Why Xabi Alonso should avoid Liverpool (for now)
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- čas přidán 12. 05. 2024
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Xabi Alonso has led Bayer Leverkusen on a surprise Bundesliga title charge this season, managing to remain unbeaten in all competitions so far with his rapid-fire attacking style.
Now, with Jurgen Klopp and Thomas Tuchel both announcing that they are leaving their managerial posts at the end of the 2023-24 season, where should Xabi Alonso go next?
Joe Devine, JJ Bull and Jon Mackenzie are joined by Seb Stafford-Bloor to figure out if the Spaniard should head to Liverpool or Bayern Munich.
This is The Athletic's Week in Football.
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00:00 Intro
00:15 Short-term considerations: Liverpool vs Bayern
04:40 Why not stay at Leverkusen?
05:47 Why short-term and long-term planning are inseparable
07:06 A comprehensive and clear career road map for Xabi Alonso
08:28 Pitfalls of succeeding dynasties
12:21 Could Alonso avoid these pitfalls at Liverpool?
20:33 Long-term planning: What's Alonso's tactical identity?
26:29 Could this work at Liverpool / Bayern?
29:18 Where should Xabi Alonso go?
#liverpool #bayern #premierleague #leverkusen #bundesliga
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Music sourced from Epidemic Sound
Additional footage sourced from AP Newsroom - Sport
Where do you think Xabi Alonso should go and why? 🤔👇
I could understand if he waits until 2026 to take the Madrid job but going to Bayern this summer makes no sense to me especially if he wins the title this season and wins the Pokal
Liverpool. The fans and owners would give him more time to build something there then Bayern. Nagelsmann has already spoken about how that club isn’t good whatsoever for a young coach. They’ve sacked numerous managers in recent years
FC Barcelona. Xabi Alonso's Dad, Periko, played for Real Sociedad for 5yrs, Barcelona for 3yrs & Sabadell for 3yrs. His Dad spent 5 yrs playing in Basque country for La Real & 6yrs in Catalunya for Barça & Sabadell before retiring & going on to coach Basque & Valencian clubs.
Xabi Alonso although born in Tolosa Basque country spent the first 6yrs of his life growing up in Barcelona before moving back to San Sebastian Basque country.
Despite playing 5yrs for Madrid Xabi's spent more time in Catalunya & is Basque. In his illustrious career Xabi Alonso has spent the least amount of time in Liverpool, Madrid, 5yrs each, & Bayern, 3yrs.
The majority of his career was played at Antiguoko & Real Sociedad for 12yrs & he spent 5yrs in Liverpool & Madrid, a year less than the first 6yrs of his early childhood life in Barcelona. Despite being a Madrid legend he's not a Madridista but a Basque man with Barça roots.
Liverpool to build a legacy with this young team.
Alonso's tailor made for Liverpool. He inherits a top quality quad that he can tweak and mold over time. Bayern is a dead project with too many behind the scenes politics, and would indicate that he lacks ambition. The Bayern and Madrid jobs are poisoned chalices as the expectations are unrealistic. Being a player at those clubs is great but not as a manager.
In my unbiased opinion, Xabi Alonso should donate 1 million dollars to me
In my unbiased opinion, I agree
in my biased opinion he should
In my expert opinion, I agree.
(I am an expert in receiving money)
In my irrefutable opinion, we're best friends...
Me too! xD
tifo without joe = 2023 chelsea
tifo with joe = 2008 barcelona
you mean the athletic
Yes.
Tifo without JJ= 2008 Derby
@@lowresmk1149the what?
This is what we came here for. Great chemistry. Love you guys together!
The team is back together😢
This is a real tifo video. Something we actually want instead of Athletic FC bullshit
Even this seems like they are forced not to be more themselves......in the past joe would roast John and JJ would make like mad
I prefer JJ and John duet
@@TheAnfieldLarkGood journos don't work for free mate. And the Athletic's youtube channel is free.
I miss the silly intros Joe would do for them too
The same guy said Raphina would be a good replacement for Salah and Liverpool should sign de Ligt😂😂😂😂😂😂
i see you struggling to keep the banter to a minimum Joe….just give in please😂❤
I love the cuts to Joe/JJ trying to hold it together.
@@Crevulus”it all flows out of them” ….pause
For the Love of God is no one concerned as to the status of Seb’s Gates? Are they good gates poor gates? Indifferent ?
Despite this glaring omission, I think Seb's looking fairly upbeat and cheerful (by Bloorian standards, of course). I infer from this that his gehts are indeed gut.
it was in his subheading
@@KrollTheBigSquid You're bloody right, you know!
I’m certain his gates are in exceptional condition
It‘s interesting how Liverpools experienced players might be a pitfall for Xabi Alonso because they became successful under Klopp but Bayern‘s experienced players won’t be a problem. Bayern‘s players got a lot of managers fired: Kovac, Anchelotti, Tuchel, Nagelsmann
Thank you
Yeah their point doesn't make sense. The idea that the successful players in the Liverpool squad will down tools is kinda hilarious. They have the mentality already in place. Alonso is extremely well respected at the club as a European Cup winner as a player. Do the Tifo guys really believe the likes of Trent will undermine him? Lol
I think one thing you might be forgetting here is that a lot of the experienced Bayern players know Alonso personally because they played together at Bayern already. Müller, Coman, Kimmich, Neuer all played with him back in 2017 so this is a very unique situation where it's not a completely new person coming in, but a coach that already has good relationships with the most senior players on the team.
@@thesilvanalyst6880 I don't know about Coman' situation with the club, but Neuer and Muller are on the way out and not in good terms with the board, Kimmich is also considering getting out. So if he is indeed in contact with them, I wouldn't think they will sing praises about Bayern.
Just tells you how little they actually knows about Liverpool as a club and currently as a team. 😒
The old gang! Y'all should get Alex on too
Seb looks super fit too, happy for him❤
Joe Devine is referred to as "young and full of vitality" mind you
Love that Joe Devine is back as the host of the podcast. Sometimes podcasts aren’t always about content but also about synergy between the people on the podcast. Joe helps bring the synergy between all the technically minded people
One key and most important stat that your team somehow missed is that, Klopp was the 22nd manager in Liverpool's 130+ history which means that, on an average every manager gets 8 years to implement their ideas. That is a luxury that Alonso most certainly won't have in Munich.
Firstly, that's terrible maths. 132 divided by 22 is 6 years, not 8.
Secondly, the 3 managers before Klopp were all sacked, serving 6 months, 15 months, and 40 months respectively. The last non-caretaker Bayern manager to get sacked after less than 15 months was Jurgen Klinsmann, and before then you've got to go back to Otto Rehhagel in the mid 90s.
Bayern expect you to win the league, play well, and get along with the board, or you'll be sacked. Liverpool expect you to make top 4 most seasons, play well, and get along with the board, or you'll be sacked. I'd argue it'll be easier to hit that with Bayern than Liverpool over the next couple of seasons.
They talked about how he'd get more time at Liverpool than he would at Bayern.
yes but in the last 25 years of modern football, liverpool has had 7, which means something like ~3 years+
This is terrible maths haha
@@mastro111 That's still more years than other clubs. Secondly, lot of those managerial appointments were as a result of terrible ownership under Gillett and Hicks. Woy was not an FSG appointment and Dalglish was not FSG's first choice candidate, but was made permanent upon fan demand. Brendan Rodgers almost went out of his way to get the sack, and should have been sacked after 5-1 thrashing by Stoke (any other owners would have), but FSG still gave him time. Overall, Liverpool is the better option for Xabi and he will be adored by the supporters.
Michael Edwards is back now and that’s huge for Liverpool.They’ll get either Alonso or Amorim. Both would work wonders with their current squad
I just saw the news. If he does return, then Salah and van Dijk leaving won't be a problem.
@@liverbot4854 Salah might leave but I think Virgil gets offered a new deal and sticks around
I don't think both will leave for now. They still have few more years in them. But before they leave Liverpool will definitely get someone else. @@liverbot4854
@@jamesryan73 agreed, trent and alisson also stay
Wrong Edwards left because he fell out way klopp about handing out big wages to ageing players. Edwards doesn't operate like that.
Fergie ran that squad into the ground then left, not having a sporting director was also a massive issue. Wenger also left a disjointed squad. Liverpool will have a great squad with youth prospects around the first team. Liverpool will also have a sporting and technical director in place plus Liverpool fans will not turn on Xavi he will get a full season with patient fans. Bayen will turn on him instantly if he doesnt rock up and start winning immediately
I agree with this 100%
People say they wont turn on him for now but the pressure will be immense on alonso if he doesn't get top 4 which is possible considering he is not that experienced . Even united fans were saying eth should be given atleast 3-4 years to rebuild but have started turning on him , Sadly premier league is very competitive and not getting results is not accepted even in the name of a rebuild . The squad he will inherit will also be good so he will straight away have pressure on him to compete for the title
@@rsvp2003 United fans have watched their Club struggle ever since Fergie left them in dissaray. ETH frustrates them because it's, what, 10-15 years of struggle? Liverpool fans won't be in that same boat. It's not comparable.
yeah - I think this Tifo analysis is the problem with overthinking things tactically. It's irrelevant that Bayern play a more similar style of football to Leverkusen if the club is a basket case.
@@rsvp2003 - there is an enormous difference between "pressure on Alonso if he misses out on top four" at Liverpool, versus "almost certainly sacked if they don't win the league" at Bayern.
The problem with the idea of Alonso going to Bayern for a couple of years and then Liverpool, is that Hodgson aside, Liverpool tend to back their managers more than most clubs. If someone has half the success of Klopp, they could be there for a number of years. If he comes to Liverpool now, he would be part of setting up the structure of the club pretty much from scratch, rather than fitting onto the Bayern structure, and then being spat out if they underperform next season. And under performance for Bayern is winning the league at least, and even that may not keep you in the job. Fail to be a success at Bayern, and would there be as many teams open to him as there is now? The Bayern and Real jobs could be available every couple of years, Liverpool may not be, going by previous managerial histories of all those clubs. This could be his only chance of the Liverpool job, if that is what he wants.
I was thinking the exact same thing mate
Very good point mate
Bang on 10 minutes in, Joe's beautiful jovially accusatory nod is just exactly what I've missed since this format was killed. Delicious.
If only this came in some kind of podcast form. Though it would have to have cool hands mixed with a warm embrace.
JOE DEVINE IS BACK THE ATHLETIC NEVER DREAMED OF SUCH ENGAGEMENT THEY HAD NO IDEA
I think there's a danger of overthinking it from a tactical perspective here. The conclusion being that Bayern play a more similar football to Leverkusen. The bigger picture is that Bayern has been a managers' graveyard for a long while and look to be still needing a rebuild. There's concerns on taking over from a legend like Klopp, but Liverpool look in much better shape, with a wealth of new players coming through the academy - Klopp is leaving them in far better shape than, say, Ferguson did at United.
Also, if Leverkusen win the Bundesliga this season, what is the incentive to go to Bayern and do the same there? It would be terrible for German and European football if Bayern - again - just hoover up all their opposition as a cheat code. As you say, there will be quite a bit of leeway given at Liverpool - he's not expected to win the league, or anything, immediately, while he could have a difficult few months at Bayern and then be sacked.
also a small point, but similar to klopp saying he will never coach another team in the prem other than liverpool, going from a historic season with leverkusen, beating bayern after 12 undefeated years, to that same bayern and reestablishing the boring old dominance just seems like a sad development in terms of his life story. going to liverpool where the owners and the fans are patient and want to build a legacy together seems more attractive to me.
It's interesting to hear that in Germany it's considered obvious that Xabi will choose Bayern, because I think the English media are also treating it like it's obvious that he'll choose Liverpool.
It's not as clear in the german media as he makes it out to be. The Liverpool option is also considered, though probably more because Klopp, a german coach, is leaving than because we care who manages an English club.
Bayern is the likely option here, but it's not treated as a given.
@@thesilvanalyst6880I completely agree. As I see it portrayed in kicker, bild and the likes here: Alonso is the clear favorite option for the position at Bayern, but Bayern is not the favorite option for Alonso.
Bayern are trying to speak it into existence.
I think its more of a wishful thinking kinda thing like if we keep saying it, it will happen. Which i cant blame both sides for doing 😂
I think a better way to view Klopp to Alonso is Shankly to Paisley. Klopp has essentially "rebuilt" the club and brought a distinct ideal and "Liverpool way". The next manager can continue the work he has done and glide on that energy. Liverpool fans will give the next manager time as well. And because Alonso has been at the club, he understands the fans.
Sadly no, not even close, Xabi was neither Klopp's assistant nor was Xabi his former player so not the same comparison.
@@rc....its close enough
what else do you want xabi to be english for this compasion to work?
@@whisthegreat Where are you from?
They probably should of recorded this later because it’s seems like the Liverpool structure is in place now and edwards is back
Exactly what I was thinking. Clearly FSG are making sure there will be a structure in place for a new manager, a structure that chooses the new manager.
I think Liverpool is smart enough to understand that Klopp cannot be replicated. No one can do what he does, or do it in Klopp's image. So a change of style and organization is necessary. But apart from Salah, Van Dijk, maybe Robertson and Trent, and possibly Jones and Allison, this is a young team and one that has only recently undergone a rebuild. The players in their 1st season at Liverpool: Szobozlai, MacAllister, Endo, Gakpo, and Nunez, Diaz, are only in their 2nd season there. So this is quite different than when Ferguson and Wenger left their respective clubs. Not that there's no challenge for any manager coming in, but I think it isn't quite a huge switch as ManU and Arsenal durign their transitions.
Alonso is a very intelligent fella. A deep-thinker of the game. He has his own way of setting-up his team, which will not be Klopp2.0. This is good. No one can out-Klopp Klopp. So a change (not a complete tear-up) will be refreshing, and the players will have to adapt. The fans will give Xabi time. Think it'll work. I think there's an even chance Xabi will want to stay another season at Leverkusen and have a tilt in the UCL, before looking to move. By then, Real Madrid will be looking post-Ancelotti. If he doesn't go to Liverpool, I would bet he stays at Leverkusen and then move to Real.
Will it shock you to learn that Curtis Jones is still 23? Definitely part of the young side of the squad, not to be roped in with Salah and VVD xD
@@MoonlitMalamute And Trent is only 26. It's not all about age, but Trent has been a 1st teamer under Klopp for 8yrs, Jones has been a 1st teamer for 2 seasons. Both are local boys. So their attachment to Klopp and the setup with Krawietz & Ljinders is strong. My point is, this is not the case with Endo, Macca, Szobo, Gakpo, Nunez & Diaz.
Szobozslai Macca and Endo are in their first year. This is their first season together all 3
@@obriendenis3965 that's what I wrote, there's a ":" in there somewhere. Nunez and Diaz are in their 2nd season.
This would make a great podcast. Just a thought…
Miss the old pod so much 😢
click play and close your eyes
Remember Bill Shankly and then Bob Paisley, we are at that junction now with JK and XA. Disappointing but exciting times.
Exactly my thoughts. That's the best comparison.
Paisley didn't have the personality of a Shankly or a Klopp, but pushed a great team to one of the best of all time. Alonso has that aura about him to do the same at Liverpool. Especially with Edwards coming back and a new sporting director, I think the structure will be there for him to succeed
Results are more important than personality! Paisley was easily more successful than Shankly, but without Shankly there wouldn't be a Paisley. Liverpool fans have their standards, but they understand results matter, this isn't a personality contest, Klopp is more than personality.
Nice coverage guys. This mite sound too simplistic but if he fails at Bayern he’s less likely to get the Liverpool job, if he fails at Liverpool he’s still got a good chance of being Bayern Manager.
How often these jobs come up is a factor, and how often these jobs come up when a club is in such a good state is even rarer.
Exactly this. It makes more sense for his long term ambitions to go to Liverpool now rather than Bayern
Totally agree. The Liverpool job won't come up very often. If he wants to come, it will probably need to happen for him now.
@@nigl2807 plus you could argue a manager hasn’t left Liverpool in a better state since the early 90s
So, basically, none of you want Alonso at Liverpool? I heard a thousand cons and 2-3 pros....
Well they’ve put “Why Xabi Alonso should avoid Liverpool” straight in the title
They don't support Liverpool, the last thing they want is for Liverpool to have another really good manager
The joy these guys brought me when the euros were on a few years ago was unmatched. Joe is an excellent host, JJ and Jon are a great partnership and Seb is super knowledgeable and was willing to share his wisdom with myself. Glad to see the Tifo boys back together
So wide of the mark here.... Liverpool look to have got Michael Edwards to return as the director of Football Operations, with Bournemouth's Richard Hughes to come in as Sporting Director. With the success the pair of them have had, particularly with Edwards being familiar with the club, this is an ideal hierarchal structure for Alonso to walk into. Alex Inglethorpe staying on as Academy Director would also be perfect, as it would keep the culture that had been built.
I also think Alonso being a very different type of manager to Klopp will help with transition. He's not going to try and be "the next Klopp" like Moyes or Emery were billed to be. This will be a completely new challenge for the players. Also, you have to consider that Alonso's position as a Liverpool icon strengthens his position with the players. This is a guy the fans will get behind, and not one that can easily be moved on by "downing tools".
Sure the Liverpool Job is after Klopp leaves is a rocky one, but no more rocky than the Bayern Job, I dont see why any manager in the world would want to work with Bayern after the how last couple managers ended things with Bayern, especially nagelsmann, what a joke of a club.
Absolutely hate Bayern, but Alonso might actually be the one coach that could make it work there again, simply because the most senior players already know him from when they played together back in 2017.
He would have a preexisting support among the players that didn't exist for any of the other managers
@@thesilvanalyst6880 A lot of those players need replacing
@@thesilvanalyst6880 it’s possible, I’m mostly speaking from the perspective imagining being a manager and Bayern has been a headache in the past so I’d rather not deal with them, could be the right man for it though
I'd forgotten how much I enjoyed these round tables ,even Seb Stafford Bore's rambling attempts to always find at least one more emotional level about anything, isn't as annoying as I remember.
Is noone going to point out them discussing and agreeing how Ancelotti replacing Guardiola in Barcelona didn't work out? 😅
yeah like huh??
Yea, i thought tjat could not be right had to google that. Ancelotti at Barcelona????
Yeah, i was surprised. They clearly meant to say "Bayern"
Hellooooooooooooo and welcome to the Tifo Football Podcast
In terms of Alonso's system it's actually not too different to what a lot of elite teams do with the ball: a situational back 3, then a box midfield, 2 width holders and a lone 9
10:15 Funny that perception of Pochettino at Spurs as a "father figure" coach, because Lucas Moura at the time gave us brazilians the impression of him as very "business like" in his personal relationships to the players. Lucas cited an especific episode in which Poch didn't even talked to him before the UCL final to give any sort of explanation as to why he was gonna be benched against Liverpool, given that it was Lucas' fenomenal performance against City that put Spurs in the final.
Poch is warm to those he likes and cold to those he really doesn't...
Bayern‘s structure has been a complete mess in the last 4-5 years. Kahn and Salihamidzic were fired at the end of last season and there have been how many managers during that time?
Very clear that Liverpool is the better option based on points made?
Less expectation from the board and fans, plenty of young players to develop and an opportunity to evolve the squad and replace some older players over the next couple of seasons. The biggest difference is LFC would give him time, he'll get none at Bayern.
This is the 2nd time I’ve gone on my subscription page in the last month and the 2nd time I’ve found an Athletic round-table conversation about a specific club uploaded in the last 10 minutes. Athletic are you watching me?
They're waiting for you to log in
I knew JJ hates Liverpool, I knew it
These are the same clowns who last summer said said Liverpool shouldn't sign Mac Allister and that we should've replaced Fabinho with Amrabat...
I think everyone wanted Amrabat after his world cup performances. We dodged a bullet
MacAllister is mid
@@F--B Clear signing of the season for price paid. I think you're mid.
@@sIlver66916 cope, seethe, and, if you will, dilate.
@@F--B You're mid.
one of the things you guys didnt touch on , is that regardless of which of those clubs he might move to if he chooses to leave leverkusen , he wouldnt just be coming in as a hot new manager fresh off a big leverkusen season. He would also be bringing that star factor , similar to what Zidane brought to Real , where as a player he stands above most of the dressing room. He was massively successful as a player at all of those clubs , Real , Liverpool , Bayern . it doesnt seem likely that he would face any significant issues getting the players onboard with his way of doing things.
finally someone with sense 😭 alonso is a champion and respected by players
Funny how having these 4 can convince you to sit and watch a 30 minute video.
More please.
THEY DID IT AGAINNNN!!!!!
SEBBB OH MY GODDD
Haha maybe it’s back to old times 😊
I'm howling at JJ's comprehensive pipe chart, brilliant
"Unfortunately you have not met our clubs expectations, we have no other option than - "
*gets thrown into the JJ Bull Club randomiser*
A weeks along time in football. With the return of Edwards to Liverpool! I feel with Liverpool they've always made smart appointments. It all depends on what Xabi wants. I feel he will have more stability at Liverpool. As far as he's connection to Liverpool.. He scored in the CL final and won the trophy and spent 4-5 years at the club... He already has a connection with club, fans and city!
None of the negative scenarios take into effect that this team is riding high on every available stat and in every area of the pitch
Seeing these 4 guys in the same room again… 😢 … brought a tear to my eye.
it would be incredibly silly for a manager to go to a club which is on their 7th since 2016 vs a club which has only had one in the same amount of time
Its funny this comes out today because the Michael Edwards theyre talking about being long gone from Liverpool looks like hes gonna be joining again.
9:57 love Joe's look to Jon at this point.
i feel like people forget the squad that moyes took over from fergie lots of ageing players and that team was att the end of its cycle and its a completely different situation weve already rebuilt a lot of the squad i think it would be a perfect time to come in
JJ and his ridiculous stats mean nothing. Liverpool are a huge club which have, fantastic players, a great acadamy, arguably the best supporters, the most iconic stadium, and play in the greatest and most competitive league in the world. Klopp is leaving the club in a very healthy position. The club that Klopp built.
I rarely watch you guys lately, purely because "The Athletic FC" put me off. I never noticed when Athletic FC posts a video, I did when Tifo IRL did
If alonso is genuinely serious the two jobs he should consider are real or Liverpool nothing else
Ancelotti extended tho so real is not likely
Facts
Difference between Alonso taking over from Klopp and Moyes is Alonis generational talent with a vision
Why is the media so desperate to talk Alonso out of coming to Liverpool?
Same reason why fabrizio Romano celebrated caicedo and lavia snubbing Liverpool for Chelsea. Fabrizio is a Chelsea fan.
Bayern is a confused mess, whereas Liverpool have a lot of potential and a more patient ownership (as well as crowd). The LFC job doesn't come around so often, so Xabi would be silly to turn it down.
I love that these chats are back and part of the channel. Really interesting and unique viewpoints and deepdives into a subject that has been talked about loads in the same way. It will still always be TIFO to me but I'm loving this type of content from you guys 🙌
I don't think what happened after wenger and ferguson etc leaving can really be compared to klopp leaving. Very different situations and very different clubs. Whatever argument there is against alonso joining Liverpool it's a lot smaller than the one for it. Bayern is the safer choice, even though they're a mess rn. If alonso is truly the elite manager we think he is, he joins Liverpool
Going Bayern would just be treading water waiting for Carlo to leave Madrid in 2/3 seasons, he'd win the league easily but wouldn't win the champions league, against the Madrid/ prem squads. If Alonso wants to test himself he should go Liverpool.
I can't get my head around how he would spend a season beating the sh*t out of Bayern and then become their manager. It doesn't make sense to me. You are either for or against, in my world.
The headline of the piece doesnt do justice to the actual substance of the discussion, but Xabi Alonso should be running towards Anfield at the end of the season. There's a huge amount of upside to achieving success at Liverpool following Leverkusen (and as JJ mentions, success comes with a lower bar at Liverpool, especially for a personality like Alonso).
Of course there are certain things that wont go away, namely FSG's analytcis baaed approach and a focus towards academy graduates and young signings - but Liverpool suggested they might have as much as £100m left over from last window to put towards strengthening the squad to fit the next managers needs.
It feels like Liverpool is ready to rearrange its structure to support whichever manager comes in next. They are now linked heavily with Edwards returning (likely as CEO) who was instrumental in creating the team that allowed Klopp to achieve so much. Parts of the backroom staff are leaving as well, leaving openings to create better fits with the next manager rather than shoehorning them into rigid system.
Im also certain that the expectations the next Liverpool manager faces will be heavily metered. No one is going to replace Klopp in whole, and the ownership, players, and fans all understand that well. As long as the next manager can maintain consistent European qualification from the off, demonstrste a clear philosophy of play, and be seen as working towards creating a stronger overall club then the club will back them.
"Travel v-logger" accuses Xabi Alonso of being too cowardly to take over from Klopp. And apparently replacing Salah plus maybe VVD will require a, "long rebuild." What a moron.
Just one to correct 1 statement that was said. Joe Gomez is the only Liverpool player that outdated Klopp (Gomez signed June 2015, Klopp joined October 2015)
I have faith and hope that the more of these episodes the gang makes, the more their personalities will start slipping through again
I missed these kinds of videos. Very happy to have it back 😊
Thank you guys so much for this JJ, Devine, Seb and Jon M really enjoyed hope there’s more in the future at least once in a while.
Weekly would be excellent but I know these things aren’t easy
Can we have a small rejoinder on Liverpool structure (13.00 - 20.00) section now that Edwards is back? Surely given his history with the club, and his imprints being still heavy (head of recruitment and scouting were his hires), significantly changes the outlook?
Seriously trying to take an academic approach with this whole points needed to be a success was shot down as soon as JJ said “who I think is good” the game has changed more points are needed than in Kenny’s time to win the league, expectations have also changed from Benitez, Houlier days
Credit to the people behind the scenes for going back to what people actually enjoy watching! This is great to see. Still miss the podcast haha
He is playing waiting game for Carlo Ancelotti to leave next season and then join Madrid when their squad is complete, smart decision by him.
Are they back together?? Can I start watching the channel again? This is awesome news!!
I think one thing that seems to be completely overlooked here is the personal aspect.
Alonso retired his player career at Bayern just 7 years ago in 2017. He still knows some of the most senior players on that team as teammates on the pitch.
Bayern has been a manager nightmare for the past few years but mainly because of the players and he would have a more personal connection to the leaders on that team from day 1 than any of the previous managers could have build in a year.
Loving Jon's deep dive podcasts on spotify, but this hits right in the feels.
Cheers lads & thank you ❤
nice to see everyone again!
With Mike Edwards possibly returning and setting up club structure does this potentially mitigate the concerns?
Wenger and Fergie both their squads in a bit of a state. Arsenal had been declining for 5-6 years before he left. Unfortunately for Alonso the Liverpool job doesn't come up very often so this 2 years at Bayern won't work.
Loving this return to long form discussions. Even if the personalities may be toned down from what I know we all loved, I thoroughly enjoy these. Little graphics like 26:11 add a lot as well. I’m not quite sure what it is, but whenever Joe is involved I have absolutely no difficulty listening to the entire video
One point to bear in mind is that the Liverpool fans tend to not like people who turn the club down. If Alonso spurns Liverpool for Bayern, he might not get the chance again
I would personally prefer if he stayed at Leverkusen for at least one more season (as long as they don't sell all their young stars, and that they back him in the transfer market). I'd like to see how far he can take this team, especially since they'll be in the Champions League next season
For me it seems insane that he would go to Bayern. Obviously he has the personal connection but it just seems crazy that the German league could be that boring and predictable that literally any ounce of success means you end up at ONE club in the country. How dull. You’d think he’d want something more interesting
It would make more sense because with Bayern he can further develop his tactics. Then in 2-3 years he could more to Madrid.
@@arglc And he can do the same at Liverpool
@Rybo4 PL is unforgiving and much much competitive than the Bundesliga.
@@arglc But Liverpool are quite forgiving and willing to give time.
bayern also only care about the champions league and i dont see them getting more patient now that their veteran players are likely in their last season or two. there’s enough tension at the club and i genuinely dont believe they care about anything besides a cl trophy, alonso isnt going to magically change that, no matter his relation with the senior players, no matter the fact he wore the shirt. bayern are desperate and unforgiving.
Already one minute in, I knew I made a mistake clicking on this video.
These discussions are so insightful. Honestly would love Xabi to grow a little more and then come to Liverpool. I don't want to see such a legend of the club fail.
A point that wasn't brought up for the pros for Bayern is that Alonso already knows the league. He knows how German teams play, how they press, how they defend. Going to England would require him to adapt his playstyle accordingly, just like Guardiola did.
Wow, these guys have great chemistry...they should start a weekly podcast that discusses football in a whimsical fashion..
does anyone have viewing stats on when Joe is in vs when not
Some bizarre takes on here. Seldom a positive outlook taken on Liverpool on here, and slighted perspectives on Klopp’s time at Liverpool.
Yes, finally a tifo video again. Glad to have them back together. Love the vibe and insights!
Can't really win if he goes to Bayern in my opinion, he's already (very likely) won the Bundesliga with a lesser club which is a harder task and then with Real, City, etc, Bayern aint winning the Champions League with their current squad any time soon. It's like beating a Ferrari in a Volvo, then beating the Ferrari in a Formula 1 car, doesn't really prove much.
THANK YOUUUU, y'all BACKKKK
JJ, on your magnificent chart, can you please draw a red circle highlighting the junction of "Success" & "Real Madrid", "Build/win" & "?"? Thanks. P.S. Great to see Joe still involved
More of this guys. Was a really enjoyable watch
It’s a joke to think that it’s a hard time to got to Liverpool. It’s the best time in the last 20 years! Easily. Trying to find a problem where there’s not
22:20 Jon seems to have taken inspiration from JJ's tactical analysis of Pochettino's Chelsea from last time.
please more roundtable discussions like this (or old podcast style too)! awesome video thanks always for the great content
Staying at Leverkusen and then joining Madrid when Carlo moves on seems like the obvious choice for Xabi.
Nope, the fans will turn on him if he loses a few games.
No Madrid will build big team for 2026@@avikarsewpersad9856
@@avikarsewpersad9856 If he's as good as advertised he won't be losing many games with that Madrid squad. Also you realize that it won't be much different at Bayern either lol.
Risky move though. Turning down big clubs to bank on a big club coming in at a later date.
@@Rybo4 Very good point but I think Xabi has the ability to justify this approach. Leverkusen will be in the CL next season and they won't have any pressure surrounding the club especially if they seal the deal and win the Bundesliga this season.
Going to Bayern or Liverpool and failing immediately would be a bigger hit on Xabi's career path in my opinion.
The suggestion I keep seeing, that Alonso would shy away from LFC because of greater league competition is such an insult....does he really seem like the kind of manger that doesn't believe in his ability?
Alonso's tailor made for Liverpool. He inherits a top quality quad that he can tweak and mold over time. Bayern is a dead project with too many behind the scenes politics, and would indicate that he lacks ambition.
Bayern arent that bad , they will get back next season for sure , we cannot also say liverpool without klopp will work for sure , things can change very easily in football . But I agree liverpool is an attractive prospect for now than bayern
So to answer Steff’s point, who replace Bill Shankly? As I remember it was Bob Paisley, who was actually more successful and I would suggest was more successful. My second point is that I would suggest that the premiership is a higher standard and so surely if you rate yourself you should be attracted to the better and harder league. Lastly if you look at the two teams, Liverpool is a i]United squad and there has been an introduction of several young and exciting players., Bayern has a squad that has been split into several factions and there is a huge amount of politics in the club.
Now for the future if as is believed Edwards is due to come back and knows the club extremely well and will bring with him a team of management that will offer the rock that Alonso could build a huge team on.
Generally it comes across as a group of people who know what answer they want and are now trying to justify it.
Having said that it is nice to see the whole group together again and replace the kids that don’t seem to know anything