The DIFFERENCE between jazz and classical pianists! 🧐 | Ben Laude & Noam Sivan

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  • čas přidán 4. 09. 2023
  • Ben Laude and Noam Sivan explain the values of learning to improvise as a classical musician.
    Watch Laude and Sivan teach improvisation and more on Tonebase!
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Komentáře • 374

  • @arnestroehmann3188
    @arnestroehmann3188 Před 9 měsíci +697

    Beethoven for example was a genius improviser

    • @Franz_Liszt_Korean
      @Franz_Liszt_Korean Před 9 měsíci +12

      Like me

    • @AltohP
      @AltohP Před 9 měsíci +50

      He wasn't on that damn phone

    • @arnestroehmann3188
      @arnestroehmann3188 Před 9 měsíci +12

      @@Franz_Liszt_Korean but Beethoven was the first one ever to write down a Bebop
      Opus 111. 3rd variation in the second sentence ;-)))

    • @plootyluvsturtle9843
      @plootyluvsturtle9843 Před 9 měsíci +17

      as well as most of the great composers too. Mozart, Bach, and from what I’ve heard Chopin especially

    • @CougheePls
      @CougheePls Před 9 měsíci +16

      Exactly. Improvisation used to have a part in the classical music world

  • @djsjdh-hoahdi
    @djsjdh-hoahdi Před 9 měsíci +306

    As a jazz pianist, years of practice improvising every day has gotten me familiar enough with my instrument to interpret and feel where the music energetically and emotionally wants to go next. It’s very limited conscious thinking, just colors that I hear the music asking for in my “minds ear” that we intuit out in a way I can’t 100% explain.
    But tell me to play back and entire piece exactly as written I won’t have a great time. Weak reading skills were traded for ear training.
    I have much admiration for my classical cohorts, playing together in either genre.
    The different ways we reach, interpret, and personalize the music we play will never cease to amaze me. I envy the cultivated set of skills of my friends who admire my cultivated set of skills. So many talents to have and so many ways to interpret and interact with this music. Who can do it all? Very few. But we all *can* respect it all.
    This video was a bit too dogmatic for me. My improvising is a power that some lack, but they hold powers i lack. While agree we should be able to intuit in real time, music is more than a verbal language.
    Improviser or not, it’s about being an adept communicator. As a listener and enjoyer, one does not have to “learn the language” to understand the communication in music. Classical musicians are incredible interpreters, liaisons, and communicators of all these different feelings the greatest composers have given us. This man’s metaphor sounded alright, but falls narrow-mindedly short and misses the whole point of this lovely form of art.

    • @nacre2927
      @nacre2927 Před 8 měsíci +15

      Dude, that was beautiful, right choice of words. For real, thank you so much for this comment, it gave me thrills

    • @matsab7930
      @matsab7930 Před 8 měsíci +1

      Where did they suggest it’s bad that you can recite entire pieces from memory or by reading sheet music? They’re just saying that the way classical music is learned today lacks creativity; it lacks any improvisation. That’s objectively true.
      Long story short; dumb comment.

    • @hernandezisaias90
      @hernandezisaias90 Před 8 měsíci +3

      Amazing analysis 👏

    • @m.dave2141
      @m.dave2141 Před 7 měsíci +1

      100% agree

    • @advikthepianokid4583
      @advikthepianokid4583 Před 4 měsíci +2

      ⁠​⁠​⁠​⁠​⁠​⁠​⁠​⁠​⁠@@matsab7930It’s not exactly the fact they said reading and reciting is useless, it’s the fact they said it in a way where improvisation is much more (if not completely) useful than the ability to interpret already written pieces. Of course, no one can deny improvisation is very important to have, but like with a coin, both sides of the story are equal. This is what the op was trying to convey, that you didn’t seem to understand.

  • @carolasandrakaty
    @carolasandrakaty Před 9 měsíci +136

    We do improvise, just not in public.

    • @Wolfganger
      @Wolfganger Před 6 měsíci

      @@mildlyinterestingltsLOL!

    • @rocelderamos3013
      @rocelderamos3013 Před 5 měsíci +2

      ​@@mildlyinterestingltsOh yea, beginners are the best at "broken chords" and "dissonance" 😂

  • @anoldretiredelephant
    @anoldretiredelephant Před 9 měsíci +236

    this is what I like about baroque historically informed performances of bach or whomever because of the improvisation, makes every new recording special and not just fine tuning the interpretation to get to what the original composer might've intended.

    • @Itemtotem
      @Itemtotem Před 9 měsíci +2

      I improvise in Bach
      Things are not to be played the same way twice wether phrase or section. The repeated sections are supposed to be improvised upon

    • @longlifetometal1995
      @longlifetometal1995 Před 9 měsíci +2

      HIP is scam. The process is amazing, but the end result is purely contemporary regardless. We have no (sound) recordings from the baroque period and the whole baroque tradition was actually lost in history, mostly after 1848. Playing on period instruments doesn't make it an historically informed interpretation, such an accolade only sells to the people that still think music is supposed to be performed in one true way and the rest shouldn't be considered

    • @anoldretiredelephant
      @anoldretiredelephant Před 9 měsíci +8

      @@longlifetometal1995 well of course we wont get to the real truth but to call it a scam is ridiculous. HIP has cleared up the interpretation of many pieces, I think most notably Bach's 'lute' works and Brandenburg no. 6, which only make any sense on historical instruments or something akin to them. I think a lot of the best art is best appreciated in its original context, like the roman frescoes from Pompeii look much better where they originally were instead of being torn away from the walls and hung up as if they were oil paintings, and I think the same can be said for HIP, yes other ways of playing the music are valid and can be very great(the WTC works wonderfully on the piano) but still the composer intended it to be played with the instruments of his day and I think that should be kept in mind in any other interpretation. and besides, we can know and gather a lot from instruments that were made back then or from descriptions of them, just because we don't have audio recordings doesn't mean we can't know what it sounded like.

    • @JFroTheMusician
      @JFroTheMusician Před 8 měsíci +2

      @@longlifetometal1995Of course we don’t have recordings, of course we will never know what these tunes “truly” sounded like. That’s not the point of HIP. The point of HIP is essentially applied historical musicology. It’s putting as much aspect of the music back into its historical context as much as we’re able to. This doesn’t make HIP a “scam”.

    • @babygirl4169
      @babygirl4169 Před 3 měsíci

      What's the name of the first piece?

  • @irenedhakde4692
    @irenedhakde4692 Před 9 měsíci +48

    Yes but playing something already written permits playing much more difficult pieces than if we improvised. We need both styles.

    • @MusicalPlayground717
      @MusicalPlayground717 Před 9 měsíci +3

      I agree both styles are necessary, but a skilled improviser can come up with music as difficult as any written piece. Look at Art Tatum.

    • @bodaciouscans
      @bodaciouscans Před 8 měsíci +11

      Sigh, why is "difficulty" sooo important for classical musicians. With some classical music students I feel that the level of difficulty is more important to them than the conveying emotion or beauty of a piece of music 😢

    • @justanothernguyen2334
      @justanothernguyen2334 Před 8 měsíci

      @@bodaciouscans its the status involved in the dick-comparing contest that is the classical world

    • @somasundaramsankaranarayan4592
      @somasundaramsankaranarayan4592 Před 8 měsíci +9

      ​​@@bodaciouscansthe more sophisticated the music gets, the more possibilities open up to convey intricate emotions. Though it is not necessary that music must be sophisticated inorder to be emotional and all sophisticated music isn't emotion invoking either.

    • @tjenadonn6158
      @tjenadonn6158 Před 8 měsíci

      ​@@somasundaramsankaranarayan4592I dare you to find a single piece of music that more completely and profoundly conveys the emotion of "despair" better than "Frankie Teardrop," by a band which for CZcams purposes I habe to call Self-Delete. The music is about as simple as something can get without being a solitary drone: a sparse drum loop created on a machine so old it would make the Roland 808 or the first generation LinnDrum look like Ableton by comparison, Marin Rev playing a simple keyboard line on what sounds like a heavily damaged console organ, and Alan Vega's half-warbling, half-screaming vocals. For over ten minutes of the bleakest sounds you'll ever hear these dead simple elements weave into a murder ballad that sounds for all intents and purposes like it's being broadcast directly from Hell itself: whether that is the literal Hell of the Bible or the Hell we all create within ourselves during our darkest moments is an exercise for the listener. It's been described by many as both one of the most powerful songs ever recorded and as the kind of song you only listen to once, with a riff and drum line that anyone vould program in five minutes. Musical compexity≠emotional depth.

  • @SILAS-cb9xl
    @SILAS-cb9xl Před 9 měsíci +73

    i play the piano and i also learn pieces of the great composers. but i also improvise and compose in classic and romantic style. i think it helps you develop a bond with the music and how the composers themselves felt during the process of improvisation and writing things down. it’s also a great way to channel your emotions. like into playing whatever melodie, rhythm etc comes to your mind

  • @jordancuevas4693
    @jordancuevas4693 Před 9 měsíci +32

    As a pianist, I believe the modern consensus is that classically trained musicians are expected to learn by mastering and performing in the appropriate style based on the compositional context and period of the piece. Improvisation is taught secondary alongside music theory, however is generally ignored for the repertoire. This goes in conjunction to earlier Baroque and Classical period teachings, where improvisation was taught as part of the performance practise and musical material (figured bass and ornamentation for example)

    • @SpitfireRoad
      @SpitfireRoad Před 9 měsíci

      Yes! Coloratura for the singer and undocumented ornamentation on keys go hand in hand.

    • @liljs4189
      @liljs4189 Před 8 měsíci +1

      That doesn’t add up with the fact that classical pianists of today have a very hard time to improvise compared to those in the baroque and classical periods

  • @LUR1FAX
    @LUR1FAX Před 9 měsíci +45

    F in the chat for that guy's hairline.

  • @bret6484
    @bret6484 Před 9 měsíci +12

    We need more classical improvisation! Jazz is always welcome to exploring and improvising, and that is why it will never die. Classical music is vanishing outside of the academic system, but it doesn't have to be that way! Learning the stylistic and harmonic conventions of classical music has been massive for my musicianship, and improvising in these styles is the best way to compose. Don't let it die!

    • @SpitfireRoad
      @SpitfireRoad Před 9 měsíci

      Not sure it's the best way to compose but like you, my classical training is a solid foundation to improvising. Perhaps you're including orchestration. Can't imagine not having access to others scores.

    • @bret6484
      @bret6484 Před 9 měsíci +1

      @@SpitfireRoad I found that once I was familiar with the "rules", my most natural melodies and intuitive formal discoveries came from deep within my soul. I like to record my improvisations, transcribe them, and edit and expand afterwards.
      what do you mean though about orchestration?

    • @SpitfireRoad
      @SpitfireRoad Před 9 měsíci

      @@bret6484 I'm the same. By orchestrating I meant "sculpting" music beyond piano/guitar/voice/harmonica and percussion. Took me half a lifetime to be bold enough to try it with any seriousness. Long user of Musescore (search Mr. Jeff). Mixcraft for my DAW, and soon, RipX. Amazing power!

    • @thedragonofthewest5789
      @thedragonofthewest5789 Před 9 měsíci

      share some music then @@bret6484

  • @RaptorT1V
    @RaptorT1V Před 9 měsíci +9

    Nikolai Kapustin is a perfect example of a composer/pianist in the middle of classical and jazz (or a man who is both jazz and classical musician)

  • @yellow92959
    @yellow92959 Před 9 měsíci +4

    I'm a classical musician mainly but I think that improvising is a valuable skill that every musician should learn regardless of what style they play.

  • @brandonmacey964
    @brandonmacey964 Před 9 měsíci +15

    I don't often play jazz, but when I do, it's gospel based

  • @TheElectricCheeseProductions22
    @TheElectricCheeseProductions22 Před 9 měsíci +8

    This is why I invest a lot of time into ear training via sight singing. The way I understand things, you cannot really improvise or make your own music if you do not have "relative pitch". If you do not have this and cannot categorize the sounds then its material your brain does not have and cannot articulate thus is cannot utilize it in creation leaving you only to function with a mostly theoretical understanding which I don't think will ever get you to making anything of great value because art is highly intuitive. If you cannot articulate music in your head then you cannot intuit with it, etc.
    Anyway, my point is that even though my piano lessons only consist of learning pieces and technique, I do not want to simply spend my life only playing music written by other people, by people from several hundred years ago. And so I take it upon myself to actually train myself to become musical.

  • @Kosmos-go6wf
    @Kosmos-go6wf Před 5 měsíci

    I just love the humility of Ben Laude.

  • @Deu_terio
    @Deu_terio Před 8 měsíci

    WE NEED BOTH so thank you for existing!

  • @mgsilverhead9636
    @mgsilverhead9636 Před 9 měsíci +2

    I've been teaching for 20 years... a curriculum specifically designed to address this! We improv at every lesson. And still learn to read scores.

  • @VinceRicafort-xo9lu
    @VinceRicafort-xo9lu Před 9 měsíci +5

    Great late classical pianists actually do improvises like Horowitz, Cziffra, etc. since they want to add their spice to it..

  • @cookie2112
    @cookie2112 Před 9 měsíci +3

    What have you done with your lives?? You've been helping in keeping alive extraordinarily beautiful masterpieces that would have faded into oblivion should you all amazing talented musicians hadn't invested your time in developing the necessary skills to allow us to enjoy that, which in most cases and in its own way, are the epitome of humanity itself. My sincere thanks and respect to all of you unsung performers of the human spirit songs.

  • @ZauberKlavierSandraLabsch
    @ZauberKlavierSandraLabsch Před 9 měsíci +29

    My experience is: classical pianists and jazz pianists are and think completely differently. You don't choose a side, you are what you are. Normally, classical musicians have an aversion to playing freely and improvising. Jazz pianists have a crisis when they have to play a certain piece without deviation. I am a quite successful composer (piano music) in Germany and I cannot improvise at all. (But I can teach beginners very well in improvisation.) There are very different areas in which one can be gifted or not gifted. And not everything can be learned.

    • @TheElectricCheeseProductions22
      @TheElectricCheeseProductions22 Před 9 měsíci +4

      Justify your expressed belief that these are "gifts" and cannot be learned.

    • @rafjeevarafjeeva5952
      @rafjeevarafjeeva5952 Před 9 měsíci +6

      I am classical musician, and I could not survive without improvisation, classical or jazz (mostly classical) and most of my compositions would not exist if I had not improvise first.
      If classicals composers over centuries of musics (before the 20th century) were able to improvise incredible thing, there is not any reason that make modern pianists and composers unable to improvise. The only reason for this uncapacity even for a lot of really technically gifted pianists to improvise is elitism, over the last century, many piano teachers taught that improvisation is garbage, taught to theirs students no never play anything that is not written on a score, making the it sacred, denying and disapproving any attempt at musical innovation.
      We should encourage students, teachers, and concert pianist to improvise (same for other instruments),never doing it contributes to the decline of classical music

    • @ZauberKlavierSandraLabsch
      @ZauberKlavierSandraLabsch Před 9 měsíci +2

      @@rafjeevarafjeeva5952 Yes, we should encourage students, teachers and concert pianists to improvise. But I think anyone who feels the need to do so will do so. No matter what the teacher thought of it. My strong desire was to compose. No one encouraged me or made me do it. It came on its own. I improvise with all the students. Those who didn't want it from the beginning never liked it. And that's exactly how it is with me. :)

    • @rafjeevarafjeeva5952
      @rafjeevarafjeeva5952 Před 9 měsíci +5

      @@ZauberKlavierSandraLabsch I agree with you but the problem is that a lot of students that would like to improvise and could do it well are repressed by teachers (at least in conservatories). I've seen teachers being really harsh to young students that were trying to improvise. I think that teachers should teach to their students the basics of improvisation, it would make them understand better harmony, and understand what they are playing when they are playing a piece, (just play notes by heart without understanding the score is not very good for interpretation). This would benefit both those who love and hate improvising. Students would have a better understanding of what they are playing, and we would have more great improvisation pianist (Apart from Cyprien Katsaris there are not many anymore although it was common in the 19th century)

    • @ZauberKlavierSandraLabsch
      @ZauberKlavierSandraLabsch Před 9 měsíci +4

      @@rafjeevarafjeeva5952 My personal experience: In Germany, most piano professors have no idea about improvisation (and unfortunately there are only a few good teachers for it at conservatories.) And what you haven't learned and can't do yourself, you can't teach at a high level, so you'd rather repress it in the student than admit that you're the wrong teacher for it. I know few teachers at universities who are good educators. Not to mention the human side. But that is just my personal experience. I was certainly a bit unlucky.

  • @dozie85
    @dozie85 Před 9 měsíci +2

    You’re right. Not enough performance oriented classical musicians study important composition based studies such as partimenti, counterpoint, schenkerian analysis, etc. These studies are key to understanding the language

  • @Luiss-ix7rf
    @Luiss-ix7rf Před 9 měsíci +9

    Keith Jarrett is widely considered as the greatest piano improviser of the 20th century. He is a classically trained pianist who began to give recitals when he was six years old. Besides, he recorded Bach's major works.

    • @SpitfireRoad
      @SpitfireRoad Před 9 měsíci

      Glad you brought him up. He can't play anymore like he used to but he is still a genius. Who is next on the stage?

    • @arvaborelius7269
      @arvaborelius7269 Před 8 měsíci

      ​@@SpitfireRoadHe's already well established, but Brad Mehldau is absolutely Keiths spiritual successor.

  • @LivingGuy484
    @LivingGuy484 Před 9 měsíci

    I really liked the music in the background! It was a nice touch

  • @h5mind373
    @h5mind373 Před 8 měsíci +1

    Here in Spain, my son is somewhat of a novelty because he is both classically trained and can also improvise on the spot- over contemporary or classical melodies. He even "finished" one of Chopin's unfinished works and unless you knew the original, it's difficult to note where one composer ends and the other begins.

  • @hanshead
    @hanshead Před 9 měsíci +1

    Uh you say that, but Organists in Europe for instance are expected to improvise. I saw Naji Hakim, who succeeded Messiaen, improvise on variously melodies.

  • @danielgloverpiano7693
    @danielgloverpiano7693 Před 9 měsíci +24

    The best explanation I’ve had for telling non-musicians the difference between classical and jazz musicians is this:
    We’re interpretive artists who take the great works of all time into our body and soul and interpret them for the audience. It’s akin to an actor doing a Shakespeare play. There are as many ways to interpret them as there are human beings.
    A jazz musician is closer to a stand up comedian who makes up things on the spot which come from their personal life experience. They retell a story, but the words might be different each time.
    I don’t think it’s at all necessary for the two to overlap, and there aren’t many Shakespearean actors who would have any interest in doing standup comedy. Why should they? And vice versa.

    • @Ubu987
      @Ubu987 Před 9 měsíci +6

      Standup Shakespeare would be interesting.

    • @danielgloverpiano7693
      @danielgloverpiano7693 Před 9 měsíci +4

      @@Ubu987 isn’t that what Monty Python did? 😀

    • @MusicalPlayground717
      @MusicalPlayground717 Před 9 měsíci

      @@Ubu987Look up The Improvised Shakespeare Company. They’re amazing.

    • @charlieb8735
      @charlieb8735 Před 8 měsíci +2

      I think that’s a well reasoned standpoint but wouldn’t that logic essentially preclude any new compositions in the world of academia besides jazz?
      I don’t feel like the vocabulary, forms and styles behind classical/western art music inherently lead to any existing modern genre and I doubt the type of improvisation in jazz would ever be compatible with anything besides solo pieces or specified solos.
      It just feels like a shame because to me, it seems impossible that someone in the vein of Paganini would ever arise from the world of classical when no value is placed on the potential compositions and creative interpretations that the highest echelon of performers could create

    • @philswaim392
      @philswaim392 Před 8 měsíci +2

      Funny because in shakespears day there was also plenty of improv, stand up, and moments where actors were encouraged to just make it up. It wasnt until conservatists put in rigid rules and made everything prescriptive that we dont see any improv in shakespearean theatre today.
      So the same with classocal music which had lots of improv. It HAD to in order for people to make improvements to music.

  • @angellee9307
    @angellee9307 Před 9 měsíci

    I LOVE YOU SENSITIVE PEOPLE! ❤❤❤❤❤ Thank-You all !!! ❤❤❤

  • @drewpalasick3681
    @drewpalasick3681 Před 9 měsíci +2

    anyone know the piece at the beginning? Recognize but can't name

  • @owenomalley4456
    @owenomalley4456 Před 9 měsíci +2

    I improvise classically it's very fun!

  • @TreasureX7
    @TreasureX7 Před 9 měsíci +3

    I am a classical pianist and I improvise. Let’s make it short like a Shorts: difference between Earth and Moon.

  • @tanglongtao
    @tanglongtao Před 9 měsíci +1

    I’m a continuo player and I improvise on the piano when I coach Mozart operas or accompany Baroque cantatas! It was SHOCKING how similar to jazz it is - I took a few jazz piano lessons and had that epiphany moment.

  • @Highinsight7
    @Highinsight7 Před 9 měsíci +2

    I'm both an organist and a classical pianist... as an organist, I improvise all the time... BUT I always improvise a encore

  • @h5mind373
    @h5mind373 Před 8 měsíci +2

    My son plays the piano professionally. Inspired by several years in London, he developed a particular love of classical pieces. Meanwhile, his work as a soloist and accompanist requires everything from pop and rock to jazz and blues. So today he switches comfortably from one style to another. If there is interest or need, I think a well-trained musician should be able to perform anything. That said, his current teacher is very much in "Camp Classical", and cannot improvise. He can't even do a walking bassline. My son, on the other hand, plays whatever the people request! I suppose a lot of this depends on whether music is a career or a hobby.

  • @vivianapereyra6529
    @vivianapereyra6529 Před 9 měsíci +7

    A classical music background is priceless ❤

  • @marasours1927
    @marasours1927 Před 7 měsíci

    I was trained classically, as a piano major in college. I learned improvisation gradually. Now, I play by ear and improvise as much or more than I play classical. I play and teach both genres now. I play in church and as a recorded artist. I teach classical pianists to play by ear and improvise.

  • @jamesonrichards5105
    @jamesonrichards5105 Před 9 měsíci +1

    can we please bring back improv in classical music

  • @hendrik4801
    @hendrik4801 Před 9 měsíci +3

    What about partimento?

  • @axucaroso
    @axucaroso Před 5 měsíci

    Reject the either/or premise! Put the classical training and repertoire together with the jazz improvisation and songbooks! Suggested listening: Bob James 1, 2, 3 & 4; Ramsey Lewis, Return to Forever, Wynton Marsalis, Renee Fleming, and Duke Ellington

  • @tchaffman
    @tchaffman Před 7 měsíci

    The ending is so real lmao

  • @on-the-spot9467
    @on-the-spot9467 Před 9 měsíci +3

    If I were you sir, I would shave it all. Promise!

    • @sonofbasedgod
      @sonofbasedgod Před 9 měsíci +4

      thanks i was looking for a comment acknowledging the haircut

  • @alexanderchirozidi4572
    @alexanderchirozidi4572 Před 9 měsíci +3

    Who is the lady at the end of the video playing the first chord of Beethoven Sonata 8?

    • @mr2922
      @mr2922 Před 9 měsíci

      That's Beethoven herself!

  • @elodier352
    @elodier352 Před 9 měsíci

    Indeed we lost a bit the notion of improvising in classical music, at least for the firts years but later when a pianist become more accomplish he is also able to improvise. It is actually the case for most classical concertist.

  • @andreashoppe1969
    @andreashoppe1969 Před 9 měsíci +1

    I don't make mistakes. I am just improvising

  • @nadim4343
    @nadim4343 Před 8 měsíci

    Both skills are necessary in my opinion. Composed music helps create gargantuan musical forms for ensembles which improvised music cannot offer. On the other hand improvising helps you speak the language and is a totally different kind of enjoyment and experience. I use both in my gigs and will favor one or another depending on situation.

  • @zzzut
    @zzzut Před 8 měsíci

    I was told that the present rigid approach to classical music is relatively recent. In opera singing, for instance, many of the high notes, ornaments and even cadenzas that are performed today were not written. In the golden years of bel canto, every performer was encouraged to add his or her personal touch. Sometime in the 20th century, voice teachers started to tell singers to stick to the written score but oddly enough, many of the virtuoso parts of those scores are some of the best improvised variations from the early singers. I don’t know whether that is true or not but that’s what I was told.

  • @EANNE1000
    @EANNE1000 Před 9 měsíci +1

    We read music and the rewards are the same, or greater, as reading any text.

  • @shakesrear7850
    @shakesrear7850 Před 9 měsíci +3

    Name of the piece pls?

  • @MayhemJack
    @MayhemJack Před 9 měsíci +1

    And that's why I quit music school-because I wanted to make music.

  • @DragosDomnara
    @DragosDomnara Před 9 měsíci +1

    Does anyone know the piece played at the beginning?

  • @raphael2692
    @raphael2692 Před 9 měsíci +20

    In Europe lots of people learn latin, it’s part of our curriculum, not only priests like in America. Latin is a great thing.

    • @mr2922
      @mr2922 Před 9 měsíci

      In America the focus is on learning the parts that are most relevant, such as affixes.

    • @SWTORLOL87
      @SWTORLOL87 Před 9 měsíci +3

      There are plenty of people across America that have taken Latin in high school, college, or both. Some start even younger. I’m just tired of seeing “like in America” from people who barely have a surface level understanding of America.

    • @raphael2692
      @raphael2692 Před 9 měsíci

      ​@@SWTORLOL87 sorry i don't like ur culture except the blacks and the jewish are good like billy holliday or bob dylan

    • @raphael2692
      @raphael2692 Před 9 měsíci

      and dday in normandie thank u for that

    • @SWTORLOL87
      @SWTORLOL87 Před 9 měsíci +1

      @@raphael2692 Okay, that had nothing to do with what I said but okay. I’m just saying it’s foolish to speak on things you don’t know about. I know it’s super cool and trendy to hate America but do it correctly.

  • @pialmot2011
    @pialmot2011 Před 9 měsíci +4

    Yunchan Lim loves to improvise. That is why each of his performance is worth to watch.

  • @accountno5571
    @accountno5571 Před 8 měsíci +5

    Speak for yourself. I'm a classical pianist and I improvise all the time. It was an examined part of my master's degree. Most classical pianists I know how to improvise, whether that's in cadenzas, or added decorations in a repeated section of music. Plus when a page turn goes wrong or a mistake is made - most classical pianists must know how to improvise a little to cover those mistakes and keep the music coherent. While you're correct in saying it's not as big a part of classical music performance as it once was, and is more prevalent in jazz, it is still an essential skill that almost every professional pianist knows how to do. Don't spread misinformation please.

  • @goldroger50
    @goldroger50 Před 8 měsíci +4

    Bro's hair💀

  • @Garfield_Minecraft
    @Garfield_Minecraft Před 8 měsíci +1

    learning a language is not like music
    i never speak but i listen to it(i'm introvert)
    and i play instrument i learn techniques and practice it

  • @musicsdarkangel
    @musicsdarkangel Před 6 měsíci

    I've been saying this for years and wrote my masters thesis on "how to learn and teach classical improvisation". You label the chords as if it was a jazz chart (use names not roman numerals. Ex. GM) and then follow with the corresponding scales/key you're in. With some practice, you'll be feeling your way around. You can also vocalize this to be more intentional. To improvise the left hand or harmony with both hands, simply keep the same chords but change the texture (example: for a G major harmony, you can play any of those G B D's on the piano in any assortment, rhythm or texture). With some practice, it'll start feeling natural. Mozart is a great starting point since his music is so scalar and clearly reflects his improvising genius. The Twinkle Variations alone are like a study in improvisation.

  • @daviddonascimento
    @daviddonascimento Před 9 měsíci

    *That one famous classical pianist that improvised Chopin at a recital* : I have no weaknesses

  • @dskinner6263
    @dskinner6263 Před 6 měsíci

    This surely short changes the endeavors and achievements of so many musicians. Perhaps there's a better way than this to encourage people to use their ears and imagination. I don't think the study and performance of written music is really comparable to the study of a dead language. Hearing (or learning to play) a written composition is still a living experience.

  • @HardluckHutch
    @HardluckHutch Před 8 měsíci

    It’s crazy because improvisation was a HUGE part of the great composers skill set, they did it all the time.

  • @nineskies5907
    @nineskies5907 Před 8 měsíci

    Same with guitar. (Usually electrical) guitarists are expected to improvise as they practice from the moment they learn their first scale

  • @gunnarplettenberg2335
    @gunnarplettenberg2335 Před 7 měsíci

    Actually we learn Latin in school so basicly to read the old roman Texts like Ciceros Speeches or Julius Cessrs de bello galico. So yes you can learn a language like this.😊 it is more than just memorizing the Text, you need to understand it too.

  • @HalTuberman
    @HalTuberman Před 8 měsíci

    Both approaches have merit.

  • @alrisan71
    @alrisan71 Před 9 měsíci +1

    what's really matters is the music itself, no matter whether it is improvised or not. Improvised bad music will always be bad music.

  • @robertaspringer7091
    @robertaspringer7091 Před 8 měsíci

    The same artists take up on rolls, the classical musician or interpret co-signs the piece he/she is playing. It’s like co-creating

  • @antjamnow1286
    @antjamnow1286 Před 8 měsíci

    Ha. That Cm intro to Pathetique Sonata at the end

  • @cadriver2570
    @cadriver2570 Před 9 měsíci

    Great short and all, but have you got any Pez?

  • @dalsegno1251
    @dalsegno1251 Před 9 měsíci +1

    Classical pianists express themselves through their personal interpretations of these masterpieces, but not too long ago, they did improvise.

  • @GdHNightshade
    @GdHNightshade Před 9 měsíci

    I'm a classicle pianist, and I learned how to improvise in a classicle style and use baroque methods, too. However, I've never played jazz.

  • @danielgloverpiano7693
    @danielgloverpiano7693 Před 9 měsíci +1

    The only problem with this argument is that I can’t stand to listen to jazz. It bores the crap out of me . Just my opinion. I want music that has a wider variety of rhythm, a well thought out structure, more musical depth, etc. I’ve yet to hear any jazz which moves me on an emotional level, and isn’t that what music is about? Every musician should read Oliver Sachs Musicophilia where he discusses the fact that our brains have a visceral reaction to hearing familiar melodies and harmonic progressions. If those are altered with each performance, the brain doesn’t react the same way. Something being improvised on the spot won’t have the same depth of meaning on a listener and ditto for hearing the world premiere of a new work. In other words, by its very nature, jazz cannot stimulate the brain the way classical music does. It’s inherent in the two types of music. Jazz has a sameness about it which causes me to lose interest very quickly.

  • @andrewbrooks7988
    @andrewbrooks7988 Před 9 měsíci +1

    It’s time dawg
    But I agree with what dude said

  • @phoneminlwin5160
    @phoneminlwin5160 Před 9 měsíci +13

    Classical Musicians do improvise!

  • @LaserGryph
    @LaserGryph Před 9 měsíci +11

    Is a shame because, back in Bach's day, musicians were expected to be able to improvise over music. Even a mediocre keyboard player was expected to be able to make a mediocre fugue on the spot. It wasn't until about the era of Beethoven that improvising started to become a dirty word and with that, classical musicians began to lose an important part of themselves.
    The Historically Informed Performance cult took it a step further and said not only are you to never improvise, but there are only two or three ways you're allowed to express a piece of you want acceptance.
    This expedited classical music to its grave.

    • @zach9390
      @zach9390 Před 9 měsíci +3

      I think I agree with the other person that the culture of hyper-fixation on perfecting interpretations to the composers' original intent was more due to a long historical process and the advent of recording technologies (which changed the whole dynamic of performance).
      It's a little strange that you brought up historically informed performance, as I tend to see in them MORE improvisation and freedom in phrasing (such as in ornamentation, cadenzas, rubato, and other creative choices) than most "standard" recordings. It's hard to believe that this relatively niche practice would have such a profound impact on classical music culture when MOST concert performances, MOST competitions, and MOST recordings people are exposed to (all of which uphold perfectionism) are not HIP. So, again, weird narrative to advance.

  • @tl8319
    @tl8319 Před 9 měsíci +7

    “Can we imagine learning a language by only reading, memorizing, and reciting the language without being able to speak that language?” Yes we can imagine it because that’s what 99% of people do in their native language. Improvising isn’t akin to speaking, it’s akin to synthesizing a new written book. Reciting = speaking. Why would most pianists be expected to reach the level
    of synthesis when almost no one in any other field reaches that level? There are millions of cooks but only a handful of original chefs.

    • @tl8319
      @tl8319 Před 9 měsíci +4

      I would also argue that 99% of “improvisers” aren’t synthesizing anything new on the spot. They are regurgitating motifs and ideas that are in their mind, perhaps original or not. But at best it is subconscious recitation in a new order, but not actually in the moment synthesis.

  • @XxMMXIIxX
    @XxMMXIIxX Před 9 měsíci

    I couldn't improvise if my life depended on it. If its not on the paper, I dont know what the next note ahould be.

  • @mabdub
    @mabdub Před 9 měsíci

    I've read that at least two thirds of Chopin's actual output were improvisations of his own music which at the time was the main reason people flocked to hear him play. It seems as though it's the composers who are allowed to improvise unless it's jazz.

    • @h5mind373
      @h5mind373 Před 8 měsíci

      People forget, "classical" music was modern for its day, and office unique and experimental.

  • @BrendanCalliesComposer
    @BrendanCalliesComposer Před 9 měsíci

    I feel that ben

  • @VincentDBlair
    @VincentDBlair Před 2 měsíci

    Historically improvisation used to be the norm in “classical” music. Organists have kept the tradition.
    Learning music theory and applying those rules in real time is essentially what improvisation is.
    Jazz is also firmly rooted in western music theory.
    It’s not a mysterious skill, it’s just a craft.

  • @themetamancer7402
    @themetamancer7402 Před 8 měsíci

    Romantic pianists: both please

  • @heikomankin3410
    @heikomankin3410 Před 9 měsíci

    What's the piece at the beginning of the clip again? I recognise it, but can't remember which piece it was.

  • @cadriver2570
    @cadriver2570 Před 9 měsíci +1

    Chilly Gonzales embodies the old-school composer in this regard. He improvises on his compositions constantly.

  • @ViRrOorR
    @ViRrOorR Před 9 měsíci

    Thats why when people ask me to just play whatever im like nope I literally cant. Im a classical amateur pianist not a musician.

  • @Rach882
    @Rach882 Před 7 měsíci

    Can someone tell me whats the name of the piece of music at the beginning of this video?

  • @pjbpiano
    @pjbpiano Před 9 měsíci

    I generally think that most classical music aficionados and experts do not actually understand what it means to improvise.
    Most people think that improvisation is all about the creation of new notes. But that is just one type of improvisation. You can still memorize entire notes and still improvise how the performance ought to go.
    That said however, many classical pianists do improvise. They are just unable to improvise in the language of the many composers music that they perform. Tone Base should really look into this and getting things right.

  • @RachManJohn
    @RachManJohn Před 9 měsíci +26

    YOU don't improvise. Artists do. Gekic does and many other great classical musicians throughout history. I do, and although I'm still learning its astounding to me that we've let it get this bad.

  • @rohinagrawal9727
    @rohinagrawal9727 Před 3 měsíci

    thats just you ben. most of us dedicated musicians learn not only the notes.

  • @TheGoldenHorncall
    @TheGoldenHorncall Před 9 měsíci

    Nice Seinfeld deep cut

  • @o-k9267
    @o-k9267 Před 9 měsíci +1

    If I should only play jazz, which I love, then why did Chopin or Liszt and others composed such genial works that reel you in and just beg to be played?

  • @davidgisbert4073
    @davidgisbert4073 Před 9 měsíci

    Who is the pianist that plays a chord at the end of the video?

  • @floridamansgarage8629
    @floridamansgarage8629 Před 6 měsíci

    What were they playing at the beginning

  • @baggypop7536
    @baggypop7536 Před 3 měsíci

    I have never felt more valid. An arpeggio is just an arpeggio, doesn’t mean I’m influenced by beethoven. All classical musicians can improvise, they are just too blind to recognize music as music.

  • @danielfrancoise8881
    @danielfrancoise8881 Před 9 měsíci

    I supous that this part of concerto for Piano and orquesta where Mozart wrote "cadenza" was for IMPROVISATION😆
    JAZZ is the opositor of clásica repertorio but MANY People play both very WELL.

  • @nenitsa.m
    @nenitsa.m Před 8 měsíci

    I am a professional educated classical pianist. To be more precise, I am learning now Rachmaninov’s 3rd piano concerto, which is considered one of the most difficult piano creations ever. Now I am a student composer at the conservatory only because I was improvising, working, reading and practicing for a few years. So classical pianists do improvise, and some of us can do this very well. I like both classical and jazz music, so I improvise in both styles equally, but I guess in classical style I do better because I like it a bit more :)
    What was I trying to say…oh, exactly - listen a lot of music, do some analysis and most important - go practice!!!

  • @paolosalvi2606
    @paolosalvi2606 Před 8 měsíci

    It's NOT about classical music or jazz music. The point is how you approach music and its meaning.

  • @parsagholizadeh2988
    @parsagholizadeh2988 Před 9 měsíci +1

    Name of this song?

    • @muzakfan
      @muzakfan Před 9 měsíci

      Does anyone know, it sounded amazing

  • @dl7857
    @dl7857 Před 9 měsíci

    Yes and no, when comparing to language, you can perform a well-known poem on a stage or entertain as a stand-up comedian improvising on the go. Both are good, and both have their place on the stage.

  • @jayr526
    @jayr526 Před 6 měsíci

    Do you play the transcendental attitudes by Liszt?

  • @bubby632
    @bubby632 Před 5 měsíci

    There are still people composing. And it's still a big part of classical

  • @sadecevanced8282
    @sadecevanced8282 Před 8 měsíci

    Was that last chord the beginning of Pathetique Sonata Mov1?

  • @johntravena119
    @johntravena119 Před 9 měsíci

    We’re seeing a resurgence of musicians who have the ability to improvise as the ‘great composers’ did. Musicians like Nahre Sol recomposing Happy Birthday in the style of different composers. There’s a video of a young pianist playing Giant Steps in the style of Chopin. The future of classical music is looking up.

  • @sheispham
    @sheispham Před 9 měsíci

    Where is the full video

  • @zzerenity
    @zzerenity Před 9 měsíci +5

    Music is more than a language.

  • @OrganNLou
    @OrganNLou Před 8 měsíci

    Organists, especially those of French heritage, have made improvisation a very important part of their musical culture.