Ep. 096 - 22 ARC | NEW CARTRIDGE |
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- čas přidán 24. 10. 2023
- On this episode, Seth is joined in the studio by Assistant Director of Engineering, Joe Thielen, Marketing Director, Neil Davies, and Senior Ballistician, Jayden Quinlan. We are excited to announce the all new 22 Advanced Rifle Cartridge (ARC). The guys take a technical dive into how and why the cartridge was developed, along with what factory ammo offerings are available. Whether you’re a target shooter or a varmint hunter, in a bolt gun or a gas gun, the 22 ARC is a fantastic choice. Enjoy the show!
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Initial 22 ARC builders can be found here with more to come: www.hornady.com/22arc#!/
America needs a 257prc… or 25prc. Please hornady
You should be ashamed introducing new products in the worst economic crisis of our lifetimes, while the world is at the brink of WW3, as well as broken supply chains and inflated raw material costs. You can't keep the stuff you already make stocked up on the shelves at a fair price, yet you introduce another new cartridge? Wtf is wrong with y'all? It's not just y'all either, as it seems the entire world has gone crazy and everyone is colluding to destroy everything that made America and just life in general, great. Disgraceful is putting it mildly.
The 1in7 twist makes a big difference in lethality over a 1in10 or 1in13 regardless of bullet weight.
If it's so good like you claim then I presume that the military and police will be the first users of this caliber.. & If they are not going to use it then why is that?
Learned my lesson with the 6 ARC. No 7 PRC and no 22 ARC until I see consistent well stocked shelves in all the ammo offerings. I will wait years if I have to. Years. So show me.
Correct
Get it strait from Hornady
@@patcoder7308at $4/round? Who has that kind of money?
I completely agree, show me staying power first. Although, I jumped on the 6arc bandwagon fairly early. I handload so I just reformed 6.5 grendel brass.
There is ammo commonly available, you might have to use a Google search to find it. You may not see ammo on shelves at gun stores and box shelves right now. My local gun store owner said he's not buying any more ammo until he sells out of what he has now, and he's not going to mark it down unless he absolutely has to. With the state of the economy, the gun community as a whole isn't buying ammunition like it was a year ago. You can buy 6mm arc right now. It's probably not ever going to be a $.40/ round cartridge. Most ammo is not going back to the price it was precovid
I would love to see Hornady start a primer manufacturing line! Then lets talk!
They do, but it kind of blew up in their faces recently
Agreed
@@thatguyoverthere2288They do have a habit of doing that, don't they! 😅😮
@@thatguyoverthere2288I missed that. What happened with thier primer goof?
@@ericsfishingadventures4433 me too
I mean let’s focus on making what we already have better, and more plentiful. We have enough cartridges, but we don’t have enough of them. If I could dream up a new product from Hornady it would be a “Super Match” line of brass designed too compete with Lapua, Peterson and Alpha in terms of quality. Bring me that.
Think outside the box.
@@skinnypedaldown5044exactly
Why is this the first thing that people say when literally anything new comes out?
Man, it’s just capitalism. With America’s obsession with the AR15 platform in a world where so much game is too far or too big for a 223 it makes sense that people will want to capitalise on that gap in a otherwise flooded market.
Agreed.
We need more of what we have already at a good price. I love new cartridges and efficiency, but not in these times.
I came here ro say just that
Well said. Hornaday get you head out of your ass
R&D is cheaper than raw material these days. What a world
Yup !
It’s not gonna happen call about money
Can't find any LEVERevolution ammo anywhere in any caliber for sale, along with various other caliber cartridges you used to produce, but, here we are looking at yet another new caliber. These new calibers look great and I am seriously considering at least two of them, but it's getting very hard to justify/rationalize jumping into something new when I cannot even get my hands on a reliable supply of other Common caliber ammo that Hornady used to produce. (Intentionally skipping the reloading component availability issue that normally is a part of this discussion). $3 to $4 PER cartridge for a box of ammo being flipped on Gunbroker because that is the only place it can be found is not going to cut it.
For real Bro. , when a simple rewind of time shows us that we bought into the hype of a new product only to be let down a few years later by the very companies that produced those products ,man it's upsetting . Take the .224 Valkyrie and how kick ass it is , but due to a mistake in some of the chamber reamers , many people were turned off and gave up on the cartridge. Most of the barrel maker's wouldn't admit their mistake and let the consumers know of the issue until the Valkyrie was destroyed. So sad .
If you are struggling to find LEVERevolution ammunition you may need to look in different places. I've personally seen tons of it in most cartridges they offer at various midwest small town gun shops lately going for a pretty standard market price.
Seth. Every podcast I listen to I just cannot get over how good of a interviewer you are. How you manage the flow of the conversation. You make all of your guests feel important and included. You don't throw any cheap shots. You have your own wealth of knowledge. Just phenomenal I don't think they could have picked anyone better to host their podcast.
I agree Seth is great
I would also like to see more development of the 8.6 BLACKOUT. Seeing the performance from 0 to 300 yrds it’s doing with a minimal selection of ammo is amazing. The combo of a subsonic heavy bullet and super fast twist rate is doing amazing things.
I’m gonna deviate and say I’m glad y’all continue to push the envelope especially considering you’re one of the only manufacturers that was able to keep bullets and brass on the shelf the last 3 years.
Thank you!
@@hornadyno not thank you. Fill up the 6mm arc and listen to the people.
@@mariomoso105947:36 - 48:02. I heard it said (or it's been alleged) that the 6mm ARC function very differently in "gas guns" versus bolt actions, mainly in respect to pressure, which is why at least one rifle manufacturer declined on chambering 6mm ARC in their bolt action lines. 6mm ARC is likely the best designed cartridge for AR-15 platform but 22 ARC sounds like it was engineered for both Bolt Action and AR-15 rifles without "oversights nor drawbacks". Personally, I'm sticking with 6.5 Grendel if price per round aren't noticeably lower than 6.5 Grendel or if ammo manufacturers outside of Hornady isn't producing ammunition for any said cartridge. I've found no noticeable accuracy differences in 6.5 Grendel between my AR-15 and bolt actions.
@@OC_Loftonmy 6 arc bolt gun functions great. I have an 18” proof barrel ar and 18” proof barrel bolt gun. Both are great I can just get 100+ fps more out of the same bullet in my bolt gun with out pressure signs.
@@varmint_king Understood. One of the companies that worked with Hornady in providing test rifles for 6mm ARC cartridge development has yet to chamber their bolt action line in 6mm ARC and may never. I was looking forward to having a 6mm ARC bolt action that accepts Stanag/AR-Platform magazines.
To add to your Business Class philosophy with “deliver it” we’re seeing a huge lack of 6mm ARC being delivered. How will those of us who want to try it know that you’ll actually support it? We can’t get anywhere close to the volume we need for what we already have.
This yes
6 ARC is the reason I'm taking up reloading. I LOVE my 6 ARC gas gun, but it's so expensive to shoot that I somewhat regret not just getting a 6.5 grendel, I'd end up reloading anyway, but it sucks not having cheap FMJ plinking rounds available just so I could shoot the 6ARC more like I could have done with the 6.5. As well as stocking up without breaking the bank
This conveyer belt of new this and new that and every one of these new cartridges results in empty shelves at the store, I have to thank you guys though. for the reality check on promises not delivered as I was waiting reluctantly for this 6ARC I took my old Winchester Trapper out for this past season and dropped my PB deer. It reminded me of the joy of hunting and not just shooting. I had almost forgot how much fun stalking was in hunting. Owning the latest greatest guns and gadgets actually seems to be a modern man made distraction from the enjoyment of this great sport called hunting. I see why so many people take up archery.
Hmmmmmm, point well taken. I hadn't even realized it, but even in my own comment on this video, your comment made me realize I was putting more of an emphasis on the gear and the ballistics instead the hunt itself. Which is actually out of character for myself, as I have always prioritized my enjoyment of the hunt over gear. I think your comment serves as a good reminder, even to myself, to not get so caught up with this new round (or any new round for that matter). I'm still very much "wait and see" about it, and admittedly, it will be interesting to see more detailed ballistics for .22 ARC, but ultimately, the enjoyment really is in the stalking and hunting itself, not just the gear. As I have always said to other people: "make it a hunt, not a shoot." Thanks for that reminder.
If you think archery isn't just as bad I think again every year 10 new bows drop and 20 new broadheads it's the exact same game. About the time you find what you like it is out of stock or discontinued time to start over
Amen! Forty years ago when I became obsessed with hunting coyotes in the hard canyons of central Nebraska, I was carrying my Grandfather-in-law’s Savage 22 hi-power. I didn’t kill as many as I would have liked with that gun, but even with $50-$100 coyotes (1980) I still had a blast just walking those hills for hours…..hunting. If a coyote “won” because of the gun’s lack of “efficiency”, it didn’t take away one gram of excitement. I eventually bought a Ruger M77 22-250 (for $220 at Gibsons in North Platte) that helped the kill percentage, but did nothing to increase the hunting experience. Sometimes it’s best just to grab your “good enough” rifle that will make an ethical kill and get yourself outdoors.
I absolutely love these group chat type podcasts. The knowledge, recounting of historical events in product development, and the genuine interest and love of the industry by the chat participants makes this a real joy to watch/listen. Thank you all.
What you need to develop is your supply chain. So the we don’t have to suffer through another ammo shortage!
They say they’re making more ammo… Yeah right what they’re doing is making half the ammo at 3 time the price you can see that by their astronomical profits Hornaday should start paying attention!!!! all the comments here more than half of them are not good
So glad we finally found a .22 caliber, high velocity cartridge that fits in an AR. Truly revolutionary.
And here I thought the 6mm Arc was silly.
That squirrel doesn’t have a chance now!
I just want more 6arc at a lower price. Availability of the ammo and brass needs to be a priority or else it dies out and we are left with what we always had with no real innovation.
Exactly.
The launch window was awful, just a few months later came the pandemic, then massive supply chain issues -- not their fault, but here they are launching 22ARC (shouldn't it really be 5.5ARC?). Finish launching 6mm ARC first. I notice Hornady helped out Federal by making 30 Super Carry ammo (that sits on shelves), but Federal never released a 6mm ARC load.
Unpopular as it may be, I find it interesting that Hornady is taking credit for the decades of development of the 6PPC and 22PPC done by competition shooters around the world. Hornady did nothing more than standardize the specifications for these two amazing cartridges, and here they are talking about it as though they created it from scratch.
Did they need standardization? Yes. Am I going to build a 6ARC because of that standardization? Also yes. Do I want them to standardize .20PPC next? Yes please!
I support this lineup and the great cartridges they are, but credit needs to be given where it's due!
Every development throughout the history of mankind has been precipitated by work preceding it by countless people.
The hard part tends to not be coming up with ideas, but packaging them and getting consumers to otherwise adopt it, otherwise anyone else would have done it by new.
I want to see 22 Creed and 25 Creed standardized and on shelves
Just put it ammo that we already have!
The Valkyrie has a solid foot hold.
But the manufacturing companies don't want to support any rounds they didn't develop themselves.
It's pure corporate bullshit!
@@mountainman997322 Creedmoor is they just released is along with the 22ARC
Baloney.@@tphpodcast
I bought into a new cartridge Hornady put out. It was a team up between Hornady and Marlin. It was the .450 Marlin. I bought the lever action rifle within a year (Marlin 1895M) and I was not disappointed. It absolutely slammed Whitetail, wild hogs. It was the only rifle that has been chambered in that round that I have found anyway. That combination of rifle and cartridge was everything the 45-70 should be…it was everything that was promised.
It was a large game dropping machine. I am now disappointed in the availability of the ammo. I will wait to see how popular this cartridge becomes, before I buy in.
Hornady does some incredible things..but buying a new rifle to use what you all do…only to have the ammo hard or impossible to find in ten or twenty years is not an option that works for me.
Keep up the good work.
Seems cool, I might check it out in 5-10 years when ammo is more available. Can't get 6 ARC on the shelves in the midsouth as it is now, had to order it from Arizona. Not even gonna think about the 7 PRC.
Correct
I stopped at 2 local gun stores today, Cal Ranch and Sportsman's Warehouse. Both had multiple Hornady loads of 6mm ARC and 6.5 Grendel.
@@LRRPFco52 no
Why does Hornady start a new cartridge every other month while there are ammo shortages?
Someone has to innovate
So Honady can get a bit of shared $$$ from gun manufacturers for producing a demand for new chambered rifles. This gives the benefit of shared promotion, for one...
Every Jane and Joe with too much money falling out of their pockets will "have to have" one.
@@judgegarry. So they are catering to the rich and wealthy rather than the majority of the American people. Is this what you’re saying? Because if it is it certainly seems to be correct by the looks of things.
@@Redpitbull44 So Hornady creates a new round, then fails to manufacture and supply it. Great business model. ..
I absolutely Love the concepts of 6ARC and 22ARC. 6ARC came out at the exact time I started planning a 6.5 grendel build. I was just thinking "I wish the 6.5 grendel used a 6mm bullet. I guess I'll have to settle." Then the 6ARC came out. I was over joyed but then when the ammo came out I noticed they only had the heavy stuff. I thought " I wish they had a lighter 60ish grain bullet for varmints" Now I am watching this and am introduced to your ELD-VT line. I am estatic. I love hornady so much. I told a cooworker that If Hornday could get a military contract for the 22ARC or 6ARC and mass produce the ammo, I bet that in 20 years half of the AR-15s produced will be in 6ARC or 22ARC.
I'm leaning more towards 6Max. Solves the glaring issues with 6arc.
If there were any ammo available, or if any of the ammo availability was under $2/round.
Why on earth would the military swap all their rifles to 22 arc
They already picked their new one. .277 sig. They won't be changing now.
@@WayStedYoucause its better than 5.56 , more accurate and increases the lethality range…
Love seeing our local ammo manufacturer making strides in the industry!
Rather see them make ammo for what all ready out there
Keep up the great work guys! Innovation in cartridges is amazing and you guys are trailblazers for the commercial market. Thank you!
You bet!
Ok so at the risk of asking a dumb question, why is an "AR / Gas Gun" cartridge developed and tested using a 24" barrel, what is the "MOST COMMON" length of barrel found on this type of gun??? I'm feeling pretty safe in assuming its NOT 24"
I was thinking about that. It's just to get the stated velocity too sell. I'm sure 16 18 20 will be the length barrels for the gas guns. The 24s will be bolt guns. Marketing gimmick. That's all I could think of.
It was probably not a 24 gas gun tested. He probably said it wrong.
I've never even seen a 24 in ar 15
@@rustyyates421 I don't think I have either. I know 24" AR barrels are out there depending on caliber. 6.5 Creedmoor drops velocity fast when it goes below 22".
Most of the ar 15s I see on the shelf are 16 inch barrel and 20 in barrels. I've never seen a 24 in barrel ar 15 or ar 10
And still, you can’t find so many of the existing cartridges. I wrote to Hornady about several, such as the 17 WSM. Hornady wrote back that they were a small manufacturer and “we’re doing the best that we can”. When I see these new calibers being manufactured and nothing happening with some of the older ones it really says something about Hornady as a company. Small manufacturer? Bravo Sierra
man you guys are killing it....i want all the arcs and prc's.
Wow 22-250 in a ar platform, iv dreamed of tbat so now the .22 arc in that type of firearm ill buy one soon as i see the ammo well stocked on store shelves.
Outstanding to see the innovation from Hornady and listening to the community's needs. Having personally seen the performance of this cartridge already.... id be honored to work with Hornady on this one
The hell with innovation
And there not listening and not giving the people what they want.
We don't need new cartridges. Until there no lack of ammo for the old cartridges.
They could be licensing it from RW. The 224AR looks like Hornady's new appropriation.
@tbjtbj4786 I understand where your coming from, but their is also a massive reloading side to this. Hornady list load data for consumers like us. I've made videos demonstrating the performance of this cartridge with handloads both in a bolt gun and AR15.
Factory ammo may be harder to find as many are buying it up right away, but I strongly recommend getting into reloading. Hornady will have load data and the same bullets available for reloading so you can get this ammo down pipe without relying on finding factory ammo
Love my 22 DPC. Wonder how close the specs are.
@@tbjtbj4786correct
Now, if we could just get the brass without going through the headaches that we have, like getting 6mm ARC brass, that would be awesome.
I just purchased 500 pcs of 6 arc from Starline; it was backordered when I bought it but it shipped about 6weeks later. I think it’s still in stock
This is great!
The idea of the 22 ARC sounds great. The 22-250 hits a brick wall at 500 yards. I would love to get a barrel in 22 ARC. I'm already set on 6.5 Grendel rifles so it would just be a barrel change. But the grail quest to get 22 ARC ammo, or god forbid unprimed brass, just kills it for me. 6mm ARC brass is still theoretical going on 3 years now. Hornady has done much, much better than every other manufacturer over the last several years to keep most of their products on the shelves. I have lost all interest in Sierra and Nosler bullets due to their chronic unavailability since 2020. And in the 300 PRC and 6mm ARC cartridges for the same reason. I love Hornady but component and ammo availability is my driving concern for any new cartridge. Overload us with brass and ammo availability and this cartidge will take off.
This is like an AM radio infomercial. "I tried every [insert product here] on the market, but none of them met my expectations"
Absolutely love this concept and will definitely be getting one when I'm able. Another home run in my book. A 6 ARC and 7 PRC are on my wishlist as well 🤣
Go for it!
@@hornadyhow about supplying cartridges for whats out there before making new ones?
@@tbjtbj4786 Just so we’re clear, your asking the company to spend their limited manufacturing capacity on cartridges that have significant competition, instead of leveraging their current competitive advantage.
@tbjtbj4786 there is plenty everywhere online.
I got the 6.5prc waypoint runnin the 95gr v max 3625fps…7prc..22arc..and the big .300prc I’d love to test and ultimately take a whitetail with for comparison…love hornady and have many bullets in several cartridges…xtp..sst…eldx..m…v max..ol Ky boy raised in these mountains with a rifle…
It would be nice if you guys had laid over some figures and/or charts/ diagrams while describing these values.
Good information to have for sure, but that’s not really the direction or point of these podcasts. Don’t forget they made the round, it’s better for the testing you see to be independent so you can confirm that it’s not being manipulated by the people trying to sell you the stuff.
I love the 6arc!!! This is gonna be awesome!!!!
If they ever finish launch of 6mm ARC and make some ammo.
How about get standard ammo on the shelves at a decent price. I dont even shoot much anymore because i refuse to pay the outrageous prices
Couldn’t someone who already has a custom 22-250 with faster twist run the new bullet and take advantage of both worlds the higher powered capacity and new slippery bullet
Yes, but not in the AR-15, unless you got one of the very rare Olympic Arms .22-250 AR-15s.
This videocame up in my feed, and at first I was really excited, then I was like "Wait, is this an old April fools video?" Then I checked the release date, and thought "oh yeah!!!"
It's hilarious how every time Hornady introduces a cartridge, the hype is so high that every other cartridge just doesn't compare. It's also funny how well they scew numbers of other cartridges to make theirs shine so bright. It seems that a few of their numbers are a bit off when it comes to other cartridges in this family. I'm not saying they are, but it's awful hard believing this hype over an unknown cartridge that hasn't even hit the market yet. And, as others have mentioned, without a readily supply of ammo, it's just another 6.8 Western waiting to die. I'll just stick with my Valkyrie if I want to shoot heavy match .224 caliber bullets. At least I can get ammo for it and not break the bank.
Speaking of a cartridge that's not supported in the market. I have a Valk and it's been relegated to a handloaders cartridge.
I have no problems finding factory Valkyrie ammo in stores or online. The only reason I can see for reloading is for specific bullets not loaded by current manufacturers.@@epfd217
The 250.imp smokes them all, my 40x shoots 4000+ 5shot groups in the 1s and has killed more coyotes than parvo"
@@davefritts6003which is just essentially the 22 Creedmoor but way more brass work.
Wow, versatile cartridge
I want to work there. Love this technology
The 5.6×39mm, also known in the U.S. as .220 Russian, is a cartridge developed in 1961...
I'm extremely skeptical. I consider myself very lucky to have never built or purchased an alternative AR cartridge because of the problems each one has brought to the table, 6mm ARC included. As we speak right now, a small group of people are looking to dethrone the 6mm arc with the 6mm MAX. These new cartridges that go nowhere or remain expensive are exhausting.
@hornaday When will there be more availability for the 6 mm arc?it's a really nice round to shot for long range.
We can't even get brass and primers as it is for the stuff we already have... unless you go flat out custom, you can't find the grendel bolt face for bolt actions....
Looks and sounds great. Did I miss something about the powders used in this one ? How versatile is it for handloaders using different kinds of powders ?
We're incredibly excited for the release of this round! Going to great alongside all of our 6 ARCs.
As a gun store owner in North Las Vegas, NV, I have to say this sounds a lot like S&W putting out all the hype on the 30 super carry right in the middle of the last pandemic when other ammo was scarce. This is just wrong for the Consumer at this time no matter the excuse or hype. I have had 2, 6mm ARC rifles on the wall for over a year and nobody cared about them, I couldn’t even get ammo for them for months. I gave one away for a police raffle earlier this year and am getting ready to give the other one away this December. Please focus on keeping up with product that is already out there I’m so sick of companies trying to be the one putting out the so called latest and greatest and leave everyone hanging. I will not be investing in any new cartridges unless a customer specifically is looking for it (probably not) for my business. 224 Valkyrie no one cares about either.
@@americanpatriot8786 @americanpatriot8786 My experience has been the complete inverse. Not only have I sold quite a few 6 ARC rifles, particularly this hunting season, I've done everything I could to ensure we had 6 ARC in stock at all times, including around 100K rounds at the moment. But we were also early adopters and have put a significant amount of effort to educate our customer base about the round and its benefits.
There was obviously a lul, caused by the pandemic and possibly one of the greatest supply chain disruptions we've ever seen, during a huge spike in demand for ammunition, but I'm not going to lay that at Hornady's feet. With all the ammunition companies I deal with, they seemed to have navigate 2020-2023 better than most.
Honestly, I agree with you on several points. I do believe in educating the customer on the benefits of a particular cartridge and that is something we train constantly on in our store. But when the base is not having it, it speaks for itself. Now having said that, I will say your customer base may not mind but on my end I am relaying the customer complaints and you can’t argue with the customer and the needs they look for. The market just needs to stabilize a bit on the cartridges that are currently in production. I specifically mentioned S&W’s Super Carry cartridge which, to date ,seems to have fallen off the wayside and all the hype has gone away. These cartridges do have a place and, Hornady is an absolute innovator, and has done a great job keeping up with manufacturing even in leaner times, but seriously let’s not start rocking the boat for the meager production supplies that are not so readily available is my and most of our customer bases concerns. This just keeps prices high overall.
I fully agree with the sentiments on adding more & more new calibers. I know locally 6 ARC was on the shelf because when the panic cleaned out ammo stocks, it was sitting by itself. So being naturally curious I had to see what cartridge nobody wanted. Eventually it sold.
I will have to say that Hornady did a FAR better job trying to put reloading bullets on shelves, even at the worst of the hysteria, than any other brand
Being heavily in the gun hobby for over 50 years I've seen a lot of hype and then "POOF" vaporware. Be it guns, gear or ammo. So I've practiced caution assisted by wise guidance from my long time fav gunshop owner. The only oddball caliber I have is 25 WSSM and that's only because it fits on top an AR15 receiver. Well, there's the 25-223 wildcat but that's not a hindrance as long as you have 223 cases.
Sierra bullets seems to have gone out of business. Leupold still can't get its Custom Shop open, its last excuse was Covid regulations in Oregon which is mindboggling. Wonder who's running the shows in Oregon??
Matching a 250 while being in a AR. Well done. Been surprised it hasnt been commercial8zed already. We need more 6ARC options though first. By no means is 6arc plentiful. Ammo, Brass, would really like mote access for my needs now. factory 90gr eld-x offering would be nice in 6arc.
Another cartridge that's unavailable to find. I agree with the person that commented "let's try to make what we already have available". I built a 6.5 Grendel & if I didn't handload/reload ammo would be very hard & expensive to find.
Curious how traditional 68 and 75 bthp match bullets perform in the 22 ARC
This is why hornady is the best ammo company in the world, they don’t rest on there lore’s they keep introducing new and improved cartridges year after year, while the other American companies are to busy saling out to other country’s,
Seriously, another cartridge? I bought into 6mm ARC, I have 2 rifles in 6mm ARC, but no ammo. It's almost impossible to find. When I do find it, it's as much as Weatherby ammo was in 2019. So much for the military ever adopting it, which was heavily implied in your launch marketing. I have 2 rifles in 6.5 Grendel - a lot of overlap with 6mm ARC, but same mags, good availability at okay price when I bought them, now nothing. Almost no 6.5 Grendel available anywhere. One guy last year was selling loosies from a partial box at $4/round on gunbroker. Hornady only offers 32 H&R Magnum and 327 Fed Mag with 80gr bullets, except it isn't really available at all, and costs more than 6mm ARC. Speer and Federal both make loads firing 100gr bullets. There are easily many times more guns in 32H&R & 327, than 30 Super Carry, but there is plenty of that on the shelves. You don't make anything in 38 Super (again far more popular than 30SC), and your only 357 Sig loads are 135gr and 147gr, nothing in 124/125gr or 115gr. Again, way more guns out there in 357 Sig than there will ever be in 30SC.
It's almost like ammo manufacturers are colluding, or, as we heard today about another major manufacturer, building up inventory produced as lower cost, driving up the costs with rumors of a shortage, and then selling at a higher margin. I don't actually believe that, but I do believe there is collusion between gun makers and ammo companies to drive demand by developing and promoting new cartridges of negligible advantage at the expense of cartridges that already exists.
If there really is a supply limitation and Hornady is at mass capacity, then don't be like Federal and introduce another cartridge. If you must do something "new," release a 38 Super Critical Defense, a 115gr and 124/125gr 357 Sig, a 90-105gr H&R Magnum and 327 Fed Mag, or just announce you'll actually make ammo for more than half your existing catalog.
I'm an old fart, and not a lot of new products convince me they are needed. I have to hand it to Hornady looking at the ARC and PRC line of cartridges I'm impressed. Anyone can make a fast cartridge, but the balance of performance to powder you get with your PRC and ARC line is impressive.
Heck yeah
I was expecting this. But it happened quicker then I thought it would.
Any feeding issues in an auto loader, special requirements for a magazine, and is brass available at this time? Tend to lose some out of an AR.
I hope this cartridge gets popular. I'd like to see it make its way into canada. I've always liked to 223 but wanted better performance. This cartridge seems to be the ticket.
Was really hoping for SAAMI 25 Creedmoor this year. Seems lie the “perfect” balance.
There is no balance cause there are very few .25 cal bullets. The market at large doesn't support the .25 cal. Just look at barrels and bullets.
@@epfd217 ah I disagree there are enough of the right projectiles available in quarter bore to make the 25 creed interesting and I agree that it might be the perfect caliber for the case capacity and design of the modified 30tc case.
I have yet to pull the trigger on the 6ARC because you can not get ammo, or brass in stock. How long before it actually produce stuff.
Never
Been a valkyrie guy. Gonna build one to run Nebraska sportsman series next year.
This is awesome I've been waiting on this since I got my 6 ARC(favorite gun in the safe)
Jayden lightly touched on it. You can't neck down 6arc or 6.5 Grendel to 22arc??????? what about necking up to 6 ARC or Grendel from 22 ARC???
This is the round I've been looking for or the 6BR. This is it, though.
Waste a time unless u can fill shelf's with ammo and brass , how long did pl wait for stand alone brass ?
I love that you guys make these, and that there is a market for it, but I'll probably stick to 5.56 Nato, 243 Winchester, 270 Remington, 7 Rem Mag, 308 Winchester, etc. for the various calibers. I may end up with a 6.5 Creedmoor, because it may be the most prevalent .264 cartridge now. For me rifles are for about survival and war. Maybe if I had more money to play with, I'd indulge in these optimized and accurized cartridges. I'm not a hater. Like I said, I'm glad more people are getting into this stuff and that it is successful.
Small projectile fat case severe case shoulder angle. Every varmint hunter loves something around 22 caliber. Sold my 220 swift when I bought my 204. Swift had a terrible reputation as a throat burner.( Underserved with new metalurgy and modern powders) loved my 22-250 couldn't buy ammo for whatever reasons or components to reload. Same problem with 204 ammo components. Parker Ackley changed the shoulder angle on existing rounds and dubbed them " Ackley Improved" he also blew allot of perfectly good rifles into chunks mixing his home brew binary and trianary powders. Guess my point is we really don't need this new and improved 22 Hornady. Please keep us in supply's for the calibers we already own.
Please correct me if I'm wrong, but Hornady's whole M.O. seems to be to design cartridges that achieve respectable but still somewhat modest velocities with VERY high BC bullets and let efficiency do the job that raw power used to do.
Like you've already mentioned early in the podcast, the .22 nosler is the king of speed in AR-compatible .224 caliber cartridges, but it can't use long high BC bullets and still fit in an AR. So with something like the Nosler youre starting out blistering fast, but losing your speed pretty quickly.
I honestly haven't looked up velocity or BC numbers at all for your new 22ARC or the new ELD-VT, but if i had to hazard a guess I'd say its a 62gr bullet (which i have heard already) with a BC approaching .4 (G1) and starting iut at probably 2800+fps which i imagine would hold its velocity pretty well.
As someone who doesn't have a dedicated varmint rifle, I have been looking to get something for smaller game, and I had previously been leaning toward getting something chambered in .22-250. However, up until the announcement of .22 ARC, I had also been considering .22 Creedmoor.
It'll be interesting to see how the ballistics compare between .22 ARC and .22 Creed, but my sneaking suspicion is that .22 Creed is more of a barrel burner, and from everything that has been discussed and hinted at in this video, it seems like .22 ARC is less prone to burning out barrels. That's an important criteria for me, and will likely be the determining factor for which one I ultimately go with. But I'm also interested to see how .22 ARC (or .22 Creed for that matter) manages with not destroying pelts as well.
Initially anyway, it sounds like .22 ARC really seems to fit the bill for all my wants and needs or a great varmint cartridge, while also being capable of whitetail duty, which is another selling point. If everything mentioned in this video is true, the .22 ARC just seems like it might be the better balanced cartridge overall. I can't wait for the official ballistics to come out for it.
Thank you for bring up Critical Defense….. why do those not expand in ballistics gel or 1 and 5 gallon jugs of water ? And the gel was 3 different mixes and densities soft to max ? I’m not knocking Hornady but that’s why I started carrying another defensive load in my EDC !!
I have been waiting on a 22 Grendel of some sort for years now
When the nosler and valkerie came out all my friends asked what I thought and I just told them to wait for a version of a 22 Grendel
I've been waiting too, I have a 220 swift and other 22 cals and always said " if they don't have a 22grendel in the next few years I'm going to make one myself" lol
@@dontbetreadin4777look up 220 soviet
@hornady which silencers have you found efficient in the testing and development of the 22 ARC? Standard .30 cal silencers?
Seth, you are probably THE top marketing guy in the industry. I love listening to you guys, and even your marketing genius has not been able to sell me on this one. It is about the same yawn factor I had for 7PRC. I get it, everyone is out to recreate the "magic" of 22-250. This, just like other wonder 22s, does not offer that much more than the .223.
I love how you said "who hunts with a 24" barrel", then go right into what it does out of a 24" barrel! Let's compare this new wonder against the .223, both 18" or 20" barrels, both with the same bullets.
I am looking forward to trying out the ELD-VTs in both .22 and .243. Keep up the good work and supports the calibers you have already introduced.
The difference is 22 arc can shoot longer higher bc bullets that 223 cant. While also adding 2-300 fps velocity advantage. More accurate and more lethal.
Just about pulled the trigger on a 6ARC......now you have me back to thinking.... well done Hornady well done.
Great podcast yet again. Exciting education
Thanks Bud!
These loads are great if you roll your own while still having a standard caliber upper backup
Agree. They are like having the classic 64-1/2 Mustang in the garage for Sunday drives but Monday morning you fire up the good old Chevy Scottsdale square body!
I just got a 22-250 but I may have to switch up to a 22 ARC if Tikka releases a model chambered in it.
would LOVE to see charts on the hornady website comparing the 22ARC to the 22-250 like you did with the 6ARC and 308 and 223
I'm still waiting for 6mm ARC brass to be available. Still cannot find that stuff. Hopefully when this line gets pushed out, the 6 ARC brass will become more available along with the 22 ARC components.
Maybe the should finish the launch of 6mm ARC before launching a new cartridge they lack the capacity to produce.
Starline is starting to push out a bunch of it, and more companies besides Hornady are making 6mm ARC cartridges. It's finally starting to branch out
Was about to build a 22 Nosler but was dissatisfied with options for Brass. Definitely waiting for an arc instead
I can understand why it would be a good choice for an AR style. In today's high cost lower availability it sounds good.
Unfortunately, where I live, you cannot use centerfire at night. 8(... What can we do to get you guys to still make the base brass though for some of these new cartridges. The PRS seems to take ALL the .375 Ruger brass and it'd sure be nice to have access to some of that. It's never in stock. Same with the ARC, now you cannot find your Grendel brass. Kind of sad.
I'd really love to see a loading with the 80gr. Eldx
Thanks, Guys!
I had the same problem with 224 valkyrie. I was never able to get anything above 80 grains to shoot straight at any decent velocity. Made a 77gr tmk load that is a laser but never got that heavier bullet accuracy and velocity that was supposedly its claim to fame.
Huge 6.5 Grendel and 6mm ARC fan, so 22 ARC is very cool. Been checking SAAMI's website the past couple days but can't find 22 ARC. Is the SAAMI print available?
What are the reasons that the 22arc and 6 arc are not made with a rebated rim, ie. 350 legend parent case? Would this not allow higher preasure given you can run a full strength bolt in an ar15? It would also make the conversion cheaper as it then only requires a barrel.
It seems like a better option but I'm unfamiliar with what draw backs may come with this.
I would like to see a video on this rifle so I can see just how good it really does ? Because I have the 22 Hornet and I love it and what is the biggest thing that makes the 22 ARC BETTER ??
If yall had to redesign 556 but to be as modern as possible, and be outstanding for military, le, hunting, personal protection, match, and target applications, how would yall do it?
I’m curious how well this new 62ELD-VT will work in a 1:8 twist 22 Creedmoor!
Are barrel manufacturers doing an option of a type 1 or type 2 bolt? Are Grendel magazines used, or do you have to 22ARC magazines?
Am i getting this right? To het the full potential of this round I'll have to shoot only proprietary VT bullets?
I am going to have to get one of these rifles.....
The 22-250 is the lords cartridge!!!
I will need one of these soon. Any news on who will be making uppers? Thanks for the Podcast... fun, interesting and exciting.
Cheers,
Richard
Utah
If you find one let me know. They will be few and far between or quite the opposite, the market will be flooded with them but the stores won’t even have a spot on the shelf for ammo. to feed them.
More new rounds?
How about getting cought up on the rounds we all ready have and need ammo for?
9x39 next? Maybe using a standard 0.355" projectile, subs and supers
Please do a little something for the 22 WMR cartridge and projectile.
The start of this podcast reminded me sooo much of the SNL Schweaty Balls skit
When do you plan to release 22 ARC dies and reloading data?
You finally did it, holy crap
When will this be available? I haven’t found any manufacturers that are building it yet?
All based off 6.5 Grendel , Great for hunting thats what it was designed for with better punch too than 6 arc and 22 arc. I will stay with my 6.5 Grendel it keeps food on table and dont need another round to keep up with, Ammo getting to expensive and its not coming down. But for those thats on the fence its your choice good luck !
Why not focus on increasing your production capacity?
We don’t want new products we want to be able to purchase the existing ones. To be able to do that we need to find them on the shelves…
Count me and brother get it on the shelf let's go