a long rant about miraculous season 5's finale...
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- čas přidán 28. 08. 2023
- I'm 2 months late but ...hey Hotspotters! Welcome back to another video where this time, I've analyzed Miraculous Ladybug season 5's finale: Conformation & Re-Creation. Spoiler alert: I hated it LMAO. If you have any thoughts, feel free to comment them down below!
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Great analysis and I agree with everything, as always. It was an honor to edit half of this video, and Im looking forward to editing more in the future! 😸❤
great job editing
Lyla could have it wiped As well
I agree, I definitely prefer this finale over the one we got, it covers everything and it gets more intense as well as interesting (considering most mlb viewers and fans are above 10yrs old)
13:13
18:07
This finale was just a let down. The identity reveal. Adrien and Emilie re-uniting. Adrien finding out the truth of his father and the rings. none of what we wanted happened. If none of this happens by the S6 finale I'm just going to quit miraculous as a whole. The fact that giving this show ONE last chance is ridiculous and should be quitting rn.
Completely understandable 😭 I’m even contemplating just not making regular analysis videos on s6 because I’ve lost hope
@TheCartoonHotspot Heck, might as well rewrite the whole show. I won't deny it. It had strong moments, but that's not enough to carry the whole show. At least the movie was good. Has some weak parts, but all stories do.
You probably won't quit on it as miraculous is so bad but good
@@yixunxi Tbh that’s probs what’s going to happen but this finale has put me at a all time low for miraculous. I’m trying to hope that I don’t acc quit but if the writing doesn’t improve I will just quit.
Righttt 😭
Seriously, the fact that Adrien stayed in his solitary confinement chamber and made Plagg give his Miraculous to Ladybug because his nightmare made him afraid that he could lose control of his powers and destroy everything kinda implies that to the writers, he's actually... not fit to be the wielder of the Miraculous of Destruction??
Cause if it's apparently so easy for Adrien to lose control, then maybe he shouldn't have the Miraculous in the first place, which honestly is not the narrative you should be portraying for one of your main protagonists, whether it was unintentional or not!
The series has proven numerous times why adrien is the best holder for miraculous of the destruction but this episode contradicts everything aboht Adrien’s character. Like I said in the video, miraculous has certain establishments but the writers constantly go against those said establishments without even realizing it😭 I truly do think Adrien would’ve found a way to face his fear and just break out of the room like cmon… THEE adrien Agreste… thé most optimistic character in the show… plus he was willing to cataclysm both dark owl and dark Cupid so now he’s suddenly scared of hurting people? (Yes I know it’s the whole world but still)
Exactly which is devastating since he’s literally one of the main characters. It’s supposed to be Ladybug and Chat Noir equal. Not one over the other. Except this has become the marionette show and Adrien is just a sidekick. He better get his storyline. Low key hope he breaks up with marionette when he finds out she lied to him
@@TheCartoonHotspot1. The fears feel real due to the Akuma’s influence. These are exaggerated responses to emotions, like with Risk.
2. Adrien is so convinced he will mess up, he doesn’t even risk a headache-induced misfire. Imagine if Ladybug activated Cataclysm, got a headache, and reflexively grabbed for her head; assuming that works.
3. A vision of Cat Blanc, plus this timeline’s hitting Hawkmoth. Enough said, he has a foundation for his fears.
@@LocalMaple Nah I gotta disagree here. By making Adrien stay in his solitary confinement area because he’s “too scared” to lose control tells us that adrien has not grown at all, is weak, and went through 0 character development. You’re telling me despite everything him, ladybug/marinette have been through, he still can’t handle the truth about his father/go up against him??? If this is the case and hes still giving up is miraculous so easily anytime a situation gets stressful then maybe he’s not fit to be the holder of the destruction miraculous?? Marinette also was under the affects of the akuma, experienced chat blanc first hand, but still was able to stand up and fight back: because she had much growth to her character.
I can’t believe she defeated Monarch without chat noir, like, wasn’t the point of season 4 into season 5, where she lost the miraculous, telling her that she needs to rely more on chat noir and less on the other superheroes?
Gabriel did NOT need to be forgiven by Marinette and Adrien or deserve a statue. Having his identity exposed wouldve been neat to see.
Yeah, I guess because it a “kids” show, they are trying to send the message that forgiveness is key but Gabriel did too much to them for 9 months for him to be forgived so quickly. Eventually, forgiveness is good but rn no
@@josratubanguraI think that kids should be taught that sometimes some people can’t be forgiven.
@@josratubangura If that was the message then why wasn’t Chloe forgiven?
@@TheJadeEmperor Let me reword my response since it has been two months and I have had more time to process. For Gabriel, I believe they are trying to say that if you have committed evil acts for “a good reason” or “love” then you should be forgiven. Which is not the way it has to go all the time. With Chloe, the writers are trying to say that not everyone can change, no matter how much encouragement they receive. Now, that would’ve been fine if they never tried to redeem Chloe in the first place, and just left her a bully. But, I also find that realistic. Someone can be on a path on redemption, but then something could happen, where they give up and don’t try to change again.
@@josratubangura the irony that thomas astruc teaches that exact opposite lesson and says chloe cant change or be redeemed while denying she was neglected, just for him to turn around and try to justify and redeem gabriel the man who literally said he was willing to destroy the world. Like you can not redeem chloe but its weird to say a bully cant be redeemed or doesnt deserve redemption, then portray the man who has been terrorizing a city and almost killing people as some heartbroken victim who was doing it all out of love and give him a statue. Also about the writers trying to say not everyone can change with chloe, they actually showed her changing and becoming a better person, they showed her emotionally vulnerable and being understanding when thing didnt go how she wants, they showed her using herself as a shield for sabrina. There isnt a problem showing some people dont change, but that doesnt seem like what happened, it seem like thomas left for a season and the writers did something with chloe, and when thomas returned he didnt like she was being redeemed. Like even in season 1 it seems like she has at least some redeeming qualities and values sabrina at least, chloe starts getting redeemed, treating people better, being less spoiled and actually taking accountability for her actions while doing the morally correct things, then just suddenly become 10x worse and doesnt even seem like she cares about sabrina at all. I can understand a "not all people change" development but based on how thomas act and what he says this isnt one of them, this is his insert of a girl he didnt like to the point where he randomly ruins her development and forces in a replacement out of no where
You know what hurts the most? Gabriel died without knowing chat noir was his SON. THERE'S NO CHANCE OF ADRIEN TELLING HIM THAT HE'S CHAT NOIR ANYMORE. Adrien would find out about Gabriel being monarch but live in the guilt that he couldn't tell his father that he's chat noir is just sad
don't forget he will carry the guilt that cataclysmed his own dad
@@bezigbijtje4869 ikr
If Gabriel had won and nobody knew anything it would even been ok, but the fact that he was recognized as a hero with a statue in the place where the heroes's statue was is revolting, and that's not even mentioning his selfish request and how Marinete followed through with the lie...for Adrien to really be free and happy he needs to know AT LEAST that he is a sentimonster so he can protect his amok, this is something that only he should do.
I agrée
@@bella11110 if you watch it again you'll see that she has a way of knowing and she herself puts the twin rings on his finger while telling him not to be like his father.
@@bella11110Marinette found out Adrien was a senti
It’s the fact that Adrien thinks his father was a hero that annoys me
@@middleofeden3534 I know right...like...adrien has NEVER been naive about his dad being good. Adrien clearly knows his dad is in denial in his grief..that his dad is distant but also controlling due to the fear and hurt over the loss of the mom and adrien both understands that people don't react well when hurt so tris to be understanding...but also doesn't pretend his dad is in the right about how he acts.
like adrien already knew his dad was a piece of work..like his dad literally lied to adrien by omitting what a commercial was for because gabe knew if adrien knew that adrien wouldn't have wanted to do the ad and adrien was really upset but not that surprised about what his dad did.
adrien might be understanding about motives or why someone might do a bad thing or act out but he also doesn't excuse it or tolerate it when it starts getting people hurt.
Sometimes, fanfiction is more enjoyable than the original
Yes but easy to get lost in
Nope
My toxic opinion as an MLB fan is that I found the season 5 finale worse than the season 3 finale. I felt unsatisfied watching the finale because of how badly executed the ending of the Agreste arc was. Nobody in the fan base was happy with the finale and i’m losing hope. The only reason I’m watching season 6 is for Lila and Felix. Great analysis though and your rewrite of S5 is much better than the actual finale ❤❤❤
Honestly… I might have to agree with you. Season 3’s finale was just underwhelming and it felt soulless… it’s hard to explain. And whilst season 5’s finale is definitely entertaining and action packed… it was just heartbreakingly disappointing 😭 and thank you! I’m glad you enjoyed my rewrite🩷
@@TheCartoonHotspotanother point is the fact that S5 finale destroyed more character arcs than S3 finale. The fact that Astruc really thought the finale fits the 8-year build up is hilarious 😂
@@worldofmiraculous5338i agree
Honestly, I find season 4 and 5 finales both worse than season 3. Miracle Queen was honestly pretty underwhelming but that was it's main issue. Strike Back and Recreation both had massive plot problems that basically destroyed the show. Quite sad to say, Miraculous may never recover.
@@TheCartoonHotspot
8 years just to ruin and rush the Final…
A Bad ending is the Problem of many series but i‘ve Never seen one this unsatisfying as that. A pity. The series was really great and very emotional. The story, the characters, the villain, soundtrack, goosebumps moments almost everything was so good. Why do you have to ruin all of that with such a poorly written and conceived finale. Im sad
i truly believe the only way that this show can be redeemed is with an antihero/villain arc for adrichat. it will only work if he finds out that ladybug was keeping all of these secrets from him (monarch’s identity, him being a sentibeing) and comes to resent her. this also excuses their identities still being a secret. sadly, i don’t have hope that the writers will execute it well
I would LOVE to see that
I feel really bad for Adrien/Cat Noir right now. He really wanted to fight Monrach and reclaim the miraculous alongside Ladybug but thanks to his heartless father, he had to sit it out. I hope next season, Ladybug at least apologizes to CatNoir for missing out on the fight and tried to explain everything that happened.
I agree but why should ladybug apologize?
@@TheCartoonHotspot Well, she got in on all the action with fighting Monarch and learning his true identity but Catnoir was forced to sit the whole thing out. He hates being kept in the dark, and I know he’s kept in the dark about a few other things too. I know him being benched wasn’t her fault and all but still.
And I hope she faces consequences for her actions because what she did by making the whole world knows that Gabriel was hero put a bad taste in my mouth.
@@Dred0n I think Gabriel might’ve made her do that
@@giannaangulo7006 he did but she should've never did that abusers shouldn't be known as Heroes.
Well it took until the finale, but at the very damn least, the writers remembered that Nathaniel and Alix were best friends and they got to do spray paint art together
😂😂
Saying that the reverse love square was rushed is an understatement imo. Adrien falls for Marinette too quickly and Lb liking CN is portrayed as Marinette wanting to forget Adrien and not a genuine feeling (it's even in the episode synopis,lol). But then in kwami's choice Adrien totally forgets Marinette kissed CN the previous episode and Marinette forgets she was in love with CN one episode prior. If they wanted to pull this off, they should have started the set up in season 3 and go through with it in s4 and s5.
Also another thing that bothers me is that are we supposed to believe that throughout the whole summer CN never asked LB anything about what happened? Who was Monarch, how did she get the kwamis back etc, etc. In season 4 there was a whole story line focused on the fact that LB kept CN in the dark and then by the end of s5 he is not only left in complete darkness but also showered by lies as Adrien. There is absolute no effort by the writers to keep things that they establish consistent.
And looking at s6, I'm sorry but I don't like that everyone in the class has a miraculous. That's ridiculous to me. I'd be happy with just Alya and Nino as permanent holders (and Chloe before she was ruined). I just couldn't care less about all the other classmates.
Agree with everything you said. With marinette keeping the secret from Adrien… okay that makes a tiny bit of sense and can have some consequences but what’s her excuse for not telling CN?… HER *PARTNER*? I don’t want to be optimistic but I really doubt the writers thought this one through
I agree with all your points. And I really hate how they all have a miraculous permanently I don’t even like the idea of Alya keeping a miraculous. What was ladybug thinking letting npcs keep a miraculous. We’re just suppost to pretend that these characters were memorable. Most of them I don’t even remember that well. Imagine all of them fighting one villain and each one of them uses their powers it’s going to be one crazy firework show. I’ll bring the popcorn
Im totally here about the fact that it feels so wrong to permanently give all the classmates their miraculous. If the trend about neglecting Adrien/Chat continues into season 6 and all these heroes are just popping up as they please, it will invalidate Chat even more and potentially risk even Ladybug's importance to the plot. She can clean akumas and whatnot, but they can similarly be destroyed as well. As it is, the charms becoming shields are slowly pushing out the need for Ladybug and Chat Noir in very small ways and I can only see the hero classmates adding to that.
Chloe is wasted potential like everything else in this show.
I agree with everything except with the love square, it was actually interesting that it was reversed and had sense, after ladybug rejected CN so many times, he chooses to move on, but Marinette really loved CN, not to escape from Adrien, she just realized how much she needed him and how amazing he was, and then she lost her feelings for CN because he didn’t love ladybug, and CN with Marinette wouldn’t work out
For me miraculous is done. The biggest plot of the show ended without a conclusion and the main character (adrien) was missing from knowing the truth. The reveal is the last thing going for this show, and it wouldn't be as good since Gabriel isn't there. He was the reason they couldn't be together and he never knew his son was Chat Noir. Lila isn't a interesting villain to be hawkmoth and emilie coming back felt anti climatic, we don't know her. We needed more flashbacks of her to know her personality and how much she loved gabriel/adrien to feel why gabriel was desperate. So many things are wrong.
I agree with you but I don’t think it’s Emilie! As explained, I strongly believe it’s Amelie otherwise there wouldn’t have been a point of Gabriel choosing to die if Emilie was going to be in the new universe 🩷
It’s Amelie xx not Emilie
Not only Adrien but Argos wasn't at the finale either, they could have at least shown a scene of him protecting his mother and that would be why he couldn't go after Adrien and Kagami or go to Paris, Amelie is too important for him, he wouldn't leave her behind if she was vulnerable and with multiple villains popping up from all sides.
I agree! I actually did mention in the video that Felix was nowhere to be seen and someone suggested he could’ve tried to help free adrien and Kagami from the white room in London or maybe helped the resistance. Adrien not being present in the finale is upsetting but adrien AND Felix both missing from the action??? Unforgivable 😭
@@TheCartoonHotspot I didn't get to that part because I've been busy, but I expected you to cover basically everything as usual 😊
I feel like the writers also forgot that Adrian is the one who cataclysm his own dad! Like when he finds out about his dad being hawk moth he’s going to have to deal with the fact that he basically expedited his demise as well
If I rewrote the ending, I'd only make a few major changes. The episode would go as normal, with Gabriel and Marinette finding out each other's identities, her combining the miraculouses and the awesome fight scene. However, sometime during the fight, Ladybug would realise that she couldn't do it, she couldn't fight this battle without Cat Noir by her side. So, she sends Plagg back, who pep talks Adrien, and Cat Noir soon joins the scene. By this point, Ladybug and Gabe are in the thick of it, and Cat Noir is doing his best to help. Then, without thinking, Marinette uses Gabe's name, revealing his identity to a startled and confused Cat Noir. In shock, he cataclysms the floor, they all drop down but... Ladybug's trapped under a pile of rubble. She's not hurt, but she is unconscious. This is now Adrien's fight. He confronts his dad, does all the same stuff Marinette does, but instead of showing him the video, he simply just detransforms. Hawkmoth is in shock at the knowledge that his own son is his enemy and this is enough to convince him to do something similar to what he does in the original finale: immobilize Cat Noir, fetch both miraculouses and make his wish. Later, Cat Noir goes back home, leaving the ladybug miraculous behind so she can transform once she regains consciousness. And guess what? All this can happen without revealing either of their identities to each other while still giving Adrien the truth he deserves.
This version wouldve been SO much better 😭
THATS SO GOOD????? pls become a screenwriter or smth
@@idkwhattoputmyhandleas28 Thank you so much!!
@@Siamese_chef Thank youuu
Marinette would know Adriens identity though if he detransforms it sounds
Just abt as good as the regular finale.
Finale was terrible. For all the reasons you mentioned and many others, It was absolute trash.
Regarding the fact that this finale might not be the end to the first, It still doesn't change how bad it was. The Agreste Storyline has been going on for 5 seasons and yet the key points attached to this storyline weren't addressed. Even if they are being saved for later seasons, It still makes this finale terrible. How many more seasons will they need to conclude It? 10? 12? The continuous cycle of leaving everything to the following season that plagues the show is self-sabotage because It ignores the fact that the ending is a key part of any story. Constantly delaying that for the sake of making content is way more damaging than just making an ending people can look back to and feel satisfied. That's how timeless masterpieces are done.
This is so true!
To be honest, it would've been much better to have the finale focus on Adrian. Marinette can get the spotlight arc 1B's finale.
Lila has direct beef with Marinette (to the point where she gets one of the strongest magical weapons in the universe just to get back at a middle school girl who called her out in the washroom once)
EXACTLY
Thomas Astruc seems to be obsessed with Marinette to... a concerning degree. I know he's not the only writer here, but as the boss, what he says goes, so this all has his stamp of approval on it. Plus statements from him and the crew from the past... ick factor.
Wait what do you mean?? Maybe I’m missing something but she’s basically his kid, his creation. Ofc he’s obsessed
@@tsukitanuki101 ( small correction ) he has supported artists working on it drawing NSFW of her at age 14, he is OBSESSED with making her always right and he's the reason she's shoved into every plotline and why he pushed adrien out of the picture, and iirc he also implied she's also like. a self insert imaginary child of him and his ex, pretty much. bc. tom was based on himself & sabine was based on his ex .. so
@@billyjoecobras Oh I didn’t know all that 🤢🤢 like genuine nsfw?? Isn’t she literally a freshman in hs thats sick.
@@tsukitanuki101 I looked it up, I got it mixed up; while the rest is all true, he actually ended up just supporting art of a fellow artist who worked on miraculous before the show aired. Said artist posted straight up porn of them and Thomas saw no issue with it. My apologies on the mix up, I edited my comment from before to rectify it !! But uh. He is also responsible for the whole... Naked Marinette in New York comic too where she had nothing but a box to wear and made her racist against black people. So that's just about as bad 😭
... And yes. She is only 14.
@@billyjoecobras He tweeted about having a piece of fanart in his wallet before. It was a drawing of Mari in a swimsuit...
It’s such a shame because when I first watched the storyboard of the finale, I absolutely loved it. I was ready to give my praises and say that season 5 was the best season Miraculous has ever produced. But when I took the time to watch it with a more critical and open mind, as well as see some of the criticisms; I realised that most of the things happening in season 5 shouldn’t have to take place time 8 years and 5 seasons in. Conformation and Re-Creation cements the problem: Adrien Agreste AKA Chat Noir, the second main character never gets to play a major role/contribute to the overarching storyline when he’s the closest player in the grand scheme of the plot considering the fact he is the son of the main antagonist.
EXACTLY!
Instead of crying of happiness and being emotional that it is finally over, we were just disappointed. Instead of a finale that is supposed to evoke nostalgia a few years later, we have a finale that I never want to see again. If a film has a bad ending, it's not good, but it's not in the least as bad as if you worked on a series for 8 years and put so little love into the finale. SOO much was missing. Incredible. Next season can't and won't be able to show us the 1000 missing puzzles from the season 5 finale and I'm thinking about not even watching it.
Sadly, you see, that's why we shorten the name to miraculous ladybug
LMAOOOOO🤣
@TheCartoonHotspot she's the daughter of a baker and herself seems to be baked into everything
Not funny. 😡
I wanted Gabriel's identity to be exposed to the public, being hated by everyone, and going to jail so bad. 😭
Adrien gives kenergy, because just like Ken's only personality trait is being Barbies love interest, Adrien was also unfortunately made to be just Marinette’s love interest...
The issue with that is… ken was always established to be Barbie’s love interest so I don’t have a problem with that. With miraculous, the writers have FORGOTTEN the character establishment they set up for Adrien. They set him up as a deuteragonist then by season 3, he regressed so much as the sidekick. Season 1&2 Adrien is not the same as season 3-5 Adrien. Season 3-5 adrien is literally a shell of his former self and that’s the annoying part because the regression of his character is so sudden- it’s a jumpscare 😭 that’s why fans are upset. If the writers wanted adrien to give of Ken energy, they should’ve stuck with that from the very beginning and then have Hawkmoth not be directly related to Adrien. You can’t have both. The writers kinda wanna do everything but then not have the guts to fully go through with it
Thomas Astruc even flat-out said that Adrien was Ken on Twitter.
I get you cause like Adrian was REDUCED dramatically it felt like a jump scare to the audience 💔
@@JayRedGearwhat a shame...
Not only that, in the movie the point was that Ken developed to be more. It’s the opposite in Adrien’s case. Adrien regressed into a love interest.
Same. Finale was supremely disappointing . I liked Bugnoir and her fight scene with Monarch and the pool party and Adrinette kiss at the end. Everything else, especially plot-wise, fell so short for me.
I've read that some people have said, similar to what you mentioned, about season 5 finale is setting up for conflict between Marinette and Adrien in season 6, which might have potential but I feel like there have been so many times the fandom has expected something unresolved to come back up later to be dealt with and it never did. Or where things were just terribly inconsistent. I plan to watch season 6 because I'm invested in this story but I'm trying to keep my expectations low because I've been burned by expecting too much of this show in the past that it hasn't always been able to deliver.
Also, your versions of season 5 finale and subsequent outline for season 6 sound 1000 times better. 💖
Right! Like honestly the section of the video where I speculate what’s in store for the next arc… that was me just grasping to be optimistic. Every single time miraculous sets something up, a major plot point, it’s just never carried out to the best of its potential or it’s just randomly dropped and never spoken about again. I can only hope so many times so like you rightfully said, my expectations are low for season 6
I’m with you. The finale was stupid. But the adrienette kiss and pool party at the end were awesome however, mostly the kiss at the end.
Personally, as many other people have said, i was very disappointed by the s5 Finale. Cat Noir not being in it AT ALL made no sense to me. With him being out of the whole battle was very upsetting to me. I was also confused, as just a few episodes before Marrinette finds out that not only are Adrien and Felix sentis, but Gabriel is Monarch. Why she is confused in the finale? I hope that Adrien is not left in the dark, as 3 beings in his life Marrinette/ Ladybug, Tikki and Plagg ALL know his father was the villian. If Ladybug/Marrinette do not let him know, i sure hope taht Plagg does.
Plagg would definitely tell Adrien! He knows him best!
Exactly she already knew. Why was she confused?
plagg needs to tell Adrian. my boy cant stay in the dark forevs
@@richardogette7753The writing for this show is a joke.
@@FeligamiAdrizoeSworaBunnydollGood idea.
i found the finale entertaining so that makes it above s3 lmaooo, but i do agree with you, the finale was a let down. you mentioned felix and i hate how thomas gave an excuse of "he doesnt care about humans problems" which is so weird cause it contraadicts both felix's storyline/arc and himself since he has stated before that the feather adrien jokes makes him uncomfortable
Exactly! He said “it’s human business” but Felix IS a human so what does that even mean?😭
@@TheCartoonHotspot right just so unserious
The worst part was that THIS was all planned. It’s all in the show bible. We even have season 6. Thomas Astruc was never fired. It was planned for him to stay out of season 6. It is appalling. And I have absolutely no trust or hope for season 6 to be any better. It is just a spiral downward into subpar atrocity. And Lila is just gonna be the new Hawk Moth, under the name of Chrysalis. It was also planned that Adrien never knows that his dad was Hawk Moth. For shame.
I honestly disagree. I don’t think this was the original plan (Of course I’m only speculating) but if you look at season 2 and 3, some plotpoints hint to go a different direction. I think it’s when the show got extended for 3 more seasons (up until season 8) the writers had to scramble to think of something new to keep the show dragging even if it declines in quality. That’s my issue. As much as I love the show, I wish it would’ve just ended at season 5
You know how we always get our hopes up for hooks that the story sets up. Yea I want to see Adrien go villain when he realizes that ladybug lied to make Gabe a hero when he was hawkmoth and the culmination of all the lies and being sidelined finally bubble up. Here's my hope, lets see what happens in a few seasons.
Fair enough
AND ANOTHER PLOT HOLE: He told her not to let ADRIEN finad out about the villain he was. But there a discrepancy, Adrien is Cat Noir. He never said not to tell Cat Noir. So assuming Ladybug tells Cat Noir, because she doesn't know that he's Adrien, she'd be doing the thing she promised not to do.
However, Her telling Chat Noir might in fact be, The major consequence of the wish. Of course thats just a theory.
Petition to make Gee the new writer of Miraculous✍🏾✍🏾
OH I'D BE SO HAPPY I'D LITERALLY CRY I'D BE JUBILATED 😂😂😂😂
SIGNED
This was genuinely SO worth the watch. I agree with every single point you made, at the start of the season a lot of people thought it’d be amazing, and that the season would lead to something since we were finally getting adrienette development and the plot seemed like it’d be interesting. However, none of the episodes really made any sense and they were all so poorly written and none of the plot lines even had me feeling anything. I hate how the whole season was just literally marinette and ladybug and all of the other characters never even seemed to matter. The sentimonster plotlines and the Luka plotline and the random Adrien going to London plotline never needed to be there. I miss the old seasons of miraculous where other characters mattered other than just maribug. Don’t get me wrong I love her so much but it’s so tiring to see her overshadow all the other characters. Also your alternate ending was PERFECT and EXACTLY what I wanted from the finale. Adrien DESERVED to be there because it’s literally his father and I’d been waiting so long to see a real confrontation from them. (As in, their memories aren’t erased and the plot actually moves on) this whole finale and season was such a letdown. The only important part of the season to me was adrienette happening. But Yk if I had to wait longer for adrienette to see an actually good season plotline I’d wait years. I’m so disappointed from the show rn :(
The finale was the worst possible scenerio : Givving Redmeption to Gabriel Agreset , the man the whole season 5 was portraying him as an irredeemable figure that is too far gone. I am sorry for the writers.
Dont get me wrong . I am one of those people who think not every conclusion should be satisfying, as in real life it is not satisfaction all the time , but this is unsatisfaction in a wrong way. They get their every major arc that was building up from the start and ruined them. Adrien never undrestood his father was a villan. He never confronted his father for his actions. He didnt even say "no" to his father. Felix's motivations was nonsense at the end.
Gabriel getting the whish at the end is just baffling to me. I may dropp the show here beacuse lets face it: the writing was bad from the start. Now it is the conclusion and It is showing itself more than ever.
I agree with everything You said but when you mentioned Felix I couldn’t help but laugh 😭 they just didn’t know what to do with him at the end
@@TheCartoonHotspot Like Emotion is one of the greatest animated episodes I have ever seen. Everything was at its peak writing animation everything. They just decided to go the typical redemption- romance with Felix that at the end It just doesn't make any sense. So he actually revealed Gabe's identity just for the sake of being with Kagami? Why didn't he directly tell Marinette who is Monarch? Why did he kill a sentimonster in ep 24?
The questions are there and there are no answers. Felix was the greatest written character in the show but they just didn't include him in the finale for no reason
@@hiradsadeghi4406 argh YES! Emotion is easily the best episode of the entire SERIES. It just proves the show is CAPABLE of producing PEAK episodes but everything after episode 18 was just so mid. Felix went from being interesting to just being… bland
I agree like honestly the final fight is good but that's it. Everything else is disaster is bad enough Adrien not being there, it got worse like bunnix being there but only for transportation for Luka and his team to arrive which I don't get how Luka being guardian make sense, Felix not showing up, Gabriel being hero like WHAT, Ladybug not telling the true to Adrien, but there is a chance Ladybug may tell Cat Noir the next season. I got so annoy, Adrien could have break out and save Kagami, and maybe meet up with Felix who also trying to save her. Then together they go to Ladybug and fight together against Monarch and his army.
Just a mess🤕😭
I remember seeing the spoilers months back. It would a been more epic if both LB and chat fought him together. But given when Bunnyx went back in time to the future LB and chat are still partners adriens probably gonna find out eventually about his dad 😬
I hope he goes on full Batman mode under LB' s nose and finds out about everything all by himself.
I hope he does honestly 😭
you made a lot of great points, especially the one about how making Marinette central to every conflict brings everything down. I've never held a TON of stock in the quality of writing for miraculous, but excluding Adrien from his own story arc by both not having him confront his dad while alive, or find out the truth after his passing was utterly bizarre and disappointing. And yet i enjoyed the finale somehow. this show /loves/ to stall. i think it has cemented its success on endlessly stalling tbh haha
What's even worse is that in episode 27, "Action," the plot isn't the epilogue of how the world ended during that finale. It's just an irrelevant climate change episode! 😢
Exactly like who asked for that😭😭
@@TheCartoonHotspot I know this is supposed to be a special, but it literally says in the MLB wiki that Monarch is supposed to be involved. Girl, the bastard is dead, you don't need super villains or akumas to have an interesting or insightful plot about climate change.
@@randomscb-40charger78😂😂😂😂😂😂
Ikr! The plastic is fantastic gimmick killed me.
I would've liked to see Felix try to help Kagami and Adrien escape and help them back to Paris with a sent-being and tell Adrien the truth, making him feel worse. Then they get to the mansion and destroy the machine channeling the kwamis' power, only for it to be too late. Gabriel makes the wish, and we get the ending, but it is slightly different. Or Adrien does escape on his reach to his house to confront his father and meets Ladybug in the way where two things could happen: Adrien learns the truth about his father the way Ladybug did but gives his miraculous to Ladybug we get a reveal from this, and Ladybug becomes Bug Noir, and the fight happens the way it did, and Adrien realizing he should be fighting with Ladybug goes down there and tries the same approach as Marinette with his father because, in the end, they're still family, but Gabe betrayed them and makes the wish and different ending with them in the pool party and all that. The second one is Adrien participating in the fight with Ladybug but having difficulty fighting because Monarch is his father. The guilt he has over cataclyming him and again tries to reach his father but doesn't work and the wish is made with a different ending.
Personality I did like season 5 Finally because, as I mentioned before, I would've liked to see Adrien in the final, but I understand why because of his new fear of having no control over his cataclysm and this new nightmare won't help him in the end (I would like to point out that I don't think that Marinette is mentally stronger than Adrien or anything like that) because he might not trust himself but that could be a discussion for another time. The fighting was fantastic, and the fact that Gabe was coughing up black dust, which was himself, was disturbing and disgusting. Also, the aftermath of the wish reminded me of The Truman Show, Coraline, and Midsommar, with how everything is so perfect. Yet, I know something isn't right because even with the kiss between Adrien and Marinette, some creepy music is playing in the background if you listen closely. It leaves me on the edge of my seat to know what the sacrifice is or what the wish is. As for what Marinette did for Gabriel, it was in character, and she didn't do it for Gabriel. She did it for Adrien as she knows that Gabriel is dying, Nathalie died, and his mother is dead. She wanted Adrien to at least have some closure with his dad like Adrien always wanted or something like that so that Gabriel can finally be and act like a father, only for Gabriel to take advantage of that because rather than be the father and let go of the miraculous like Emilie wanted but he took the coward way out because I questioned if Gabriel used the wish to rewrite some people's memories about him being Monarch for him to look like a hero who sacrificed himself to save Paris and help the heroes. Man, there was a lot to unpack. Also, for me, I think what happened to "Lila" in the end was something having to do with the wish, such as rewriting the universe to make it seem she was Monarch the whole time and also passing on Nathalie's illness towards her because while I can see Gabriel sacrificing himself to be with Emile in the afterlife by giving his life up, we still don't know what he offered for Nathalie and to make himself the hero. Season 6 will be insane if our questions are answered and we learn more of the truth.
I'm excited to see what you have planned in the future and your analysis for the movie, and I have something I would love to see you cover: Gabriel's and Emilie's love story. Did they love each other or the image and perception of each other?
Also, if you guys want a fix it fanfiction and what happens afterwards I recommend these ones: archiveofourown.org/works/49283356/chapters/124359607 archiveofourown.org/works/48295141/chapters/121799488 archiveofourown.org/works/48138142/chapters/121389691 archiveofourown.org/works/48812089
Great points and I prefer option 2 from your ideas🤭🩷 I’d have to disagree with your point on marinette trusting gabriel for adrien. Because in Revelation she literally told Adrien that seeing the best in people is fine but not to the extent of them taking advantage of you and yet she did the same thing by trusting Gabriel. Either way, regardless of her pure intentions, it’s not really her decision to make. I honestly think adrien would’ve wanted gabriel to face repercussions and not roam Scott’s free for his crime. Like I can genuinely see adrien urging his father to own up to his mistakes even if that means Gabriel going to jail
@@TheCartoonHotspot true but I do wonder if Marinette still wanted that for Adrien I do agree with what she said in Revelation and what you said I so think its because he's dying soon and might as well give it a chance even if it backfired bad for her (still blame Ms. Bustier for her forgiving nature lol 😂😋)
@@TheCartoonHotspotI agree, but I also think Marinette probably just took the chance for the sake of her BF.
Maybe her thought process was like "Maybe I can try to risk it and reach some sort of agreement with this guy or else Adrian will become an orphan."
It would've way better if the show tried to put in that way. Literally just have Adrian vent about how he is worried about Natalie health.
26:13 THIS. It really annoyed me how Mari and Luka had a whole episode regarding the aftermath of their breakup, but Adrien and Kagami couldn't even get a MOMENT on scene where they go into depth about their's. I agree, Protection would have been the ideal episode.
U ate and left no crumbs with that rewrite of the finale, why lie? It WAS amazing!
Thank you bff🩷🩷
I had given up all hope by season 3 for MLB, and only forced myself to watch everything after knowing some spoilers, and yet somehow I ended up being even more disappointed than I already was, which is quite an accomplishment. Everything about the way that Adrien's character was handled irritates me so much. Whyyyy does Felix exist when you could've given his entire character arc to Adrien? I love Adrien, but he would've been so much more interesting if he was the one investigating on his own and discovered that he was a sentibeing. I so desperately wanted to see an exploration of him coming to terms with that information!
I am so tired and bored of him just being sadboyTM and having absolutely no agency in his life whether he's Adrien or Chat. The entire point of his Chat persona is that he has all this freedom that he doesn't have in his day to day life, and they do absolutely NOTHING with it. Maybe they didn't want to overshadow Mari since her only defining feature is her feelings for Adrien, even though they absolutely could've spent more time letting her grieve over the loss of the other miraculous and the immense pressure that she has on her shoulders. Hell, what happened to the whole "I can't love anybody because it's too dangerous" thing that she literally broke up with Luka over? It's just not a concern with Adrien because he's so perfectly perfect that he'd never be akumatized, I guess. Ok, sure. I love romance, I ate up all the shenanigans at the start of season 5 and was genuinely optimistic for a few episodes, but it gets to a point where it's just sickening how obsessed the show is with the will they won't they formula that the characters aren't allowed to exist without romance being the only thing that they care about.
How could Adrien mope about ladybug/marinette 24/7 if he knew about his origins and suspected that his father was hawkmoth? Can't have the tension that could've existed if the father/son suspected each other and had to come up with increasingly elaborate ways to avoid each other's suspicion, of course not. We just NEED another episode of Marinette floundering like a fish out of water around Adrien because there wasn't enough of that in the first 4 seasons. If they didn't want Adrien to steal the limelight from the main character, they should've just given HER the interesting backstory instead. Hell, they could've just had Gabe be a whole lot more antagonist towards Mari throughout the entire series and not just at the very end so I would care about their conflict at all, like idk she could've been his apprentice (which is where I thought the whole hat thing would eventually lead towards??) and have THEM be the ones suspecting each other, YOU HAD SO MUCH TO WORK WITH.
I just know that they're going to do the whole "you lied to me" thing to justify him and Mari breaking up at the end of season 6 for the ~drama~ of it all, and I feel sick to my stomach just thinking about it. It's such a lazy way to create drama. Idk, there was already so much potential for the series just based on the premise alone and they chose to do the most played out, tired tropes imaginable to make the show a slog to get through. Making it a slowburn romance that slowly develops over the seasons is fine, I don't mind being drip fed shipping material and waiting for them to end up together, but if you're going to make me wait 5 seasons for them to get together, and then I can't even enjoy it because I know that they're going to break up, WHAT WAS THE POINT. I refuse to watch anything more until the entire season is out and I know spoilers. If they kept him out of HIS character arc just for future romance drama, then this is definitely it for me. I'm done.
The way we’re the same 😭 I planned to stop wayching around season 3 too because I was just so fed up. For me, season 3 where you really start to see Adrien’s character regress and then s4 kinda redeemed itself so I had hopes for season 5. I ended up being immensely disappointed. Basically to summarise your point: the writers have a lot of time in the show to execute some storylines or character arcs, and they end up WASTING it.
I actually like felix as a character/ foil to adrien but I didn’t see the point of him existing if adrien wasn’t even going to find out the truth. And you’re right about Adrien and marinette having a lot of character outside of their romance with each other but they’re never allowed to explore that which is so frustrating. I think marinette had it worst around season 1 and 2 but adrien has it worst from s3-5. Big yikes. I’m just so frustrated.
I’m curious; will you be watching season 6? Completely understandable if you’re not LMAO
@@TheCartoonHotspot I watched seasons 3-5 in the last few weeks knowing full well that I was going to be upset the entire time, so chances are I will watch season 6, but if there's an annoying breakup arc I make no promises. And I do like Felix, his motives are so much more interesting than 90% of the cast and I can't believe that he had more impact on the plot in the 4-ish episodes he showed up in than Adrien ever did in 4 seasons, I'm just confused what his purpose is supposed to be besides being a convenient way to exposition dump Adrien's backstory on Mari, once again taking agency away from Adrien who deserved to know first and share that information when he was ready ("I'm doing this for Adrien" says Felix, who never once tells Adrien that he should take the rings from his father?? So you can tell Kagami the truth but not your so-called favorite cousin? Where do I begin) I'm never forgiving the writing team for that decision!!
I don't understand how they've wasted so much time for nothing to happen, like I know that it's an episodic show but to have a whole season where almost half of the episodes add nothing??? I can't help but laugh at how abrupt the breakups were with Luka and Kagami, after teasing those relationships for what, two seasons? And then they break up in one episode? Girl, I didn't even know Luka and Marinette were dating until they broke up lmaoo Do you want drama or not?? Pick a lane! Also I'm in complete agreement about how Gabe should've been resentful towards Adrien (it would explain why he insisted on being so awful to him, like I know you miss your wife bro but who treats a kid that they love like THAT) and I can't believe that they didn't play that up more (reason number 451 why they should've just GIVEN FELIX'S BACKSTORY TO ADRIEN INSTEAD)
Haven’t watched the analysis vid yet
As a whole the finale just gets worse and worse the more I look at it
Everyone has already criticized Adrien’s role in the finale but can we plz talk about Kagami because her “arc” makes me want to cry 😭
She has had so much build up within the past few seasons and while I wasn’t so fond with the whole Feligami story line or her knowledge of Ladybug’s identity, admittedly it was a bigger toll on Felix’s character than hers
What hurts even more is that the way they built up her character in season 5 to fight against her mother, then in the finale and we see precisely ONE a SCENE of her getting locked in a cell. The end. We don’t even know why she’s a senti in the first place or her relationship with the Agreste family. Similar to Adrien she also ends up not getting full closure on her mother but what makes it even worse is that Tomoe gets away with precisely zero consequences and doesn’t even get called out for what she did at all. Also side note but can we also talk about how Representation had next to no correlation with the finale? The episode could’ve been deleted and everything would’ve made sense, even anti-chat which was reused again as a plot device so that Adrien had an excuse not be in the finale
Initially I thought I would be wanting to stick with this show till the end, but watching the Miraculous movie made me realize that no, I cannot continue with this series anymore. On top of all the other issues with the show, this ended up being the breaking point. It’s so sad to leave this show but I think I have to. Do think I will be checking out whatever MCU (miraculous cinematic universe) Jeremy has planned, but that’s about all. Goodbye miraculous you shall be missed
The Finale was complete and utter bull. There's NO WAY they're just going to keep all that effed up stuff from Adrien. It's just not realistic, it's eventually going to dawn on him.
And you're right, your rewrite would have worked perfectly. Sure they'd still have been defeated, but at least their defeat would have had at least SOME dignity.
Also, as much as I love BugNoire. I think they should have waited to give us that for when Marinette confronts Lila in season 6 (if she does) then at least it would make sense why she'd be alone. Because that's HER antagonist like you said.
I feel like they really just need to re-write the entire season except for episode 1 (the only good episode in the season) everything else needs to be written properly.
Especially the whole Senti-Being Subplot. If they really want to make that work, they need to sit and think "How will this affect the show?" Because now the only thing that the viewer thinks of when they see Adrien is not gonna be Chat Noir, they're just thinking, Sentimonster.
It would make more sense if Adrien was conceived naturally and Felix was a Senti since the writers seemed to go with the story that Felix was created out of jealousy.
Everything addressed in the show could have been executed better. But we can't worry about the things we can't change so I'll just hope that they take this very long hiatus to make season 6 exceed our expectations. Because if I'm being totally honest, I'm not expecting much out of it.
About the part with adrian being a skill fighter, why does he get beaten so easily, even by marinette
Like I explained in the video: the writers forget their own character establishments.
Honestly, the twist with "Adrian is not human, but a sentimonster" really pissed me off the most. It comes from nowhere, breaks any shred of remained logic, it is absolutely redundant and useless for the story, it exists either as a lick to fan-theories or as an excuse to his father's cruelty toward him like "Oh, well, this boy is not a human, just a thing with human face, so it is okay to abuse him, it's not a human kid, and Gabriel is not a bad person, since he loves his human wife way more than some her male senti-replica", i.e. to excuse the shades of a child abuse and to erase Adrien's arc to confront his father and defeat him. Plus, if he is a sentimonster (i.e. the thing, magically created out of emotions), why the hell it looks and acts like a normal human?! Why he can be a superhero and use other talismans?! How he can have own personality, emotions, desires, typical human weaknesses (sickness and allergy, for example), blood, organs and probably DNA identical to his "parents", so nobody notices everything etc?! Plus, why people are so sure that Adrien and Kagami are sentimonsters? I mean, only Felix was confirmed to be a senti, not Adrien and Kagami (I remember the peacock tale on the walls, but, again, Felix can't be so sure about Adrien, he didn't participate in this). The idea with a woman who can magically conceive a sentimonster child is so meaningless and f*cked up. Not to mention in this case that Gabe is NOT Adrien's father, while Emilie is his creator, NOT mother. The same thing with Felix - Colt is his creator, NOT father, while Colt's wife is NOT Felix's mom.
Long ago, in 2018, I already said that the final defeat over Gabriel will suck, and that happened finally. This series shouldn't exist. They ruined Chloe, they ruined Adrien and Marinette, they ruined Gabriel's potentially tragic arc with falling into madness and half-redemption in order to save son, choosing his life over the dead wife, they f*cked up everything.
You are starting out with the false premise "He's not a human, but a Sentimonster." These things are not mutually exclusive. He's both. If you create a Sentimonster that you want to be a normal human, than it *is* a normal human, with the only differences to other humans being that he was conceived unconventionally, you are able to control him if you have his Amok, and you are able to kill him with a snap of fingers if you have the Peacock Miraculous.
Also, Adrien *was* confirmed to be a Sentimonster. In "Representation," there were peacock feathers in the background of pregnant Emelie. Kagami is also likely to be one, because of hints in earlier episodes.
@@dennis_kunThat's even worst in my mind
Man, after hearing your re-write and other CZcamsrs re-writes, I keep feeling more and more underwhelmed and disappointed with the actual ending :( it could have been so good.
Amazing video and points. I totally agree with what you say about Adrien, Marinette, and the entire story. Adrien is (was?) the glue that held the entire story together. Due to him being born Emile used the peacock miraculous, resulting in her falling into a coma, and Gabriel starting his career as a supervillain, starting the story. Gabriel has always felt like Adrien's villain even though he always swore revenge against Ladybug, Monarch has felt like Adrien's antagonist, because Adrien holds the story together. Marinette is the tape. Tape works better for holding some things (Other storylines) together, but in others glue is better (Adrien). When they took out Adrien everything started collapsing so the writers tried to fix it by putting tape over it. It just felt wrong. At this point the writers are just committing story assassination.
Wait…because… this is such an amazing analogy omg 😳 you’re absolutely correct! They’re not just committing story assassination… they quite literally assassinated Adrien’s character too😭
I've heard a theory that the series went through a retooling in season 4, and part of that was demoting Adrien from deuteragonist to love interest. If that's true, I wish the writers had commited and remove Chat Noir entirely. The way they're removing him from important plots doesn't feel natural..... but taking away a chance at freedom from an abused child could look worse I guess.
sis you better than me cause i couldn't even FINISH this season. ngl i have no idea how season 6 is going go for the series......
Just you describing how you'd rewrite the finale almost made me cry. It's so simple and obvious and yet so good and satisfying after 8 years of waiting. I'm devastated with the decisions they made this season. I'm actually writing my own rewrite because I got tired of being upset at the direction of the show. I'm gonna keep watching bc I love the characters so much, but unfortunately, my expectations are low. I'm sure there will be really great scenes and cute moments, but I have no clue how they're gonna continue at this point
I don't care for Lila being the main antagonist in the following season. She's such a nothing character. Absent for 90% of the show and we're suddenly given this reveal that she's living multiple lives? Why should we care about any of that? We're given nothing about her character. Why she's doing this? How she's getting resources? Had she been introduced more recently (either last season or this one), then I could forgive it. But she was introduced in the first season and basically had no presence. What's worse is that she tells blatant lies and only gets away with them because the characters have to hold the idiot stick.
If Adrien obtains the butterfly miraculous and the Kwagatama, he could confront his father about being Hawk Moth. Undoubtfully, it'll be hard to put into the plot without memory erasing since Lila is the new holder of the Moth Miraculous and she'll probably stay as the new main antagonist for a couple seasons but there are some ways of how it could be done. For example, an akumatized villain steals and uses the Rabbit Miraculous from young Bunnyx and our main 2 heroes along with older Bunnyx are the only ones chasing the villain. Then Ladybug and Bunnyx get neutralized/stunned and Chat Noir takes the Time Miraculous in order to continue the chase but the villain decides to hide/to pursue their own goal. Since Chat has no idea where to find the villain or when was the moment they got akumatized, and understanding how fragile time is he decides to get the Butterfly Miraculous in order to retrieve the Akuma but gets Kwatagama and decides to talk with Hawk Moth for whatever reason and figures out all of the truth about his father being the previous holder of the said miraculous.
Or we could have some sort of Chat Blanc episode, but where Adrien is the one who gets sent into the future in order to resolve something or to fight some powerful akumatized, Ladybug for example. He tries to fight her, but doesn't succeed at first so he decides to escape in order to try and find another solution or come up with a plan. That's when he finds the butterfly miraculous. Of course he doesn't find out that Lila is its owner (like if she lost it for whatever reason). Chat Noir talks with Nooroo who obviously can't reveal the identity of his owner so the kwami gives Chat the Kwagatama. Then Adrien finds the place for the reunion and uses the Kwagatama. Chat Noir contacts Hawk Moth and that's when the revelation happens. In that scenario Adrien confronts his father both as himself and as Chat Noir. He askes Gabriel why and for what he's done all of it and gets the answers. After doing that Adrien decides to unify two miraculouses that he has and retrieves the akuma from Ladybug. Then he gets sent back into his time. Now that he has all the truth, Chat Noir wouldn't be so eager to confront Ladybug for a couple of reasons:
1. He could get too emotional and accidentally reveal his secret identity to her;
2. By doing that he could've put too much pressure onto her which could lead to her getting akumatized.
Overall I think in season 6 Adrien will 100% find out the truth about his father being Hawk Moth whether he'll figure it out himself, be told about that by Marinette, or get told that truth (probably only partually and distorted) by Lila along with getting used and manipulated by her. What i found unlikely to happen in the nearest future is Adrien finding out the truth about being a Sentimonster; I feel like that topic can be extended for a good amount of episodes but right now we have more important topics to get uncovered.
I know that the logic in my scenarios suck but i mean is Miraculous Ladybug too logical anyway? And at the time I'm writing this comment it's almost 6 a.m. and I still haven't slept so this text probably isn't all that comfortably readible but oh well.
16:12. Adrien isn't a character nor is he an equal. He is a MacGuffin. "An object or device that serves merely as a trigger for the plot but is insignificant in itself"
Ugh.
You know it’s bad when a one off movie does it better.
I was really sad that Adrien was not present in the final 😭
I mean he has to be present!
Its his Dad !
They could have handle that better 😒😔
i feel like Catnoir lost his shine in s4 since ladybug/marinette kept on getting other holders and at some point stopped relying on him.
GIRL... your version of a finale hit HARD
I pretty much gave up on this show with the episodes truth and lies (i think?). Taking all the time to get Marinette and Luka together and Adrian and Kagami just to have them to break up literally in the following episodes just screamed poor writing. It would've been so much more satisfying to see their relationships devolve and burn out over the course of a season instead of immediately ripping the plug to go to ground zero.
I agree
I think its really weird she trusted him...because you say she is overly trusting...but honestly....she ISN'T actually that trusting from what I've seen....like...she WILL forgive some people...but usually its due to having a bias(like her forgiving or giving chloe a chance at irst more to do with her crush on adrien than ACTUALLY trusting chloe)(or how she didnt actually try to give lila a shot until lila lied her out of school but then admitted to lying and got mar back into school where then mari thought they were square and actually meant her olive branch this time). a aspect of her is she tends to judge people quickly and has a hard time seeing from other people's points of view and forgets to consider other people have stuff going on.
I mean it could work because mari had been learning to see people are complex and have different sides of them and might not know how to get what they want across in a healthy way which she had learned for a bit with chloe, then kagami and sort of felix(i honestly don't really count him)..and how that understanding nature was something she admired in adrien/chat noir which they could have used to at least have a proper connection of adrien's influence on his dad and marinette if they really insisted on leaving him out.
but honestly girl tends to hold grudges alot of the time when it gets personal.
honestly if they had leaned into how gabe actually was pretty similar to marinette (they had ALOT of parallels) it could have worked...but everytime gabe showed some nuance they always undercut it with him doing something evil or something that made us dosbelieve any sincerity in his emotions even though objectively he has a very sympathetic understandable reason for being a villian.
heck they hd even had a clear point that using miraculouses for personal feelings or when your feelings are out of wack can have consequences....the nman has been amplifying his OWN negative feelings to feel other peoples negative feelings this whole time. which can NOT be healthy...not to mention he was never chosen for this. just point out his mind was getting warped more due to excessive use of the miraculous in a way it wasnt intended...heck it could even explain why gabe was hyper fixated and struggled to see other routes to save his wife when they opened up..just like how akuma victims might SEEM in control of themselves but in reality can't think clearly or logically and will do stuff that don actually make sense to fix their problem. just like how gabe had a clear goal of saving his wife but at other timesdid stuff that made not sense like what happened in newyyork and almost causing a nucucler war or what happened in hong kong. or how he missed how to fix the issue using time travel.
but NOPE that wasn't brought up with him even though it would explain why he was getting worse and worse and more hyper fixated. not to mention with him using all those side miraculouses...he might have found a loop hole but that didnt seem healthy.
and its even weirder considering the plan made sense from a logic standpoint. pretend to be a villian. akumatize someone to get attention so the ladybug and cat miraculous wiuld be activated so he could actually find them. steal them...then je could fix his akuma using the miraculous...then use the wish to fix his wife who could return using the 'gone missing' story. people woulnt blame the victim becaus hawkmoth made it clear he was in control. the victim wouldnt rememmber what they did which could minimize trauma. and he would fix the damage using the ladybug before using the wish to save her...and if he loses ladybug would still fix all the damage...he had a illusion that no one was really getting hurt and he knew he didnt actually mean to put people in danger..and his humerious was pride and surity that he was in control..not realize that people WERE getting hurt. from his point of view the plan minimizes damage. andit could exlain why he would spiral to being more exstreme since it didn't seem like people were getting hurt since he was watching from afar...its easy to justify it.
and more the guardians werent around so he had no one else to go to for help. and by the time they were a thing again he would think why would they trust him or helo him after what he's been doing. even him being exstra mean at firstmade sense because he was trying to cause akumas that he could use. the thing that confused me about his reaction to marinette is season 5 was him being that determinded to break them up...like we see he actually oes seem fond on mari in the other seasons...from her talent. he agreed not to tell adrien that she took and book ad said it was brave to come forward. it felt like ppreviously him trying to break them up had the logic of trying to get her upset enough to become a akuma and then he could just give in after and the situation would be fixed...but it was weird he was that intense about breaking them up to this degree this season.
He and marinette honestly have so many parallels that would have been more forfront if they didnt insist on making him more and more of a abusive asshole. and why should I sympathize with him over chloe who he ACTIVELY sabotaged. he targetted her parents, isolated her on a rooftop and cut her ability to signal to ladybug...then methodically played on her insecurities and then brought out pollen to imply ladybug couldnt keep pollen safe and told her to her face he targeted her parents becuase of her. where chloe then spiraled from there into focusing on what she knows how to do(being bad) to cope with her guilt just like both mari and adrien regressed into their crushes as something safe and familiar to cope woth their problems and loss after master fu and excusing problems they each faced. WHY is this show expecting me to sympathize with Gabrieal who sabotaged chloe's babysteps to being a better person when they actively chose to write him worse this whole time?!
if they at least strengthed the parallels the I could se why Mari might have had a influence over gabe and why that was a focus here instead of where in honestly should have been(adrien)...but honestly we saw mari be blunt about not excusing people before..especially woth gabriel and she didn't hold back the other times with gabe in battle. so the HELL?!
what are they aiming for in the long run now is the question....I honestly DO like myself a evil lila especially since it feels like mari had been accidentally making lila stronger at times and picked the beef with her at first(lila is entirely responsible later but I could see why lila was annoyed at someone she just met trying to out herand judge her when mari didnt know anything about her...was mari right that lila was a liar and not good yes...but I could understand some of the beef there especially when tied to mari's mistep with her jealousy. and unlike lila mari is actually talented with connections. and it could play on how mari tends to leave adrien and chat out of info alot of the time...but I honestly CAN'T see how delaying the reveal or even delaying adrien knowing would be more climatic then just having it adressed properly here with adrien facing his dad.
like would it touch on how her feelings for him can seem a bit sus when it didnt really feel like she fell for chat noir?
will her habit of running away from stress kick in due to hiding the truth from adrien?
I mean even as is I couldnt see adrien actively siding with his dad when they had wrotten gabe to not be compelling at all and just a jerk most of the time!
heck just have mari do the wish since she aparently can handle all those miraculouses before or if she wants to make sure to minimiize backlash!
I'm even more confused because why not have it where she stopps him from doing the wish but then gets him help from the guardians...pointing to how this was a cry for help from gabe for his wife this whole time that he hadnled in the worst way and that if he calmed down and asked for help it could have been solved better? which could thematically point to how akumas were people who were upset and who lashed out in illogical ways trying to get people to notice there hurt..but what they were doing wouldn;t actually solve the problem and make them feel better...but once they get calmed down theycan get actual help or other people to help since the issue is known.
like does adrien lose his dad? don't people deserve to know hawkmoth is gone? will adrien want revenge on hawkmoth due to his dad? is his mom back.
will adrien being a sentimonster even matter in the future?
like it feels like they are trying there best to reach the future that matches howthe future alix says ladybug and chat are 'wiggly wavery arms' complicated.
and why the hell did they think I would want a redeemed andre? or that i would think him abandining chloe who he gave no real guidance to the mom who is definitly abusive would make him at all redeemed!
and even they trying to imply adrien has a temper felt odd when as the black catt he is literally the one for the role where he can actually think things out pretty logically alot of the timeand him empathey is one of his main character traits! like if they wer going for him learning to be firm and not letting understanding potentially seem like excusing then have adrien face his dad!
and why do they act like adrien cant go against his dad at all!adriens go to move is running away and sneaking out when he feeks his dad is being unreasonable and learning to be firmer as chat noir!
its just so many weird choices!
Oh my god I usually hate fan re-writes but you’re honestly an artist with it. Like this is the best ending I’ve ever heard. I agree with everything you said.
Thank you so much 🩵🩵
The writers deserve a salary cut for this finale 😡
@@aseadshahi3785LMAO
I love miraculous, but i’ll forever be frustrated with the writing. While not mind breaking, miraculous is still a good show with a interesting concept. The problem is that they drop the ball in the writing department. I think my main problem with the show is the fact that we have 5 seasons now and it feels like we’ve barely progressed at all. It feels repetitive with the same rinse and repeat format, and only now in season 5, we actually get somewhere. The show has been declining since season 2 honestly and it’s really disappointing. One thing i wish we could’ve seen was more experimenting. For example, they finally leaned into the idea of MariChat in season 4. But by the time they actually do something with that idea; they pull back and end it as quickly as they started it. Not to mention they make Adrien and Marinette start dating. It’s kind of the same thing with Luka and Kagami. They ended things as quickly as they started it. It’s like they’re too scared to move away from the “status quo”, and honestly i think peak Miraculous is when Ladybug and Chat Noir are even. Like during season 1 and 2.
It’s really unfortunate to see how they’ve fumbled the bag with miraculous and i can only hope that the writing gets better in later seasons. But we’ve already wasted 5 seasons doing practically nothing with the plot. Almost any development gets regressed back to nothing. A real push and pull game, which is frankly exhausting.
Demoted to the "princess at the tower" role, just like Kagami- San. And to put more salt on the injury they even had Mari waking him from "eternal slumber" on that weird scene. When you think about EMASCULATED it automatically reminds you of Adrien Agreste!
"Emasculated" is the wrong word to use because being active or having power in the story should not be considered inherently masculine. S5 was bad because instead of having a partnership, only one person (this time the girl) was active.
@@sannh like they say, get woke...
the "emasculation" is the least of my worries, he's always been presented as more feminine when he's adrien, my problem is that he wasn't able to do ANYTHING in this finale, not even realize his father was hawkmoth, hes basically the damsel in distress but not even done properly.
@@ranchustars3050 at least he could vent a bit on representation, if only he could have cataclysmed his father in the face then! let's only hope that his reconstruction begins on S6
it's so weird that felix had so much conviction of what he told to marinette he didnt even try to help her on the raid to the agreste manor. but no, they had to go woke and overpower ladybug to sock gabriel around for half an hour and still lose the fight! this "no men allowed" policy in modern entertainment should irk anyone!
There is honestly nothing I enjoyed about the finale.
1) Adrien's character. Since season 4 he has been placed on the backburner. I can handle a couple entirely Marinette focused episodes since she is really the main, main character. However, we started the series with both Marinette and Adrien playing a significant role in the plot. Both their characters were introduced as a sort of parallel with them both been given the miraculous' and fighting crime together. One being creation, and the other distruction. Why did the writers reduce Adrien as Chat noir to a minor character? The idea of him being a sentimonster was actually pretty interesting to me. So tell me why in the finale Adrien didn't finally find out his history and origins, along with the fact that his father was Hawkmoth????? Both ladybug and chat noir has been fighting this villain for so long and he wasn't included in the FINAL FIGHT and his own FATHER? We get absolutely no confrontation between them? After his father controlled him and treated him like crap the whole time? I am astonished. Not to mention Gabriel being made a hero lol
2) Adrien and Marinette's relationship. Oh boy where do I start. We had seasons of Marinette pining for Adrien and Adrien pining for Ladybug. Then the writer gave us a sad attempt of a reverse of the love square. I never thought it could be done so badly. Marinette is written to now have feeling for chat noir, and chat noir for marinette. Hardly any development in that department but whatever. THEN, in ONE EPISODE it is switched to Marinette and Adrien being loved with each other. No development, just random for no reason. Ladynoir gets absolutely decimated and whatever dynamics they had gets ruined. It was done so terribly.
3) The kwamis and alliance rings. The whole season I waited for the heroes to come closer and closer to finding out who is haskmoth and counteract his strategies. How was there no realization that the alliance rings were at play? They also made absolutely no progress in getting back any if the miraculouses and the fights were useless. What happened to the original point if the show
Thomas Astruc should be embarrassed of what he’s done!
Thomas astruc's personality type is the same as Gabriel Agreste. He is a very unhealthy intj.
Thomas asstruc is disgusting. I'm hoping he permanently disappears.
You should became the director and main writter.
The miraculous movie at least had a good ending in my opinion if you compare it to this season's ending.
My analysis on the movie will be uploaded soon!❤️
"Exactly that. You proved capable of moving on with your life, something I couldn't bring myself to do. You've already done it once, so what more is one more time?" This actually made tears form in my eyes. Imagine if we saw that actually happen. Well at least it happened in the movie, THANK YOU JEREMY!!!
And it was absolutely and utterly ridiculous for them to bring in lady dragon and that robot-whose-name-I-forgot in the show no reason.
I have way more problems with the show but I'm sure the other comments will cover them.
Honestly, a whole book can be written about the problems in the show.
Ladybug and Cat Noir are branded like they're "two halves of a whole" yet the show makes Cat a side-piece, especially nearing the final episodes during which we see much more of Adrien while Monarch is being turned into a chalk outline.
It's underwhelming considering he is also Cat's archnemesis.
This finale was definitely a lot
for the most part it didn't live up to the expectations and it certainly was not better than strike back or heroes day, but it was a solid setup for season 6 in my book.
there is some stuff i appreciate about this finale.
bug noir's outfit is really stunning, the battle was really cool, Nathalie's redemption, awesome, the adrinette kiss was beautiful & lila ready to shine as a villain.
the way you described how you would have the finale written was phenomenal. how there would be a reveal, Adrien learning the truth and the growth of his character, that's all a true pay off to the first saga. i'm not a great writer by any means but i would sure know how to write a finale better than this. even like how you squeezed in a ladrien moment
there is definitely lots of things that they would need to fix in season 6 for the fandom to forgive the writers.
these are the things i hope happens in season 6 onwards for the show to be redeemed.
Lila shining as a true villian as she has the best potential than gabriel ever had.
adrien eveuntually learning the truth and confronting marinette about everything leading to the eventual true reveal.
the spirit of gabriel visiting adrien and telling him everything and apologizes to him for what he put him & marinette through & convinces him to move on and be with who makes him happy.
adrinette reconciliation
that's all i can think of at this moment.
while season 5 didn't meet it's full expectations, i still enjoy most of the episodes that i thought were well done
i can assume that one of your videos will be about what you hope for in season 6 and how you want the Lila saga to fix what the first couldn't do ?
definitely keep us entertained as we wait.
Tbh my hopes have completely disappeared for season 6 LMAO so I’ll doubt I’ll make a video on that. I am more interested in making a series of videos on how I’d rewrite some characters: particularly Chloe, Kagami, Luka, Alya, Felix, Nathalie and Gabriel🩷🩷
I suggest making an entire video talking about the Miraculous Awakening movie and how it differs from the main show.
Everyone including Marinette was affected by the perfect alliance nightmares whose to say this ending really happened
i desperately need a fanfic where Adrien/Chat Noir goes "villain" bc he just has a breakdown and lashes out LIKE MY BOY NEEDS IT LET HIM GO FERAL
It's a nonsense how Marinette just discovered Gabriel adentity when in the last episode she was show by Felix and kagami
Didn’t Plagg, Felix or Nathalie tell Adrien about Gabriel being Monarch and it’s sad we don’t see Adrien fighting Monarch or knowing about his identity, HE’S HIS DAMN SON and why did Marinette, who isn’t associated with Gabriel should be the only one fighting and finding out his identity anyway?
Hey Gee!! You’re right!! It season 1, I can’t remember the exact episode but here’s the quote, right after Adrien snaps at him saying something like “shut up and just do what I tell you!!” Gabriel Agreste states: “Quite a temper, you remind me of someone” meanwhile he’s gazing at Emelie’s portrait
the villain getting everything they want and it creates utopia making the last 5 seasons pointless
UGHH exactly
@@TheCartoonHotspot I would have had cat noir be in the fight and learn about his dad but not ladybug figuring out that he is Adrian so the have extra drama next season of Marinette having to lie to him about his dad being a hero.
I still can’t express my frustration with that finale. Going into s6, you cannot tell me that ladybug didn’t tell chat noir because there’s no reason for her to not tell her partner 😣. He has a direct connection to Monarch that no one else knows. He would have to pretend everything is fine in and out of the mask. Now that he has unlimited use of his cataclysm, chat blanc has to come up. The nightmare is that fear of losing control. Gabriel still has a hold on him. Lila being the new butterfly holder could lead to her sensing his internal struggle and try to target him. S6 has to be the season Adrien knows the truth. I don’t think we can move forward without it.
Anyways… GOOD RIDDANCE TO THAT HORRIBLE UGLY MAN 🫶🏼😼
So... does Adrien remember his time in London and that his father told him it was for his own good? I hope because if not, why would he think his parent is a good person? That makes no sense!
Even after his death, Gabriel still makes his son suffers. Marinette has to lie about him and won't reveal he was Monarch to Adrien. Not sure he will take it well if she told him later. It will shocked him then he would be mad at her for hiding the truth; probably broke with her during a few weeks. His father didn't think about that, he's a jerk 😡
Whiles the movie wasn’t perfect it did the story so much better then the show that has been running for years the movie is the only canon to me now and I hope they make a sequel
Bro had the disclaimer in the beginning, because the season 5 finale was indeed traumatizing to me.
Not me reallizing that canonically Gabe traumatized everyone by having them experience their worst nightmares, so the joke actually has another layer I was not aware of when making it in the first place.
OH MY GOSHHH GIRL WHERE HAVE YOU BEEN??? I’M SO EXCITED FOR THIS VIDEO❤️❤️❤️
On vacation LMAOO🤣🩷
i havent thought abt gabriel committing suicide and not reviving emilie at all- i still hate the finale but this theory/possibiliy makes me hate it a little less LOL (that sounds mean i dont mean it that way but in a character development of adrien, nathalie etc stays way) great analysis as always :)
Oh it’s not a theory LMAO! I believe he actually did it and tbh the way the show portrayed it was pretty smart so I’ll give them props for that. He basically chose to be reunited in death than go against emilie’s wishes and bring her back to life. And thank you! Glad you enjoyed the video 🩷
oh yeah keeping what happened vague and us not knowing for sure if it was emilie or amelie was smart- i was so sure its emilie until this vid LMAO
miraculous reminds of steven universe a lot like how the first couple of seasons are slice of life mostly non canon episodes and later seasons build on suspense and actual development later, but steven universe has no scenes where steven isnt in them, which holds back developing characters like peridot, or lapis. since everything leads back to steven/marinette it leaves no room for development for other characters to develop which leads to a less satisfying show overall.
There is a way for Adrien to see Monarch. Remember the Kwagatami that allows one to see past holders?
Thank you, yes! Honestly, Monarch could have been defeated in episode 1 of season 5 were it not for plot convenience. Sure, yeah, villain plot armour for serialized kids' shows and whatnot, but not at the expense of main character traits SO well defined they've affected their relationship with the other main character. This isn't lazy writing, this is a deliberate bad choice.
Adrien being reduced to a damsel in distress is absolutely infuriating, especially given his supposed character growth. Again, I understand this is a children's show and one can only traumatize one's characters so far, but is agency not valued when its impact can't be as simple as destroyed chimneys??? ....I'm not upset. Whoever said I'm upset?
LMAOO i completely agree with you
About time 😭😭
Sorry😭🩷
Imagine how great it would be that Adrien overcomes the curse of being everything turning cataclysmic (ha) whenever he finds out his dad his Monarch and gets a new suit like Ladybug did in Mr. Pigeon 72. Like his arc comes full circle instead of being on the sidelines like he always is 😅
YUP
For example.. Argos.
Where was HE during it, and why did he let his MOTHER wear the product Gabriel made.
Honestly expected him to make use of that brain of his, find where Adrien was, taking his place, etc.
Try to save his girlfriend.
But no, have Adrien be a wimp, and Felix... Was probably cowering in his room worried about Kagami.
Heck could have even just LET plagg destroy the building/room, and have him pretend that cat noir was there.
"Cat noir, thank you for saving me!"
Before the cameras die.
Also the whole showcase of various heroes over the world... What exactly was the POINT of them?!
the most disrespectful thing is not respecting the time gap from 2016 to 2023 like and make the entire show plot about 9 months like in the origins episode it was the first day at school after The summer vacation then in season 3 the same thing happened so that’s at least 8 to 10 months then in the Shanghai special it was summer again and the school is over so how does all of the count as 9 months
and there’s another thing WHY IN THE HECK THEY MADE A hole 3 episodes WITCH IN THEM CHLOE WAS SLOWLY BEGINNING TO BE A GOOD CHARACTER THEN ALL OF THE SUDDEN BOOM IN SEASON 3 SHE'S THE BEST PERSON IN OHIO I THINK ZOE IS ONLY A DAMM BAD COPY OF CHLOE AND IF CHLOE WAS THE KIND OF EVIL CHARACTER THAT IS ENEMIES WITH AN other evil character like miss wigs and help in defeating her to her own advantage but then releasing that team work is good is a far better than simply joining miss wigs for no reason.
the writers: miraculous fans need to learn acceptation
Not only was Adrian kept in the dark, he wasnt even given quality screen time. Like, his writing was just bad in S5. A dad-son moment would have been Miracolous"s redemption after all the bad episodes in S4/5. I'm only gonna watch S6 so i can see if they learn from their mistakes. But, then there's Astruc. *sigh* can't a viewer have a good ending?
i agree with you that marinette wouldnt be trusting in this situation. she is INCREDIBLY forgiving, but we have known her to be anxious and scared. even if she did do this and ask if he wanted to be a hero, i believe marinette as we know would have stepped back or wrapped him with her yoyo. we have no reason to believe she trusts him because she doesnt trust much of anything. she always asks “what if its a trap, what if its monarch” and since season 1 gabriel has bren the villain, in her personal life, for restricting her from seeing adrien, and as ladybug for, yknow… she has seen what he does where he pulls her aside and does some sneaky ass shit like giving her definitely poisoned pancakes 🤢 she would literally not be trusting of him in this situation in the slightest edit: AND ANOTHER THING. THIS TRUST THING WOULD NOT HAVE HAPPENED IF SHE WAS TRANSFORMED. YOU SEEN HER WITH MONARCH IN HER HANDS AND SHE FCKING CATACLYSMS HIM. LIKE?? ALSO HER PANIC ATTACK IN S4 OR 5 WHEN SHE LOSES ALL THE MIRWCULOUS?? LIKE THAT WAS TRAUMATIZING FOR ME I WOULD BE SO SCARRED? and she just TrUst HiM bEcAuSe SheS a GoOd PeRsoN? NUH
I do agree with I was disappointed ☹️ Thomas did say he originally only 4 or 5 seasons but now we r extending it to 7 seasons
Her own version of the finale actually made me cry and it's not even official yet just by her saying it not us seeing it but you her just saying it was way more emotional impactful than the official finale and I would die to see that version
Maybe the reason ladybug lost was because she wasn’t fighting with Cat Noir? Maybe it wasn’t intentional, but it makes sense since it was them against the world, but when it’s not then Ladybug would loose?
Your rewrite of the season 5 finale was really well thought-out. I also 100% agree with you with everything that you said. You definitely have a new subscriber now.
ur version of the finale was so good that i wanted to see more bc its so much better than what we got
Might do a separate video on a more in-depth rewrite 🥰
@@TheCartoonHotspot pls do I would love to watch it
@@TheCartoonHotspot pls do I would love to watch it
@@TheCartoonHotspot pls do I would love to watch it
This is an amazing video. I am starting to write a book of my own and you have given me so much inspiration and ideas. Especially from hearing you compare ATLA to Miraculous. I love your videos and make sure to keep up the amazing content
Thank you so much! Good luck with your book- I’d love to read it, if possible, when it’s complete!🩷
Wow really? I would love for you to read it. I'll prob post it on my channel later on in life when it is completed. If I do hopefully you can read it. Have a good day or night
I know that many are tired of Gabriel, but if he could come back being trapped with Lila by the butterfly miraculous it would be the perfect punishment for him, the thing with Gabriel is not just madness or evil, but respect. He does not respect even close people and uses the power he has over them, if he respected Adrien he wouldn't control him and make him feel sad, if he respected André he would have thought of something else instead of "exposing" André after a moment where he opens his heart, and the respect he had for Nathalie was gone and this is clear from the way he talks to her at the beginning of the episode Representation. So being stuck with someone who doesn't respect him and would make him feel bad would be a poetic justice, Lila might even do things to mess with him psychologically like he did with others, like calling him by his real name to make him keep remembering the past he wants to forget, or commenting on things that are happening to Adrien to make him feel bad about not being able to take advantage of the wish(regardless of whether Emilie is alive or not it would also make Gabriel feel bad for not being by her side, but if she is alive Lila would definitely talk about her too).
I love your analysis it clears up some things. I love your ending works pretty awesome way to handle everything with Gabe's end and the fight between lady bug + cat noir vs hawkmoth
🩷🩷
And how did plag leave Adrien's "prison" whit the miraculous the miraculous can't go through the wall
Unpopular opinion I hate representation it may not have been the video to say this under but i have too.Representation felt like they were trying to get creative and failed cause without any previous hint kagami suddenly know that ladybug is Marinette which destroy everything in her mini arc.
Additionally I would have preferred a flashback as apposed to the play cause honestly it felt like a last minute thing like oh shoot we jave to tell you this.When the could have easily spread it across the season with mini flashback as Gabriel questioned what he's doing and where it started. It all coming to a head in the finale where then what you saide would come in and there's a great end .
Furthermore some oh the episode could have done what they wanted show luca training ,have Su-Han help ladybug learn how to be a better guardian and make lila's manipulation seem believe.
There lot more i could say but I'm rumbling on but honestly this is my question why did it take so long to do just this?
I completely agree with you! I actually have a representation analysis video so if you haven’t seen it, you may wanna check that out! I rant about how the episode was kinda… meh 😬