Balaur Arms 1st Gen (HONSHU HISTORIC) 15th Century Italian Longsword Review
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- čas přidán 6. 09. 2024
- Update: as of late 2023, the 1st gen of the Balaur Arms swords made by OTC have been rebranded as Honshu Historic(al) Forge swords, sold by United Cutlery. The much improved 3rd gen sold by Kult of Athena is now made by LK Chen.
Balaur Arms is a fairly young player in the historical arms reproduction scene. Their models are designed by the people at Kult of Athena--a major historical weaponry distributor in North America, including its founder and ex-owner Ryan Whittlinger. The 15th century Italian Longsword is one of the first models released by the brand, in an attempt to incorporate unique hilt designs from actual surviving examples, along with good blade distal tapering to entry-level reproduction swords.
In that sense, this model achieved a lot, yet due to the price range, the end result is still in a relatively rough shape, and the Oakeshott type XVIIIb with hollow ground geometry not only has quite a bit of asymmetry (perhaps noticeably more so than swords by other players in this price range like Hanwei, Windlass and Ronin), but also suffers from rather over-the-top floppiness. The blade flexes left and right, back and forth even when one dry-handles the sword, which frequently throws the edge alignment off and destabilizes cuts other than the most static ones without complex maneuver and footwork.
The cause is probably its complex distal tapering (a valiant attempt nevertheless), which starts out at 5.6mm (too thin for a late medieval cut-and-thrust longsword with hollow ground diamond cross section) and then tapers down drastically to 4.4mm at 6" from the base and stays on that thickness until the point of percussion at 24" from the base. It tapers down to 3mm at 27" from the base and then back to 4mm to reinforced the tip. While the portion just below the tip isn't too flexible for stiff thrusting, the thinness of the majority of the blade results in the whipiness, which coupled with the very rough edge geometry (Kult of Athena's sharpening service left a 40 degree edge angle, therefore the 2 surfaces forming the apex are almost perpendicular to each other), makes this a below-average sword for cutting.
It's noteworthy that after I spent 2 hours reprofiling the edges to a proper convex geometry with apple seeding, it can still cut well enough, especially with static cuts, even against deflective hard targets.
The hilt, which is lifted wholesale from the Brescia Spadona is mostly well done in appearance, but it's filled with epoxy visibly everywhere. We see a large aperture on the crossguard to accommodate a hollow ground blade with diamond cross section, yet the opening is about 9mm in thickness and 52mm wide (indicating by design this was supposed to be a excellent blade with proper rigidity), meaning the maker could not fulfill KoA's design and had to fill the gaps with epoxy. Over time the hilt became very creakily even though no component has become loose. Very alarming!
The entire word weighs just over 3 lbs (1369g) with a 34.6" blade, and a lot of weight is from the pommel and crossguard. This coupled with the substantial profile taper and distal taper makes the handling of the sword very easy--almost unsettling so, and when the blade starts to flex on its own, and the main hand receives a lot of vibration--a sign of not-so-great blade harmonics and improper vibration nodes.
Overall even though the blade can be offered in a sharpened state, I would not recommend it. It's best left blunt as a handsome training tool. I used it a lot for the motion capture of longsword animations in the video game I'm developing--Fortune Favours the Bold (www.westcoasti..., Facebook Page ( / fortunefavourstheboldt... )
The sword reviewed is no longer available for ordering on Kult of Athena as of December 2021, as KoA has ended their previous collaboration with the contractor OTC. However you may still find this sword on the second-hand market. For its price it's not a bad offering, and overall the design is in the right direction but needs lots of modifications, or a more competent maker. Kult of Athena has announced that they will collaborate with Windlass for future models of Balaur Arms. There's some indication that a prominent voice in the Historical European Martial Arts community has been attached to the project. If it is indeed true, this person as an authority in this field can definitely provide more than competent consultation to the brand and push the future maker of to better implement designs that incorporate measurements from actual museum examples, and scientific sword harmonics.
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Balaur Arms 15th Century Italian Longsword review referenced:
• Sword Review - Balaur ...
The flex and wobbly nature of the blade is quite problematic. I think you analyzed it perfectly.
Thanks again, for the great review
Thank you for viewing!
You can't fool me Kane! I hear that JenovA remix! You are also a man of culture I see! I picked up this same sword about 2 years ago and regret it. It's floppier than some Jians I've handled.
Haha, you are right. Both soundtracks are remixed from FFVII.
Nice review buddy!!!! I wanted this sword as soon as I saw it, because the specs seemed nice. However I was quite skeptical that they could deliver. I was so close to ordering it but I passed. I’m glad your getting the info out there for us to consider. Very thorough bro!! Keep up the great work!
Thank you! Glad that the video has some value. It was a nice try on Kult of Athena’s part, for a budget sword, it has lots of interesting aspects. The maker just could nail their designs. I think they should push the maker a bit further, while perhaps raising the price a little bit-doesn’t have to get too hung up on offering a good sword for less than 300 dollars. Honestly I would rather pay for a great sword for 400-500. On the other hand, the first models did attract a lot attention from the community with feedback. So maybe they got what they wanted, it’s perhaps only improvements on future models from this point on once they have built this solid following.
@@FortuneFavoursTheBold yes I agree, nail the details down a little further and increase the price for it if you have to. It’s great to see budget attempts at nice sword design. It shows the awareness and general demand for proper swords. HEMA is I think making a great impact here.
very good vid with great info. Thank you for the update on this
No problem. Glad to be of help!
Always impressed with your cutting skills and form. Especially with a less than desirable sword.
Interesting that devils edge was included in that as well. Got their hurlbat on a whim, when I ordered a sword or something. Claimed it was 1095. It bent on the very first throw. I also have zero faith in their sharpening service. Have have yet to get a blade I would consider sharp from their service...
Thanks a lot Eric! Yeah, Devil's Edge really has some trust issue. Prior to KOA broke the news, I was always skeptical of DE's claim of 1095 as blade steel, given so many people managed to break them in half or bend them. Balaur Arms, on the other hand, seems to have at least used passable steels (1561-1566 equivalent), but either the design of the thickness and tapering has some issue, or the maker didn't implement it faithfully.
Superb cutting skills 👏 Long swords are not my thing personally but I do enjoy your detailed opinion!
Thank you very much!
Haven't had a chance to watch yet, but I read the summary on SBG. I must have really lucked out on the one of these I got - I just did a couple hard test swings and its not the least floppy or whippy.
Yeah, I referenced your footage of flexing it in the video and compared to me doing the flex test. It would seem I was able to bend it to 75-80 degrees without applying much force, while yours would not exceed 30-40 degrees.
@@FortuneFavoursTheBold Watching the juxtaposition of our two flex tests is really striking. Loved the look on your face when you cut the Pom bottle, btw.
I agree with you about KoA's lackluster attention to rust on the fittings. Both of my recent BA purchases from them came with rust. And their sharpening was bad on one, and atrocious on the other.
I'm really curious to see what developments happen with Windlass. I'd love to see them pay more attention to detail and implement proper distal taper and better hilts.
@@alientude My thoughts, too! Kult of Athena's handling of their merchandise really needs some reform! Shoddy! I was quite nervous letting them handling my Albion Regent last year, but it came out alright. Maybe they only mistreat the budget pieces?
I'm very much looking forward to the new Windlass thing, too! I trust Matt Easton that Windlass has done a good job on the prototyping, but the question is whether they can maintain that level of care throughout production.
BTW that POM bottle was really a bit shocking. It's a very hard and deflective target. I have amazing cutters either failing to cut through, or not cleanly. My first time to left it on the stand with minimal movement. Full disclosure: based on the atrocious performance of this sword and the creakily hilt, I fully expected the sword to either break in half or the hilt falling apart when it fails to cut the POM bottle, but it finished with flying colors, haha.
yea i love your style and yer a sword god in my eyes.. so much fun on that stand you used now i know how to make my Pool Noodle stand!
Thanks a lot! That stand is quite light and mobile. Easy to carry around, just need some weight at the bottom to secure and stabilize it. On the top level, I use some foam padding so in case I miss, the blade would cleave into thick layers of foam, instead of directly going into the wooden board, either potentially damage or at least dulling the blade, or destroy the stand.
@@FortuneFavoursTheBold i plan on getting a plastic shower stand from walmart..cut a hole for a bamboo..and then put in the pool noodle..with my weights..always work out before ..cutting..lol..legit.i think 60 pounds can hold it down.. we will see
@@ryldauril6379 Yeah I think even 20 lbs would be more than enough as a stabilizing force. Having a bit give would make the cut a bit challenging, as human targets would also have some give too, so a clean cut is required to pass through with minimal disturbance. Sharp edge and good edge alignment!
you need more views and ppl watching you i plan on telling everyone about you!
Haha, thank you very much!
Very helpful review with detailed explanations! Keep up the good work, man!
I definitely plan to!
Thank you for this review to expose them so we can avoid it at all costs.
It might not be completely useless. It handles rather well, and can be a sword for form training and drilling, but as a live blade cutting sword, it's not a good offering at all.
nice
Thank you!
Very thorough and well researched. Your disappointment with this piece is well expressed.
I have a hanwei jian with a similar style of distal taper, in jumps rather than smooth change, ( I call it "staircase taper") and it's also whippily frustrating to use.
Thank you very much! It does seem that the first batch or so of this model did a better job at implementing a reasonable distal taper--more linear and starts out thicker, that did help with the rigidity and performance. It's in the right direction to experiment with complex distal taper. Perhaps future models could use some consultation from Matt Easton to get it done right.
Great, great video! I had an eye on this sword but you just demystified it 😢 ... no, for the better 😅 Enough info and demonstration here to help me with my desicions on the market. Thank you so so much! On the channel alientude i already learned, that the newer model does not match the quality and craftsmanship of his older model. I bet the demand for this sword and brand did rise a lot over the years and what i've seen with other products and manufacturers, this often won't result in an increase of quality.
EDIT: I just saw new cutting footage of the sword maker LK Chen from 2023 and then i found a lot of updates, also videos of this brand on your channel. If they did improve, i think it would be fair to also make an (quick) update of this exact sword. Because when i search it here on youtube, your video pops up and if the newer versions are good, this video is outdated. I'm without enough knowledge now, but i'll continue researching this brand and their swords also here on your channel.
EDIT 2: I finally clicked the description (didn't think of it before) and i see, you did wrote a small update. It's just the first two sentences, right? The rest of the detailed description in the info box is only about the 1st gen?
EDIT 3: Found a review of it just 10 days old. Seems like your video helped to improve it! :D
Have you heard of the seller Raven Forge, famous for their pizza axe? They are quite new in the scene and are flooded with 5 star reviews by their customers. I'm looking at a sword, which is one of the two swords in their shop, which is functional, sharp and made for cutting. Item name: Raven Forge English Longsword. Video: Instagram Requests pt. 2: Scottish Basket Hilt & English Longsword. Raven Forge TV CZcams channel. The second sharp sword i'm referring to is named Black English Longsword. They look really nice to me, especially the English Longsword, on which i fell in love in that video. There are no expert video reviews of it like you do anywhere. Couldn't that be an item for you to review here on your channel? I mention it, because i scanned the whole market on swords for the last 3 weeks daily (yes, i am that crazy) and this sword stands out in many regards, like: optics, stats, 5 star customer reviews but also no cutting testing and expert reviews.
I can recommend all the current European sword models of Balaur Arms by LK Chen, but the current Italian longsword the least, not because it’s a bad sword and not because of “bad craftsmanship”, as LK Chen’s craftsmanship is vastly superior to that of OTC, who made the first batch of Balaur Arms swords. It’s because the design of the Italian longsword given to Lk Chen by Kult of Athena is inadequate. LK Chen’s all in-house brand products are developed from 1:1 replication of antique originals at the museums, or in LK Chen’s personal collection, or on loan to him. These Balaur Arms models are dreamt out of Kult of Athena employees’ mind. They did not have any antique original to reference.
However, due to the vast past experience of LK Chen, he was still able to specify aspects of these designs and produce some of the best swords under $1000. Not the Italian longsword though, it’s good, but it could be better. Get the Current Balaur Arms German longsword by LK Chen. Best $398 you can ever spend on swords, period.
BTW, do not anything from so called Raven Forge, or anyone selling off Instagram. RavenForge is not a forge or maker, they are a reseller, buying cheap sword-like-objects from Windlass, Deepeeka and the previous contract forge of Darksword Armoury, and resell them for 2x markup. Those 5x so called “reviews” on social media or Amazon are all bots.
If you want to spend under $500, and get a good longsword, currently the only 2 reliably good choices are balaur Arms German longsword, and Hanwei Tinker longsword (preferable having someone re-hilt the sword to improve it).
@@FortuneFavoursTheBoldOk, thank you very much, i'll take a look into them all again! Especially the German one.
@@FortuneFavoursTheBold It sounds like, you have not been on their website. They are a team of young, passionate people of the UK medieval scene. Look them up, they do a ton of different stuff and have made their name as a seller and a forge for knifes and blades in the UK: Their own pizza axe, high quality knifes, their Uruk-Hai sword and other stuff. They are not on Amazon, nor Etsy, nor selling over Instagram. I think here you are judging to early and uninformed.
Every single one on this page ravenforge.com/collections/swords is either made by Windlass (often dirt cheap discontinued ones sold for 100 euros elsewhere in EU countries), Deepeeka (bottom of the barrel stuff sold for $100-200 in the US), United Cutlery (stainless decorative LotR wallhangers) that is marked up 2x.
I really am shocked often by how gullible people are and how adamant they are thinking they are instead knowledgeable. First familiarize yourself with the market. www.budk.com/Lord-of-the-Rings-Swords-2993
www.kultofathena.com/brand/deepeeka/?_product_categories=swords
www.celticwebmerchant.com/en/brands/windlass-steelcrafts/
Man I really need to work on my footwork
Haha, it's always a good idea.
I heard the manufacturer that makes Balaur Arms changed recently. I wonder if some of the quality issues are a result of the switch.
I discussed that in the video. Please watch to find out.
@@FortuneFavoursTheBold yes I did. I often comment as I have a thought and in this case jumped the gun 😂
Regardless I enjoy your vids g this one I found particularly informative
@@asa-punkatsouthvinland7145 Thanks a lot!
@@FortuneFavoursTheBold very welcome! My sword vids tend to be more targeted at entertainment & occasionally viewings. I do know a fair bit about swords & have collected since 1995 but I think others are better at giving detailed reviews especially on newer swords as I don't have the $ to get them too often.
You have good knowledge g the ability to spotlight swords in a way I couldn't so I aim at doing vids in a different way.
BTW if you ever get the Balaur Single edged Viking I'd be very interested as I've wanted a single edged Viking for years but apart from high ends like the Albion Berserker & low end junk there is essentially nothing in the entry-mid range.
Given the issues Balaur is having it's kind of a roll of the dice but if it is decent I'd likely get one
@@asa-punkatsouthvinland7145 Thanks! I have heard good things about that sword, although I would be slightly cautious about the quality control of it. Indeed single-edged Viking-era swords are not featured enough in the reproduction scene. It may have acceptable rigidity, given that it's got only a 30" blade. It might be quite forward heavy but it isn't necessarily wrong for that kind of sword. One thing about it is you would have to really work on the edge bevel yourself. KoA is going to do a shallow secondary bevel with very obtuse angle. If you have the tools and patience (and the skills) it might be worth giving a shot, especially if you have the 25% off voucher if you have purchased a BA sword before.
What is your opinion on these swords
The Balaur Arms sword? I think it's alright as a sword for drills, especially if you don't even bother sharpening them, because they are easy to move around. But they are simply not up-to-par for any test cutting.
This one or ronin katana euro?
Well this version has been discontinued, and there’s a new version fulfilled by Windlass recently. As far as I can see based on what people have been reporting, the thickness issue has not been addressed in the new version yet, I don’t know how floppy it is without personally handling one.
Ronin’s Euro designs have some issues and their QC seems to have a lot of problems lately so I can’t really wholeheartedly recommend their models.
The man, i understand. Im into folders and its the same deal there. Doing a good working knife seems to be fucking impossible... The again man
I bought a Black Fencer sharp longsword 18a. That should do it👍
@@svensvensson627 Would love to hear your opinion about it!
@@FortuneFavoursTheBold absolutely!
How does the Gen 1 compare to the 2024 model? I'm about two seconds away from clicking "Buy" on this, its so sexy.
By the 2024 model, you mean the current BA Italian by LK Chen? Or the Honshu one still made by OTC?