The Hangprinter
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- čas přidán 5. 09. 2024
- This frameless RepRap 3D printer hangs from the ceiling.
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In don't know if there is a 3d printer innovation of the year award, but if there is then this guys wins.
This is one of those special niches where lightweight electronics and components perform better than heavier machines. Genius level stuff, I am so glad you found a way to make this work.
Can't wait to see you build one Tom! Live stream hopefully
Need food, drinks machine and a porta potty for that live stream. :-)
I really think calculating the movements isn't that hard for that ... thing. the most impressive thing for me is: having this idea and realizing it. i still don't think it's easy to sell it commercially because the speed seems to be extremely limited.
this guy has big potential, i really hope seeing more things like that. just impressive.
I think for our style of FDM printing this mechanism is surely not the best. But its an impressive proof of concept. Not every additive manufacturing process needs to be super fast. I could see this thing in the construction industry. Cause the main problem with current printers that can create buildings is that they need to be huge. With this style of printer the only strucure you would need is a crane. And these things are allready on every construction site. Just my 2 cents :)
Matthias Langwieser Speed is a huge issue in construction. Time is money. There's no way that slow technology would be adopted. Deadlines are very tight in the construction industry.
Internet Tough Guy yes but a printer can work 24/7 and never complain. It can probably replace a team of 10 guys by itself. So even if it's slower I can see it become a very cheap tool to build.
Moments You're making a blankey statement without thinking about the details.
+Moments The details I'm referring are related to logistics and technical feasibility in installing multiple "printers" in a construction site. Let's say you wanted to "print" the walls of a house with concrete using a crane and a giant hang printer as per Christian's idea. You would need dozens of them to match the speed in comparison to using conventional techniques. It would be physically impossible to install that many on a small construction site not to mention the extravagant cost of have all those cranes sitting there doing nothing.
This is just one of many issues you cannot overcome.
"It will probably work".
I must remember this next time my boss ask me something. That guy is a genius.
brilliant, a true inspiration to the meaning of a Reprap and what being part of the Reprap community is . people like Torian is what gives me hope for a brighter future for us all. I can see the future now ! these kinds of printers replacing sky cranes and building homes.
this scales so nicely. put it in a garage, a room, a closet, or a box. print as big or small as you need when you need. turn this into a black box that you just attach to anchor points and print anywhere, any size. awesome!
Obviously it is in early development stage but it has so much potential to become something that you pull out of your bag and you start printing anywhere... well at least anywhere with a sealing
sealing?
seals are pretty cute though
i like dolphins more.... sorry for the typo (ipad)
Hary Pisimisis ... anywhere your 100% sure a cat doesn't walk into the room.
I like it when people think outside the box.. This guy totally removed the box!
Mind. Blown.
As already said, if there are awards for this type of thing I hope he gets noticed!
I'm very much fascinated by this printer setup. I've learned about it some time ago and home to watch it printing live one day. Thank you very much for that awesome interview!!
The idea to do something like this was spinning in my head too. I was inspired by the spidercams they have at events and stadiums to freely move the camera all over the place. Really nice to see someone actually already took the idea to a working printer prototype.
Something that i'm kind of missing is the downpressure of the nozzle on the existing print to make the layer adhesion better. The logical step would be to make the carriage as light as possible for fast acceleration, but at the same time you probably loose layer adhesion pressure with that. I guess you could try to overconstrain the system with more string drives and anchor points, so you could actually stiffen up the position of the carriage in space?
Still very impressive, and kudos to Torbjørn for getting this far all by himself.
That's right. Lifting the print bed further above the anchor points gives you more down pressure if you want it. You'll risk having too much of it near the top of really tall prints.
I'm speechless. this is the best idea I've seen in quite a while. will definitely build one.
With three huge linear bearings, one could increase line tension on the things, maybe something like wall mount. Use lightweight slides on the bearings, and bolt em to a room's walls. Then a quick release for utilizing the room for other purposes.
We'll call her the Hanginator!
this could go from building a small box to a full on sofa. very modest guy and gave credit to his friend. I wonder whether the concept of having the whole printer as the moving mass could turn and box room say a garage into giant corexy huge printer
also a completely out of the sky idea suspend a printer such as this from a drone!! no cooling fans required
This is super cool! I was thinking about building a large core XY machine, but this looks like a great way to get big builds without dedicating the whole build volume full-time for a machine. Need a garden statue or birdbath? Set this up in the garage, make a print, and pack it away when done.
Great design. As for the potential of cable setups - stability, speed - you should look for "cable-robot simulator"
The obvious next step is to complete with SeeMeCNC's Part Daddy by adding in a 3mm nozzle and pellet-based extruder setup, and scaling it up to a hanger sized printer.
Keep in mind the setup is weight-restricted - a pellet-based extruder is probably not going to happen without mayor upgrades everywhere else, too
Obviously.
obviously first. =)
Thomas Sanladerer build one! What a great idea for a cheap simple printer
I imagine there must be a reason why the points for the walls are not placed half way up the wall by default? I am thinking it would give a bigger print area that way without having to move things around but there must be a reason he's set it up so that the points are always at the bottom of the print area
If you want some help or contribution, I'd like to indulge in this.
P.S My qualities are only Computer Science Engineering and troubleshooting(all types).
"But you were unsuccessful?"
Wow, that's really amazing. I agree, scale this up to print industrial size objects using steel for the cables. Onsite formless concrete part building.
SERIOUSLY IMPRESSIVE !!!
You and your team are going to go places...
Hmmmm, I wonder if this could be guided by a tiny, room sized, version of a GPS.
That way, it can readily compensate for any bumps and lumps in the fishing lines that anchor it at its corners.
The possibilities with the kind of system demonstrated here are endless :) .
Finally a good use for everyone's guest rooms.
This is AWESOME! I see so much potential for architectural adaption!
So this printer is awesome I've seen it a few other places. But as soon as you said at the end you might build one too, I've got to say DO IT!!!!!
I like that when he was asked about his favoured filament he said he doesn't have a recommendation, but he's sponsored. I'm sure his sponsor didn't smile as much as I did at that missed opportunity :)
reprappro.me sponsored the roll of filament in the video ;)
Total sponsoring so far is at about $4000, half of it from E3D in the form of hot ends.
See
github.com/tobbelobb/hangprinter#credits
and
salt.bountysource.com/teams/hangprinter
Is the correct answer :) Thanks!
Talk about thinking outside the box!
Wow, that is really neat Tom, thanks for sharing!
Amazing job! I'm part of the people working on a "half-finished build" for a year, and his design and anchors position is very smart/interesting, makes me want to continue my own project! :)
Happy to hear that! Do you have pics?
Torbjörn Ludvigsen at the moment I only have 3D models and printed leftovers of what I called the winches (which means the hanging platform is freed from the weight and inertia that come with the electronics and mechanical components).
If you are interested, I can try to reassemble the system and take a few pictures or videos of the project.
Torbjörn Ludvigsen by the way, I'm curious: why did you decide to run a cable from the winch on the ceiling down to the hanging platform, instead of using RF?
I'm interested in any dev documentation you have/can make =)
What is RF?
Radio frequency... aka bluetooth etc..
wow, just wow, can't actually believe it, it's so cool! Thank you for interviewing him and presenting his stunning work!
I love it!
A puppeteer overhead and three professional stunt kite flyers holding the side cables would be cool.
Dow Great Stuff expanding foam sealant coming out of the print head.
I've been up to long.
This is an amazing idea! The current design is very rough, but with a little more work this could be a great way to print large objects for cheap with a tiny little machine.
I saw this machine a couple week ago and I thing it is amazing design. Thank for bring some more info about
A collabsible composite tubeframe could solve calibration issues while maintaining mobility. It would also allow sliding the 3 axis upwards so max shape won't be conical. And you could have line pre-tension together with some high modulus line like dynema or kevlar to have better resolution. Maybe compensate line spooling in software?
damn, that's cool.
Moving the motors on the anchors ? wire less maybe ?
Add a spinning gyro ? So many cool ideas here.
Thats amazing why has no one ever thought of this low cost high area printer!
BRILLIANT, MIND BLOWN! Thanks for sharing!!
Brilliant idea! The best part - this design can be scaled to practically any size. Building/printing a house should be pretty cheap and fast when this technique is perfected. It would need a new software - with ability to change layer thickness dynamically, so that internal layers are thick (for speed) and external thin (for quality). Calibration also needs to be automatic, I can imagine a new printer setup in a new place could take only a few minutes that way.
This is the best idea in 3d printing I have seen in a long time. I am going to make one for sure :D
Wow! Absolutely amazing! :) That kinda solves the scalability most machines have. I have so many projects i'd need larger one, but some how it seems i never quite can find the time to build a large machines (or barely even maintain the crap machine i'm using now).. I guess you can find time for all the interesting bits, but maintaining your tools ...
I love innovation like this in technology :) Well done!
Tom I want to see more on this! I saw this guy a few months back! Missing a few key ideas but could be the future..
mind-blowing , love the idea.. appreciate the makers
I am inspired... when I have the time I would love to look at this further and how to make it into an easy use, easy setup system.
Brilliant.I had it in mind to design something like this to display the replica of the studio filming model of the Millennium falcon I'm building. I'd attach the model in place of the print head, extruder etc. and have it "fly" around a room. Would have to move a little quicker than a 3D printer of course but that's just a bit of coding and I wouldn't have to be as fussy with accuracy.
I had thought to put the motors and controller etc. around the outside of the room, only the, almost invisible, fishing line attaching to the model.
Looking forward to Tom's build of this.
Take a look at the "Tower of Babel" build in the vitana.se blog link above, not perfect but incredible.
Wow. Never seen anything like that before. Thanks for posting.
Now that is a seriously innovative design.
Tom, I would love to see you build one on a live stream. Or maybe just do a tear-down.
Hi Thomas
Would love to see you run through safety upgrades for [ Anet A6 ]
Single PSU Mosfet for HB /
Power supply switch pane with light /
Controller Board fan /
and possibly 12v to 24v ( before I fry my controller etc.. )
The calibration could be done using mathematics and probing the surface, similar to how autocalibration for delta machine works now.
+Dejay Rezme most likely - someone just needs to implement it 😉
Right, I might have been talking out of my ass. It might not actually be possible, since it's overcontrained with 4 "arms" for a delta. You can't even "home" without calibration.
I love engineering imagination , well done exposing this . If he is the first the machine should be named after him .
Very cool! Thanks for sharing this interview.
"more money stuff"
I'd like to see a desktop version, just so that you can easily break down the printer for storage and moving. I'd love a printer, but I just don't have the space for one to always be out, having a collapsible one would make things easier.
This is very exciting. as usual, Thomas on the cutting edge. Thanks for the great channel.
I need to clear out my garage... 3D printed car, anyone?
I'll need some new furniture anyways... any suggestions for good models to print?
www.thingiverse.com/thing:1987128
print this full size!
ok thats pretty cool, but its all about the iron throne!
www.thingiverse.com/thing:652327
Great Idea, hope to see it beeing used more. Oh and i'd like to have some more (and closer) closeups of the machine working while doing the talk next time please. It's mesmerizing :)
Even more closeups? I thought they was already too much of that!
I love the idea. It actually wouldn't be too hard to make an automatic calibration system that could calculate the location of each of the 4 mounting points. Just manually move the print head to certain locations in your print area and it could figure it out with some simple math.
Can you sketch solution and math you're thinking about?
By far the most interesting thing so far in #3DMeetup, this guy is another Josef Prusa on the making, i can see even Tom is impressed. With a Diamond Hotend this thing could probably even print stuff with 3 color filaments.
The design could probably be changed to include the spool holders on the ceiling wooden frame.
I'm humbled.
About the spool holder: Yes! Add it, add it (crowd cheering) github.com/tobbelobb/hangprinter
Great job man :)
Thx!
Printing larger objects requres larger filament diameter, i mean if you could get 10mm filament it would go alot quicker to print that vase with probably same quality
Couldn't you make a hybrid between the hang printer and a delta frame? Basically instead of having it hang from the ceiling which is not convenient for most people unless they have lots of space. You could use a delta like frame, then hang the wires precisely on it and use that very interesting motor system. I realize it probably would only be able to make small prints but at least they would be very consistent in quality.
the nice thing about this is that it is probably very silent as almost any vibration gets absorbed by the strings...
i had a similar idea a couple years ago but it didn't have the center hanging strings and mounted the 3 axis strings on the ceiling so the strings that he currently has on the floor wont hit the print. but i couldn't figure out how you would calculate the positioning since as you get higher smaller movements would move the head extensively and would make a parabella .but if the program could be figured out then you could scale this to be suspended from cranes and print houses and more.
Home installation 3D printers sounds awesome. Imagine using an edge/doorframe to mount your Z axis and maybe a cantilever X axis... I dunno about the base though... maybe do a 3x1 like this video. but the print sizes!!! I would print bike frames :)
Imagine in the future, drones having the capability of 3d printing
Love Castle Uh.... sure.
you'd just get a warehouse or any empty space, place a handfull of drones in there and they would manufacture your products, returning to base to charge or get more pla pellets
This is definitely going in a corner of the makerspace if I don't run into opposition :D
I'm building two at the moment. one for the makerspace underbroen. and one for my self. I already have some improvements for the mount, and smaller motors is the obvious improvement. :) also optical sensors with gaps in the lines (like a regular printer) and then also a more 3D printer friendly (stable) model. maybe have some geared pancake motors. I love this 3D printer. I 💞 your channel btw ;) you are the only one I follow. :D
Guess you're a runner-up to make the first functional copy (that I'm aware of). I'm very eager to see any video/text/picture/anything you post. See you in the forums (forums.reprap.org/read.php?1,738858), facebook group and the github repo! (sorry for the many sites, will collect onto hangprinter.org/ ...)
Keep us informed on your progress! I want to make one too
A scaled down design would be amazing
Ha, I literally had this idea the other day after seeing an inclined plotter with two strings...
After seeing the accuracy of the plotter I dismissed it as madness as the repeatability was just not there. Apparently I was too hasty! :)
Well Leigh, the project is open source, so how about a second go?
You both had a brilliant idea.
I remember reading about this when he was just starting the project and figured it would never be precise enough to print something useful but it's nice to be proven wrong sometimes (and that he didn't dismiss the idea without trying!) :)
Torbjørn Ludvigsen has spent the last three years developing a new kind of large-format 3D printer that can build furniture-sized objects in any room
great video guys, looking forward more from each on this! :D
Hmm, just a thought, I know this limits the number of viable user spaces but couldn't you put the steppers at the corners rather than the centre and then put the control board at top centre thus reducing the weight of the head and thus making it able to print much faster and probably more precisely too? The only wain problem with this is that you are limited by the length of the stepper motor cable but if you made it so that each stepper had a radio reciever and a control board with a 12v in then you could power each one individually while retaining the flexibility of keeping it centralized. Just my 2 pence
Thomas make a toturial how to build this pleas !! This is so cool.
A reasonable sized print head in a setup that makes it possible to print things the size of car body panels? I'd throw a grand at that if it means I can finally start doing what I want to do with 3d printing and cars.
Maybe can add foldable umbrella/tripod like mechanism, faster to calibrate and stored but it limits the build size.
One of the goals was to specifically not need a frame, but of course you could add a tripod-esque structure around it.
He could do with something that projects a triangle down from the ceiling tether point to aid in accurate and quick setup.
Hmm, 3 of those lasers that project a line, seems like it would the easiest option.
Great idea! It would require just a single measurement from the floor to the projector, as long as everything is level.
omg its torbjorn.... When did he get so tall and thin?? Where is his turret?
This is amazing. I would love to do this for my capstone project in a few months for my engineering class so i will look into this a little more
Why not build the motors into some modules in the anchor points, instead of the print head? I guess it would require a bit more creative wiring but it would have much less weight to move around... obviously.
Edit: lol, nevermind, just watched the rest of the series :)
I met at the event Torbjørn and be able to speak with him for 3 full days and the project is super interesting :D maybe I will make one in the future!
Seeing what magic you cram out of little Ultimakers I would _love_ to see your Hangprints. When project ideas come to you, then you contact me, ok? ;)
Of course man I will for sure!
That's pretty cool! 🤓👍🏼
There's a CZcams video of a delta printer that is using strings to move, it's kinda old but this is like some sandwiched that into it's own little packet
love the interview format!
It's not often that I get the chance to talk to someone other than "the sales guy". But when I do, it usually turns out pretty nicely!
Game changer! Livestream build vote :)
Awesome printer! Yet another one to build 🤔
That looks like one nice sunday stream building/setting this up ;) :D
Going on my to-do list.
might take me some time...
I hope you make one Thomas! We are printing the parts now and we are on a quest to make this work but I think if you made one it would certainly help us. I know we can make the mechanical portion no problem but I think the software part might throw us a little. If you do it we could follow the Master Maker Thomas' lead!!!!
What is the effective build volume, given the anchor points? Sorry if this is answered, I have not been able to find info on this. I imagine it's not the full volume of the pyramid formed by the anchor points but less.
its really great
Amazing project!!! congratulations!!
impressive design
I knew jordi was a scientist from the start.
Especially for huge prints, that design might be more portable and affordable. The only thing that might get in the way is the loss of precision because of the build up on the spools as mentioned in the video, but that could be compensated via calibration, I think.
+David Jenni it is already being compensated for 😁
Can't one just make the spools larger, so the lines doesn't overlap on the spools, seems easier than trying to compensate for it in software. It will be hard to predict exactly how the line wind up on the spool otherwise.
+Mårten Thornberg a lot about this build is "good enough", if he went for "perfect" it wouldn't exist 😊
Larger spools would make the existing compensation work better. Size is limited to be printable on 20 x 20 cm machines. If I could only get motor shafts inside instead of outside the spools. I have a few failed sketches of that...
this is awesome very cool dude we all can make one in our own homes.
Thomas Sanladerer that guy is a Genius and deserves to be a millionaire👍🏽.
I was thinking about building this printer inside a europalet sized box, or a shipping container so you can transport and print !
Would it not be possible to move the ABC and Z movement motors and their gears over to where the tension lines are anchored to the ground? Getting the wires to run to the steppers might be annoying, but if you remove 4 of the 5 motors and only have a motor for direct drive extrusion you would be shifting the vast majority of the weight off the carriage and onto the "frame". If you managed to make it a Bouden ( wouldn't recommend due to how far away your spool is) you could literally have all 5 stepper motors off of the gantry.
I have been planning on building one of these for a while
would love to have a place to put this. it would be a real conversation starter .. :D
How do the vertical lines keep tension? I'm also assuming that's as fast as it goes? Probably have to give up speed for precision with print volumes that large.