DCS: AH-64D- Stop hovering so much
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- čas přidán 24. 03. 2022
- Helicopters CAN hover... it doesn't mean they have to...
#DCSWorld #DCSApache #RealPilot
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I solved the fuel issue by never surviving longer than 20 minutes
🤣🤣🤣
LOL
Yeap, I’m using that strategy a lot myself. I can confirm that works for ammunition as well. Also solves your problems with landings I you have those like me. That should be a part of pilots training in military aviation.
Take less to be more agile. If that makes you survive longer, find the break even point ^^
@@CakePrincessCelestia there’s nothing more valuable than advice from Wonderbolt. Thank you, you’re awesome!
I feel like this is a direct result of Casmo watching me take a tow missile to the face on the 104th server while hovering trying to get George to find a tank. 😆
Noooo 😉
Laughs in Ka-50 at 3000+m, taking out known SA-8 and SA-15 positions. Well, only works if they don't reposition ;)
I feel casmo is one of the few legit ppl who wants to teach us noobs / simulator geeks for the sake of sharing and not making money, he is one of the few and thank you man 🙏.
Well he flew the Apache in real life and so he has a deep connection to it. He knows how it works and what to do so he wants to see others do the same. What you said is part of it yeah but I feel like he mostly does it because he sees people doing thing wrong and wants to correct it and offer advice.
hover at 2500 feet - you've just RSVPed every enemy air defence system in the area with an invitation to a 'shoot me down' party
Just watching Apache stuff and seeing what the pilots who flew them in such crazy dangerous situations really shows how wrong Hollywood was about who the real Top Guns really were and are. Atack helicopter pilots see 5 times more action than a fast jet pilot and they do it without a ejection seat …….BallSSsS
The real reason you shouldn't hover is the engines take a lot of effort to hover those heavy balls of steel.
Fire Birds needs a remake...
Like serious remake. Leave the love/sex story out, no drug cartel with some crazy badass mercenary in tiny helicopter, but actual enemy.
And make it about European escalation, not some sand desert country.
And get Tom Cruise pilot The helicopter, as he has that license as well...
@@paristo man that would be awesome! It’s really crazy what these dudes do in real life, playing sims and shit is one thing, but gearing up and hoping into that crazy machine and busting azz and knowing everyone below you wants to kill and torture you is a whole different experience you just can’t imagine, on top of that the feeling of turning sharp going up and down hauling ass low to the ground, ….. I am going to stick to watching these guys do it in videos lol
Make orbits while CPG gets set up. Turn outbound, then turn in for a run once at the right distance. Rinse & Repeat. Thanks Coach!
Now I wish the ka50 had auto orbit
6:48 - "... there's probably not a whole lot of tanks there." I dunno, with my luck, there would be tanks hiding in the clouds.
That intro is literally like %90 of my DCS MP experience. Fly 20 minutes to a target area with no Intel, then shot down by some dude with a heater hiding in a tree somewhere
Guys, if those Viggen guys pass under you, you are too high. I'm afraid of heights unless it's in fixed wings. Thanks for the video, I always went down and sideways when in a low hover, but pushing forward and turning the helicopter does make more sense.
CMWS is the real MVP.
Man that PNVS looks sooo smooth compared the the jittering nightmare of VR.
As someone who likes to use the combined arms units like the SA19 I would say please continue to hover as much as possible. Optically guiding missiles onto Helos is super satisfying lpl
What servers enable that these days?
Thank you, Sir. After endless staring at the symbology and minor but constant counter maneuvers that slow my brain down, George has been flying for two days now.
Try mapping the monocle to a button. Out of combat, it can feel a lot more relaxing to practice hovers without a ton of symbols and green lines
@@jeremyt7722 the default binding is "i" on the keyboard
As @jeremy T said, don't focus on the instruments. Focus outside, on the trees, street, runway lines whatever. I never use the system on the IHADSS, having lot of practice on the Huey.
@@sloppydog4831 Yeah, practicing that now. Switching IHADSS off from time to time seems to be an option.
Thing I love about attack helicopters is you can use allot of the same tactics us snipers use. Simple and effective
I made this mistake on my first attack run against some tanks...... turns out ATGMs are just as effective against an apache sitting fat dumb and happy as they are against another tank........
Wait till they get you with the main gun. I earned real quick back in the Blackshark days not to get too close to tanks. Especially tanks with a laser range finder. Looks cool when they miss though.
@@sasquatchycowboy5585 Oooof, never taken a main gun hit. Had a couple of ATGMs to the face between the Apache and my A-10 days...... kinda embarrassing in the A-10 tank buster when a T-72 kills ya.... I mean, kudos to the guy pointing the laser, he's got 30mm going off all around, and still keeps it on the jet coming at him..... that takes something else lol
@@Streaky100001 lol.
@@sasquatchycowboy5585 yea pretty much instant range acquisition, ballistic solution calculation followed by a Mach 3 tungsten arrow going straight at you
@@Lemard77 It's way better then it used to be. At least as long as your moving you are OK. Back in the Blackshark days you couldn't even get close to an MBT.
Good real-world insight as always. Thanks for these!
Great technical presentation. Much to consider.
You can NEVER be too high...oh wait...wrong room.
Very nice! It's great that you share some tactics as well and good advice. I found that flying the Mi 24 really helps anyone who hovers too much, it's just so much better when you keep moving most of the time.
Exploding. The mistake everyone makes is exploding.
Oh wait there’s more video.
Good point.
Yeah I've definitely preferred to be moving at least 70+ knots and with trees "tickling my tummy" as I put it to my 8 year old watching me.
In an old video, I saw an apache circling around a village. So that's why he was circling! Amazing! I would have never guessed it would be to save fuel.
You're the best Casmo! I can't get angry with George for too long because of your voice lines.
It cracks me up seeing folks hovering over 300 ft to get a shot. Let alone the higher shots. Sneak up behind trees and get closer lol. Great vid casmo. It had to be done.
The high hover is getting everyone killed, you need to think of the apache as a sniper. Low hover is your friend
Better yet, think of it as a light attack plane. Hovering just makes you an easy target.
*first 20 seconds*
"Let's talk about what everyone is doing wrong in the AH-64"
~Note to self: STOP DYING~
Literally I keep getting picked off while hovering. Now I never use hover hahah. I just roll in and roll out. In circuits
Problem is, George seems to ALWAYS fucking miss his AGM shot if I'm not in a hover. It is so frustrating.
Doesn’t need to be a hover, the chopper just needs to in “balance” with steady flying and within the yaw limits. If you set the video to see what George/Casmo is seeing then you can see how sloppy controls impact the tracking. I can get 3 A2A helicopter kills in a row with George as the CPG before the KA-50s can even react if I give George a good shooting platform.
Gotta love new heli players.. (hovering at 1200ft engaging targets at like 4k) wondering why they're getting swatted out of the air by tows
I blame warthunder. 😂
Very informative. Thank you.
Flying helicopters in general is highly dangerous.
Once upon a time I was flying my Mi 8 in an empty server with only 1 opponent, I was trying a run to drop some MANPADs, I was cruising close to ground at about 300 km/h then BAM I get whacked out of the sky. I actually jumped from the explosion. No idea how, no idea when, but he some how acquired a medium sized helicopter in a 255^2km map in his jet, and blew me to hell. So fly is equally as dangerous as hovering. You don't always know where threats are, especially in DCS, we have no intelligence unlike real life.
2:05 That's a STOP sign :) - you gotta stop right there ;)
2:36 Nice! Perfect torque...
Another awesome video thank you sir.
Watching gun cams of the Apache taught me this. They always roll in to constraints, slow down and stabalise, then roll out. They never hover or do bob-up attacks.
Just out of interest, were those mostly COIN ops? Might be some differences between those and near peer tactics, and I also wonder if a bob-up attack would be more conducive for FCR and radar Hellfires vs. TADS and laser Hellfires, since you can dive out before missiles start landing... Definitely an interesting subject overall, and definitely the Russians leaned heavily into moving attacks, no reason why it wouldn't work for a lot of what the Apache does.
Not that I know anything about this stuff. I just like fiddling with all the cool buttons on the front seat. =)
@@jubuttib I don't know either, only time I've seen hover attacks is Desert Storm when they destroyed infrastructure like bridges, I guess it depends on your air defence intel. Russia knows Ukraine has a massive amount of stingers from the U.S.
@@ukLeeham720 Wasn't actually even thinking about Ukraine, but yeah that applies. Was more thinking about some discussions based on translated doctrinal documents.
Makes sense. Same thing with a fire fight on the ground. Don't want to be right up on the cover, but back off a few feet.
Yo, the video thumbnail told me to keep hovering to play though
I'm no helicopter pilot but as a pilot, I feel that the number one mistake that these players are making, is taking a helicopter into combat that they have yet to learn to fly. This thing's only been out for what? 10 days? I'm ashamed to say that I am on my 11th helicopter and I haven't even taken it into combat yet. This thing has a steeper learning curve than the F-16!
I've seen two of your videos and man, you really did your homework on this helicopter! Thank you for doing this. I don't know how you know so much about it but I'll start watching more of your videos if I can ever find the time.
Helps that he’s an actual apache pilot.
@@Rhys3295 oh he is? Lol. No wonder he knows his stuff.
My virtual life isn't at risk if take my DCS Apache into combat before I'm ready. We're not trying to actually pass the Army's qualification courses here.
You mean stop hovering so high. The aircraft was designed to hide behind cover while using datalink to find, track, and eliminate enemy targets. The AH-64 works in teams of 2 or more. One will paint targets and the other will shoot. After one runs out of ammo they switch.
Nice to see videos on attack helicopter tactics.
It called "Missile Missile, forward" and they didn't even move XD
Sometimes it be like dat
Casmo.. Thanks for being here for us
Yessir. Advise has been received and utilized. I now have more fuel and less Apache death. Keep the advise coming Mr. Apache pilot, Sir!
Three tours down range, I dont think I ever saw a Apache hover outside of the FARP :) Terrain was to flat in our OE.
sneaky stealth hovering
Amazing how I got roasted in Discord recently for saying guys were too fixated on hovering and that it's not exactly something you'd want to do much (based on real world experience in helicopters (civil LE)).
If I had a dollar for every dumb comment I read on the internet I’d be independently wealthy. ignore the haters. 🤷🏻♂️
@@CasmoTV what's crazy is one of them was supposedly an Apache driver. My thinking is they didn't understand what I was saying and thought I meant you'd NEVER hover.
It happens. What can you do.
Thanks for sharing this-watching the DCS fixed-wing community dipping their toes into helos, flying A-10 mission profiles in an Apache, has yielded a palm-shaped imprint on my forehead.
excellent update. fly gooder... :D
Great info thanks
I seem to remember from Janes Longbow (release in 1996), they talk about tactics. And one tactic with the Longbow, because it has the radar on top of the rotor, you want to position the aircraft so it is behind cover (i.e. a hill), but just barely have the radar peekover over the top.
That way you can pop-up, fire your new radar-guided Hellfire's, drop back down, leaving the Longbow's radar with a line-of-sight as it guides the missles to the target.
Edit: Yup; i had to dig out the manual:
> FCR stands for Fire-Control Radar, a second type of target acquisition system found only in the Longbow. When you bob-up from behind a hill, the bulbous Longbow radar dome on top of the helicopter automatically scans either a 90° pie-shaped arc (for ground threats ) or a 360° circle (for air threats) and “memorizes” targets. The beauty of the FCR system is that you can store multiple targets and then fire off missiles in quick succession. After launch, the missiles lock onto individual targets identified by the FCR. (TADS, by contrast, can only store/track one target at a time.)
> While tracking ground targets with FCR target acquisition active, the safest way to update radar information is to mask yourself in a valley or behind a hill or other natural terrain, maintain a steady hover and slowly raise the helicopter. Your radar automatically updates whenever the top of your mast has a line of sight (LOS) to the target.
And I thought taking ATGMs to the face is part of an attack helo pilots job ;) seen it happen so often while I fly at 80+ Kts in my gaz. Great vid.
whaaat i've never done that (5 minutes after being blown up in a high hover)
High hovers are bad… there are airplanes up there! Thanks for the vids.
Liking the Apache combat theory thank you
Super helpful.
Came for the hover, stayed for the waypoint edit...
A treeline will give you concealment. For a while. But it will not give you cover. At least not good cover, and only for a short time from nearby ground based direct fire weapons. Take it from a former artillery officer and FiST (fire suppourt team) leader. Being in a helicopter only helps you can scoot before they shoot. A clever enemy, can fix hovering helicopter in place in a clearing, by firing over the treeline. While his helicopters, his SHORAD and MANPADS, his mortars, his field artillery, all cover the clearing tree line just waiting for you to unmask.
Shoot
Scoot
Communicate
Really puts into perspective that the platform I work with runs about 25 pounds of F24 per hour.
Gonna use this for my Blackhawks in Squad lol
Another great video. It’s something I kind of knew instinctively (like an infantryman firing from the middle of a field as opposed to using cover) but I have found myself getting sucked in whilst trying to get George set up etc. I’ll endeavour to try running racetracks on the server now and be content with just picking off one target at a time.
6:50 "obviously there's probably not a whole lot of tanks there".
'Probably' but if you're ever inclined to do a "Plan B" video.......
Thanks for that segment, getting the WP on the ground with the KU...... the KU deserves some study time; in some DCS model there's a way to dedicate your hardware keyboard's NUM pad to typing in values directly but I can't backtrack to that video or which aircraft. Any clues appreciated.
after watching this for the entire length im fully convinced that pineapple belongs on pizza.
excellent points, Casmo. Perhaps it would be possible to explain when would be a good time to have a low hover - that way we can see what the use cases would be.
[if you are able to do so, of course]
Pre-emptive guess: When you can get a good line of sight from far enough away*, with enough cover around you to dive back into should things start going wrong.
*Which I guess usually means hilly terrain, and/or without constant massive tree cover. Mariana's is a tough environment, so many of the islands have just so many trees it can be really tough to see anything from low down, and the plains areas of Caucasus also make it tough to spot anything from low down, because a single tree blocks visibility for 20 km... =P
I'm going to need you to start every vid with "slaving, roger deslaving"
Not sure how the algorithm would respond…
Speed is LIFE!
This is even a common mistake in the KA-50, which is the attack helicopter so many are accustomed to. A lot of people think the Akula is a sniper, it’s a reconnaissance helicopter, it can sit in a hover (and sometimes you want to with it) but its job is to exploit angles, conduct reconnaissance, engage targets of opportunity, etc.
I don't know what real doctrine is, but the Ka-50 is infinitely better if you fly it in a pair with a friend and pretend it's a two-seater. One guy is head-up, hands-on flying, watching for threats. The other guy is head-down, using the autopilot more, and running the weapons. Same number of pilots, but distributed lethality and survivability.
The autopilot and datalink make it relatively easy for a pair to fight like a single unit, which seems like it would be useful. Shame about the MWS and Igla getting canned, though.
The Ka-5x is better than the AH-64 at hover and non forward flight because of the coaxial design.
Because of the missile it is better to shoot from hover or forward movement.
Doctrine for it is the same as the Hind, the Ka-52, and everything else Soviet/Russian - you fly racetracks and maintain your speed. People like to point to the speed and range of the Vikhr as "proof" it's meant to bob up from behind trees/hills/etc and shoot from a hover, but the real reason that missile flies so far and so fast is so that it arrives before whatever the SHORADS just fired at you. If it was meant for hovering behind stuff, the optics wouldn't be at the absolute lowest point of the airframe.
Not siting Ed Maceys Apache as a major reference point, but one takeaway at least is that they would allways "wagon wheel" around targets, then run in rockets/guns ... I guess high hovering near a target that can shoot back (even just a rifle) is a universally bad idea, especially in a high altitude place like Afghanistan
Well good thing I don't know how to hover ... ehem I mean I totally did not hover intentionally ...
Lol!
He does make a good point
The trouble with setting waypoint altitudes too high is that other players will be able to see the massive green diamond in the sky and know where you'll be in a minute. Thanks for the video :)
:) Stationary targets, good for Apache, not as Apache
Fly choppers a lot, and one thing is that the game has advanced but the ground AI programming has not. Once with range of SAM, if if you are only a little exposed to it, and if you have clutter behind you, it fires, they have superhuman line of sight...and perfect radars. The ground AI needs improving to make this sim more realistic.
>Hovering very high
That's hilarious
things you learn in your first 2 seassions of heli in dcs
Thanks for the tipp im definatly gonna use your advise :D I do hope ed does something about Georges aim with the gun. For me he cant hit Sh*t even at close range
Some of us grew up doing the deep attack so hovering is part of it. There is time for hovering, just depends on the fight.
No doubt about it.
nice
Not to worry the ground always makes sure it never hover for very long😁😁
Not a problem, I can’t hover. My Apache is a slow moving fixed wing.
its generally better to slide side to side rather than try to turn away from a missile in helo as well. High hover is essentially suicide.
I really enjoy doing popups in helos... maybe not practical, but it is sexy. I guess back in my time during desert storm it was a more common practice, but there have been incidents since then. Casmo, I'd love to know what percentage of your training time was spent in popups, but that's probably OPSEC. Real life aside, can you talk about situations in DCS where you'd prefer to hover and popup?
Overheating engines are bigger issue then loose fuel lol.
These pixel pilots who think they're real world pilots crack me up
Casmo you are the man!! If I can offer one critique, because you're teaching... remove the monocle. It really obscures quite a bit on the screen here. I love your information and that is the only critique I have as someone who also 'tries' to teach lol. Keep doing what you do!!!! Love it!
Some people about Mi-24P:
"It isn't easy to launch missiles from hover, Hind is horrible"
Apache pilot about AH-64D:
"Don't hover so much..."
Btw, didn't yet check the fuel consumption in Apache so it was interesting point. In Mi-24 the fuel consumption is same regardless the flight situation or weight, about 840 liters per hour. Why you can be at high speed cruising, NOE, hovering, fully loaded or completely empty, it doesn't matter as turbines consume that almost constant rate.
"Hind has the same fuel consumption regardless of flight situation.." says who? the TV3-117 engine manual and the Instruction of usage of Mi-24 says differently.
I took full fuel and 4 external tanks. I was definitely overweight and I got bored after flying around for 3 hours. I had 6.5 hours of fuel when I took off but my fuel flow kept getting lower for the less fuel weight that was on board. It would be fun to try to do a massive ferry flight although I'm pretty sure I could cross the Atlantic with that much fuel at over 120kts
@@deekamikaze 4 fuel tanks? You psychopath 😂😂😂
Love the Hind. Nice mix of ATGM and rockets. Haven't really used the bombs or dispensers much on it but should give them a go
@@SouthPoleAntarctica Two pilots that fly Mi-24 and Mi-8.
That was their answer to question that why Russian helicopters don't have the fuel flow meter, but only have the fuel amount instruments, because the fuel consumption rate is so constant that you don't need to think about it.
You will just take the ~850 liters per hour and look at the available fuel and calculate in head that how long you have, and your have slight reserve too.
So if you have 1300 liters left, you know you have about 90 minutes left (1300/850=1.52).
If you have 200 liters, then about 10 minutes(850/200=4.25).
When you plan your mission, you only think about the time you need to fly, not weight, no hover, no altitude etc. You example take 10min for starting, 200 km per leg, 15 min in location, that gives you with average 180 km/h speed flight time that is 1 hour ~6 min so it gives in total 2 h ~40 min, and it is 850 * 2.3 = 1955 = ~ 2000 liters.
Just maintain the flight speed that you arrive in both locations in time and that you stay less than those times in each end and you never run out of fuel. Doesn't care do you fly loaded or empty, at 2000 meters or 40 meters. Just maintain schedule.
@@MrWiggo91 You can't really use bombs properly without bombing sight, that developers decline to implement, even when it is part of the operation and fully functional. So you are left to just fly over target and drop them, hoping best that you hit near target.
Sadly we got the P model instead far more produced V model with 12.7 mm Yak-B gun for destructive aiming accuracy up to 1200-1500 meters (caliber is excellent for over 2.5 km but you really don't hit targets there than by luck, and then if you even could spot them with naked eye). And quick slewing, automatic sight adjustment for flight parameters etc made it very accurate system at long range. Even having that automatic moving target prediction as in P, that you hold crosshair on moving target few seconds and lead is computed.
In DCS that would have been more useful because so many trucks and like targets.
But at least we get now they side door gunner with 12,7 mm HMG to do same as with Mi-8. So all hummers, many APC etc becomes vulnerable targets when you can fly around and door gunner keeps shooting at enemy. But this requires skill as no automatic sighting.
could you start showing your control input indicator? the rctl+enter thing? It will help me and other pilots understand what we should be doing with our stick at certain times, otherwise we just reinforce bad habits by doing what we've always been doing.
I’ve done a half dozen videos about how to fly helicopters lol. If those don’t help, my control indicator sure ain’t
@@CasmoTV nice
@@CasmoTV cool response bro.
And for your information, seeing what an expert helicopter pilot is doing with his controls during missions and general operation is a huge help to novices who dont have the skills or muscle memory that you have. There's no need to be an elitist douche
Just looking at real pilots flying that thing, it looks like they don´t hover very much, they are usually moving around.
Casmo, we need you to do an autorotation video! CTV... you are our only hope! Thanks in advance if you can :)
Working on it.
I just saw another video where I saw this happen IRL to a KA-52.
He should have subscribed to my channel. Could have saved his life.
What do you put in the aux gallons external entry on the fuel page? 230lbs per bag? Or 230 lbs.. Period. ?
Casmo any tips for targeting with the cp/g? I find it very hard to use my lmc to ground stabilize beacuse the instant it's engaged any movement of the controls causes drift, which means with a mini stick at least I sorts have to let the reticle drift onto the target.
Increase the dead zone in the axis settings slightly.
Question, what's the callout instead of splash? Shaq? Where'd that come from haha
Some nerdy jet jockey no doubt.
This is the first time running across your channel. Are you an actual 64 pilot? The way you know about the bob-up box, and when to transition your symbology. Its great.
Yeah I was.
@@CasmoTV Oh dope, I'm about to finish up flight school in the E model, and I'm off to Hawaii to fly the Delta for my first duty station.
Thanks for your service.
@@CasmoTV I am glad Apache pilots finally learned to hover lower. We AH-1F pilots watched whole flights of AH-64As hover 150 feet above the terrain then "shot down" by MILES.
I asked one AH-64A pilots if he was concerned about being shot down by a manpad. He replied, "Well, everyone is too afraid to mess with Apaches." A different AH-64A pilot gave a more reasonable response. He said, "We have to be that high to designate targets 8 kilometers away."
When I eventually became an AH-64A pilot myself I reminded other AH-64A pilots it was stupid to hover 150 feet above the terrain. Yes, I am glad Apache pilots finally learned to hover lower.
@@devenray4384 How is it now?
I work Apaches at night all the time as an ATC and they’re always asking me to just sit and high hover lol… then they land for fuel, then they do it again
They also aren’t being shot at I assume 🤷🏻♂️
Any advice in how to attack mobile units? In pve its fine, but against humans, all they need to do is to move in a straight line and all your helfires will miss, is that a George problem? Or IRL the apache is incapable of engaging mobile targets ?
does anyone know what that green bar on the vsi means? not the arrow just the green bar that occasionally comes up and down
Is there a link for the insurgent engagement video we can see at the end of this one?
700 at flat pitch? Shoot, the 60 can be as efficient as 740 in flight.
So many problems with power levels, the engines always turn off, and rpm is too high. I have so much to learn, and its so frustrating not to even be able to hover and use weapons.
I downloaded a file from Users that would help set up my Hotas, and that is not helping.
When I try to fly the training mission for the 30MM, the right hand side says Next, "WAS-UP" the Gun- Tedac left hand grip WAS UP ( NOT HIGHLIGHTED)
I press the WAS-G/UP and it does nothing. I tried all of the WAS buttons and the training mission will not continue for Me.
Thanks for any help with this training mission
Clear Skies
Mike
I only hover before landing and taking off
Is it still acceptable to hover at a far range for hell-fires? I'd imagine it wouldn't be optimal to slowly be flying towards a SAM site that hasn't acquired you.
'raceways' to follow is a great idea, but I wonder, for the hell fires, I'd still have to turn in due to turning limitations on the missiles.
Ofcourse just don’t get so close and don’t be away from cover.
@@CasmoTV Awesome, thanks!
How viable would it be to perform low altitude strafe-style hellfire engagements on medium-threats (like armored vehicles with heavy machine guns or guided missiles) in case of flat areas with little to no covers?
As, store targets from distance, go low, approach target with speed as copilot shoots, offset while missile is following laser, break away once rounds on target... Is this a good idea, or would this be a suicide for a helicopter?
That’s just too dangerous. The Apache isn’t the Hind. If you do that with any helicopter it would be the mi24. But even then, helicopters are vulnerable. What will you do when a manpad blasts you point blank while you’re doing that? Just happened in Ukraine on video recently.