The Confusing Borders of Lake Constance
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- čas přidán 29. 08. 2024
- If you're sitting on a boat in Lake Constance, are you in three countries at once? Or just in one? Does it even matter? Because strangely, it turns out there are parts of the world where no-one really minds when international borders are not just ignored, but are completely undefined.
SOURCES:
Smith, B. (2001). Fiat Objects. Topoi, 20(2), pp.131-148.
ontology.buffal...
Khan, D. (2004). Die deutschen Staatsgrenzen. 1st ed. Tübingen: Mohr Siebeck.
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So in this situation, Austria (which has the shortest shore line but wants to share the lake equally) is like the guy who orders two appetizers and the biggest steak and a couple of beers, and then suggests everyone just split the check three ways; Germany is the one who regrets not asking for separate checks at the beginning and wants someone else to make the decision; and Switzerland is the one who pulls the pocket calculator out and figures out who owes what down to the penny.
You just discribed our countries
That sounds like Switzerland alright.
Apt description.
@IamMe unfortunately, yes. We are slow learners, it seems.
@IamMe Really? (Northern) Germans don't go to the toilet without a plan.
Bavarians and Austrians, yes: "Schau ma amal" ("We'll see").
I laughed at how Wikipedia describes Germany's position: "Switzerland holds the view that the border runs through the middle of the lake, Austria is of the opinion that the contentious area belongs to all the states on its banks, which is known as a 'condominium', and Germany holds an ambiguous opinion".
We're like "we all know how us fighting over borders ended last time and we could really do with the optics."
@@anna-flora999 Germany, Austria and Switzerland fighting over borders with another?
Like when?
@@Icetea-2000 Germany and Austria had a lot of wars over the years
@@anna-flora999 No, Germany and Austria had no war.
Prussia and Austria did but that was within the entirety of german lands (that austria is part of themselves) before Germany existed, so you can hardly call it a war between Austria and Germany.
And even so, it wasn’t about something ridiculous as ownership of a lake.
@@Icetea-2000 You're the only one implying the word "between". He only said Germany and Austria had a lot of wars. He didn't say with each other.
when it comes to territorial disputes between countries I think "meh" is the best possible outcome we can have today.
Eugene Cherish Germany seems to do that more often. There's another dispute over territorial waters with the Netherlands that's has been resolved by an "agree to disagree" policy.
@@Quintinohthree well, we have some history an a set of burned hands concerning aggressive border politics. We learnt our lesson well and are aware that others might get nervous if we get forceful or insistent. Also, as the largest (by quite a bit and in multiple factors) actor in this "dispute," we have little to gain and much to lose from a fight over a lake with few resources and friendly neighbours on the other side.
This is Euro Union. There are no b0rders.
Why? Austrias solution seems much better. Why not just share instead of not care?
Luda Stout switzerland is not in the EU there is the only Problem offically this is a outline boarder of the EU and should be protected from Austria and Germany but everbody is like meh have better things to do
Citizenship wouldn't be an issue. None of the three countries offer citiezenship to those who are born within it's borders (ius soli) but the parents' nationality (ius sangiunis)
@@pluscrafter7117 Meaning, the lake would only be an issue if someone lived on it for 12 years ;).
Actually, on a slightly more serious note: countries don't have to ask other ones whom they give citizenship (even in the EU, I thunk, but Switzerland is not in it). So, none of the three countries have to care what the others think where Lake Constance is. So for Austria, you can live anywhere on it, for Switzerland half and Germany would need to make up ots mind.
However, if a stateless child is born on the lake, one of the 3 countries has to give it citizenship as per anti-statelessness laws. Which one gives in?
(e.g. Britain doesn't allow citizenship to be inherited if the parents are both born outside of the UK)
@@DrDiHai we wouldn't have to make up our mind actually. If your parents were German and lived 20 years on this lake in Germany and you are born by them you are German. You can have more than one nationality according to our current laws so there is no problem. Most people with an Swiss and an German nationality that live in Germany that I know tend to drop their Swiss nationality at the age of 18 because they would have to join the army for some time or just have the German nationality and then claim the second nationality at the age of 26 (I think) where it is save that you do not have to join the army anymore. All this is no uncommon thing.
1:47 that wouldn't be a problem: In Austria, Switzerland and Germany the citizenship doesn't depend on the place of birth like in the US or UK (ius soli). A newborn on Lake Constance would simply get his / her parents' citizenship (ius sanguinis).
Yes, that's right. Plus, in Germany one of the parents supposed to be a German citizen.
Being born in the UK doesn't guarantee citizenship either.
@@ludastout2852 Not really, according to ius soli, even if both of the parents are not German the kid will/can get the German citizenship if the parents have lived for 8 years straight in Germany.
False information with 130 Likes omegalul
@@broti02 at least the german one is right you get your citizenship from your mother
If you're wondering why my coat looks ridiculous, it's because there was about a 30mph wind blowing off the lake, and it was either freeze to death or accept a certain loss of dignity...
Just a little bit perhaps but I can still see the red so it's not horrific.
wow- good luck warming up
And there is a new hoodie I see!
out of interest, what is the sculpture behind you meant to be?
I like how the Video just been posted but your comment from 4 weeks ago, did Santa give you a time machine?
Another fact involving this lake: the world's shortest international flight flies over this lake and lasts just 8 minutes linking Switzerland to Southern Germany. And that is something you may not have known!
James Funnell Basel to where? :D
St. Gallen to Friedrichshafen. Additional fun fact: Overall shortest scheduled flight in the world is from Westray to Papa Westray in the Orkney Islands, is 1.7 miles long and takes around 2 Minutes depending on the wind (record is 53 seconds)
SwatTeamExit Yes it does. Germany has over two dozen "international airports" most of them losing millions in public money every year
SwatTeamExit With only one airline.
Unknown Name nope, actually we have 13 airlines.
With "InterSky" we had an airline based in Friedrichshafen, but they are insolvent. After that we had an airline hub from the belgian "FlyVLM". But they are broke too.
Greetings from Friedrichshafen
I live right there i in Constance and I must admit, that sometimes it is really funny explaining this subject to people, that don't know about this, especially americans are like "whut, how can this happen???" But I also, have to say, that your Statement is not entirely true, because in the so called "Konstanzer Trichter", the Constance bay, there in fact is a fixed borderline between Germany and Switzerland in the middle of the bay. But because nobody knows exactly where that middle is (and nobody really cares about it) it is not an issue at all. Water Police from either Country is allowed to check your license and personality anywhere on the lake and they also always work together in search and rescue missions. I am really happy about how all countries are really relaxed with the current situation.
I like the phrase "water police" :)
@@bartholomewdan
Well that's what it's called in german - "Wasserpolizei"
German is a very descriptive language :)
@@alishak8241 Actually the German word is "Waserschutzpolizei" which if translated word by word is "water protection police"..... and if you now add grammar into the descriptive part of the language it means this police is there to protect the water.... ;-)
@@ulie1960 Da weiss einer wovon er redet!
I'm suddenly terrified by the thought of a Swiss policeman checking my personality-
I grew up on the Austrian side.
Some creepy trivia: The criminal investigation department of Lindau (city on German shore) reckoned in 2012 that there are at least 95 bodies still in the lake. Due to cold water temperatures in maximum 251m depths the bodies decompose very slowly, thus not developing enough gas to create buoyancy, once they sink below 40-50m they won't come up again.
I’m Swiss, live on Lake Constance and i’ve never heard anyone argue about which part of the lake is theirs. Germans come across to Switzerland and we travel to Germany, no big deal.
Thats how it should be! When there is no problem then dont try to create one
Sounds lovely, but what happens if things turn ugly and start looking like 1940 again?
@@patrickfitzgerald2861 the funny thing is, it wasn't even an issue during this time, the locals stood together and the swiss helped many people to escape the Reich across the lake and also took care of many local german children during the bomb raids
@@georgobergfell Okay, but I'm certain the Nazis thought it WAS an issue, and that's exactly my point. Have you noticed that extremism is on the rise in Europe (and elsewhere) these days? Well-defined borders aren't a perfect thing, but they can help to prevent "misunderstandings." 😉
Greetings from Gaienhofen!
I've seen enough speedruns to know that if you break a law on the center of that lake the world will glitch out and you can wrongwarp to the final boss.
Or, quite possibly, skip the boss (some crime, and running away from the police, maybe?) as well
Wo is the final boss?
@@ralfdwerlkotte5619
Thanks to all those glitches we now have 2020
I live only an hour away and now I wanna try that
I'm gonna try it out tomorrow
The moment when Germany is more neutral than Switzerland. XD
@Orlando Rotundo ? Ok then. Have fun commiting war crimes again.
@@minumilati151 tbfh the Anschluss of Austria wasn't a war crime, it wasn't even an invasion since most Austrians wanted to be annexed
@@DidamDFP Check your history facts. Someone who is holding a gun behind you is not democratic thus making the 'Anschluss' basically an annexion. Check also the voting paper where you can only answer with a big YES and a petite No. Everyone who voted no got problems with the Gestapo.
@Orlando Rotundo it's actually in our constitution, that we can't annex austria. The only option would be a reverse annexation by austria
@@henryblack323 Its not that easy, their was many People especial younger ones, who wants the "anschluss" thats why Kurt von Schuschigg wanted to exclude this People from the voting by saying you only can vote if you are 24 years old.
"they replaced the border with sculptures" ahh, europe.
😆😆😆
Still its better than fences
Well we are 3 german speaking countries with more or less the same law and borders are not holding back some criminals...so its ok like this.
@@detachsoup6061 Cause no one wants to get in like they do elsewhere....
@@diablo2531 So the largely USA-caused migrant crisis never happened? Mmkay...
I can't stop but, your "eh" killed me.
N0616JC Productions ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
-\(°~°)/-
I tried...
rip
I can confirm this. Im German and whenever Im asked about the state of Lake Constance, I just reply 'meh'.
Or 'liquid'.
europe generally has a „meh“ approach to borders
As we all know Lake Constance is 100% Swiss! While the Bodensee is 100% German!
Also what is Austria?
@@TremereTT Konstanz ("Constance") is a german city.
@@demonte6582 I know.
Also I wonder why Tom didn't intoduce the Büsingen problem too.
@@TremereTT there is no problem in and around büsingen. Yes, its an enclave, but everybody agrees to the same border.
As a German I am confused:
Why isn't it just called "Bodensee"?
It's sometimes a difficult choice when there's a local name and an English name: because both are used, in this case I went with the one that I found easier to pronounce and fit into the script!
Michi
The English name is "lake of constance"
Oh, it's the Bodensee. I didn't know that and was really confused for a sec.
Wait a second:
The English name is "Lake of Constance" so it is named after the city of Constance/Konstanz which is in Germany. Therefore the lake should belong to Germany. Problem solved :-)
The lake is so large compared to Konstanz, it would be more suitable to call Konstanz the Place Of The Lake Constance.
Except that's not useful in that there are a lot of places around that lake... since it is so large.
Be sure to tell your mathematician friends "The boundary of Constance is variable."
There is one Problem! Constance or Konstanz is a City in germany. The lake is called lake constance because its next to that City.
Sergej Karl joke sergej. A play on words.
WHERE'S THE RED T-SHIRT
Under the Grey hoodie, the other piece of clothing Tom owns 20+ copies of.
grande1899 It is there you can just see it's collar under that jumper
OH MY GOD ITS GRANDE1899 AKA SENPAI GRANDAYY
Grandayy wot
fancy seeing you here
I wish the cameraman moved his camera a few inches down so that the sculpture would line up with the horizon.
What's the name of the sculpture btw? I guess it's supposed to demonstrate the different base altitude levels used by Germany (Amsterdam sea level) and Switzerland (Adria sea level)?
TJGermany oh wow, haven't thought of that and didn't even know about that difference!
I don't know, but the whole project is called "Kunstgrenze" literally art border
you could say it's...
not constant
oh noooooo There is no god.
*slow clap*
It's Konstanz.
Immer schön am Boden bleiben
Bodensee
I never heard the english name for the lake...I was a bit confused for a second...
well, it is not the english name - in fact it is the roman catholic name - which is for example also found in spanish, italian and french
Bodensee sounds better
@@baumfp no.
@@thisguy976 Yes
@@baumfp Yes.
Anyone wondering what that part of Africa is where nobody claims it?
Well it's on the border netween Sudan and Egypt.
if you were wondering
Jay Foreman did a really interesting (and as always humourous) video on this as part of his 'Map Men' series.
It's called Bir Tawil
MAP MEN MAP MEN MAP MAP MAP MEN MEN
Bir Tawil
Fun fact: If you stand on the far end of the lake you can't see the coast on the other side, because of the curvature of the Earth.
but your eyes stand 2 metres high, don't they?
true, but that's not enaugh, you would have to climb the church tower from the "Konstanzer Münster" for example to see Bregenz on the opposing shore.
Is that why I can't see Canada from Ireland?
@@garethh9440 Yes.
@@neecogwheelsword3627 please do elaborate on that, as Im having a bit of trouble understanding what you want to convey here :)
That means that I once was in Germany, Switzerland and Austria at the same time.
But what I really like about this is that they dont fight over it. Just imagine how much better the wold would be if every territorial dispute was solved this way.
Indeed. That's what always exasperates me about the endless anti-EU rants you find on the internet; they always go on the assumption that every country is inherently in a state of natural competition and moderate hostility with other countries, which is simply not true. As the EU countries (except Switzerland, but they do associate with the EU quite a bit) in this video prove, it's perfectly possible to have utterly friendly and cooperative relations between two countries that needn't ever result in any obstruction. I'm not going to pretend that the EU is what made Lake Constance a succesful condominium - after all, the friendly relations between Austria, Germany and Swizterland go back much further to the Holy Roman Empire - but it does show what nuisance countries can avoid if they just open themselves up to one another in a friendly way, rather than endlessly shouting about closing borders and building walls.
I totally agree. It's kind of peaceful hearing about it.
they don't fight over it because there's no oil under it xD
Coming from this region myself I was kinda shocked to hear that in other parts of the world, you will have lots of problems moving over such a border. When you are used to this kind of freedom, it is mind-blowing that you have to jump through a lot of hoops to cross the border from e.g. Canada to the US.
@@warxdrum I guess you have a point here ... or had it, like two years ago. But it's still valid, I would say.
Konstanz is a good example for more confusing state-border-issues:
The area of »Trägermoos« is legally a part of the Swiss municipality of Trägerwilen, but some legal issues, e.g. land survey, is in the responsibility of the German city of Konstanz.
“What happens if a baby is born in the middle of the lake?”
As far as I know neither of the three countries has Birth Right Citizenship so I guess... meh?
Correct
Yes, none of the three countries has citizenship laws that say merely being born in the country makes you a citizen.
But you have to write in the passport in which nation someone was born. So you still have a problem.
@@untergehermuc depends on the country that issues the passport
it could be a challenge if someone dies on a boat on the lake. Which office issues the death certificate?
I agree with Switzerland, but I love Germany's answer.
As a German, I have to agree with you, that our stance is just great. :3 Although as a human I prefer Austria's stance. Could serve as an example to all humankind.
you mean "ehh~~"?
Austrias idea is the best. It's easy for the country with the smallest land boarder to claim equal sharing but its definitely the best option.
Brem
Austria is like that guy who didn’t do anything for the group project and says “We did it!”
I agree there should be a defined border BUT I think it should simply be at the coast and the lake is international waters
DO YOU KNOW WHAT I'M SAYING? NO RULES^^
I am always amazed at how well those European neighbours get along with each other. I am from India, and we have Pakistan and China as our neighbours...
Nowadays yes, but of course this is only the relatively recent lesson of many centuries of war -- including two world wars!
after centuries of blody wars, it still needs some practice.
@@CCervido Even in the world wars Germany, Austria and Switzerland didn't fight each other.
@@David-zx8fc True, but Germans and Austrians have fought in history
tbh, only because it's a lake. would it be solid ground (and ownable land, taxable people, etc), the incentive to sort things out would be much higher, or the dispute bigger (unlikely nowadays).
lots of these small border problems are.made obsolete nowadays because of EU membership (and similar treaties in Switzerland's case). it's only becomes a problem if one country decides to leave...
i think "meh" should become an option for many things, forms and programs :D
¯\_(ツ)_/¯ would solve so many problems.
It feels so weird seeing a Tom Scott video being filmed in a place I always walk through.
Can you share me the exact location of this borderline place?
1:40 is the most interesting part of the video. Finally someone tells us how to pronounce it.
the red sculpture at the start is awesome it looks like on part is in the foreground and the other is close!
indeed very cool artpiece
Austria, Germany and Switzerland meet to fix the border issue at the Bodensee.
Austria: "We should all get equal rights at the lake and share it equally between us three."
Germany: "OK"
Switzerland: "Wait, wait, thats not fair. You have the smallest (border) of us three. Your part should be smaller. The border should be like this!" *Switzerland shows a map*
Germany: "OK"
Austria & Switzerland: "Whats wrong with u germany? Why u dont care about your borders?"
Germany: "I stopped caring about those border issues. In the past looking at borders, and trying to move them always made me angry. And people dont like me when i am angry. Do u guys want to make me angry?"
Austria and Switzerland nervously sweatting: "Its, Ok, we dont care either... its fine, Bye!"
Actually, who cares about germany? They didn't take it at ww2. Why should they now. And if they take it... the water comes from the alps in switzerland ... we are good in building tunnels...
The only place where the true spirit of a European Union almost exist. If only the Swiss would chill out.
This comment was made with humorous intent to stimulate lighthearted conversation.
without any effect.
Dominik Daners Breaking news: Central European war started over lake dispute
John OBrien well Switzerland is not in the EU
I demand a referendum - Lakexit!
...you know to stop immigrants or something else fanciful.
SimonHellinger and im glad about that
MAP MEN MAP MEN MAP MAP MAP MEN MEN!
Chaz Hinkley EXACTLY WHAT I THOUGHT! xD
Martin Steindl Ive drawn a wizard
Chaz Hinkley NEVER DRAW ON A MAP!
Mahogany mahogany!
. . . MEN MEN.
Just one point:
The »special case« is located on the »Obersee« (the bigger area of the Bodensee aka. Lace Constance). For the »Untersee« (smaller part of the lake) and the »Seerhein«-areas (river between the two parts of the lake) there are borders defined.
Tom, I am so impressed that you manage to explain anything in an amusing and enlightening manner, without any hesitations, fill words or frequent cuts. Are you just that good - or are there lots of failed takes that we never see?
I lived on the lake for almost 20 years and nobody had a problem. We all shared it and good neighborhood is the parole of the day and the centuries. Lake Constance - Bodensee always was an international waterway and in the middle ages nobody cared because all of it belonged to the holy roman empire of german nations. How wonderful a place without lines to be disputed because there an none.
What a neat comment
It took me way too long to figure out that lake constance is the Bodensee...
Zahlenteufel1 xD
Zahlenteufel1 wundert mich gerade dass es auf #6 trending ist... wohne in Konstanz btw
Zahlenteufel1 😂 Same here
I remember the day that I realised the "Bodensee" everyone was going to for Holiday was the "Lake Constance" I wanted to visit myself :D
I'm in Konstanz right now, visiting friends for New Years. Biked and walked that Swiss - German border a few times in the past few days. Didn't see Tom, alas.
You see, Donald? You don't need a wall, you just need ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
I actually wondered where he plans to build that wall, because the US/Mexico border is in the center of the river. People depend on access to the river on both sides for fishing and other uses, so you can't just build the wall on one bank or the other because it would be stealing the other side's access to the water. So where would the wall even go?
We currently have fences. Where the border is on the Rio Grande (in Spanish, el Río Bravo del Norte; it isn't always), the fence lies in the U.S. some hundred-odd feet inland on the U.S. side. These fences cut through Native lands and cemeteries, and do absolutely naff all to prevent incoming immigrants. Though with Trump's record of both wanton environmental destruction and complete lack of knowledge with respect to anything he does, I wouldn't be surprised if he tries to build a wall straight centrally in the water.
+Alexander González
...and make the fish pay for it.
You do realize that the border of Switzerland, Austria and Germany is a bit different compared to the border of USA and Mexico?
Trump is not building a wall between Canada and USA for the same reasons.
vanhakaveri I thought it was because Fox doesn't make stories out of the 'bad hombres' north of the border.
I never search for his videos. But Everytime I'm recommended one I alwaysssss watch them. Very interesting content mate!
I dream of a day when all borders will be treated with this same "meh" attitude.
Love your videos.
I seriously didn't know that :) i live in Germany amd always asked myself why the borders aren't shown on any maps. Now I know, thanks Scott ;)
europeans: "no need to make a fuss until we need to"
americans: "WE NEED TO BUILD A WALL AROUND THE LAKE!"
Vasectomy Fail
Austrians: We can share everything! Let's be an example for the world.
Germany: Sure, zhere is nothin zhere anyway.
Switzerland: Yes, there is. Our lake.
UK: All travel on the lake is international travel, even if its origin and destination is the same, and subject to customs.
@Cindie Calderón You do realize that a lot of the drug trade across the border is done by Americans as well.
Also YOU HAVE A MEXICAN LAST NAME.
@@Dutchcomentatah a
Through the lake, as a matter of fact. Doesn’t matter as long as you find somebody you can let pay for it. 🍊
There are other condominions in Europe that work perfectly, for example the river Mosel between Germany and Luxemburg. I think this is a really good solution to a lot of border problems. You need to solve them together by nature.
I love the fact Germany says ¯\(ツ)/¯ which goes to show we could one day live without borders.
That would be awesome!
Germany had many plans to live without borders in the past...
I live in this region and I always thought this is how things were handled everywhere and that it`s just the normal way to handle borders in lakes.
Pretty sure this is my favourite video you've ever done. Starting the year off strong, Tom.
Mr. Scott, you are one of the most enjoyable vloggers I’ve seen. Your voice, demeanor and eloquent command of English are truly exceptional. Please continue the great work. A network should make you an offer. Cheers from the States.
If this was a Vox video it would've been 9 minutes long
And it would have been narrated by some mindnumbingly bland American.
Another interesting fact surrounding Lake Constance is that the whole Lake (well, the sky above it) is considered Swiss airspace and Swiss air traffic control is responsible for Lake Constance's airspace.
That is not correct. Swiss air traffic control controls quite a lot of foreign airspace, also from France, Austria and Italy. But this airspace is not Swiss, it is just delegated to be controlled by another country for practical traffic flow reasons. And German delegated airspace to Switzerland is a lot bigger than Lake Constance.
If Switzerland had all of it, wouldn't that take the lake out of the EU?
@@anonUK it is a problem if you take goods like cigarettes or whiskey from one country to another. So, if you go fishing and have a lot of tobacco or alcohol with you, taxes depend on where you are checked by which customs officers.
Of course Austria wants 1/3 since they have the smallest coastal part. They'll lose big time in a division
I think people are really overestimating the value of this lake
@@svda814 True. A division wouldn't effect the tourism by much.
@@nico.s1608 For Switzerland it is probably more of a convenience thing. In the south west there is a lake as big as lake constance between switzerland and france and there the border goes right trough the middle of the lake.
Almost all of the Austrian shore is available for public access (except for some strongly protected nature preserves), this is not true for the german and swiss shores, this makes the Austrian part of the shore very special.
Something interesting is that the historical center of the German city Constance (Konstanz) actually lies on a tiny bit of land which is geographically on the Swiss side. During WWII every German city used to dim or shut the lights in order to not be recognizable as a city by the allied bombers, while Switzerland didn't need to do that. The major of Konstanz at the time decided however to keep the lights on and hoped to trick the allies into thinking it was a Swiss city. The decision payed off, and today Konstanz is one of the few German cities that still have their original historical architecture.
Flensburg is another City that wasn't destroyed. But we were saved by our shitty Weather.
Still cannot get over "Behind me is Lake Constance, it is a big lake."
Them: Where are you?
Me: I'm on Lake Constance.
Them: So are you in Austria, Switzerland, or Germany?
Me: Yes.
Each country should own it 4 month each every year :-)
so you could have a twin, born in the same place as you a few minuites later that has a different citizenship than you, if you time it correctly, also based on which timezone !?
Which timezone? I don't know, gmt+1 maybe? Just maybe?
+John Wyatt You missed the point of the video!
Genius!
I'm sorry, I could not make the smiley larger.
In switzerland/germany this lake is called Bodensee (Groundlake)
ahhh.... the flowery charm of German...
NichtPixel well only in german Switzerland
NichtPixel The Boden in Bodensee has nothing to do with an actual ground. It comes from the village of Bodman.
Now I know! Thanks a lot
Unknown Name And another comment says that the village takes its name from a flat plane, basically a floor, so yes, it is related.
From 1414 to 1418, the Council of Constance was held in the city, where the highest ecclesiastical dignitaries from all over Europe met to end the Roman schism. This made the city famous throughout Europe, and with it the lake, which - like many lakes around the world - was named after the city at its outflow. Today, Lake Constance is called Lago di Costanza in Italian, Lago de Constanza in Spanish, Lac de Constance in French and Lake Constance in English.
+Tom Scott - in the Habour of Honstance and in the lower lake (west of Constance) the border is defined via a contract between the former German state Baden and the Swiss Confederation. What you said applies only to the upper lake :D
Thanks to this video, I can now add Austria to the list of countries I have visited! I had been to Germany and Switzerland and have taken a boat out onto lake constance (from Konstanz, so I presumed I was still in Germany and well away from Austria) - but hadn't been to Austria - because I went on a boat out onto Lake Constance, I HAVE been to Austria! I'll take that!
Well that's something I didn't know. I mean an amazing place, sorry.
Kyle Netherwood clever
I don't get it
Tom has a series called things you may not know and also one called amazing places. Kyle just made a joke combining the two names because this video is about an amazing place and something you may not know. It stops being funny when you explain it.
Therer are quite a few places on earth, where neighbouring countries have a different oppinion about the exact borderline, but found a way to live with it. For example in northgermany/netherlands the border in the Dollart Bay between Groningen and Emden.-
There is other people this concerns: skippers. if you - like me - want to do your "boat driver's license" in Germany you need to take a special exam to drive on this lake, called Bodenseeschifferpatent. It's controversial since it isn't really much different than any other lake and international nautical law states that any skipper must acquaint himself with the local specifics of any body of water anyway.
Nice video! As far as I know, the people in this region are generally very laid back. They constantly cross the borders everyday and dont really care about this issues. It might come in handy, that all three countries are german speaking (switzerland in this part of the country) and the culture and laws are not that different from each other.
the only time i had to care about that border was when we've been in Military service (Switzerland has compulsory service for all Males) and we didn't have too much to do and thougth oh, we'll visit Kreuzlingen, which is the Swiss City there. If we'd crossed the border accidentally that would've counted as a declaration of war technically since we've been on military duty.
fun lil countries we are.
You know, that would make an excellent location for a German-language adaptation of The Bridge (Swedish-Danish crime series, later adapted for a US-Mexican one). Someone finds a dead body in the middle of the lake, the body is tied to some kind of conspiracy, the different countries can't agree on which jurisdiction has the responsibility, so they combine efforts in a small team of quirky investigators, and off you go.
There is actually a TV Series called "Die Toten vom Bodensee" where a team consisting of an Austrian-German pair of detectives solve Lake Constance murder cases.
That water sculpture is so....eye bending. It looks like an illusion digitally inserted into the picture. lpl
Oh I know a fun riddle about lake Constance. I hope I translated it correctly :)
An airplane crashes in Lake Constance. Lake Constance borders on Germany, Austria and, Switzerland. Where will the survivors get buried?
There actually was a major air crash in the region; the "Überlingen mid-air collision" (look it up on Wikipedia), where 71 people died. Two planes collided over Lake Constance, the wreckage missed the lake by only a few miles and landed on the German side.
In a grave marked "Paula Schultz"?
I hope they wouldn't get buried.
Sarkelinar That one's better than I thought.
Drown them in the middle of the lake for having the audacity to throw their dirty plane wreck into it >:)
You made an error at 1:25 with the graphic: The small, western "mini-lake" (the Untersee) has defined borders (although i am not sure how they handled it) and only the big part (Obersee) has the problem with the borders.
They took google maps
, which shows no borders.
I went to Lake Constance a few years ago. I stayed in Friedrichshafen, Germany and got a ferry over to Switzerland and Austria. I saw zeppelin airships fly over the lake which was amazing.
(2:10) For online maps, it's easy, do it like they do for other borders:
- China claims some land, so Google Maps China shows China's claim
- India claims the same land, so Google Maps India shows India's claim
- for the rest of the world, it shows both claims as dashed lines
For this lake, do the same:
- Switzerland claims the lake to be divided in the middle, so Google Maps Switzerland shows the line across it
- Austria claims the lake to be shared, so Google Maps Austria shows no lines
- for the rest of the world, it can show the line across as dashed
It'd be nice for us European (dutch, german, swiss, austrian) viewers if you atleast mentioned the native name for Lake Constance, which is Bodensee :). Now I had to look it up which lake it was, while I've been taught in primary school already about the bodenmeer, or just bodensee :). I believe in a recent vid you mentioned the pronounciation of the american patent office, so when you're in germany/austria/switserland you could atleast mention the german name :). Then again, the 'thing I might not know' here is also 'the English have a different name for the Bodensee, they actually use the french name' :).
That moment when you live near constance and Tom Scott was there but you didn't knew it.
I half expected Jay Foreman and Mark Cooper-Jones to show up singing Map Men for some reason..
So according to my country I'm in Austria, Germany and Switzerland at the same time almost everyday in summer XD
Wow you confused me with your Lake Constance for a second. It's the Bodensee zefix
It's a perfect lake for a houseboat, if you want to change the country of residency every 3 month or so :-)
epSos.de And if you want yo go through administrative hell I guess
I'm assuming you do know that Lake Constance feeds the largest river in Western Europe; the Rhine, right? In fact, the Rhine is also connected to the Danube through the Rhine-Main-Danube Canal, so without ever leaving fresh water, you could anchor your houseboat in significantly more than three countries if you started at Lake Constance.
Robert Faber
Yes, a houseboat would be able to travel between 5 to 6 countries in that river and lake. It's probably possible to be a resident of UK and all the other countries would treat you like tourist on a 3 month long vacation, if we anchor that boat in a different country every 3 month.
Robert Faber except you can't follow the rhine for more than a few kilometres before theres an impassable waterfall.
Homerheadbanger
I think there is channel, that goes around the waterfall.
I was really, REALLY hoping you'd tell us how if you view the last sculpture through the other sculptures and line them all up from a certain viewpoint, it draws the borders over the lake.
great stuff. just commenting because it helps with ad revenue
It does?
WhattheDesigns™ | SELTEN INTROS same question : it does?
¯\(ツ)/¯
I had no idea, but if a comment helps Tom, then by all means he shall have a comment :D
2:15 "computers and people don't know where to draw the line"... well that's a deep philosophical inside!
I live in Munich and have been to Lake Constance. I love the lake and the surrounding towns. If you go, please check out the Zeppelin Museum in Friedrichshafen (provided it survives the current shutdowns, that is). When I was last there several years ago, they still offered Zeppelin flights over the lake (which I sadly couldn't do timewise). I don't know what the current status is, though. And be prepared to dress like Tom because the wind coming off the lake can be quite cold and strong. The Zeppelin flights are grounded when it's too windy.
Quickly, summon the Map Men!
Map Men Map Men Map Map Map Men Men ... Men
wish that series would come back...
@@timothymeyer3210 it came back!
wouldn't work, they don't draw on maps
I'll make sure to commit all of my crimes on the lake, so that nobody bothers to prosecute because they don't want to spend years working out the jurisdiction!
ShapelessMonstrosity jurisdiction would probably fall to a joint task force or europol
Flawless plan.
ShapelessMonstrosity Trust me, Europe has the "who has jurisdiction" figured out. With open borders you have to know how to chase people across the border
We have open borders. They'd lock you down wherever you happen to be and probably talk it over with a glass of fine wine.
No they don't. Open borders makes things worse because they have the useless EC to not do anything.
Best part of this video: ¯\(ツ)/¯ (+ the weird sound effect)
This would have been interesting to know when I was on a ferry across the lake in 2016. We left from Friedrichschafen (Germany) and landed at Romanshorn (Switzerland).
Adding to the confusion is that the city of Konstanz is a German city, but it’s on the Swiss side of the lake. I never quite figured out how Switzerland let that happen. I lived in Konstanz one summer when I was in college. Our house was very close to the Swiss border, so we’d sometimes do our grocery shopping in Germany and sometimes we’d do it in Switzerland. During all that time, though, I never knew that the lake itself was wholly claimed by all three countries.
If you ever make a video on/in the Amazon, please name it "Amazon Places"
Who else immediately went to Google Maps to see how they displayed the borders at Lake Constance?
That is actually a great idea!
Penny Lane They used to display the Swiss claim, but it's been a while since.
seems like they are going with the Austrian claim now (no borders), but maybe my browser is biased
I.e. I'm not located in Austria right now, but logged in with my google account which has that information that I'm Austrian. I'd be curious what a Swiss browser/account/location would display.
I checked. It turns out they don't bother. I had to check against a well defined boarder like US-Canada, and found it drawn there.
I'm from Switzerland and in Switzerland right now, maps.google shows the Austrian claim (i.e. no borders).
I love how weird the world is sometimes. 3 countries whose official policy is: ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
I guess that's the best attitude to have towards a border dispute(?) in this day and age.
it's only weird because we're not used to it. the concept of owning land and the dispute of what that includes is the weird part actually imo.
My students in Austria were baffled as to why it's called Lake Constance in English, given the German name is "Das Bodensee".
Been there, driven around the entire lake. Nice place, especially when it's a clear day and you can see the alps.
YES! More border videos! Love these and language videos too! :D
Heyyy, I live there :) but we call the lake ,,Bodensee"
What Tom tries to tell me with that Video: Borders on the lake constance are unclear.
What i learned in this video: The english name of it^^
BTW: Citizenship in Europe (or at least Germany) is handled that way, that you automatically get the Citizenship of your parents. No matter where you are born. And in case of insecurity, i guess, they would just go by where you land.
Nice that you made it to the Lake Constance.
I hope you had time to travel arround the lake and enjoy the diffrent landscapes and countries all around.
i love that meh sound and especially that it is exactly the same all three times. Now that smiley has a sound. Thanks, Tom.
2:01 I turned on captions to find out how to spell "🤷🏽♂️" .....I was disappointed.
I am a student at konstanz university. Thanks for telling me more about my new home area
donerkebab97 so, which country is your uni in?
kathie O'Regan Germany
donerkebab97 was studierst bro? bin auch Stundent in KN...
Botan E.
Information Engineering. Wobei studieren schon weit gestreckt ist
haha.. made my day
Wooooh, it would have been a huge surprise for me, if I had met you in Constance by accident. You would be surprised how many fans you got in a small city like Constance. Hope you liked this south end of Germany and didn't freeze to death. Come back in the summer time and have a swim in Europe's most important drinking water reservoir (supplying 4,5 mio people).
Austria (and even more Vorarlberg, the state where the Lake is) has a very special view on Lake Constance. It is common good, maybe therefore we see it as a condominium. In the Austrian part of the shoreline it is, for example not allowed for private persons or companies to posess the "last meter" of land. The whole shoreline has to be publicly accessible (with little exceptions of two community run swimming beaches).