Why Electric Motorcycles are Failing
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- čas přidán 11. 06. 2021
- It's 2021 and EVs are everywhere - Teslas, e-bicycles, e-scooters, etc. But seeing an electric motorbike in the wild is still rare. Why is the motorcycle industry failing to electrify successfully?
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‘The target buyer is young, debt free and has six figures of expendable income. She is a green environmentalist, but always wished to enter competitive power sports. Lives in the city, but has a garage...’
Perfection.
And has a unicorn. That’s really important, although why anyone would want a unicorn is beyond me. Their teeth would put a shark to shame.
Ryan makes these comments while wearing $1k of riding gear and... "The net worth of FortNine's channel through 6 Jun 2021. $1,106,380.
Interesting.
@@perrycalabrese3475 Ryan is not making fun of high income people. He is merely pointing out that the motorcycle industry is targeting a very small and specific minority with EV bikes, thus it is unsurprising that they sell so little.
@@I_Santos_ he's more taking a stab at the fact these people don't actually exist. The people who do buy these bikes are those not afraid to experiment. Everyone else wants to know it'll work.
@@dcaonoek exactly.
Ryan: *releases this video*
The motorcycle industry: "Write that down, write that down!"
Nope. They're trying their best to have CZcams suppress the video and de-platform Ryan.
@@jcwoods2311 is that for real?
In your dreams lol, I mean ours.
Elon musk needs to start building motorcycles. Current Motorcycle companies are notoriously slow at upgrading. TW200 is still the most practical motorcycle made from back in the '80s without any upgrades.
yeah sure buddy
In Taiwan (which has a very high motorcycles/scooters number per capita for a developed country) Gogoro has become THE scooter brand of the moment despite not being especially cheap. And it is an EV. They have battery swapping stations everywhere in big cities and we are a relatively small but densely populated country.
Yep. Works amazingly well. It's the swapping stations that really make it work. Faster than filling the tank with gas. Cities need to help commit to the infrastructure, but the stations are just small kiosks that don't take up a ton of space so it's not difficult especially in most large spread out N. American cities with tons of space. I think the biggest issue would be convincing N. Americans to get out of their cars and ride a scooter. Winters in colder cities don't make that prospect much fun but it could work amazingly well in warmer southern cities.
What's about SYM? Do they have E motor I've always wonder.
@@IronKurone I think they have some e scooters too. And I think they have swappable batteries as well but I don't know the details.
Wouldn’t work in America. People don’t like to cooperate and the homeless would steal the batteries for their curbside shanties.
You would do even better with electric bycicles. Cos those do allow some fitness exercise and are better handling usually. People buy motorcycles for adventure, open road outside city. You don't need such high horsepower to weight ratio in city.
Regarding the single gear point, all brushless hub motors are capable of star delta switching. What this means is that they effectively have two electrical gears. You do need access to all 6 power wires not just the normal three but that’s nothing a soldering iron can’t fix. One mode is high torque and the other is high speed.
When you run out of speed it isn’t that you lack power as such, for any winding configuration there is a top speed related to your voltage, as you approach that point the motor generates an equal and opposite voltage to the battery meaning that at that rpm no power is drawn. Of course in practice you will never reach that zero power point on flat ground.
“Since we are dealing directly with the factory, the children offered to build.....” lol.
Spyware included ! Thanks China
That was funny!
Oohh... now I get it
Yeah, totally unlike the US wich uses mexican children for that. Oh, the irony.
@@LightCrasher they get paid better than the chinese.. ironically the chinese outsource stuff to mexico too.. fentanyl production
"hardware, spyware all in"
"the children offered to build the motor axle to match my swingarm width"
Can always count on F9 for these lines lol
And self hating rhetoric
The trump logic is stong in america.
@@Baleur The irony is weak where you come from.
@@Baleur Rent free. Kek
@@Baleur Quiet from the gulag.
In Europe e-scooters are quite popular especially in urban environments. They reach 70km/h for a total of 100km which is plenty for city commuting in addition to noise reduction and great acceleration.
I'm from the Netherlands, and i don't think i have ever seen an e-scooter that fast...🤔
@@Timmehhhhhh they probably are legally constrained to 50kph
@@Timmehhhhhh Because most people drive mopeds. A motorcycle license is relatively expensive. And a moped is often allowed on the cycle paths. So most people opt for the moped
@bkdmx 😂😂😂😂😂😂. Not at all. Only Holland, Belgium, germany and a few others have a specific 25 kmph catagory.... And in germany and belgium Ive only seen the moped catagory, so Im guessing it isnt even that popular. Only reason a big part of 50cc bikes in holland are in the 25kmph catagory is because its one of the few countries with proper bicycle infrastructure
@@THDevill they have 25kmph catagories?
This is spot on. Here in Southeast Asia, EV scooters are exploding. They're selling like hotcakes at just around $300 a pop. Tiny bike, with tiny range - perfect for just jetting back and forth between the wet marker and home.
Except, now we have people who just drive like a maniac in these things because they think regular road rules do not apply to them. Seriously, they actually need to be licensed by this point.
@@CrossfeetGamingregular road rules should not apply to them
I'm going to guess it has something to do with Harley selling theirs for $30k
Not just them, Zero ain't exactly cheap...
Hmmmm Harley being Harley
Why buy a 30k electric Harley when you can buy a comfortable and nice 30k Tesla?
Harley is a luxury brand. I dont think this is the reason. The same way Bentley sells their SUV for $177.000 and the SUV market is not failing because of this
Of course!!!!
I think manufacturers simply don't want to accept that the average price will have to go down. That's why they keep offering high end high margin bikes. they'd rather it fail than set a standard for affordability they don't want.
Which suits me fine, since a bunch of no name startups are now eating the big boys lunch
@@JB-1138 True. But those aren't electric.
@@JB-1138 Those aren't electric and omg don't get one of those dumb mini bikes 🤦♀️. Spend the relatively tiny bit more a get a cb300r. Same style but it's actually a bike you can use and not look like a dork on lmao
Isn’t capitalism beautiful
@@WhoTFVotedBiden yes. it gives me freedom and wealth
@7:43 I just noticed the 'stick' stand. Simply lovely.
This is the video that made me buy my electric scooter.
Was seriously tempted to build my own like this, but with no real workshop and whole bikes becoming quite affordable, I bought one. Quite similar to this one in specs I now realize.
Battery looks to be about the same size, though the engine and top speed are limited to 1000W and 25kmh to abide by local regulations.
Works perfectly, even fits in my elevator and tiny apartment.
Ryanf9:
put a 2 stroke engine on a bicycle
Also Ryanf9:
Converts 2 stroke motorbike into an EV
Future Ryanf9:
Nuclear powered CanAm
Shhh... the plans for the Ballistic Beaver are still secret. ~RF9
@@FortNineWell well well... now I'm not only JUST curious, I'm also slightly aroused.
Which I think all of us can blame that on Ryan's personal "aerodynamic" design language 👌🏼🔥
🤣
@@FortNine I've heard of a nuclear battery being developed in California that will be available to buy in 5 years... whether that is true or not we will have to wait and see!
@@americanfarmer2779 testicle cancer
@@FortNine No sooner do you start talking about electric motorcycles and someone had to bring up poor Ishmael.
“Big motorcycle” will put a machine with _air conditioning_ to market before they consider a practical business strategy.
😆 Sometimes on hot summer days I wish I had a hose bringing A/C inside my helmet, I wouldn't be too mad if they come up with something like that 😅
Filling your helmet with liquid nitrogen could be the solution good sir.
Well, I do have what is basically a heater for my legs and feet on my Goldwing LOL
@@viel.anthony My first thought was the Goldwing leg heaters too. Honda is decades ahead of the punchline
@@Kurvan Love my 1500. It's an SE so it's got the toe warmers as well. I can ride at midnight even it's 4 celsius out there and it feels good.
I rode my Zero DSR over 600 miles on a two week trip this summer in the European alps and was surprised at how well it went. It’s a different way of travelling compared to the 1200RS my dad was on and used to, but we had a great time riding together regardless. Riding an electric motorcycle works, but requires a change in riding behaviour.
Well, I have an Energica EVA, and I went 710 km last weekend alone....went very well
Late to the party here, but as a follower of the movement for years now, i can say that for all the electrical vehicles, motorcycles make the MOST sense because of lightness. There's an inverse curve of weight to torque to aerodynamics, and at some point, like Tesla is finding out, you just reach a plateau where you're brute forcing more range with more weight. Superlight motorcycles, at or under 100kg can have that hundred miles of range, but they have to accept that a LOT of motorcycle classic features and styles just can't be thrown on a vehicle where rider weight matters, let alone curb weight.
Pretty simple: affordable ones consistently have terrible styling and the cool ones are ridiculously expensive.
also small range, won't even make it from town to town here in Canada
@@guessundheit6494 ...said the person posting a 6 year old video
@@stevejeffrey11 Cars won't make it without refueling between towns in Canada. It's just like Australia.
@@guessundheit6494 Thank you for proving my point. Ugly AF. Putting blue LED accents and making it look like an Apple product doesn't make it "cool". If you want to ride this George Jetson Vespa be my guest. Noone will look at it twice other than to point and laugh.
Agreed, had to build my own and managed to do it for 1/3 of the cost. The claims of not being able to drive from town to town in Canada is debatable though, and bike type/riding style plays a big role in this too. Some bikes like the Zero S and my custom build can provide slightly over 100 km/charge with a 4-6 kWh battery (which is relatively small, producing a light curb weight of ~300 lbs compared to their ICEB counterparts like the 350 lbs CBR300) while others like the SR/F can do 200 km's with a similar power to weight ratio as an R6, and guess what? An R6 only gets a max 200 km's per tank fill up too. So I don't see the problem in terms of range. Buy what suits you, if you can afford it lol. Whether or not you make it from town to town depends on the same factors as an ICEB; your batt capacity, your route and how many charge stations you want to ignore along the way. Contrary to popular belief (which seems to hinge on information and technology from 5-10 years ago 90% of the time), the charging network in Canada is massive and growing everyday. There are multiple level 1 and 2 charging stations in every major town and city. Google 'Canada ev charging network map'. According to my math, if a person has a 12-14 kWh battery to play with then they shouldn't run into any problems from either direction until they get into Ontario - even petrol vehicles run out of fuel on that stretch of highway if a person isn't careful. But they'd do really well to make it across Ont. on most e-moto's without getting stranded in the middle of nowhere. Other than that, there shouldn't be a problem. Not here in NB or the rest of the Atlantic provinces, anyway. Charge time shouldn't be much of an issue either. Most battery tech today is capable of 2 or 3C charging. Hell, my sponsor Grepow can build their batteries with 5C charging capability. That's. Fast. Like, plug it in, sip a coffee for 15 minutes and it's time to go again. I don't know about anyone else, but after a couple hundred klicks on a bike I'm ready to take a break and stretch my back and legs, take a leak, have a bite to eat/drink, etc. There's a reason why my naked sport only has a 4 kWh battery; it's mainly a commuter and I don't plan on being bent over for more than 100 km's at a time. 23 years working construction + a leaning posture just doesn't allow it.
With that said, the # 1 complaint that I've gotten over the years promoting these things is the lack of sound. #2 is style/cosmetics. I referred to Zero motorcycles here, but I can't stand the look of them or 99% of other e-motos on the market. They're just too goofy. Even with subpar backyard build quality, the styling on my DIY build is so much better. #3 is range. Put sound generators and >12 kWh batteries in the right bikes for an affordable price, and they'll sell. Electrifying cruisers and touring bikes makes as much sense as electrifying 18 wheelers. It's not worth it, you'd be lugging too much weight around to get the range that you want without having to charge up more than once/day. But for sport bikes, street bikes, mopeds/scooters, anything that most people aren't spending 4-8 hrs/day on would benefit from an electric drivetrain if the manufacturers would smarten up and make them more appealing. The price will come down in time as infrastructure pays for itself and investors get their return, just as wind and solar tech costs have dropped dramatically this past decade. Battery tech isn't far behind. Riding e-motos the past few years is the most fun I've had on anything with a motor and wheels. But to each their own. I certainly don't judge anyone for opting to not get one...but you should consider it, or a conversion. It's nowhere near as complicated as it might seem, and it's so much fun.
This is one of the smartest videos I've probably ever seen. Engineering, market analysis and a business case all packaged in not even 9 minutes of a video. I'm seriously impressed, hats off.
And great comedy on top of that👏👏
I subscribed because of this video, excellently made
@@Sopixil Same.
yep!
I’m also seriously impressed!
Yeah, I got an E-bike, and I have to agree. It works as a short-range city bike, but not if you're doing any significant traveling to and from a location.
Close to a dream e-motorbike. Cheap, light, looks fine as all get up and practical. I've been bitten by the two wheel bug since getting a pedal e-bike, it's amazing to get around on and take back trails and shortcuts but I'd love something faster I can have on the road. It's a smart way to get around and I do like the idea of having an electric for ease of use and low maintenence but I think I definitely want an ICE bike as well
E mortor bikes can't go on highways, and most speed ways for local commute sure, but the mortor cycle demigraphic has all but killed it (for mass adoption).
E-bikes could be one of the primary modes of travel in dense urban zones along with OG bikes and public transport. That would be so sick
I've got news for you. E-bikes are already one of the primary modes of travel in the Netherlands!
There are some crazy ebikes put there. Some of them are basically motorcycles you don't need a license, registration, or insurance for. You can even take "shortcuts" on bike trails
@@pnblondon1087 In the US there are virtually no cities with bike-friendly roads, and with half of people on the road looking at their phones, you're greatly increasing your risk of major injury.
In the bay area they are very abundant. Not much electric motorbikes, but a bunch of electrically assisted bicycles. Really great for commuting. Technically they are limited to 20mph to be compatible with bike trails, but I'd bet some people are quietly modding them beyond that limit, not sure.
@@pnblondon1087 One of the few places in the world where e-bikes are a negative development.
The tubes screensaver brought me back to a simpler time
On an iMac no less lol
That was 100% intentional. These guys really add a lot of depth to their content, phenomenal production work.
@@two_motion Anal-retentive. That’s a hyphen, NOT a dash...
@@shshnkbhskr that was the cherry 👌
i built my own custom electric bicycle, it goes 40-45mph, i think the biggest thing that needs to be added to electric motorcycles is 1. chains, i will take a chain over hub motor any day, it has more torque and a mid-drive motor drives a crank instead of the wheel itself giving it more power 2. using a mid-drive motor and a chain could allow for gears on the wheel similar to a bicycle, allowing faster speed in high gears and high torque in low gears, it would help with the problem of a rear hub motor trying to put out more torque the faster you go. there is so many ways electric motorcycles could be improved and built
i need a step-by-step build guide for that thing, my man.
That side stand at 8:00 is only for legends.
LOL totally missed that
Thanks for pointing out
Anything to keep the weight down!
@@jasonhalljaxyt shut up
It's organic, the kids will love it...
I looked into getting one but the prices are just obscene for what they are offering. I was really disappointed.
@@zUJ7EjVD My struggle is I live very rural so I need something more substantial then an e-bike. I am also a bigger guy so I need something that's going to be equivalent to a 400-600cc bike. I travel less then 20-40 miles a day. Everything I could find was 10,000$ plus. When you compare that to a traditional gas bike your looking at closer to 5000.
@@Mikey__R ayo stop scaring me, I live in the EU
For the price of some of these electric bikes you can buy a fully loaded plug-in hybrid car. It’s insane.
@@Mikey__R I don't foresee the EU banning IC bikes anytime soon: They only applied Euro5 emissions standards to bikes NINE years after they did for cars. A ban is decades away, if ever, given how the engine is such an important part of the experience.
Agreed, for most urban use it's fine... Here's the thing, a lot of cities in the UK are not flat unless you're living on the east side of the country, so what's that thing like taking on hills?
Absolutely loving this, and agreeing with you on all points. Though couldn't you help some of the problems along with a center mounted electric motor with gears and a chain? Would make it slightly more efficient on low and high speeds right?
Lifetime biker here, Gas Vs Electricity... E-Cycles Are Too Expensive, Too slow, No Range. But, Sondors Metacycle proves it's getting better! $6,000 = 80mph and 80mi range (130kph and 130km range) What if, Instead of facing long charging times, we had a standardized battery E-Pack, like 6 or 8 stacked "D" cells that are used by all electric bikes and available at E-stations for exchange. E-bikes and E-motorcycles using the same E-Packs! Where an E-bike uses 1 or 2 while an E motorcycle may use 10. These E-Packs drop into housings sized to each vehicle's energy needs. The "Station" has charging facility for 1000 E-Packs that can be installed in any 2 wheeled vehicle in minutes....
5:54 "$1400 from China. Hardware, SPYWARE, all in." LOL! I'm dead!
"Since were working directly with the factory, the CHILDREN offered to build the motor to match the frame rails!" Savage!
That is so true.
Every app on the market you get thats Chinese, is 100% spyware.
My clothes are following my every move.
@@zoyka2126 Everything you get even made in America is 100% spyware.
@Google Account Pretty funny coming from Google.
You singlehanded do what the entire production of BBC top gear (the good one) tried to accomplish. Factual, stunning cinematography, entertaining and never forced.
But full of BS.
No, the BBC tried to do that part too, though they may have achieved that part 😂
The second top gear with Clarkson was simply racist drunks
i hope you mean tried to accomplish in the sense of they tried to achieve this and succeeded, because in reality, the good BBC top gear really did succeed in doing this
@@tahruyn1409 yes. That is a better way of putting it, thank you
As someone who bikes (not an e-bike!), there is a lot of conflation with two wheels = dangerous. I would need to regularly go about 50 miles at one go in order to even start thinking about it.
Also, people need to realize this: Bikes aren't dangerous. A death box weighing 2,500 pounds, made out of steel, going at a high speed on the road (cars) are dangerous.
this is the kind of video i wanted on E-motorcycles, so much crap on them but no genuine response on how it can improve, while this video doesn't go fully into detail its still far better than any other video i've seen. we just need the right people to work on this subject, people who actually care and don't just want money and popularity.
this is actually a really interesting idea for someone looking to refurb an otherwise junked classic bike. There's a ton of old hondas and kawasakis in my area that look alright cosmetically but have rusted tanks, junk engines and disintegrating wiring harnesses. With old stock drying up this could be a great way to get a second or potentially even third life out of these 40-60yr old bikes.
Ev conversions are a wonderful, although really small, part of the motorcycle community you can even find a guy who straight up made his own from scratch
I have a restoration project in my garage that I've been "getting to" for some time now. Ev conversion actually makes a lot more sense...
Check out the 50s Jaguar -> Tesla swap in progress on SuperFastMatt's channel
Get an old Honda Cub brought back to life with a cheap electric motor and battery. Nice!
The old frames typically can't take the extra torque. I've been advised not to swap my '79 750 for a 1100 bc it'll bend the frame. And if a 40yo 1100 could do that I wonder what a modern electric motor would do.
"hardware, spyware all in" good thing I didin't drink anything at this moment
Ryan has a way with words
"and the children even matched the colors" dude knows what china is 😂
@@geesegoose6174 I'm a bit disappointed about the lack of vinnie the pooh jokes though
These videos are so well made your almost the only reason I still watch CZcams anymore ❤ love the channel and keep up the amazing work to all the people making Fortnite possible 😊🥰
The other thing is as a person who does not ride motorcycles, but has been tempted to get started. These things are too quiet, a huge safety benefit of a lot of motorcycles is how loud and obnoxious they are. A superbike or a harley is always going to let you know it's there even if you can't see it, but an e-motorcycle is so quiet they can sneak up on you and that's a negative in my book for safety.
I used to dislike obnoxiously loud harleys for the longest time until a guy who actually rides one said to me. "Loud pipes save lives." And i couldn't agree more, especially here in california where lane splitting is legal.
“misunderestimate” my favorite non-word.
Mine too! Thanks George Dubya!
Hey Juan, big fan here,awesome that you watch this great channel too
I agree with every comment in this thread.
Usually my comments are longer. I'll use the extra space to ask everyone to view the Playlists on My Channel, not for my benefit but for ours.
This and he made absinthe legal in the States again. Even a broken clock is right twice a day.
Your comment perhaps, has some value - if wrong forgive my amisunderestimation . Non-words do have a worthvalue in my mindsetopinion.
"I'm no physician". It's the little things in these videos that get me.
Thanks! I got it upon second viewing.
is he a physician
He's a knob who thinks he's smooth. Won't help sales either.
I'm no science rocket but I totally agree with you
He probably needs a physician!
1:04 I own a Zero DS! It's perfect for a work commute with *plenty* of power (59hp peak) and a running cost of about £52 (63 USD) per year.
It's price tag (~£8k) and range are really the only downsides to it.
It's limited range (of about 120 miles) means I can't consider going on road trips as, without the charger accessory, it needs up to a 9 hour break to charge up. And the power bank accessory only adds about 20 miles.
No charge point needed though, it's just a UK mains to IEC cable and the charger is built in... not always a good thing, I've already had one charging circuit break and had it replaced under warranty - for which my bike was out of commission for several months. But I could theoretically park outside a friends house and charge it on an extension cable, and throw them a couple bucks for the electric.
It sounds like a UFO, so that's cool too.
it is an old video, but i was planning on doing a similar thing with a project bike, but a way bigger battery and motor. (had found a 27kw motor at 72V from a small excavator XD for a great price)
but the two main problems were i couldnt find a good donor bike for its frame (and didnt want to splash extra for one in operation and have to deal with selling of its engine and working parts
and two i didnt/dont have a garage to work on it (nor the tools... but space being the main issue, as tools can be slowly acquired if you have where to put them and use them)
still a dream project 6 years later
Having lived in China, I can tell you the cheap electric scooter is the most popular mode of transportation except in cities where they have been banned. I lived in Guangzhou, where they were banned because they were so popular they clogged the streets and caused gridlock. Traveling to smaller cities like Zhanjiang, the electric motorbike was the most affordable option for many families. I often saw entire families riding down the street on a scooter meant for two. The most I saw on a scooter was six, two adults, and four kids, one being a baby in a papoose-like carrier. I had a cheap scooter at a friend's house I kept in a storage closet plugged into a regular outlet to recharge. The only thing I saw that made them a little dangerous, besides whole families riding one, is they are silent. Many times I was almost run over crossing a street at night because a rider was not using his lights to conserve battery. The silent scooter with no lights on has taken out many people who never knew what hit them.
Best thing I ever buy accept from my gaming PC I never knew they existed till 6 months ago I now have 3 will be buy my next one when I cam afford it then am calling it a day they amazing and love always and going off road
"The most I saw on a scooter was six, two adults, and four kids, one being a baby in a papoose-like carrier."
So, three child policy + 1 as crumple zone 😁👌
About carrying more than normal on motorbikes or scooters. This particular one I observed in Nigeria - Africa. But could have been in any other African country or most of Asia.
Three ADULTS one man (rider) and two women (passengers). NOW the cream of the crop. One entire, live and not so young calf!!
The poor thing was somehow tied up, on it's side, over the head light/steering/tank. in a position that can only be called torture! Rather horrific scene, the poor calf eyes were a good tell tale! With most of the body literally hanging over all those metal bits! Anyway it was a pretty common scene! Also commonly seen with chickens, goats, more Humans all sorts of cargo, etc. While all this procession was passing on the dirt road. The driver was happily using it's phone!! LOL 😂
Definitely can't be judged by developed countries standards. ;-)
I've seen entire families on scooters a lot in Greece. No electric though. It's all 2 stroke so you definitely know they're coming lol.
@@wigletron2846 ‘whispering death’ (originally applied to trolley buses) vs ‘loud pipes save lives’.
Ryan just went full Thanos:- "Fine, I'll do it myself."
What's funny to me is this is that the bike he made its very similar to the Scrambler style ebikes already on the market, the only major difference is they have pedals
Compound the great points made in this video with the fact that in most of Europe a motorcycle, electric or not, requires a whole bunch of expensive training and insurance, where a bicycle requires nothing. The performance difference between a low end e-motorbike, and a high end e-bicycle is minimal to nothing especially when considering the limitations of city traffic.
Im sold on ebike. I built mine 2 months ago and love it! $800 1500 watts top speed of 37mph and will go 20-50 miles depending on my assistance. I havent bought gas in 2 months!
I totally agree, I have been wondering for a while why the big motorcycle manufacturers aren't realizing they can make good money in the mean time with e bicycles until the density of batteries get to a point where it has more energy or the charging gets fast enough to make sense and they become easier to use as well.
Chinese electric scooter manufacturers realized few months ago :D
My girlfriend’s Haibike e-bike has a Yamaha motor🤔
@@backcountyrpilot yeah I saw that too, but why is there no r125 equivalent electric city bike/dirt bike
@
All those cheap electric scooters have a battery that, when it fails (still happens too often), is more expensive than the complete scooter
@@Nightdare But it is still very affordable, easy to ride for anyone without motorcycle driving licence - everything said about why electric motorcycle are failing.
(for me it is not reason to sell my KTM, but neither reason to not ride electric scooter as well)
This guy's on-camera skills are fantastic. What a joy to behold. Reminds me of early day Clarkson.
and now time james may , ow wait , all time james may
camera skills are also very prime top gear. the shots of the rides give you that joy and longing to hit the road
Idk, Im actually noticing a lot more e-bikes on the street nowadays ...Perhaps they just needed a little time ...Great video, love all the work you put in to your channel ...Very high quality material, with a Hollywood style polish and shine.. Awesome voice , and delivery. Keep up the good work buddy!
This video is very much ahead of it's time.
"I ain't gettin' any more aerodynamic..."
Oof, I felt that.
I'm trying to get to a very ideal round shape but even this way there is some significant drag at high speeds :D
@@kornelkovacs5662 same!
"Sure, the physics favors urban use; but I'm no physician." #DadJokeGold
Great video and spot on! I think the electric bicycle market will be the sector that eventually moves the bar for electric motorcycles. The Ariel Rider Grizzly or the Surron ebikes are so darned close I could imagine them taking the next step in a few years.
These videos are ridiculously good.
The windows screensaver on the mac was hilarious
Fort Nine is an international treasure, truly one of the most talented content creators to ever walk the earth
He really takes things to another level
I think Quinten Tarantino is his Daddy.
Must be Canadian.
i mean its not just this one guy. the channel is run by a canadian company
he's like the scott the woz of automotive youtube
Beautifully succinct, clear, examination of a declining industry. The problem is that the key criterion for a motorcyclist is that whatever it is it has to be extremely noisy and bulky, so... make the frame out of heavy gauge steel bars, make it wide, make the handlebars 1 metre across, put a vast motor on each wheel, and most importantly, add a huge loudspeaker on the back that fires out MotoGP sounds at 200dB that says "Look at me". Then and only then will there be a market for eMCs. There is no logic to owning any motorcycle over 350cc and this would work well to attract those people.
I have a new Ford Lightning EV truck. My gas street sportbike isn't going anywhere anytime.
1. Power is incredible. 100+ho
2. Used for $2300 + suspension + mods $4000 OTD ready for track days.
3. Dead reliable, good for way more miles than I will ever put on it.
4. It's greener to just keep my old bike going.
It's a stupid proposition. Dirt bikes, though, thats a game changer for the sport. No more noise pollution = lots of new riding possibilities.
this guy is a clever cookie. he probably deserves a round from every motorcycle manufacturer
Clever cookie for what? Anyone watching the ebike market knows it's had big growth. What these cookies have done is the research to give us cold hard data to quantify the growth.
motorcycle dealers don't even give him bikes to review.. let alone tours to manufacturers.
Yes I agree his humor is great.
I want that ElectroSuzuki, You should go into production...
Check out Huck Cycles, they basically make the same thing as in the video
@@user-de4cq6uk6l yeah for 10x the price...this hipster shop is NOT the answer
@@Industrious420 exactly, if someone could mass produce ebikes like that for $500-$800 a pop it would be a massive success
@@user-de4cq6uk6l I think something in the 2-4k range would sell like hot cakes 🔥
Not that tekky to make they have similar kits for regular bicycles
We need a 1 year later update on this one... @FortNine
"since we're dealing with the factory, the children offered to build the motor axle..." I'M DEAD!!!
Ryan builds an electric motorcycle.
Everyone who has a project motorcycle: We're going electric!
Bruh not gonna lie, I'm considering it.
@@AlexSmashX3 I'm totally doing it now.
I wanna buy a project bike just to make it electric, like where are the links to the products used
@@vascomarum if all i need is a divers license for a build like this, then im for it too. I wonder what the insurance would be for this?
Highly recommend it. The 1970s project bike is a never-ending game of whack-a-mole... it usually takes a professional to get the thing all working at once. But anyone can rip everything out and install a battery and hub motor. It's oddly satisfying. ~RF9
I cannot describe these F9 vids as anything short of perfection.
I can
Try f5 to refresh.
@@sMv-Afjal you talking to him or me? Guessing it’s him just clarifying. I find them kind lame lately so I’m not about to hit f5 and watch again, more like alt+f4 or control+w or command+Q on Windows, Linux, or Mac respectively
@@Fee.1 actually ctrl+w works on PC to close a browser tab as well. Alt+F4 closes the whole browser.
Nevertheless, you're entitled to your own opinion. Personally I can just really appreciate the work they put in and wanted to express that. Not trying to change anyone's mind per se.
Great video as always 😊 but i need and love the sound of a roaring petrol engine. Call me an environmental jerk, but i would rather pay trice the price on petrol than ride an electric mc 😊 i ride a v-strom dl 650 XT 2020 with great milage and won't trade the (although perhaps boring sound) with the silence of the electric "engine". Thank you sir for the great video(s) 💪
lmao love your humor wasn't sure where u was gonna go with this short documentary! Cousin had an e-bike 10 years ago, amazing how MC, cars and ebikes are everywhere now.
6:00 that was put so beautifully wow 😭
The other day I seen someone sitting at a traffic light, wearing full riding gear and standing on a electric unicycle. I thought he was just weird but after looking into the electric unicycles and finding out they can hit speeds of 60mph, I now want one. Things are crazy.
It's a shame those weren't invented back in Evil Knievel's day, right? Seems like something only someone w/a deathwish would truly appreciate lol
FortNine has another video about how people are getting seriously hurt on these because they don't wear gear - they think of it like a bicycle, but it's more like a motorcycle.
Anything that moves faster than you can run needs a helmet while riding.
As fun as those may seem, just hope you never run into a panic braking situation. At least with 2 wheels, dumping it tends to be an option rather than a given.
Yeah i knew a commuter who road one, could take it on the train to seattle aswell
Modifying the tank to be a glove box/storage compartment would be the icing on the cake.
Would be interesting to see one modded to where the 'gas tank' IS the battery box.
@@barklordofthesith2997 bad idea, due to the high center of gravity of course.
@@nightarrow7473 While i agree that a lower center of gravity = better, i don't think it would make much of a difference as the gas tank when full of gas would weigh more than what the battery does.
@@barklordofthesith2997 But when the tank is full of gas, it usually has a much heavier engine directly underneath it. This thing is just a steel frame with wheels
That's actually a really good idea 💡
Charging plug at the gas cap, maybe?
First time watching your channel, an incredibly well rounded video. You have a subscriber. 👍
I think that one of the biggest reasons for electric motorcycles failing is simpler than all this. The motorcycle buying demographic loves the lound sound and visceral feel of motorcycle engines. I can't see that demographic of motorcycle buyers getting onboard with the quiet, refined nature of e-motorcycles.
By contrast, former vespa riders are going to be quick to adopt the e-mopeds and bikes for the same reason, they just want cheap, reliable around-town transportation.
Like you touch on in your overall thesis, the current pack of e-motorcycles is gunning for the high margin segment that is touring and sport bikes, but realistically those folks aren't giving up that hobby anytime soon.
Sales pitch: a DIY kit to build your own ev bike for a sensible price
They're out there. Typically around $2000-$3000 depending on what you're looking for. QS motors out of china is the big one for overseas and price / performance.
Link is literally in the description.
But flawed: I refuse to buy Chinese (for obvious reasons as well as safety. I will not store or charge a Chinese battery in my home!) and all proper stuff that is reliable, safe and not made with slave labor is too expensive.
I'd rather work on a CNG motorcycle or one that runs on E85
Everyone at IKEA : write this down! WRITE THIS DOWN!!!
@@pistonburner6448 "I will not store or charege a chinese battery in my home" I guarantee you already have multiple. Mobile phones, or if you dont have one of them a cordless home phone will use chinese batteries.
@@professorfrog7181 he isn't wall wrong about the battery (not sure about this one), if its in a diy kit you probrably want a affordable diy kit because otherwise you probrably wouldn't do it diy. And cheap batterys are more dangerous
3:42 "Sure the physics favors urban use, but I'm no physician"
Me: *eye twitch*
I feel like that was definitely on purpose lol
*wet paint*
It was definitely on purpose for Ryan. The question is was it on purpose for the character he was portraying?
Nice video. I had to go back and look a second time. That TC90 model with the dual range transmission was my first motorcycle. I rode it with the ICE for many years. Fun little bike.
Hit the nail on the head! For condo and apartment dwellers, there's no place to plug in at night. And that's the main dwelling of your typical urbanites.
Yep. While I do like the low rumble of the Triumph Speedmaster that I've been oogling for a few months now, in the end it comes down to feasibility.
I can refuel the Speedmaster.
I couldn't recharge anything else than an e-bicycle with a battery that can be taken out of the frame.
Niu has a detachable battery you can bring in office, coffee shop or condo charging. :)))
@@FortNine While I think they're still a bit too pricey, and in case of "non-urban" bikes still lack range... Yeah.
The charging infrastructure just isn't there.
@@rjgallman4916 I actually asked my boss about charging my (at that point hypothetical, never bought it) ebike-battery in the office.
He wasn't a fan.
Thats where portable batteries come in
Honestly, its cost.
If the Zero was more like $6k CAD to compete with many of the small ICE commuter bikes, I would totally buy an EV
There's that, but there's also electric bikes that did it better. You're not going to go on a decent road trip with an electric motorcycle and in town, you might as well save money and get an electric bike. Most people around here don't even have the ability to charge one at home, but charging an electric bike at home is doable for anybody with a home.
Exactly. Also used. I can get a used honda which is 100% fantastic and lasts for ever for 1k......
A good chuck of the mileage on my Cb500x has been commuting, some of the roads I take are 80+kph, so an e-bike is not ideal but could easily be done on a Zero and I would gladly do so! but the cost being double the bike I already use means it makes little sense.
For an affordable price for what they offer in capabilities I would be happy to have an electric motorcycle as a 2nd bike for commuting. But they are all a long way from that price for it to be viable.
@@Zonkotron Yes, used motorcycles have gone up but they are still very affordable. Plus you can get a brand new Ninja zx6-R for $10000.
@@SmallSpoonBrigade This sort of misses a major niche. E-bikes are great for urban commuting, but a large portion of Americans and Canadians are surburban dwellers, having a 30km or so commute requiring maybe not freeway speeds but would want something that could do 100 km/hr. This is the niche nobody's sought to capitalize on, the suburban commuter. So far there's a huge gap between basically a scooter (not enough speed or range) and the super-expensive high-performance offerings (too expensive). I just hope someone will make that before they all just give up on electric motorcycles entirely. With gas at US$3/gallon, I think that could sell super well. Market it to non-motorcyclists, tell them how much money in gas they could save each year - "Pays for itself in six months!" Market it not as a toy but the money-saving ecologically-responsible alternative to a car. Offer package deals to take the MSF course as part of the purchase, maybe gear bundled in as well (making it all much more approachable to non-motorcyclists), "US$4,500 and three days, and you're set to ride!"
Man, I really like your presentation style and how much thought you put into this video. I wish you weren't exclusively motorcycle focused
In the UK this would need road registering and a license for anything that has more than 250w and and doesn't have pedals... also can't assist above around 15mph (half the urban speed limit).
But converting blown up cheap dirt bikes for less than a couple grand and ending up with a 30-40mile range and the ability to explore lanes quietly is a great idea, hope the kits become more accessible with less custom machining needed.
North American companies fail to launch a small cheaper electric commuter bike
*Ryan in Thanos voice: Fine I’ll do it myself
Anyone can. Benjamin Nelson on CZcams, has a playlist on how to build an electric motorcycle.
You can start with cheap parts first, like a basic controller, lead-batteries, and a cheap motor, then later upgrade to Lithium batteries, a liquid-cooled motor with radiator & pump, and a fully tunable controller with Brake-Regeneration.
There are other videos about how to make an electric motorcycle, by converting a gas one.
And vids of bikes people made, to inspire you.
Aren't they Japanese companies tho?
who really wants them when you can get an E-bike for less?
@@THESLlCK
I am above & beyond sick of pedaling. I hate the limits of the human body. I want pegs or floorboards, and knee groves my legs can hold onto. I want a effing motorcycle. I'm sick of being poor, I'm sick of degenerates & bullies sabotaging me. I hate NYC.
I'm trusting no one, staying away low-quality people, and just focusing on earning money, and leaving this garbage city.
These are straight facts. i went into the industry trying to build an e motorcycle with a 100 amp battery but nobody wants it, so I started building moped/ cafe style electric bikes that can have modular batteries/motors added by the buyer at their own discretion if they wanted to add some spice to their builds. You have to cover a wide range of interests with one bike model, you can't expect to win out everyone in that 0.04% category with a flashy 1 ton bike
no one wants to speed the extra money and training on insurance and other things,
I spent a couple months in Beijing and electric bikes of one design or another are ubiquitous. It is baffling to me why, in the age of CAD and better batteries/motors, that we can't design a sleek, practical, high-performance e-bike in the US. The market and tech are there, so what gives? Oh, and the majority of the e-bikes in Beijing were very ugly. They look like those old archaic lawn mower engine-powered mini bikes, only larger and retrofitted to electric components. Atrociously functional.
@@brentwalker3300 the market is mostly with simple ebikes. motorcycles fall off in interest when people realize they can't lift if off the ground if they fall off due to battery weight lol. Chinese design companies just poop out what they think americans will be interested in due to a handfull of popular brands at the best bang for their buck, i don't blame them. I design from the usa but I know everything will have to come from china to make a profit so I also have to use semi generic hub motors and components.
@@Timbodacious Interesting. Thanks for the reply. Is using a hub motor really the best topology? I haven't looked into e-bike tech much but I would think there is a better approach. Also, given the higher efficiency due to lower weight per occupant, I would think that e-bikes would be able to provide sufficient range/speed for them to be really competitive as a daily commuter. Also, placing the batteries low provides good low center of gravity and stability.
@@brentwalker3300 hub motors are best bang for your buck and good for bikes that are just for cruising. hub drives leave a bit more room for batteries in a bike also.mid drives are best for trails and hilly locations but with bicycle chains anything over 2kw starts to eat gears and chains. Range is the problem that plagues ebikes and motorcycles. at low speeds they can be a great value to invest in but at freeway speeds you're only getting a 60 mile round trip on average with most brands
The reason they don't sell is that they're quiet. In my experience, riders seem to make it their goal to deafen all pedestrians within 3 blocks.
Here's my take on this. A MOTORcycle is an experience as a whole, you get to know the character of the engine, hear the sounds it makes, feel the vibrations, even smell the fumes. Watch oil levels, coolants etc. It's in some way a living breathing thing, just on a whole other level than a cold boring EV. MOTOR cycles forever!
I just stumbled upon this channel, I can’t believe i found a younger version of technology connections
Just imagine if they make a collab LMAO
AHAHAHAHA
@@rennypd6434 I think it'd cause some kind of tear in reality from thoroughness, wit, and production values.
you just sold me this channel.
I think they're pretty much the same age, lol. That age being max 30
I bought my five year old daughter a Razor electric “dirt bike” to ride around the cul de sac. It taught her balance and throttle control tool. Bought her a bigger one when she grew taller. She absolutely loves it. If those things were available when I was a kid, I would have never gotten off it except for a daily recharge.
The recharge, small range, and lack of power is why I graduated from my 38mph 48v 1000w ebike of 11 years to a 150cc scooter.
what you need is a geared hub motor or add a derailler. there are soo many good options of powerful motors and controllers and high discharge battery.
This nailed the issue at hand very accurately and fun. I'm a fan of e skateboards with a budget I got a meepo Hurricane with AT cloudwheels and a phantom with cloud wheels. Recently got a 2 battery Gosen e bike that does 100 miles at 28mph. It does half and at 25mph on a full battery. My budget is 3k US next year and I'm definitely interested in something with more torque. You can find LSM rides that offer that and go 50mph with no need for a motorcycle license. Anything more than 5K US and your just showing off. Since you can just get a moped that does more for far less on gas.
If you chopped the top of the tank and reattached it with small hinges and a lock you could use that space as small storage (once again a useful addition for an accurate target market of an office worker).
Or move the power regulator into the fuel tank and put a storage compartment where the engine was.
@@TomFoolery9001 this guy gets it!
I knew this comment would be here.
“All from China, and since we’re dealing directly with the factory, the children offered”
Sir, that was absolutely comedy gold. I absolutely lost it 😂 This guy is the American Jeremy Clarkson
I think he is Canadian unless you mean America the continent
Jeremy Clarkson is a British conceited egocentric narcissist ! Ryan is an intelligent unassuming, down-to-earth, informative (In the world of motorcycles) and a Canadian which has nothing to do with Americans.
@@palco22 what British hurt yoy
@@lasagna5934 I understand you completely, It is a shame that Clarkson is British and Gordon Ramsay (another low life) is unfortunately, also British but *ssholes come in a wide variety of nationalities. Which one are you ?
@@palco22 one of the british colonies lol
Motorcycling is often a social activity. It just doesn't work if refuelling regime is different among the group.
I'm a first time watcher, Where did you record this the background is beautiful
{0:00-0:42} Squamish, BC (south of Whistler, north of Vancouver.)
{1:13-1:48, 2:21-2:40} Cypress Lookout, Cypress Bowl Rd., West Vancouver.
{8:09-end} Cypress Mountain Resort Parking Lot, West Vancouver.
The two-lane back road at various other points I haven't been able to pin down.
i had brammo empulse, it drove ok. parts were near impossible to find..and last year it burned down whilst charching....so back to dinojuice.
FortNine: builds an own eletric Motorcycle
Germany: "TÜV SAGT NEIN"
Die Akku hat keine Kühlsystem, ich wurde es nicht so gerne fahren wie eine Chinesische...
TÜV sagt immer nein 😔
It's a Moped with the 1.5kw motor at best. So no TÜV for the time being .... :D
actully you can swap your petrol engine against an electric one on any
fingers to TUV....they´re working for China...
I drive a Niu with a normal drivers license here in europe with a 3100W hub motor. 1500 is barely enough to get you up a hill.
You were in Squamish!! Thats dope.
Just wanna pop on in and say something you have probably heard before, the production quality of your videos are some of the best I've seen especially for CZcams.
It’s actually crazy how uneconomically expensive EV-motorcycles are, for the price of most zero’s you can get a nice sports bike, dirt bike and a cafe.. oh yeah and your not restricted to your neighborhood
That's exactly the problem I keep running into as well. I COULD save up and go for a Zero (if I wanted one in the first place), or I could go and get a nice naked bike, a cruiser and some pretty old timer. That's not even a decision.
Love this video I've thought about doing a build like this since I first hard of e-motorcycles.
I always come back to your videos to have fun with the the sarcastic remarks and innuendos 😂
I'm a city girl. I have myself an Eagle E-motorcycle Made in Korea. It's a motorcycle just retrofitted with electric engine and wiring. It even has a gas tank. Cost 3000. Goes up to 55 kilometers an hour. And the landlord allows me to bring it on the elevator twice a year for winter storage. I love it. Booting around town on it is some of the most fun I've ever had. But I have never driven any other motorcycle so no basis of comparison.
I found the statement about the landlord allowing you so frustrating. what a shit world we live in where adults needing permission to do basic things is increasingly becoming the standard. landlords are parasites. Without them, and with reasonable zoning laws, purchasing would be affordable.
@@BeefIngot Spoken like a man who does not pay to maintain an elevator....
@@steveflinn6Oh yea dude. I feel real empathetic about some dude raking in profits from other people's sufferings having to pay a grand every few years to have a next to maintainance free elevator looked at...
Let's just ignore the fact that collectively people are paying far in access of any of their costs _and_ don't get any equity in return
The tone deaf things some people say
@@BeefIngot Hello, bringing a motorcycle into the building and into the elevator should never be a « basic things » ever… My point of view 😉
@@BeefIngot use the stairs then nerd
Dude looks more like Tarantino every time I check in on this channel
With a little Mr. Bean thrown in.
@Alex Berkman I think that says more about you than you realise.
@@ConradLarsonGaming hehe....
Today I'm going to run some errands around town and maybe hit a drive through on the way home. Something like this would be awesome to do it on.
I’ve had my 1500 watt ebike 4 years and love it don’t want a car or motorcycle it’s perfect for city driving
It’s more versatile than a car
This is why for now, a diy ebike is the way to go. I have an internally geared rear hub on mine, it's awesome.
How did you get your rego?
Any tutorials I can use?
The reasons to build your own far outnumber the reasons to buy one manufactured.. You can buld a whole bunch of bike(or bikes) for $3500-$5000..
They are not. Impractical, Expensive, and a nightmare to service. It's a chore
I’m running a 2.5k watt mid drive so I can use the cassette to switch gears. There’s literally no point to being below third gear cuz the torque throws you offf lol