Why Peter McKinnon Is BAD For Film Photography
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- čas přidán 14. 07. 2023
- Pwhhaaats up! In this video, we're going to delve into what will no doubt be a mildly controversial topic. Peter McKinnon's recent foray into film. Now, before we begin, let me clarify that this is not a personal attack on Peter himself. It's about examining the potential negative impacts of his influence on the film photography community. As a significantly louder voice in the space, his immense popularity can have unintended consequences for both seasoned film photographers and newcomers alike.
When you search for anything related to film photography on CZcams, Peter McKinnon's videos are likely to dominate the top search results. With his massive subscriber count, he naturally ranks higher, overshadowing established film photographers who have been actively working in the medium for years. This can lead to their voices being drowned out, making it difficult for them to reach the audience they deserve.
Another concern arises from Peter's influence on the market. As his popularity grows, so does the demand for the cameras he chooses to shoot with. This sudden surge in demand inevitably drives up the prices of those specific camera models, making them less accessible for aspiring film photographers on a budget. This inadvertently creates a barrier to entry for those who simply want to explore the world of film without breaking the bank.
Moreover, it's essential to recognize that Peter McKinnon is primarily known for his digital photography and videography skills. While his expertise in these areas is unquestionable, the same cannot be said for his experience with film. Film photography requires a distinct skill set and understanding of the medium, including knowledge of different film stocks, exposure techniques, and darkroom processes. Without a strong foundation in film photography, it's doubtful that Peter can offer the same level of insightful advice and guidance that seasoned film photographers can provide.
Ultimately, the purpose of this video is not to discourage anyone from watching Peter McKinnon's content or experimenting with film photography. However, it is crucial to approach his film-related content with a critical eye and recognize the potential negative consequences of his overwhelming influence. Let's ensure that the voices of experienced film photographers are not drowned out, and let's encourage a diverse range of perspectives and talents to flourish within the film photography community.
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This was cathartic, glad somebody else was thinking it. Echoing what you said at the end, he's in it for the views and the novelty. Him and his two-second- attention-span audience will soon realize film photography is hard and there are no shortcuts. That moat is what I selfishly love about the medium.
It is wild someone else had this thought lmao. But Honestly it is such a learning experience, and you have to be passionate, and patient.
No shortcuts for real.
@@CandidPhotos hell yeah
dude can't even acknowledge that he made film photography mistakes on Iceland because he is a beginner. and that is okay. He doesn't need to hate on Film just because he sucks at it.
Agreed.
As a pm fan I’ll admit that his photos on film were the best, but just saying it he’s doing it for the views is just plain ignorant
We can only hope that a small amount of his influence could go towards keeping film companies making film
@@__Mr.White__ you are unnecessary we shall forbid you as well
ok and you think digital photography is eco friendly wake up just the lithium battery cause more harm to our ecosystems, yes film photography is not all good but i think that if you look at the company usage of chemical change, the end of very bad film for the ecosystems like Kodak64 and other and how we has user make more eco friendly choice.
@@__Mr.White__
@@__Mr.White__tell us how you are going to buy lithium powered car to save environment.
I am using +20y old cameras, while all new photographers are buying new model every couple years.
People like you should be forbidden...
Unfortunately EPA is banning some chemicals while are completely OK with the chemical spill that caused worse environmental harm than entire film industry for its entirety... but you won't see any tree hugger fighting with government about that...
As a female film photographer, and as a photographer in general, I do not get the bro attitude lol, thus not watching those type of channels anyways 😂 Yeah, Peter can sit on top of the search, but there are other creators that will get pushed by the algorithm anyways if their video is relevant no matter the sub count.
Another thought, when big youtuber promotes film photography it might spark an interest in their audience to try it as well, thus exposing other film photography channels to that said audience (not many probably will stay because film photography is not easy), and that actually can be good
Good points. You're not missing much on the "bro" attitudes... trust me. LOL. Pete is his own brand - but he hasn't affected the way I shoot - or what I shoot. Was shooting film before PM - and I'll prob still be shooting film once he moves on. :) | @freshouttafocus
I agree, I felt the same excitement when he bought a Leica SL2-S since that’s the camera I use and create content around (along with film). Then he jumps in, has the best lenses for it immediately and says “I don’t think this is a viable professional camera” shocking because of his relationship with canon that he would say that.
Hey man! Really appreciate the shout and kind words, glad you’ve enjoyed the channel. 🤝
Long time fan, keep up the good work!
His best friend Matti was just gifted an x100v by fujifilm. He reviewed it and declared it the best camera he owns after 1 week. I used to love these guys, but now I just want them to stay away from the photography communities I love.
Yep. Me too. But since long (if not that was their goal since minute 1 which I guess it was) they are sell-outs. Matti was veeeery boring at times when traveling and later has been tedious to me. So I unfollowed him years ago. It's just not interesting. His brother was more true, to me. Yet it's been ages since I watched his content. They are trying to be products of mass consumption and now they are big F1 fans and trying to get involved there. I am willing not to happen, as I have been a fan of that sport since mid 80s and we don't need a legion of fans coming from those two. Plus I don't look forward to have them on the service roads. It is very hard for me to get a media pass for F1 and I do sometimes, imagine if it's a new trend with those two and their fans (and some video guys there are huge PM fans and have all his super expensive products). So, I just hope it stays like that.
I have to agree. I had to unfollow Matti cause his videos just started to feel fake and contrived. I’m almost to that point with Peter. I want to like the guy but it’s come to a point where it doesn’t matter what he does, so many of his followers gush over it. And they are consistently getting free items sent to them, free trips, access that nobody else would get. It gets a bit tiresome to watch
The sad truth is that the online photography community is mostly occupied with mere picture taking and gear, not PHOTOGRAPHY. There are some incredible channels I watch that cover more than just surface level, yet they are tiny in size. I recently, after years of waiting, got into film photography. I adore it, truly. But I don't make enough money to shoot it a lot, and gear purchases are sparse. Sadly, saving for a particular lens or camera sees that gear appreciating in price faster than I can save for it. It is difficult not to over stretch myself and panic buy equipment that I know will only go up in price. :(
Can you link some of those tiny CZcams channels?
@@directedbyabdullahI would also like to know, those types of channels can be hard to find
asking for two please @@directedbyabdullah
As an amateur photographer, Peter used to be a must-watch content. But, recently, his content has moved to the out orbit. Maybe I sensed, without knowing, some of the things you mentioned. I am gravitating to film because I inherited my mom's Brownie Reflex. A few repairs and I ready to go :)
Best of luck!!!
Now that is cool. Have fun with that.
Peter McKinnon is as good for film photography as Jake Paul is for Boxing.
Peter’s channel has long since transitioned from a photography channel to a Peter McKinnon channel where he’s he brand.
Not sure I agree with you 100% on your video, I feel it will be the gateway for people to find more creators online by seeing him do film photography. He’s not making any Film Photography 101 videos, so I doubt it will be blind leading the blind. Not defending Pete, but he isn’t making videos about photography, but just him, who happens to do photography.
I get were you coming from but sheeeesh. yall didn't even give him a chance, the man just started his new hobby and yall already on him lol, but photography in general is subjective so it is what it is
People forget no one needs to be an aficionados of this to make videos. I didn’t even knew this guy before this video, but I don’t why shit on him so much because he’s just more casual about photography
Hey Isaac, neat video, you make some good points.
I must admit that I haven’t yet watched any of Peter’s film photography videos, but I can imagine what they’re like.
Peter actually has a special place in my heart, because back in the days he was the one who inspired me to become a photographer and I’m deeply grateful for the videos he was making back then.
Nowadays my interests and taste in videos has shifted and so I haven’t been following his stuff too much, but what I want to point out in regard to your points is that I don’t think that too much will change. I completely understand this sense of fear, but as far as my observations have gone, it seems to me that audiences on CZcams have become very niche and tasteful. E.g. most film photographers in the CZcams space make rather chill if not even calming videos but everyone in their own way such as Grainydays being the dry yet funny guy. Peter is so different to what we have so that I don’t think it’ll be too damaging because viewers who like his stuff will stick to those videos and probably find mine way too downbeat and boring. Whereas someone like me doesn’t particularly enjoy upbeat fast paced videos so I will not be tuning into those too much🤷🏻♂️
Just sharing some thoughts off the top of my head, I hope that made sense😅🫶🏼
I had the idea a few weeks ago, but decided to make it when I saw the sentiment on the film photography Reddit.
It’s certainly possible thinks won’t all be bad. People have made comments about the potential benefits of him shooting film too. If I had to guess, the likely result will be somewhere in the middle.
Very much love your channel, thanks for stopping in!
@@Overexposed1I agree with the statement in which I don’t think PM will make an impact on film and if anything he will just bring the spotlight to other creators. People watch Pete for his personality and his touch rather than for his the content itself and that’s why he has a lot of followers. It’s the same for any medium whether it be cooking or beauty etc.. you have different kinds of creators in that space who do things differently and niche down for different forms of content but at the end of the day you guys are all photographers. I do both photo and video myself and would love to one day buy a film camera and take what I would like to call the purest form of photography but it aches me when people feel the need to shun people out and almost reject them from a space that they want to explore. Pete is in his own lane when it comes to the space and him diving into film is just gonna give the spotlight to other creators as he did in one of his videos in which he used his platform (that yes was heavily influenced by Casey) to use it to promote a bunch of film photographers. (He made a video that he gave shoutout to some of the big dogs in the film space)
This video came up when I was looking into film photography. I am a digital landscape photographer, and your video resonated to me. Especially your exhaustion with photography influencers. Photography was always a hobby for me, but I really started taking it seriously 5 years ago ( still consider myself new ). I am a student of youtube university, and learned from several youtube landscape photographers. It seems that I am not the only one though, because the platform is now being flooded by "landscape CZcamsrs" who churn out videos of the same subjects. They literally all look the same, hiking b-roll, stop, this is my composition, "if this is good, here is my final image", cue gentle unrecognizable melody, zoom out photo effect, then "subscribe and share".
The only way to tell if they are established is by follower count, and if they are pitching MPB or Squarespace. The worst is the Luminar ad campaigns. It is really getting bad, and I don't see an end to it. Landscape photography is notoriously hard to make money from, so it quickly becomes the plan to "blow up" on youtube. (we all know how that goes) So even the "established" landscape photographers will jump on the sponsorships for $, so get ready for 2 or 3 minutes of a video vomiting "squarespace" praise.
So sorry for the vent, but film photographers are not the only one feeling pain right now. Even though I suspect that your pain may be a little more chronic.
Couldn't agree more!
Interesting take. I think you've shared some legitimate concerns with CZcams in general, such as videos getting stuck at the top of search despite not containing the best (let's call it "experience-tested information"). At the same time there is always space for a more technically accurate or thorough video on any given photography topic. I've found this to be true with some of my Lightroom editing tutorials.
When I first started making tutorials I was very unimpressed with the quality and technical accuracy of many of the Lightroom tutorials that would appear in search. So I made my own. And guess what... They flopped at first because I was outranked by other larger channels with dedicated audiences who didn't care about technical accuracy. But I knew if I kept making videos, eventually they would find an audience of their own.
I'm still new to all of this, and still trying to figure out the "system" (which is something Peter understands and has capitalized on very well) Hopefully one day I'll get there and the quality of my videos will speak on their own.
The reality is that there are a lot of small niches on CZcams that have been dominated by larger creators coming in and adding their voice. I think the most we can hope for is that this drives new viewers to the existing smaller creators, or challenges the smaller channels to be innovative and capitalize on this newfound interest in their niche. ❤
I love your videos. Breath of fresh air. This year as I started getting into cinematography, I finally came to realize there are CZcams videos and photographers and there are those who have done this for a living with real clients. Both have good advice but there's a difference in nuance and quality.
I agree that his videos could start to dominate somewhat over those of smaller film-oriented creators, but I don't see it as a big problem. Many enthusiasts will actively look past the largest creators, if only to seek out other opinions. Smaller creators come across as more genuine, more creative, and more trustworthy, largely since they are less beholden to sponsors. Also, using Google Trends as a measure, Peter's popularity peaked in 2018-2019 and has been on a steady decline since then. This tells us that while he is still popular, people are viewing their photography-related content elsewhere.
I get what you’re saying, but I don’t think I agree 100%. When I first started watching film videos in the early days of Vuhlandes, Grainydays, etc - it was so light and fun. I watched the recent Peter ones where he only got a couple shots and I thought that was very realistic of what film was like just getting into it. I got the m11 and been shooting it for a year…got the film bug and bought an m6. Ended up missing a roll, missing shots, etc and could relate to that video. Nowadays, I see film makers making videos bashing other film makers, people saying what you can’t take pictures of…no more gas stations, no more old buildings, no more NY street….in the near future seems we can’t take a picture of anything 😂... things seem so heavy now…that’s the best I can describe it… - yes his video might be at the top, but he’s one of one. Everyone else will still be there for anyone that wants to dive deeper. I think it’s ok to have a little candy every now and then. Just my two cents.
lol it's funny, but I had the same thought about gas stations, old buildings, and street photography in NY. When people view photos and then talk about them, there's a constant need for something new. That's why representational art has such a hard time these days, because lots of artists and critics say, "Well, that's been done already." However, I think if you have a different take on the same subject, then it becomes new again.
@@thomervin7450 good point. I can’t remember who said this, but the sentiment was that w everyone should have the right and Joy to photograph a subject. Even if it’s the Statue of Liberty or the Eiffel Tower….just cause it’s been taken a million times, someone shouldn’t rob your joy of taking that photo. Photography is a joy, not something to be taken so seriously and gate kept. These days I feel like if I’m walking around with a film camera I have to have a whole mission to my photos, planning my book, being a zone focus ninja 🥷🏽 😅. It’s exhausting. Let’s just take photos and have fun 😂
Yeah the video also fails to note that a lot of the film photography CZcamsrs are pretty much all the same.
They're either these zen dudes that walk around their neighborhood with Lo Fi on the background.. making green juice with incense all around them
Or they're these guys that are an exact copy of Grainydays personality.
Then you have Mike Gray who was initially a really cool guy but Tyler Shield's douche personality is starting to rub off on him
The point is not that you can't photograph said things. The point is that you can't claim its art. Immagine bother are photographers out there actually trying to create something new, never been done before. Yiu already can't do much hasn't Ben done before. Problem is that most si called artist Photographers aren't even aware what has or hasn't been done. The point history know what has been done and where your influence comes from. Otherwise how can you expand on it? Its hie they say. Most of the time when youbgind something original you probably don't know what it was influenced by. You can photograph whatever you like...
This is why I stopped making videos on my own channel. I started to realize people just wanted me to talk about gear or see the beautiful models etc.. and I knew that this was not what I supported or wanted to turn into. So, I get where you are coming from and took some balls to come out in the open and lay it all out there. But, as someone who (before the pandemic) was "rocking and rolling" on my way.. I stopped believing in my own "message" and had to stop to re-think how I wanted to continue (if at all). Here I am, still 3 almost 4 years later still thinking, lol.
Bit of the same journey for me, but now I make whatever content I want (which barely gets views) but I think what’s still largely missing is business related “how to” content as the whole algorithm is flooded with “get rich” content. so I am working on more of that now (rather than endless gear videos) and still desire to help others level up.
I think if you are still passionate about photography (and/or filmmaking) it’s still worth putting some content out there. If you have some bigger ideas then leverage your channel and go for it!
I'm mostly mad that he can overprice a variable ND filter
After some years I see more people consuming (or just flipping) film and cameras but it's still pretty rare to see people pick up photozines, photobooks, pay for an exhibition, commission work... it's also difficult to have conversations nowadays with all the "vibes", "tones" and general results-oriented lingo (if one more person tells me to start a film photography podcast I might lose it).
I guess it's that time in the cycle of a hobby where it's trickling back into the mainstream and influencers are trying to intercept it or insert themselves into its community, repackage it as one more lifestyle commodity, get the bag and hop onto the next thing; we're just gonna have to ride it out with patience and persistence.
Even when I was a newbie photographer and just started watching CZcams, I realized that Peter’s videos are kinda useless. He clickbaits constantly and sorta rambles about nothing until he gets past the 10-15 minute mark. All of his videos can be summarized in about 60 seconds and the information is never quite as valuable as other CZcamsrs. He makes very good thumbnails and aesthetic videos, but other than that, I have no idea why he is so popular and revered.
yup. i found so much better youtubers to learn from.
Simon d'Entremont is a good youtubers who gives you valuable tips instead of trying to sell you something to improve your skills.
Nick Carver on top
I watch almost all of Peter's videos. Been watching for years. I like his style, enthusiasm and photography (digital or film). But watching his stuff hasn't made me change my style or photography...I don't use Canon, premiere pro, lightroom, or photoshop. I like moody photos, but I also like colorful ones too. I've never bought any of his gear or personal drops. I watch other film photography channels too. BUT I don't even shoot film or plan to shoot film. I'm just a digital shooter. I watch film photography channels because it's informative and entertaining. I don't think gatekeeping film photography is the solution to your worries. And I don't really have an answer, but it seems to me that film photography has been pretty expensive for a while now.
Film photography has been cheap for decades. Cheaper than ever. Low demand was why you could buy a Leica or Hasselblad from a dealer with a warranty for $700 and film for $5. Prices now (and in the last couple of years) are beginning to catch up.
LOVE THIS. I think it's brave to callout PM on this platform mainly because his fans are so devoted and excessive, I've said it a million times, I honestly think PM could film a video of a dog taking a dump and his fans would tell you it's one of the greatest things they have ever seen. I hated it when I saw he was moving in to film, I don't like to think that other creators who have done so much for the community like willem verbeeck, Vuhlandes, grainydays etc will now get overshadowed by PMs frankly average photography and his army of mindless uncreative fan boys.
Bro I enjoy pm work but I would disagree on the statement that he can overshadow vuhlandes n grainydays.
It doesn't have to be that way. He brought several accounts publicity in a recent video. It appears as though @hijoflacko is the only one using it to their advantage, however.
I totally agree! I always felt the same about him! Nothing personal! He is a good entertainer! Nothing wrong with that.. but hey: he has a cult following 😂 and like you said; he films a dog taking a shit and his 17 year old followers call him the best filmmaker ever existed! 😂
COFFEE B ROLL LMAO. what is with these guys and the coffee b roll!? as a photographer and indie filmmaker, i find it really funny how all the big CZcams Camera Content Creators talk about shooting "cinematic" shots which, to them, basically means slow motion. that's it. slow motion. that's cinema, baby! i don't think i've ever seen or heard any of them name one actual cinematographer as any kind of influence. i don't even think i've heard them talk about movies at all. maybe i just don't watch enough of their Content™ but i suspect that if you ever asked them to name a single cinematographer or film that's influenced them they'd just give you a blank look. but, hey, they know how to shoot "cinematic," bro!
i think once you accept that these guys are first and foremost CZcamsrs/social media entrepreneurs as opposed to legit artists, then it all becomes less annoying. don't really look to any of them for advice--they're just Content Creators™.
I've watched PM's videos for a number of years now and I felt like his glory days were those where he was sat in that little home office putting out genuine and interesting photography content - days when he actually picked up a camera and made a picture with it. Nowadays, it's just another video about him, his brand, some weird piece of merch or his truck/holiday/hat. The day I saw that first film photography video dropI felt genuinely uneasy because yeah, his presence and involvement will have a potentially negative effect at least until he loses interest in it.
If he's going to go down that rabbit hole, I want to see genuine content from a genuine journey. I want to see him buy some POS 4th hand K1000, OM10 or QL17 off of eBay with busted light seals, I want to see him using a free light meter app on his phone to get settings or fumble his way around Sunny 16. I want to see the look of mild disappoint when he's developing his first B&W roll at his kitchen sink and it either didn't dev properly or the neg gets scratched when he squeegees it. You might argue that this sounds like I want him to fail. I don't. But I want his beginnings in this to look like ours did, not to just float in like some prodigal photography savant with flawless shots taken on a pricey Leica.
I followed Peter from his early days and he was inspirational to me to go further with my photography. And I'm grateful for that.
I too lost interest though when he changed and stopped being that inspiration. I was sad that he didn't evolve into something more and better.
But that's a hard thing to do for people who make it big on CZcams.
I have been seeing people "getting into film" on CZcams for a while now and have no interest. I shot film for 20 years. I've done it. I don't need to do it again. Other people have fun with it and that's great, but it certainly wasn't going to pull me back to his channel.
Really nice to see someone actually speaking up against fake-ass reviewers like Peter Mckinnon or Matti Happoja, who are little more than marketing reps of Sony/Canon.
they dont film their own stuff anymore even
I love the “dark colors, pirate skulls and whhbbatts up every bodies” 🤣🤣 - great video on a hot take!
Thanks for watching!
Peter has figured out CZcams. He understands that content runs a distant second in importance to personality...and he has tons of personality.
Don't worry, he will go back to digital within the next 6 months. The reality is that film is not flexible enough for him.
I hope he actually sells back that fridge-full of film of his and not let it go bad.
My initial reaction when reading the title is "what?".
Peter McKinnon is a very well known portrait photographer, a big fan of Pentax 67. How come he's bad for film photography?
Ahh... wrong Peter, then. That's Peter Hurley. Ehehehe...
ALL I CAN SAY IS THANK YOU! im so glad im not the only one in the community that feels like this.
I’m sat and the popcorn’s getting ready. Also, great job on the description which is very articulate.
I will never forget that he made a video about steel wool photography.
I thought this the moment I saw his first video on film photography. My heart sank. It went against everything that I loved about film photography…
Someone needed to say it.
👊
1 million percent agree with everything you wrote in the description.
I started in 1983 processing and printing film at a one hour photo lab, also did b/w in the dark room. And we were the first lab south of Atlanta metro to offer same day slide film processing. I learned to print before I learned to shoot. Started shooting weddings in late 1985, and we have shot over 1,000 since then. I'm old now, lol. Digital has came a long way! I now use a Canon R6 and it's awesome. I do miss film sometimes, but I priced a roll of 36 exposure film the other day for $20 omg... we used to sell it for $3.99! Gotta keep up with the times to keep the money flowing! The albums brides wanted in the 80's are not near as popular nowadays, they just want their digitals to put on Facebook or instagram! But, if they are buying I'm selling! I've always done photography for the money, I do love my job, but it's always been my income source for 40 years!
You spoke my mind. I'm not a film photographer yet but I do love watching people photograph on film and play around its quirks.
My number one concern was that prices will skyrocket for Film cameras and maybe Film will get even more expensive (though I’m not sure on that one i mean If Kodak sees a giant increase in customers would make it cheaper?)
Absolutely not gonna happen. The equipment required for film photography is simple, durable and plentiful. He’ll probably use the hype cameras anyway - but they’re simply not required. Film is going up but for different reasons and Kodak will need that in order to stay profitable.
I have felt this way about Peter for a while now. Like many, he was one of the creators to get me really interested in photography, but as I learned more about the hobby, the more I drifted away from his content. I think he’s a great guy but CZcams is his business, it’s how he makes money and often he is searching for new niches he can tap into to gain their viewership. Nothing wrong with that, but not my cup of tea and ultimately not really the content I’m fond of anymore. I love film photography and am just getting started with it, and I think his videos could bring more people to the hobby, which could bring good traction, but it can also be bad. I guess we’ll see. Pete’s not my favorite and his overpriced mediocre gear isn’t either, but this is ultimately how he makes his money so I understand why he does what he does. Let’s hope some areas of photography stay pure 😂 nice work on this video.
I don't really think that being interested in several things at once means that he's doing it to "tap into new audiences.
It's definitely healthy to be curious and to be passionate about several things in life
Well said, except most of his 6 million don’t show up anymore. Pretty sure that’s a space station sleight of hand, he’s falling out of fashion and his endless shilling. Glad you spoke up about it.
Honestly just because it’s expensive doesn’t mean it’s good, it just means you can afford it. One of my favorite camera’s was $5.00!
And secondly this dude sounds like that he’s just trying to cash in on something, that he isn’t in love with the beauty of film. JMO
I'm one of the people who got back into film because of his videos. Luckily the algorithm started giving me other film shooters that really know their stuff well (grainydays, King Jvpes, Film Supply Club). I love watching Peter for inspiration. For me, I get inspired to go out and shoot more from his videos than anyone else's. I'm learning more though about my camera, film stocks, and proper "to-do's" from everyone else. Now it's just an investment of time shooting that's the challenge!
I never comment on YT but just wanted to say, this is the first video ive seen of yours and it made me subscribe immediately! My biggest hate is the influencer pov street photographer videos where they bang out 50 mediocre shots wandering around their local city block and people treat them like they're Henri Cartier Bresson.
That’s a good one! Thanks for watching
Man this is a tough one. Been thinking about what my opinion is for the last 20mins after watching your video.
I think I have the same general opinion about PM as you. It’s like the saying “I can’t deny he makes a good cup of tea but I don’t like tea.” He’s good at the CZcams game but yeah it feels super sponsored and there’s not a lot there sometimes.
HOWEVER. I don’t at all think him being into film will have a negative effect on the industry.
I make my living in video and whenever I see a kid posting cringy content with a crazy orange and teal lut I don’t feel threatened or like my work is worth less. Whenever there are crazy trends if anything it makes good work stand out more.
To play devils advocate, what’s the guy supposed to do? People complain that big creators feel stale and “vapid” but then when we see them try a new format or style we complain and say “get back in your lane.”
Again I’m just conflicted. All your points are good and I do feel the same way about PM content. But I kinda think you should be able to make and talk about whatever you want even if you’re not the best at it. It just gets muddy when you have 6million followers I guess.
More people getting into film photography will GREATLY benefit all of us film shooters in the long run. Period. This is just some pessimistic gatekeeper mentality to think otherwise. I don’t particularly have any respect for Peter but I’m 100% on board with more people shooting film, however the heck they decide to do it. I love the OG film CZcamsrs you mention: Matt Day(who by the way is only digital at the moment, for some irony), Ted Forbes(Art of Photography, who also is digital now), Grainydays, Nick Carver, many others.
Exactly.. 100%!
Nick is the goat
Most of the larger names in reviews and gear vlogs are not in fact industry professionals. I take them all with a grain of salt.
Had no idea who he was, looked up his channel, skimmed through a couple videos, and came to the conclusion it's extremely pretentious. Especially the "minimalist desk setup" video i saw. Damn. Either that or its just because ive been doing instant-photography for a few years and only just dipped my toe into 35mm so dont really know anyone in the online content creator space
This sounds crazy but in 15 years, CZcams only recently in the past month showed me a Peter video. I had no idea who he was. I saw the one where he did his first roll of film and I couldn't finish it.
Ironically, this video is on my feed just because I watched said influencer’s video(s). I see your point and frustration, but careful with the gate keeping vibe. I’ve no interest in film really, too late to the game perhaps, but highly respect the art. I look forward to watching more of your content and learning from your (and others’) perspective.
i agree with pretty much what ever you said, but i wanna counterpart at the same time... peter for sure is the biggest influencer about photography, where people copy their style and all, BUT if even just a 10% of his entire subscribers are true photographer or just not sucker or simp about him and his style, they will get maybe into film photography and get to know other content creators and let the word spread. and honestly maybe some of those will try will even stick on it. i hope the wave doesn't get too short or too harmful after. cause yes the wave will be big, but if after that the wave is completely gone? the market suffer. i just hope that whoever will get into film through Peter he will stick to this medium, instead of just sucking on his fav content creator, whoever those may be
Agree! That’s definitely possible too. Thanks for watching.
Only 10%, or even less, probably become good anyway. Lots of artists hung out together in small groups and ended up affecting a lot of people. Can't look at the masses and gauge life based upon what they think they want.
Same bro, I watched PM video about videography , photography back in the days 2018. But when I start learning about film photography that's from the guys you mentioned not PM. Willem verbeeck , Teo Crawford , kingjvpes , grainydays those guys are my truly inspirations.
Bro I loved this video. Don't forget the clarity slider though, you know that thing film or not will be hiked!
Oh yeah - Peter McKinnon. Interesting dude, reacts very unkindly to critique (to put it mildly). "Vapid" is a good description of his videos (stylish, entertaining for some, but little content, at least by now), so I unsubscribed a very long time ago. Glad to see someone actually speaking out loud what many non-PMK-fanboys might think. Interestingly enough, PMK does still not come up in my YT recommendations (or I just don't look) - but *this* video here came up. Gives me some hope for the algorithm … 😁
When PM switched to film I immediately thought his views must be down or he's having a mid life crisis and the only way to stay cool was to join the film community. Trying to stay young.
can you do a follow up video?
"No self-respecting wedding photographer shoots in 35" - my older brother once he got into medium format: Hasselblad, Mamiya RZ67, etc.
I’ve only seen one of Peter’s videos only because everyone but me seemed to know who he is. I couldn’t make it all the way through even one video. Endless pointless B-roll. Lots of talk about him and very little about photo/video. Flashing lots of gear and talking about none of it. I feel like I wasted 20 minutes of my life and didn’t finish the video and left not even knowing what it was about.
And I’m just a nobody weekend photographer. But, Peter who?
LOUDER FOR THE PEOPLE AT THE BACK
I doubt Pete is inexperienced. He glosses over things because his audience are not seeking specific technical knowledge. They follow his film style and storytelling. He evolved as his income evolved. While I agree he has changed a lot which is why I moved on from his content, he moved from details to personality and lifestyle because his goal was to find success through content. Not that he sought to be the best educator out there. With that said, great video! Perhaps, soon your camera shelf behind you will grow as well. Then, we might see your raptor videos. lol. I am now following you to see if that becomes true.
I unsubscribed his channel long ago. Still wonder what 6 million individuals like about him. His video editing i guess
I gonna Tell you I kinda Disagree with you, I've been watching Peter for a long time and I have to admit he was one of the reason that kept my Passion to photography Grows up, and his switch to film or even anything else is good for this niche, and I'm sure not all the 6 Million Subscribers are fools or just sheep following him, he is creative and even topics outside photography or videography is still interesting, He is also a supportive person as he keeps recommending other great content makers that truly added to my knowledge, and lets be honest here, this video about him is 2 goals one , raising your concerns is sure a good thing to share , but sure having his name in your video title is good way to increase your reach, views and subscribers on your channel.
Still I like your video and concerns but I always advice you to keep looking for the good side of everything happening we are all here trying to learn, and get entertained.
Check Alessio Albi photography...then look at peter's work
I have no idea how people can listen to Peter McKinnon chat about absolutely nothing for years on end lol
I think his thing is just based on the parasocial relationship a certain type of guy wants in the modern world - people consume the content because they want to hang out with a fun older brother or something.
Man, some of the bigger film photography channels out there are not all that original.
Very true. Peter was great for motivation, but his videos don’t offer much education… which is fine- but I don’t really care for his vlogs & all the “fun secret” projects he’s always working on.
Also, his titles are always like, “I’m quitting CZcams” “I’m quitting film” “why I’m quitting blah blah blah” - I feel like these are titles CZcamsrs use when their channels start to die. They just need outrageous titles to draw interest now.
Fair play to you, man for making this video. I was also a little turned off by Mr McK and his approach, especially when it came to film. I think you've said it all. For those you shooting and developing for more years than we care to mention, let's enjoy the continued charm and influence film has on people. BTW I watched your portra 400 video.
The problem might more be the way CZcams offers us a way to discover meaningful content. Having a way to bypass or customize the algorithm for the user in a comprehensible way would definitely be something welcome.
At least he's jumping super late on the film train, all the great cameras are already completely unaffordable :D
I mean, not to sound all OG hipster or whatever, but a couple years ago a lot of us film-shooters felt the same thing when the filmhype jumpstarted. On the one hand it was able to bring in a lot of new young people to the hobby, but on the other it also muddied the waters a whole lot (and raised prices all across the board).
Edit: I work parttime in a brick&mortar photography retail store that’s been around for 100 years, the film resurgence from a few years ago brought it a LOT of new customers and still do. But it also made me aware of how very few of these new users actually respected the craft. Most don’t research what film they’re using or looking to buy, aren’t careful with their cameras and don’t even care about picking up their filmnegs. Hell, some don’t even understand the concept of film itself…
I imagine these are growing pains whenever a hobby goes mainstream, some are in it purely for the look and not so much the craft.
the answer is to stop watching influencers and photography professionals on CZcams no matter who it is. unless you want to know something specific. I have not followed Peter McKinnon and i don't intend to as a Pro myself i simply can't wathc most of these people talk about Photography
You hit some solid points man on why it may not be good. I started watching pm videos way back and helped grow my niche for photography. I don’t know if he will even dive hard enough on film to do damage seemed to stall out quick.
This video came up just searching Peter McKinnon… not really sure why I’m posting this (maybe it’s more cathartic for me?) but I think PM has worked hard for the life he has and whether it’s good or bad is really all a matter of perception. I don’t know him - I don’t know you - but I can assure you that ultimately what you do with your hobby / profession is way more in your control and PM will likely have zero impact.
*I used to ape his style and watch every video too. Still love him - but I’ve just learned that it’s my life to control and go do what I want. Be that putting things on CZcams or just living my life. He’s only got as much influence as you allow him to have*
Peter McKinnon has chosen a perfect time to venture into film photography full throttle, mostly because high volume film photography is out of reach for most people who want to shoot a lot. The real reason most of the high profile film CZcamsr’s numbers are tapering off is because of that very same reason. It’s actually an act of kindness that he’s waited until this time. As far as running the price of gear up, I don’t see it happening. He has always used premium, flagship gear out of reach for most people and that seems to be the direction he’s heading in now. Hopefully, the end result is that by way of his videos,more people will discover channels such as yours, a channel that represents the heart and soul of film photography.
i agree... hes not into that minimalist, not the ones to show that having less can give u good pictures kind of people... he will use the flagship because he wants the best n fast workflow
I had this conversation about everything you just said in this video with my wife months ago when i saw that first “film photography” video.
Truly agree with this as being a “moment” and will eventually be thrown under the buss. Money will be made and then the exit strategy will take place. I expect that too.
Shitty part is sky-rocketing prices for gear, cameras, film and all.
Some good insights here. I had a lot of similar thoughts when I saw he jumped on to the film photography "band wagon",, but couldn't quite formulate them cohesively as you just did. I hate to criticise anyone who wants to join the film community, but he's entry in this segment felt almost like posing, if that makes sense. A bit like posting endless pictures of a Leica M6 on Instagram for attention. I thought your video was very well done.
A hilarious side note, a couple years ago when Peter McKinnon came out with the first Polar Pro ND I was still in my "I want to be Peter McKinnon" phase, and I bought one of the damn things. It cost more than the camera and lens I was attaching it to at the time.... I ended up quite disappointed with it. They're not really better than the other filters I'd bought for a literal 1/10 of the price.
I really appreciate the kind words Noah!
Never watched his channel before and I've only watched a few of his videos on film. If film ends up a flash in the pan for him, then eventually most the disadvantages mentioned here would go back to our "post-covid normal." If it doesn't, the value is in drumming up interest in the industry. I'd love for manufacturers to see film worth investing in again.
As for him potentially making poor tutorials/reviews due to his lack of experience, his videos seem to be about him finding the experiences many of us have with film. He seems almost humbled. He'll eventually learn you're lucky and be happy with getting two great shots on a roll.
The guy's coming from digital as a giant. I find it interesting to watch him navigate this frontier.
Good video, it'll be interesting to see how it goes. 🙂
I'm glad people are agreeing with you in the comments, as this is a super hot take. I lost interest in him years ago and hearing that he's now into film has crushed my already unrealistic dreams of ever owning an xpan. We must keep him away from the xpan!
I really don’t want to talk about an xpan. I have been fighting the urge for about 6 months. I’m weakkkkkkkkkkkkkkk.
@@Overexposed1 when I got into film, they were under $1000 and I was like “I’ll wait, maybe they’ll go down”.
Whoops.
As someone who religiously watched Peter for the first 2-3 years he was on CZcams, these days, his channel is laughable at best. Every point you made in this video is spot on and I'm not stoked for someone with 1 year of experience, someone who's obsessed with vanity and fads, someone who very happily extorts the photography community for his own pocketbook [PolarPro & Nomad], and someone who tends to hyper-stylize and overdramatize every small setback or minor upset becoming the voice of film photography. He's the next Joe Greer, but worse. I'm not sure how he still has consistent viewership?
I'm kind of in the same camp as you. I watched Peter religiously when he uploaded stuff. Love his work, but lately he's been pretty hit and miss. It's been sad of course, but as someone who is going through life changing events...I myself haven't uploaded or made stuff for my CZcams that I've been super proud of. Even my freelance stuff has been hit or miss because I've been super selected with my work. Peter's photography is good even if it doesn't resonate with you. It's good.
Before I have people tell me off for my comment let me reiterate. I said his work is GOOD, which it is, but does it deserve the recognition it deserves? Does it deserve to be put up on such a high pedestal? Probably not because I've seen a lot of work from other photographers that is just as good or better in similar situations. Yet he HAS an audience and he's doing what he can to educate and also get better with his craft. So should we be tearing him down? No. We should be a community to build each other up and congratulate others for their successes.
Keep shooting and creating. It only gets better from here on out if you do that!
@@alexshotthese I don't think the issue is with PMK as a creator, he can continue to sell out and make whatever content he wants and anyone is free to enjoy it for whatever reasons they do. The issue is with him becoming the loudest voice within a community he's just entered. Not only is it bad having a new comber sitting at the head of the table, but the community is one that only survived because of very dedicated enthusiasts who kept the format alive. So to have this rather egotistical persona coming and posting videos like "One month into film and I'm already disappointed"... Can you see how that can be rather detrimental to a community that has long been hanging by a thread? I know that this is getting a bit deep, but this community is built on passionate enthusiasts who are committed to a format they love, and PMK will undoubtedly be making a larger profit off his viewers while simultaneously overshadowing the great photographers who have been here for a long while. It's just dirt in a wound. Not entirely his choice, or his fault, but an accurate predicament nonetheless.
This new audience is going to be looking to this internet character who creates content mostly for views and his pocketbook rather than for the beginner film shooters looking to get into a new hobby. He creates for himself more than for his field. That's why his old stuff was good and his new stuff isn't. Although he may bring film to many new eyes, at what cost? How will PMK frame film?
1:25 I think product placements describes what he was doing. Also, wondering how many people are familiar with the Polaroid back which attached to the Hasselblad camera in place of the regular film allowing you to pre-check your work by shooting a Polaroid waiting for it to develop looking things over and then reinstalling the cartridge with the film in it.
I just got back into photography albeit digital. Peter was one of the first channels, I came across and to be honest it almost pushed me out of the space entirely. I ignored that and kept going, and I’m quite happy that I did. I’m very grateful to have found your channel.
I don’t know man…it’s so easy to see the negatives of what PM will bring, overshadowing smaller creators etc, bringing in expensive accessories, but he will bring people who haven’t done film to your channels also. You may find film channels grow more than usual as interest peaks. Sure some will leave when he leaves but some will stay if your content is informative and entertaining.
I may ad, I do watch PM but atm, he’s not bringing the content for me, but he has talked about film over 5 videos, which has put this video in my recommended, so it’s working.
Never heard of the guy. Happy I live under a rock.
He's more of a influencer than photographer, guy once made his friend pose on street and called it street photography. We used to enjoy his stuff in the beginning but now its repetitive and boring.
You weren't harsh. Everything you said is correct. I feel the same about Peter. I was there since his first videos. It was so refreshing, so great. Now, nothing seems to make sense anymore. Thus, he's kinda stuck when it comes to subscribers. Yes, eventually he will get 6M. Though, rocketspeed youtubers such as Johnny Harris, per instance, will soon surpass him easily when it comes to subs. Channels like Peter's, Matti's are someway the same for quite some time now.
Who knows, maybe Peter will influence a manufacturer to make a new film camera that doesn't have a plastic lens.
Nailed it. I myself was intoxicated to what I'd describe as polished Casey Neistat 2.0. I no longer watch either. I grew tired of coffee, lifestyle, and travel videos that had little to do with actually creating videos and photography. He chases trends and sells products. I think we'll see a short term peak in interest in all things film followed by a rapid drop and quick sale from people who will move to the next trend or are frustrated because they aren't instantly professional film photographers. Hopefully though we get to keep a few thousand people who keep at it.
I know what you're saying in. this feels like when celebrities join the podcast space.
The camera prices IS A HUGE problem. it pisses me off big time.
I agree that his content has become more personality-based as of late. I watch much less of his content these days than I did back in 2017 but I still check him out. But I don't really see a problem with him using his platform to document his journey with film. If he garners interest in it, then that opens up the door for someone more experienced with film to better meet the demand that Peter is helping to generate.
Peter McKinon ... Kim Kardashian of photography
I was, until this moment, blessedly unaware of him. (I am old).
To be fair, a lot of the big film photography channels are lifestyle/flex videos with just a bit of education thrown in.
No hating because they are entertaining but following someone's adventures is most of YT.
Nothing but good points. There are a ton of amazing film photographers out there peeps. Just go out and check out photo festivals this summer. Peace.
Really glad someone was thinking it. He comes across as a bit of a douche and I've never liked his videos. I just got a holga and want to make a parody video "I just got a holga and I'm already over it" but that's just because I don't know how to use it.
Douche? 😅 You must only be looking at his recent stuff without the context of his older stuff. I literally only watch him BECAUSE he's one of the few genuine, non-douchey humans I've come across on CZcams. Just a dude that likes trying new things and it's fully transparent about not knowing what he's doing half the time. He's just documenting his life journey of learning and growing when it comes to photo/film. I swear people see his half-decent looking videos and that he has a ton of subscribers and they just assume he's full of himself, completely ignoring the videos where he almost cries as he explains how lucky he is that people actually care what he's doing.
@@jadewilliams5507 I made no assumptions, that wasn't the only video of his I watched, nor do I care about how many followers he has on here. Genuine is not a word I would use to describe him, and I certainly wouldn't say he's one of the few genuine people to come across on youtube. There was a group of them in Atlanta this weekend, and they were all lovely humans. I'm glad you enjoy Peter's videos, they aren't for me, or many other people.
I used to watch Peter McKinnon's video but haven't in a while. I saw he was getting in to film *yawn*. I also thought it would be another passing novelty. I wish him good luck. I figure if it helps the film community so much the better. I prefer your Colonel Sanders meets Ansel Adams approach to videos.
Thanks Lester! Much appreciated!
I look forward to the "donations" to the film companies, that will better push them to make more/different film.
This video came on after another youtube I was playing while doing some after lunch cleanup. When I first heard you speak I stopped what I was doing to watch and listen. I'm really happy you made this video. Being an explorer or sorts I stumbled across Mr McKinnon and ignored him. I stumbled across him a second time when he click baited me with switching to film. Eh, same _____ different day. There just wasn't anything sincere or of substance. I follow some people because they're entertaining/fun, some because they're informative/educational, and not enough because they're inspirational. Mr McKinnon offers none of the above. I can't even watch because it's a form of travel video. Not for me. For a change I'm happy with the CZcams algorithm. Instead of feeding me crap I don't want and blocking what I do want, CZcams has introduced me to your channel. Thanks for being here and I'll be watching more now that I'm subscribed.
Thanks John! Happy to have you aboard!
07:48 to 08:10 had me nodding and grinning 😆
Who even watches McKinnon anymore, apart from maybe kids on the platform who just found the channel? I doubt any serious photographer above the age of 20 actually finds his content relevant and interesting. He is a content creator in 2024, and his content is supposed to be entertaining and engaging for views only. He started off as a tutorial guy on CZcams, teaching useful skills (thumbs up), but nowadays it's more about money. His ideas are running out, and he is trying to keep himself relevant since this is his career, which makes sense-you have to provide and pay your bills, which I fully understand. Unfortunately or fortunately, he has influence, but seriously, who even watches McKinnon's VLOG channel anymore especially if you are a serious photog or just seriously enjoying the hobby.
Bingo! I don't really have a problem with Peter, but your analysis is spot on. The price effect from his videos is both the best and the worst effect from his influence. But don't diss my gas station obsession. ;) Andy
I think Peter McKinnon is bad for Photography in general. He is great for video production. I started watching him but realised he doesn't do much photography anymore. Now i don't shoot film but i love real photography. By real i mean 1 shot capturing that moment in time, no stacking or editing with AI to remove something in the background or change the sky etc.
Maybe i should shoot film also?
This is the first time I read the name Peter McKinnon, and I'm (back) into film since 2 years. What did I do wrong? ;-)
BTW Great video! It was fun watching. And a little bit frightning to imagine that we will be part in this McKinnon-Multiverse soon....