The 7 Stages Of Being A Professional Musician
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- čas přidán 3. 06. 2024
- Feel free to watch at 2x speed. Or 0.5x speed if you want to pretend I'm drunk. JOIN US: / bennjordan
#musicindustry #musicbusiness #musicproduction
Timespamts
0:00 Intro
2:04 Stage I
3:46 Stage II
5:08 Stage III
7:42 Stage IV
10:07 Stage V
12:19 Stage VI
14:25 Stage VII - Hudba
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I laughed SO hard at the "crash and burn" section. I don't think you've ever really grown as a creative person (in ANY field) until you experience the "I might be a genius" to "I might be mentally disabled" transition. And it tends to happen pretty quickly.
It happens to me every other day, I'll have a great practice session on my guitar then the next day I forget what hands are.
I took 9 years off of my musical journey, and now I'm jumping back in, feeling like I'm on a hobby-mirror of Level 2 moving to Level 3. I'm beginning to realize how little I've learned in my first 6 years of guitar, and how much I've forgotten in the 9 years since. I said to myself 'I've been playing for x years' til it got to 10 and I realized I haven't been playing at all. I always dreaded theory, and gravitated to party tricks, technique practice, and tabs of my favorite songs - but now its time to buckle down, and my Level 2 complex has been making me think "once I learn theory, I can be a jam god", when in reality, Level 3 lurked around the corner and told me how little I actually know.
or if you keep panning between the 2
I'm pretty sure that's called the Dunning-Krueger effect and I have certainly experienced it. It's quite sobering.
Damn. I'm about to turn 25, I have a bachelor's in Music Composition and when you answered the question "what will you do if it doesn't work out?" "I guess I'll just die" is basically what I would answer too...
I hope you gonna do well... For me music was just a hobby... For last 15 years.
Few weeks ago I quit my job to finish as much of the projects I have on hold since then. Don't know how will end up. Im thinking about making video log when time comes to do it 😊
I hold a MFA in composition - music is not my job.
Making music doesn’t have to be for money or for popularity. I feel like the terms amateur and hobbyist are used in a derogatory way far to often. Just because you make music for you, doesn’t mean you aren’t a musician.
I’m turning 30 next month, and have toured the us multiple times and done things i never imagined, but also still am not supporting myself full time with music. My plan if this shit doesn’t work out is just that lol… here’s hoping 🤞🏼🤞🏼
I'm 50 and the most important thing in making music is do what you want .
Realize that everyone who is good & known for what they do were doing it for 10 years before anyone knew who they were. That should tell you what to do with the next decade.
I'll bet $100 that I'm the least competitive musician. There's no way any musician is less competitive than me. I challenge you to prove you're less competitive but I bet I'll win.
Challenge not accepted
@@StephenOrion ooooo you're good
@@StephenOrion Just checked out your music, it's nice!
@@spadassin5725 Thank you. Releasing a lot more this year after taking time off to learn and grow.
I make music for like 15 years, haven't released single track... Say wut?!
Friendly Amendment from a 57 year old who is rediscovering musical joy: Stage 8 is where the greater influence of your endeavors (both musical and social) comes back home to you to remind you of your further relevance in the larger cultural context, and where your freedom to experiment is not only highest, but your feedback of "social draw" from your life is immediate and supported in a much more authentic way. It is the actual "Fulcrum of Parasociality" and is the most balanced of your journey thus far - neither self-deluded nor clouded by the delusions of others regarding your notoriety.
"You kids get off my lawn!" gets replaced by "Thank you for enjoying my lawn, come back anytime so I can tell you my story about it, and you can tell me YOUR story about it!" :)
Bravo
Thank you for this.
Surprised, (not surprised) that Mr. Know it all, did not respond to this amazingly prescient honest and touching comment. Not too mention it gives so much more hope than where video ended, he should take his blinders off but perhaps stage 8 eludes some
@@tatnallkennedy - Thank you for your sentiments, they are appreciated. In Benn's defense it is incredibly difficult for anyone with a substantial number of followers (and the added stress of public exposure of one's possible mistakes) to respond to anything posted in CZcams commentary. I've heard other CZcamsrs say that they hardly ever reply at all because of how psychologically crushing dealing with general public cynicism can be. I feel it myself, and I hardly make any waves at all with my current status in Parasociality.
Besides, I'm grateful that he shares a large amount of his knowledge and effort on a public venue such as this. He hardly has been paid well for doing so, meaning it's only "for exposure" that he is posting here, and still at a cost of considerable time to do the editing necessary. If you consider Public Replies added to that already large effort and it's clear why so few do.
I hope to be like you when I'm your age, that sounds very fulfilling
Can't wait for your reality/existentialism series!
Damn right
I'd say a lot of hobbyist musicians just live that Stage VII life from the get.
So true
I'm 47 and for the most part this was spot on. Thanks for the laughter 😁
The other day i checked who are the artists I listened to the most on Spotify over a span of more than 5 years. You are 2nd place, that is crazy consistent. and I'm not even 30 years old. You are a big inspiration for many producers of my age.
how do you do that? I'd love to see mine.
@@akashnba03 obscurify can show this stuff obscurifymusic.com/login (go to the All time tab when you've linked up to it)
I'd more so call myself a music professional than a professional musician. I'm 56 now and feeling more creative than ever, doing so many interesting projects I'd never imagined and enjoying the benefits of the many years of wonderful experiences. My music career has not gone according to the plan of my teenage self, but my wife and I do make a decent living creating art together (she's a choreographer and visual artist). I wouldn't say I've been through all your 7 stages or in that order, every "music career" is different. I'm just grateful to be having so much fun and feeling so inspired much of the time. My advice? Surround yourself with beautiful artists and collaborators and you can't go wrong. You might not get rich and famous, but you'll be happy! Thanks as always for the great subjects and thoughtful approach.
Love this 🙏🏻🙏🏻🙏🏻
Bravo.
This really brought me comfort, us younger musicians need more messages like this.
❤❤❤
ngl, 11:10 that advice is SO simple, and it really is, but I really needed to hear it and I'm really grateful I found your channel from Venus Theory. Sir, you have restored the creative juices I thought I had tragically lost with your funny words
This video is going to become required viewing for all of my students who are planning careers in music. Brilliantly executed as is your usual standard!
If there is something that "the internet" has taught me over the years, is that anything can happen at any given time. Of course, it's pretty improbable that your career will turn around again, and you see a sudden "rise to fame", but it's not impossible... if you are pretty talented, but people simply don't know yet to fully appreciate the scope and depth of what you compose, the rise can still be something in your future. Especially to someone that composes what you compose... ;) I sure hope you keep doing what you do best, and that you can get through life without caring too much about money. Surely, one day people will say "Remember The Flashbulb? That guy was awesome... only now we fully understand the depth of what he did..." :) best of luck to you, Benn
I was never able to break out of the "local musician" part of my "career" and while I've managed to squeeze out a few albums that I'm proud of (and some that I am working on now) It has always been an uphill battle. I'm 39 now and I'm hoping to, at this point, sell enough albums to keep my hobby funded. My job and personal life was always such a hinderance to my studio time and i sometimes regret getting a full time job instead of dedicating myself more fully to music. But here I am. I came so close to submitting something for your contest but I just couldn't find the time to get it finished. I look forward to your future videos and to dropping the link to my album for the discord folks to pick apart in the future!!!
I earned 28p (about 35c) on spotify last month. I’ve been playing for about 35 years.
Fantastic video Benn. I feel like you're elegantly speaking to multiple audiences here, those considering or already on this journey, but this also helps bring some clarity (dare I say closure?) to those of us that maybe followed other paths in life and always wondered, "what if?". Such a profound bit of content man. Please know that you are proving to be every bit as relevant in my middle-aged life as you were back in college when I used to park the car out in some green space somewhere, throw on some Pale Blue Dot, and look to the stars for the meaning of life. Now it's just taken a different, evolved form.
Wonderful! Thank you.
“The chances of you being the most determined or talented part-time or hobbyist musician becoming successful is extremely slim.
The chances of an all-in professional musician becoming successful is inevitable.
You’re not betting on fate, you’re just wrestling with time now.”
Priceless. Thanks again Benn.
Those are also the seven stages of being a professional software engineer.
A friend of mine's in his 70s. He was in Dr. Hook, which should give you a pretty good idea of when in his life he became irrelevant as a professional musician. For the last 35 years he's been working in a music store, selling guitars, getting paid modestly, and enjoying the security of having employer-provided health insurance. He makes music every day. (He commutes by bus, and sits in the back of the bus playing his guitar into his phone.) Every so often he gigs. He doesn't have the slightest hint of ambition. He's in his 70s, for Christ's sake. I know few people who are as happy with their lives as he is.
Thank you for this Benn. I found your channel when I needed it the most. I will repay this in one way or another in near future. Cheers
Oh my gosh. This is the best video I’ve seen on CZcams. Thank you Benn!
hey Benn, this just may be my favorite video of yours
Great video! Thank you for making this.
I’m a little late to your channel, but i really appreciate the reality check you incur on here so often. Its really great to hear someone successful, yet not famous in the classical sense or even having a charting song, talk about this kind of stuff. Its really valuable for us that are trying to eke out an existence in the difficult music industry of today
This is the first time I've had to pause a video halfway through and share it with my musical colleagues as fast as possible. Absolutely brilliantly put. Thanks for keeping it real and hilarious! Amazed at how relatable your experience is. More power to you, thank you so much for this
Always appreciate your insight and candor, Benn!
the content of your videos has always been substantive and engaging, thank you for this!!!
This is so well written and produced. Thank you so much for your wisdom and the expert arrangement of concept. Godspeed!
This is really cool, love to see things like this. Helps me prepare myself for the road ahead
This is one of your best videos yet. Thank you
Ben, your videos are so good. There's much to be learned. Thanks for posting this
thank you for everything you do to help musicians that look up to you. this is one of your most reassuring videos by far hahah. after watching had to put on The Fear of Vision, cry, and think about how im exactly where i need to be with my career and that all the ups and downs are just a part of the journey
This is a really, really good one. Thank you Benn!
Thanks Benn. You truly are one of the best creators of this platform I could find. V.
Apsolutely fantastic, thanks Benn!
Such a brilliant and needed piece of wisdom. You are a good human being. I follow you because of that, the music is just an added bonus.
That was extremely honest and heartfelt. Thank you for being vulnerable and sharing your wisdom. You’ve made a really big impact in the musical world, and I hope that you reflect on your career in a positive way even if there are ups and downs.
wow, fantastic. thank you for posting this
As always, Waaaaaaaaaaaaay deeper and well thought-out than I expected. Dude, you're the king of underselling. I don't know how often I pass on one of your videos because the title sounds so meh, but then when I do watch one of those videos, I immediately after go and watch at least one more
Really enjoyed that, man. Thanks for sharing.
The flowers for Algernon analogy is brilliant! I needed this video, excellent timing :)
Wow. Probably the most insightful musical broadcast I've ever seen since ... age 14 (when there were none and I was saving to by a Boss Dr 110 😎). I discovered you looking for a new reverb pedal , but I've since enjoyed you output and found that you're just a beautiful human being along the way. kudos for bringing this into the world ☺️🙏
Thank you so much for posting this. I've never been very prolific but in my specific niche I'm somewhere between step 5 and 6. It was nice to hear everything you said and gave me a little calm and appreciation for the process and others lives.
Hi Benn, thanks for a great video. I just graduated with degrees in saxophone and composition and wanting to make that next step and move from my small state of Idaho. Moving to a city is somewhat intimidating but that humbling stage you talked about made that leap seem more doable. Thanks for the great videos- you got a new patron.
Thank you so much for this! So insightful and delightful.
This video really inspired me to finish my debut album. I've been working on it so long that any attempt at releasing it makes me fear that it will be beneath me in 6 months based on the knowledge and skill I've gained. But this made me realize that this part of my career is one of the best parts and the creative energy flowing through me will overcome any technical shortcomings. Thanks again.
What great insight you offer. This is the stuff that helps other profession musicians mitigate these stages and likely move through them easier, and possibly faster. I never made it to professional level and bailed for the common job and family, and pretty much left music behind all together. Although I did gig nearly every weekend for 12 years and brushed lightly with some of your stage insights.
nice video Benn!! it's really helpful :)
great video,, the last graph joke is brill! thanks from Ireland
I've heard it said many times in my days..So I say it here "Nothing is as refreshing as the truth"...Thank you Ben!!
awesome observations in this video. you really narrowed it down to the main points, thank you!
Honest, refreshing and real! Thank you for this video :)
Awesome video Ben! I think this will give a lot of people clarity. Also I laughed a lot at the graph near the end lol
I want to be a career musician because contrary to all the other jobs I've tried so far, it is the one thing I feel I could do indefinitely, that will always keep me invested, thinking forwards and working hard, that will challenge me constantly and encourage me to surpass my limits. Ever since I was young I drew a lot of purpose from music, for so long I dismissed it as a dream and sort of just let it rot in the back of my mind while I did other things... That hurt me more than I could have imagined, I thought it would go away eventually but it was always there it would just sort of linger around me in a taunting manner.
Recent events have brought me to a certain realization, that I cannot just let this pass me by. I'm only just starting to learn truly how hard this is going to be, that I currently have almost no idea what I'm doing and how much I still have to learn as well as what it's going to cost me, but that said (and call this ignorance possibly) I really don't care if It ends up costing me everything, because I'll hate myself if I don't put absolutely everything I have into it. And even if down the road I fail and have to go back to the regular work I usually do, I'd probably just save up for a while and then start all over again, repeating that cycle until I finally succeed or my life ends, simply because it won't stop calling to me.
I'm not confident enough yet to say I'm a professional musician, far from it. I can't get anything I've made so far to sound how I imagined it (hell, some of it I can't even stop from clipping all over the place lmao) and I am often frustrated and disappointed with the results of the many hours it takes me to write and produce a single piece of music, I also discovered I'm not as good at playing guitar as I previously thought! But in spite of it all, the little time I've spent doing this so far has been more rewarding, educational and invigorating to me than all the other working years of my life combined.
This video is inspirational. I've been struggling to figure out how I want to enter the music industry because I've been training vigorously since childhood, and music feels like all I have to offer. I'm 25 and I feel like I am not even at Stage 1 (or maybe I feel like I skipped straight to Stage 3), and I don't know how I should rationalize it or even think about moving forward without fearing that I'll become homeless. The biggest issue about starting off is not feeling the instant feedback loop that you're making the right decision. At any rate, I thank you for sharing your perspective on matter. Hearing that I will inevitably grow and perhaps eventually succeed will help me a lot mentally/emotionally during my journey.
Excellent, transparent, and honest words Benn! Much appreciated. I am a musician who has went through many stages as well, as many others my age have. In fact, the most success I had in the music business was with a group based out of Chicago called Blackmaker. Hard rock and southern influenced rock band. We had many albums, mostly self released or on independent labels. The unfortunate demise of our group was getting signed by a Major. An album that never saw the light of day. That was our ceiling, it crashed, and we became disheartened and eventually after legal battles, getting out of contracts, etc. called it a day. With that being said, that experience taught me alot about how to conduct myself in the business world today, and the types of offers and situations to look out for or to embrace. I still take chances of course, haha, but my decisions are a little more focused. I too am a multi-instrumentalist, electronica artist, pop, hiphop, producer, mix and mastering engineer. I am still building my business this many years later. Basically had to start back from the ground floor at the age of 40. I now have a family, and my priorities have changed. I have offers to do some road work, but am much more choosing when I accept. I do most of my work from home, most of my clients are from every city but my own. As the city I live in doesn't foster much of a scene in my field. I just primarily wanted to thank you for your honesty and hard earned wisdom. I always tune in to your videos, as they are very informative. Keep doing you. 👍
Bruv, thank you for the reminders.
This is; Good as Gold.
Thank You for your music and videos!
This is awesome, thank you for making this
you are a musical genius. love your music so much
This is important and meaningful work, thank you Ben
O M G SLAP THAT BASS . I m in love with this channel. Just Subscribed 🙏
This video is one of the most beneficial I've ever watched. Thank you.
Very interesting take, thank you Benn,
This video felt like a therapy session for me. I needed to hear some of these things. I believe you were spot on with everything you said. I’m definitely somewhere in between 6 and 7 right now.
I discovered your music about half a year before you released Arboreal iirc - so I was 12 at the time - and I've always consistently listened to everything you released since then. I guess that makes you the artist I've been into for the longest. Not even my interest in the beatles lasted that long. Hearing this reflection on your carrer makes me nostalgic, not in the sense that "The Flashbulb is someone I used to listen to" as you mention, but nostalgic because I associate different parts of your discography with different moments of my life. I can think of quite a few amusing life experiences that, one way or another, only happened because of your music - and that's with me living here in South America, not having any chance of attending any of your concerts.
Fantastic video! Well said.
Thank you for sharing your experiences, it was incredibly reassuring to hear it laid out like this :)
This is very relatable! Thank you!
Thank you. This is an outstanding video with the right balance of humour and content.
When you showed the photo of Mark is the moment I realized why I even clicked on one of your videos. I lived in Humboldt for 10 years and knew the Mucca band very well. I knew I had met this guy before but I could not remember where for the life of me! Great stuff here, Benn! I remember helping Mark move all the Mucca gear into a new studio and can confirm that Mark did like giving work to musicians!
Absolutely phenomenal video dude, thanks for being so willing to share your decades of experience with the world.
🚀🚀🔥
I absolutely loved the ending of this video. I love your content, I think you’re my favorite single musician. You don’t make my favorite music all the time, I like too many different things to say that about anyone, but as a music producer, music educator, and veteran of the music industry, you are somebody I’m happy to be able to learn from. A lot of people like you may never reach out as far and spread what they have as far and then die relatively young and all we have is their music, which isn’t much other than something to enjoy, or something like a bit creative radiation from the past telling us that something was once there. I probably won’t become a professional musician. I’m autistic, so my life expectancy is low enough. Music has been the most important interest of mine throughout my entire life but I’m too poor to start and too averse to change and too bad at adapting that I don’t think that life would suit me. I will still keep it as a hobby, and try my best to stay close to music as I can despite what else I wish to do.
Fantastic insight, and a roundup & relatability to the final stage of music making with total freedom, contentment & acceptance. Music cures, music gives an escape, music gives life.
Insightful. Thx, Ben
Such a great video, and such good wisdom. Thank you!
If you're all in "You're not betting on fate you are wrestling with time." My experience in a nutshell. The truth is that most people make great music, it's whether you have the work ethic and time management skills to do all the things. Most don't.
Thanks for sharing what you've learned. This is a really beautiful video that can apply to all creative jobs.
So refreshing. Great work!
I watched first video from your channel yesterday, immediately liked it and after 3 or 4 video in a row I realized: you are The Flashbulb, who was my one of five top inspirations from 13 to 20 age. I have always wanted to write like you! And yesterday the Universe gave me a sign 😂
I'm 32 now. I am professional mixing engineer here in Russia and writing music. Thank you so much, Benn! You have made a giant influence on my music life.
this is a very honnest look into your life and i appreciate you sharing it. Namaste
This video is a checkpoint for musicians of all ages. I'll be starting stage I soon :) I hope that all of this is worth it.
This was wonderful, thanks
Thanks for sharing!
Great video. I'm 53 and have been an amateur musician all my life - and not really a professional anything either. I've done alright, but what struck me about this video was how true all the steps were for myself anyway. Nicely done.
Yo Ben I really really really love this video! thanks for the content and the vulnerability + honesty. You're an inspiring musician and content creator🙏
I hope maybe at some point you could share your experiences and your opinions on being a multifaceted musician/creative since there's more and more people doing different jobs at the same time I'm for instance being performing artist and an engineer just as an example.
Keep up the good shit!!!
this is SO good and SO true (and wise and nice). thank you mate ❤️
dude, you're ace, like a lot of snarky viewers/producers i started watching this through my own filter of BS and by the end was agreeing with every damn word. nice job!
Been, my name is Dan. I lived down the street from your grandparents on 77th. I'm so happy for you success. The earliest memory I have is going to a White Sox game with you and your mom. I pass the corner house a lot as my dad still lives there. I discovered your music recently and it is spectacular. Congratulations on all your success. I have a friend who lives in Woodstock, GA and it's a nice area. Hope you are doing well!
Love hearing your unpathetic yet personal insights!
just having gotten into music a year or two ago and wanting more than anything to become a professional musician, this video was really impactful. thank you.
Thanks for making this video Benn. It was really informative and it has made me take stock of where I am in my life currently. Since I was 14 I've dreamed of becoming a professional musician but the last couple of months I've been slowly coming to the conclusion that I don't want to become one because the idea of touring, releasing music consistently and playing shows really isn't my thing. I'll always continue to be in bands and write music but its just not for me. I'll always respect and appreciate what professional musicians do for us (the listeners) because without you artists my life and many others would be empty.
Dude, I found your videos recently and love them! Now I find out you're The Flashbulb?! Autumn Insomnia Session absolutely blew my mind when it was released. Amazingly small world!
Oh wow man that’s pretty dope that you’re a fellow Chicago born musician. I’m a 22 year old saxophonist/artist and producer from Rogers Park. I’m glad I found your channel and knowledge
Hey Ben, I picked up red extensions of me on vinyl when I was like ... 19, ish? I never did the dj thing like I had imagined, now I'm watching some production vids and see Ben Jordan in the suggestions. "Is that him?"
Your energy and thoughtful way of speaking are totally in line with that album's vibe.
Thanks man, good luck with the whole online thing!
I feel like that as a hobbyist with days-long creative outbursts and then weeks of barely touching an instrument in between, I go up and down a lowkey version of this scale every time I make a song :D
Great stuff. I watched this and subsequently listened to a couple of your albums to relax to. One was in 2014, the other 2017. ‘Nothing is real’ and ‘Piety of Ashes’. The first one I thought was pretty good, then later I thought you were indeed a ‘musical genius’ as I drifted into unconsciousness and kept waking to hearing what turns out to be Apple’s playlist of the best music similar in genre! So, after I got over the fact you were not in fact responsible for every top-ranking electronic music song in the last 20 years, I still think these are two fantastic albums. I read somewhere (Ari whatsname book) that if you really really finally come to the conclusion you can’t bring yourself to do anything else, if nothing other than say writing or making music is how you feel about spending any of your time, then become a writer or a musician.
If you really cannot bear doing anything else, it’s time to turn to the creative industries and pursue that. If on the other hand, you can tolerate doing a ‘normal’ job, you might not be ready for turning to creative writing or music. I feel this might be pretty true for myself, but maybe there are others for whom they have many avenues they could pursue successfully, and music was just one of the many talents they possess and are happy spending time doing. I did a job I grew to hate. After the last two creative routes I tried to follow failed, I finally turned to music. I would prefer to die than do the main job of work I used to, so this is not a joke that you have made, as you will know. As I explained to one of my grown offspring, I am fortunate my first name is ‘Ian’. Finally, the most headbanger name in the world has a use. I can call myself legitimately a ‘music-ian’. Frickin’ thing finally has a benefit. I feel I know what a ‘real’ musician is, and I am not that. This was an interesting review of your take on being a person professionally making music, and I thank you for opening up on this. All the best from Richard Getts.
Hey Ben - really great, very interesting. I'm assuming this has been your journey. Mine took a slightly different route (via writing) so I can relate to many points although I think I escaped some of the worst ones 😱 Love your videos. Just keep on truckin'
Good advice for any career in my opinion. Stay humble, there is always something else to learn!
So glad you brought up the slowdown of finishing songs as you go on. I remember writing multiple songs a day and being super happy with them. Now I finish songs at a snail’s pace because I don’t see a point in doing something if I’m not improving. Personal innovation gets harder and harder as time goes on.
So inspiring. Thank you
I really like your video and your perspective, its very real. I think that its uncomfortably true, being an artist cannot be fulfilling until you understand that you do it for yourself, not for being rich or famous. But that leaves a huge gap in terms of seeing others having comfortable lives, while yours can be a sort of sacrifice in the name of art. This is adressed in your video, and its the hard truth.
Haha. , thanks . I indentified with this alot. I was a bass player for many years ,still am. I didnt write ,sing or play guitar til I was 28. By the time I learned to craft decent material ,the music industry had changed beyond recognition. Ive had to learn how to just keep going because I love to do it. Im 52 now and the acceptance stage has come about. The challenges are a real lesson but the benefits emotionally of making music im happy with ,far outweigh the rest. Thanks for a great video .