I regretted my laser purchase. Until I upgraded.
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- čas přidán 31. 05. 2024
- Not so long ago, I regretted purchasing my diode laser. Yet somehow, less than 3 months later, I upgraded to a Co2 desktop laser. What gives!? There are so many challenges with getting into laser engraving, especially with an entry lever diode laser. But having a Co2 laser cutter has so many advantages! In this video I’ll break down the advantages and drawbacks of Co2 vs diode lasers, compare costs, and answer the question: which type of laser should you get? Diode or Co2? Plus, I’ll talk about my ventilation set up and the xTool smoke purifier.
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►Chapters
0:00 Why upgrade?
1:18 Diode vs. Co2 lasers
2:00 Cost comparison
4:31 Advantages of Co2 laser
15:03 Drawbacks of Co2 lasers
16:42 Fume extractor
18:20 Bottom line: should you get a diode or Co2 laser? - Jak na to + styl
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Actually for the price of the P2 for another $2000 you can look into a full blown 80 - 100 W Co2 laser, floor model water cooled with a much larger bed and self contained. Depends on what you want to do. P2 is still a hobby craft unit the xtra $2000 gets you a full blown very fast production unit. I use a Rabbit 100W floor model Co2 at work all self contained, runs 24/7, It's only issue like all Co2 units is you must keep the lens properly clean. Even this won't cut metal though.
A lot of the advantages that you confer to the P2, are not a function of it being a CO2 laser, but its actual design.
Not all CO2 lasers have autofocus or a built in camera.
Some CO2 laser cutters also use honeycomb beds and get messed up the same as diode lasers.
Not all CO2 laser cutters have integrated air assist pumps or water coolers.
Even with its integrated cooler, the P2 needs topping up with coolant before use, so it is not ready to go out of the box.
Judging by the amount of smoke present in the enclosure, while cutting, the included exhaust fan is inadequate. With a beefier setup, there should be hardly any smoke inside, and very little smell if vented outside.
CO2 lasers use a number of mirrors to direct the beam to the cutting head. These will eventually get dirty, and require cleaning, which then necessitates realignment. Also, the laser tube will degrade, and need replacing. Whilst this is also true of diode lasers, the replacement process seems a lot simpler with the latter.
Disclaimer: I have not used diode lasers, but prior to retiring I did use and maintain CO2 laser cutters as part of my job.
Comparing a fully enclosed and integrated 55W CO2 laser cutter with an open frame 20W diode laser is somewhat disingenuous. A fairer comparison would have been with Xtool S1.
Good review. Would add some tips/comments:
- The diode laser's honeycomb - you have it on a flat surface and that is why you're having so much char at the bottom... A honeycomb structure is usually used (besides holding small pieces) so that the air is sucked from below and out of the enclosure. Basically, you're burning wood... and if the smoke cannot escape (now it can't as there is no space between the honeycomb and your bottom plate) then the charring will occur.
- too small exhaust on the CO2 is a joke... it should accommodate at least as big exhaust as your diode laser enclosure. Apparently, they traded this important function for "looking good"... It does look good & especially thin, but that you have to wear a mask speaks a lot... For me, this is a design flaw.
- for me best cleaner after testing proved to be "car break degreaser", nothing else comes even close... Car shops have them and they aren't expensive.
A delightfully respectful, clear and comprehensive comparison. Thanks very much!
Thank you!
the problem is its nothing more than a ad
As someone just getting started, this was exactly the info I was looking for. Thank you!!
Diode lasers and CO2 lasers each have their place. Low power diode lasers have a smaller focal point, and that enables them to produce higher resolution engravings. However, as noted in this video, diode lasers have limitations when working with clear acrylic and glass.
FYI - Safety glass(es) for lasers offers protection only for specific wavelengths. If you work with different lasers, then you need to ensure the safety glass(es) you select is/are appropriate for the wavelength(s) of your laser(s). This may require purchasing different sets of glass(es).
Also cutting speeds.. is better to have both so to cut with one and engrave with the other...
@@Phelnok Agreed.
You have dirty cuts from your diode laser for the same reason your honey comb is getting so filthy, you need a 'down draft'. Down draft is a 'must' because your respirator doesn't protect your skin. Lasers don't burn, they 'oblate' by impacting an area w/concentrated photons, the byproduct of the friction is heat. You need the compressed air to clear our the debris but the consequences of this are tiny atomized particles that coat everything, skin, clothes, walls, if you can smell it, then it's on your skin. Long term exposure, speaking from experience, you will develop contact dermatitis to things that are considered 'harmless/safe'... I ran a Kern HSE utilizing a 150watt Coherent Diamond series laser for over 10 years w/the best down draft/compressed air setup US tax dollars could buy. At the end of the day, you could smell the 'stink' from whatever I had been cutting even w/the best ventilation on the planet. We didn't know, Kern didn't know, it's thanks to the DIY community that we now understand the hidden dangers that are completely manageable. Wear long sleeves when possible, minimize skin exposure and shower/rinse exposed skin sooner than later. I still laser daily, love the hobby/profession and miss my Kern :D.
Thanks so much for your videos on both the diode laser and the CO2 laser. Very clear, very concise...and ultimatelt very helpful!
Great videos Marie, as always.
Upgrading from a diode laser to a CO2 desktop laser can be a game-changer for anyone serious about laser engraving. While entry-level diode lasers are great for beginners, they often fall short in terms of power and versatility. CO2 lasers, like those offered by Monport, provide significantly more power, allowing for faster and more precise cuts on a wider range of materials. This upgrade not only improves efficiency but also opens up new possibilities for your projects. Monport lasers are known for their reliability and performance, making them an excellent choice for anyone looking to elevate their laser engraving capabilities. Plus, with a good ventilation setup and tools like the xTool smoke purifier, you can maintain a clean and safe working environment.
Thank you for your considered information, keep up the great work.
Thanks
You make the best videos. I learned a ton from this one.
Very well done. Accurate based on my experience. Thanks for the content.
Great Video. I recently purchased the Xtool S1 40 Watt diode laser. I am still learning how to use it. As far as for cutting out things, I will use my cnc router which I do know how to use. Thanks again, I do enjoy your videos.
I learnt a lot from this video, thank you!
Glad it was helpful!
Great video, Marie. I never realised how little charring a CO2 laser makes compared to a diode one. Mind-blowing!
My wife and I bought the 20W D1 Pro during the last black friday sales. We got a deal too good to pass and ended up with a rotary too. Even with building an enclosure, getting a honeycomb, buying an air assist pump, and adding venting it cost us just over AU$2000.
I'm still impressed with our little diode and all the things we can make with it, but cleaning it is a bit frustrating at times and the internal cable management was horrendous straight out of the box. I would love to get a CO2 laser at some point and am considering xTool as I feel XCS is powerful enough for our purposes.
I still love our diode laser though and will most likely keep it if we do upgrade, for the purpose of using it for engraving only.
Glasses. all the time. No matter what type of laser, even through the safety view screen
Wow! Wish I had seen this a few months ago. They ship this assembled?$ I’ve spent so much time assembling, repairing (waiting on a new motherboard now)… and just the insecurity that comes with assembling and learning all the things you outlined and more. Anyway, thanks for taking the time to do this. I gotta sell more stuff with my old one first, but gotta do the upgrade the co2… until then, super envious!!
When using foam degreaser on single sided objects (like stove, oven and oven glass etc):
1. Spray the foam and set clingfilm/plastic wrap on top of the foam. Let it soak for 30-60min and wipe it off. No more scrubbing!
For grills/honeycombs:
1. Lay a clingfilm on table that is two times + 20cm larger what the cleaned area is.
2. Spray the degreaser foam on top of the clingfilm.
3. Put the object on the foam and spray some more until all cleaned areas are unvisible.
4. Make it airtight and seal the package by wrapping it up by turning the rest of the clingfilm on top of the object. Turn it upside down after 15-30min and wait another 15-30min (depends how hurry you are in).
Remember to avoid breathing the fumes and use mask/use good ventilated space when unwrapping
For the laser cutting device, I'd probably buy a growing tent (150x150x200cm costs around $150, smaller ones are cheaper)
Hi, since you are located somewhere in Montreal, you could use the services of Freeport Fowarding in Champlain, NY. I did use them before the pandemics and it's about 30-45 minute drive including passing the border. You do the taxes on your own when returning plus you save on shipping within US vs shipping to Canada.
Thank you for the comparison! I will definitely purchase acrylic templates. Have been nervous to purchase the wooden ones with fear of breaking.
Thanks for the feedback!
Well produced and presented video, thank you. A question - would you consider the edges of laser cut wooden pieces to be suitable for gluing to other cut out pieces, or would they need sanding?
The cutting area is another factor. Large area co2 units are sooooo expensive. Also, if you are using the laser for production, do not ignore the fact that you will need to replace the laser tube at some point. Otherwise, good video.
Super helpful. Thank you.
Wow, the diode laser gets really messy! Indeed, I would hate maintaining it. I can see one advantage to the diode laser though: since I have a 4ft x 4ft cnc, I could put a diode laser on that and be able to work on a project much larger than 26 x 14 inch, at a much lower price than a co2 of that size. And I would get a 44W diode laser, which would be faster than the diode one you’re comparing. But seeing that mess, oh man! It’s a huge bummer, indeed.
If your in a warm climate you will need a chiller.
CO2 tubes like to run about 18c. More temp and they will shorten the life.
I am in tropical Australia.
This is great, thank you. Im in the middle if "making it work" with my diode laser. Works for what I need ,but boy, a CO2 would be great.
Great review! Thanks a lot - now I know the drawbacks of a diode laser! My theory that diode laser is way less energetic and so it doesn't instantly vaporize the material, but slowly heats it up, releasing wood gas and glue that holds plywood together, and that's what ending up on the honeycomb and bottom tray.
Second thing about filtration - if the filter considerably reduces amount of fumes, maybe you should pipe the filter outlet outside through the window? If it doesn't have output flange, you could probably make one out of plywood.
The filter box actually does get vented outside but I suspect the filters aren't fully sealed and there's some minor leakage. You can buy laser filtration units that are MUCH MORE EXPENSIVE that I suspect work better.
@@DIYMontrealThen, I guess, some sort of silicone goo is your friend 😏
Thank you so much for testing these 2 out for us. Have you tried any of the engraving options, especially on cylindrical objects like a glass or a metallic cup?
Very good assessment, tks.
Ive got a cheap and chearful 3018 and it does the job well enough, but Ive never had to clean off any gunk/grease from the bed? Is that just from the plywood glues?
Sooooooooo Well done! Thank you!
Great video, lots of time spent editing. Excellent review. Mahalo for sharing! 🙂🤙❤️
Thank you kindly!
merci beaucoup pour le temps consacré à cette question, et mille merci de l'avoir abordé dans son intégralité!!!
Nice summary, thanks for posting it. This emphasizes the necessity of doing your homework before getting ‘buck fever’. A clear idea of what you want to use the tool for is essential before spending the dough. I mostly do engraving on curved wood surfaces so neither of your options would be suitable for my needs. This is because the Z movement is pretty minimal to nonexistent in these machines. Cheers.
Thanks for this comparison. I was thinking about a diode laser but now I'll wait until I can afford a CO2 laser. I want to cut and engrave acrylic.
Also the bottom of the CO2 doesn't get as dirty because all the gunk is carried with the smoke and since there is a gap beneath the ribs and the bottom it gets carried out the exhaust.
Whats the difference in the kerf widths between these two machines?
Curious if you have looked at the Atomstack and Ikier 70W diode laser setups...? Seem like decent competitors to your CO2 setup (with the exception of laser cutting clear acrylic of course, they are still diode lasers...)
Comparing the speed of 20w to 55w is probably pointless if we compare the technology itself, not the power. Laser modules can be purchased with a power much higher, even higher than CO2.
I bought a diode laser very similar to the one you have and surprised to find I could not cut clear or translucent acrylic like I had done on the Techshop CO2 lasers. D'oh! Even though it's a tremendous amount of rework, I may get a K40. Hopefully I can find a middle ground CO2 that's not 5K instead.
14:25 this here is also the main tradeoff between the 2.
it means you can cut things with the co2 laser that the diode can't do.
but for the same exact reason. there are things your diode laser can do that your co2 laser cannot.
like engrave things past a transparent surface..
or burn away laser paint on a glass without engraving and shattering the glass itself.
Thanks!
i'd thought of getting a k40, fine for light work, not production i suppose. the upgrades needed to make it even halfway usable are a bit much. there's one upgrade that takes care of a whole bunch of problems, argon shielding gas. after that, upgrading the tube, lenses and power supply is at least easy and relatively cheap.
supposedly takes care of the stench, cause nothing's catching on fire to make the stench, no smoke, no loud exhaust fan, no filters, cause there's no smoky particulates to get rid of. you just make it gas tight on the bottom, gas tightish everywhere else, and all the garbage that would escape and strangle you to death is kept in the gas, which you can vent occasionally, no air assist, cause there's no crap to blow out of the laser nozzle.
if it weren't for the price of a gas cylinder, it'd be an easy decision. if you're not using a LOT of the stuff a tank will last a long long long time, which means that if you rent the tank monthly it'll quickly make the cost of buying a tank worth it, though they're 200bucks on the .ca jungle site for a small tank.
knowing other people have gone that route and had easy success, even with cheap k40 garbage, i'll be ready when i finally move on from using a laser head on my cnc machine.
Hello, are you try argon shield or just speak theoretically?I make some tests with CO2 gas for air assist and reality not like theory.
@@sashgorev i've seen argon used in videos, if you already have ga shield welding gear it's not that difficult, some tape to seal the bottom and plumb it in, disable the fan. i've seen the co2 tests and it's still smoky and too light so it doesn't shield well, but, if you didn't seal the enclosure to keep the co2 from blowing away, it won't do anything.
@@felderup Thanks for reply, I'm very curious to see these tests if you can put links here.
Regards
I have a CO2 laser and a diode laser engraver, and I am writing down the pros and cons I felt while using them.
First, let me tell you about the advantages of CO2 laser.
1) High output allows for fast and thick engraving or cutting.
Now look at the cons.
1) A separate chiller is required to cool down the CO2 tube.
2) The range of carving is small compared to the size of the exterior.
3) If the machine is left in cold temperatures in winter, the coolant in the CO2 tubes will freeze and be destroyed. Therefore, you should use automotive antifreeze in cold places.
4) The laser's focus is thicker than that of a diode laser.
5) The price is expensive.
6) Lastly, the biggest disadvantage is that CO2 lasers have a short lifespan. It's only 6,000 hours. After using it for 9 months, I experienced that the intensity of the laser's light decreased and the light went out. CO2 tubes are replaced once every 10 months to a year, and the replacement cost is $300. The short lifespan of a laser is quite stressful.
Also, in countries with four seasons, due to temperature differences, no matter how well you maintain your engrover, gas will gradually escape and its life will end after two years even if you do not use it.
The advantages of diode laser engrover are:
1) The conversion efficiency of electrical energy is high.
2) Air cooling is sufficient without the need for a water-cooled chiller.
3) The range of possible carving is large compared to the size of the exterior.
4) The price is cheap.
5) Laser focus is precise.
6) The lifespan of the diode laser is a whopping 100,000 hours. Once purchased, it can be used for 15 years even if used 20 hours a day. So there is no stress about replacing the laser.
Now let me tell you about the cons.
1) The output is weaker than that of a CO2 laser, so cutting transparent acrylic is difficult.
2) MDF over 15mm cannot be cut with onepass.
However, 40W diode lasers have now appeared. So even thick MDF can be cut with onepass. The unfortunate thing is that cutting transparent acrylic is still inconvenient.
😄
I enjoy all your videos This comparison video is very interesting. I have a question though I understand it's CO2 lasers cannot tolerate freezing temperatures ?
You have to put antifreeze in the tube so it won't freeze. They give you guidance on the ratio. But still unclear if you can keep it in an unheated space. Probably not.
@@DIYMontreal Thank you for getting back to me
What about work area or size of material. I can engrave on a section of an entire sheet of plywood by just setting the laser on top of the sheet. The only reason I have not switched to CO2 is the limited space to fit whatever you are working on
True. Some Co2 have a really big area. The xTool P2 is 12x20 I believe, but you can add the pass-though option which basically allows you to feed a long 20 inch wide sheet though it as it engraves
@@DIYMontreal I am currently using a 30 watt optical output diode laser module by Laser Tree and it is very powerful. But that brings me to my biggest complaint about diode lasers.... The power ratings. Some manufacturers advertise the power consumption rating and others will actually tell you the output rating. It gets very confusing for a beginner and it took me buying 4 different laser modules to finally know what number to look for, which sometimes takes a bit of digging
@@jacoblittle3209I have same LT-K30 head, it's amazing power.Set on homemade extended S9 frame with dimensions of workspace 370/780mm i successfully cut few shapes on gipsum plate size 900/1800/12mm.Think that can't be possible with hobby CO2 laser. Regards
I feel the same about mine. Wish I had just bought a CO2. I would definitely use mine more then.
that diode laser shouldn't need that much cleaning unless you are cutting materials you shouldn't be cutting. or don't have the propper airflow.
(basicly you are getting flames comming out of the bottom of your wood depositing soot and other things on the bottom plate and the honey comb, that said. you wanna move away from the honeycomb. it's the cause of your bad airflow) get slats for your diode laser
even if you don't get flames. the thick smoke is getting caught in the honeycomb structure. giving it more time to dirty the bottom of your work and the honeycomb itself
While entry-level diode lasers present challenges, CO2 lasers offer numerous benefits that make them a superior choice. In your video, you'll explore these advantages and drawbacks comprehensively, comparing costs and addressing the crucial question: which type of laser should viewers opt for, diode or CO2? Additionally, you'll touch on essential aspects like ventilation setups and the xTool smoke purifier, providing valuable insights for those considering diving into laser engraving. Amidst the comparison, the Monport Laser emerges as a standout option, offering unparalleled precision, versatility, and reliability. With Monport, users can confidently embark on their laser engraving journey, equipped with a tool that delivers exceptional results and addresses the challenges often associated with entry-level lasers.
An easer way to clean the honey comb is to use the degreaser and a Electric Pressure Washer, Way faster and more user friendly. Also 4k for the xtool co2? The omtech 60W laser goes for $2600 and the remainder cost can be used in the chiller and exhaust solutions. Bigger cutting space and quality laser...
Just great, go and buy the Creality Falcon 2 40W/20W diode laser and this video has just about made me think I've just wasted my money. How long do the Co2 tubes last though??
I would try to make a slat bed instead of honeycomb, but if you stay with the honeycomb let me suggest this: Nylon Tube Brush Set. Cut the ring off and put it in a cordless drill! Also you can get a 3" or 4" marine bilge air blower for $25 instead of a $119 fan and those will extract fumes like a beast.
the built in air assist on the co2 laser is probbably a blower style fan. given the fact that you can't hear a loud pump.
makes the laser head a little heavyer. but it's making me think that's a good upgrade for my co2 laser.
lower power consumption and much quieter.
Thanks, you have forget in the cost, the CO² cartridge. I don't know if I sell my D1 for this P2.
What you mean 'CO2 cartridge '?
Is there a ‘pass through’ option?
little warning on the viewing window of the co2 laser.
yes the window stop all of the laser's infrared light. and your eyes are protected from the laser light.
BUT it doesn't stop visible light. and the heated material still emits a verry bright spot of light wich can still damage your eyes.
it can even give you welders eye if you are not carefull. (tiny damage to your rettina wich feels like someone threw verry fine sand into your eyes right before you go to sleep)
I'm looking at a CO2 as well, as the diode is SOOOOO slow.....What about laser tube cooling?
So you’re saying the machine isn’t sealed well enough that even if you vent directly outside, there’s still a ton of particles in the air ?
The machine isn't sealed at all (not meant to be as air needs to come in to makeup the air being sucked out). The issue is the built-in fan lacking power. You need to add a much more powerful fan like the one I use for my diode laser.
That’s a massive subsidy for your side hustle.
An interesting video. What is the life span and cost of the CO2 tube and does it degrade in its intensity over time? If it does then your settings will be changing it over time. This CO2 laser is a high end hobby/low production model compared to the larger commercial production models which cost $20,000+. You never mention that many items are not laser friendly and can in fact be deadly if layered. I enjoy your videos and various projects. And yes our Montreal winters do not allow opening the windows. I am in Pierrefonds (West Island on the Island on Montreal - geography info for those not familiar with the are)
You can’t engrave metal on a co2 without expensive coatings. I have a 100w co2 and a 40w diode. The diode does a great job cutting wood. And when it comes time to replace the tube in your co2 we can talk about price and ease of service. I’m assuming you haven’t had to adjust your mirrors yet either
Back when you bought your first laser, your mistake was buying the open frame D1 instead of the enclosed M1 which doesn't have many of the issues you mentioned.
Also, some time ago xTool have released another enclosed diode laser, the S1 - while it doesn't have a built in camera, they added a clever multipoint positioning system.
Probably WAS a mistake!! Didn't know the difference and didn't do my research...
@@DIYMontrealIt was a somewhat expensive learning experience, but you are wiser now!
that close up view at the bottom shows that your far away camera needs to be calibrated.
seeing as the edge of your workpiece doesn't line up.
does a 40watt diode as fast as a 40watt c02 laser? i ask because ur comparing a 20watt diode to a 55watt c02 laser
No, a 40W diode doesn't cut as fast as 40W CO2, especially when you're using acrylic.
What about a water pump / cooler for the tube?
all built-in to this specific desktop laser. No need for external ones.
Thanks
You need a gap between the honeycomb and the aluminium plate. Thats why you get a mess and have to clean all the time.
I take it you are only comparing that version of xtool. Many of the features you stated are not available on a Diode are available. Case in point the WeCreat laser and the Creality Falcon Pro.
It looks like you're only wearing dust filters, but you mentioned fumes.
I use 3M 2097 filters. 2097 adds filtration of nuisance-level organic vapors (it has some charcoal in the filter).
Whats the thickest the co2 can cut through?
It's depends of material optical power focus and numbers of passes.This is valid for all types of lasers.
Fantastic review, Marie! Thanks a bunch! 😃
Stay safe there with your family! 🖖😊
Thank you! You too!
You just talked me outta buying any DIY laser.The hassle with either is just not worth it.
the title needs a translation.
it should say.
"i was an idiot who bought a laser that doesn't do what i needed it to do because i didn't do any research. and then i upgraded to the laser i should have bought from the start"
because they are both just as good. they simply have diffrent use cases. there are lots of things that the diode laser can do that the co2 laser can't even hope to do. and vice versa.
You didn't upgrade, you got a free one. LOL!
Allthough a co2 has it’s advantages, the problems you have with the diode laser are due to mistakes I see you making. (for example: my diode laser gives me clean edges because I let it run fast with more passes without loosing time)
Only problem with light burn is you have to pay to use it, i've never cleaned my honeycomb once in 14 months, and an aquarium air pump works just fine for air assist. I tried running mine in the basement, no amount of vacuum will get the smoke and smell out, I run it in the garage with a camera watching it now.
Yeah, I was wondering what the obsession with cleaning the honeycomb. I've never cleaned mine and so what? I think it may be worse because there was no gap beneath the grid for the airflow. I've also not used a diode cutter, maybe they are just messier. Still, who cares if the bed is dirty? Does it affect the work?
Does the CO2 does not needs cooling ?
This one has a built in chiller.
More expensive ones with RF metal tubes are air cooled.
@@YaaLFHJust a blower chiller.. or an refrigerated chiller.
Where I am 28c is a standard temp so I use a chiller.
@@marcwolf60 Refrigerated.
The P2 certainly better in many apps , but you're comparing Apples to Oranges. Also the P2 is 55 W theX2 is only 20W, not the same. Good review though. FYI you can buy Gelatin filter sheets cheap 20x 24 inches from Lee filters @ about $20 per sheet. for the blue/UV diode laser for building your own cabinets Filter sheet number # 158. Why are you showing gooy Bee honey combs, not a fair comparison!! Persoanlly I'm looking for a laser that can cut up to 1/4 thick steel, but at $50,000 to 100,000 never going to happen! Actually thes days for metal cutting a desk top water jet is a better choice, but still not cheap, and a lot more hassle to use.
To be honest I still think its a lot of money for a co2 laser. My OMT laser was 2200 euro's and the active chiller about 600. For that money you get a 50x70cm 80 watt laser.
I completely understand you are happy with the upgrade don't get me wrong, but yeah... there are cheaper alternatives out there.
Yes, there are cheaper alternatives but they don't work straight out of the box, you have to buy an external chiller etc.
The advantage of the desktop CO2 lasers is that they come with everything you need built in, just add coolant and you're ready to cut.
It sounds like your biggest issue is you don't do your own research before purchases.
The random stock footage is very off putting.
So, you bought a laser and you didn’t like it. But you like the one you got for free!
That is fair and I guess accurate. But if I had to pick one today for my business, I would lean towards the P2. Unless I could somehow find room for a bigger floor model the the Thunder Nova.
Yeah, I think I'd prefer either if it were free.
There are literally hundreds, probably thousands of videos that discuss what you brought up in your intro.
08:40 this has nothing to do with the fact that it's a co2 laser and everything to do with the focus of your laser.
my co2 laser has a cheap lens and i get the heavely burned sooty edges aswel.
you need a thin straight laser line. mine focusses into a dot meaning that above the dot and below the dot it gets wider fast. wich heats up and burns the wood and makes deep cuts harder because less of the laser is getting to the cutting part.. if you have a decent lens setup the focus "dot" can be several millimeters tall. wich is much better for cutting. (less so for engraving because it's also a wider dot then mine)
I normally think DIY Montreal does fair comparisons, but this time she has missed the mark. This video is not so much a comparison of diode lasers vs CO2 lasers, but a comparison of an older 20 watt open frame diode laser to a latest generation 55 watt CO2 laser. Most of the downsides to diode lasers she mentions are no longer true since many diode lasers now include full enclosures, with exhaust fans, cameras and large laser-safe viewing areas. Diode lasers are not just for engraving, in fact a 40 watt diode laser will probably do a better job of cutting wood than an equivalent power or more powerful CO2 laser. And things like a honeycomb bed vs a slat bed are not a function of the laser type, but the bed type. Charred cut edges are a function of the settings one uses, not a characteristic of the laser type. I own a $1400 diode laser and much prefer it to an $8,000 CO2 laser I also have access to. CO2 lasers have one advantage over diode lasers, the ability to cut clear and translucent acrylic. Otherwise they are, as she points out, much more expensive, much bulkier, and have sensitive parts like mirrors and expensive tubes with a limited usage life. I hope your viewers do not watch this video and get the impression that if they want a laser for their wood shop they need to spend $4,000 plus. There are lots of great diode lasers available for a fraction of that price that do a great job of both engraving and cutting wood. I love Marie's woodworking videos, she is one of my wood working heroes, but I don't think she has enough experience using lasers to make a good comparison between diode lasers and CO2 lasers.
Thanks SO MUCH!!! For this comment!!! I always have a bad feeling when people do videos on things they got for free. And comparing a cheap run of the mill laser to a higher end newer one is really apples to oranges.
You clearly know a lot more about lasers than I do! This wasn't intended to be a comparison video but more my experience with lasers and why I upgraded. I feel like a lot of people starting out with lasers would go for the same basic entry level model that I did, and I feel that's a mistake. If anything, there's a need for more education and greater research when investing in a laser cutter. Promise I'll go back to woodworking for my next video ;)
@@DIYMontreal Yes. I would agree. The quantum leap you made is REALLY a big one. Like comparing a bicycle for transportation vs. a car. And when a company gives you something like this for free it's REALLY hard for us lay people to not look at it from a guarded position. If Ford gave me a brand new Raptor pick up truck and wanted me to give an honest feelings about it vs. my 2003 F-150? HECK YEAH I would have great things to say about it! The laser cutter is different for you because you DO have a business that you are using it for and probably would have been the right investment for you to make in order to ramp up that business. Bob over at "I Like to Make Stuff" Got a free $13k Thunder Laser to do a video with. That thing BLOWS the $5000 xTool away. But again... don't think he would have made that leap had he had to pay for it himself. (I look forward to the next woodworking video you make 🙂) Best wishes, Rick
“No additional accessories”
Buys a lot of additional accessories
“I don’t know why my undertray on co2 is so clean”
Maybe because there is much more space between the bed and the undertray?
You can also achieve this with diode laser.
“Honeycomb on a diode laser is a pain to clean”
Then don’t get a a honeycomb for a laser. You can get the same style workbed for your diode laser as you have in your co2 laser.
I've seen other diode laser cutters make successful cuts out of acrylic just by adding a black sheet of card stock underneath the material to be cut. After the cut you have two pieces of laser cut art that can be cleaned and sold. It shouldn't be too hard to find the video on CZcams. Epilog makes a superior C02 Laser cutter/engraver that is made entirely in the USA. What you have is something made in Communist China.
I did the same purchase process, but the cheaper versions.... eleksmaker diode laser to the k40 co2... same results...
I am not sure if I would agree with you regarding some of the points in the video. Both CO2 and diode laser have their places. The fact is, xtool d1 pro is outrageously overpriced for what it is. When it comes to this type of open frame diode lasers, there is really very little seperating xtool from other more budget friendly options. CO2 laser machine is another story, but I still won't spend anywhere close to $5k for that. You are comparing the cut speed of two machines with very different laser power output, which is completedly unfair and pointless. The CO2 may look to be worth it, only because you overspent on the D1 Pro. There are plenty of budget brand 20W laser out there, nowadays at around $500ish. Occasionally , there are sales pushing it close to $300, with an air assist included. with that, the equation would be drastically different from your viewpoint here, esepcially for people new to laser machines.
The big question is... would you take the 5000$ investment when starting up a small business ? Or would you need to take the staged approach ?
08:55
again. that's just THIS 5000 dollar model.
it's a feature of the model. not a propperty of co2 lasers.
my co2 laser does not have an auto focus. infact it doesn't have a focus at all.
i need to adjust the height of my workpiece.
and to get a diffrent focal point i need to swap out the lenses.
little side note on your end conclusion at 15:10
my co2 laser was cheaper than your diode laser.
have not seen you talk about the water cooling. are you sure that it's a co2 laser?
(it could be a metal RF tube.)
oh and stay away from cutting anything vinyl.
pvc.
old records.
don't cut them.
the fumes comming off of that are detrimental for your laser. and extremely lethal for humans. (chlorine gas. wich when it mixes with water. ie the moisture in the air. turns into hypochlorous acid)
You would be even happier if you weren't paying 3 to 4 times what the laser should actually cost. There is nothing about a xtool laser that justifies those outrageous prices.
What are you using?
that built in exaust fan is not good enoegh.
it has poor static pressure (just like any other pc fan)
wich means if you have a long tube to the outside. the fan isn't going to be good at extracting anything.
you need a blower type fan.
(the smell is another story. you say. yes that's because it's not extracting propperly. and YOU MOST CERTAINLY NEED A TUBE TO THE OUTSIDE!!!! most of these fumes are toxic for you. if you smell it. you are inhaling the toxic fumes)
Baby wipes work very well for cleaning off laser residue.
Thanks for the tip!
You've spent $7k on two consumer grade lasers when you could have purchased a purchased a premium commercial grade Thunder Laser 35 100watt for $10k.
It comes with everything and by everything like closed loop steppers and over sized tubes. No "maximum" wattage advertising. A 100watt tube means cutting to 100watts.
Live and learn but more importantly do your research before you end up with two toy lasers for $7k.
Don"t blame the price of a diode laser on your poor shopping habits. Even your CO2 laser can be bought for half what you paid for yours, but it won"t be an x-tool
This has to be the most disingenuous way to describe the differences.
I would say she is representing this as if she’s under pressure from someone to represent CO2 lasers as the wholly grail.
Just look how she started by comparing the full price of the diode laser to the discounted CO2 price. 🚩
While CO2 systems can have their perks so can diode. Both systems have advantages and disadvantages. Do your research and know what you are getting into.
Did she get the xTool for "free"?
Literally every video about diode lasers covers all the limitations you complained about at the start. If you bought it not knowing these issues you didn’t do any research ahead of time.
Go ndg! Lol sorry i had to...