danger close (and incorrect) fire mission Generation Kill
Vložit
- čas přidán 24. 10. 2010
- in episode/part 3 of generation kill, the incompetent / "super blurr" Company commander of B company tried to call in fire mission based on wrong information that there was 100 killer RPG (enemies). Despite after being clarified by one of his Platoon Commanders that is isnt so, funny / interesting part is that after being told target point is just 200 metres away from them and anything 600m or below is danger close, besides not knowing what is Danger close, he ignored common sense .... and still insisted on doing (maybe just to show he is "in charge")... eventually there is (fortunately) no fire mission because again of his incompetence, he didnt know and didn't use correct protocol/instructions necessary for executing the fire mission; hence later part of clip (based on radio traffic,) the artillery guys clearly ignored him but proceed to give fire support for Alpha (A) company's commander's request for fire mission since Alpha commander given the correct protocol/instruction.
- Krátké a kreslené filmy
The most dangerous element in a combat zone: An incompetent officer
in this case his incompetence was so great that it saved everyone there
Butter bars with a compass
The most dangerous element would be the enemy, after all, an incompetent officer is only there because they are there too.
@@Arcaryon An incompetent officer can get you killed with no enemy around, like Encino man was about to do. lol
@@jakelee5096 You LITERALLY hear gunshots and explosions in the clip.
That officer would have been fragged by his own guys if he’s in Vietnam
look up the death of Philip Esposito and Louis Allen
One of my old plt sgts told a story of how one of his 1SGs in Iraq let an LT bleed out because he ordered one of his guys to dismount off the tank only to get blown up as he touched the ground. The 1SG literally staring at the LT watching him die.
Lord Ahegao nice one, glad I’ll probably never serve under that sgt
Depends on the unit
@@maxron6514
I would
>Calls in artillery 200m from his position
>Has tanks nearby he could've radio'd up for support
CST Graphpads why risk it if it’s hunter killer?
@@vemundr9263 the abrams tank 120mm primarily uses apfsds and heat, but they also have HESH and cannister available for engagments involving infantry, there is a 120mm flacete round that the 120mm could use but isnt by the US.
@@TheSamplebridge maybe when we see the m1a3 they use it along with a tropy system
@@TheSamplebridge Can I just say how horrifying it would be to have to deal with a 120 mm flechette round?
Like, please, just put a .50 through my head or chest and call it done.
Well how am I supposed to get my bronze star with a V if I don’t do dumb shit?
"Assassin, this is Steel Rain, YOUR grid zone designators are correct."
The smugness behind that line is biblical.
I didn't get it. Care to explain?
Somewhere in the comment feed is a chain of comments under mine. I explain it there.
@@babayaga9102 Assassin is their sister company, when they called in fire support they got it right as compared to Hitman who gave the wrong grid zone. It's a running theme in the series that the sister company actually has competent officers.
FDC is always full of smug a**holes lol
@@RobertMc0811 That's because if you shot outside of the box, it's their ass if they gave bad data
"...YOUR grid zone designators are correct." This shit is hillarious.
Spending some time in a mortar FDC, this level of radio-appropriate shit talking feels right at home
I didn't get it. Care to explain?
@@babayaga9102 my understanding (which is likely not entirely accurate) is that Encino Man, the captain calling in the fire mission, was using an incorrect grid zone designator, which is the prefix for the map sheet he was using. Thus, the rounds would have landed nowhere near his intended target (maybe in another county, lol). The FDC recognized this and disallowed his fire mission. The passive aggressive jab he makes is to make Encino Man feel stupid over the radio. Someone please correct me if I’m mistaken, I’m just a lowly POG.
@@BoomerWarfare Even i was little confused in that scene because i don't know much about military terms. What is grid zone designator? and if the grid zone designator was incorrect , why was the artillery fired?
@@shikharashish5183 a grid zone designator is at the bottom of the map sheet and identifies which sheet you’re using. Artillery was fired in this video because two different people called for fire on different targets. One fire mission was denied, the other was acted upon.
You've got to hand it to the guy who plays Encino man. He plays the role so well you really start to hate him.
indeed, this series had really good acting on the marines side, the iraqi's feel a little stiff though.
That's when you know you've acted well. When everyone hates you. I played a bad guy in an amateur dramatic play and my SO said she didn't want to sleep in the same bed as me because I was so horrible.
Best compliment I ever got.
@@davidian7787 wait, what if she meant bad at acting?
@@davidian7787 What was the name of it?
Same with Captain America. You don't quite hate him since he is a nice guy, but such and idiot that you wish he would just shut up and listen to his NCOs.
I remember when I was in Afghanistan as Army working with Marines. My CO was very into listening to his subordinates and trusted them. He was always super paranoid about our safety. Then one time him and a Marine CO got into an argument regarding a very close air strike to us. The Marine CO absolutely refused to listen. So my CO told up to pack it up we’re leaving. Marine CO called him out and was mocking him calling us cowards. My CO being more level headed didn’t say anything. I asked him what was that all about? My CO said “Marines Officers are trained to care about one thing and one thing only, that being medals and awards. Their men are just numbers. To me you guys aren’t numbers I know you guys, I live with you guys. I won’t even let you guys get a papercut if I can help it.” Later that day at the FOB the marines pulled in a bunch of trucks with wounded Marines and Soldiers. Those marines had shrapnel wounds from one of our ordinance. I remember standing there a young private watching them take the bloodied bodies of marines to the medical station. My CO came up to me and said “Told you, Private....Big mans gonna have a medal by tomorrow.” Only when I met that CO years later him now a major and me a sergeant I understood why he was so against marines officers. Because his brother was killed by one in Iraq when he was a Lance Corporal. The officer that called in a strike on his brother got a medal for doing it.
Well....shit.
Shit
I hope I'm not that fucking incompetent
I want this comment to be upvoted more. I seldom say thanks to US soldiers but thank you for this story. I hope that officer is well .
Things that never happened 500
Best comment
We had a second lieutenant who just like that guy in Vietnam. He was fresh out of OCS
Finally the first sergeant had enough and took him in the bunker and “ talked to him “ After that he turned out to be a fine officer
The boy is lucky he wasnt fragged
2nd lieutenants shouldn’t be given a platoon straight out of OCS. I think they should be assigned to at least a 1st LT or captain to be sort of an apprentice/mentee to said more experienced officer
@@zacarribuffet8882 In Vietnam, the US had issues with troop shortages in quite a few areas. That's the whole reason project 100,000 was started.
@@zacarribuffet8882 I thought thats what company commanders were for?
@@dervogalfanger3097 No. company commanders are in charge of....................Companies....
"Sir, tell me EXACTLY what you're doing." That's a phrase I've had to utter to more than one officer.
Man same here and I’m just a SPC(P) 🤣. Luckily my LT listens she’s a butter bar tho.
Stolen valor. U ain't a marine
youtube army men. In your dreams baby
@@obannon7740 huh? I don’t understand your nonsense.
@@stanmoroncini8825 I said you have never been in army boy
For those who don't understand the Grid Zone designator line, U.S. military maps break the earth into 100,000m grids that are typically designated with a two letter combination. Assassin begun with PU which was the correct area, Bravo Co. Commander was using PQ. Basically he was calling a fire mission and would be 100km off target which is... a bit of a boo-boo.
Worse, PQ isn't even in Iraq anymore. It's in Saudi territory. Dude was about to start a war with an allied country just for a medal
My ass in Riyadh looking up from the newspaper: 'What the...'
Thank you for that explanation.
I may not understand the jargon but I can imagine something like that could end up going from a Bit of a Boo-boo to a complete and utter clusterfuck from hell.
@@darkhunter5293 complete and utter clusterfuck doesn't even begin to describe the hellfire that would evaporate everyone from the sorry puke who pulled the cord on the cannon up to the brigade and perhaps division commander if a fire mission was actually sent through that was 100km off.
"Reconfirm grid zone designator."
"Um... What do you mean?"
LOL.
I love how they just ignore him after that.
"Standby, Hitman. Break. Break."
What did they mean by that and why did he have the wrong ones? And who called the 2nd mission on the bathe party HQ?
Grid zone on military maps will have 2 alphabet followed by 6/8 digit.
@@testfortester7131 it means that the coordinates were not in the right AO (Area of Operation), I checked the first coordinates the captain gave, dunno if it's accurate to the book or the real life event, but it basically pointed to a location in Saudi Arabia, the neighboring country down south. As for the 2nd mission, it's most likely called in by Fick, the guy who came over to the captain
Farhan AM but why did he give wrong coordinates? Did he not have a map and was just guessing numbers?
Former 13 Mike here. You don't call us up so lightly. Whether it be Army MLRS or Marine HIMARS, you don't call us unless you mean business. They don't call us "grid square removers" without good reason
I heard of a story that happened in Vietnam where two U.S. units tried to call in artillery strikes on each other and artillery caught their mistake before shooting.
@@orlock20 How did they mistake each other's positions?
@@yourdeath7820 I assume it was the same reason Pat Tillman was killed. Since it was policy even then to call a third party for an artillery strike, I assume it was a common thing for people to see movement at a distance and assume it's the the enemy.
@@orlock20 pat tillman was shot by friendly small arms fire for several minutes and was killed from 10 meters away. he was murdered plain and simple, this is nothing like that
This is where FDC comes in to make sure LTs don't call for fire on their position lol
Gotta love how Doc manages to stick a "sir" in there, making his outburst almost acceptable. Cue Encino Man's puzzled look as he tries to process if what was said was unacceptable form.
His dumbass was probably thinking about the mustache contest
Doc is not a marine, he's a naval corpman. And a respected one at that going thru buds. Doc doesnt answer directly to the Corp.
Well…nobody fucks with doc though. He kind of has understood command authority since if you’re shot, it’s doc who is coming to try and keep you alive.
@@Oblio1942 In the unit he's with yes he absolutely would answer to the officers. Doc Bryan had extensive training and was highly respected and that's probably the only reason he wasn't disciplined right there. Even the Gunny states that he should be NJP'd by Fick.
@@jamesbarnett527 Well no he's also a combat medic which no unit, let alone a recon unit, can spare. This is also why you see doc lead lots of the "complaints" of officers in the series. they can't just boot one of the few combat medics out of the unit and Doc knows it.
200 meters isn't danger close for arty. 200m is the kill zone
negative, 155s have a 50m radius of effects. danger close for mortars and artillery is 600m. 200 is close but not close enough to hurt you if behind cover. Forward observer knowledge i live by.
Only if those are 16-inch Iowa battleship guns.
Pretty much. I mean within 50M is the technical KZ but if you are 200 away you are still fucked up and dead
Educate yourself.
in any & EVERY case : bad place to be
I have never seen an officer THAT fraggin incompetent. I have heard stories, but I never saw one.
It happens in every sector of business and military... Except in private sector business it is usually a family member that is given a job they have no idea how to do...
Angst Tsgna ...and they don't have access to 155mm Howitzers, usually :D
Foxhole Norman
+Mr. Provocative films At least he wasn't a dunce like Encino Man.
Dike was more of a dunce though he didn't even try to lead though
lol at 5 second fire mission
apparently we got new shells traveling the speed of light and flash gordon for a loader
+Chris Jayson This is Hollywood, afterall. In reality, Alpha Co.'s fire mission must have been called in and delayed due to Hitman's incorrect execution of protocol.
lmao
the fuck is a strumpet?
ammo produced by Marvel Industries & CO. xD
+off topic 5s Time of flight would require the artillery to be very close, in flat terrain here it would probably be direct firing were it so close.
"Your grid zone designation are correct" Sounds like the artillery officer is a math teacher giving a quiz.
Nah, he knows a lot of people are listening to that net, and felt like shit talking in a radio-appropriate way that "if you're gunna have the audacity to call a mission 200m away don't be so fucked up so as to send your POS as 3000 miles away"
I didn't get it. Care to explain?
@@babayaga9102 The grid coordinates that the first officer were coordinates in Ukraine.
@@perkele8613 lol 🤣😂
@@perkele8613 fuck i bet that Artillery guy wishes he could hit Ukraine from Iraq. "sorry sir, we haven't secured project Babylon yet."
Wow this is weird AF to see on my feed. Was at an actual danger close fire mission near Diyala Iraq where two rounds dropped short, one behind me and one on top of an amtrack. Killed three Marines, and the official report is that it was enemy fire. It was friendly. Kilo 3/4, April 2003.
I was on an AFROTC exercise in May 2003 when a Lance Corporal who was there came and talked to us about that incident. He had come back to the States on some kind of medical leave. He casually lit a cigarette as he told us about it, standing at a makeshift podium in front of several dozen cadets.
At the time he told us it was Iraqi fire. I wish I could remember his name.
I like how the Marine at 0:16 was disturbed that his company commander didn't know about Danger Close, but he was gong to tactfully correct and teach the right thing without trying to embarrass his C.O. in front of the troops. But the Captain insists on it anyways.
It was a US Navy Corpsman but yeah
The marine corrected him. The Corpman was ornery as fuck. Can't blame doc
Well you don’t fuck with a SARC, we told officers off 99.9 percent of the time when they’re fucking up. My LT was my bitch. If we were in prison he’d be the one I pass around to my friends to have
how would he get to be a captain without knowing this or being able to call in artillery correctly
@@kentallard8852 You are correct in that a captain should really know his stuff. They've been in long enough, had positions like being a platoon commander. Sometimes 1st Lieutenants are even given the billet of a Company Commander if they're good enough. A Captain is no dumb boot and can be relied on.
However, every now and then in an organization, especially as it gets big enough, that someone not good for higher positions still makes it; They slip through the cracks. Recurring training, experiences in various positions, exercises should have prevented this. The stars align and someone not suitable still made it, somehow. The military is no exception.
Usually you can see someone with the proper high enough rank, time in service, etc, and you can safely assume they know their stuff, know what's up. Usually. Most of the time "the system" does right.
i knew what danger close was before i even entered middle school, just from watching movies...
+Bruce Willis lol, I was gonna say; I've never served in the armed forces and even I know what it is.
Try useing the term at age 7 lol
+Bruce Willis Fuck man I know that shit from Call of Duty and I've never even held a real gun.
+Cal6009 lol, i had heard the term when i was 3 from my father, and i hadn't ever even seen a gunn outside of movies
This has to be fake... A RECON MARINE OFFICER of all people NOT knowing what danger close is? Seriously? WTF? How dumb is this guy
“Officers call in danger close fire missions to get medals”
1:02 the man immediately proved him right
cff doesnt get u medals, being buddy buddy with the boss gets you medals. quotas for medals gets you medals. everyone knows this
Officer can easily write themself a recommendation for a Bronze Star Medal. That's why you see so many Bronze Star Medal on license plate. and once you know what they do to get medal, it's all BS. They put everyone at risk for a medal. This scene is very accurate. That's why when i see medals i always think how many people you screw over to get the medal. It's all a game to them and you are disposable.
@@jasonbarnes6568 True, it's like high school, if you not in the clique you gonna have a tough time in the military. While you doing shitty detail and the one who buddy with the leader, get to take smoke break and show up late and still get field grade promotion and promotion
@@wayup8700 Some in corporate culture, companies etc. It's just the nature of humans and people with different personality types like narcissists and psychopaths.
0:14 “danger close? Since when does Shepherd care about danger close?”
Lol
I wouldn't imagine a mw reference here 👌🏼😂
Too right mate
"And once again our asses are saved by sheer incompetence." Awesome line :D
He said FOR ONCE. Not ONCE AGAIN.
Either way, that's basically the tagline to the US Army.
Roger is Dead.
I love how the guy who calls him on how dumb he is, is a Navy guy lol
redith137 I read in the book the show was based on was that this Navy Doc called out the officers a few times because was Navy and attached to the Recon unit. Basically didn't give a fuck about insubordination.
He's also one of the most experienced / well trained guys. He passed up joining the Navy Seals to join the Marine Recon.
Us corpsman are like that
@@howardkingston7794 That should be one of the main rules - don't fuck with the guy who can save your life
But he's not just ANY Navy guy. He's a Recon Doc and very well-respected among the Marines.
And his famous quote “Let me remind you who the enemy is. It’s the enemy”
"Isn't this danger close for the task force."
"Since when does Shepherd care about danger close."
I like how in this scene Encino Man calls an artillery strike on his own guys over an rpg team that doesn't exist and fails because he doesnt even know the protocols, while Assassin sucessfully identifies and calls artillery on the Ba'ath party headquarters, but when they get back to base Godfather praises Encino Man.
This is basically the ZF clan call arty on Friendly's in a nutshell
Didn't think I'd see a womble comment here
Lmao that fire mission became an accidental broken arrow mission
@Noot Noot Wants Noose Noose this one still makes me crack up.
225199
Must have been called by Cyanide or Nevel...
"It's doesn't matter if it's right or wrong.."
Watching this after being in the military really changes my perspective. I have unironically heard these exact words said by a SNCO and CO. I've watched good people suffer for so many poor decisions.
I don't know if I can come back to these clips.
Can agree, one of the biggest dangers you can have for an entire operation is the competence of your leaders and theirs above them to make smart decisions
I worked for govt too, I've experienced identical behavior.
So, admission of bias, I do not wear the uniform anymore, so the rank does not intimidate me as much. However, if somebody says "It doesn't matter if it's right or wrong..." my kneejerk reaction is to say: "Yes is does, you f*cking troglodyte! Now shut up and get lost!"
Well this was written by an actual embedded journalist within this unit so it pretty much happened just like that in real life
I like how the guy telling him its danger close with the range finder can flip to the exact page that danger close is on but encino man doesnt even know the definition.
To think this is based on Actual events...
wait what
@@anderskaring5742 It's based on the collection of interviews with the same name.
The reporter embedded with them actually did a series of articles, in Rolling Stone, based on what he saw.
also based on Nate Fick's book
Decisions like this are made every minute of every day and that is why life on this earth is what it is.
since when shepherd care about dangerclose...
"Sir thats within 100 meters of your current position"
"Thats not a suggestion send it"
I was looking for this exact comment 😂
COD MW2 reference
Nice.
I remember watching this show when it came out. The way they depict the officers was so spot on and aggravating. I had so many of the same experiences with those types in Afghanistan just a few years prior. I would have to turn off the show and cool bc I was getting too mad
What sho
@@Heavycorp17 the show generation kill on hbo
I joined to be like LT Fick, but found out that the place was run by Encino Man and worse.
@@Dark-Mustang so many characters were spot on: the sergeant major, captain america, the gunney with all the gear..
This may be a little weird, but I love the radio etiquette of Steel Rain. Speaking very quickly, clearly, concise, zero BS. Even his sass is saying your "YOUR, grid zone designators are correct" is veiled in enough tact to be beyond reproach.
This is what proper military voice procedure sounds like. The required information is clearly communicated in minimum time. I know, because I was once a radio operator in a Canadian Army reserve unit.
What idiotic officer doesn't know danger close
Laila McManus apparently him.
Tactical Frog depends on what you’re calling up
@@andywuhu6720 for artillery it is
@@andywuhu6720 well, mortars would be the right thing to call in for that fire mission, you do a CFF (Call for Fire) artillery mission and it's within 500 meters of a friendly, you will be reported to the CO and probably even relieved.
More than you think
In my army, such an officer would be quickly "promoted" to sit behind a desk where he can't cause any more harm than he absolutely has to. When you're seeing a desk officer (as they are affectionately known) in the field, make sure that whatever you do, be not where he is, for where he goes, madness will follow.
I've seriously seen people volunteer for the worst duties in exchange of not having to be around goofballs like that. Self preservation is a powerful instinct.
Hazard pay is only hazardous if you can't trust your buddies.
Not in 03 Iraq, where any officer from a staff assignment to signals could've been reassigned to Infantry. Captain America was apparently a genius as an intel officer, but fell apart in the field
Yeah, the shit for brains are promoted in the US military too. Only problem is if you promote too many of them, without also promoting people who know what the fuck they're doing.... Then the shit for brains actually end up completely in charge, and you end up with the mess we've got now.
Military seriously needs to up the IQ requirement for recruitment.
@@Sneakyboson Problem is that the brainy guys and girls are already taken by other branches where you DEFINITELY do not want such a dud.
Because the stuff they handle sure ain't no dud...
Reason number 1 that desk officers should be behind a desk and not on the battlefield.
Tell that to Caesar lol.
The mistake Encino Man made is that in an earlier meeting, they changed the protocol for fire missions from being your location + distance and bearing to target, to just being the location of the target.
No, the problem is that the dude was trying to call in a strike on a target 100+km away from their area of operations. Artillery doesn't need to know your location, and it does literally nothing for them because they can't see where your position is. You give your own location + distance when calling in airstrikes, since air support can't ID friendly blobs from enemy blobs from civilian blobs from the air. Distance + location means that air support can choose their ordinance used + angle the strike away from friendly units. If the friendly calling in the airstrike is 3km away from the target, dropping a JDAM to level the neighborhood is on the table. If friendly forces are within 400m, then you are looking at a possible gun run or two at most.
Artillery is miles away from the line, and they are limited to just dropping ordinance on top of the target. The knowledge of friendly locations doesn't do them any good.
@@ShaggyRogers1 The FDC would need to know your position if you call in either a Polar or Shift From A Known Point fire mission because they need to know the Observer-Target line in addition to the Gun-Target line to process those kinds of fire missions.
What bothers me the most isn’t the incompetent LT, it’s the Gunny just standing by him saying shit like “you’re way outta line” or “it doesn’t matter if we’re right or wrong, you need to NJP that man” to LT Fick rather than correcting the LT who is actually screwing up. It’s one thing to have a fairly new and incompetent LT, it’s a whole other thing when senior enlisted are validating that screwed up behavior
The incompetent officer is actually a CPT
Totally makes sense
Even more hilarious is a gunny telling an LT he's out of line for correcting another officer. Every NCO knows that officers beef with other officers, and that's their business.
"I doesnt matter if we're right or wrong" I cringe everytime when I hear that. This is war, not a little kids game, that guy was about to blue on blue the hell out of that situation
As a FISTER, can we agree this was at least had effort put into it? Like the even gave an MTO. I think they meant time of flight, rather than a time to splash. But really, if a civillian made this, it shows he was at least moderately interested in accuracy. I've seen infantryman call in worse fire missions if I'm honest😂
Elyse Kovic :,)
Josh Jones 0861 approved, I was thoroughly impressed by the accuracy of the show
Infantryman here, can confirm
Josh Jones I’m a 13 Juliet agreed in Korea we where doing rehearsals and we got a mission to land in Africa
Love you FISTER's 19d heavy recon here. I loved working with you guys, fucking artillery scientists.
i like how the target is just 200 meters away and they're stood up talking like they're a kilometer behind the frontline
@Grim Looters Worse. The subtext being that everyone knows they're in danger by both sides by their enemy and by their incompetent leaders
Danger Close for Artillery and Mortars is 550m. The Safety Limit is 200m, adjusted when own troops start seeing live shrapnel. That’s what we were taught in the Australian Army, anyway.
"Australian Army" makes sense.
@@Khoros-Mythos ?
Good to know. This movie's about the U.S. Marine Corps, though.
@@harl3quinn similar doctrine
what's the danger close mark for emus?
One of the very first things I learned in AIT as a Forward Observer was range, corrections and DANGER CLOSE... As a matter of fact, I think we learned DANGER CLOSE first and saw the effects of friendly fire so when we had to actually call for fire within 600 meters we used the term DANGER CLOSE and knew just what chances we were taking. Danger Close was a last resort with us, mostly. This CO looks all ate up, but not unlike a lot of fucking ROTC officers I've seen in my military career.
@Albert Fels Knowing you probably fucked up when your entire fireteam goes silent and stares at you after giving an order isn't something that should need training, though.
Danger close is used all the time....its REDs you have to worry about
Sounds a waste of life especially with all the people fucking your career from every side
Some rotc LTs are not the brightest. The rest of us try hard to be tbe best we can be while taking care of our men
@@winningsince1992 yes, but you also have to take into consideration wind, humidity, weather, all that shit. So a 200m cff could land short and be the last cff you ever do
In Highschool, Danger Close was when you found yourself sitting on a really low toilet and your sausage and meatballs were "Dangerously Close" to touching the bottom of the bowl, which nobody ever wants because poo water could splash up during a fire mission. If you had to call one in, you either had to hover a few feet above the seat or be very careful, lest you risk "Friendly Fire" and have that filth splashed onto your package. I've only had to call in fire danger close twice as a senior, but I know a few guys who weren't so lucky.
/:
What the fuck are you smoking chief?
fucking golden
😅🤣😂😅🤣😂
Amazing
I still think it's cool how Captain Patterson is played by Michael Kelly AKA CJ, the mustachioed, propane tank-wielding badass from Dawn of the Dead.
No way... never saw that coming
Patterson isn't in this video, that's Craig 'Encino Man' Schwetje
Damn. I barely recognized him. The range of his acting Is amazing.
@@KumaTheSenpai yeah he is, he's the one who called the right fire mission and was worried about civilian casualties
@@heramann6916 that's Encino Man not Patterson.
“Dumb motherfucker sir even the most boot-fucked marine knows danger close” I love the Doc
Just love Lovell’s face when Encino Man says danger close. It’s like he’s lost all faith in command.
Funny, we have a bunker at work where FOO's go to experience being on the wrong end of an artillery barrage. Once locked inside a battery of AS90's drop 3 rounds each on the ground 100yards away. The trainees watch through armoured slit windows a couple of inches wide and a few feet thick.
What's interesting about this scene (and other scenes with the B company CO and company gunnery sergeant) is that the CO isn't even willfully incompetent. He really does care about his performance and wants to improve, but this job isn't at all his area of expertise. On top of that, his standard officer's training dictates that he look both in control and decisive to his subordinates, hence the brush-off of LT Fick's warning. But, all that wouldn't be set in stone if not for the most( at least to me) dangerous man in the whole company-the company gunny. This guy is 100% willfully(as in he wants to be) incompetent. This can be seen in several things, such as the intentional withholding of supplies, NVGs, and thermal optics from LT Fick's platoon, and the pointless swamp mission in a later episode. More importantly, he managed to convince the CO to look to him-and him first-for advice.
So, in part the CO's fuckups are due to the company gunny encouraging him to act like an idiot, and in part to him listening to his company gunny more then he listens to his platoon commanders(I'm not going to delve into his relationships with them but suffice it to say the company gunny encourages him to pick favorites). Essentially, this command structure is a toxic swamp, with any attempt to clean it forcefully pushed away.
Thought it was interesting that they're using a US Army Ranger handbook (from '92 I think) to reference danger close. Not that it couldn't be used, but I'm pretty sure that they wouldn't have needed to refer to any publication (let alone one from another branch)...but, who knows I was only a Cpl. (0351) when I got out...and it was nearly 17 years ago. Our first CO (prior enlisted) was amazing and top notch.
Intentions don't matter, only results. Encino Man should have been scrubbing toilets.
@@akshaynatu6568 maybe, but he made it to Iraq and a combat command, and that alone is enough to prove he had brains and drive. Just didn't know how to use them in combat.
Speaking of, I believe because Encino Man didn't have anything to base his command style off of for combat--not his fault, no new officer does anyway--he fell back on the leadership he knew best, football captain shit. He chose poorly.
@@mileskessler2905 How does a fcuking Neanderthal moron like Encino Man (and an insane lunatic like Dave McGraw/Capt. America) become a high-ranking officer?! Who did they blow? Who did their family pay off, are they rich?? Unless this show's portrayal of these two guys is WAY off base from reality, I just can't believe these zerobrains were promoted that high!!! Jesus.
I appreciate that two out of three officers here are competent, Fick and Patterson carry more than their fair share while Encino Man has to be baby sat by troops he's supposed to be in charge of.
When my cousin was in Iraq, one of the lieutenants in his company was the son of some politician or whatever. The dude had no chill. He was wrong more often than not. Routinely insulted the men under his command and even threatened a damn captain with his family name that if he didn’t get his way, he’d be dishonorably kicked out of the army. After he got back he tried to write himself up for a silver star. No I’m not making that up. He legit tried to award himself a silver star. The sad thing is, not once he faced consequences for his actions.
That right there is one of them future democrat or rino politicians in the making.
Crazy how he never fell into a door or tripped town some stairs….
Only ideas are bulletproof
@@pendragonshallhow many democrats have done something like that?
As someone who wants to become a Military Officer, messing up in the field especially, is my biggest concern.
As long as you listen to your nco and take in there imput you will do fine
@@Epicgamer980 Indeed, they've been in the field longer.
You would be miles ahead of officers who's biggest concern is messing up their own career.
Experienced NCO's can smell the difference, I assure you.
@@DreadX10 I appreciate that, thank you.
If you're concerned about it you're already in the right path
This is based on a real event. Hitman was lost in the sauce on location and my 1st Sgt sent them illum rounds before throwing the HE.
splash in 5 seconds? I wish it worked that fast.....
Lol it doesnt though. It will take the 13B's almost 5 seconds to get 3 or 4 rounds into the air. So maybe assuming we have rounds that can teleport to their target then sure thing.
first you have to input the info int to computer, then you have to send the gun orders, then the crew has to adjust and load the gun. then the time of flight. it take awile to send a round down range. BUT when the FDC says splash over, in this case 5 sec. the round has already been fired and will hit within 5 seconds.
@@jakemaize The round was already fired when the FDC replied back thus it was correct. When the company commander shouted to his troops "Splash in 5", it took about 7 so technically, there's abit of off but still, it's pretty accurate.
It's the same like cooking a grenade. The fuse is technically 7-10 sec depending on grenade but they told you to count to 3 then toss it out. Same logic.
@@MrLolx2u NATO standard fuses for grenades is 4.5 seconds. When you count to three you're getting close...I used to teach a class on grenades used by the VC/NVA. Contact time was from less than a second to 3 or 4 years...
its a actual callout given to forward observers to tell them the rounds are about to hit, it doesnt tell you how long they are already flying.
Man that confusion on what danger close is coming from a marine commander is more concerning than anything else I've ever heard. It's one thing to not be aware of the term and how anyone on Earth hasn't heard the term somewhere in life, movies, video games etc.... But to still not have any common sense to figure out that having a fire mission from artillery miles away hoping to land at a target 200 meters from you might be DANGEROUS is unreal... Just totally oblivious to everything and anything that any normal person should at least have some awareness of, let alone someone military trained and commanding a force... Wow
Douche move on Encino Man's part to be sure. To be fair, if you've read the book and Lt Fick's book "One Bullet Away", recon marine officers don't train to lead in the field. His MOS was intelligence officer but was still expected to be on par with experienced infantry officers like Assassin Actual if he didn't want to get passed over for O4, and if an officer in the marines is passed over twice in their career they're out of the corps.
Then it's up to him to become competent. If that means having an NCO. in his back pocket until he knows wtf he's doing, then he better wear out some BDU's. That all said, he should have learned to listen as a 2nd Lt. Someone failed him long ago. Either in not teaching him, or washing him out. All that aside, yeah, I've seen all ranks hang onto some people and I often wondered why.
While Encino Man’s incompetence is infuriating, Gunnery Sgt “Casey Kasam” Griego’s constant passing of the buck and basically allowing this shit to happen is inexcusable. And how Griego is constantly trying to throw Lieutenant Fick under the bus… I can’t even begin to describe my rage for Bravo Company’s Operations Chief. He’s just as bad as Captain Schwetje… if not worse!!!
Fick eventually gives him a little "know your fucking place trash" talk but it was definitely too late.
“What one should really fear is not a competent enemy, but an incompetent ally.”
-Napoleon Bonaparte
“Since when does Shepard care about danger close?”
When the Corpsman has to tell you something, you know you're already in the wrong.
He doesn't even know what Danger Close is!? How the fuck did he make company commander!?
Collegeboy
This was 2003. Anybody with a pulse or who hadn't been dead for 24 hours could get into the military, including nimrods and ne'er-do-wells.
+Derp Festor i'm not sure how it is in america, but he probably never set foot on a battlefield or did a tour as a grunt and went straight into officer school
The book explained he was a intelligence officer, but was forced into the company role because of men shortage
Then he should understand the limits of his knowledge and learn from his troop sgt or the other officers.
You'd think an intelligence officer would be more capable of that than others.
End of the days he's a bad officer
Nathaniel fick’s memoir “one bullet away” provided a really good explanation of this scene
If a Doc tells you it's a bad idea, than you should reconsider before calling in on something.
200m is close enough to catch shrapnel even if the shell lands exactly where you wanted it to
13F in training here doing AIT at fort Sill. Cool watching this clip before even thinking about joining the military and now watching it again and knowing everything they're saying after calling in hundreds of simulated missions.
changingTimes nobody cares POG
"That's danger close for artillery."
"...danger close...?"
*Visible disappointment*
Doesn't matter who you are; how experienced; how certain - you always welcome a second opinion if it's given in good faith: anyone can make a mistake.
Being a junior Officer, the incompetence of some Officers and NCOs can be overwhelming. Just accept that you can fix stupid, learn "Hanlon's Razor" and cling onto the competent commanders and NCOs. Learn, train and read (Sec. Def. Mattis professional reading list is a good start, it's about 78 books). Listen to your subordinates, foster an environment of trust and teamwork, develop thick skin and accept criticism, if warranted.
If you're interested, there is a movie that came out in 1998 called, "The Pentagon Wars." I recommend that movie to any inspiring Officer or NCO. The movie is a comedy, but you'll experience some of the chaos and stupidity that comes with a military career.
The one thing I find funny about the Pentagon Wars is that the Air Force did the exact same thing a decade after the Bradley came out when they started developing the F-35.
It needs to be amphibious.
Ahh, the F-35. A trillion dollar toy that will never work and will be in the works for 50+ years at least. That's what I call job security. Just imagine the amount of taxpayer money that's going into the waste category that's being pocketed.
I wouldn't recommend pentagon wars. As a military satire yes. But the film doesn't really convey the reality of the situation. Unless we are comparing James Burton to the guy who just tried to call the danger close.
@@Biscuitchris7again Lemme guess your main source is Pierre Sprey
Interesting discrepancy between the stories of Evan Wright & Nate Fick vs. Casey Kasem. Kasem's version: "The Company commander saying to Doc Bryan, "What's danger close"
this never happened. As for Fick grabbing the handset out of the Company Commanders hand that never happened either if it had the Company Commander would have crushed him......
.....As for
the artillery strike, the Company Commander was trying to keep them from firing the mission without getting himself in trouble so he took his time giving the Battalion information hoping they wouldn't fire the mission. We still received the one round and it didn't come close to anyone. It landed just behind the house. The two guys with the RPG got away and no one shot them as said in the book. I have this whole incident on video although you can't see everything you can hear it all. This is going to be great when the truth comes out. One thing about video, the one eye doesn't lie!"
Then Nate Fick's description from his book:"I met the captain when his Humvee pulled into our small circle. "Sir, we took some shots at them(the RPG team), and they seem to have gotten the idea. We're glassing the area, but haven't seen anyone moving." Captain:"Yeah, but Alpha Company's up there calling for fire, and I want to call a mission, too." I couldn't believe it. We were going to fire artillery to keep up with Alpha Company. "Sir, I'd rather go on doing what we're doing. We've got things under control." Captain:"You just keep tabs on your platoon, Lieutenant Fick, and let me work up the mission."
Three minutes later, I listened as he made a botched call for fire to the battalion. I sat on my hands until he called in a target location only two hundred meters from where we stood. Anything inside six hundred meters was considered "danger close" - requiring special care due to its proximity to friendly troops. In this open ground, we'd be showered with shrapnel from our own rounds. I started to intervene.
"Sir, that's way inside danger close. Cancel the mission." Gunny Wynn said with growing alarm. "We're shooting it. Keep quiet" the captain replied. "It's an empty field!" I shouted. "We're watching it. You are going to hit us with the rounds, and probably RCT-1, too, since we don't know when they'll be coming up the road. Cancel the fucking mission." I reached out to take the radio handset from him.
I later found out that Major Whitmer was on the other end of the radio, and he was even angrier than I was. He threw the handset down in disgust, screaming about "that fucking idiot", whom the battalion staff secretly called "Shitman". His candor earned him a disapproving look from Colonel Ferrando, since the division chief of staff was within earshot. But he rejected the mission and put a limit on the damage wrought by the captain's ineptitude. The CO drove off after threatening me for challenging his authority.
Wow, even my uneducated ass figured 200m can still be close, but in this case, 3X that is still close? What in the hell were they firing?
It makes sense the Gunnery Sergeant Griego would dispute this description of events. It makes him and Schwetje look bad.
@@ravleow9748 Oh, you can read any of the stuff he's put out since and tell he's an asshole. The one thing that should have been included (but I understand why it wasn't since it happened after the source material) is that in a battle that came when the insurgency picked up, he went above and beyond and saved multiple lives, earning the respect of the whole company. Between that experience and the crackdown that came when the show got famous, it seems like everyone buried the hatchet and Kasem became part of the crew again.
Despite that, he still seems like the same "punch down, kiss up" jackass, and you can find the guy by looking up any of the other Marines who got name recognition from Generation Kill - he's used the ones he's still friends with to try to boost his media presence. He seems like a serious scumbag who just happens to be good in combat and knows how to lead under fire, I just wish the show caught that side of him because he's definitely used it to avoid responsibility.
@@JnEricsonx 155mm HE rounds. Big shells that make big explosions designed to wipe out anything in a 50 meter radius. However on flat ground the shrapnel can potentially fly much farther than 50 meters plus they work in a margin for error, even though modern ordinance is extremely accurate it's better to be on the safe side.
@@ddandymann Fair enough. If one of those things can hit me with shit from 6 football fields away....I wanna be a county distance away.
Video description helps clarify what happened. Haven't seen GK in forever, my questions were answered there. Thanks.
In WW2 if a commander deliberately put his unit in danger he could be relieved of command immediately.
How did they manage to attack positions?
take it from an old british gunner signaler and OP operator fire mission danger close is or in my day was the one used to call down fire on your own position
Thats what happens when you make infantry officers act like forward observers. In Finnish Army every infantry platoon has two officers in it, the platoon commander and a forward observer and the forward observer and his team call in artillery on the orders of the platoon commander so the commander doesn't need to bother with artillery protocol, he can just point to the observer what needs to be deleted and the observer worries about protocol and the commander can focus on leading the platoon.
Those were Marine 1st Recon not regular infantry.. by definition are Forward Observers..
@@starga-fr7qx No, FO is an MOS is the US military. Recon Marines are supposed to be trained in this, but an FO will do a better job.
Sounds good, but i also rather have officers study arty air striking calling and tactics and forward observing (the platoon will also retain its forward observers) so they can understand how to do it without retarded bullshit happening like here so they would make a better officers that know whay they are actually doing, and in case the Forward observers get wiped out
They weren't even "true" infantry officers. IIRC, Encino Man and Captain America were both former intel officers. Only Patterson and Fick were infantry officers. Fick was the only one who went through BRC.
@@outis7080 and of course the irony is that Fick answered to Encino Man. This wouldn't have been as bad, but Encino Man's Gunny was clearly suspect. I feel things would have gone better for 2nd platoon if Captain America's Sgt (Kocher) was in his stead. Encino Man clearly was out of his depths, but did at least try when others helped him. Usually. But there are 3 platoons, and you go into war with the army you have and not the one you want.
Who wouldn't get a tad insubordinate when your commanding officer is a bigger threat than the actual enemy combatants.
“ it doesn’t matter if you’re right or wrong you must follow orders”
At the end of 24 years, never had found an 0-1 or 0-2 (in any branch) you could trust not to get you killed.
Encino Man was an O-3.
Did he just said nine....?Did he just said fXXking NINE?!!!!
love
I like how they went straight to FFE in a populated target area without adjustments. Really lends credibility to a call for fire scenario...
On the bright side, if the first round lands on your position it sure makes corrections a lot easier. If anyone survives that is.
1 q
¹¹¹
11+
1:43
Damnit, he's under Commander Boreale!
Stehl Reihn
Let me know how those 9 digit grids work out for ya buddy.
6 digit. "PQ 059 098, 038°." Still, a 6 digit grid (100m x 100m area) for a target 200m away with artillery? He's just trying to make use of his SGLI.
Changed it to the max before deployment after his son told him about uncle Jodie
Nobody says a nine digit grid or an odd number grid
But Doc said it best " for once our lives were saved by sheer incompetence"
Leaders who move forward to fight at every opportunity and see all situations as reason for a battle will get their army killed in the end.
-Sun Tzu
I remember a story my grandpa told about a short term skipper in Ww2 who was new and shitty. They saw a Japanese periscope wake and told the capt. He said no it's not a wake and ordered them to stand down. They were all pretty pissed off that he let it go. They made enough complaints to get him reassigned without tossing his rings as overboard.
94589smiller
"If you notice fdc said 1 ROUND HE IN EFFECT. And they shot more than one round. Good try holleywood. From a former 13B"
I'm sorry I couldn't let this go lol, its older than the google plus transition. 1 Round means each gun fires 1 rd, or a volley per say(Volume). So ya didn't count the rounds but that means during the FFE portion of your mission you'll receive 1 round per tube/cannon for the size of element thats firing (hence more than 1 rd impacting). Leave it to the FO's and FDC to figure out this shit out, keep to your lanyard. From a current 13F.
Thatd be one round per tube. Guessing theres more than one gun there killer.
Steven Cromer take the time to read the entire post if you're going to comment on it, that was a quote.
Oh my bad. From a current 13F.
He clearly says "5 guns, 1 round" and then I think it's "HE delay in effect" cause they use a delay fuse to penetrate the building.
click read more
wish this show had a few more episodes. was so good
This captain wasn’t even an 0302. He was an Intel officer. But I’m sure he learned the proper protocol to call in a fire mission while attending the Basic School. Guess he slept through that lesson!
I’m just watching this with the mind set of “Don’t ever be that guy “
*I am genuinely baffled how such a heavily strict organization like the military would end up with, and even allow such horrible officers to stay in command. How are they not fired?*
Politics my good man. Suppose he was a son of a high ranking politician.
Kinda like the Bidens or the Bush family.
Sometimes it's intentionnal. Officers (especially in Europe) tend to come from old famillies with noble or military root. Coupled with the fact officer tend to see themselves as above their subordinate and that peace time officer corps are closer to the corporate world where you have litteral armies of useless managers, it's a very fertile ground for nepotism and other similar bullshit.
Sometimes it just because the system is fucked up. The enlisted side is a good exemple of that. Sergeant being promoted because of their fitness score instead of their leadership skill is a reccuring criticism among US vet on the internet.
In armies where recruitment and fidelisation of personnels is a massive challenge, I have seen incompetent or outright problematic servicemen being not only kept, but rewarded for their bad behavior. If they did something wrong, they got to be moved whereved they wanted, while competent servicemen where forced in the unit nobody wanted. This became even more dramatic since a lot of there incompetent and problematic servicemember tended to be gathered in support or specialised unit, which job is to make the job of the mainline unit simpler. But since they sucked at their job, the mainline unit had to pick up the slack while the support unit were basically acting as some sort of boss.
Imagine a dude being so bad at his job you give him a promotion, put him in charge of making cofee for the entire departement, but then the dude start requesting that the rest of the departement clean the cofee pot and fill it every morning because it make his job simpler.
This thumbnail had me at desert helmet and forest jackets.
"It doesn't matter if we're right or wrong those men are out of line" us military leadership from top to bottom
In “One Bullet Away” Fick described it as more of an intense moment, and he wasn’t called Encino man but Shittman
Considering that the grids Encino man gave were in Saudi Arabia they technically weren't danger close
"Assassin, this is Steel Ray. YOUR grid zone designators are correct..."
Steel Rain.
I need to rewatch this series...
LT. Taylor... 2003 OIF... 41st Trans... 18th CSSB.
"Who's tanks are those?"
🤦🤦🤦🤦🤦
hey i have the same range finder. AWESOME.
-Loved GENERATION KILL.
The best place to be when artillery fires is nearby the gun, then the round will be going far away from you
I like the way Fick handles the insubordinate sergeant in the background.