When Jump Starting a Toyota Goes Very Wrong!!
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- čas přidán 1. 08. 2023
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@WrenchingWithKenny @SNAFU.performance @traditionovertrend2704 @ktmracingsisters1261 @matersworkshop6123 @MotorMouthRadio
@cruzcorp914 #wrenchingwithkenny #keepwrenching #wesselmotorworks - Auta a dopravní prostředky
Everytime you check all the fuses, they're all good, it's never the fuse. When you DONT check the fuses, and run around with your head cut off, it's a blown fuse
Yes, I have seen when you look at the fuse it is connected, but when checking with OHM meter, it is open.
@@daviddubeck2436 Or checking for 12V power and it lights up so you figure all is good. Then check with a meter to find only 6V at 1 amp. A crap connection will turn on a test light but not a pump.
Lol!!! OMG that's sooo true.
Each fuse in the car usually controls multiple things. When you're troubleshooting look at what else is on that fuse. If one thing that's on the fuse is working it's not the fuse.
Cars never originally had all this crap.
Everything becomes a fuse if you pump enough electricity through it.
😂😂😂😂
First of rule of playing with electricity, don't let the smoke out. Keep the good stuff coming Kenny.
You mean the genie
@@bryanmercado8755
He does mean "smoke."
AvE
Lol
@@f.demascio1857 Lucas Electrics Service Item 530433 😂
@@bryanmercado8755 rub the electrons the wrong way (by jumpering a car backwards) and the genie turns into an evil genie and makes random fuses pop. 😆
Reminds me of the old 50s-60s Chevrolet "fuseable links" that looked like regular wires.
My 88 F250 has those awful things.
Thanks for taking us along through this. I know it’s a royal pain to film, think and work at the same time when doing it all by yourself.
Just FYI: I created a couple fused jumper wires just for situations like this. Also have one more with a 15amp circuit breaker…
That's pretty smart!, thanks for the advice😊
Brilliant idea. 🚗
That's a good idea!
The circuit breaker is a good idea, could have used that when I was troubleshooting why the fuse for the rear wiper and power mirrors kept blowing (turned out one of the wire for the rear wiper is probably shorted to ground somewhere).
After going through a few fuses I decided to use a small lab power supply instead, since those are current limited, but that was not ideal 😅
Go to a junkyard and try to find one! My buddy owned a salvage yard and we used to go through and make up fuse packs with those plastic organizers! They never pulled any of that stuff before crushing!
The fuel pump relay you tested is for switching the fuel pump to low or high speed. When the relay is activated, a ballast resistor is added in series with the pump during low load conditions. Otherwise the normally closed contacts of the relay short across the resistor to provide full pump speed when the relay coil is unpowered.
The relay you were expecting to test is called the 'circuit open' relay or 'c/opn'. The one side of the contacts is constant battery positive, while the other is feeding the pump via the relay previously mentioned.
Well done. Love the electrical repairs. They're so much more satisfying.
Thanks for showing us and explaining how to use a test light. Nobody has ever showed me how to find the power side like you did. I will remember this
Presiding over my first new Toyota, sons. Nice to see the kind of fun to be had..thanks!
Multifuse because there is one assembly step on the line to do it, instead of 10 steps, and the fuse block will rarely fail in use on most cars. The alternator has at least 2 shorted or damaged and leaky diodes as well, you can replace with a new part, or simply take the pain of getting the back end off and replace the diode pack. Would also suggest replacing that test light with a more modern power probe, which gives you benefits of actually showing voltage on the tip, and also the ability to apply battery voltage or ground to it as well, with a self resetting PTC fuse there that will disconnect the test point for excess current flow.
couldn't agree more. Makes diags like this less difficult and often much faster.
A good point. Incandescent and LED test lights put different loads on a circuit. Using a faithful old incandescent test light can actually blow some modern electronic parts.
came to the comment section to say the same thing
The SCR in the alternator regulator diode trio was shorted out, it often happens on those oriental car brands. They get a generic size replacement battery with the connector posts on the wrong sides and think it fits without looking at the pole marks. Edit to add: Most American cars have a fuse link on the alternator to save it from cross jumping mishaps and will just roach the alternator cable.
Please don’t worry about the length of your vids. My opinion is more is better. Long time sub, watch every vid. Keep em comin.
Kinda miss doing this. Thanks for taking the time to diagnose with us.
Nice to see you back under the hood!
I always love a good whodunit!
30 minutes is a short video not a long one.
Don't be afraid of longer videos. Most people prefer them. Especially car guys (and gals).
We want the complete story! No matter how long it takes to tell.
Please don't become one of the guys that leaves some of the storylines as dead ends.
We would really appreciate follow ups on any of these cars the next time or whenever things finalize. I know you have a ton of stuff to do. Your efforts are entertaining, educational and very appreciated! The guys at the shop must be thrilled to have you back- even if it's for only another week or so.
KRK - Keep Wrenching Kenny!
What @mod_incllc3235 said 😁😁
Thanks for sharing Kenny. It was informative and nice to watch. You seem like a really chill person and made the video really easy to watch. Hope you have an awesome day!
Man, I love watchin you do diagnostics!
Just a suggestion. Add a DC amp clamp meter to your arsenal of tools. The sure do come in handy. Excellent analytical approach of troubleshooting.
And while you are at it, add *multiple* sets of fuses, so that you do not need to stick 30A in 8A slots "just for now".
@@orangmakan For real. Now those big fuses? If the local dealer or the auto parts store sells them then buy as needed--they are more expensive and there are all manner of them, so no point stocking something you may never use. But all the traditional fuses are cheap, you just need to find the 3 or 4 fuse sizes with the most common current ratings. Toyota loves their teeny tiny fuses. OH and a metal fuse puller is a smart investment. Those plastic ones turn brittle in the heat over time.
@@docferringer Every manufacturer loves their little tiny fuses these days..... My old 92 Corsica had normal automotive bus fuses, 2000 Malibu minis on some incidentals (radio, accessories, interior lights, power mirrors, etc) and normals on the important stuff, but 2008 f-150, 2007 optima, 2007 versa minis.....minis everywhere.... They cant convince me some accountant sticking their nose in engineering isnt a thing when its obvious a conversation ala 'we can save 3 cents per annum if we use these instead of those' (and presented on a graph where the y axis is undefined so they can make that upward line as big as they want) definitely happened...... That being said those freaking cartridge blocks are some BULLSHIT!!! Whats wrong with a maxi? or a breaker?! FFS that kind of stuff turns me off to brand quicker than anything else.....
And side note for the home gamers out there: there is nothing inherently wrong with using a larger fuse for testing.....provided you know what you're doing. Yes, you can have a minor short pulling a bit too much current, which pops a 10A but not a 25A, and that can melt stuff, cause a fire, etc (also why a multimeter with a decent amps range is a good idea, or the aforementioned clamp meter, though for DC Id worry about the EMI in the average vehicle screwing with it). If its a dead short, itll blow the 25A too, which is information you can use for more troubleshooting. Its when it doesnt blow you need to be on your toes. Also, NEVER EVER RUN A HOTTER FUSE THAT DESIGNED!!!!! No, not even 'its only 5A more....' THAT IS ENOUGH TO BURN YOUR CAR DOWN! Its 'okay' (for those who know what they're doing) for troubleshooting, maybe even getting back to some form of civilization. But it is never acceptable. Ever. Even doing it for testing is bad, which is why mechanics dont let other mechanics see them do it.....its embarassing.....as it should be. Take one out of something you dont need (radio, turn signals, seat heaters, rear glass heater, door chime, whatever) BUT DONT RUN MIS-SIZED FUSES!!!!! EVER!!!! When it goes bad, AND IT WILL GO BAD, we will all laugh at you. All of us. And we will tell others what you did and why it was stupid so they can laugh at you too. So dont do it. Oh, and put fuses back in the little extra space holders when you use them dammit. If there are unused and unwired slots, fill em with backups. And still keep a little yellow slide pack in the glove box. Its not hard. There is no excuse. In fact, if your next tab is an amazon order, add a pack or two to your order.....do it. Now.
One option for the 50 Amp fuse is to use a 50 Amp Mega fuse (rather than a Maxi) in a sealed Mega fuse holder. Then make up the jumper wires with crimp on eyelets which would probably be 6 AWG.
Thanks Kenny, I needed this one, good job as always trouble shooting.
Yeah ….. frame that test light and get a newer one. Thanks for everything.
Kenny, thanks, for the video. Learned alot from watching!!
Wow very low miles What a shame it was left to sit those 4.7L have been known to go over a million miles
Odds are the owner was an older person and went to a home or had a slow health decline. Their possessions usually sit untouched or cared for and slowly begin to decline. Thieves show up and start destroying as they do. Family finally decides to do something about it or the owner reaches a point where they sell off, die, etc. The growth on the paint is two years of being in the weather/ pollen / under small trees like a dogwood so likely a covid death.
Adding in you only see corrosion like that on the large aluminum parts if the vehicle spends a few months sitting over wet ground.
What bothers me the most is manufacturers reinvent the wheel. Those special fuses could have easily be incorporated separately into the fuse block, slightly larger fuse block. Now if one fuse blows. you have to replace that whole fuse module. And it's most likely only from the manufacturer at inflated prices. Same with fuel pumps. They've made a DIY fuel pump replacement for $100 into an $800 replacement by a dealereship. My PU could have had a fuel pump access panel in the bed but they chose not to install one.
You almost always see tach movement on cranking if the primary ignition system is good. Yours didn't move until the ign 2 fuse was swapped out.
Excellent videos!!! Thank you!!!
Very nice video, I liked your explanations for everything you did to find the issue with this truck.
Great diagnosis.
Great troubleshooting and that for the jump scare on the loud startup. lol
Great video
Appreciate long analysis
99.9% it was jump-started backwards. On modern toyotas that style fuse is a pain to replace because its bolted from underneath the fuse box
In 2008 my neighbor asked for a jump start for her newish Rav4? and I hooked the cables backwards on her battery then corrected the mistake. Car started but only idled - step on gas pedal did nothing. My excuse? My neighbor's Krazy hot body and skin tight jeans distracted me to the point where I mixed up red & black.
Buddies ex had a car he got painted, so they stripped them thing. A couple months later they started putting the thing back together... It wouldn't start.
Ford focus, there's a fuse on the backside of the fuse block under the dash. Just 1, and it was blown. I think it was something to do with the airbag system that would blow and cut power to the fuel system in case of an accident. They obviously disturbed the system when taking it apart.
Same on 2008 Lexus, one would think that Toyota would make the battery cables colored (like Red for positive and Green for negative. Its a dam shame, one spends 70000 for a car where one has to almost ques the polarity for buster hook up! I did take care of my battery leads after the same fiasco on LS460
Thanks Kenny I learn a lot watching your Videos ,Good job trouble shooting.
You missed the fact that the tach did not rise on crank . A sure sign of deeper problems.
Noticed that too
Good catch! I missed that!
Only because I haven't seen a reply on the ETCS fuse, That is for the Electronic Throttle Control System. Just in case anyone was wondering :)
Somebody may have cut the pipe in front of the cat to relieve backpressure to see if the cat (s) plugged. I used to pull the O2 sensor out, but some of the guys at the repair shop where I worked would actually cut the pipe, especially if they couldn't get the O2 sensor out easily.
SHORT: If the rectifier bridge is shorted in the alternator it could eat 60amps easily. Pull the big wire off the alternator to see, but I can't say why the engine has to be running unless maybe there's an alternator cut in relay. When I was there, GM was modulating the current output from the alternator using the pcm, to help with cold start EPA test #'s. If the battery was really up, the pcm would slowly recharge the battery instead of lay a big load on the engine at that critical time in the start up cycle. Toy? I Duno Nuthin Bout 'Em. I'd like to see the follow up on this one Kenny. ben/ michigan
If the tachometer isn't moving while starting there's more than a fuel issue 😊
That 60amp bypass fuse looked totally viable if the oem fuse is silly money
Areed. I would have had several fuse holders in there with maxi-fuses to replace that POS bodge fuse assembly.
I must admit I like the longer videos. Would be nice to see this one running! Thanks
I agree. Most other guys I watch, they show the resolution. It’s almost like having closure seeing the vehicle run at the end. It may take several days and some editing, but having the complete repair wouldn’t give me this cliff hanger feeling.
I have told my guys at the shop for years that we need to do a video on every car that comes in or pick up or truck whatever it is that says electrical problems caused by maybe the person that owns it and we should do a video and tape everything we do so they can see real life what we have to go through to fix the vehicle
chasing an electrical problem gets crazy. Sometimes the customer gets mad because it takes 3 hours to figure out an electrical issue & do the repair. Thanks for sharing your stories. I enjoy reading them. Keep wrenching 🔧
Great show! I'm interested in understanding the electrical side of automotive work. If possible, please show more electrical work like this.
Thank you.
Great video!
Hi Kenny I love the VJO's! I always give them a like, I did not know that clicking on the amazon links helped, now that I know I will do that to help support. Matt from Diesel Creek always says, "click on the like button it does not cost anything and it helps support the channel" I rarely use to hit the like button because I used the likes as a book mark. Now I know better and also on the links helps too. Thank you so much for the great content!!!!!!
Great video man. And I actually don't mind longer video's like this.. Keep it up buddy.
They are a pain (those type of fuses) they are so easy to miss.Cheers mate.
The best I believe I have seen was a couple of fellas in Carine with a Ford. I asked, " Have you done anything with it" ( big mistake) he said no and had just been running.
I told him that would be impossible and again he told me it was just running and he didn't do anything.
The problem was that the battery was dead flat, and the positive lead was bolted to the motor block.
He then told me the neighbour did it.
I never asked anyone again " have you done anything "
After that I asked has " Anyone done anything "
Lack of a tach when cranking may be a signal
When you turn the key to on, if you don’t start, fuel pump relay will be powered for two seconds and then disabled not to run pump for noting. Having the key at on and searching for fuel pump voltage without somebody flipping the key inside every two seconds is total mistake.
35000 miles on an older tundra that’s what we call a unicorn lol I’d like to find one for sale that’s for sure all mostly very high miles or in terrible rust condition up here in the rust belt nice video
Those block style fuses were common on Japanese motorcycles from the mid-1970s through the early 1990s. They be on younger bikes, but I only rarely worked on those.
Great video and explanatiom.
I scratch my head when it comes to car electrics nowadays.
As an electromechanical engineer, I would think that 8x the coil amperage would be a minimum size for the fuse + whatever else the car is running. Another thought was that a coil could be short drawing more current & overloading the fuse. I couldn't tel by sound if the car was firing on all 8.
This guy has the "unicorn" master cylinder just like my truck! First time I've seen another one
Years ago I worked on a 78 Firebird that burnt wiring in the dash due to a overcharging alternator... Fixed wiring changed alternator and sent it on it's way with no more problems...
@2:44 you will see the fuel rail schrader valve next to the oil filler cap and engine hoist hook !
14:44 "Or this is live off the battery, I'm not 100% positive" - that is funny! Well done.
A great video, I sometimes, forget to do the simple first and check fuses... then spend an hour looking for the cause. I like that you did it first. I would have checked the Codes before jumping a blown fuse. In this case it was a right thing to do. I am always afraid to make things worse by jumping a blown fuse. I would have replaced it and probably burned it out too....
Enjoy your content Kenny
Thanks for your cool vids , I have fat fingers and hands , I have put hose clamp on hand to make it smaller , kinda worked . I got where I can wrench with left or right hand on compact motor cranes Thanks
That truck is hunted 😂😂😂
Good diagnosing Kenny
have done it myself, on an older car, just fried the alternator. learned my lesson.
maybe quit saying it was to several shops and still not fixed..... I have a feeling all you will get are basket cases!! I use to love the challenge of finding the gremlins myself .... but it is nice to just have a normal week at the shop every once in a while!!
You're right! Meg always says by saying that the universe sends me the basket cases. Thanks for watching & keep wrenching 🔧
Really good job by the Toyota electrical engineers in protecting the ECMs. With an older car several of them would be fried after such an event.
Simply adding a diode in the Vcc or B+ in the design would solve most of the problems. The ECM's and other devices often fail because a diode in the circuitry is in revers bias on the power input and when it sees reverse current it goes dead short. CB radios used to do that. If you get a shorted CB is the protection diode in the back of the radio. Same with an ECM but they are potted with epoxy and cannot be repaired in most cases. If the manufacturers would just put in protection diodes in series with the electronics, all this BS can be eliminated. I did that on my big pickup I used to have and jump started people all the time and my electronics in the truck was WELL protected.
Backwards jump starting will fry the diodes in the alternator and then they shorts out.
Too much reverse bias current. Never good.
I'm not necessarily disagreeing, but those diodes normally deal with more than 12 volts when rectifying the three phase AC made in the stator, so I don't see why 12-13 volts from an attempted backwards jump start.
Don't say "more amps" or "current", as the diode is essentially an open circuit when reverse biased, which means no current, whatever may be available from the battery.
I won't try jumping backwards on my car to test, though....
the wire size for a rigged fuse must be used - test the alternator for an unintentional ground / short to ground
After all that hassle the owner will likely say thanks man.
My Lancer Evo had a fuse block like that, it blew when I accidentally hooked up the battery backwards and saved everything from damage, thankfully, that was a relief for a $20 fuse replacement
Came across this video. Had to subscribe awsome explanation on what your doing
Winnipeg Manitoba Canada 🇨🇦
Oh Canada! Thank you for your kind words. I appreciate you watching. Keep wrenching 🔧
Im learming. Thanks I'll check later for final
I've had the diode pack in the alternator blow when jump started in reverse.
Its a pain to replace but much cheaper than a new alternator.
@14:40 "...Or this is the live of the battery, I'm not a hundred procent positive..." So. Dry. Humor! 🤣
Good analytical video
That roar on cracking is impressive
my goodness you are very knowledgeable
It's possible to legitimately repair that style of cartridge fuse instead of replacing it. All that's needed is to solder a piece of wire of the correct size between the two sides. To get the correct fuse rating, you can count out a number of individual strands from a piece of stranded wire, and use multiple strands that add up to the correct total. You'll need to measure the wire with calipers and find a table of wire parameters that includes the _fusing current_ (i.e. not just the service current), but such tables are readily available online if you search for them.
As an example, I've got a roll of 16awg stranded copper-clad aluminum wire, which internally contains 40 count 32awg strands. Looking up in a table, a single 32awg strand of copper clad aluminum has a fusing current of a little over 5 amps. So for a 10 amp fuse, I'd probably count out three strands, and for a 100 amp fuse I'd probably count out twelve strands. (I'd add one or two extra strands beyond the number suggested by the fusing current, as the current split between multiple strands of fuse wire is never fully even. The first strand to blow in a multi-strand fuse blows at something like 70% of the sum, and once the first strand blows it'll rapidly cascade to blowing all the rest of the strands.)
Note that if you are gonna do this, definitely use copper-clad aluminum wire rather than solid copper wire. That's probably what those cartridge fuses have in them already, and it fuses at a lower (i.e. safer) temperature, where a solid copper fuse link might get hotter than that housing is designed to contain. For a much more 100% legit way to do this, buy a glass fuse of the right ampacity, crack it open, and using the bit of fuse wire inside it. I'd only buy a roll of purpose-made fuse wire if I was planning on repairing hundreds of fuses this way though, since rolls of the stuff are usually very expensive.
Maybe the bad alternator ruined the battery and made it need the jump. Batteries and alternators often have a mutually destructive relationship, like my exes.
Something to watch for on some Toyota/Lexus vehicles is the immobiliser. On my old Mk.2 GS300 if the battery or ECU fuse was disconnected, once reconnected the key had to be left in the ignition for 6 minutes to unlock the immobiliser. I can't remember whether it was first or second click, but definitely in and turned for 6 minutes, preferably without radio, aircon or headlights as they'd be draining the battery at that point. If you didn't do that six-minute step you'd get no spark.
Great video
Great video... Probably the best quality truck on any of your videos. Why leave such a nice low mileage truck to sit for so long?....Id just solder a wire across that black cartridge fuse.....😮😮😀😀🇬🇧
Why not?
I love watching your videos, I am a complete moron when it comes to automotive but learn a lot watching your process and also as you explain. Thanks buddy.
My best pro tip That all the pros already know if you're trying to find A poped fuse just grab a Test light check both sides with the key on you've got one side lit and the other Side is not bad fuse. If nothing's lit up on that fuse Circuit is probably not switched on. Extremely effective when working on af$fords where the fuse box is not labeled and you don't have the owner's manual just check the fuses. And then all other makes And models all just check the fuses.
I believe that big fuse is called a Universal Linkage.
Toyota has it listed as a fuse link. Thanks for watching
I always see that generation of Tundra with broken ball joints sitting along the road.
Just joined your channel, good stuff
Great t shooting way to go bud
"The truck looks clean."
Yeah, clean as any construction yard porta potty.
i repaired that kind of fuse on a glow plug relay, i just cutted the inner wire of a normal fuse of the right value and soldered to the big box, it saved me a hundred
Had a laugh seeing this video I did the same thing about a month ago with my 2001 Dodge Ram, it's been sitting about 4 years so I decided to try to get it started and moved. Have 3 brand new batteries in the garage all the same well I thought. Dropped ot in went to start It cranks over but won't start After looking at the battery It was hooked up backwards the battery posts on this battery were reversed The battery was for my brother's 2500 Silverado. Grab the right battery try to start it wouldn't start blew the fuses. Always pays to look before you do and not assume. I found that out the hard way.
Great video at my shop we can make every day we can make videos like this everyday it just seems like the cars have just we've had plenty of people put a battery in backwards and sometimes they really have to work at engineering to get that battery in their backwards
24:19 Meanwhile that frog is thinking "😱AAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!!!!"
This is been my life we are electrical shop and this has been my shop my love this has been my life for over 60 years it is amazing the amount of fuses one of the cars that you typically or some of the cars that comes to our shop is the Mercedes and look at all those fuses since there was involved with crossword corporation there is a lot of fuses on your ram trucks
If you're working with a loose live terminal, you can clip a WOODEN clothespin on it: greatly reduces the chance of an accidental short
Years ago I had a Dimler Sovereign, lovely car, Bought a new battery for it fitted it and everything went haywire,, this model had electric everything. Any how I checked out what I could but am no auto electrician, but luckily for me there was one literally 3 or 4 miutes down the road, so took the car there, (fortunately it started) took the guy less than 2 minutes to find the new battery had been reverse charged! So I left the car with him for a complete check of all things electric and went quite literally across the road to the car spares shop where th battery came from and told them (I knew the guys in the shop well) what had happened was, to my shock they jumped straight on the defensive and said no not having that you connected it the wrong way round! I was quite shocked, I had been buying from there for years using their shop for all my needs for our cars and vans and also things for my racing cars, but I guess they were protecting themselves, anyhow before the conversation took a nasty turn the auto electrician came in the shop, with the battery, and defended me, they checked the battery and apologised, the auto electrician then gave them a long list for which they would have to supply without cost plus his labour, new alternator 4 electric window motors, wiper motor 2 electric fuel pumps, the list went on and they were more than a little shocked at how much the lot would cost them. The guys two pals that owned the shop, went grey, the blood drained from their faces. Then the electrician said, no only joking looks like just the alternator, as nothing else was actually turned on, and a new battery. They got off lightly, but thereafter no battery went over that counter before being checked first.The electrician just took a drink from the shop for his time, he didn't want anything from me, but I insisted and gave him some money for the "tea boat" as we used to call it. That car run like a Rolls, my wife loved it, but so did the petrol stations, boy it was juicy, and petrol has never been cheap here in England. Taught me a lesson I stick to to this day, never take "new" items for granted.
good video
as handy as you are with that test light, i'd bet a day's pay you'd be overjoy'd and much more productive if you had/ learned to use a power probe III, does basically the same thing, but can apply power, has a built in resetable fuse, and a LCD voltage display (all just slightly larger then your test light, but still skiny)
24:15 that scared tf out of me
7:00 Copacetic! This is an interesting word, I'm just leaving a comment to bookmark for myself the use of the word in the wild.
One think I check on a crank no start is to see if the tach moves that way you know your getting a reference siganl if I am out in the feild with no tools
GOOD VID KEN
Thanks,i’am a Toyota owner something for memory tool box.
They switched to the cartridge fuse to replace the fusible link. Most fusible links will melt without showing any damage on the insulating sheath.
Good morning Mr Kenny,I know I'm 8hours late,but watched as soon as I could 😊😂😂
You should do a video on proper jump starting.