Why SEELE will ALWAYS be THE STRONGEST Explained | Honkai Star Rail
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- čas přidán 24. 07. 2024
- The weight that Seele carries as a DPS is the one thing that can make me ignore waifus and appearances. She literally represents the indomitable human spirit in gameplay and in lore. Seele is proof that you don't need to be at a better starting point than others to succeed. Does it help? Definitely. Does it matter in the long run? Not really. Optimize what you have to the utmost extent.
WE'VE MADE A CHOICE GO FIGHT AGAINST YOUR FATE
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Script: "How is Seele still the strongest?" You might be asking. Her multipliers are low compared to other DPSes, her self buffs aren't insane either, and her passive "Resurgence" rarely procs anymore because of lack of additional enemies on the field. The reason is because of gameplay optimization. Despite her shortcomings, if you have complete knowledge of the game and play perfectly, her ceiling is the highest among all DPSes. This is because of her advance forward from basic attack, her speed boost, and her low energy cost for ults. They allow for insanely complex rotations to be possible. You can manipulate the action order to the point where Seele would get double or triple the amount of effective action of another DPS like 镜流. And despite her self buff being mediocre, its trigger point is not from Resurgence passive, but mostly from her ult. With such a low energy ult, you can effectively maintain 100% uptime on her buff, there's even a hidden mechanic where if you use her ult on her turn specifically, the buff will be extended by one turn. Little things like these make Seele overtake everyone despite all odds being stacked against her. That's the general concept behind how she has the best feats in the game, lowest cost 0 cycles on both Memory of Chaos and Pure Fiction, surpassing even Acheron by using less limited 5 star cost and also surpassing her when using equal relics.
Now I'll explain why I keep vehemently defending Seele's place in the meta. Let's start from version 1.0, Seele was the underdog character, even prerelease 景元 had more hype than her. And that's because a vast majority of Seele's strength is locked behind the player's competency, and when incompetent buffoons play her, she ends up being bad. I like it when a character is like that, trash when played by trash, and the strongest when played perfectly, Seele fits that role so very well. The concept and dark horse archetype that she represents supersedes everything else in the game, that's why I'm willing to ignore all my biases and rate her above more beautiful characters like 镜流 and my main waifu Acheron, because those 2 characters have mediocre skill ceiling, weak players can play them effectively, and there isn't much room for optimization either. If you don't believe me, compare the rotation between my Acheron and Seele 0 cycle, Seele is just more complex. This is also the reason I enjoy using Robin as a DPS, her complexity matches Seele's, and when speedtuned perfectly, she's actually top 3 strongest DPS and can do many low cost 0 cycles, although her shortcoming is having a restrictive team composition and being countered by some enemies like this dinosaur. To surpass Seele would mean that a character would have to be more complex than her and have multipliers comparable to hers. Based on current trend, Hoyoverse is not going down that path, so for the foreseeable future, there's no character that will be surpassing Seele, until the day a more complex character appears. If Hoyo releases more overtuned trash, as the best HSR player, I will make sure that Seele's feats are better than theirs, always and forever, no matter what their kits are, because at the end of the day, proving Seele is better is the same as proving player skill matters most.
Anyways, I know there will be people who oppose what I'm saying, there will be deniers, mainly casuals. To deny Seele's supremacy is to deny the player's impact on the game, and to admit to your own powerlessness. It's unbelievably pathetic to deny this truth, it's basically denying the ability to break past what is intended by Hoyoverse. Not many games allow you to surpass the feats of all the overtuned trash with an outlier underdog DPS by having game knowledge, in a lot of other games, some characters are so much more unbalanced that no matter what you do, you can't close the gap. But in HSR you're given the golden opportunity to do just that, so instead of accepting the narrative Hoyo is trying to spin, wouldn't you want to have an impact on the meta instead? I hope you guys know where I'm coming from now. Enjoy the rest of the video, I think it's a decent summary.
0:00 Intro
0:56 Reasoning
5:38 Summary
Why Seele will ALWAYS be THE STRONGEST Explained | Honkai Star Rail
#honkai #honkaistarrail #hsr #memoryofchaos #purefiction #hoyoverse #mihoyogame - Hry
Seele makes every other DPS disappear among the sea of butterflies
couldnt agree more
mfs be playing her with turned off brain then call her bad 💀
4:23 I heard it as "Seele's feet are better than theirs".
LMAOOOO
First and foremost, thank you for addressing the elephant in the room. From my personal experience, there seems to be a high corelation between players who auto battle, even in end game content like gold and gears, that also see Seele as considerably weaker and "powercrept". I think you put it perfectly about how you will only see her at her max potential once you put the time and effort into actually understanding her kit and how she plays. I also think it's worth noting that Seele is also the beneficiary of having all around great synergy with every support unit in the game. Whether it be four star options like Tingyun or Asta to characters like Sparkle and Ruan Mei, every support is great and playing into her strengths which is also another reason I love having Seele on my teams
My Queen has gotten sponsors... Now we need her ASMR!
people clown on you but i agree. Seele's strength is that her damage comes from taking multiple actions with resurgence and high natural speed. Along with her self action advance, this means that Seele's damage distribution can be fine tuned for every encounter and it's up to the player to figure out how to not waste a single point of damage. This is why her min max potential is so good but people only care about damage per screenshot even though their DHIL/JL is overkilling for no reason. With good knowledge of your damage thresholds and using basic instead of skill/ult to kill when you don't need to, the amount of extra AV you get with Seele is incredible.
As someone who started playing in 2.1 after being pestered by a friend to play. The few times I got to try Seele (a tutorial and a event i think) her mechanics and potential skill ceiling are what really seem really fun and make rolling for her a no-brainer.
Xolze finally got a sponsor!!!! To celebrate this great accomplishment, can u release a asmr vid doing a tier list ranking of hsr characters 👀
idk about ASMR
@@XolzeTelos it’s just whispering into mic, maybe u could release short vid to gauge thoughts on asmr vids?
Tbh, I'm really surprised why there's no one talking about how strong Robin for Seele. I guess people focus too much to that FuA CDM buff for Robin and ignore other buff like 100% AF from her ult. I'll tell you about my Story with Seele in PF.
I can manage to get 40k easily PF with something like E0S0 Seele, E1S0 Sparkle, TY DDD, Lynx before current PF with FuA buff. I only got 32k for current PF with similar team. I tried to change my Lynx to Asta for current PF and then I got 40k (really close to die). I pulled Robin because I think I can upgrade my Herta Himeko team and free Ruan Mei from that team.
After some testing, I tried something like E0S0 Seele, E1S0 Sparkle, E0S1 Robin, TY DDD for current PF. I can get 40k with one cycle left with this team (Sam didn't have a chance to enter her combustion state LOL). My strategy with this team is by recharge Robin's ult with TY ult so Robin can ult immediately after her concerto state end and we get a ton of turn (also permanent buff).
Yeah Robin was one hell of a buff.
this is actually giving me motivation to rebuild my seele again, god bless
I started the game early but didn't get Seele until some final days of her banner (or Zilla as the auto subtitles XD). I got Seele a few days before her banner ends, and luckily got her signature right after, so I have a solid dps I could bring to everywhere. For relics I only start farming when others finished building their Seele, I learn to play Seele when others have played her, and still play Seele when many others benched her. She's still the greatest dps character I've ever had, no regret pulling Seele. MOC? She's a Hunt, obviously can clear MOC; PF? She has Resurgence, obviously can clear; AS? Boss has summons, why not?
your convincing me even more to pull for her now
I would assume even if shes getting endless turns and all that that simply by power scaling the endgame to suit the future powercreep shes gonna fall off.
Like the gap will just get so large that her complexities dont matter.
She got a buff from Robin, she was about equal to Acheron before but now she wins. It'd take a DPS even more overtuned than Acheron to win lmao If that happens then the game is screwed.
@@XolzeTelos yeah if the powercreep comes through supports then Seele should be fine, if it comes through new damage dealers then oof.
@@AdrasAdraki We definitely won't get another DPS like Acheron that can threaten Seele's supremacy for a full version at least.
@@XolzeTelosBoothill...
the amount of 🦇chesting is crazy
i laughed my ass off when the summary started 😭
After seeing this vid i wanna see an in depth guide on seele maybe I want to roll for her now
I have been a Seele main since 1.0, shes strong and my fav character
i always found her cool as with her scythe, her resurgence is saitsfying and i just love how shes the only character that can give herself infinite turns
If u want a fun strong dps i would recommend Seele, even above all the other dps
I know cause i have them all, and shes still my fav, even tho i quit i will forever be a Seele main ❤
Would you say that even now it's worth pulling for Seele when she reruns? I've got all the harmony characters except for Robin (Can't build FUA team yet), since I'm prioritising my pull for a future BS/Kafka rerun comp, provided my pulls on the Firefly banner isn't too costly. I'm casual but willing to dive into the speed stuff and experimenting with optimizing my account to get full clear on all the endgame content, hopefully zero cycling one day since I don't find it difficult to clear MOC with my account. Though PF is tough, but maybe it won't be when I get BS/Kafka and maybe a Seele depending on your opinion.
Sure, pull for Seele.
before watching: i cant tell if this sarcasm or not
after watching: still cant so ill just say this no ones saying seeles bad they're just saying her kit doesnt come online till after a kill and thats a big issue considering no one else in this game struggles from this conditioning i would still rate seele about s tier even without the kill and in most end game content aside from gold and gears shes still good just really squishy and struggles without weakness implant so in all honesty still imo a well respected good dps.
(edit) wanted to add no hate towards any seele enjoyers like whoever u want and play who u want and most importantly misha out dps'es yanqing remember that.
the wind set is op. I admire you for farming it
Seele keep proving she is best dps every single time. on element, off element, against one enemy, against 5 enemies. People keep talking about powercreep when Seele a 1.0 dps is still on top. We have been devolving since Jing Yuan in terms of dps mechanics. New dps absolute brain dead to play and need eidolons and sig lightcone for basic features.
I've been shilling seele since 1.0 and everyone just kept talking about how she got powercrept or I should drop her. Glad to see there's more level minded people out there
U ARE TRULY A REAL SEELE MAIN FROM DAY 1. like the dedication u have to prove that she is still on the same level as she was on release is literally unmatched. keep building this woman!
That's 100% true, she's future proof as long as the game reward strategy!!
We getting the bag 🫡
Hi asking for tips, Is -1 sparkle better or hyperspeed sparkle for seele?
Hyperspeed
@@XolzeTelos
So this is where that Firefly comment came from x) I see ! Maybe it's a sign telling me that I did the right choice to pull for Seele, so Firefly will be her successor since they are similar (because of Firefly e2 I think)
Does Seele need eidolon or her LC TO WORK or what stats do need on her?
I don't have her but I belive she is very stroong also and underrated because NA players can't play her
Seele's eidolons are useless. Her LC is good but not needed either, it's better to pull on supports, like Robin E1. As for stats, it depends on how many limited 5* cost you're using, if you're using an E2 Sparkle with E1 Robin you can get away with trash stats, but if you're using lower cost team, then you might need something like 70/200 crit with 3.2k atk. Can also be lowered if your supports are speedtuned properly.
me when a character known for turn manipulation is good in a turn based game 🤯
I see your point but I REFUSE
W edit keep cooking
When will you post a guide on how to Actually play her
I have no idea
Comprehensive Seele guide and techs vid soon? Pwease 🥺
I'm bad at making guides
mate you havent even made low cost seele 0t on aventurine or the new moc
Robin plays like her so just imagine fr. I'll do it later.
Looking at current fiction, the FuA one, u think Sili want Night for this 🤔?
Sure
jingliu or dhil? which one is better and have higher ceiling?
DHIL
Agreed, my built Qingque does more damage than built Fraudliu
What are the min stats for Seele and her teammates to make her 0 cycle ?
Depends on what 0 cycle you're going for and how many costs you're using honestly. It could be as low as Tectone's, or as high as 3.5k atk 200% cdmg.
@@XolzeTelos what about crit chance and speed?
@@adamtaing9391 Crit rate doesn't matter in 0 cycles, it depends on how much willpower you have, I've won with characters at 50-60 crit rate lmao. Speed on Seele is completely useless, wasted stat. On supports, it depends on what comp you're using, if Spronya then 170+ speed might be required on a couple supports, if not Spronya then lower speeds like 150+ are fine.
Alt title: why seele will always 0-cycle
also no way argenti is better than black swan kafka edit: nvm i completely read what u put wrong lmao
Black Swan alone yeah, Kafka nah.
I'm not a theorycrafter, so Seele will always be the strongest because she's cute af.
the edit is hilarious
How is robin just as complex to use as seele?
Complicated if you use her as DPS. Watch my previous Robin 0 cycles, quite complicated imo.
3:52 21 THOUSAAAAAAND FROM TINGYUN TALENT? I THOUGHT THAT WAS USELESS WTF
It's good
why zero cycle when you can enjoy life and grab yo jades
Because 0 cycle is true completion in HSR, like how in other games there are secret bosses that you need to beat for that sweet 100% completion, HSR is no different. 30/30 is max score you can get, so why not go for it? Just a completionist thing.
what you said is true in your vision of what is the strongest, for me it doesnt matter the sealing of the dps character, the floor is waaaaaaaaaaaaay more important, imo if the dps has a higher floor then seele he is better then seele, because what is the point of the character having a higher sealing if at the point that u reach this sealing u are destroying the content anyway? there is no point. the only point is to do self imposed challenges like 0 cycle what is not necessary to beat the game.
Spoken like a true casual, who's to say one day MoC won't be so hard that it requires knowing how to play the game well? imo People who put in the bare minimum don't deserve to decide what meta is, at that point just play whoever you want and shut up.
@@XolzeTelos imo people dont need to be a completely fuc**** loser and waste their intire life min maxing on a P2W gacha game to have a opinion about the meta, what u see about the meta can change very easily on what u wanna get out of the game, if i want to 0 cycle with the less possible effort then seele wouldn't be the best anymore, i can still 0 cycle with my S0 ratio with just 1 5 star sup at E0S0 and really mid artefacts, my seele cant do it (i actually put way more effort into seele since i like her more)
@@recker4267 Then it's not meta, it's called your opinion, there's a difference. You can have opinions and think that Acheron > Seele, it's fine to have preferences, it just won't be the meta.
@recker4267 First of all, I HIGHLY doubt you can do that with Ratio, not to mention that wouldn't even come close to getting a 30k score in pure fiction 4, and the biggest selling point for Seele is that she is arguably the best for clearing all end game content at a pretty f2p friendly e0s1, being able to compete with the best dps units in MoC, Pure Fiction and Simulated Universe. Every other dps besides Acheron either cannot get it done in all modes or require way more investment and complex team setups in modes they are weak in like Jingliu in pure fiction. But hey, if your preference as an auto battler is to spend similar resources and time on 4-5 dps units than you do you ig
@@XolzeTelos meta stands for "most effective tatics avaliable", but most effective for what? do 0 cycle with the highest possible investment? then yeah seele is the meta, but if it is for the lowest investment possible 0 cycle? it woudnt be seele i tell u that, i can't see a character that needs way more investment as a more effective strategy, it doesnt even make sense
erm what the sigma
the koolaid is strong with this one
How are they gonna make the character who is confirmed to be unable to read require a brain to use
The irony of Hoyoverse.
1:20 did seele's ult affect the audio here?
LMAOOO nah, I think the mic got hit.
This is where I will disagree. Sure she has been able to zero cycle every MoC so far but it takes so many tries at times and it just makes me angry. I can't count the amount of times I didn't crit on the finishing blow when I have 90% cr. It's fighting RNG. Acheron is truly number one because it takes little to no effort to 0 cycle with her.
For pushing records, Acheron also needs resets for RNG tbh (took couple hours to get that 1 cost 0 cycle on Gepard), no character is truly free from RNG. (if you're pushing records) So RNG factor is irrelevant, we look at which record is the best. Seele isn't just "able to 0 cycle every MoC", she's able to 0 cycle with the most restrictions/lowest cost.
The difference lies within their relics. Acherons BiS gives her so much free cr and she's basically guaranteed to do consistent DMG throughout. Not to say she doesn't have RNG but she doesn't have enough to make me restart 20 times.
@@OnlySSSTuna Maybe because you're going for different runs? Some runs are bound to have a lot of RNG, while others don't have as much. How teams are structured etc also affect this.
Acheron is just less complicated in my experience. Also seele nearly lost her title of 0 cycling every MoC with aventurine. She was literally saved by robin.
@@OnlySSSTuna Yeah less complex is definitely true, that's what the whole video is talking about. But stuff like less relic investment and less rng are bogus, it depends on what you're trying to do. Don't get me started on less 5* cost, that's Seele's specialty fr. Also, Seele can 0 cycle Aventurine without Robin.
Why Hoyo give Seele such a strange E6? Is it just a simple whale trap or something only 200iq players can understand?
It's good if you don't kill the boss with an ult, which is kinda hard as a whale.
Ain't no way... this channel is even better than Eango at satire.
Nah this isn't satire, this is the truth.
how you feel about ff v3?
Worse boothill.
@@XolzeTeloscould you explain?
@andychen5447 Boothill just does what she does better than her. FF is eidolon reliant.
Sadge....hope hoyo buff her again in V4 and V5
@@XolzeTelos e0s1 firefly is equivelant to e6s5 acheron
Counter argument can she crit
Yeah she'd crit
@@XolzeTelos even if she has 99.4 crit rate?
0.6% margin of error is tough, true. It may cause some trouble but she'll crit.
@@XolzeTelos understandable
There is no dimension where seele will ever be on acherons level, they are in separate tiers of power for a reason, and as endgame content mobs get more hp she will not even be able to proc resurgence without convoluted setups meanwhile acheron will still be doing 800k average e0.
I'll wait for the E0 Acheron pure fiction 0 cycle.
@@XolzeTelos All e0 seele clears of pf 0 cycle ive seen including yours are of her being mega ultra buffed by 3 harmonies to allow her to do enough damage to the mobs(whose hp have been increasing) to proc her resurgence efficiently, my point still stands that she will be unable to perform these feats in the future with stat increases, while acheron can (At the best that ive seen) do a 1 cycle e0 without any help from other dps that will continue for the next year or so of pure fictions due to the immense damage she does per cycle, i will forfeit your point that at the end of the day agency in skill is most important and i do agree that characters like seele should be the strongest in the game, one thing that she lacks to be considered the strongest is some form of infinitely scaling ability(Gaining some amount of permanent attack or damage percent per kill) that would allow her to outperform future dps in modes where her ceiling can be pushed to its utmost height, i genuinely hope we get such a character in the future as that would make the general skill ceiling of the game much highee and allow for different strategies and team builds to be implemented to achieve the highest possible outcome of that units power.
@@Berswerk The thing is, your assumption about Acheron and Seele in the future are based on nothing. With Robin, Seele's potential in pure fiction got MUCH higher, while Acheron is stagnant. If HP increase, all I need to do is use more cost to win. RN My PF Seele feats are at 4 cost, I can assure you the Acheron you've seen aren't 4 cost. Seele needs 3 harmonies to win, but Acheron can't win even if you gave her 5 harmonies. The gap between 1 cycle and 0 cycle is insurmountable. So instead of assuming stuff that has a low chance of happening, make conclusions based on reality.
@@XolzeTelos I have a habit of overoptimizing everything, especially in relation to the f2p playerbase, the reason i believe that seele requiring that many harmonies(resource intensive) is a massive downside in this discussion is due to the fact that most players unless day 1 wont be able to have access to all of those units, especially built optimally, other units can perform similar or higher feats to seele in multiple gamemodes without needing that level of investment which makes them have a higher total value in my evaluation, I am simply pointing out the reality that seele is a very investment heavy character to perform at these benchmarks which reduces the chance that the average players who use her will be able to perform at these levels. My statement about the power increase of the mobs isnt exactly fantasy as you have seen it yourself the massive hp jump of mobs/bosses from the last moc to this one, and that will only continue to happen with stronger dps releases making it harder for seele to perform at a level higher than those units due to her own kit limitations.
There will always be a stronged harmony to help her in this matter but it is also inevitable that one day it just wont be enough
@@Berswerk Harmonies are an issue in 1.4, we have more than enough right now, stop living in the past. Also, if you are complaining about triple harmonies, then what team do you want? Inefficient ones with sustains? So much for hyperoptimization. Even if you were to compare sustain 0 cycles, Seele has the lowest cost 0 cycles there too. No matter what kind of 0 cycles you try to invent, Seele will always require less cost than Acheron, that is a fact. Doesn't matter if you give her 3 supports or 2 supports, her regular 0 cycle, sustain 0 cycle, restricted 0 cycle, 0 AV clear, all will always require less cost.
You really think MoC will keep increasing at this rate? 2m to 3m to 4m to 5m before we hit 3.0? What a joke, look at 2.3 MoC, you'll see how wrong you are. Hoyoverse didn't monopolize gacha by being trashy and having uncontrollable powercreep. A DPS would need to powercreep Acheron hard to be able to surpass Seele. I just don't see it happening. Flawless in PF and MoC in 1 character is extremely improbable.
pure BS. Seele needs the highest investment of any dps since her kit revolves around getting kills. There is not much you can do if you face tanky elites without adds
Her specialty isn't resurgence, resurgence is just an extra that makes her surpass Herta in PF, watch the video dumbass. It's more so about advance forwards, speed boosts making -1 Bronya/Sparkle not require speed, 2t ult with Tingyun, lots of action facilitating stronger synergies with Robin, and more things. If you have flawless understanding of every kit interaction this would be obvious.
@@XolzeTeloswhat spd setup do you recommend for bronya or sparkle with seele? I’m not using ddd or wind btw
that sponsor looks like a scam 💀
LMAO idk about that
just roll sparkle lmoa
No she's short and flat
I get what she's trying to say..but the amount of copium in this video, I can't 😂
Nah 0 copium.
🧢.
Naaah rewatch the video
is 80+180 wind set necessary for seele?
i love seele, i have her 82+195 quantum set E0S0 (i couldnt pull her lc T_T) but i just cant play her that well like u in most situation. would like to see more showcase on how u use her mechanics.
Depends on what you're doing, wind set is for PF.
interesting… you make me want to follow your religion, too bad i just came back to the game 😢
This has to be ragebait
You have to be ragebaiting