Drawknives for Bow Making | Sharpening, Recommendations, and my Vintage Collection
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- čas přidán 1. 06. 2024
- Which drawknives should you buy or avoid? Sharpening tips, tricks, and show and tell with my massive collection.
0:00 Introduction
0:30 Kirschen 10" Straight Drawknife
3:20 Narex 240mm Curved Drawknife
5:12 L&IJ White #6 Cooper's Drawknife
6:40 Barton Unknown Model Drawknife
8:59 Kirschen 10" Curved Drawknife
13:24 Oxhead 10" Curved Drawknife
18:45 Oxhead 10" Straight Drawknife
21:43 L&IJ White Timber Framing Drawknife
24:54 DR Barton #16 Timber Framing Drawknife
25:52 Unknown Vintage: My Dad's Drawknife
28:12 Barton #9
30:03 Swan Drawknives
30:18 Morakniv Wood Splitting Drawknife (Not recommended)
31:57 Flexcut 3" Drawknife (Not recommended)
33:56 Felled 5" Drawknife (Not recommended)
38:53 Sharpening Checklist
43:42 Sharpening Example
Oxhead 10” Curved drawknife amzn.to/3SOw2OX
Oxhead 10” Straight Drawknife amzn.to/3dh4qBR
Kirschen 10” Straight Drawknife (New model, the one in the video is the old model) (the Oxhead is very similar and a better price) Kirschen 10” Straight Drawknife amzn.to/3QIia74
My main drawknife: Kirschen 10” Curved Drawknife (I recommend the Oxhead curved drawknife instead. I think they might be the same knife and the Oxhead is much cheaper.)
amzn.to/3QIia74
Whetstones
King 1000/6000 grit combination whetstone amzn.to/3Ccf4nM
King 800 grit whetstone amzn.to/3dhpvvZ
King 220 grit course whetstone amzn.to/3QK9AVF
Dan's Arkansas Stone 3 piece set (no affiliation) amzn.to/3AmKMh7
Tormek honing compound for stropping amzn.to/3w2fhq5
Leather strop (these are very easy to make, but here's a link for the lazy) amzn.to/3bZvHIG
NOT Recommended. Don’t Buy the following. See alternate recommendations:
Narex 240mm Curved Drawknife (A good drawknife but the bevel is way too steep for my taste, so I can’t recommend it. Great for debarking. Either Oxhead knife is a better purchase.) amzn.to/3AjSokd
Flexcut 3” Drawknife amzn.to/3SLhuQn (Instead buy a Mora 120 or 106 amzn.to/3JPMgn8, amzn.to/3Qpcnnp)
Morakniv Classic Wood Splitting Drawknife amzn.to/3bQ0CYa (I love most of Mora’s knives-the 106 is one of my all time favorite tools-but the drawknife is simply not recommendable.)
Felled 5” Drawknife (Worst I’ve ever used. I don’t recommend any drawknife of this style. For $10 more you can buy a serious drawknife such as the Oxhead, which will last generations) amzn.to/3phw9VO
Your having way too much fun in your shop. Sweet demonstration. Thanks
I generally seek out vintage hand tools. Many hand tools made before WW2 are usually better made and more durable than modern ones.
"Ohio tool" draw knives are great.
They make everything just good enough these days but the old ones were indestructible.
I would love to see the restauration of an drawknife!!! After the flood we had, two years ago I'm restoring a lot of my own tools lately. Thanks for the great video, you've a new subscriber. All the best from Germany, Maximilian.
A blade resto would be awesome since I know a lot of us would like older tools. As they say, they don't make them like that anymore.
I just got started with bow making, borrowed a rusty old draw knife, cleaned it and sharpened it roughly and had terrible results. Green juniper, crabapple and dogwood came away in ragged strips which sometimes went too deep into the belly of the bow. Now you have shown me what to do. I find all of your videos really helpful. Thank you.
Thanks, it's kind of you to share your experiences and skills...you didn't have to take the time but you did, and it helped me a lot.
Thanks Doc! Plenty of bowyers did the same for me. We all have fun talking bows and sharing the craft
your favorites folder shows me your a uneducated bum 'doc'
damn. you and sebastian lague both upload 1 hour videos in the span of a day. awesome
Great job!!! Great advices
Great video Dan , very informative and useful. Thanks very much.
great video. thanks for all the sharpening info.
I want to say thank you for the help of this important information, you are doing us a favor by warning us not to make mistakes, and thanks again🙏🍻
Thanks so much for this Dan! Exactly the education I needed on these :)
Dan- love teh content- found you while searching drawknives- Thanks for the content and making the time to discuss these things- It is appreciated!
Awesome, thank you!
I'm new to woodworking & it's nice to see someone give solid recommendations of good beginning gear. I have the mora & I like it for whittling. I got the flexcut but broke the handle w in a week & then got the German blue one but haven't used it yet. I find all sorts of suff at flea markets, yard sales & what-not for absolute peanuts that i get w the intention of refurbishing them! I just often buy the stuff just to save it from the trash bin & I figure I could probably scrap it & still make some money. By the way, I love your homemade tool organizers & vise!
Thank You , I learned a lot.
I just got the Felled 8” straight draw knife for $25 in the mail yesterday (9-30-2023). Let me say, much much better than holding and using my hatchet in place of a draw knife. Pros : it was factory “sharpened” which actually didnt do to bad at stripping down some white wood I have around. Will be looking for a vintage/antique one though.
My first drawknife was the 8" felled knife .....larger version of the 5" you do not recommend. It works better bevel down than bevel up and is decent for carving when sharpened to a better edge. It has plenty of strength for debarking and worked well for me in chasing a ring in ash and white oak....not as much success with red oak or juniper. I have another, lighter, curved draw knife for shaving and finish work...it is an ohio steel drawknife that does not have the umph I need for heavy work. I just bought the blue ox head curved knife (after watching your video) and am looking forward to using it. Thanks, Dan....I will let the felled knife go dull and use it for the debarking stuff and make the oxhead my main knife. Enjoyed the sharpening aspect..this was something I needed and came at a great time for me.
Glad to hear! I’m sure the felled can be improved by sharpening but I really don’t like that knife enough to spend the time. I will probably reforge it into a different tool
Yes, please do a restoration video
Just refinished a draw knife today following your instructions. It's not perfect but it works!!
Really like your vids and the style of them, keep it up! If you're looking for any video requests, I'd love to see a detailed build of a red oak bow for max performance. I know you have a short vid out there but a more comprehensive one would be appreciated. Thanks!
I have only the "Ochsenkopf" (its cute how you pronounce it ;) ) and I like it. Problem is the blue paint on the handles. Its not "solid", so it makes your hands blue, when you use it intensely and probably have the right sweat pH. I think i will completely remove the colour. Carving is pretty good in my experience too, but i keep training sharpening on it. So maybe it could be more sharp and have a better angle right now.
Ha, I should have looked up the pronunciation. It’s no wonder they go by Oxhead in the US-much easier to say! So far the wax mix seems to help keep the paint on but i’ll definitely take it off if it turns anything blue. I am definitely not a fan of paint on tool handles. Wood is such a better material to grip. Manufacturers feel a lot of pressure to do this because it keeps the product more shelf stable and makes them stand out in online pictures…but it also makes the tool worse to use so it’s definitely an annoying practice
@@DanSantanaBows I agree on the handles! And its not so hard to spell as you might think: The "chs" in Ochsen is pronounced the same way as in ox. So Its pronounced like Oxnkopf. Thanks a lot for this very insightful video, which is more like a lesson for free. Tools and the right choice and maintenance is very underrated i think.
@@hansimgluck9207 thank you!
I bought drawknife made by Richter Extra, which looks the same as your narex. Narex even uses Richter name for their chisels. It is about 90-70years old and should serve me well
Cheers bro. I've just picked up a 16 inch cut. Gilpin draw knife from 1834. Made in cannock UK. Just up the road from me. Your info on sharpening was just what I needed. I've put excellent edge on it. Tried it today on a Ash stave and cut perfect. Thanks bro great work. Catch ya soon.
Awesome, love it!
Heya dude - your Kirschen curved link is the *same* link as the Kirschen straight link. :)
I’m a woodworker (mostly hand tools) and have always wanted a drawknife. I have several Narex products and decided to get their drawknife. I’m glad I watched this because I thought the exact thing! This can’t be the bevel angle right!!? Waaaay to steep. I haven’t even used it yet because I have to reshape the bevel as well. Total bummer. I think I may just take it to my grinder to knock down the bevel. For the money, I agree, I shouldn’t have to do that.
Great seeing your drawknives and hearing your take on them. I agree with you over what is good and not. It is important for people to understand the merits of various tools as there are some tools that are essentially landfill. I would like to point out the in the middle of the video you talk about the Mora 220 and the flex cut knives. These are pushknives and not drawknives. You can occasionally use them to pull for certain cuts but as the handles are inline with the blade this makes them difficult to control on the pull. Pushknives as the name suggests work best on the push and not really for long planing cuts. The flexcut was designed with the help of David and Sally Nye for making fanbirds to rive or split very thin sections of wood along the grain to make feathers that are then twisted out to form wings of a bird. For me this is the only use of this knife, although I am sure other people have found different uses for it. The Mora 220 is sold as a kindling splitting knife. I know many people who use them for spoon and small bowl and cup making, but have adapted them by grinding a longer back bevel on one side. Pushknives come into their own when shaping the convex outside surface of bowls and I have made some that have 11 inch long cutting edges. All the best and stay sharp, Sean
I agree with the mora and flexcut not being “real” drawknives. My issue is that when I bought them they were marketed as drawknives, not push knives. There are many great drawknives out there that do have straight handles so that you can use them either as push or pull knives, but theyre much more solid than either of these. I’m especially hard on the flexcut and the mora because I think they’re lousy as both drawknives and pushknives. The mora is bad at all it’s intended functions-push, pull, and splitting. The flexcut may be good for making specialized shavings, but as a carving tool it’s surpassed in all domains by either a carving knife or a real drawknife.
Very nice! I'm teaching myself to make high end drawknives, particularly for bowyers. What I really need is a good idea what bevel angle you prefer? I know that the common theme seems to be 25°...but I hear a lot of guys talk of 'modifying' the bevel angle. If you like something flatter knowing in advance would be perfect.
Oh also...I'll be making a number of self bows to test my work...and your videos are invaluable!
Thanks!!
I’d be happy to help you design the ultimate drawknife! I have a bunch of ideas
@@DanSantanaBows sounds like fun! I made something generic for myself this week...no wood handles, but the design I made doesn't really need them (it's similar to a 'blacksmith' knife). I'm mostly just looking to get a feel for how the things are supposed to work. The primary bevel is a full convex for the first 3/16", based roughly on a 25° bevel. The secondary bevel is much closer to 10° to keep it out of the way of the knife. The transition from primary to secondary bevel is a full blended convex. I'll be finalizing the bevel, sharpening, and trying it out tomorrow. I'll let you know how it goes lol.
@@CrisAnderson27 I actually think it’s better if the bevel gets in the way because the corner acts as a chip breaker and folds over the shaving, helping it curl away rather than letting the knife dig and get stuck.
Personally I like a flat bevel. I see the appeal for a secondary bevel but don’t think they carve as nicely
@@DanSantanaBows I saw you mentioned that in the video. I'm thinking it might be something I'll need to experience to understand your full meaning. In 99% of bladesmithing, reducing friction improves performance exponentially...but not having used this kind of tool for its intended purpose...it could be the complete opposite for sure.
I started sharpening my blades using an air-belt-grinder & 3M Cubitron 80 grit belts. Yeah, that's about the best way to sharpen ANYTHING I have ever stumbled across. You get absolute razor edges in close to zero time. I use a leather belt to strop the edge after - and every edge stops on a fingernail. It cut out a LOT of mucking about with stones etc etc.
Mouth is watering at your tool collection btw - ohhhh, so many good tools. Very nice. :-)
If you try that method ^ I mentioned, you will NEVER run a finger on an edge to see if it is sharp, because it will cut you - you'll switch to dropping the edge onto wood & seeing can you push the edge sideways - done right, you won't be able to, it will stop dead. I handed a newly sharpened fiskars to a friend - he did the "finger test" before I could say anything - cut him to the bone. There was blood, there was moodiness & he did sulk. Quite a lot as it happens.
Dunno what he expected, I did say I'd just sharpened it - he still sulked a lot. You'll also start minding how/where you put blades down, because you'll know they will open the unwary if they brush against them. Which you used never do before using crappy sharpening methods.
Do you have a video on the way you built your holding vice?
I haven’t made a tutorial video but in the video on workholding methods I take it apart so you can see how it’s designed. I used a vise screw from woodcraft but any vise screw should work. Let me know if you have any questions and I can post more about it
@@DanSantanaBows ok, I will thank you.
Been using a hatchet, rasp and knife. Ordered my first draw knife, not popular where I am in Australia. Cost me, I got a kirchen curved 250mm.
This has probably been said, but put some lock nuts onto that Felled 5" to fix the loosenig handles.
thanks !
Great video! I enjoy the ‘tools of the trade’ type of videos. How about a detailed video of your workbench that you have your bow vise on? I built a shave horse out of hand hewn cherry, locust, & hickory. I’m thinking of building a primitive/timber workbench for bow and axe handle building.
Will do! For now check out my video on workholding methods where I show the insides of the workbench
@@DanSantanaBows Awesome! Will do!
With damaged draw knives i like to take 1000 grit diamond plates and sanding the entire flat a small bit before moving up.
Really good informative video. One of the best I have watched. I am very interested in your bench top shave horse. Do you have a video on making it or a PDF drawing. Thanks
See my video on workholding methods where I take it apart so you can see how it works
@@DanSantanaBows I can’t find it. Is it part of a paid subscription?
@@dennismeko czcams.com/video/ZkAFzKKuVek/video.htmlsi=6gZIbRw793Y5D_z1
Great timing for me. I have been thinking of buying a good draw knife for my bushcraft tool kit and your video is very informative. Unfortunately, the very good ones are extremely expensive new, or used on eBay. I might take a look at the first one you reviewed (what is the brand?) and/or the Oxheads. It seems ok for beginners and not so expensive. Thanks for sharing.
Look in the video description. Later in the video he recommends a 30 and 40 dollar option that is very good
It's spelled Draw Knife not drawn. Just FYI.
Show us your holdfast!! Looks interesting.
See my older video on workholding methods
Hey Dan, is there any drawknife you'd recommend right now for a beginner?
The ox head and two cherries are no longer available on Amazon anymore, and I think maybe they stopped making them because they're rare online as well
Just what I needed, TY. Primitive arrow build today btw
Awesome good luck! What are you using for the shafts?
@@DanSantanaBows 2 hazel shoots (21" & 27"), from my garden and one 24" oak dowel, store bought, and recycled from older set. Nocks cut, ready for turkey fletchings (6"-8") cut and singed today to be attached with pine-pitch glue, first time, and deer sinew (yummy), bone points (remains of a lamb roast). 3 more 21" hazel shafts in the pipeline.
@@jillatherton4660 I love working with hazel, it’s such a pleasant wood all around. Where I live we mostly have witch hazel which isn’t as well known but is still a great bow wood with a heat treat
@@DanSantanaBows I have 4 saplings (1 1/2"-2"D) earmarked for felling once the leaves are off. I shall be chuffed for anything useable between 48" and 60", I may even succeed with all of them.
Nice! I love vintage draw knives🙂 Do you have a video talking about your bench top vice?
See the one on workholding methods, I take it apart and go into it briefly
@@DanSantanaBows thanks!🙃
enjoy your videos pal I wanted to shed light on the Mora drawknife I have 3 identical knives,I make bowls spoons etc but this knife is not a drawknife it is actually a push knive desighned to push stroke rather to pull stroke you can put a scary sharp edge on it and trust me it works super.
I agree that it isn’t a real drawknife. The problem is that they market it as one
@@DanSantanaBows fore sure took 6 months to find out only because i ordered a custom one from europe and ask the custom shop why my Moras were so shitty he said with humor thats because they dont tell you the real purpose all the time so now I have 3 push knives lol
👍👍👍
What's your opinion on Barr timber drawknives?
Is there a reason one might want the curved draw knife vs the straight one he recommended? I might be making some spoons and walking sticks with it. Not sure which would be best.
the curved one is more aggressive and slices more, the straight one is easier to control and has more splitting action
Ramelson also makes a very good knife as well, I have the smaller one and it comes polished and razor sharp and holds the edge very well with 1095 hi carbon steel…but it comes at a price of $50!
I haven’t had the best experience with their tools and have been through a few strikes with them. Quality wise they feel hobby grade but are usually at a price point where you can do better
@@DanSantanaBows I make Windsor chairs and I have shaped the spindles,arm rests and the crest all out of red and white oak and carved the poplar seat and I have not had to even hone it once…granted it it mostly green wood other than the kiln dried poplar for the seat blank, but I am impressed so far with its quality and the finish that it came with, I look forward to getting the 10” one as well!
Is the link to the oxhead curved knife correct - I can’t seem to find it?
I have one there 1876 the big old solid long one
Try hockey tape and chalk for your draw knives
I mix a bit of pine tar into the wax I use on tools which makes them grippy, but there’s no need
😎 👍🏼
Hey buddy your a great woodworker. You swing those knives around like a samurai ninja! But why don't you make a jig for those wet stones? I know its a tough stone but i cant believe i just saw you vice down on the edges of that stone. Towel or not, easy there buddy! Make a jig so you can switch out different grit stones without having to vice them down.
I have a jig but went back to this setup since it’s more comfortable and easier to film. The vice and towel are very gentle
@DanSantanaBows R&D is your friend! There's literally thousands of different ways to set up a jig. A little bit of damage over a period of time adds up to a lot of damage. Bro, not only are you applying force to the sides of the stone. You are also applying a downward force on that same stone at the same time as you sharpen your blades. Surely you have seen a wetstone crack and break or even explode before!? First off, you can tell me it doesn't cause damage to the edge of the stones until you're blue in the face, but I know better! You wouldn't be using that towel if it didn't. Second, you need a stable and in place stone in order to sharpen the blade properly. So if you didn't vice down on the edges of that stone as hard as you can, it's going to move all over the place! I can design a jig for you that wouldn't even require viceing the stones down and can also work with you to come up with a design that will be film friendly and comfortable for you. Gravity and applied forces are your friend also! It's not so much the woodworking. You're a master at your craft! I can just help you be more efficient at it. I'm not after a bunch of money or fame or anything like that. I generally want to help you out! And I'm also crazy about archery. 😆
If you have a draw length of 36 inches how would you need to design and tiller the bow for that? I had a bow I used for several years with that draw length but it broke not long ago and I have been unable to find any bows for sale with that kind of length at any price...
For a rough estimate on the bow length, double the draw length and add the total length of stiff handle. You can follow the board bow tutorial or the maple longbow buildalong. For the width, compare with the width of a bow of the same design and adjust proportionally to the draw weight
And here I thought all drawknives performed the same. I really want a timber framing draw knife now.
Love that one, it saves me so much effort in the long run. Takes some getting used to but when you put your back into it that thing is a beast
whats the explanation for those to be so expensive?(in my country the cheapest i could find was 180 dollars). Maybe its a tool thats not used often around here
They shouldn’t be that expensive unless handmade. The two I recommend are $30-40 but I’m not sure how much it would cost for you to import
@@DanSantanaBows Yea iam gonna keep looking for them, and will also check the import fees, thanks for the video! great content
🙂❤
You may need to get into spoke shaves buddy.
I have several. They’re useful but I have no passion for a spokeshave. I put card scrapers within arms reach, drawknives a step away and spokeshaves 2
The Oxford draw knives r unavailable in my location im in California does anyone know a draw knife of equal value that does
Try searching for both oxhead and ofhenkopf. I’m butchering the german spelling. Anyway it’s sold under multiple brands
Hi where can i bay Draw knives-.Sekund hand.?
yes but also see the video description for the one I recommend
Mini bow?
Como se chama essa ferramenta
Drawknife. Nao se em portuguese
That Mora isn’t a draw knife. It’s used to split smaller sticks from a log, like if you would if starting a fire
I agree, which is why I said “drawknife” in scare quotes. It is unfortunately marketed as a “wood splitting drawknife” though I don’t think it’s any good at either function
S’good
The bevel should be down when drawing. He's using it upside down. There would be no reason to have a bevel if it is up. If it's harder to cut with the bevel up it's because the bevel over time has gotten to be too steep because of repeated sharpening. The bevel should be about 22 degrees and any restoration should include adjustment of the bevel. Most drawknives, especially longer one, have the handles bent so that they are parallel with the bevel . That allows the pull to be straight back when the bevel meets the wood.
Some knives are made for bevel up and some are made for bevel down. I have several of each. See my comments about this topic in the video
Most bowyers in the US work with knives bevel down, especially those that mostly use osage. Internationally and with white woods that is not so true
Bevel down gives more of a scraping action and the ability to carve a tighter radius. Bevel up gives more of a slicing action that makes carving more effortless but has a higher risk of tearout. It’s a purely technical choice, neither one is wrong
@@DanSantanaBows You haven't demonstrated any competence beyond the simplest of cuts, and your explanations make no sense so I think I'll just leave it at that.
I purchased a set of two cherries chisels. I am extremely disappointed in their Finnish, their ability to hold an edge, and their Susprctablity to rusting.
So on many levels: they are overrated and they SUCK.
l have since bought a set of Sandvick chisels and I couldn't be more pleased. They sharpen easily, they hold their edge, they stay where you put them, they are not rolling about the bench, or worse, they are ergonomically made where they will lie flat without the handle getting in the way. More research is required before you go around endorsing companies.
I recommend a particular drawknife they make, not the brand. I don’t endorse any brands across the board. The two cherries drawknife I have has excellent edge retention and geometry. If you watch the video, I make a counter recommendation which is extremely similar and half the price
I do put in good words about morakniv and narex making generally high value products, but I also think they make lousy drawknives.
NO, NO, and NO! Spoke shaves and not draw knives!!!!
Spokeshaves are just drawknives with training wheels 😂
I do have several and they’re useful enough. Not my favorite tool, I just use them when I have to
I think your bevels are to flat. Never had a problem when working with a razor sharp edge. That would be a big pian in the butt, working with a semi sharp drawknife...