Why You Need to Watch Out for Shady Musicians
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- čas přidán 23. 06. 2024
- Don't get scammed by shady musicians! Watch this video to learn why you need to watch out for them in the music industry. Protect yourself and your music career!
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This is one of the reasons I quit the industry. So many flaky people, back stabbers, and bad actors. It's sickening.
🙏 don’t give up 🔥🚬🐨 we need more brothers like you ☝️
A G R E E D.
I fixed this by giving people a breakdown of the performance fee vs. rehearsal fees in my rider. (Yes, I charge rehearsal fees!) It gets me around the people who try to get me to commit to an honorarium, THEN start trying to schedule all these "added" rehearsals!
Because some people don't want to pay deposits, I also charge the non-refundable variety. It eliminates the people who aren't about business!
You are an intelligent musician.... I charge for rehearsals just in case if some one flips out. Time is a virtue.
Rehearsals require more work than the actual gig. Why would ANYONE rehearse for free?
@ScratchySlide:
Precisely! I ask up front for a rehearsal schedule, and factor that work into my overall fee. It's really akin to the pay schedule associated with union scale.
@@ScratchySlideI believe some people have the hobby musician mentality, that they’re still kids trying to get noticed. The rehearsal is “bonding time” to get to the level where they might get noticed on a gig. Even though they’re way past that, some people stay in that mental state when it comes to music and other art businesses.
The moment I got my mechanics ticket everyone started showing up at my place on Saturday wanting their cars fixed for free.
That's fucked up. I've always paid for work done for my car even if they were family.
That guy burned bridges with a whole band which means it will be multiplied by a factor of 10. As the saying goes, "Do a good job they tell 5 people, do a bad job they tell 10"
Nah, people desperate. He’ll get work
That's the thing about the pool of musicians. As much as we all might complain about working a 9-5, there is a lack of "Straining out" of the flaky ones compared to a corporate job. That unfortunately leaves situations like this.
And this is why " managers ,agents, contracts , entertainment lawyers," exist...
salute..👊🏼
We used to have functioning "Musician's Unions", that you paid dues, had monthly meetings & gigs were posted daily. In the '70s @ N.Y.C. I was a member of 'Local 802'. If you played "Union Rooms" you were paid "Union Scale", no problems. So many 'Clubs' have no affiliation with any Unions. In the '80s we used beepers & would hang in a bar or club waiting for the beeper to send a phone #. In the '90s beepers had messages on them & cell phones led into the 21st century. Technology changes, musical styles change, but "bad faith behavior" among musicians, bandleaders, producers, studio owners & club owners has led the "Music Business" less rewarding for all.
I quit a band BECAUSE they didn't want to rehearse. I get not needing a rehearsal if you're familiar with the songs and the other musicians, but still.
It's a different thing. The two big mistakes the singer made in this case was:
1. He/she didn't mention the rehearsals until after the musicians were booked. The rehearsals are a part of the job and the time spent on them has to be included in the agreement right from the start.
2. He/she came to the rehearsals unprepared. I think we all know how frustrating it is when one member of a work groups hasn't done their preparations properly and everybody else have to wait for them to catch up. It's ten times as bad an extremely unprofessional when that person is the one who's supposed to be the leader of the group.
This why I quit the music industry back in the late 90s. Imagine how even worse it was back then. At least there's email, text and what not. Back then it was only phone numbers. Couldn't make ends meet, late rent, selling gear just to float another month. Bailed LA and had to move back in with mom in San Jose Ca. Shameful but I was always one paycheck away from being homeless.
I had a pastor text me two hours before service and said “service cancelled for the summer”
Really digging your channel, looking good, here’s to growth and prosperity!
This happen to me on many occassions...Its ashame there are so many musicians who have some of the most horrible personalities, very selfish & dont care about anyone but themselves....smh!!
i tell my wife that, for the most part, musicians are the worst because of these very things...
I’ve had similar experiences.
If you’re around long enough, you’re bound to run into people like that.
It’s one of the reasons I mainly do solo gigs.
I just don’t want to deal with the frustration
yup...
Wow! This is what I gotta look 4ward to? That was messed up ALL THE WAY AROUND! Thanks for the video! I will sure keep an eye for that BS! Right on point!!🤨🎶🎸👍🏾
I got up with some musicians and we decided to do a New Year’s Eve gig with other Christian bands. Our lead guitarist had a guitar solo to initiate the intro of our first song. Long story short, he did a no show and we all found out he played for another band that very night. It felt like he kicked us all in the teeth. I have to forgive but I can’t forget.
Guy I knew asked me to be a part of a project, he had a gig lined up. I traveled an hour each way to rehearsal for three weeks. Two of the other people in the band didn’t bother to practice the material. The gig Was an hour away. A few days before the gig, the guy tells me the pay was going to be about $90 and he was going to 1099 me. I was out! I don’t mind helping someone out, but I will not be taken advantage of!
great post, I love band stories. best regards.
Only 2 hours, I was playing with a band where there were vocalist auditioning. Three hours of of not knowing lyrics and out of tune singing. Then one of the actual singers came for rehearsal. There were other circumstances, but that was the last straw for me. I wished them the best and quit that band.
This was just on my mind this morning ‼️ some people ain’t who you think they are and it’s always some other musician that smiles in your face. I either keep my distance or have people put down deposits.
Your rehearsal story reminds of an EP I did with a band just before covid. We were an alt-country quartet. Upright bass (me), drums, lead electric, then our singer on rhythm. It was his band. He was sick. He could barely sing. The plan was we'd just do everything live. Then later we'd go back and redo each part completely or overdub where needed. And, layer some other instruments. Sure. Well, the singer kept stopping to couch and hack. His singing was shit, but saying how great he was doing considering everything. We said we'd reschedule, but nope. His playing was okay, except for the stopping/starting. After 3 hours we got 8 songs done and called it a day. A week later I went back to lay down my bass with just the lead guitarist (also the producer, though I wish he wasn't, but that's another story - just cause you can play doesn't mean you can mix music). He told me the drummer was gone. He wasn't coming back, but didn't say why. On all but 2 songs his drum parts were on, so we dumped those 2 songs. I redid 2 complete songs, then changed some things on the other two for some overdubs. I was done. While I was there my guitarist told me that the rhythm guitar and singing was beyond garbage, and played it for me in pro-tools. The drummer and I had a great connection, so we were locked in. But, our singer wasn't, more than I realized. That's why 2 drum parts were trash, and likely why the drummer was gone, he was changing time constantly to keep up (and I'd been locked into him so I felt something was wrong, but didn't realize it). That was disappointing. Had our singer just stepped away we might have had 8 songs not 6. Anyways, the singer came back to redo everything. Still sick. I heard he spent 5 hours doing 6 songs and they were all garbage. I heard the vocals and they were worse. Then he came back again for another recording session and finally got it. ... I left soon after. We had a gig on the schedule. I did it and walked. After the 'seriousness' taken with recording I decided my definition of "seriousness" vs my singer was not on the same page.
There are some people in the local scene here that have been known to be shady in ways similar to the story you shared here. I avoid them! I’ve also been messed around by venues changing their mind at the last minute…and clueless club/restaurant owners/managers that don’t understand music and don’t know what they want.
I had one worse. Was asked to become a part of an already existing band, attended 3 rehearsals, everyone was comfortable with how the outcome should turn out, come 10 minutes before the performance the lead singer not only shows up with minutes to spare, but didn't want to perform that night. As his boys went to the lobby to beg for him to perform, I'd already had a young lady from the area set to perform provided the lead singer pulled this stunt, because I'd witnessed him doing it to that same band months prior.
As soon as word got to the lead singer that there was a suitable replacement ready to go, he had a sudden change of mind, and performed with the band.
A few days after the performance, the band let me go due to, "causing unneeded friction within the band while not being a fully vested member of the band".
They did you a favor!! 🏃🏽♀️
That is wack. You were providing a plan B and trying to save them from the mess he was causing. They will learn one day. You was not the problem.
@@thajust -
To be fair, my involvement with the band was not all that innocent. I'd agreed to help them out because they were local fan favorite, it gave me a chance to do some behind the scenes recon on just how organized they were once I'd fond steady music for my band, and the young lady was had recently moved to the area, and it would've allowed me to see her talent in a live situation.
Had the same thing happened to me once. 24 hours before the gig....got a call. After I spent a week working on the set list. It has not happened again since.
I agree, rehearsals are a waste of time unless the songs will be altered from the original covers.
Terence, I am so sorry this happened to you. That musician is absolutely unprofessional! Were he here in Japan and tried to pull that stunt, his career would be over! Guaranteed! NO ONE would want to work with him. His name would forever be mud!
I like rehearsing when I have special gigs or new arrangements (jazz) with scores, that my musicians must read. I also feel more comfortable going into a concert having rehearsed new songs. I need to know of the key is right for mer whether the song sits right for me! I can rehearse alone while playing the piano, but it’s so much different if you have a quintet playing behind you.
If the rehearsals are long and complicated, I will always pay my musicians. Whenever I rehearse with my regular musicians, I ALWAYS lay out a spread of food and drinks, and as I mentioned, I sometimes pay them.
I would NEVER cancel on them. If ever the show gets cancelled, (for example, because of a typhoon or during Covid), the musicians ALWAYS get paid!
I have found that over the years, if you treat your musicians well and with respect, the6 will perform excellently and even go out on a limb for you.
Definitely put that musician’s name on a black list!
Here we go!
About a month ago a music minister from a local church posted that he needed a bassist for 2 services that coming Sunday with a rehearsal that was taking place that evening. I reached out and after going over a few details we confirmed the gig. He explained that the rehearsal location and exact time wasn’t confirmed and that he would get back to me later that day when he found out. Never heard back from him. I had moved things around in my schedule to accommodate his rehearsal. I did text him in regards but never got a reply. From what I understand, he’s done this before to other musicians in town.
You got a point bro I know the feeling I was with a band I had go pick up band members that wasn't my responsibility we didn't agree or anything he always volunteers me go get them an for gigs I got fed uo with the shit an moved on I'm not a taxi driver
Sounds like Lauren Hill, Anyone???, Anyone???, Bueller???, Bueller???
That’s why I love doing original bands …. We can weed those people out fast …in original band there is no money so you are there because you want to be
The way I do it, I go through the song and/or lyrics to at least be somewhat familiar on my own time before the rehearsal. Then if everyone does that it goes a lot better and we just smooth out the rough spots and tweak the nuances
Cue the stagehands... yes someone should write a thesis on this. Ans a subset about drummers. (😂) GREAT VID
Rehearsal time is not practice time. Buddy showing up not knowing the lyrics and having no idea about arrangements he wants is already not cool. After trashing that gig and cutting off contact, I assume he's not getting crickets back.
There is a great Noah Guthrie lyric "what we do is who we are". Some people prove who they are this way and they are not worth the effort.
I'm sorry to hear what happened 😞 once bitten twice shy,never again.
I think the tendency today is to think everyone has the same level of developmental psychological integration. Sad fact is a lot of people did not have very good parenting and they are basically operating at the highest level that they can. It's like ethics doesn't really have much to do with it. Not sure if you're still a Christian but you talked about your experience in that industry. A lot of it today accounts for that those of us who were brought up with those values often are encountering people that are nowhere near having those values or those learning experiences. It doesn't mean that Christians are that much better but often the environment that going to church on Sunday created in the culture was I think a lot higher.
Sorry to hear about this. I've been there as well, rehersal is about coming prepared with the material and NOT learning it during the rehersal. At that point you're wasting everyone's time and showing a lack of accounatbility.
I agree that a lot of things need to be standardized such as protocols and etiquette to not only help commitments run smoother, but also to weed out the unprofessionals or, at least, those that aren't quite at the pro working level yet. This also makes it easier to nix unprofessional CLIENTS and maintain/develop a solid working reputation, which is absolutely everything.
So true.
new subscriber from Australia ☝️🔭🐥 stay cool bro 🙏
Thank you for speaking truth to power. I see this in church as well. Just lazy with learning lyrics and the correct cadence of the melody.
Yeah I need to know everything. How many rehearsals, how many hours the rehearsals are, how many hours I’m need the day of the gig ( IE we don’t play til 9pm but sound check at 2pm type of stuff). Then I give my rate and contract it all out, cancelation clauses and all, even for the smaller gigs. I can be friendly and flexible but what I don’t like to be, is frustrated.
Snob musicians can be quite unreliable while quite sensitive" emotionally speaking. Lots of lips pursed while on lookout for money! Have Plan Bs and Cs non musical speaking! Cowards is an understatement!
Keep in mind as professionals that love the craft of creating and performing there are those who truly love and respect the art....You dont have to be a great musician nor a great singer what is needed is great COMPATIBLITY for the art ....and thats when ...................The Magic Happens !
This is so like what I go through all the time players showing up not knowing the songs only wanting to do what they know then the show happens and it’s a complete utter train wreck this is the Pennsylvania musicians garbage every town is like your home town only 2 hours or more away so extremely discouraging to the point I don’t really care to play and I’ve had this across the country as well,so sad it’s like chasing the Elucid unicorn only you can see but never catch really makes you rethink about career choices
Been there. During the holidays as well. Never worked with that person again.
Practice makes perfect enemies. The only time I need to see you is at the gig when we play and then I pay. Practice on your own time.
"rehearsals" means you show up knowing your part, and then address any issues that come up while playing the music "together"- that's it...i completely agree that "most" rehearsals are a waste of time...if you're all on the same page regarding the keys, arrangements, etc, it should no problem for seasoned musicians to just show up and play the music "at" the gig...
Sax player here. Haven’t had this happen to me but I’ve seen other musicians undercut so they can get gig at a venue which I hate and it only hurts other musicians.
I saw that too many times. .sad
~ 🌺
I had a singer do some sh*t similar to that.. I was at my MOTHER'S hospital bedside shedding and charting - IN THE HOSPITAL
You just received a subscriber
Wish this video was created sooner!
How do you perform any gig without rehearing first, to make sure everyone is tight. Without rehearsing you wouldn't have known the singer didn't know the lyrics. But this was why I stopped trying to work within bands, and just set out to becoming a songwriter and producer of making music to hopefully sale to established artists. Practice makes perfect! Before recording any track I'm going to play the instrument part several times, and after I practice the part, break for a while or 'til the next day and then come back and perform with better results. Even a professional rehearses before recording a song or performing before live audiences; James Brown stop his band during a live show, took them off stage to re-rehearse the show, then brought them back onstage to do the concert. So, it's important to rehearse, or you'll end up making yourself (and everyone else with you) look like a fool. Peace
Do you know if this person actually DID this gig with the new band?
I had the same issues as a producer and Mastering engineer, I had several singers ( well at least they said they were singers ) after hearing a short snippet they wanted to sing on my tracks, so I invited them over to see what they got and to rehearse to know and understand thier flow well all they did was hum ,,some oohh aahhh and that was that, waste of time; other occasions, I was told my music was to complex and they like simple beats lol .. I find it strange that nowadays I see more so called artist on this selfish " look at me" trend and that seem to be the narritive for being an artist instead for the love of the art.
Watch Out in Any business!
That person needs to practice at home before rehearsing. ✌️♥️
~ 🌺
I learned an acronym from some Marines when I was in the military: Delta Whiskey Echo - DWE - it stands for "Dick With Ears". Sounds like it describes that 'musician' perfectly.
It’s funny, some of the flakes are commenting on the other flakes, thinking that they’re never the problem. You know who you are
"Thinking that they're never the problem," but also, "You know who you are." 😂Peak passive shit talking
this is why i switched 80% from rock to EDM, working with bands is too unpredictable.
Amateurs don't the difference between "practice" and "rehearsal".
"Amateur" just means they perform for payment outside of cash. The attitude between them and a professional are solely based on the individuals.
This feels like Lauren Hill energy…
We see this all the time. What's funny to me is that vocalists are the worst of the bunch. Sure, there are some lazy musicians that bluff their way through gigs or come out like it's solo time and forget the foundation of the music, but that can (sometimes) get masked and overlooked. The vocalist is the front person and the focal point of the audience in general. So when they don't learn the lyrics, it's a lot harder to mask that - especially for a popular song where everyone in the audience knows the lyrics. Because the vocalist is the one on the billboard, they feel like it's ok, or they can get away with making up words. But don't let the band mess up! And just as bad - when you're given a set list to learn, come to the rehearsal prepared with all these songs you had to learn for this one vocalist, just to find out they're dropping two or three of them. Why? Because THEY never learned the words of the songs themselves (even though they picked them)!!! And of course, they don't care that your time is valuable, and you've got other songs to learn for other artists. So much Shade in this business unfortunately...
I left music school about 10 years ago and was still playing with students in the area. One guy turned down my gig because he was offered to play with an older cat. Dude did a rehearsal and the older cat not only kicked him off the gig, but also “offered” him lessons. Guy was livid and teared him a new one. The younger guy ended up moving back to his home town to get gigs and the older cat has been all but exiled from the gigging community. Shady mfers out there.
Do you have a video when you talk about people using stems and click tracks and fake instruments on top of live instruments during worship service everything is so mechanical and so robotic
Write charts, buy charts, rehearse less.
Everyone has stories like this if they are musician but very few have that many stories if they're not a musician it seems to me & that is why when AI finally rolls into town then 10 years later such videos as this will be of minor historical interest on how much BS Was tolerated in the past while, by then, the same so-called musicians who were so flaky on a regular basis will be telling everyone how AI took their careers and crushed their dreams
I agree with most if not all of the comments. I would like to add that by turning down 4 other opportunities for this guy, may potentially have burned bridges for those that you have turned down. The ones that were turned down may have future events or opportunities and think, nah Imma pass on calling you because he turned us down before. See this was very inconsiderate of that person.
I always ask about the guy setting up/leading the gig- “are they a real musician, or just a karaoke type?” Tends to answer if they have skin in the game sometimes lol.
Sorry to hear that happened to you too.
Simply, common decency UNCOMMON...
Front and Center Bruce Lee Tee-Shirt!?....I am trying to figure its relative on context about your Subject, Theme or Purpose of this CZcams Broadcast?...LoL x7
F,n hillarious
I love this thank you for telling the story! There’s a bass player I work with a lot who has what I think is the best approach. If he agrees to a Tuesday night 6:30 -8:30 rehearsal he shows up having learned all the material perfectly, ready to play at 6:30. At 8:30 he packs up and leaves. In between, he’ll give you his best, and be patient if someone isn’t prepared. But when rehearsal is over, he’s out.
This artist did you a favor by calling another band. He’ll learn. Or not. Ya know?
buuuuuuuuddddyy.... I have been there
Musicians need to unionize or the exploitation of labor will just keep getting worse.
At least 50 per cent seem to be arses.... ive had to sack loads.... yet always did my best for them.... that's the world
The best and common thing are the professional guys never come prepared tp practice. They are listening while people are arriving. Lots have day jobs fam etc yet are prepared.
Getting fellow players gigs then find they are bad mouthing you to get your venues for themselves.lol
Done
I hear you. I bet this hoser hired (with no money) a bunch of wannabes more clueless than himself so he never has to rise.
Sadly people live in fantasy land so often now they make-believe that they are amazeballz pro-ful when in reality they are totally clueless. Whenever they run into actual professionals (or anyone better than them) they blame their laziness on the better people, often by casting the better people as the clueless ones. Even going so far as to make public announcements about how stupid the better person is compared to their amazingness. This is the single biggest reason that there are so many people "stuck" in those (cesspit) songwriter & producer groups & forums because they are too afraid to step up.
:-)
The only thing that ruins great music is musicians.
Bruce Lee. 😎
Dude sounds like an amateur. You may have dodged a bullet.
Wrong! That's what rehearsals are for! Even Micchael Jackson's musician rehearse, famous bands rehearse before a concert tour. Rehearse...rehearse...unless you want to sound crapy just because of one musician. Your arguments doesn't make sense.
&... get gig insurance.