Ep. 51 Tom Tuning Relationships for Rock/Pop
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- Äas pĆidĂĄn 25. 02. 2019
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The pitch relationship between multiple toms in a setup is a topic of constant conversation. Often times drummers will resort to a fixed interval or even a set of definitive pitches for each of the drums. We take a different approach and break down our method for tuning toms given a modern rock/pop scenario in Episode 51.
Hosted by: Cody Rahn
Production: Ben O'Brien Smith @ Cadence Independent Media
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Love how you guys always present stuff in a manner of âlet us tell you what you donât know about drumsâ vs âlet us tell you how much more we know about drums than youâ. The difference is subtle but appreciated.
I believe Stewart Copeland once said â your rack toms should sing, and your floor toms should sound like the foot steps of god.â I tend to agree. Great video guys, I always look forward to your content.
THIS!!! You really see this out of those us that were around in the 70s and 80s and the idea that 2 toms on a kit is enough voicing for a song is just 'wrong'. As Neil Peart is quoted as saying, "Less is not more... more is more." I don't think I have even played a kit with less than three mounted toms of some sort and it's usually in the 4 - 7 range - and yes, that just mounted/rack toms not counting floors.
@@thunderfoot11 Right on, as I'm a rack tom player myself (4 toms on a Rack and a 28") Just like that Copeland quote!
This series is by far the smartest and most useful series to how drums behave, how we can try different methods. You help us understand how drums work, and not just give us a certain (maybe) working idea. Your approach is a lot better because you teach us how to think drums (if that makes sense). Would love to see a video on drum tuning accessories, like Drumdial, Tunebot, etc. I'm sure you'll find out too that heads don't strech the same way at every lug, so a Drumdial works only for new(er) heads and only to get you in the ballpark, etc. There are a ton of issues that one can find if one takes the time and thinks it through.
Oh man, you guys always leave me with so much to think about!
Fun stuff, right?! Be sure to experiment a bit and then feel free to hit us with any questions/comments/stories about your experience. Cheers! -Ben
Jordan, Oh Man, I agree with your Comment. Rob Brown in his videos, says" don't overthink this, Man". I am a 70 YO, retired, who plays only for personal Enjoyment to play an instrument. I resurrected playing in 2019, after a 50 Year Hiatus. I am a Obessessive Complusive person. That OCD is starting to hit me. What I have learned that when I frustrate myself by trying to achieve the "perfect" sound form my Drums, (especially, the Doooo, Doooo sound that Jared on DRUMEO describes), that on many of these YT videos, the drums are Miced up. So after watching Eric (?) here, Rob Brown, Jared, Stepehen Taylor, the 80/20 Drummer, it starts to make me a bit Crazy. I hve 4 Toms (2 Racks 12 & 12 ) and 2 Floor Toms (14 & 16). In order to get close to that Dooo, Dooo sound, I find i need to Moongel (and Gatt Tape) the batter heads. I tend to get some Overtones form the Toms, is That what Copeland says is "singing". Man having OCD SUX.... But sometimes it's Fun. I play about 1 hour a day to MY Music : Clapton, Winwood, Stones, Beatles, Petty, Mellencamp, CCR, Cars, Talking Heads, Springstein, Eagles, even Bonnie rait and Linda Ronstadt, and more. Be well. Post any other tips that might help. Oh yeah, PDP Concept maple 6 Drum Kit with Evans Cl;ear G1s on the reso heads and Evans G2s Coatd on the batter heads.
I have used a four tom setup for quite a long time; 2" diameter size intervals. I figured out a simple technique for setting tone intervals between them that I really like. Starting with the second higherst tom, play the first six notes of the US national anthem. The floor tom dictates the bottom tone, according to how you decide to tune it, but the interval is based on the anthem.
I often find myself nodding in agreement with the content. The major improvement though is the drums are being played more often backing up the theory with sound. Great stuff.
PERFECT TIMING! I was just messing with re-tuning my toms again and trying to get them more in tune with each other
Really enjoyed this!!
Man, I love all of these videos and am really paying attention to this. I just bought my dream kit and am getting ready to put all new heads on it. I just bought a 6 piece Sonor Designer in African Bubinga wood. Looking forward to playing around with these tuning schemes. Thank you for all you do. Not only do I appreciate it, but my band appreciates it. LOL!!
Always top quality information. Thank you!
Man I love your videos. Iâm pretty new still to drumming, Iâm coming up on a year with my kit, but I really like to understand how and why things work and donât work and if there are other ways and methods out there and dude you are one of the few that knows your shit. So many drummers were writing stuff (when I was really first getting started) like that they donât change the tuning on their heads for like an entire year once they put on their new heads n stuff.
Iâm just real glad to see someone who goes super in depth on all these subjects. Love your content.
Btw, I gotta rewind to get the name of the guy you mentioned, but about a month or two ago I decided to detune my snare a little to tune it to a more funky rock style and so then I didnât like the feel of where my toms were sitting at in comparison so I ended up raising the reso on tom 1 and keeping the batter fairly tight and so at that point my 10 tom was definitely higher in pitch than my snare and funny thing is I kept my 12 the same and kinda used it as a marker of where I was and then I lowered the reso on my floor tom which is a 16 and tuned up the batter and then went back to the 12 and slightly detuned batter and had to tune up the reso decently.
I usually like having somewhat similar sounding toms, but sometimes I also like to kinda have like my 12 tom be the main go to and the 10 and 16 will go on the other ends of the extremes almost with the ten having loads of attack and tons of sustain and then the 16 growling and vibrating the house lol
But if I were to record myself or be close micâd instead of needing my drums to project well then Iâd probably start with wherever I want my snare at, then figure out the best place for my middle 12 tom based on my kick and snare and then based on those configurations Iâll then setup the 10 and then my 16 floor tom and usually by then all the drums flow well together and thereâs usually no big outliers in the odd sound department.
You asked us to comment on what we like n stuff, well I like be able to actually have the knowledge and capability to change up my tuning like this whenever I want to. Like Mr. Greb says, if your excuse for not knowing how to tune properly is only tuning once a year when you got new heads or whenever you got them, instead take your heads on and off and in one hour maybe you can completely tune up and detune and repeat on your drums a good 5 times, so if you do that everyday then in 3 days youâll have 15 years of tuning experience.
I I think too many people are finding a sound they like and then being like okay I donât need to know how to go anywhere but here, which I understand, but donât really approve of even if I didnât currently drum. There are also guys that are pretty successful at the drums and still have no clue how to tune the heads. Donât ask me why, I have no clue how that happens, tuning was one of the first things I was learning, but oh well, we can only push ourselves, not others.
But like my sisters boyfriend came over once and said he had experience on the drums and Iâm like sweet maybe Iâll actually learn something new and cool, but as soon as he sat down he doesnât really know more than just a few basic beats and he could work a little on how he holds the stick, but heâs naturally the guitar player, so itâs no wonder that once I asked him if heâs ever tuned drums before his answer was âI usually just sit down at our drummerâs kit and theyâre already done.â Lol
Everyone in the band can always be a drummer lmao you know, until they sit down and try
10 outta 10 on this one, amigo. Somebody told me years ago (when we all had a ton of toms) that the less mic's on the kit, the more pitch difference between the toms. It keeps the individual pitches clear out front. I've stuck with that advice & it's never failed me.
Very good video! Look forward to the next one.
I bought a drum tuner and, while my tom intervals have been amazing, I havenât been satisfied with my floor tom sounds since. Iâm hoping the pro-tip at 2:21 will help. I have watched every video and I have learned useful tips from each one. Thanks again, dudes!
Another really good video, and the tone you get from only 2 mics going to tape, is really impressive. Nice job.
Thanks so much! If the drums sound good in the room with this approach, they'll sound good when recorded. We've also worked to treat the room a bit so we're not running into all sorts of wild reflections and whatnot. More on that soon... Cheers! -Ben
Spot on dude! It took me years to realize that giving each tom it's own voice is more important than intervals! Find that sweet spot on each drum and they will usually find the right Voice overall! One of my kits is a 12, 13 and 16 and I always find it a bitch to get the toms just right! I usually just pull the 12 and save myself the hassle⊠LOL! Great video as always! Cheers⊠Keith
Thanks for all your help guys, recording went great!
Excellent! Glad to hear it, James. Cheers! -Ben
Another great video guys!!! On my reference kit 10,12,14 and 16 with 22" kick. I kick the reso head up about 25%. On my BEBOP kit. 12,14,and 18" kick I tune the batter head up about 25% higher. It's kinda strange for some reason but the end result is fantastic. I For the longest time use to tune both heads the same but I find now by trying this method I can tune my heads a little tighter and at 64 years old the extra rebound off the heads is wonderful.
Great info! Also, great timing, as I'm actually playing with a 5-piece kit for the first time in a while this upcoming weekend.
So well explained! I have a certain way of tuning, that gives me a Sound that I like. Normally i get fourths and fiths. But I dont go cracy with the exakt tones distances. From this basis I can go to a specific sound.
I just got some UV2s and decided to try tuning to certain pitches to achieve intervals between heads and between drums.
Man, what a different way to tune. Like the most frustrating banjo tuning ever.
It did achieve a really sweet C#/ F ish floor tom sound with a little muffling, but my 10 and 12 were tough. Evtnaillu I leave up on pitch and simply trusted my instinct as I had before.
Once itâs all dialed in, I do plan to record those notes and intervals for suture reference.
Thanks again guys! đđ
dude, so thankful for this video, recently got my mapex meridian birch and I was having a problem with my tom tuning, they soung really great, but just do not blend togheter well. Really grateful for your information!
Great video as always! I hadnât thought before about how the depth of the toms would affect what interval you might choose. It got me thinking, it would be super cool to be able to isolate the effect that the depth of the shell has on the tone of a drum, assuming all other factors were the same.
Keep the videos coming though! Iâve been following since the beginning and this quickly became my favorite channel by far!
Another great video. Never thought about playing toms together to see if you like the combined notes.
Also I recommend the Pearl floor tom leg air suspension rubber feet to get more low end frequencies out of your floor tom. Amazing how much the legs being in direct contact with the floor chokes your floor tom.
Yes! That's a topic we covered in depth in Ep. 17: czcams.com/video/nKsV501prgw/video.html&
@@SoundsLikeADrum How did I miss this?! I thought I was an episode completist. I like how you all start from the point of zero choke.
"the interval is not the sound" LOVE IT. great video
Exactly! Thanks so much for watching. -Ben
I'd really like to see you pick up on the topic of "old" vs. "new" standart, when it comes to rack toms (10/12 vs. 12/13). Diving in on the tonal possibilities of each setup at different tuning ranges or pairings with floor toms. Thanks for producing such great content!
i like your input. subscribed!
Another great video - nice to see you play Cody.
Thanks! Gonna keep adding more of that in the future.
This is exactly what i wanted to see
I copied the tuning at 7:34 onto my Ludwig Classic Maple kit and played a live show this week. They sounded great..Thanks for the reference.
Great video! Personally for toms and floor I use a perfect 4th above for resonant over batter. For intervals I use perfect 4th below for 10 and 12, and then perfect 5th below for floor tom, which is 16x14.
I do the same! Lots of attack, minimal and smooth sustain. I tried the Simon Phillips approach (tuning both the same), it allows the drum to create many overtones that I found overpowered the note that I was going for. Can't say I'm a fan.
@@ddrum1090 Awesome. I find that even tuning works great in the studio. I don't like what I hear while playing, but the mics pick up something completely different. For rehearsals and live scenarios perfect 4th is beast.
Great content!!!! đ„
Couldn't agree more with not focusing on a specific note/tention, the video you guys did a while back on tuning till you hear the shell "wake up" and making sure your getting sound from the wall of the drum not just the heads was brilliant, I play a 10,12,14,16 and tend to have the 10' cranked to cut through the mix and the 12,14,16 one big cohesive rumble but do the same as you mentioned and ensure the 10 & 12 sound cohesive when hit together.
Great video!
these drums sound really well to my ear, without bend and a pleasing tone, especially the rack toms that seem harder to tune usually
You're the best. So insightful and intelligent. I true to tune each drum to where I just like how it sounds with any genre. Then I am less concerned about how they sound together or how they are pitched as a unit. If every drum sounds good, I'm happy, but never paid well. Lol. I also tune to what the music generally calls for. If we're playing lots of Thad and Mel charts, I'll tune down to the Mel range. If the night has a bunch of Buddy charts I'll pitch everything up quite a bit. Basie, middle. So I survey the set list and it may include a double pedal. Same with my ride. Buddy, bright and splashy. Mel, dark and blendy. Louis Bellson, well I have a ping ride, but what were they thinking back inthe 70s?
Even though i don'thave drums yet i always finish these kind kf videos
Great ideas, with many variations to consider. Never considered the snare as part of the voicing with the toms. Iâve got 10,12,14 rack toms and a 16 floor. I tend to find a nice sound on the 10, then a deep growling 16, then tune the 12 and 14 to fill the gaps in between. The result is a nice even melodic structure in the toms.
Time to experiment.
Awesome well saidđšđŠđšđŠđđđ„đ„
Great video! Just subscribed! Maybe now I can get my set sounding the way it should!!!
Welcome to the community! -Ben
I've been using a similar method for several years. When using 1 up 1 down, I try to get the toms about a 5th apart, and when using 2 up and 1 down, I go for 3rds. I also tun the reso head slightly higher than the batter. Controls the sustain/decay without adding that god-awful downward pitch bend that a loose reso has.
I always found that I like at least a major 3rd between my toms, a 4th is my preferred.
holy shit, great sound.. i love it so much.. is this just one mic? i can't get that sound with my kit, but i guess its because of my small room
I've been playing the kit for about 38 years now, and because my love of rock music was highly influenced by Kiss back in the day... I always used the song Strutter to tune my 12, 13 & 16 inch toms. Sounds funny... but I used this method for years. LOL
That's great! Always nice to have a reliable method to work off of. Cheers!
I would be really curious to see a video exploring tuning on floor toms. The idea that the distance between the heads effects how much you can pitch the bottom head is something Iâve always experienced but never been able to articulate before watching this. Iâd really be curious about the physics behind the result, maybe a collaboration idea with Smarter Every Day? Excellent content as usual!
We actually have one! It doesnât go suuuper deep into the specifics of the physics regarding depth but it might be helpful :) -Cody
Masterful playing. Need to absorb this info. and, as usual, food for thought.
Thanks so much for all that you do. The drumming community is blessed to have you both.
Let's see more of your playing please. How's the owl and why an owl please?
Thanks for the kind words! We're definitely on the path to including more performance in the videos going forward. Re: the owl, it was a Christmas gift from a family member who used to be in the tattoo industry and offered to make me something. Always had a thing for owls since I was a kid so seemed like the thing to do! - Cody
Very kind of you to share that information and thanks for taking the time. I have a motorcycle that looks like a big black crow. Don't get your owl wet as they can't fly or hunt in the rain! Looking forward to some great performance videos and I'm amazed how modest you are about about your playing. (that seams to be the way with great players though)
Great video.
Thanks, Joseph!
Great info - especially the bit about top-bottom relationship in the context of shell depth. Thanks for that!
Your room sounds great. What are its approximate dimensions, including the ceiling height? We don't see treatment in your videos, but what's going on with treatment off-camera? Thanks for so much great content!
Thanks, Raymond! We've made considerable improvements in the room treatment since the release of Ep. 1. Room height is 7 1/2' with general dimensions of 40' x 20' but with bump outs and storage space. We have a pair of GIK 242 absorption panels mounted as a cloud directly overhead the filming area with a pair of their 244 bass traps in the corners, 242 on the adjacent sides and then six free-standing 244 gobos (two behind the seamless and the other four arced around the filming area). We'll likely feature this setup and do some A/B comparisons in the future. Cheers! -Ben
Thanks for these video's!!! Great! Like your channel!
I tune my drums with e tuners from 1990. Now i use Tunebot since about 2014. A great tuner . Really much better than the chromatic guitar tuner i used befor. That one did give many many overtones, really difficult to find the root/fundamental note but i did have ways to dampen the overtones for instance with e rings to ger a good reading for the root/fundamental note of the drum head.
Will be very pleased if you use the Tunebot (âŹ80-âŹ110) after you have tuned the drums and tell the fundamental tone of the batter head and the bottom head : as measured, Hz and info like C2 low/medium low/exact/medium high/high . That is objective information we can use.
That makes it a repeatable technique and stops the indefinable info.
For instance an example regarding description of a tempo; Not to fast, keep it medium , dont rush but but may be using a bit pushing to give it some extra tension and drive; sorry what is the tempo bpm please! If i have to cover that song me and my band mates need a bpm .
If i am in a hurry all bpm tempo's seem slow to me but for the audience and other musicians and singer they are still what they are.
If you tell this info to a speed metal drummer you will get another tempo than when you tell this to a slow ballad combo drummer.
The same for tuning; please use Hz or 2C low, medium low, exact, medium high and high and that kind of objective/repeatable info.
If you say tune 16 floortom as low as possible but remove all rimples. I come to 1b or 2c = 65 Hz and with 1a=55 Hz I get rimples on a 16 floortom. 2c is for me the fat deep tone i like. However some people tune it up to 2d wich gives mnore response for the sticks.
tune-bot.com/tuning-guide/
If you have a long gig you have to check your toms in between sets.
A Tunebot really makes that process very fast and easy and repeatable: see my video
Tuning 8 drums in 2 minutes with Tunebot. Concert. Drum Cam.
czcams.com/video/K_wtOQaqwhM/video.html
For a 3 tom rock kit i use 2c=65 Hz c 2g=98 Hz 3c=131 Hz or 2c=65 Hz 2f = 87.3 Hz 2a=110 Hz.
If i have a 14 floor tom as deepest i start at 2e=82.4 Hz.
Floor to medium tom is 5th ot 4th interval.
Medium tom to high tom is 3rd major or 4th interval.
Bottom head same as top head for maximum resonance.
In a big multitom (for instance 5 ) tom kit i think 4th intervals are extreme; i tested it.
the high toms will be extreme high than.
3rd major are nice interval; with 4 toms you'll have exact an octave between lowest and highest.
Tuning in chords also does help 2c 2f 2a 3c is kind of f major chord for sizes 16, 14/13, 12, 10.
In a 6 tom kit it can be 1a 2c 2f 2a 3c 3f for the sizes 18, 16, 14/13, 12, 10, 8
If there is a 14 " i like to find a solution with a 2e=82.4 Hz
Tuning 1 step up you get a g major chord and ...my snare is 3G= 198 Hz.
So than the drum kit is in tune.
Having all sizes in a certain tone is easy when you exchange or add toms to sets. I have 2 drumkits and an extra 16 floor and an extra 18 bass.
All my 3 14"snares arre 3G=196 Hz. I can exchange snare, toms and bass drums between kits. My jazz kit sounds exact to my pop kit and the extra's can be added. Always it sounds together well. But ...my jazz kit is not tuned as a jazz kit but as a pop kit. I have no problem with that.
Between floortoms i like a major third. I also like a major third between toms that you use often for fast patterns. That is more easy for the earts than big intervals with fast patterns.
As a test i have tuned my 10, 12, 14, 16 , 18 Pearl Master Custom Maple toms in the sound of the shells (with all hardware included/hanging on the rack) each tom did sound well. Each drum was within its comfort zone.
Bass drum: Thumpy
snare drum: Ab
(reso: Ab with batter muted
batter: Ab with snares off)
10â tom: D
(both heads soloâd B)
12â tom: Bb
(both heads soloâ G)
16â tom: D
(both heads soloâd B) octave from 10â tom
This is my tuning setup. I like it because itâs consistent. I use a tuning app on my phone and just tap the middle of the head im tuning while muting the other head until I reach the note I want. I tune both the batter and reso head to the same pitch on my toms. I like sustain from it and to me the toms sound musical played together.
Here's a radical idea: having both heads tuned to the same pitch. I don't know why drummers tend to discard that idea, it works beautifully for me. I might loosen the batter head a little more on the 16" and 18" floor toms just to cut the sustain without muffling, but all smaller toms go with the same pitch on both heads.
Tends to be an annoying tone when ove tried that the reso relationship with the batter is very important tho and I love experimenting
@@jangobango2847 Experimentation is the best way to learn and gain experience with drum tuning : )
I was just pointing to the fact that using the same pitch has never been mentioned on this channel, although it's a valid option.
I would think that if you get it off by a bit then it would sound dissonant because then each head is at two notes that are close but not exactly the same kind of like when you play to notes that are a half step apart on a piano.
@@DarthCiliatus Yes, that is true sometimes, but not always. That's why some effort is required to make the drums sound good.
I use to always tune both heads the same for over 20 years.playing live always received complements on the sound of my drums. I'm retired now and found in my studio that tunning that way my drums resonate so much I started experimenting. My larger kit for instance, 10,12,14,16, and 22" kick (Pearl ref. Or DW same sizes I tune the reso head about 25% higher and buddy it has helped cut the sustain down quite a bit. It sure is rewarding when you find your perfect sound. ( especially with out using any dampening on the heads).
I have a 7x8, 9x10, 9x12, 10x13, and 15x16, and I tune them to the notes on a 5-string bass. G D A E B and it works wonderfully. The high G is also a minor third above the snare which is tuned to E. The 16x22 is tuned an octave below the floor tom to low B! Best rock tuning scheme ever.
Nice! Glad you've got a system that's working for you. Do you have a go-to set of intervals between that batter head and reso head to achieve those pitches? -Ben
@@SoundsLikeADrum I don't mic them, so I tune both heads to the same note, even on the kick, for sustain and power! Except the snare. But anyways idk if it's just me but I think the tone is great, and it's just g2s on an old mapex Venus set lol With a supralite of course.
Love your videos. First time post. You said you don't like tuning to a song. I agree. But consider if you have many toms like a fusion set (3 up and 2 down). If you're not careful you can imply a chord and that can clash with the song. That's why I like tuning each tom a 4th apart from it's neighbor. Think "here comes the bride". They all sound good in pairs and do not imply chords.
Totally! That's actually the issue I was thinking about, which is to say that if the kit is tuned in intervals that 'go' with a song (as in fit with the key or imply the root chord), You're gonna end up clashing at one time or another. That said, If I was running a 4 or 5 tom setup I'd probably do something like you're describing, intentionally avoiding letting the kit become to chordal. -Cody
Awesome video! Loved the point that you made about shell depth being a factor in the overall sound of the drum...depth of the drum does make quite an impact on the interval relationship between the reso and batter head tunings....âShort Stackâ Toms actually sound better with only a 1 or 2 step interval between the reso and batter head rather than minor/Major Third or perfect Fourth tuning you would use on larger depth fusion or standard size drums.
I once had a suspension mounted DW floor tom 12x14 compared to a 14x14 with legs.The 12x14 with it being 2" shorter and suspended blew the 14x14 away. Pretty wild.!!! Made a believer out me.
David Suprenant I totally agree......small Toms can sound just as powerful as the full size versions with the proper tuning.....Iâve found that Toms with shorter depths, like those on my sons PDP New Yorker kit, are usually tuned best at 1 or 2 steps between the batter and resonant head.
my main snare is usually the upper|mid voice amongst the toms, but i play 10 toms ( including the main snare and 3 auxiliary snares ). hoowee, i don't tune to any particular song, but ( as i was saying on a sylvia massey video recemtly ), i like to keep common major notes covered among the drums, so that at least one of the drums can ring out in unison or harmony with repetitious or defining notes in any given song. there have been times, though, in the middle of a service, i'll hit a tom in the middle of a song and it will sound like one of the melodic instruments hit a *sour note* đ€Ł that's why i try not to tune randomly.
Wow! What's the tuning of the floor tom , the toms and the bass drum? Its a killer sound for my ears!
At 4:08 what tunes were your drums at if you know, I am looking for that sound but I canât hear tones that well. I canât find any other video that gives specific notes and has a sound I enjoy
You can hear the time sing when you talk. That's how I like tuning.
Note sometimes I use 2ply on the reso to choke the Tom a bit.
Hey Cody, what do you think about putting a G12 or G14 reso on 18"x16" floor tom (maple) with ec2 or g2 on top? My purpose is to give a little bit more "presence" to my 18" with a "rumbling" "deep" sound... Since it is big and low, I found that I lose the volume of the 18" ...Thx!
Will you guys have a video on pedal types? Differences in single/dual chain vs strap vs direct?
We'll likely get into some more hardware discussions in separate videos outside of our Tuesday Tutorial series, yes. Cheers! -Ben
in terms of drums working together, I've been thinking about how even differences between tom sizes doesn't equate to equal differences in note value, as differences in sound waves and pitch are non-linear. Since double the length of a sound wave equals a difference of an octave, it stands to reason that a 10" drum and 20" drum should be an octave apart. So for a 4-tom setup, rather than the usual 10-12-14-16 (or god-forbid 10-12-13-16... ugh...) I've been thinking of something more like 8-10-13-18, where the amount of the increase increases from drum to drum (and lookey here, it follows a small section of the fibonnaci sequence, with the differences going 2"-3"-5")
Great video! Fantastic information! What hats are those?
15â Zildjian Fat Hat protos! -Cody
@@SoundsLikeADrum they sound incredible!
Awesome info. Which pearl set are you demonstrating?
Itâs a 90âs Pearl Masters Custom Extra Maple 6-ply đđ»
Definitely like the wider interval. Also don't like my toms sounding like a chord. I do whatever I can to keep them from sounding melodic.
yes. in my thinking of music , drum beat is killing . I think, that going to make really fresh. if you understand...
When you are returning the drums for each experiment are you just losening and tightening the batter head or both the batter head and the reso head? Also are you just turning one lug or all of them
If I remember correctly I was re-tuning both of the heads each time to make sure the two were interacting happily and sounding good together. I was for sure tuning every single lug, not just one or two. Hope that helps! - Cody
Simple question: how would one of those Silent Stroke mesh heads affect the sound of a tom if it were used as a reso head? The batter is a standard head. Would it sound like a concert tom or will it be like a two headed tom but quieter? Has this ever been addressed? Thanks!
Itâll give you the concert tom sound with the benefit of having your reso hoop in place đđ» recommend! -Cody
very interesting channel. Thanks to the author. By the way what's his name again?
what sizes are these drums in the video?
What note are the toms tune to ?
Do you alter the frequencies of the drums depending on the room, or is the general method the same from room to room?
Definitely different from room to room but not dramatically. I tune by ear in the room Iâll be playing in to make sure the drums speak and are easy to play in that particular space, itâs always about the sound that day and what my ears are telling me. -Cody
Hey I have a 1995 mapex Mars rock shellpack. 12x10,13x11,16x16 floor Tom. What would be a good tuning range for them? Like how many turns past finger tight. I can't get mine to sound the same as yours because of the depth
Oh and I'm using g12 Evans batters and Remo ambassador resonant
Great video!
Could make a video about getting attack and rebound without tightening the batter side? I like my toms really low, just half turn over fingertight, but I feel like I need more rebound.
The shell sizes is 12â by 8â rack tom, 14â by 14â and 16â by 16â floor toms
Thanks! At a certain point you're going to need to change the tension of the batter head if you want more rebound. You can adjust the reso as well to maintain a similar sound while achieving more rebound (this will also help with acoustic projection). Tightening up the batter head will also help to prolong the live of the drumhead. -Ben
I will, Iâm curently using evans black chrome heads that are quite thick
Is that a session studio classic kit you guys are using.?
Masters Custom Extra Maple
To get a clear tone when tuning; is it ever a good idea put on isolation head phones?
Hard to say, definitely havenât tried it :) let us know if itâs a thing that works for you! -Cody
Stone Brewing (T-shirt)!
Yup! Great stuff :) - Cody
Hi Casey, what fundamental on each for your baseline?
The specific pitches really don't matter here as they won't be relevant to your circumstances because of the multitude of variables involved. Your best bet is to experiment on your own (starting with getting a desirable sound from your middle tom in a three tom setup). -Ben
Nice Video, you adressed some interesting topics.
I have a question for a friend.
He has a Pearl Vision with a 16 floor tom made of birch. New Emperor heads and even after playing in it doesnt have any low end and sounds horrible. Other drums I tune sound great with some tweaking, but what could be a way to make it sound?
Thanks for your time
Hard to say without seeing the drum in person, I guess the first thing I'd do is try a lot of different pitch combinations between the heads and see what that particular drum prefers. Floor toms can be tricky. There frankly could be a defect in the drum edge or something too but I'd try a lot of tuning combinations before worrying about anything like that. - Cody
Tell him to try replacing the stock reso heads with some clear ambassadors. Emperors sound great when paired with an ambassador.
Another thing is to try moving the drum to a different area of the room and/or different room. Donât discount the acoustic effects of the space as they can have a profound effect on the presence (or lack of) certain frequencies. -Ben
Try the Pearl Air Suspension Feet for the floor tom legs. There are some good videos about floor tom low end being choked by the floor tom legs being in contact with the floor by another product called BootyShakers (careful where you google that one LOL). The air suspension feet are standard on higher end Pearl kits these days, I believe.
What do I do if my 14â floor tomâs batter head doesnât seat properly on the bearing edge? It doesnât have as much loudness/presence as the other toms on my kit
What sort of seating issue are you having specifically?
The head doesnât sit level on the bearing edge
@@crawfordmerk5685 This is a more common issue with certain types of drumheads when fitted to certain shells. If you can't get the head to seat properly even by application of a bit of force in the center of the head and balanced incremental tensioning then there may be an issue with that particular head. Do you encounter the same issue with different heads? Have you tried any of the Evans heads? -Ben
for the life of me... I can't flipping tune my 10" tom ! I have a tama hyperdrive maple and the tom is shallow. I use a G2 clear on the batter and a 1 ply clear reso and I'm trying the 3rd minor setting (F#3 batter/ A3 reso) and it sounds crap... a massive BOIIIING ! I want them to sound low, deep enough relative to their size but if I go too low, lugs are loose and detune, and skin gets flappy, if I tighten those lugs even a bit I get that awful "boiingy" noise... is it the reso or the drum itself ? it's infuriatingly frustrating.... can you help guys ?
I'm late to the party but try tuning both heads to the same pitch. That solves a lot of problems with weird overtones and such.
i like to be able to play the racehorce trumpet thing with 3 toms and the snare .. with the snares off and the snare is the highest note .. not exact pitches but relatively ft is "1" (or do) 2nd rack tom is "3" (mi) 1st rack tom is "5" (sol) snare is octave "1" do
whatever tuning range you prefer just transpose
Wasnât sure which video to post this on but I hope someone can help me. I play birch drums and they sound great from behind the kit, but itâs come to my attention thatâs not necessarily how they sound out front. So how do I tune my drums for them to sound best out front and get them to really throw the sound for those un-miced gigs?
Thatâs a great question and one with a lot of variables - drum size, head choice, stick size too. What kind of setup are you running as far as those issues go? -Cody
Sounds Like A Drum 10 12 14 20. G2 Coated batter, g1 clear reso, 7A sticks 100% birch 6 ply shells. Playing classic rock covers mostly.
Ok gotcha - and what sort of tuning scheme would you say is your normal thing?
Actually as far as pitch goes my tuning scheme is very similar to how you have them in this video. I do try to make sure every two sound good together. My goal is to a achieve a focused clear note with short sustain
Hi there, is it okay if I used my 13 inch tom into a Floor Tom?
Of course!
What mics do you use?
And AKG C414 at ear-distance from the snare drum (just off camera) and an AKG D112 in this instance for the bass drum (just outside the mic port). We use a Sennheiser shotgun microphone for all of the narrative portions. -Ben
You guys hip on the drum dial?
Iâve used it before but it hasnât made an appearance in the series and I havenât used one in years. -Ben
This (I think) will be the channel that FINALLY answers that existencial question in every drummers mind.... Where the HELL does the DAMNED drum key go when it touches Da F#-nG CARPET!?!?!
Still searching for the answer to that one ourselves but when we figure it out you better believe we'll be doing a full investigative report on it. đ-Ben
When you said "minor third" how many turns does that mean?
Hey there! Itâs not a matter of turns, there are too many variables with the drum and drumhead (and tuning screws for that matter). A minor third is an interval between two pitches (three half steps). I use a guitar tuner occasionally to check pitches rather than counting turns to get to a specific pitch. Hope that helps! -Cody
@@SoundsLikeADrum get it, thanks so much!
Hi yeah I'm having this huge problem from my 12" tom (first tom) no matter how much i tune it theres still this ring that lasts forever. whenever i try to fiddle with the tuning, that ring is still there but to a different pitch. this ring still exists when i use muffling. pls help :((((
Gino,what's the make ,model ,type of wood,diecast or flanged hoops,selection of heads,and the depth of the tom? I think I can help you.!!!.
its a pearl target series, luan mahogany i think?, triple flanged hoops, pinstripe on top and stock on bottom, its a 12Ă9 tom. thanks!!!
@@zhongxina8426 I'm not familiar with the target series from pearl,but if this drum is mahogany,you should be able to get the ring out of it. For that to exist,perhaps you have a bad head,warped hoop,or out of round drum. If that is not out of round,the hoops are straight ,and the bearing edges are smooth,then it's got to be a drum head. I have purchased new heads b4 that were warped or the frame around the head was bent. Check it out and good luck,hope your able to solve the problem.
@@davidsuprenant893 alright thanks again!
@@zhongxina8426 let me know what the end result is.I hope you find the problem and that it is something minor. We're all in this together,drummers sharing knowledge and trying to help one another for this incredible instrument we dearly love.
God I think I've watched enough drum tuning videos to last me a lifetime and I STILL can't tune any of them đ€Š
Watching videos isnât enough- youâve gotta out this stuff into practice and repeat it. Itâs just like any other aspect of performance.
@@SoundsLikeADrum im trying đ
I'm with you...the funny thing is that every video I watch seems to do it COMPLETELY differently. Even though they all say, "tune them to what sounds good to you!" Which drives me crazy. I tune them how I think they sound good, and then nothing I play sounds like the original song.
I KNOW how to tune my guitar...there's a standard. This is driving me insane.
What do you think about Tunebot?
Honestly haven't ever used one but I know they work for some players. Whatever works! :) - Cody
Having used one a bit out of curiosity, theyâre an interesting product but I can imagine such a thing becoming a crutch- trusting the numbers rather than training your ears. Iâm very much in support of discovering sounds you like with just a drum key and your ears and then, if youâre in a scenario (particularly a studio environment) that demands perfect recall of that tuning over and over, these devices can be quite useful. Just my $0.02. -Ben
@@SoundsLikeADrum This was much softer than the Instagram live rage against the tunebot machine.
A.J. - Not so much a rage against any one product but rather the reliance on some form of abstract, quantitative measurement to tell you if your drum sounds good. We're trying to inspire drummers to explore, experiment, and develop their ears rather than simply tune until a dial says it's in tune. -Ben
Who's Tom and why are we tuning him
To my ears, the 2 rack Tom's are to similar...and the floor tom is more distant from the other Tom's. I play with a 12, 14, 16, 18 line up...I like what 2 inches between each tom can do. More range, and the size of each note is greater...just my preference.
That a Stone shirt?
Why do companies make kits 12 13 16? I don't understand it because it makes it impossible to tune them evenly. Shouldn't it be 12 14 16?
Back in the 60s when I started out playing that's what the companies were selling.The first time I remember that changing to a 10,12,14,and 16 is when DW hit the seen. NOW with the vintage market making a big come back 13s are back on the market. With my experience you just have to toon that 12" a little higher or that 13" a little lower.seems what was once old school is now the new. STARTED OUT playing 14" deep bass drums,then went to 16s and then the 18" deep bass drum.Now days the 14" depth is coming back big time. The drum companies keep things interesting. ITS CALLED MARKETING.!!!
Is this the same concept with 8", 10", 12", 14", and 16"?
It really comes down to personal preference but yes overall Iâd say so. The style and the specific track can dictate a lot of my choices ultimately no matter how many toms there are Iâm usually trying to get them to sit in their own sonic space but also function as a group. -Cody
I will say, it between drum parts and strings is big issue for my kind of music. bass drum? like fresh and soul type...
Three tom kits have more options than two toms? Sorry, I just had to point it out.
How to make them not sound like drums?
fresh music ? very close very close.. if you see people .how they playing music?