanda and Carmy/Claire's first kisses for comparison 😐
czcams.com/video/nrxF51Ff0Ss/video.htmlsi=7IVBWmN4d5D_JA86
Michonne and Rick are a perfect example. They were never together in TWD comics and I don't believe they were supposed to be a thing in the show. Now they have a whole series dedicated to their love. I feel like a Syd and Carmy fit that. Them being together may not have been the blueprint but the way it's playing out feels like they will be endgame
Baby don’t get me started on Rick and michonne ❤ I love those two
I really loved your review! I have the same point of view. I'm Brazilian so I had to use the automatic translator, but I managed to understand what you wanted to say. And Claire as a dead wife got me a little hahahahaha❤
If Sydney and Carmy were real people, I doubt their partners would feel comfortable with their dynamic. "you should be my focus" ????. However, even with how empty Claire is, it felt like that was on purpose. We see her through Carmy's eyes until the end of the season & he's locked in the freezer. She's crying, her face doesn't have that weird filter on it & she looks normal. Claire is not the main problem, it's Carmy's inability to communicate and be happy. Nat offered to do the stuff he kept putting off & he refused. Everyone leveled up in the kitchen except Carmy. He helped all these people grow but, he wasn't there to see it & he's gonna continue to self-sabotage.
I'm rooting for Syd and Carmy! The show is screaming it and yeah I haaaaated Claire. My blood felt icky everytime she was on screen
The slow burn is right there, I can't wait for their chemistry ti bloom and explode.
Thanks for the vid. You brought up so many key things I didn’t even notice before. I didn’t see Carmy and Syd as an item until the last episodes in Season 2…. But it didn’t come out of nowhere. Seeds were planted from the beginning.
And Carmy’s body just aligns with Syd even when they’d arguing. Friends do that too, but unlike a purely platonic relationship, they’re an uneasiness there where they don’t know where they stand with each other.
If they remain platonic or if they become romantic, I won’t be upset either way. But you’re right, Claire is like a male fantasy.
Also come to think of it, it’s infuriating that Claire is a doctor and didn’t refer him to treatment or therapy even though Carmy said she witnessed him have multiple panic attacks. Why gurl why?
Literally my exact thoughts about Claire and we also just know nothing about her at all like what’s to care about? I can’t even tell why she’s even in the show at all, and how everyone has to constantly say how great she is.., show it instead of saying it. It’s just annoying
Honestly got swept up in the escapism she provided that I'm surprised to find the reactions to claire has been so polarizing but you make such great thoughtful points!
Love this take! Please post a follow up at some point.
Thank you for this video. The Claire plot undermined everything that made made this show great and everytime she was on screen the quality of the writing immediately PLUMMETED.
Claire is shot in soft focus all the way through until the final scene outside the fridge. We finally see her, not through Carmy's eyes. Her skin isn't perfect, her makeup isn't perfect. We'll see the real Claire in S3
No thanks.
You've pretty much conveyed the vast majority of my thoughts while watching this Claire character being introduced.
She gave off Desperado vibes which gave me profound secondhand embassment. ;)
Again - ALL Great Points.
It puts me in the mind of another beloved interracial television 'couple' which had seasons of hints, breadcrumbs and a slow burn that MANY of US caught feeling that it signaled something down the line.
It eventually led to the romance of one of the most phenomenal warrior couples on television....
Michonne and Rick Grimes aka #Richonne of The Walking Dead. 😎
Many white folk provlaim to have not seen it coming but the connection, the looks, the moments, his utter respect for her and her word/opinions.... it was all an obvious lead-up for many of us.
i feel like everything in the bear is intentional, so the way they set claire up you just KNOW their relationship is doomed to fail from the very start. it's rushed, strained, they dont really fit together... and carmy (unconsciously) gives her a sign that maybe he doesn't really wanna pursue her despite everyone (richie, michael etc) telling him "she's the one!!". like in fishes he was very pissed off about them talking to and about her and implying she's his dream girl. the whole relationship feels unnatural, rushed, and just... wrong. it feels very strained, but i also think he desperatly wanted some normalicy in his life now that he's like getting his shit together, trying to find something beyond working in the kitchen. it's a way of trying to grab the reigns on his life back after the turbulence of season 1.
i just had this thought but, maybe he even did it to make his brother happy? just a thought.
Claire stuck out like a sore thumb in this amazing show. She was so badly written into the whole thing that I was really baffled because other than her the show is so so so so insanely well made, from the acting,the writing, the story-telling, the characters, the editing, just perfect. I am praying that she won't come back in season 3.
She’s definitely coming back in s3. Carmy is gonna need to explain his feelings to her in what he said in the fridge. Whether that brings closure & they continue the relationship or not idk. I just need Carmy to get some real help before he gets serious about a romantic relationship, it would just be better for not only him but also everyone he works with. I love the relationship he has with Syd. I like them more than Claire. I just hope that they get help first before being in a relationship otherwise it’ll crash & burn like him & Claire (so far)
Claire was a prop to make the "you have to be misserable to be a genius" trope which after 8 seasons of House M.D I'm sooo over it. The worst part of the show without a doubt.
No shade to the actress it was unfair for her too.
This is one of my favorite analysis video I've ever watched! I learned a lot about film and TV from you. I also cracked uppp at your reads. You even had be blushing like MAD (I'm a die hard Syd/Carm fan) when you named those intimate ass moment breadcrumbs the writers are giving us!
This video essay honestly was so soothing and relatable to watch, thank you so much for your thoughts and ideas, these are great!!
omg I had all these thoughts abt this season and you managed to put them into words. Great video, great point, every question you made was so valid, like, how can the writers say there's not romance there and then do this??
“If someone said she was a figment of carmy’s imagination because he had brain tumor I would totally believe it” LIKEEEEE LMAOOOOOOOOOOOOO so trueee
Why would they put the scene of Syd & Carmy being awkward about to leave for the day asking eachother what they are doing afterwards & leaving that awkward silence (an opportunity for one of them to ask the other to hang out afterwards) if it didn’t mean anything. That was a chance for them to get to know eachother better but then he met Claire. Even gave Claire the wrong number on purpose. Afraid of what could come of it. It makes complete sense with where Carmy is in the story. I just wish they didn’t drag the Claire thing out the whole season & wove her into the story so unauthentically compared to all the characters in the show. She’s very sweet but compared to the off the wall chemistry & build Syd & Carmy have, there’s no question, I love them. They are the heart of the show & the story. Do they need to be romantic, I’d love it. Love a nice slow burn but let’s not pretend that there’s zero chance of them getting together in the future. The set up is all there. The admiration, drive, respect, friendship, it’s all there. Why not. Platonic relationships can exist. If that’s what they have rn (I think it’s more) then ok sure but if that changes, it was all planned from the start. It’s all about that build & I love that.
im waiting for season 3. you got punctual points well done!!
Claire was the only bad part of S2! She better be one and done.
I agree it feels like she just came out of nowhere land....I mean all of a sudden she pops up, yeah I didn't like it....he has way better chemistry with Sydney!
I can't believe you were brave enough to talk about this but thank you!!
just going to say that i would be SHOCKED if the writers didn't write claire like this on purpose. claire is meant to be this easy love interest that carmy can get lost in and ignore his trauma with. shes supposed to be generic, she's supposed to always easily get along with him. they already know each other from the past so there's no drama, and all of his family loves clarie (when they talk about her in the ep fishes). that's why it hurts even more in the last episode of season 2 because he self-sabotages his relationship when she was ready to love him, and this confirms for him that he is unfit to love and be loved (especially because of his trauma with his mom). that's why i think this is really setting up a slow burn with syd, he's going to keep pushing her away even though they care so deeply about eachother, but i think it would wrap up both of their story arcs really well when they both allow themselves to love freely and be invested in eachother and the bear. (again who knows if that will happen)
Thank you for this video. I have HATED the character Claire and the way the MEN on the show talk about her as well. What throw-away writing of a character, a textbook example of writing a woman AS A FUCKING PROP
The Bear earns the emotional payoff. It never gives any of the joy for free. People suffer. Sid and Carmy could end up with each other, but it all needs to simmer for longer.
I genuinely think the uncomfortableness/annoyance we feel with claire was very deliberate, we're supposed to feel that way about her. They want the audience to *feel* it isn't right for Carmy instead of telling us in the dialogue the same way they are making us *feel* the connection between sydcarmy without directly telling us. They directly told us everything necessary to know with Claire/Carmy because we weren't supposed to *feel* anything with them.
I don't think it was bad writing at all, I think it was written this way very intentionally. The writing of this show is written to appear at a very surface level but the music, the sound effects, the very specific choices of direction etc are where the real story is being told. Every Carmy and Claire scene *felt* uncomfortable to me and it wasn't even because Carmy just seemed like he wasn't being himself with her most of the time. All of the things I mentioned above were showing us that their relationship was not right for Carmy while the well established childish "loser" of the show, Richie, was saying the opposite! They weren't trying to sell Claire to the audience through Richie, they were doing the opposite. Meanwhile they were showing sad montages of Syd lonely without Carmy letting us know that's where our sympathies should lie as the viewer.
It makes sense, though! She's an idea, a mirage! In life sometimes you need to choose between the mirage (Claire) and the real deal (Sydney). She's everything Carmy could ever want, right? Then, why this relationship feels so empty? Because that's all it is, an empty shell.
Fantastic deep dive.
i love your perspective but i also feel like you're wrong and right at the same time. the writting of claire is in fact purposeful and made to be a parallel to sydney's character, Carmy can't really be himself with Claire because she seems to have a wrong impression of him, he is himself with sydney because she gets it. she gets the passion, the ambition, the fear, everything. not because they're alike but idk, they both have strong ties to their jobs and their identities are tangled in it to the point they kind of forget themselves, and they have to show up eveyday to find that joy again. like being ER is important to claire but it isn't her whole life.
Honestly props to the actress because she still made me like her character even though everything was stacked against her in the script department and me absolutely hating this type of female character. It's a wonder this subplot didn't take me out of the show entirely and it is weird how this horrendous writing is stuck in the middle of so much good.
They might still give her character development, but even if they do, I'm much more interested in seeing Sydney and Carmy together.
It’s hard to tell what the writer’s intentions are with Syd and Carmy. I’ve seen male-female friendships portrayed in tv before and it wasn’t so….emotionally intimate. I’m not saying you can’t have those moments with friends but the tone that they chose to put the scene in made it come off as less platonic and potentially something else. And I don’t think that was by accident; the writers are too good for that.
Brilliantly stated!
Carmie doesn’t need a girlfriend right now. Carmie is broken, and needs to seek intense therapy. Any woman ( including Sydney) who enters a relationship with Carmie will be hitting themselves against a brick wall with a healthy dose of verbal abuse. Sydney are business partners, and Sydney needs to focus on business and getting that Michelin star ⭐️. I also believe Sydney has some concerns (Possible Lupus diagnosis) that have not been revealed on the show as yet and will make any relationship impossible. Regarding Claire, Carmie needs to focus on making The Bear successful and straightening out his personal relationships with his family. That’s ALL he can handle. Not every show needs a relationship at the center of it. 🤨🤨🤨
This take is perfection. 🤌🏼🤌🏼
I’m team SydCarmy slow burn- then romance 💘.
Thanks for the knowledgeable commentary.
I do feel bad for the actress that plays Claire because writers did do her wrong. But she seem to be written just to cause tension between Carmy and the Sydney.
I was trying so hard to figure out where tf Claire came from and why we kept seeing her. It was really offputting when she kept popping up and Carmy completely ignored Syd's needs. Like he doesn't even have to end up with Syd (I loved the table scene, there was so much tension) but it's clear they belong together. Not specifically romantically, but they work great together when they are focusing on their shared goals and passion. And there was Claire just... like an apparition LOL
gurl your commentary made me laugh--i actually don't mind if syd and carmy reman friends but listening to your commentary got me rethinking because yeah claire is now looking bland as hell---she did annoy me when she said "because you're the bear" i was like huh corny as hell
Carmy has changed. How can Claire love him if she doesn't know who he is now?
Man, you are in my inner thoughts!
I honestly think the left the breadcrumbs there as an option. They don't know exactly what they plan to do, but they wanted the option, they wanted to keep the door open. It is very obvious. I don't know why people are in denial. They would not be good writers if they didn't do that. Its clear they started the show without knowing how it would end necessarily so it would make sense that the left their options open.
I just finished the second season last week and it's still on my mind. I really love all the main characters. What a cast!! Every episode feels special. Anyways, I hope for a full-blown, quietly passionate Sydcarmy romance at the end of season 3 or starting in season 4. I think the writers are more than capable of making the transition feel natural, which it seems they are already working on. However, I hope it's well-received. In my opinion, part of the pushback from fans is that Ayo (Sydney), while adorable, isn't a stereotypical leading lady. If Jeremy Allen White (an average looking guy but sexy imo) had the same magical chemistry with someone hotter I think less people would be whining about keeping them platonic.
It really was just lazy character writing to me. A huge issue I had with Claire was not so much her generic quirkiness (though i guess this contributes to the main issue), it was the fact that we constantly hear about how perfect she is and yet we never SEE her do anything that makes us believe it, aside from her little pep talk with carm. But even that pep talk was just... Talking and no actions. Based on this one thing she does all we can truly gather about Claire is that she is nice. And that's it. We barely see her grapple with her anxieties until the final episode. That plot point of having her get carmy's real number is also the only other action we see her do and that tells us nothing interesting about her character and at worst it makes her seem bad with boundaries. I don't know... I'm hoping that the character doesn't return if this is the quality of writing they put into her introduction. If they flesh her out in the next season I won't be mad because she definitely needs it. But this was just poor character writing full stop with Claire.
thank you for explaining it I couldn't tell why I was cringing so much about Claire XD
I also don't buy into a literal doctor being not stressed at all by things in life and having loads of time and space for Carmy's shit. I guess I also agree that Claire and Carmy isn't good. I'm not convinced that Sid and Carmy should be more than a close friendship
it felt soo weird that she tracked him down after giving the fake number.
considering that, i think it would be a fun twist that claire is sort of fucked up and manipulative. like her interest being on carmy's reputation and possible money. it would make sense of her admiration being pure flattery
at least thats how i would "fix" her character
Also when they found the money carmy said to Sydney her plans from the report she wrote him and Passover it at the time showing her that he really did care about what she was thinking and believing in him 😢❤
I get it but can two chefs actually be together?
What? That happens quite frequently in real life. The owners of the Chicago restaurant Kasama are a couple. If you're in the hospitality industry you know this.
Why not? I see two doctors/surgeons be together. same goes for 2 lawyers, nurses, teachers, programmers (like myself, dating another programmer). So, why can't two chefs?
they added claire into the show because they wanted us to feel this way about her. i say that because while we feel this way about claire, sydney also feels this exact way. like sydney we want the restaurant to work we want to see it go well we're invested in it, but carmy hasn't been invested in this season cause he's messing around with claire, a girl we don't even know. so overall the feeling we have and you have towards her being here is the "secret" but not so secret feeling syd has anytime claire is involved. she's used as an enhancer to let us feel what syd is and to show how bad carmy is with knowing what he actually wants. from super chef to pants designer to restaurant owner to boyfriend bro is just lost.
i claire is MEANT to juxtapose against carmy, to surface how his internal struggles bleed into the external, directly referencing how he mirrors his mother by being unable to function in stillness in peace and "ruining" something good. However, her character's exposition is written soooo lamely, and all that comes across less strongly than the juxtaposition between claire n syd
How can I like this video more than once 🎉
I know Ayo has said that she doesn't really want Sydney and Carmy together or can't see it happening, but I'm so drawn in by how they're paralleled and have that two sides of the same coin dynamic. Every time I see Claire she seems like an invader. I know of course that men and women can just be friends but there's already so many examples of this in the show, and I honestly can't see any other ending than a slow burn Sydcarmy that could be truly satisfying.
Actors say that sometimes to keep the spoilers down. Last time Ayo was interviewed with that question the first time she says maybe but they have to do a lot of work on their trauma.
I completely agree about all the Sydcarmy stuff. Especially about not paying attention to what the show runners say. The draw is in the will-they, won't-they, so it never makes sense for them to tell people ahead of time if they will or won't. Any show I've ever seen that had a will-they, won't-they couple in it, the show runners played it off and pretended it either definitely wouldn't happen or that they weren't sure, because they obviously wanted to be able to surprise the audience. Also, they sometimes change their minds based on the chemistry of the actors. After seeing the incredible chemistry between Syd and Carmy (on screen and off), they'd be stupid not to take advantage of that.
As for Clair, I think it's important to remember that this is a story that is not being told in a linear fashion. It has taken 3 seasons for us to see how Tina came to work at the Beef and why she loved Michael so much. We still don't know much about Carmy's dad or when exactly Michael started struggling with his mental health. I think at some point we may get more background on Clair and why she's had a crush on him all these years, and how she happened upon him in the store that night. She may even get a whole episode to tell that story, starting from high school. We'll see her admiring his artwork, even when he didn't know he was being watched. Maybe we'll see her hanging out with Michael and the rest of Carmy's family but always keeping an eye out for him because he was cute and sweet, but so shy she was never able to really get to know him. Then he went off to NY for culinary school, and she went to NY for med school, and they were both so busy over the next ten years or so. But now, Clair has graduated and is back in town, and maybe someone told her that he was too. Maybe they even told her that he had a crush on her back in the day (his whole family seemed to know that). She had never stopped thinking about him, and thought, maybe now is my chance. So she found him in the store and finally went for it. And because she knows he's unbearably shy and withdrawn, she wasn't going to let him push her away with a fake number. I think getting the back story on Clair would really help flesh out that character and her relationship with Carmy. But I think it will be all to set up the fact that Clair was his dream girl once upon a time, but they're different people now. And memories of her are so tangled with his dysfunctional family, it would be best for Carmy to start fresh with someone who isn't connected to any of that. Syd didn't even know Michael, which in so many ways is a good thing. She's the only person on the show that knows Carmy just for him, not through Michael. And that is significant.
I think Claire and Carmy felt inauthentic and not organic too, but that didn't stop me from crying when Claire overheard Carmy's breakdown in the fridge. I think he liked her and had a feel of what happiness and "normal" can be like, but the timing was just off with the restaurant opening and her being tied to his past too... I agree her place in the show was not earned like the other characters. I'm not sure how I feel about Syd&Carmy for now, I kind of see them in a platonic way with potential for more than friends.
I really like reading posts like this. I find it interesting how human beings act so differently when it comes to the same situation/s. I didn't cry, but for some reason I felt like I was holding my breath from the moment Carm met Claire. When she heard his freezer breakdown, I honestly felt like I could breathe again. ...... And to be honest I feel like I was experience what Carm was going through while dating her.
yes yes yes!! Syd and Carmy belong together because they speak the same language!! Claire was nice but it feels like Carmy can be himself with Syd...they belong to the same world. I hope the writers have them end up together...it seems that way and it would be nice to see the characters fulfilled.
You know, I actually didn't hate Claire. I sorta liked her. My interpretation of the Claire x Carmy x Sydney situation slightly differs from yours but ultimately similar in that we both ship Carmy and Sydney and believe that the writers are laying the foundation/option of making them end game.
Mini detour, what do you guys think of Sydney and Richie? Some character development over the next 4 seasons, the enemies to lovers could be soooo good.
Okay back to our #1 ship. I got the impression we supposed to view Claire through Carmy's "eyes" - her character only exists to reveal and develop Carmy's character. All her scenes and mentions were all in relation to Carmy. I do agree with you that she represents the pixie dream girl. Anyway, ultimately her character development is not important.
Now to the panic flash scene. Since we are analyzing Carmy's panic flash scene, we need to view Sydney through Carmy's eyes (similar to Claire) and looking at the 2 Sydney flashback moments - lets dive a little bit deeper. 1st Sydney flashback scene is their first meeting when she came to work for him and the 2nd flashback scene is when she came back which also happens to be when he found the money. Personally, I think the power of the flashbacks lie not in the moment but in what came afterwards. Those moments represent a shift in Carmy's world and Sydney became the new inspiration/drive behind Carmy. I don't deny that the Berzatto brothers dreamed of running a restaurant together (The Original Beef and The Bear) but it's only becoming possible because of Sydney.
So anyway, why was the thought of Sydney able to calm down Carmy and not Claire? I think the key is to understand what each lady represents to Carmy. One, the past, doubt and dysfunction and the other the...
I'd love to hear everyone's thoughts on this and whether you agree or disagree with me 😂
Yeah, I think Carmy thought of her as a manic pixie dream girl and the reason why she left after he made that speech in the fridge is the fact that she realised he saw her that way. Him making her into a manic pixie dream girl meant that he saw her as oppositional to him becoming better in the restaurant, but it was never her who took him away from it in the first place. It was him. He decided to keep on skiving off to do stuff with Claire when he should have been working, and he decided not to let her know he should have been working. He made her into his manic pixie dream girl, he didn't give her a chance to be there for the more serious stuff or the work related stuff and the moment she realised that was the case she had to leave.
claire represents the beef, something carmy wanted badly and the easy way out in life. The beef ultimately wasnt for him (running the remainder of it and it adding to his anxiety). and something he earned is better for him in the long run (both his time in nY/Copenhagen and opening up the bear). Claire is easy for him to be with and will dismiss her own feelings for him. Sydney wont let his bad habits or irresponsibility fly. she and carmy have earned each other
Ayo is the whole reason I started watching the show in the first place, so I paid particular attention to things she did. I assumed that Carmen was significantly older than her at first, until they started playing up how he's the baby. But even then I took it as kind of a hero worship / Mentor type thing.
What I really paid attention to were the moments between Sydney and Marcus. The similarity and understanding each other's lives, both being young, black, and culinarily gifted. So I wondered if they would keep it buddy buddy or romantic. And the brief failed ask out in the end (boy can I relate), felt very real but I wondered what that meant for them going forward.
Then cut to Carmen and Sydney working together. What seemed to be a great partnership suddenly started seeming like more. On a certain level, I could totally see it. The thing that made me not want to see it was just the differences in their Lifestyles and histories Beyond cooking.. But still, there was just something there.
I didn't recognize Claire as the manic pixie type at first. Because they did a great job of disguising it with her actually having great responsibility. Being a doctor means that she obviously took something very seriously, unlike the typical manic pixie that just floats through life. And the fact that she remembered and pursued Carmen was definitely a trick. It made it seem more in their relationship than they're actually was.
Funny enough I've been in the same situation, being an introvert but going to a party for the manic pixie. And somehow I also ended up opening up also. From an outside perspective people probably came to the same thought, she made him open up, she made him more fun! He's going to love her for that! But really with the way Carmen is, just the fact that she crushed someone so closed off to partake in a raucus social event, really seems like the type of action of someone that doesn't really care about YOUR feelings. Then I started to think about her being a doctor, but her being so free for Carmen. And why did she like him so much again? And that's where I really started to be confused by their relationship. That type of thing just doesn't happen
And while my brain started to notice them sewing the seeds of Sydney plus Carmen I really couldn't see them bonding beyond a shared interest. I was really rooting for Sydney and Marcus.
But if they do wind up with Sydney plus carmen, I'm going to need to see them connecting on a deeper level. It is obvious that Pete fell for Sugar before he met her family because they treat him like absolute crap, and it is so uncomfortable for him 99% of the time. Could Sydney be happy in that type of environment? I don't think so at all.
Overall, really good video, definitely give something to think about, and more to consider analyzing about the characters.
I agree with all of this. I still think there's a potential for Syd and Marcus, actually. Their personalities compliment each other very well! But I go back to what Luca told him (and what prompted him to finally just ask Syd out), and how Luca wanted more from life and how it made him a better chef. That's my concern with him and Syd. I think, like Carmen, her entire life is the kitchen and that might mean being in relationships with people who are also like her. This is fiction, but the restaurant she and Carmen were supposed to go to is a real one and the people who run it are married. For people like Marcus and Luca, that might be a line they want to draw. I actually think Syd will give Marcus a chance, and it'll be fun to watch them try to navigate a relationship! I just think that like Cuz said, Carmen seems to hate the kitchen but also love it, and I think that's the same for Syd. They love food in all its beautiful ugliness and that might just be right/healthy for them as individuals. Which is why I think they mesh so well, full stop. I do think Marcus is starting to get it though.
As far as the intimacy with Carmy and Syd, I think her telling him that her mother was dead was a big step. And his response, feeling like he should have known that already is engaging to me as a viewer lol Because I think they think the same on a lot of fronts, but like you said, they don't know a lot about each other in actuality. Being "soulmates" can only get you so far.
@@skatergurljubulee reading this again... Wow so well written/said.
tbh i kind of liked her, maybe that s just because i like molly gordon , but i defenitly didnt want her to last, she was getting annoying in way, she was too perfect, she was like a mirage like it was said in the video and like it was the show that carmy was "waiting for the other shoe", it felt like idk a dreamy bubble that had to explode at some point
i didnt see a lot of ppl mention this but at the end of the "you make me better at this" scene like carm says "i wont let you" and they stare at each other and he turns his at some point and it s like a little awkward and that might be nothing idk.
but the editing, especially in the two, three last episodes is so obvious abt sth going on between carm and syd and just like carm ending things with claire.
for exemple in the 8th episode, we see carm claire and sydney coming home and carm cooking for claire. But it doesnt make any sense for syd coming home to be amongst those shots, if there was nothing that hinted at syd and carmy being romantic they wouldnt add her coming home in that moment, i think it s implying through the editing of those scenes that she could/should be the one coming home to carm, also they would probably like come together tho
then in the next episode, it starts with carm and claire in bed then it cuts to black to syd getting ready. it basically implies the same as the last minute of the 8th episode. It could also mean sth else, like syd could represent the restaurant i guess and a how it could be sth good and the bubble he lives in with claire is not sth that will last, which is proved when she goes to his restaurant and that bubble explodes faced to the reality of his world and how those two cant coexist
and the panic attack was also just another scene where we could see that she and what they only bring him stress and anxiety meanwhile syd in someone who grounds him and is like a constant in his life
also even though he mentions having talked abt his family trauma after a panic attack with claire, we never get to see that, or any really meaningful conversation with claire, he s only one part of himself with her bc it s all nice, so he s kind of mostly nice when he s with her too
Thank you for saying what a lot of us fans are thinking
I think (and hope) it is going to be a slow burn. I hope they avoid typical, lazy will-they-or-won’t-they tropes and instead let the denouement rise like homemade bread.
Miss Madame..
You Ate that Up👏👏👏🤣🤭👏👏👏💐💐💐💐💐
BRAVO👏💐👏💐👏💐
i thought i was the only one who didn’t like herrrr omg lol. i don’t like her character at allll. Its like she’s trying too hard or something i cant put my finger on it
It’s like she’s trying to be “Look at me, I’m so quirky and cool and sexy, with my constant whispering and ‘witty’ comments like turning a conversation about your dead brother into a demand that you go to a party with me!” all the time.
I'm 5 months late but I'm honestly not sure where this relationship is going. On the one hand I think this would be amazing as a slow burn romance, but at the same time I really want to see Ayo's character go further than just being a "romantic interest" to anyone in the show. You guys forget that romance isn't everyone's end goal. Ayo clearly wants something from all the hard work she's putting in. I just really want her to succeed without things getting muddy or watered down. I also don't want her to turn into Carmy's security blanket when he needs someone to make him feel stable (which is usually given to black women in movies and shows). He has his own issues to unpack, and I'm not saying people with issues shouldn't get together, I'm just saying he really messed up with Claire. Clearly he's not ready for something real, and I don't want them to push Syd to fill that role just because. Like I need a reason for them to fall in love. Food and a similar goal for the restaurant isn't enough for me. I need passion for one another.
I agree with all this!
Agreement they have an amazing friendship. Romance I don't see. Feels almost like his little sister.
when Carmy and Syd meet for the first time was a stereotypical film "meet-cute" if I ever saw one, lol, they might not end up in a romantic relationship, but they are supposed to be together