1971, PDM, PPP and a history of the Left - Tariq Ali - Writer/Intellectual - TPE
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- čas přidán 2. 04. 2021
- Tariq Ali is a British political activist, writer, journalist, historian, filmmaker, and public intellectual. He is the author of many books, including Pakistan: Military Rule or People's Power (1970), Can Pakistan Survive? The Death of a State (1983), Clash of Fundamentalisms: Crusades, Jihads and Modernity (2002).
Tariq Ali comes back on the podcast to discuss dynastic politics, the PPP that was, if there is any reason to be hopeful in PDM, 1971, Fatima Jinnah, and the Pakistani left.
Does the left in Pakistan need to consolidate? Does it need to update its manifesto?
Do we need a revolution in Pakistan?
Did India want to take over West Pakistan in 1971?
Watch on this deep dive podcast with the legend himself, Tariq Ali. There is also a hilarious Hamlet story in there.
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The podcast is hosted by comedian and writer, Shehzad Ghias Shaikh. Shehzad is a Fulbright scholar with a Masters in Theatre from Brooklyn College. He is also one of the foremost Stand-up comedians in Pakistan and frequently writes for numerous publications. He can be found on Facebook, Instagram, Twitter and Tinder.
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Some of the comments by Tariq Ali regarding behavior of Pakistan towards Bengalis were absolutely true, and followed by Punjabi establishment (Army and Civil) in Bangladesh from 1947 to 1970. I met Tariq Ali as a child in Dhaka (I think around the 1969 Movement) in Mashiur Rahman's house in Eskaton as he was being introduced as a young firebrand, and I was curious and went to that house with elders to listen.. Mr. Ali looks totally different now. Question is why he did not try to change the Pakistani society still believing that women are to be used to produce babies only as cows and stay at home so that Pakistan's population is now more than Bangladesh's. There are many other Pakistani values that need to be radically changed and Tariq Ali of 1969 could have contributed to help his society. Proud Bangladeshi, from Boston, USA
It was like a grandpa spilling his treasured secrets to his favorite grandchild. Loved the podcast.
Tariq Ali apke dada hein? Lucky you @Shehzad
@@ThePakistanExperience time for another episode i think
Rip Pakistan Studies. A total different perspective of reality and is difficult to be digested by most of Pakistanis. Thanks for bringing this side of history.
Shehzad, you seem to be an intelligent fellow, which is a rarity in Pakistan, would love to hear you interact with Mr. Istiaque Ahmed...
وہ مطالعہ پاکستان نہی مغالطہ پاکستان ہے۔
لوگ سچ سے زیادہ سچ کی کہانی سننے میں دلچسپی رکھتے ہیں ۔
If "the truth hurts" could be a podcast, it's this one. Tariq Ali is a goddamned treasure.
I'm an Indian, and Tariq Ali is more or less one of my favorite intellectuals in South Asia. Feels really good hearing him speak in Urdu.
Great Tariq Ali , i love listening to him
...... From Punjab (India )
Words lost! He is such a gem. Please do more with him. Well done!🎉
Aesay buht hi kam ashkhas hain jo karwi baatain itnay meethay andaaz main kartay. Tariq shb is not a person: he is a principle, a benchmark of perfection and epitome of integrity. God bless this legend with a life of thousand years.
From an Indian perspective I'm getting to learn so much. You are doin an amazing work. Keep at it bruv. Bless. Cheers.
@@ThePakistanExperience good on ya Shehzad. I'm on a binge spree here. Being a centrist myself it was refreshing to hear u and Uzair goin to and forth. Keep em comin.
@@ThePakistanExperience The option(to invade West Pakistan) put before Indira Gandhi has been mentioned before by her secretary (PN Haskar or Dhar). When years later he asked her why she didn't take that option her reply was "When leaders have to take big decisions they are often on their own". Make of that statement what you wish.
Agree Sir, even today, Bengalis are more revolutionary and emotional. I been to Port Blair in Andaman Island (popular as kale pani jail). Most names on the list put there of freedom fighters is Bengalis and next are Punjabis, Hindu Muslims and Sikhs together. Even demand for pakistan started from Bengal and they worked more and sacrificed. Indira was a wise person but only mistake she made was to attack Golden Temple. She misjudged the Fire of Sikhs and history of them. They never pardon an attacker, what ever is the cost.
We need this detoxifying podcast. Thanks shehzad bhai. We need this one. You're doing a great service to this society.
My Supreme Leader...
Been listening to him for years
Here are the timestamps.
00:00:45
Which virus effect tariq ali and the world
00:02:30 --
On 50th anniversary Bangladesh independence. End of Jinnah's Pakistan.
00:03:53
Fragile ego of west Pakistanis
00:04:16
Why breakage of Pakistan was necessary
00:05:12
End of Ayyub era, First free fair election in Pakistan's history.
00:06:26
False Conspiracy theories regarding 71 war
Indian Intervention in 71 war
How Indira Gandhi solved refugee crisis.
00:07:40
Bhutto's blunder in 71
How Pakistan can be saved in 71
00:08:30
Bhutto's wrong assessment
Talks were made to be broken or not?
00:09:31
Mentality of west Pakistan’s elite
How Bengali’s were made inferior by the Britishers
00:11:30
First time Pakistanis were united in 68-70
Pakistanis resistance against the military
00:12:50
Army's propaganda against the Bengalis.
Mass rape orchestrated by the army
00:14:40
Indira's Gandhi interview regarding his book
Indira Gandhi interviewed me.
00:15:58
Is Pakistan preparing to invade India
Attacking India is a suicide for Pakistan
00:17:40
RAW's intelligence on Pakistan's attack on India
00:18:50
How military takeover in India is difficult
How she stopped Sam Manekshaw
00:24:01
"If i had been prime minister of India at that time, i would've moved heaven and earth to stop him (zulfiqar bhutto) being hanged, it's unacceptable" Indira Gandhi
00:25:58
Conversation with Zulfiqar Ali Bhutto
On hostility with India
His role in 71 war
Pakistan's army role in
00:29:01
Do you feel Fatimah Jinnah's campaign was pivotal for Pakistan's politics?
How Ayyub rigged the election against Fatimah Jinnah
00:31:00
Mysterious death of Fatimah Jinnah
00:32:18
Pakistani Diaspora's colonial attitude.
Their support for Ayyub
00:35:01
Pakistan - A rentier economy
How petro-dollar saved Pakistan.
Mercenaries
00:36:30
How Indian capitalism is different from Pakistan
Why it's backward
Govt backing of industrialization of Pakistan.
How 22 families gained control of Pakistan's economy
00:37:29
Failed nationalization of Bhutto
00:38:35
Muslim league manifesto 1947 regarding Land Reforms
Why it failed
How feudalism gets stronger in Pakistan.
00:40:13
Current govt performance
Imran Khan's broken promises.
00:41:21
Clashes among PTI
A tale of two ministers.
00:43:09
Hafiz Jalandri's mushaira heckled by a young lahori "Goliyan khanda hoye ga"
00:46:27
Social Media ki siyasat
Passing the ball
00:46:54
Koi ummed thi PDM se?
PMLN and PPP's dark past
How PPP got hijacked.
Zardari's competition to Nawaz in Corruption
00:50:10
Benazir wanted to make Zardari stay away from politics.
Benazir's dynastic decision.
00:52:35
On PTM
Why I trust PTM.
Why PTM is a new kind of political party
00:54:20
PPP and PMLN political culture
How bhutto made PMLN through Zia.
Army's intervention in politics
00:55:30
Every province has the same problem.
On the hegemony of Punjab.
00:56:40
Why Pakistan's left consolidation is important
Weak base of left in Afghanistan during 70s
Why left failed in Afghanistan.
00:59:38
Lenin when he heard about communisms overtake of Mongolia
Left's assessment of geopolitics.
01:01:20
Imperialists strategy of divide and rule
01:02:14
America story of betrayal in Middle East
Why I hate being right.
01:04:50
Only way is to consolidate left all over Pakistan.
01:05:50
Why current left is dogmatic?
How Lenin made Marxism a reality.
Lenin was a supreme realist.
01:08:40
How Marxism took over the world.
Mao and Lenin's practical approach to Marxism
01:11:57
We don't need dogmatic Marxists.
01:12:40
What we really need?
01:13:05
On Pakistan's language issue.
Elite's hegemony over language
01:40:00
Language and Identity issue.
01:14:55
Sufi Tabbasum's Punjabi Hamlet
01:17:38
Dr. Nazir Ahmed and Punjabi
Political drama
01:19:03
Tariq Ali's interview in Punjabi during his India stay
01:21:30
Faiz Ahmed stance on Punjabi language
Why every Punjabi poet wrote in Urdu?
01:24:20
How Punjabi language was saved by East Punjab
01:27:29
How Pakistanis treat Punjabi
Elite mentality
01:29:05
On Urdu language
01:31:00
Status quo fear of the opposition.
Why state is so insecure?
01:32:01
How Zia made us hypocrite.
01:32:38
How Britishers made Punjab a model state
01:34:03
End
My supreme leader
Thank you so much!
Thank you so much!
dill karta hy, yeh banda bas bolta rahay , aour hum suntay raheen.
what an historian
What a priceless anecdote about Mrs. Gandhi. Tariq sahab is a masterful storyteller. Thank you so much for this!
czcams.com/video/IzlM7gM9Cks/video.html Watch this interview of Sam sahab. His animated description of interactions with Ms. Gandhi only give credit to Tariq sahab's anecdote.
@@ThePakistanExperience Din ban gaya mere jaise history nerds ka
Also that part needs to be clipped and made a separate video...pls Shehzad.
Indira Gandhi tattling against indian army chief ridiculing him for having wanted to finish off the issue and insinuating that army wants to coup to a Pakistani journalist....is extremely unfortunate
Schrodinger from insta here....
You made my fav person come again...
Thank you so much.
@@ThePakistanExperience 🥺💕
Shehzad you are an excellent interviewer. You had complete respect for him throughout the interview, and Let him speak his mind without interruption.
really learned a lot ...thank to Tariq Ali
from i'am an Indian bengali
Tariq Ali is a class in himself. Speaking truth to power. Listening him is an education.
@@agrippa-theskeptic9346 You are true gobarbhakt.
Many thanks Shahzad, be safe , be strong, Tariq Saab is a legend and a true Pakistani, hoping to see many more videos like this on your channel, also loved Dr. Taimur's discussion
my grandpa used to spill beans on bhutto tenure like this with me.
He's not just a great intellectual but an excellent story teller. Such an engaging podcast!
Exactly
Watched Tarik Ali after long time.He is INTELLECTUAL par excellence.It is always treat to listen to him.
What a legendary person! Great interviewing as well. Unlike most Pakistani hosts and podcasters, Shahzad doesn't try to act like a a second expert and intervenes with just the right frequency. Keep it up!
It was amazing when Tariq sir started speaking naturally in punjabi .
It seems to me, his Panjabi is more natural than Urdu. Unfortunately, too many native-speakers keep their gifts hidden. Thank you for encouraging Tariq Ali to express himself in Panjabi.
Tariq Ali is unquestionably one to the most brilliant Pakistanis of his generation. He. is close to what Noam Chomsky Is the USA. What we need to recall is Indira Gandhi is reported to advised Bhutto at Simla, after the signing of the peace agreement. She as a fellow politician advised ZAB that he had the historic opportunity to firmly cork up the then defeated humiliated Pakistani generals in the bottle for all time to come. And, if he failed to that, they would, in time "eat up his Country ".
What a personality! Could have listened to him hours on end! Thanks Shehzad.
Great Job Dear,
48:10 knock knock,
Shehzad: who's there?
Crore commander 😂
Loved It, and the guest you brought are Just Waooooh.
Again, an outstanding conversation!!👍🏻👍🏻
Just came across this. Always thought about this topic and honestly, such a nuanced take on it is refreshing! Sh. Tariq Ali's books have always been on my list but shall not remain there for long! Can't wait to engage with his writings =D. Thank you for conducting this interview and sharing it with us!
🙌
The Indira Gandhi excerpt from this episode was really interesting and surprising from an Indian standpoint. I though I knew a lot. But learned a lot today. Thanks to this amazing platform!!!
Love from Delhi!!!
Didn't Indira Gandhi's secretary I think Haskar or Dhar mention this option put before the PM by Manekshaw. When he asked her at a later date(when Khalistan issue was boiling over in Punjab) as to why they didn't finish the job(i.e. invade West Pakistan) she said "When leaders have to take these decisions they have to do it alone".
Amazing talk
Salute to Mr.Tariq Ali for telling us the truth all so deepest gratitude to Bongobondu Sheikh Mujibur Rahman. Joy Bangla
What an amazing podcast 👏👏👏 Tariq Ali sb , a treat to listen to❤️ Its like listening to an old buddy, very nostalgic yet extending up to present times. Thanks for your efforts shehzad.
Aaj is channel k bananay ka maqsad achieve ho gya hai loved it❤
One liner : pakistan ka hal sirf INQILAB hai❤
Salute : TARIQ SIR
❤
Great PODCAST. Tariq Ali brilliant as always. Minor correction: Last interior minister was Brig. Ijaz Ahmed Shah and has nothing to do Zia Ul Haq.
Tariq Ali a symbol of truth
A great intellectual personality
Always a treat to listen to Tariq Ali. On the other end, Najm Sethi sold himself to the dynastic parties.
Very well done Shezad. You didn't act like many other hosts, you let us listen the legend so freely. Thanks
Fabulous discourse - Really enjoyed it . and learned a lot - loads of love !
Very brave talking gives me different dimensions of thinking
Loved it Shehzad keep up the good work. Please also do a podcast on the Soviets' invasion of Afghanistan and how Pakistan tackled it. 💕💕
Karaye Ka Jihad....
Bro you have my respect , your ability to hang with this intellectual giant without sounding like a moron is nothing short of brilliant. Kia baat hai maza agya .
بائیں بازو کے نظریات کابڑا دانشور سرخ سلام
Thank you so much for bringing this living legend ,Tariq Ali to us.. i have heard him many times , in English.. even with Karen Armstrong , but jo maza idhar aagiya wahan nahi... reason... though i am Pashtun , but yet enjoyed , when Tariq Ali spoke in Punjabi.. Thank you once again..
Thanks Shehzad for this amazing podcast!!
Thank you shahzad for another amazing podcast with tariq sahab🙏
This was brilliant and insightful! Thank you for having Tariq Ali as your guest. I thoroughly enjoyed the Punjabi also.
So insightful! Still thinking why I did not know about this great man before listening to ur podcasts. You introduce me to so many intellectuals. Thank you so much shehzad
Lots of love and respect for Mr. Tariq. He is a divine orator
Excellent Analysis
Great analyst Sir Tariq Ali.
Today is just like listening stories from the eldest member of the family great man love to see him.
সত্য কথা বলার জন্য ধন্যবাদ
ঢাকা বাংলাদেশ থেকে শুভেচ্ছা 💚❤
Wonderful!!! What a great historian and storyteller. Being a leftist, he doesn’t hesitate to tell the truth.
What a program, brilliant
The military is more than the de facto political party in Pakistan’s political spectrum with strong authoritarian mind set because of its training and experience. Not de Jure. Because it has no social contract with Gen Gracy’s ‘bloody civilians” bit that never got trashed.
another awesome interview...thank u for bringing him back on the podcast bro..i got to learn a lot abt punjab in this one..100th episode is nearing already!!
Ohh . Bahot hard guest..
Bravo.
19:06 - 23:50
Mr. Tariq Ali provides two dramatically different versions of this encounter in his books namely, _An Indian Dynasty: The Story of the Nehru-Gandhi Family (1985)_ & _The Duel: Pakistan on The Flightpath of American Power (2008)_ . The version he is narrating here comes from the latter book.
In the first version, Indira Gandhi is in the middle of an interview being conducted by the Swedish TV when the phone rings. The Field Marshal Sam Manekshaw is on the other side who informs her of the surrender. She thanks him and gets on with the interview. On the next day, during a cabinet meeting, her *ministers* insist 'on finishing the job'. She then meets her Generals who also request her to let them have their way which she declines. There is absolutely NO mention of the Field Marshal marching in and behaving in a manner Mr. Ali is describing here.
Hence, either Mr. Ali again somehow met Mrs. Gandhi after her assassination in some other dimension to update his previous version or the novelist Tariq Ali got the better of the journalist Tariq Ali and thus flowed a colorful albeit fictional version.
Furthermore, anyone who has read about and seriously observed the late Field Marshal speaking can discern that he couldn't have displayed such gross indiscretion. He appeared a thorough professional not some sycophantic, run of the mill Bonapartist eager to gratify his superiors for promotion or other perks and privileges.
Lastly, John Richard Sisson & Leo Rose in their book _War and Secession: Pakistan, India, and the Creation of Bangladesh (1990)_ question the veracity of the whole event. According to the interviews they did with Mrs. Gandhi and other officials, the policy debate over West Pakistan happened in _early_ December not after the fall of Dhaka. Also, interestingly, none of the interviewees highlighted any serious disagreement over the decision of unilateral cease fire.
Really provide evidence she did it. Another Mr Ali meeting Mrs Gandhi just can't as she was killed in 1984
@@ThePakistanExperience it was not mimicking he is saying Marshall manekshaw was on other side of the call when the good news came in of pak army surrender.
The other thing here is that the Indian plan was to capture as much of East Pakistan as possible and declare Bangladeshi independence and form a government.
General Jacob has said this in multiple interviews that he did not have orders to take Dhaka but that he chose to do so because the Pakistaani general buckled under pressure.
❤ from Bangladesh
Zabardsst . . what a man Tariq Ali sb. its always great to watch him 👍👍👍
I'm surprised you haven't invited Vijay Parshad on yet, such a brilliant Marxist intellectual.
Long life to Tarique Ali sir ,,🙏
Unbelievable work Shehzad, love from India❤️🧿
Mr. Tariq Ali should have mentioned here that the "All Indian Muslim League" was formed in Dacca (Now Dhaka, Bangladesh) in 1905
Mr. Jinnah, i believe, was not a participant in that meeting.
Bengal politics and politicians were then much advanced than the rest of India. Significant names are
Huseyn Shaheed Suhrawardy
A. K. Fazlul Haque
Netaji Subhash Chandra Basu..
And more
TARIQ WAS A "GREAT AND PROMINENT" STUDENT LEADER OF PAKISTAN.
Very intelligent person proud of pakistan, we must respect our intelligencia,
Spell-binding! 🌻
Great Tariq Ali
Correct me if I am wrong, Kipling didn't even spared Pakhtuns, he writes of Peshawar in his book “Kim” that it is an “insalubrious city” More famously, he describes it as a “city of evil countenances”.
In his essay of the same name, he cements many stereotypes of Pakhtuns; that they are warrior-like, vicious, oppressive to women, and highly sexualized.
Ohhhh Sonia
They are glorious PATHANs, glorified by Khan Brothers.
such an awesome conversation 😍
Ugh, wish I speak Punjabi. Thanks for having him on, love Tariq.
Excellent, great to hear Tariq Ali sir.
Amazing podcast bro !
such a great person ❤❤
As per my information the army had agreed to all six points but talks broke down on moving the capital to Dacca. Mujib knew what that meant. That the army intended to bring a coup after things had simmered down and he was adamant that the capital be moved to Dacca, thus making it impossible for the Punjabi army to ever bring a coup again. When talks broke down the army decided to begin military action to start the war and deliberately let East Pakistan break away. They did this to consolidate their position in the west.
Listening him again 👍🏻
Lovely podcast, 46:20 here just 1 correction previous Interior Minister was not Ijaz ul Haz it was Ijaz Ahmed Shah...
A great interview 👍
"Despotism creates the circumstances of its own undermining. The information gets worse. The sycophants get greater in number. The corrective mechanisms become fewer. And the mistakes become much more consequential. " - Stephen Kotkin
Ustad daaman wrote beautiful heart wrenching poem on partition
brilliant..i love this guy...tarriq ali...the writer of the extreme centre
Can't thank you enough Shehzad. You're doing a great job ❤
It's history revisited. Great show
Excellent video. One gets the impression Pakistan suffers from an identity crisis. 75 years on they don't seem to have built a nation and exist as a loose union of ethnicities. The ensuing insecurity complex is making them adopt languages and cultures. Islam and India-hatred seem to be the factors that unite them. If that be the case lasting peace between India and Pakistan will be pipe dream as their establishment will not allow it.
Nikita Sergeyevich Khrushchev: " Its his life - or his revenge. There is no third choice " 1953
It would definitely considered to be a propaganda or shit by an old man, if id have been listening it before 9 April 2023 and 9th May... Great analysis and history lesson..
Please ! Bring him again as an Indian I want to ask some questions to him .!
Thank you for the lovely podcast TPE .
توهان جي مهرباني 🕉
Tremendous class 🙏🙏
Well done👍✌️
Common man of Pakistan 🇵🇰 India 🇮🇳 and Bangladesh 🇧🇩 should learn how to respect each other and should not follow footsteps of hate mongering politicians as this is what politicians do - divide and rule!
As Pakistani I admire tariq sir
Thanks Shikar pur for inter view of Tariq sb
The Sikh book Guru Granth Sahib is not in Punjabi (some sections are). Majorly, it is in sadhukkari/sadhu bhasha (a mixture of many North Indian dialects), which was commonly used by Bhakti saints. The script used is Gurmukhi. It also has compositions of bhagats who spoke other languages like Braj, Kaurvi, Sindhi etc.
It has poems by Kabir, in Awadhi, by Tukaram, Eknath and Jyaneswar, all in Marathi, in Urdu , and in Pahari, etc etc. Also it has writings by Guru Nanak, Guru Arjan Dev, etc, all in Punjabi.
The Left has left the power of political theory. There are as many hypotheses in present Pakistan as the number of leftists. This is the worst kind of problem with left in Pakistan. I do not claim that Lenin is the God of Revolution but still...what's the alternative? Postmodernism perhaps?
can we please have a time stamp on this one? @the pakistan experience
Why Z. A. Bhutto disagreed to handover power to Mujeeb? He was power hungry. He was a key catalyst to break Pakistan and separate East Pakistan.