When was Jesus Crucified: Supposed Bible Contradiction #21
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- čas přidán 25. 08. 2024
- Was Jesus crucified during the 3rd hour or the sixth hour?
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Sources:
Craig Blomberg - The Historical Reliability of the Gospels
James W. Ermatinger - The World of Ancient Rome
Flavio Conti - A Profile of Ancient Rome
E. Randolph Richards and Brandon J. O'Brien - Misreading Scripture with Western Eyes
Gerald Borchert - The New American Commentary: John 12-21
I have to say, as a skeptic this channel has made me rethink a lot of things.
Don't be fooled my friend!
Praying for you.
Keep searching! Christianity is true, look at biblical prophecy!
@@veridicusmaximus6010 😐
@@isaiahreno Christianity is not true. What proof do you have that it is? I have proof of otherwise.
Thanks again for more quality content. My faith has been in a bad place and these videos really help
Andrew Elliott I’ll be praying.
Ill pray for you.
Focus your eyes on the cross
Jeusus is not god!! Concept of God in Christianity :
Imagine i am god and i made myself a Human beeing to save people whom i created from a sin they did not commit, and the only way i can save them is by killing myself. Then when i was going to be crucified (by my own creation) i prayed to me and begged me to save me and asked me why i have forsaken myself, then i refused my own prayer and killed myself.
Christians , its time to WAKE up and thing for a Minute.
@@thekiterunner8482 nope u have to question why he have to come to Earth to save us, read Jermiah more
What I got out of this; the cable company still uses the ancient Greek notion of time-keeping.
Anybody knows the Greeks knows about Creek time
I am from India and in India it's very common for a 10 AM meeting to actually happen anytime between 10 and 12 noon. We are not particular about time keeping
Of course this is another noncontridiction contradiction. Most people bringing these supposed issues up would be protesting if everything matched perfectly saying collusion or copying and they also protest if there are small minor explainable differences. It is just a game they play.
It's almost like the easy contradictions are the ones being addressed, or the ones easy to dismiss.
well said.
@roasted pancakes The hard contradictions, I assume, are stuff like how God seems to act differently in the Old Testament. But that's more of a different covenant. But I might be missing something.
@roasted pancakes When they said Jesus died and resurrected, they were just exaggerating because everyone knows that people don't rise from the dead.
@Jesus God_Savior I assuming you disagree with the resurrection being an exaggeration. Do you agree that the Old Testament stories are exaggerations? And that the reported instructions from God were exaggerated?
This video reminds me of the movie "Crocodile Dundee", when our protagonist asks the village elder "When was I born?" and the elder's response was "In the summertime."
Another way to eliminate this problem is to first understand that, in the first century Palestine, the Jewish day began at six o’clock in the morning, as it was the hour when the sun arose. Thus, six o’clock was generally regarded as the first hour of the day, making nine o’clock the third hour, twelve o’clock the sixth hour, and so on. The reader must also conclude that Jesus was likely arrested at a late hour because the disciples kept falling asleep (Mark 14:37-41). He was then put on trial by the high priests while it was still dark and held captive at the house of Caiaphas until daylight when He would be taken to Pontius Pilate (Matthew 27:1-2 / John 18:28).
Keeping all that in mind, one may well conclude that when the Apostle John placed the sentencing of Christ near “the sixth hour,” he was, in this particular instance, actually referring to the sixth hour after Christ’s late-night arrest. And assuming the arrest occurred around three o’clock in the morning, which is most likely, this would peacefully coincide with Mark’s claim that Christ was crucified during “the third hour” after sunrise.
In short, no matter what “hour” Mark or John considered it to be, it is perfectly evident that the historical crucifixion of Jesus Christ occurred at about nine o’clock on Friday morning. Thus, if a paraphrased Bible has John’s Gospel reporting that Christ was sentenced around twelve o’clock or noon, readers can rest assured that such a version is not the true Word of God.
You are quite literally doing gods work my friend, Keep up the amazing work.
Thanks for your efforts Michael. Hope you and your family are well.
Thanks, we are well
@@InspiringPhilosophy why don't u show us ur family
@@InspiringPhilosophy What year was Jesus crucified?
@@nireekshanaanand3464Because that's his personal life. That's a pretty dumb question. Why is his family any of your business.
Well, the early "timekeepers" were often based on the sun, which, as we now know, rises and sets at different times depending on the season and location.And halfway precise clocks were only developed in the 13th century AD.
Thank you for your explanation!! it really has helped me to get the picture in my mind of how the day/events proceeded . Visuals are so much easier to comprehend for a lot of people than reading. you did a great service for a lot of Christians. God bless you .
This was another great video, as usual!
I have wondered if you were ever going to a bunch of videos or a series on the historicity of the Old Testament (like say the Exodus, the period of the Judges, the United Monarchy). I do have a copy of Kenneth Kitchen's work, but I find myself dozing off and not retaining the information. 😅
Yes, 2021
@@InspiringPhilosophy Well, in the meantime, do you know of any good books or videos that talk about Old Testament historicity and reliability?
@@ChecedDomingcil try historical reliability of the new testament and also go to 'people also search for'i guess there are good books there
@@theguyver4934 There is no porn. There is erotic language in Song of Songs (a book in the Old Testament). It does mention private parts and talks about sex within a marriage but it is all in euphemisms and metaphors (example: "I will climb the palm tree and take hold of its fruit." Fruit here refers to genitals.) Genitals are never spoken of explicitly and it is a fraction of the book. Female breasts are mentioned (example: "your breasts are like to fawns, twins of a gazelle." - a husband speaking to his wife, describing her body. He describes her full body, including her neck, head, eyes, nose, legs, hair, and even feet). The book is not explicit, though. I wouldn't at all consider it "porn", both because it is not explicit, and the purpose of it is not to arouse, but to tell a story. The purpose of porn is to get you to lust, unlike Song of Songs. Song of Songs as a whole book is basically poetry about the love between a husband and his wife. Many people think it symbolizes the metaphorical marriage of God and Israel. I think it has both a literal narrative (marriage between King Solomon and his wife) and a metaphor (marriage between God and Israel).
I think the occasional eroticism in Song of Songs is beautiful, not sinful or wrong to write down. It really is nothing like porn. It tells a beautiful story. You should read it sometime, heck, read the whole Bible.
They didn’t have IPHONES 😱
Mark says Jesus died at 3pm then it says "when evening came" Joseph went to retrieve the body leaving three hours or so for the dead body of Jesus to be picked at by birds.
Love your work IP! Keep it up! These help me
Great videos from both inspiringphilosophy and whaddo you meme .. today was a good day😎
And Capturing Christianity is having Josh Rasmussen and Cosmic Skeptic on as well!
John's gospel also mentions the 'tenth hour' in John 1 and the seventh hour in John 4, so the argument that Bible writers only used 3rd, 6th, and 9th hours is not true. It is true (as IP argues) that they did not use the same sort of precision in ancient times as we do today, and John 19:14 says it was *about* the sixth hour when Jesus was on trial before Pilate, so (if we take John to be using Roman time - for which there are good arguments) John is saying it was early morning when Jesus was on trial before Pilate.
There are no good arguments for John using the Roman Civil hour system. And he certainly was not using a generalized 3 hour period called the 6th hour.
@Veridicus Maximus how are there no good arguments for John using the Roman time system?
As someone who asks people about "the Facts" I see how each person can give variations of these "Facts". But the bottom line is the bottom line. Jesus was crucified for us. That's all we need to know. I love your information ... Thanks!
I do have a small issue with that take on things. One: Blind faith is bad, and Two: Facts are REALLY important, Facts are Facts, and can decide a lot of things. It is a fact that the Romans estimated, therefore this videos argument relies on facts to work. There is an even better answer for this "Contradiction" as well. Johns book was written by a scribe while he was in Jail. Because of this he most likely gave summary information, which is why the Gospel of John is not in the same order as the synoptic Gospels. It is important to research VERY deeply on Jesus. You would not blindly believe that other gods are real, or that a pen could somehow defy gravity at random. The Jesus claim is a HUGE claim, and it requires evidence. This is why so many people spend their lives studying theology. Again, I am not trying to argue, but I do want to make my point about Facts. Everything else you do in life is rooted in some form of fact or experience that is coherent with reality, so why leave the biggest one out. Arguably the best way to look at the bible is through the lenses of a Panentheist, and in some cases a Henotheist. The Bible openly acknowledges other Gods, but makes the point that YHWH is the most powerful. We see this when the title "Queen of Heaven" is mentioned in the bible. Whenever a false gods title is mentioned they Lowercased it, but for some reason The Queen of Heaven is not Lowercase, but instead uppercase. (Jeremiah 44) . Anyway, I figured I would throw you for a small loop, my goal is not to diminish anything, but instead to help further the education of the people. :) Hope you are having a Blessed day.
Jesus God_Savior Thank you my friend :)
This was a well thought out and researched excellent video. It's spot on.
Thank you for these videos; I've always identified as an atheist/agnostic and a Naturalist though Jesus has appeared in my dreams and when I have panic attacks He is there to help me through them. I don't know what to make of it because I am skeptical of what is happening. Others non-belivers have mostly mocked me or say that I am lying about seeing Him in my darkest hours. I don't know what to make a concepts of God or how to read everything in the Bible however Jesus seems to be able to help whereas the most people, churches, atheistic organizations, relationships, drugs, and doctors have come up short. I know there are Westboro church style Christians and mocking leaning toward pseudo intellectual atheists out there because I once walked with the FFRF folks and found them as religious and blind faith based as the YEC style baptists that sour people on church and give them emotional reasons to reject Jesus. Jesus said he came for the sick and The Bible said to Draw Near. The Bible could be written by reporter that are like a reverse J. Jonah Jameson for the Spider-Man (by bad analogy which can be mocked because Spider-Man is fake despite existing but was drawn up by Stan Lee but He seems to be a manifestation of Words that came to life like a Stephen King novel written by weird prophets Isaiah 100s of years before hand...Yada Yada Yada... I know all the jokes,, insults,, and disses for the bad analogy) but there seems to be something to this Nazarene by all accounts.
Also I call Him a Nazarene the way Eminem represents Detroit despite being born in Missouri yet most atheists allow that pass but when it comes to Jesus they act like they can't grasp something like that or understand how you can represents a place and not be born there but still call it home. I also find it interesting how Eminem took something like rap which was consider belonging to one group of people (by some like those who called him Culture Vulture) and has opened up rap music to the masses like Jesus did with The God of Israel and opening that up to others. Same with Hank Williams learning music from a black man who never wrote anything down and people know very little about yet that music has now influenced music and people globally.
What did jesus look like? The classic man with a beard?
Thank you this was insightful.
I'm going to have to disagree.
John 18 happens at night, after dinner. During the night, Jesus is taken to Annas while Peter is outside warming himself by the fire because it is cold--because the Sun is not up.
John 18:28 says it was early. This agrees with Mark 15 that says "As soon as it was morning..." thus, early. Also, the Synoptics refer to the time that Jesus was crucified as the 6th hour, but John is recounting the time that Jesus was condemned to death as the 6th hour. I agree that there is some leeway with their precision of the time, but I think the trials happened while it was night for some and early morning with Pilate, and John was rounding off to 6 AM for when Jesus was condemned, while it was probably actually later than 6. Then they have to get the cross and make the sign that goes above Jesus' head, and the actual crucifixion is closer to noon, which is the time that the Synoptics discuss.
Sir.. Why John said the day of the crucifiction was the day of the passover while in the synoptic account, the crucifiction day is after the passover. Why would John make such a difference? .. It made the NT seem less reliable..
Thank you IP.
Hey Mike could make a video about the 72 disciples of Jesus and whether Luke was one of them and also it is an apparent contradiction whether it was 70 or 72 thanks
Atheists and Christians could just get a lot of arguments out of the way if they would just read history. . .
We do - that's why I became an atheist. This is a bad explanation.
@@veridicusmaximus6010 I know it is been 3 years but I can answer your doubts with the holy spirit
*IS THERE REALLY A CONTRADICTION?*
Answering the question of how long Jesus was on the cross is complicated by the fact that two systems of marking time are used in the Gospels. Matthew, Mark, and Luke use the Jewish system of marking time. John uses the Roman system. Using the Jewish system, Mark says, “They crucified him and divided his garments among them, casting lots for them, to decide what each should take. And it was the third hour when they crucified him” (Mark 15:24-25, ESV). According to this, Christ’s crucifixion began at 9:00 A.M.
Also using the Jewish system of marking time, Matthew says that “from the sixth hour there was darkness over all the land until the ninth hour” (Matthew 27:45, ESV). That is, the darkness lasted from 12:00 noon to 3:00 P.M. This was Jesus’ final three hours on the cross. At the end of that time, “when Jesus had cried out again in a loud voice, he gave up his spirit” (Matthew 27:50). After that a Roman soldier made sure of His death (John 19:34), and Jesus’ body was taken down. Jesus had been on the cross from approximately 9:00 A.M. until 3:00 P.M., a total of six hours.
John adds the detail that Jesus’ trial before Pontius Pilate was taking place, according to Roman time, “about the sixth hour” (John 19:14, ESV). Since the Romans started counting their hours at midnight, the “sixth hour” would start at 6:00 A.M.
So, using the Roman system:
“about the sixth hour” = about 6:00 A.M. Jesus is sentenced by Pilate.
Then, using the Jewish system:
“the third hour” = 9:00 A.M. The crucifixion begins.
“the sixth hour” = 12:00 P.M. (noon). Darkness begins.
“the ninth hour” = 3:00 P.M. Jesus dies.
Putting it all together, Jesus’ trial ended about 6:00 A.M. His crucifixion began about three hours later, and He died about six hours after that.
The trial didn't end at 6 a.m. Pilate only got going at that time.
A crucifixion doesn't begin in one moment is over the next.
The supposedly Roman system is not a Roman system.
Excellent explanation backed by reputable scholarly citations. I appreciate that you briefly mentioned the “Jewish vs. Roman timekeeping” hypothesis but did not build your argument on it. It makes much more sense to view the text through the lens of the culture in which it originated-rather than imposing (very recent) Western presuppositions onto the text and demanding that it conform itself to our modern ways of thinking.
Thank you so much for all the amazing videos. I couldn’t guess the amount of time spent on each one. Between research and making the video seems like it would be more than a full time job to me. They are appreciated very much and are very helpful.
0:50 Also because this wasn't the Roman system. There was no way to tell midnight - hence one could not count from midnight.
Good Job 👍.
Doing a very good job, as always.
Keep making these videos, this is your best content
You did an wonderful job! God bless you!!!
Im still lost. How could have there been such a discrepancy between the two gospals if John wasnt simply using Roman time? It still would have showed that Jesus was judged after being crucified, which makes no sense. Maybe I'm just not getting it.
Have you ever seen witnesses accounts in a trial? There normally is a time gap between 1 and even 2 hours when they tell the same events. Now imagíne that in an era when time wasn't measured so precisely.
Thanks a ton man for this!
We can still see remains of this in phrases like morning noon and night.
Great video IP!
One thing is right - John is not using the Roman Civil hour system. But the solution in this video is just as problematic and typical of Blomberg's gymnastics. If John is just guesstimating why does he use specific hours? And if he is using "quarters" why does he say the 10th hour in John 1:35-39? I have never heard of the 10th quarter. The only time quarters used in the hour system was for the nighttime - Vigilia Prima, Secunda, Teritia, and Quatra - the first, second, third, and fourth watch. The 6th hour of John if under such a system would mean Jesus is before Pilate from midnight- just prior to 3am on Friday. And the only ones placing precision on the text is John by using such things as hours in the first place. So those reading it as such are not the ones imposing modern standards on to the text.
The hour was flexible but not to the degree of meaning a possible 3 hour period. An hour was able to lengthen or shorten depending upon the length of daylight and nighttime darkness. The max was about 75 minutes while the minimum was about 45 minutes depending on the Winter or Summer Solstice. But Jesus was crucified during Passover (April just after Spring Equinox) so the hours were pretty much the same - about 60 minutes. Giving John some flexibility we can say what he meant when he said the 6th hour on the Jewish or Roman (Natural hour system) - between 11:30 and 12:30. That's it!
And they had precise enough time keeping devices to account/allow for this flexibility but not to think that they could be off by a 3 hour period. You sum up with "In other words the ancient audience would not care about precise time keeping" - yet John sure did! Playing fast and loose with an hour by making it really 3 hours in order to make it work. When details show a problem - they really don't matter - when they don't they are God's precision and stamp of inspiration that calls for never ending reams of theology. Imagine the Jews running their ceremonial sacrifices as such - 10 am sacrifice or 12 midnight no biggie as long as it's dead. Yeah! Can't you guys just admit humans make mistakes.
Please help me out, because I'm still confused. If I understand correctly, then even if they would have simply chosen a different time frame.... how does this explain that John chose the higher one (6th hour) for an event that was way before the crucifixion.
Great vid as always 😊
I am surprised that Inspiring Philosophy appears to have no knowledge of the Civil Lunar and Jubilee Qumran calendars. These calendars give a far better account of the apparent contradiction.
There were accurate mechanisms in that time period such as sundials and water clocks but without a digital or analog display, I can see estimations/interpretations being made that would depend on the persons viewing them.
Hey if this really the 21st one, why is your playlist only 1p videos long?
This is very interesting I never heard this explanation before keep up the good work IP!!!!! Keep cranking those videos love them
Hey, IP. I’ve been looking for your Ted Talk but couldn’t find it. Did they not post it yet?
Semi-related question: do you think there are any contradictions in the Bible? Do you hold to any kind of inerrancy?
I don't even know what the hell inerrancy even is anymore. Everyone defines it differently. So i agree with Mike Licona and just outright reject the term. Of course there are contradictions in the Bible, like differences between 1 &2 Kings and 1&2 Chronicles. As for the gospels differences, I'd recommend the book hated by fundamentalists everywhere, by Licona, "Why Are There Differences in the Gospels? What We Can Learn from Ancient Biography."
@@InspiringPhilosophy i know your a christian apolegtic and i look up to you and your works, but what is the point in using a book that has contradictions? at this point i am genuinely confused
Excellent explanation. Can you do one on the “day” of the crucifixion.
Trying to harmonize John with the Synoptics can be difficult regarding the day of crucifixion within the context of the feasts. I understand that there are two different types of sabbaths and this might help with the issue, but I’d love your insight on this.
He has a video on that
Maybe John was not inspired by God as God would not inspire such an apparent contradiction...unless God wanted this apparent contradiction?
Can someone give me a reference of another greco-Roman source where we know someone is rounding to 3rd, 6th, 9th hour, or 12th hour?
@Maester Gryphon why assume? And why do you disagree with his explanation? do you have a counterargument besides a mere assertion?
Matthew: Miriam and Joseph were afraid to return from Egypt, to Bethlehem, because they feared that Archelaus, the son of Herod the Great, would want to kill Jesus, so they chose to live in Nazareth, which was not under his control, hence it is clear that Joseph and Miriam lived in Bethlehem, according to Matthew.
If they were living in Nazareth, and only went to Bethlehem because of the tax, then there is no reason for Matthew to state why they chose to live in Nazareth, he would simply say that they returned to the city from Grom, Nazareth!
Can you also please explain the the so called contradiction in creation order in geniuses 1 and geniuses 2
My takeaway is that the Bible is not infallible because the ancients weren't as precise about time and could be mistaken about it, and I guess God couldn't inspire them to get the time right.
Or God didn't care about exact timing because the readers didn't care about exact timing.
The words "infallible" or "inspire" do not mean what you seem to think they mean.
@@str.77 infallible means without error. Whether God cared about timing or not, if it's not perfectly accurate then it's not infallible.
InspiringPhilosophy, can the next Bible Contradiction video be on the different accounts of the discovery of Jesus's empty tomb?
Probably
I know the answers to the contradictions and look forward to the resulting video.
But remember they say God inspired the Gospel so the time must be precise
Why?
Interesting. Thank you.
Does John not contradict Mark about the day when Jesus died? 14 Nisan vs 15 Nisan.
Omg! Omg! Omg! I have to say this! I’m sorry for having doubt that religion is rational to believe! I’m so sorry! And best of all! Your not a lying Christian! You are a honest man full of wisdom!
Was Jesus crucified the day before the Passover,or in the day of Passover?
Did "The Last Supper" was the Passover meal or an ordinary supper?
(For general information, this is a contradiction that even New Testament scholar George / John Wallace claimed he could not solve).
This may be off-topic, but do you plan on refuting EssenceOfThought’s videos “refuting” your upload about abortion?
I’m not wasting time on that troll. His arguments are horrendous as is.
One of your best!
what about the year ??
Hello, IP! Considering that the gospel of Luke was written much later than the previous gospels, what was the purpose of incorporating it into the New Testament, if it most likely took what was in the previous gospels?
Rekarious Luke was not only a physician but also a interviewer, Luke made a job to compilate more info from Jesus’s family and the apostles including Paul. Many details were not put together in Mark or Mathew. Same reason John wrote his gospel with a more personal view and focusing more in Jesus’s divinity. Remember Luke made this for Theophilus ( maybe a Greek Jew a leader of one of the new Christian churches).
@@MAP2023 Thank you very much for the reply. This very much clarifies the matter.
Can you do one of these for where jesus was arrested? Three different locations mentioned in the Gospels!! I feel like there is something about biblical geography that can help explain this?
One location is mentioned: the Garden of Getsemane on the Mount of Olives.
Michael! You should make videos on TikTok. There’s a lot of people there who extremely hate God.
I bet he'd be banned from it not too long after posting a few videos.
TikTok will die soon. It is a Vine ripoff.
@@MAP2023 Let's hope so🤐
Meat is from 3:39 -5:10.
Not exactly sure the Holy Spirit would record an inaccurate record of the truth we have the spirit of truth vs the spirit of error. God is not the author of confusion so why isn’t this a simple clear teaching in scripture?
So why do we have to assume that they didn’t have an accurate measurement of time? Everything I am hearing is “extra biblical information” can you use the Bible alone to show there is no contradiction? I have faith but I’m seriously looking for a refutation BIBLICALLY not outside the Bible that would argue against the assumed contradiction of two different times
To be frank your the world's best christian defender tanks for your videos love from India 😎
It would be like you to put subtitles in English, because I don't understand English very well, I'm Brazilian.
Do you believe the Bible is inerrant? I am not sure why you feel the need to make these videos. I like them, but they feel unnecessary.
They show the Bible is not in error as skeptics like to assert
@@InspiringPhilosophy I do not see the reason for belief in scriptural inerrancy. Inerrancy is a product of the theological shifts that occurred after the Reformation. The belief that every single event reported in the Bible is historically factual, every word recorded therein literally true and every apparent contradiction unreal is contrary to almost all of Christian tradition.
I agree
@@tanner955 Yup. The MESSAGE is inerrant, which is what God would consider important.
I LIKE YOU INSPIRINGPHILOSOPHY
God wrote the entire Bible man wrote down the words.
Bro, you’re very thorough! Right on.
It is written in Jesus 2:12-15: Do not concern yourselves with accuracy, for it is the harmonizers that shall inherit this earth. In the end all I want people to do is to claim that they followed my teachings, while not quite getting my teachings. For I have a sense of humor.
If only someone had taken a picture, this will still be a non-issue. Jesus Lives!!! 😎
RECONCILING DIFFERENT ACCOUNTS OF THE FIRST VISION a similar defense of the "apparent contradictions" in Joseph Smith's First
Vision!
Not the same. The Gospels were written by different people, it makes sense that each gives different details.
@@vincenzorutigliano5435 "Mark" is derived from Paul. The other "canonical" gospels derive from "Mark" an unknown person writing who knows where, when or for what purpose. Any questions?
@@tgrogan6049 Mark isn't derived from Paul and while Matthew and Luke use his text,they are not simply derived from him. John is fully independent anyway.
Nor is Mark an "unknown person".
@@str.77 Please write me in a few sentences everything you know about "Mark"?
Yet another profound insight to add to so many others you have provided us with Thank you once again.
IP you strawmanned this one look at the following texts. They are completely different days.
Book of John
14 It was the day of Preparation of the Passover; it was about noon.
Book of Mark
Jesus Eats the Passover Meal with His Disciples
12 On the first day of the Festival of Unleavened Bread, the day the lambs for the Passover meal were killed, Jesus' disciples asked him, “Where do you want us to go and get the Passover meal ready for you?”
When i see this video starting i thought IP do not know these time difference (John rome time) others different..but you know everything..i know these facts before..but some common mans do not know about timings..we can clearly tell 3pm Jesus died
Please explain gender to Me and why God made 2 genders
You have a decent channel and cite sources well, but the bias comes out strong here. Like you make this whole video about addressing minor exact time of day problems with the gospels, without at all addressing the fact the Mark and John say Jesus died on completely different days. It's not a "supposed discrepancy." It's just a discrepancy.
See #20 from this series.
John has jesus crucified as the passover lamb a day before the passover others have him crucified after having eaten the passover.
Ok first of all Jesus was crucified on Thursday the 5th day of the week the 15th day of the month
Wednesday at even, the start of Thursday is the beginning of the passover/feast of unleavened bread
That is Understanding
ok
Halleluyah 🔥🔥🔥🇮🇳
So are you convinced that there is no contradiction in the Bible?
There are non p.s I'm a muslim
Amazing dishonesty from the supposed followers of truth..
Drops 🎤
I think the discrepancies between the birth stories are far more interesting.
I find the strong agreement between Matthew, Mark, Luke, John, Peter and Paul that Jesus died as a sacrifice for us, was buried and was raised by God to be most interesting. :) Minor, relatively easily explained discrepancies don't work me up too much. It is nice to have someone tackle them so clearly for us. The prophetic writings of the Messiah preserved in the Septuigent version of the Old Testement are interesting as well.
I think I'ts rather pointess working your way through apparent 'Bible contradictions'right now. there are so many ~ you have a lifetimes' work ahead of you! you would be much better served by looking at the pain and the suffering of people around you and coming up with some cogent reasons and comfort for those who are doing the suffering right now. How can you be so irrelevent to events? Where is the help and compassion? Sad.
how do you know that he is not helping? it is evil that he wants to understand the bible or dedicate some of his time to G-D?i think is not nice to condemn people because they dont "help others" all the time. i know lots of people who help others but they are horrible human beings.
What are doing to aleave this suffering you feel so convicted about that you are writing about in CZcams's comment section? Why are you here insulting other's faith instead of helping all the people suffering then?
Don’t really care for contradictions. I’m sure you can use semantic techniques to harmonise almost anything. Plus, it doesn’t mean something didn’t happen, just that down the line after decades of the story being passed down by ear, a few people got minor details wrong. Not hard to believe. If anything, it’s more embarrassing denying things like this happen. I’m much more inclined to believe a story about a war happening with a few conflicting figures than a consensus on something like someone rising from the dead...
If I’m going to point out a contradiction, it’s going to be about your worldview and not something trivial like this. Tussle with these two below-
1) If god is omniscient and knows everything you’re going to do, how do you have free will (the ability to choose differently)? This isn’t saying god is controlling you, but that if god knows everything you’re going to do, your actions are determined. You do not have the free will to choose differently.
2) How is an all loving god consistent with one who, in exodus, killed a bunch of innocent Egyptian babies for pharaoh’s crimes? Obviously this isn’t the on example, just my favourite. If god gets to do whatever he wants, then how does that then not make good completely arbitrary?
1. I really don't get this "logic". I never have understood. How does God knowing your actions = determinism??? If I took my child to an ice cream parlor, pointed to the menu, let them pick any favor they wanted, and I knew my child was going to pick chocolate because that is their favorite flavor, does that mean their choice of chocolate was determined by me?
2. First of all, God cannot "do whatever He wants." He cannot contradict his nature, such as lying. This is a misunderstanding of God's omnipotence. Secondly, for the Exodus passage, you have to internally critique it in order for it to be a non fallacious argument. From an atheists point of view, there is no life after death. God taking the life of someone, especially at such a young age, is horrible to them. However, from a Christian/Jewish point of view, there is an afterlife. I see it as an act of mercy, actually, not cruelty. Those babies were handed into the loving arms of a Savior after death. Thirdly, since God is the ultimate creator of life, He has the right to take it away whenever he wants. As humans, we don't. And I'm not sure what you mean by "good." As for the initial purpose, it was to pass judgment onto Egypt and persuade Pharaoh to let the Hebrews go.
1) God could have created the world in an inimaginable amount of different ways.
If he is "above" time, then he may see what happens from the beggining to the end of the world he creates.
Now, I want you to imagine with me the following situation:
What if, instead of creating a world in which you would be born in the country you were born, God choose to bring you to life in Japan, or Africa, or any other country in the world.
Do you agree that this change would affect some of the decisions you would take in your life?
So God could have chose to bring you back to life in any country, knowing that any of those possibilities would lead to different outcomes about your life decisions.
Let's say that if you were born in Japan, you would "freely" marry at age 30, but if you were born in Canada, you would freely marry at age 25, and God for some reason wanted you to be married at 25...
I think you get what I'm saying right now.
That's a way in which he can control what you will do even tho you're free to choose.
2) If God is real, then killing anyone is just passing this person to another state of existence.
Is it "Bad" to get people from this life to the afterlife? At least that's not obviously "bad" for me, it would need more arguing to get to that conclusion.
And to answer about the "If god gets to do whatever he wants, then how does that then not make good completely arbitrary?".
The truth is: God doesn't get to do whatever he wants.
He himself says in Numbers 23:
“What did the LORD say?” Balak asked.
18Then Balaam lifted up an oracle, saying:
“Arise, O Balak, and listen;
give ear to me, O son of Zippor.
19God is not a man, that He should lie
So we know that there are certain principles/values that don't change in God's character and that he has to act accordingly to those values.
I want to know, what I've said made sense to you? I don't want to be hostile. Forgive me if something I've said made it seem like it.
And I'm Brazillian, so if I made any mistakes while writing, forgive me ahahahhaha
@@ea-tr1jh I never got a notification for this. Sorry for the late reply.
1. Okay. So a god knowing your actions = determinism for this reason. So if an infallible god knows every action you take before you take it, those actions are determined and you cannot do differently as to what this being saw you do. Thus, you don’t really have will because you cannot do differently as to what this infallible being has already seen you do. Again, this doesn’t necessarily mean that the being is controlling the decision, but it still means that the actions are determined if they know what you’re going to do infallibly. It’s like watching a movie for the second time. You know exactly what the characters are going to do and they do this every single time. They cannot suddenly change what they do in it. You’re not controlling those characters, but their actions are still determined. Although I think you can argue that since god set up he universe (script for the movie) with full knowledge of everything that was going to happen if he chose to do it this particular way, you could argue that he is indeed, responsible- determined it that way.
2. My wording was poor in this one. By ‘doing whatever he wants’ I meant ‘whatever he does is just good by definition’. So killing innocent babies in exodus for example, is good by definition. However, if anyone followed these kinds of actions for the same reasons, I doubt it would be considered ‘good’. So we’re applying a double standard to god here when it comes to good, which simply labels whatever he does/is as good. And that becomes a meaningless tautology that is no different to saying god does what he does or god is what he is. It’s the exact same equivalent of saying that. Not only does this mean that calling god good is a vapid tautology void of its intended meaning, but I would even argue that this label of ‘good’ is not something to be respected and revered by reviled. Again, poor original wording on my part. Was trying to be too concise.
So, it’s okay to kill infants because they get to go to heaven when you do so? So when people have abortions or people kill babies, are they actually then doing a good thing since they are sending them to heaven? Does this count as an act of mercy? In a way, it’s guaranteeing them eternal happiness versus the potential of rejecting Jesus and suffering for eternity. So why then condemn others for doing the same as god? Unless you apply to a double standard where it’s okay for god to do so but not others, which would be my original point.
Right, well, I don’t care if god is the creator of life. That doesn’t mean he gets to do whatever he wants with it and then retain his ‘all loving’ title. He has a bit more responsibility than that. But if he gets to kill whoever, whenever, for whatever, then this is what I meant by ‘doing whatever he wants’. And if your definition of god being perfectly good is set to a standard so low as this, something lower than the standards set for humans, then your description, like I said, becomes void of all intended meaning. If ‘good’ is being able to kill whoever, whenever, for whatever, then it is no longer something to be revered but reviled.
Can an all powerful god not free slaves from a man without killing innocent babies? If anyone suggested this or did this for the same reasons, we’d still consider them immoral for the actions that led them there. Especially if they are clearly able to achieve so in much more peaceful terms considering their power.
@@yanbarros6401 1. Yes. If I was born in Japan, with a completely different lifestyle to the one I had now, I’d probably make many different decisions. That’s because decisions are influenced by many factors.
I don’t really get what you’re saying? No. If god had me born in Canada, I’d then be determined to get married at 25. This kind of confirms my point. I cannot then deviate from being married at 25 if god is infallible.
And the last sentence is a bit baffling. God controls me but I still have a free choice? I don’t think that choice is free anymore if god is controlling it. Again, we’re defining free will as the ability to do differently here.
2. Right, well then if killing someone is just passing someone on to another existence, then why do we condemn things like murder? If we’re just passing people on to other existences.
I would argue that yes, passing people on is still bad because it causes the families suffering and that it takes away a persons freedom to choose.
By ‘god gets to do whatever he wants’ please read the second part of my reply to the last guy. I was a bit vague here and I apologise but I clear up what I meant by it. You didn’t seem hostile at all and your English was very good so don’t worry.
I’ll copy and paste the response I gave to the other guy so if there’s extra in there, my bad.
2. My wording was poor in this one. By ‘doing whatever he wants’ I meant ‘whatever he does is just good by definition’. So killing innocent babies in exodus for example, is good by definition. However, if anyone followed these kinds of actions for the same reasons, I doubt it would be considered ‘good’. So we’re applying a double standard to god here when it comes to good, which simply labels whatever he does/is as good. And that becomes a meaningless tautology that is no different to saying god does what he does or god is what he is. It’s the exact same equivalent of saying that. Not only does this mean that calling god good is a vapid tautology void of its intended meaning, but I would even argue that this label of ‘good’ is not something to be respected and revered by reviled. Again, poor original wording on my part. Was trying to be too concise.
So, it’s okay to kill infants because they get to go to heaven when you do so? So when people have abortions or people kill babies, are they actually then doing a good thing since they are sending them to heaven? Does this count as an act of mercy? In a way, it’s guaranteeing them eternal happiness versus the potential of rejecting Jesus and suffering for eternity. So why then condemn others for doing the same as god? Unless you apply to a double standard where it’s okay for god to do so but not others, which would be my original point.
Right, well, I don’t care if god is the creator of life. That doesn’t mean he gets to do whatever he wants with it and then retain his ‘all loving’ title. He has a bit more responsibility than that. But if he gets to kill whoever, whenever, for whatever, then this is what I meant by ‘doing whatever he wants’. And if your definition of god being perfectly good is set to a standard so low as this, something lower than the standards set for humans, then your description, like I said, becomes void of all intended meaning. If ‘good’ is being able to kill whoever, whenever, for whatever, then it is no longer something to be revered but reviled.
Ever heard of a sundial?
The Greek word ωσεί suggests when it says "it was about the x hour," we might say "it was pushing the x hour" which supports your thoughts here.
By assumption people hope for salvation. LOL.
Disagree. The fourth Gospel changed the day and the time of Jesus’s crucifixion so that they coincide with the day and time of the sacrifice of Passover lambs, in order to fit with that Gospel’s “Lamb of God” theology. That is also why the fourth Gospel does not have Jesus sharing a Passover meal with his disciples prior to his arrest as in the earlier three Gospels. Because in the fourth Gospel Jesus has to die exactly with the lambs.
the bible is not a history book, it is a spiritual book...
Wrong.
What a champ
Being that jesus was actually not mentioned except in the bible makes me go hmm...... Not a lot of evidence outside of the bible for someone who was supposedly performing miracles. Hmm.....
"Not mentioned outside the bible" except for being mentioned by Josephus, Tacitus, Pliny the younger, etc.
@@grubblewubbles so one guy basically mentioned it. It's a major miracle if it happened. Not sold yet. It's like the fact that in all of history one guy had a vision of heaven. One guy out of billions of humans. Really?
@@Truth-Be-Told-USA I listed 3 people outside of the Bible who mention Jesus. You said that there were none. That pretty much settles it. The reason not many ancient authors record about Jesus is that they simply believed he was a charlatan whom there was no point in bringing up.
@@grubblewubbles humanity has had billions of humans in history and today. 3 or 1 is insignificant and you know it. If 3 people said there was chocolate rain in Hawaii no one would believe it without more witnesses. It's a joke. God is clearly evil and enjoys his own evil entertainment. God is clearly blessing the leftists and keeping them out of jail
@@grubblewubbles 3 people LOL settles nothing. Where was everyone else?
I have another contradiction that I hope you answer. I don’t know the exact verse but in the Old Testament it says a baby is alive when it takes its first breath, but in the New Testament it says a baby is alive at conception.
Nathan Tone You don’t need to look in the Bible. Science confirms this and logic, too. A fetus is a living unborn baby, the newborn is a born living baby.
Miguel Peralta I know but that’s not the problem. The problem is the Bible contradicts itself.
Nathan Tone There is no contradiction at all, those verses don’t cancel each other out. You think they contradicted themselves because you want them to do so. 🤦🏻♂️🤦🏻♂️🤦🏻♂️
Thanks IP, for being the lamp that guided my faith
Crear explanación, as usual