Dragon Ball: Super Saiyan (A Prophecy Done Right) - Detail Diatribe

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  • čas přidán 13. 01. 2022
  • Pack your snacks and crank up the artificial gravity! Today we're diving into the progenitor of an entire genre of anime, the workout inspiration for an entire generation of anime fans, and the one thing it absolutely nailed in its first big arc!
    Our content is intended for teenage audiences and up.
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Komentáře • 5K

  • @Nofixdahdress
    @Nofixdahdress Před 2 lety +7273

    "Most people don't remember Nappa, he's not that important."
    Lies, Nappa was the most fleshed out and fully realized character in all of Dragon Ball. He had a degree in child psychology with a minor in pain, had an interest in entomology and insect reproduction habits, enjoyed playing Pokemon, and after the events of the Namek Saga went on to become a successful movie producer.
    i may have watched too much DBZA

    • @ssfbob456
      @ssfbob456 Před 2 lety +235

      Shut up Nail.

    • @markberghel275
      @markberghel275 Před 2 lety +498

      There is no such thing as "watched too much DBZA".

    • @thomasbukowski2526
      @thomasbukowski2526 Před 2 lety +524

      You forgot his modeling career, forever ruined by krilin

    • @alLEDP
      @alLEDP Před 2 lety +106

      I only say MUSTACHE!!!!!

    • @sergiodasilva6505
      @sergiodasilva6505 Před 2 lety +120

      Overly Sarcastic Productions should do a video about DBZ parody

  • @andrewrichbell
    @andrewrichbell Před 2 lety +5305

    The "pure heart awakened by fury" is basically "a good man gone to war" trope which sounds like an excellent topic for a trope talk.

    • @adrianrocha49
      @adrianrocha49 Před 2 lety +390

      "Demons Run, when a good man goes to war."

    • @Mr_G.
      @Mr_G. Před 2 lety +213

      Night will fall and drown the sun, when a good man goes to war.

    • @adrianrocha49
      @adrianrocha49 Před 2 lety +90

      @@Mr_G. Exactly! The 11th Doctor is a bad ass and personally, my favorite Dr.

    • @gamercore5216
      @gamercore5216 Před 2 lety +20

      Alvin York

    • @MegaMan-bs3oy
      @MegaMan-bs3oy Před 2 lety +133

      Well what is cool to me is that EACH of them get it by letting their struggles go. GOKU gets angry. Vegeta lets go and doesn't care anymore. Gohan lets it all go and stops holding it in. I think that itself is an important message. We ALL want to get over that hump that we know is stopping us from reaching our true potential inside ourselves.

  • @clericofchaos1
    @clericofchaos1 Před 2 lety +1094

    Red: "Most people don't remember Nappa, he's not that important."
    Nappa: "I am hilarious and you will quote everything i say."

    • @shotq8070
      @shotq8070 Před 2 lety +61

      "Are We there yet?"

    • @clericofchaos1
      @clericofchaos1 Před 2 lety +76

      @@shotq8070 "Vegeta...Vegeeeta...I'm haunting you!"

    • @mrernseatthesnickers6839
      @mrernseatthesnickers6839 Před 2 lety +38

      Nappa: you fell down the stairs
      Vegeta: I fell down the stairs...

    • @clericofchaos1
      @clericofchaos1 Před 2 lety +45

      @@mrernseatthesnickers6839 Nappa: "Hey, i'm Nappa and this is vegeta. He was a prison"
      Vegeta: "Don't say it Nappa!"
      Nappa: "...bitch"

    • @timothymclean
      @timothymclean Před 2 lety +41

      Let's face it, DBZA is different from DBZ in a lot of ways-and one of the biggest is which characters are memorable.

  • @euansmith3699
    @euansmith3699 Před 2 lety +1087

    Regarding "Everyone is Super Saiyan Now"; I'm reminded of the 4-minute mile. It was long supposed to be impossible. However, once Roger Bannister showed it could be done, it became a realist target for top middle-distance runners.

    • @thomasffrench3639
      @thomasffrench3639 Před 2 lety +224

      Yep, this is Dragon Ball in a nutshell. Once some breaks a limit, then that limit becomes a common feat. It makes a lot of sense. But it does become ridiculous with how many more transformations there are. I only just finished the Cell saga and Dragon Ball is starting to lose its tactical fighting.

    • @josephineparsons78
      @josephineparsons78 Před rokem +72

      @@thomasffrench3639 yeah power creep in dragon ball is a very famous issue, I do think it starts to get addressed ish? In super

    • @nnaauujjddaa
      @nnaauujjddaa Před rokem +71

      @@josephineparsons78 Not really? Beerus made a big deal of super saiyan god but by the end everybody and their mother could fight at super saiyan god level, which i find ridiculous bit well that dragon ball for you.

    • @MigattenoBlakae
      @MigattenoBlakae Před rokem +25

      @@thomasffrench3639 Tactical fighting does come back a little bit in DBS, but it’s not super focal.
      However, DBS: Super Hero is a decent example of tactical fighting coming back. It’s not amazing or anything, but each character in the movie is obviously working towards a goal and not just rushing headstrong into the fight, but instead thinking about what role they need to fill for the team. I won’t spoil anything more about it, I just think you’d enjoy it if you want more tactical-ish fighting.

    • @jagnestormskull3178
      @jagnestormskull3178 Před rokem +18

      @@thomasffrench3639 The tactical fighting comes back a bit in Super, especially during the Universe 6 vs Universe 7 Tournament Arc, and really any other episodes involving the Time-Skipping assassin Hit. Roshi's Tournament of Power fights were also great examples of tactical fighting in a fantasy world.

  • @___i3ambi126
    @___i3ambi126 Před 2 lety +3184

    I am disappointed. I wanted a whole hour of Red talking about DBZ. Now we will forever be 4 seconds short.

    • @Pablo360able
      @Pablo360able Před 2 lety +244

      Just click over to the 4 seconds where she touches on this in the Superpowered Evil Side episode of Trope Talks.

    • @ShadeSlayer1911
      @ShadeSlayer1911 Před 2 lety +76

      4 is the death number in Chinese. That mean bad luck. Coincidence? I think not.

    • @josephdavis9234
      @josephdavis9234 Před 2 lety +90

      This is DBZ. Four seconds is a while.

    • @1224chrisng
      @1224chrisng Před 2 lety +28

      at least we'll have 4 more episodes then

    • @eclipserepeater2466
      @eclipserepeater2466 Před 2 lety +12

      It's longer if you pause to read the slides! :D

  • @couragew6260
    @couragew6260 Před 2 lety +2863

    The best part is everything weird on DBZ’s earth can easily be explained by the Dragon Balls themselves. Someone wishing real animal people were a thing, someone wishing for dinosaurs to be revived, etc.

    • @johnnygyro2295
      @johnnygyro2295 Před 2 lety +478

      As cool as that theory is, the animal people thing was mostly explained/retconned in the Kakarot game as the result of Animorphaline. It was a drug that could temporarily turn people into beastmen/animal people and was a popular trend when Goku and Bulma were younger but, by the time of Z, it died down in popularity.
      It also turned out the Red Ribbon Army gained a good chunk of their funds by selling their own version of the drug, but it was apparently an extra strength version since one side quest you do is trying to help two guys who used the drug turn back to normal.

    • @nok4799
      @nok4799 Před 2 lety +108

      @@johnnygyro2295 that's cool lore!

    • @sinisternorimaki
      @sinisternorimaki Před 2 lety +118

      @@johnnygyro2295 I prefer to assume that there was a containment breach in Penguin Village.

    • @luckyloser1946
      @luckyloser1946 Před 2 lety +91

      @@johnnygyro2295 Wasn't oolong, puar, and that one dog person (pilaf's henchman), and that one rabbit goku just put in the moon born as animal ppl?? Wouldn't that mean Animorphaline has been around for quite a long time?

    • @luckyloser1946
      @luckyloser1946 Před 2 lety +25

      Also my theory is that someone wished animal chicks were real ;)

  • @ShadowBlade972
    @ShadowBlade972 Před 2 lety +2744

    "People don't wish for immortality cause that would be game breaking."
    I can hear Garlic Jr. screaming bullshit in the Dead Zone from here.

    • @GZilla311
      @GZilla311 Před 2 lety +195

      I mean... him being in the Dead Zone is his own fault. The ONE thing that would be worse for him than for anyone else. NOTHING else they knew of at the time would have finished him.

    • @treasuremage7546
      @treasuremage7546 Před 2 lety +114

      Canon: Garlic who?

    • @BassMeisterable
      @BassMeisterable Před 2 lety +12

      @@GZilla311 Throw him into space or into the sun XD
      Edit: Oh, Mafuba!

    • @jasper265
      @jasper265 Před 2 lety +40

      @@treasuremage7546 just the bad guy from the filler that was better than much of the canon 😉

    • @8-bitsarda747
      @8-bitsarda747 Před 2 lety +73

      sorry, I can't hear you over the sound of Kars' thoughts stopping

  • @shadowstriker6506
    @shadowstriker6506 Před rokem +112

    "they were setting [Piccolo] up yo be a Vegeta-type villain, and then they introduced Vegeta." is such a great sentence

    • @thomaswhite5122
      @thomaswhite5122 Před měsícem

      And "goku is winded and says 'that last attack has me spent I must end this quickly' then he doesn't"

  • @MrFootballFan55
    @MrFootballFan55 Před 2 lety +3555

    I appreciate Red's blunt honesty. "Or... Finally an excuse to make a sideshow about DBZ".

    • @AxxLAfriku
      @AxxLAfriku Před 2 lety +3

      GAGAGAGAGA I just disliked my own face because I am unpretty. HOWEVER: I always like my GOOD videos however. No dislikes allowed where I come from. Don't be mean, dear m

    • @Lol8922
      @Lol8922 Před 2 lety +116

      @@AxxLAfriku Sir, this is a Wendy's.

    • @Obi-Wan_Kenobi
      @Obi-Wan_Kenobi Před 2 lety +29

      "Finally! A good excuse to have Krillin punched in the face!"

    • @MrFootballFan55
      @MrFootballFan55 Před 2 lety +18

      @@Obi-Wan_Kenobi Hello there.

    • @nestorgamer9746
      @nestorgamer9746 Před 2 lety +16

      @@Obi-Wan_Kenobi GENERAL KENOBI

  • @DakoGuyver
    @DakoGuyver Před 2 lety +1338

    Red talking about Vegeta: "He develops a bit of a complex about this."
    That's an understatement right there XD

    • @zenmastermtl
      @zenmastermtl Před 2 lety +67

      Oh ya think? I'd call it more of a "decades spanning obsession"

    • @avatarofaiyel
      @avatarofaiyel Před 2 lety +106

      Honestly, the best part is when this culminates in the buu saga with him realizing that Goten and Trunks can go SS and being all like "this mythological, superpower legend is now a child's plaything" and having a bit of a midlife crisis about it.

    • @blademaker9843
      @blademaker9843 Před 2 lety +65

      HOW MANY PUSH UPS DID HE DO? HOW MANY SIT UPS? WHAT KIND OF JUICE DID HE DRINK?!?!

    • @dac314
      @dac314 Před 2 lety +24

      Goku. Button.

    • @absolutelynotgriffith1954
      @absolutelynotgriffith1954 Před 2 lety +30

      I WANNA BE A SUPER SAIYAN, I WANNA, I WANNAIWANNAIWANNA

  • @Kaijugan
    @Kaijugan Před rokem +829

    Crazy thing is, Goku typically always starts off his fights using only martial arts. He only slowly slides into the Saiyan form of brawling later in most fights or if he needs to change things up. At his core, he is a martial artist, not a Saiyan warrior.

    • @eonnephilim852
      @eonnephilim852 Před rokem +59

      Something that the DBS manga does amazingly, IMO. Ultra Instinct is also the most fitting for him

    • @cccbbbccc5910
      @cccbbbccc5910 Před rokem +22

      @@eonnephilim852 ... until it turned into another powerup

    • @totoranger01
      @totoranger01 Před rokem +36

      The thing is that in the manga they acknowledge that he treats it like a power up and that he won't be able to truly master it until he can use it in his natural state

    • @impartialthrone2097
      @impartialthrone2097 Před 10 měsíci +8

      ​@@cccbbbccc5910doesn't Ultra Instinct just get stronger with every attack the user evades or deflects? So it kinda rewards Goku's use of martial arts, whereas Ultra Ego gets stronger the more damage the user takes, rewarding Vegeta's brawler fighting style?

    • @Williamjacob7789
      @Williamjacob7789 Před 10 měsíci +4

      @@impartialthrone2097It doesn’t get stronger.

  • @BitVyper
    @BitVyper Před 2 lety +697

    The thing to understand about Toriyama is that he's a born serial author. He doesn't plan ahead, but what he's very very good at is throwing a whole lot of details out and then picking and choosing which ones he wants to bring together to make the next chapter satisfying. He's dancing, not marching. The android and cell arcs are really interesting to examine for this very reason because when you know what was going on in the background (Toriyama getting playfully bullied by his editors to keep changing villains), you see that there was just no rhyme or reason to that whole set of arcs, and yet what do we get? It starts with the ghosts of Goku's past, things that can at least be loosely attributed to his deeds coming back to haunt the world, fatherhood and passing generations as a theme with Trunks, Gohan (compare and contrast), and all of Dr. Gero's creations (basically brainwashed to carry on his grudges). And so Cell is this melting pot of all the previous generation's abilities, and he wants to get stronger just like them. He's a monster made out of everything that they are, so they can't beat him and Goku becomes cognizant of this leading into Gohan, who doesn't want to fight at all, having to be The One True Foil to Cell. Solid indicator for all of this being intentional too is that Goku stops doing the hurt-yourself training, and basically just says it's self destructive. He knows the old tricks aren't going to work because Cell has them all.
    All with basically zero planning. Toriyama just throws a ton of stuff at the wall and assembles the pieces he likes chapter by chapter, and it all works out because he has a good instinct for theming.
    As an aside, I like the fact that Goku doesn't get that Gohan doesn't like fighting because it shows that Goku was really pitching over the horizon. He knew Gohan was the one to do it, sensed a sleeping power, understood that there was something different there, but he didn't know what made Gohan different or why.

    • @Bacxaber
      @Bacxaber Před rokem +1

      Or Goku is just a selfish idiot.

    • @hellocentral5551
      @hellocentral5551 Před rokem +12

      This is... Really well thought out. Wait, then what was up with the Buu arc? I always here that was completely nonsensical and all over the place. Was it just Toriyama at his worst, or is there something of which I am unaware.

    • @dyppityjoop5912
      @dyppityjoop5912 Před rokem +42

      @@hellocentral5551 Actually Cell Arc was supposed to lead into Gohan being the main character for the rest of the manga and Goku was supposed to remain dead, but then editors reactions and fan reception towards Gohan as MC was less then stellar since many people still liked Goku and wanted him to be MC, so Toriyama was forced to change back to Goku as MC and scrap Gohan whole thematics of passing on the torch and stuff which retroactively made the Cell Saga kind lose its punch and made it become sorta pointless in my opinion. Meanwhile the powerscaling of DBZ had gotten uncontrollable and turned into exponential powercreep, since Cell was so absuredly powerful and DBZ at that point had turned from technique vs talent into just raw strength vs raw strength because that was what worked for the Cell saga and what audiences reportedly liked, so that forced Toriyama to stretch the scale of the story to just bloated proportions and so he created Buu and the Supreme Kai and this culminated into just a mediocre plotline that wasn't necessarily bad but had just twisted into itself and became winding and not very fun tbh.

    • @dankwaifu2093
      @dankwaifu2093 Před rokem +41

      @@dyppityjoop5912 Toriyama wasn't forced to drop Gohan and bring Goku back. That's just a dumb myth. He's been quoted saying, "I intended to put Gohan into the leading role. It didn’t work out. I felt that compared to Goku, he was ultimately not suited for the part." ... "Drawing Gohan’s daily life made me gradually realize he likes studying more than fighting." Toriyama, on his own, realized that Gohan would hate being the main character of a fighting series, that following Gohan's battles wouldn't be fun because Gohan doesn't have the personality to keep the story fun, not when it comes to serious fights.

    • @josimiel696
      @josimiel696 Před 11 měsíci +13

      ​@@hellocentral5551Toriyama seems to work best with an editor over his shoulder. Towards the end of the Android/Cell Saga Toriyama got a new editor that was more hands off than the previous 2 he had. This means that the Buu Saga is the one were he had the most free reign out of Z's stories. As expected from someone who originally started out as a gag artist/writer and famously writes by the seat of his pants, the arc with minimal editorial interference got a lighter tone and tended to jump from idea to idea.
      That isn't to say it's all bad, though. The Buu arc still manages to pull off iconic moments and memorable fights. But the overall plot is probably the weakest of all of Z's arcs due to Toriyama just kinda changing focus on a whim. Like wanting Gohan to be the protagonist, to changing back to Goku, but then still bringing Gohan in as the focus during Super Buu for some reason, only to change back to Goku and Vegeta for the finale.

  • @matt0044
    @matt0044 Před 2 lety +1841

    It's intriguing since Akira Toriyama has gone on record that he writes by the seat of his pants yet managed to make a good payoff to Vegeta's posturing about being the legendary warrior. I feel like there's a Trope Talk in this style of writing, the ups and downs.

    • @jbark678
      @jbark678 Před 2 lety +75

      Especially considering how ubiquitous it is in Shounen.

    • @bradleymay5350
      @bradleymay5350 Před 2 lety +153

      That's a really intriguing topic. I remember one author giving advice about how to work through writers block, commenting that "the unwritten page has a basilisks stare." But he broke it down really systematically. Go with three arc storyline, inciting incident, rising action, climax and so forth. Go for 5000 word chapters. If, in this chapter, you plan to get the character from point A to point B, create a rough outline. All of it seems very restrictive and uncreative, but it's sometimes liberating to have a set of rules to then bend or break.
      But yeah, counter that with Toriyama's (and as Jordan pointed out, most shounen authors) necessary strategy of "I only have seven days to produce a new chapter. I've been on this weekly grind for the last ten years and honestly? We're going with first draft ideas at this point." Very different writing strategies.

    • @UnreasonableOpinions
      @UnreasonableOpinions Před 2 lety +28

      In cases where it's the author's choice and they have all the time they need, the benefit of writing like this is that you can concentrate on making strong characters since you don't need to have a plan for the plot to develop your characters. You also get to have more natural progression of plot events and character responses to them, since you are somewhat letting the characters drive. Naturally, the weakness is that if you realise you need a certain event or outcome you often have to force it inelegantly, and you have a much harder time creating grand or sweeping plots. You also have to spend all the time you theoretically saved on outlining on extra drafting, since you often have to tune or even rewrite early chapters based on later ones, since you had no idea what they were going to be.
      And, yeah, this doesn't apply to most Shounen writers, or people writing for weeklies in general. There you get barely enough time to first draft a script and throw it at the ink team, so you get all of the downsides without any upside.

    • @Obi-Wan_Kenobi
      @Obi-Wan_Kenobi Před 2 lety +47

      At the end of the day, I think Toriyama got lucky with how good the Saiyan and Freeza arcs were. Writing by the seat of your pants is really risky because things can so easily go off the rails, become unsatisfying or become illogical.
      Like credit where credit is due, it requires great skill to write/draw fast and make sure everything lines up, which Toriyama did achieve with this arc, but other DB arcs, particular the Buu arc, really highlight the weakness of writing without a plan. And while the the Saiyan and Freeza arcs happened to be great, who is to say they wouldn't have been just as good if not greater if Toriyama had the time to plan them out?
      I really feel like nothing is gained by writing by the seat of our pants that couldn't be accomplished better when planning things out Well, nothing except meeting strict publishing deadlines which I am sure Toriyama must have been under. But at best writing fast results in happy coincidences, not meticulous and deliberately great stories. And I think the success rate is clear as to whether improving stories or planning them out is better. So few great tv shows, books, movies etc were created without a plan while the vast majority always had a general plan.

    • @ducky36F
      @ducky36F Před 2 lety +21

      @@Obi-Wan_Kenobi I know you aren’t trying to take anything away from it but I don’t think it’s quite fair to attribute it entirely on luck, Dragon Ball was already a hit in Japan at that point and still took over western audiences even with the atrocious anime dub. There is some luck in basically everything but it takes skill work under the pressure he was under and still come up with the goods. Cell and Buu went down hill but I don’t think that quite proves he was lucky, Freeza really feels like that natural end of Goku’s story and you have to wonder if he would have continued without the pressure to do so. And really Cell still had enough high points most people still have fond memories of it even with some of the weaker writing. Basically I think the Sayain and Namek arcs were more than luck, have enough that carried between the two that he had some idea where he was headed (even if it seems Super Sayain may have originally been a joke) and I think producing what he did, the way he did still takes a lot of expertise in his craft. Could it have been better given more time to plan? Possibly, but we’ll never know for sure and it wasn’t really an option for him at that point.

  • @jaredhall5169
    @jaredhall5169 Před 2 lety +3865

    Ironically-- Making Dragon Ball Z into a funny abridged show is more in keeping with the original spirit of Dragonball.

    • @kereminde
      @kereminde Před 2 lety +553

      I think the part I liked the most was despite it totally satirizing the original piece, it also distilled a lot of the essence of the characters down without really changing them. A bit more snarky in places, but almost all the characters are recognizable as... well, the original characters.

    • @gratuitouslurking8610
      @gratuitouslurking8610 Před 2 lety +370

      @@kereminde Also sometimes arguably doing some of the characters better, especially the later Cell arc episodes where a lot of the side-action prattle actually was character development the show itself would usually gloss over.

    • @GlitchToph
      @GlitchToph Před 2 lety +262

      Hard agree. For me, the Abridged Android/Cell saga is superior to the manga/anime original, if only for the better balance between comedy and seriousness (along with some story fixes thanks to the benefit of hindsight). It just feels better to watch.

    • @razkable
      @razkable Před 2 lety +44

      Db is funny and z can be...I don't like the tone of z. It's way too serious and boring...look at the rocky mountain plains of where vegeta and goku fight...it's so boring to look at same for their rematch...namek is so boring of a setting...they fight 20 in a really boring setting I like 20's hideout and area where they have to find him and the road vegeta loses to 18 on and the island city hopping cell does where 17 fights piccolo on that volcano Island and the cell games occur in the same spot as the other plains battle aka in og db with king piccolo albeit with a little variety with the arena at least...boo takes us more to the sky and supreme kai world which is awesome but I hate how like namek it's very plain and since no one lived on it its empty but somehow has the z sword and kais and a witch in the past and they have earrings and there's comics...smdh...and mountain ranges somehow...fat boo fights us in the dessert too which sucks ass

    • @kereminde
      @kereminde Před 2 lety +53

      @@gratuitouslurking8610 And, similarly, was building off things TFS had been saying earlier so... bringing old references back to the forefront as part of their final arc.

  • @zacharychristy8928
    @zacharychristy8928 Před 2 lety +2491

    This moment was immortalized for me by the TFS abridged version.
    "Im going to break you."
    "What?!"
    "Like a kit-kat bar..."
    "...WHAT?!"

    • @jessicajayes8326
      @jessicajayes8326 Před 2 lety +110

      Goku time!

    • @jaydenbuchanan8083
      @jaydenbuchanan8083 Před 2 lety +131

      'Hungry?"
      "What?"
      "Grab a snickers."

    • @KaiTenSatsuma
      @KaiTenSatsuma Před 2 lety +197

      *_THAT'S RIGHT FREIZA, YOU ARE NO LONGER DEALING WITH THE AVERAGE SAIYAN WARRIOR ANYMORE_*
      Oh, _Here we go..._

    • @Tomha
      @Tomha Před 2 lety +115

      "Not going anywhere for awhile? Grab a Snickers!" - Goku
      "I...can't help but feel that we're both missing some context here." - Cooler

    • @lordhighkage7105
      @lordhighkage7105 Před 2 lety +45

      *gets hit*
      "...WHAT?!"

  • @danielquinlan2457
    @danielquinlan2457 Před 2 lety +138

    I want to call attention to something about the Super Saiyan transformation that I hardly see anyone talk about. When Goku becomes a Super Saiyan, his personality becomes far more hostile and belligerent, aka more traditionally Saiyan-like. So, I find it interesting that the same transformation just so happens to change Goku's physical appearance to more closely resemble the character who most represents the Saiyan race as a whole: Vegeta. His hair stands straight up and the the design of his eyes changes from the normal open circles to the closed-off, fully outlined glare that characterizes a lot of villainous Dragon Ball characters, including Vegeta. In short, Super Saiyan Goku more or less looks like a tall, blond Vegeta with bangs.
    Likewise, it's a funny coincidence that for Vegeta, for whome Super Saiyan is only a slight exaggeration of his default personality, has the _least_ extreme change in appearance out of anyone. He already has the evil eyes and hair that stands straight up, so Super Saiyan is literally just a palette swap. Just an interesting bit of (probably unintentional) thematic, visual story-telling that I don't see discussed very often.

    • @naisagathefirstdestronmand8559
      @naisagathefirstdestronmand8559 Před 10 měsíci +7

      I do find that very intersting. Yet also equally as interesting as the fact that Goku actually gains pupils in super saiyan, (techincally he gains iris', but you get my point). Something that is usually done to make a character more empathetic.

  • @Rekuzan
    @Rekuzan Před 2 lety +2112

    Piccolo Jr's backstory actually IS brought up once during the Cell saga (briefly), right before Piccolo and Kame fuse into a super Namekian.

    • @josh-oo
      @josh-oo Před 2 lety +153

      It's also brought up in the Namek Saga while they're trying to figure out how to get to Namek. They talk about when Piccolo Jr fought a disguised Kame at the World Martial Arts Tournament and spoke an alien language, and that's how they remember that Piccolo and Kame are aliens and therefore Kame must have a spaceship.

    • @QuakerMC
      @QuakerMC Před 2 lety +96

      That was the most disappointing transformation in the show for me. They actually set up how powerful Piccolo and Kami fusing would be in the Namek saga, which on top of them originally being the same person, had me really looking forward to this fusion happening. Then Piccolo kinda does it on a whim and it just allows him to briefly be on the same level as one of the secondary antagonists at that point

    • @Maia_Cyclist
      @Maia_Cyclist Před 2 lety +27

      @@QuakerMC he was the strongest z fighter at the time

    • @QuakerMC
      @QuakerMC Před 2 lety +58

      @@Maia_Cyclist For like an episode. This foreshadowed return of his true form couldn't stand up to the main villain and was immediately surpassed by every Saiyan

    • @1234andrewjacksmith
      @1234andrewjacksmith Před 2 lety +13

      kind of the problem of scaling bad guys and the new ones being way way way stronger than the old ones since well Piccolo is kind of stronger than Friezza(and super sayians) which would have before gero went SCIENCE(the fact he can just make things that can either scale infinity or never run out of juice is just insane let alone how almost all of them are basically the strongest mortals at the time) mode and bulit said bulishit fighters made him like 3nd strongest being that can act freely in the universe if not a bit higher(2nd or 1st if you don't count any one with god powers)
      the 2nd or first is I think moro had his powers removed so he would of been weaker and well buu is sealed(and has god ki now embed into him on a deep level) and the other is Beerus(also he get knocked down a peg if you count people who are forced to remain neturel because Weiss

  • @scotcurran8282
    @scotcurran8282 Před 2 lety +680

    "Maybe if we kick Frieza in the nuts we can beat him"
    The true horror of Frieza's final form: The reveal that he has no nuts.

    • @s4ug4t51
      @s4ug4t51 Před 2 lety +37

      They don't want you to know to this but *it's his tail*

    • @johnnygyro2295
      @johnnygyro2295 Před 2 lety +56

      @@s4ug4t51
      And with that, Goku biting said tail becomes more disturbing. Thanks for that horrible mental image...

    • @MrFelblood
      @MrFelblood Před 2 lety +16

      He has transcended all weaknesses

    • @ashikjaman1940
      @ashikjaman1940 Před 2 lety +4

      I wonder how Frieza's species reproduces

    • @s4ug4t51
      @s4ug4t51 Před 2 lety +13

      @@ashikjaman1940 Ignoring my reply in this comment, probably like the namekians

  • @connormcguire484
    @connormcguire484 Před 2 lety +858

    Every time Red says “that’s right... FRIEZA!” I can still picture vegeta’s stupid shit eating grin - the one which precedes existential panic after abject failure.
    Fucking champion video my dudes.

    • @luigiboi4244
      @luigiboi4244 Před rokem +26

      I blame Team4Star for this programming.

    • @lancetheking7524
      @lancetheking7524 Před rokem +23

      @@luigiboi4244 I praise them for that programing

    • @ipodwraith
      @ipodwraith Před rokem +1

      👹NIGHTMARE👹NIGHTMARE👹NIGHTMARE

  • @henrichvonruben9114
    @henrichvonruben9114 Před 2 lety +1554

    the part about Goku's face after he "kills" Frieza, wasn't because he felt bad about killing him, it was that he gave Frieza multiple chances to admit defeat and that he was wrong and should change his ways, just as he essentially done with Yamcha, Tien, even Krillin if you want to get technical, even Piccolo and eventually Vegeta turned good and Frieza chose to try and kill him even after all that. It wasn't that Goku felt bad about killing Frieza it was that he felt bad that there were people like Frieza, Goku's always given almost everyone second chances minus Tambourine and King Piccolo, and after all the second chances he gave Frieza, Frieza still only wanted to kill him and rule the Universe

    • @motorcitymangababe
      @motorcitymangababe Před 2 lety +193

      Yeah, it must have sucked to realize that while you can always kick a bad guys ass you cant change who they are and some people are not good deep down. Its an antithesis to what goku stands bym

    • @Sorain1
      @Sorain1 Před 2 lety +129

      I'm with you on this. It's pretty clear to me the intention was that Goku was upset because here was someone who could choose to be better, like so many he'd met. Only, like King Piccolo, he chooses to be a petty evil tyrant. For anyone, having a chance at redemption thrown back in their face stings. For someone like Goku, it's an especially bitter pill to swallow.

    • @quandarioustoddricioushorn9292
      @quandarioustoddricioushorn9292 Před 2 lety +68

      @@Sorain1 tbf. Goku proabably thinks that he managed to change king piccolo (since Piccolo jr. Was the reincarnation of king piccolo and he changed)

    • @GGMCUKAGAIN
      @GGMCUKAGAIN Před 2 lety +47

      Well that's the beauty of art and literature, that's your subtly different interpretation on a single cell in a story. there's no wrong answer, we all read the emotion but its cause is gonna hit differently for different people.

    • @lordfelidae4505
      @lordfelidae4505 Před 2 lety +23

      It was frustration. ‘Why did I even try?’

  • @Deathnotefan97
    @Deathnotefan97 Před 2 lety +1798

    On the "there are usually only a small plot specific number of Senzu beans around"
    When they were first established in Dragonball, there were literally several medium sized pots full of them, easily a couple thousand beans all together
    One of Goku's friends (Yajirobe) didn't listen when he was told that a single bean serves as 10 days worth of food, and ate several handfuls
    After he hilariously expanded from eating like a years worth of food all at once, Yajirobe, just a few hours later, was hungry again
    It's never explicitly stated, but Yajirobe is the reason there are only like 12 beans at any given time, he eats all the others (as from that moment forward he lives on the tower where Korin, the cat who grows the beans, lives)

    • @effigytormented
      @effigytormented Před 2 lety +288

      He was the only one back in the day who could rival Goku's appetite.

    • @JGuraan
      @JGuraan Před 2 lety +202

      Good ol' Bean Daddy

    • @marybarnes6407
      @marybarnes6407 Před 2 lety +93

      I didn't know that. I just thought it took a long time to grow them and they only grew a small amount at a time.

    • @pwnorbepwned
      @pwnorbepwned Před 2 lety +184

      “Do you know what an all-Senzu diet does to a man?”
      “What?!”
      “Korin likes it.”

    • @Selverna
      @Selverna Před 2 lety +57

      @@pwnorbepwned Huh... now that line makes sense to me with this explanation.

  • @AFreakingAxeCH
    @AFreakingAxeCH Před 2 lety +1045

    Its just funny how Red narrates things feels like how the series went down in DBZ abridged instead of the actual original anime cut

    • @Tangly
      @Tangly Před 2 lety +110

      There would be a lot more Nappa though

    • @scottwerner279
      @scottwerner279 Před 2 lety +99

      At this point abridged is more ingrained in my memory than the og

    • @Pokemonleafmon
      @Pokemonleafmon Před 2 lety +47

      @Casey Hall Hilariously derailing one-liner

    • @Pokemonleafmon
      @Pokemonleafmon Před 2 lety +23

      @Casey Hall Oh shoot. I didn't realize you forgot one, I just felt like saying "hilariously derailing one-liner"

    • @sleazymeezy
      @sleazymeezy Před 2 lety +15

      @@Pokemonleafmon I am hilarious and you will quote everything I say

  • @BoomTheGuardian
    @BoomTheGuardian Před 2 lety +946

    To its credit, SS4 from GT actually has a pretty cool thematic hook that sets it apart from the other Super Sayain Upgrades, and it actually takes the big monkey plot point full circle to tie it back into what sayains are about. It's a transformation that requires a sayain to directly confront and reconcile with the broiling font of insatiable violence lurking just beneath the surface of their personality. You could argue they don't explore that angle to its fullest potential, but conceptually I think it's a pretty cool idea

    • @imaniwashington6341
      @imaniwashington6341 Před 2 lety +152

      So i personally really like the idea of SSJ4 being the "true" legendary SSJ because of how primal it is. It feels like the thing vegeta described in the legend and has the added thematic of man and beast merging to become stronger than both. Also its the only damn time their aura and energy beams match color, I cant tell you how frustrating it is to see a golden aurad person fire a blue laser thats made from the same energy source

    • @youtubeneedstochange4414
      @youtubeneedstochange4414 Před 2 lety +106

      Super Saiyan 4 was EASILY the best thing about Dragon Ball GT. If it had never existed, I don't think that series would still be remembered today.

    • @ashikjaman1940
      @ashikjaman1940 Před 2 lety +1

      Big red monkey man

    • @TheFirstRamenKamen
      @TheFirstRamenKamen Před 2 lety +8

      The new Broly pretty much is just that.

    • @wynoglia
      @wynoglia Před 2 lety +4

      Ss4 is da shizz

  • @ghostaccountlmao
    @ghostaccountlmao Před 2 lety +384

    44:25 I never thought Goku regretted killing Frieza. I always thought Goku felt true pity for him, because unlike Yamcha, Krillin, Tien, Demon King Piccolo, and to varying extent Vegeta, Goku couldn't level with Frieza on an emotional, humane level. The "you fool" is more like Goku coming to terms with Frieza's character and his disposition, and it saddens him.

    • @toxicdemon1315
      @toxicdemon1315 Před 6 měsíci +2

      I think it's regret because he truly never wanted to kill Frieza. Killing for him was something of a last resort, something he never wished to do unless it was absolutely necessary and he had no other option. He thought Freiza was a good opponent, another way of pushing himself to get better, and killing Frieza was the LAST thing he wanted, much like with Vegeta

  • @ZchibizroxZ
    @ZchibizroxZ Před 2 lety +1605

    The way you've captured how strange the beginning of DBZ was without the context of DB was spot on, I remember watching it as a child without DB & just wondering what the hell is happening the entire time, but having fun regardless.

    • @scottwerner279
      @scottwerner279 Před 2 lety +62

      Agreed, it was so weird as a kid since DB felt like a prequel that was added on. Not sure the actual time table, but I remember watching the announcement for DB as a kid after we were like into the androids arc or farther

    • @zombyninja2576
      @zombyninja2576 Před 2 lety +20

      Yeah I didn't know the plot until I rewatched it in college haha. Fun to watch them fight tho

    • @josephcarpenter1452
      @josephcarpenter1452 Před 2 lety +11

      I thought I missed some episodes 😂

    • @ratoh1710
      @ratoh1710 Před 2 lety +47

      "Wait, what's going on here? I am so confused!"
      *Cool martial arts and superpowers*
      "Wait, what was I thinking? Couldn't have been important. Oooh shiny lasers!"

    • @RedCloudfield
      @RedCloudfield Před 2 lety +17

      to me is interesting seeing in the comments how many people had this experience, it may be because i'm on the younger side (20) but in latinamerica they transmited dubbed versions of both DB and DBZ so i was already familiar with the characters and the overall story, i vividly remember watching DB every day on a national chanel called etceteraTV as a young child

  • @Rekuzan
    @Rekuzan Před 2 lety +446

    Fun Fact: Akira Toriyama, at the height of his Manga career, was basically a functional drunk. He would routinely spend 3-4 days out of a 7 day work week and rewatching old Jackie Chan movies frame by frame, modeling his fighting poses around it. tl;dr = It's why the action scenes are so good, and he STILL made his deadlines!

    • @idktbh5791
      @idktbh5791 Před 2 lety +32

      what a legend

    • @weirdofromhalo
      @weirdofromhalo Před 2 lety +53

      That explains why the original Dragon Ball has such good fight scenes. Shame it didn't last.

    • @ShaimingLong
      @ShaimingLong Před 2 lety +27

      @@weirdofromhalo Which in turn reminds me of the huge amount of hope I had with Ultra Instinct, looking like it would bring some cool choreography and a bit of actual martial arts back into the series, only for it to end up falling back on the same style of fight animation they usually do.

    • @Kleebo
      @Kleebo Před 2 lety

      Interesting

    • @Healermain15
      @Healermain15 Před 2 lety +8

      @@weirdofromhalo I'm not suprised it tapered off, since that lifestyle sounds completely unsustainable in the long run.

  • @hiropisku1078
    @hiropisku1078 Před 2 lety +649

    I feel that Vegeta just thought with each power boost, he'd magically become a Super Saiyan if he just shouted it out loud enough.
    I mean, the plan sort of worked in the next arc.

    • @Doggo761
      @Doggo761 Před 2 lety +72

      “I need you to ALMOST kill me.”
      “What?”
      Quote TFS

    • @captianbacon
      @captianbacon Před 2 lety +42

      well you also have to be pure of heart. and vegetas heart is pure, pure unadulterated badass

    • @user-pj1ec5om5g
      @user-pj1ec5om5g Před 2 lety +45

      @@captianbacon more like pure unadulterated ego

    • @coltonwilliams4153
      @coltonwilliams4153 Před 2 lety +25

      @@user-pj1ec5om5g I heard that Triclops!

    • @jamesavis1
      @jamesavis1 Před 2 lety +34

      I wanna be a Super Saiyan! I wanna! I wanna! I wanna! - DBZA Vegeta

  • @Richiedoesmc
    @Richiedoesmc Před 2 lety +635

    You forgot one of the most important details Vegeta slowly dying and reveling to everyone that Freiza blew up the sayian homeworld and genocided their species for a prophecy that may not even come true. While crying showing everyone Freiza truly broke him and if things were different maybe he could’ve been a good guy.

    • @jessicajayes8326
      @jessicajayes8326 Před 2 lety +147

      Goku: Oh I get it. If it weren't for Freezer, you wouldn't be...
      Vegeta: Dying?
      Goku: I was gonna say evil.
      Vegeta: Oh no, I'd definantly still be evil.

    • @Vapor817
      @Vapor817 Před 2 lety +47

      yeah that last part is 90s funimation dub but it is true that vegeta begged goku to avenge their race after frieza basically stabbed them in the back

    • @michaelmcdoesntexist8350
      @michaelmcdoesntexist8350 Před 2 lety +48

      "You'd be dead, and I'd be laughing. Hehehehehehohithurtstolaugh"

    • @ero-senninsama1734
      @ero-senninsama1734 Před 2 lety +15

      while its cool for Goku's character to recognize his saiyan heritage, it doesnt really do anything for the profecy or the super saiyan transformation itself. Its not like he has to be or think like a saiyan to transform.

    • @megasuperiordude
      @megasuperiordude Před rokem +36

      @@ero-senninsama1734 It's not necessarily about goku though, I think it leans more toward the implication that freiza actively fears the prophecy and would rather destroy this entire race of very useful mercenaries over a shallow prophecy than risk it being true. It gives the prophecy more weight by showing the main villain has actively attempted to prevent it, implying the prophecy of hope is what doomed their race. It gives the prophecy a "stained in blood" touch, which is fun.

  • @rockybirdy1529
    @rockybirdy1529 Před 2 lety +276

    One small extra info on the giant monkey thing:
    So you how everyone keeps it a secret from Goku since he killed his granpa...
    The first time Goku realized that he turns into giant mokey at fullmoon is actually when Vegeta transform during the Saiyan saga, and his first thought is... "I'm sorry, granpa. If I die, I will go apologize."
    Which is very nice and heartwarming, and such a shame that most western watchers wouldn't get it at first.

    • @Bezaliel13
      @Bezaliel13 Před 2 lety +16

      *Dub* Goku: "I see, you killed my grandfather!"

    • @rockybirdy1529
      @rockybirdy1529 Před 2 lety +5

      @@Bezaliel13 Wait, really?!
      I only read the manga, so I wouldn't know.

    • @jawwer12
      @jawwer12 Před 2 lety +2

      But Goku meats Gohan's ghost during the King Picolo saga iirc

    • @rockybirdy1529
      @rockybirdy1529 Před 2 lety +16

      @@jawwer12 Nah, he met him way before that (like before Tien, even), and Goku didn't know yet.
      IIRC, Gohan did ask about it from the others and opted to keep it a secret from Goku as well when he knew the moon was gone thanks to Roshi (yup, the moon got blown up twice in this show...).

    • @jawwer12
      @jawwer12 Před 2 lety

      @@rockybirdy1529 shit, you're right.
      I'm dumb

  • @DaiGato420
    @DaiGato420 Před 2 lety +855

    The best thing about this is Toriyama did not mostly plan this at all and one the reason for it is that they made it blonde to that they didn’t have to color goku hair in the manga and that save a lot of time

    • @1212121221233333
      @1212121221233333 Před 2 lety +72

      the thing is that this was one of the points that toriyama was planing to end the manga but by popular demand he keep going

    • @XanderVJ
      @XanderVJ Před 2 lety +88

      It was definitely not planned from the beginning of the manga, or even from the beginning of the DBZ portion. But it definitely was planned around the beginning of the Frieza saga, since Frieza himself name drops the concept early in the story.
      Of course, that's not to say that Toriyama had the entire arc planned in meticulous detail, but he definitely had a clear direction. That's why the Frieza saga has easily the tightest plot in the DBZ section, if not all of Dragon Ball. (The Saiyan Saga was also pretty tight, but also because the plot was very straight forward, while the Frieza saga has more twists and turns).

    • @representativejoints1188
      @representativejoints1188 Před 2 lety +9

      Idk you can look it as lazy but how else to you pull off contrast in a colorless medium?

    • @1212121221233333
      @1212121221233333 Před 2 lety +2

      @@representativejoints1188 well he could use the same thing that kuramda use for the bronce cloth turn gold in saint seiya before

    • @micow9951
      @micow9951 Před 2 lety +3

      @@brainderp808 yes exactly and dragon ball is one of that 90% , that's what he means by unplanned

  • @Dragoon7485
    @Dragoon7485 Před rokem +41

    The funny thing about the currency inflation of Super Saiyans is that even Vegeta notices and gripes about it -- when he finds out that Trunks and Goten both have it, he gripes that it's like there was a "Super Saiyan bargain sale."

    • @archivist_13
      @archivist_13 Před 6 měsíci

      Nice bit of self awareness there lol

  • @eternaldreamer8764
    @eternaldreamer8764 Před rokem +325

    I still remember watching this series for the first time as a kid and being genuinely scared of how different Goku became when he transformed into a super saiyan. I was uncomfortable and scared because he wasn’t the character I knew anymore and seemed like he would kill someone in a heartbeat. I never realized until the more recent years just how good of a writing decision that was

    • @mendheimer3046
      @mendheimer3046 Před rokem +4

      "Uncomfortable and scared" Lol

    • @dotjpg7783
      @dotjpg7783 Před rokem +17

      @@mendheimer3046 they were a kid 😭💔

    • @Humorless_Wokescold
      @Humorless_Wokescold Před 11 měsíci +10

      @@dotjpg7783 and Goku starts by yelling at his son. Goku almost never screams at people. Even going back to the 22nd Budokai in Dragon Ball, when the Crane School is flatout cheating to restrict Goku's movement, he doesn't scream. He just calls Tenshinhan a cheat and keeps pushing through it. And now Goku's yelling at his son like he's about to start smacking him around.
      I can totally see a young kid being freaked out by Goku's newfound attitude.

    • @maxentirunos
      @maxentirunos Před 10 měsíci +1

      @@Humorless_Wokescold Even more if you are from a bad family with a violent father and can recognize the signs of a beating.

    • @impartialthrone2097
      @impartialthrone2097 Před 10 měsíci +6

      ​@@mendheimer3046ooo look at the big man, afraid of sincerity and authenticity 🙄

  • @ryansmith841
    @ryansmith841 Před 2 lety +953

    Also adding to the vagueness, Frieza blew up the Saiyan homeworld because he feared the rise of a Super Saiyan. Made even more interesting that the only Saiyan to stand up to him in the fray was Bardock, Goku's father, who looked almost identical to him

    • @chaingun87
      @chaingun87 Před 2 lety +100

      And as mentioned in the video, noncannonically became a super saiyan because of Freiza as well

    • @JaelinBezel
      @JaelinBezel Před 2 lety +9

      What about Gine?

    • @windghost2
      @windghost2 Před 2 lety +33

      @@JaelinBezel She died on Planet Vegeta.

    • @invadazim4320
      @invadazim4320 Před 2 lety +14

      I always wondered why frieza didn't kill off nappa and vegeta after destroying planet vegeta. Was he unaware they were alive or something?

    • @rawalshadab3812
      @rawalshadab3812 Před 2 lety +101

      @@invadazim4320 I always thought it was pure ego. He felt like making the Saiyan prince his bitch was too much of an ego trip to give up.

  • @kagegenius
    @kagegenius Před 2 lety +156

    Also, in the manga the speech bubbles for Goku change. So, usually in the manga the villains have angular speech bubbles and all the good guys have round speech bubbles. But, Goku in Super Saiyan gets angular speech bubbles. It's a subtle difference to show character shift.

    • @yusiuc5533
      @yusiuc5533 Před 2 lety +34

      The text bubble changes again after Goku and Gohan’s training in the hyperbolic time chamber. His speech bubble as a full power SSJ is rounded again with the added changes to his eyes shape.

    • @bluesbest1
      @bluesbest1 Před 2 lety +35

      Also, Toriyama differentiated between heroes and villains by how much outline there was to their eyes. All the good guys have incomplete outlines, whereas the villains are completely outlined. It's a way to make the bad guys just a little bit unsettling by comparison. Anyway, whenever anyone goes Super Saiyan, their eyes get fully outlined. Goku, in a way, _became a villain_ when he transformed. It was all far too subtle for me to notice until someone pointed it out to me, but it's another cool subtle storytelling tool.

  • @spencersegler
    @spencersegler Před 2 lety +229

    On the topic of Goku's behavior changing after the transformation, I remember Master Roshi talking about it on Earth in the anime. Apparently, he could sense him from earth and stated something along the lines of Goku being at a very dangerous point as a warrior and that this amount of sudden power(relatively speaking) can change a man permanently and not always for the better.

    • @Ramsey276one
      @Ramsey276one Před 2 lety +11

      Gouken Akuma
      Ryu

    • @youtubeneedstochange4414
      @youtubeneedstochange4414 Před 2 lety +22

      Roshi is always coming in with the best lines of advice.

    • @spencersegler
      @spencersegler Před rokem +9

      @@Ramsey276one Street fighter?....... Oh like a parallel with dark hado and light hado.

  • @chelrok8764
    @chelrok8764 Před 2 lety +139

    “There are three things all wise men fear: the sea in storm, a night with no moon, and the anger of a gentle man.”
    Patrick Rothfuss, The Wise Man's Fear
    Is kind of the conclusion I draw from this video

    • @jessicajayes8326
      @jessicajayes8326 Před 2 lety +5

      Demons run when a good man goes to war.

    • @lorcostridge2811
      @lorcostridge2811 Před 2 lety +4

      Love that quote. Personally I think all three fears are predicated on the same thing: which is unpredictability.

    • @Rodanguirus
      @Rodanguirus Před rokem +10

      Amusingly, in Dragon Ball, a night without a moon tends to be safer for the general population.

    • @-libertyprimev1-902
      @-libertyprimev1-902 Před 3 měsíci

      ​@@lorcostridge2811there's also the 4th (maybe more like 3.5) fear of unpredictability, "The most terrifying form of man, is one that's accepted they're already dead."

  • @ShubhamGupta-ir2gn
    @ShubhamGupta-ir2gn Před 2 lety +234

    "Most people don't remember Nappa"
    People who watched the Abridged version: Well yes but actually no.

  • @jamisonosborne
    @jamisonosborne Před 2 lety +769

    The best thing about the whole "Training vs Talent" concept is that Vegeta comments on it on at least two occasions.
    Once after, Captain Ginyu steals Goku's body in Dragon Ball Z. And again in Dragon Ball Super when fighting Goku Black.
    Both times it is essentially the exact same message of Vegeta bragging that Goku's greatest strength isn't his actual strength, but his drive and strength of character.
    It actually reminds me of Superman's "World of Cardboard" speech. Superman starts off by commenting on Batman's tenacity by saying, "That man won't quit so long as he draws breath."

    • @ryuudevie7
      @ryuudevie7 Před 2 lety +20

      Yeah, there's a lot of comparisons to superman and goku, isn't there? I loved that scene.

    • @XanderVJ
      @XanderVJ Před 2 lety +43

      Vegeta wasn't the one who commented the issue with Captain Ginyu, but by Goku himself (he realized it when he saw he couldn't use Ginyu's body properly either).
      He did it with Goku Black, though.

    • @JaelinBezel
      @JaelinBezel Před 2 lety +9

      And then Batman quit while he still drew breath in the prologue of Batman Beyond.

    • @jaredmorales5130
      @jaredmorales5130 Před 2 lety +34

      @@JaelinBezel That was more so because he almost broke his moral code because he was forced to use a gun to threaten a crook since he had a heart attack on the job. If he didn't do that, he never would've stopped being Batman.

    • @Pacbandit13
      @Pacbandit13 Před 2 lety +6

      @@jaredmorales5130 Batman should of retired by 30, let alone fighting god's. Always took me out of comics

  • @blakerichardson1002
    @blakerichardson1002 Před rokem +31

    More than a year later and
    "Vegeta is actually getting skew by getting kicked into this rock,"
    is still one of the funniest lines i've ever heard.

  • @BloodfelX
    @BloodfelX Před 2 lety +90

    Now that I think about it, Goku staying in space after Namek makes a lot of sense from his perspective - though I don't really remember the anime going into it all. Goku just awakened a side of himself that is near-uncontrollably powerful and is scary even to himself - I think Goku wouldn't want to go home to his friends and family until he knows he can control this godly powerful near-berserk state if for no other reason than he doesn't want to lose control and or accidentally hurt (or even kill) anyone; even someone who so downright necessitates being killed such as Frieza.

  • @brianweaver327
    @brianweaver327 Před 2 lety +357

    "Most people don't remember Nappa, he isn't that important." - Red
    "I am hilarious and you will quote everything I say." - DBZA Nappa

    • @rollochairbreaker230
      @rollochairbreaker230 Před 2 lety +32

      Hey vegeta, are we there yet?

    • @AskMia411
      @AskMia411 Před 2 lety +8

      My thoughts exactly

    • @nestoreleuteriopaivabendo5415
      @nestoreleuteriopaivabendo5415 Před 2 lety

      @@rollochairbreaker230
      Filho de uma mulher que troca favores por dinheiro, eu ia dizer exatamente isso!

    • @ShaimingLong
      @ShaimingLong Před 2 lety +13

      ~My response when she said that was "Except for everyone that watched Abridged!"
      I still wish it were somehow canon, like by the time he's revived he's so weak, that he just throws in the towel and lives a more simple, but lavish life. So he's not relevant to any plots, but can be included in those rare random just for fun moments. Or, worse, just mostly forgotten like 17 and Lunch/Launch.

    • @AskMia411
      @AskMia411 Před 2 lety +5

      @@ShaimingLong 17 did get to shine in the universe tournament arc, and honestly made him one of my favorite characters, but yeah, too many good side characters get sidelined because of power creep. It's a shame

  • @geofff.3343
    @geofff.3343 Před 2 lety +198

    DBZA did it best when Vegeta keeps getting powerups.
    Vegeta: You see, Freeza, you're not just dealing with average Saiyan warrior anymore--"
    Freeze: "Oh my god!"

    • @maxteraform
      @maxteraform Před 2 lety +19

      That's right. I've risen beyond the limits. I, Prince Vegeta has finally become a Super Sayian!

    • @ShaimingLong
      @ShaimingLong Před 2 lety +24

      And then the pay off in the Broly movie when Vegeta's the one groaning at that phrase.

    • @coolgreenbug7551
      @coolgreenbug7551 Před 2 lety +3

      @@maxteraform Yes yes yes, and then you killed the Jaberwokey and saved Narnia

    • @jessicajayes8326
      @jessicajayes8326 Před 2 lety

      B*tch you just jealous of my super saiyan swagger.

  • @yorurumi
    @yorurumi Před 2 lety +166

    "We're gonna pretend like pop culture osmosis has not taught every single one of us what a super saiyan is"
    No worries here super saiyan has never managed to bypass the rock I've lived under for 90% of my life

    • @dragonfyre8928
      @dragonfyre8928 Před 4 měsíci

      Something something, Legally Blonde, something something

  • @JoshtheOverlander
    @JoshtheOverlander Před 2 lety +124

    Funny little side note to give to Blue: The Spirit Bomb almost never works, exception being Kid Buu. It's supposed to be this amazing skill fueled by the energy of countless living beings, but as far as reliability goes, it kinda stinks XD

    • @dedf15
      @dedf15 Před 2 lety +27

      When you tell your enemy you are going to incinerate them with a glowing ball of pure energy that takes prayer and teamwork and standing still yelling for half an hour...
      Is there anyone who would be like "man, you and I are having such a good conversation, I really couldn't leave now...or step to the side by a single block"...

    • @ssj4jason737
      @ssj4jason737 Před 2 lety +10

      I mean it's non canon but the Genkidama also worked on Omega Shenron but then again that was made up of energy from all across the universe

    • @demi-femme4821
      @demi-femme4821 Před 2 lety +19

      And with Kid Buu, it only worked because it's super-effective against evil and Kid Buu is 100% pure mindless evil.

    • @theendersmirk5851
      @theendersmirk5851 Před rokem +17

      It's like the ultimate in unconventional Chekov's gun, because it keeps not working, right up until the final boss of Z, finally giving a payoff for King Kai teaching Goku it at all beyond injuring Vegeta that one time.

    • @ashikjaman1940
      @ashikjaman1940 Před rokem +8

      Hey it worked against the one guy it REALLY needed to work against lol

  • @Vee_Sheep
    @Vee_Sheep Před 2 lety +465

    Red mentioning the existance of 3 other chaotic superpowered monkeys in Journey to the West has now made me even more hyped for the next episodes, but also each year that we don't get there will hurt me a tiny bit harder

    • @chinuaalibatya7345
      @chinuaalibatya7345 Před 2 lety

      🫂

    • @supC_
      @supC_ Před 2 lety +5

      Umm, 3 other monkeys kiiinda sounds to me like Raditz, Nappa and Frieza… somewhat unfortunately.
      Edit: Vegeta, obviously. Not Frieza.

    • @Vee_Sheep
      @Vee_Sheep Před 2 lety +1

      @@supC_ well,, yeah

    • @DavidSartor0
      @DavidSartor0 Před 2 lety +7

      @@supC_ "Raditz, Nappa and Frieza"

    • @supC_
      @supC_ Před 2 lety +3

      @@DavidSartor0 how did I screw that up so badly?

  • @lightsideofsin8969
    @lightsideofsin8969 Před 2 lety +1184

    "People in the US didn't get DB before DBZ"
    Now every single discussion I had about it with Americans retroactively makes sense!
    Edit: I am German and the German dub for Kai got new voice actors who sucked and that's why many Germans didn't care for Kai. We loved DBZ as it was.

    • @Outlawkk
      @Outlawkk Před 2 lety +37

      We had OGDB but like most 80s/early 90s anime it wasn't pushed or was syndication filler for affiliates for channels like Fox, ABC, and the like.

    • @AsymmetricalCrimes
      @AsymmetricalCrimes Před 2 lety +25

      Unless you saw both long after their dubs came out. Speak for yourself but I saw DB first.

    • @egondoerr
      @egondoerr Před 2 lety +32

      The first series was available, but it only really aired at something like 6am on a Saturday in the early 90's. So there are people like me who got some exposure first, but it certainly wasn't the full experience.

    • @blackroute1527
      @blackroute1527 Před 2 lety +2

      What about the Manga?

    • @jacquesmassard9226
      @jacquesmassard9226 Před 2 lety +7

      @@blackroute1527 The Manga came out after the series here.

  • @SqurtieMan
    @SqurtieMan Před 4 měsíci +18

    What an incredible legacy this man leaves. RIP

  • @yotomoe5953
    @yotomoe5953 Před 2 lety +37

    Something worth noting is that when Goku goes Super Saiyan, his normally round and open eyes become closed and harsh like Vegeta's. Also in the manga characters who are "evil" speak with angular speech bubbles rather than round ones. Super Saiyan Goku has angular speech bubbles, further conflating the idea that something's not right with Goku. The anime achieves this effect by having Nozawa or Schemmel speaking in a more intense voice during the duration of the form.

  • @TransientLunatic
    @TransientLunatic Před 2 lety +444

    I love how DBZ Abridged held on to the comedic roots of the series while still being evolving into something more serious over time
    Plus, Piccolo, Nail and Kami are an incredible comedic trio

    • @cxfxcdude
      @cxfxcdude Před 2 lety +47

      Now hear me out. Big Green Threads

    • @pikapuffin368
      @pikapuffin368 Před 2 lety +29

      The best part about SAO Abridged is that SWE learnt this principle super well and is applying that to a series that took itself crazy seriously, making it sooo much better for it.

    • @connorwalters9223
      @connorwalters9223 Před 2 lety +15

      @@pikapuffin368 New episode came out today and it’s awesome!

    • @pikapuffin368
      @pikapuffin368 Před 2 lety +6

      @@connorwalters9223 IKR

    • @KaiTenSatsuma
      @KaiTenSatsuma Před 2 lety +20

      YOU CAN WIN
      YOU FEEL GREAT
      YOU
      CAN
      DO
      THIS

  • @SirFooplesTheThird
    @SirFooplesTheThird Před 2 lety +715

    DBZ is capable of handling some moments perfectly. The OG Super Saiyan transformation, Gohan going SS2 against Cell, Vegeta sacrificing himself in the Buu saga. Excellent stuff

    • @9Godslayer
      @9Godslayer Před 2 lety +60

      Hercule befriending Buu.

    • @Arphemius
      @Arphemius Před 2 lety +44

      @@9Godslayer Hercule? Did American censors seriously call him by a different name? That is absolutey hilarious.

    • @yepyep86
      @yepyep86 Před 2 lety +17

      Arph I 100% don't believe you have never heard of the name Hercule it's such a known thing my phone auto corrected the lower case h to H because it's his proper name

    • @hokage9990
      @hokage9990 Před 2 lety +47

      @@Arphemius yeah Mr. Satan did not go over well here

    • @Arphemius
      @Arphemius Před 2 lety +62

      @@hokage9990 But that's the best part! At the end when Goku needed to power up the spirit bomb and so the entire planet Earth raised up their hands and chanted "Satan! Satan! Satan!" I just laughed my ass off.
      I genuinely did not know that until just now when Tyler mentioned the name.

  • @jamesadkins7150
    @jamesadkins7150 Před 4 měsíci +18

    Came back to this the day after Toriyamas death was announced. By far one of the most important and impactful artists in the last 100 years.

  • @rodneyestrella1759
    @rodneyestrella1759 Před 2 lety +24

    One thing about the original anime was that when Goku spoke in Japanese with let's say a country hick accent, while Vegeta was finesse, royalty, and was something that kept provoking Vegeta's mid-life crisis!

  • @P_Goldman
    @P_Goldman Před 2 lety +216

    "Chekovs Seafood Dinner" is the funniest thing I've ever heard. I hope Blue can allow us to steal that 10/10 gourmet course of a joke.

  • @shadowkishi6127
    @shadowkishi6127 Před 2 lety +547

    i love how super saiyan became so commonly used that vegeta kind just.... forgot that it was a big deal. like, during the 6/7 tournament he tells cabbe "hey lets stop messing around and go super saiyan yeah?" just completely disregarding that it was so rare that even he wasn't sure it was real lol

    • @ZAH33D
      @ZAH33D Před 2 lety +117

      His mind broke when he saw kid Trunks transform in front of him.

    • @AsymmetricalCrimes
      @AsymmetricalCrimes Před 2 lety +56

      I excused the Saiyan Z Fighters going Super Saiyan but I lost it when I say Cabba and the U6 Saiyans do it so easily out of nowhere. At least with Trunks and Goten you could say Super Saiyan is passed down genetically...

    • @nilktots6380
      @nilktots6380 Před 2 lety +8

      thats the disappointing thing about fantasy is realizing that the impossible dream world is more relative, we could be a fantasy world to a hypothetical possible reality. i didnt think zebras were real because they seemed kinda on the nose but no one cares about them really.

    • @alfredocolmenares4408
      @alfredocolmenares4408 Před 2 lety +15

      @@AsymmetricalCrimes with that I'd say cabba had a proper transformation. The tingling sensation was his own way of trying to explain how it felt, rather than that being the actual cause (which people think is how it works for him)The universe 6 Saiyans are also slightly different from universe 7 Saiyans their potential has to change in order to get them strong enough to transform

    • @Dell-ol6hb
      @Dell-ol6hb Před 2 lety +10

      @@AsymmetricalCrimes ehh yea but it isn't a big deal plus the U6 saiyans are clearly quite different to the U7 saiyans, like they don't have tails and tend to be more calm and less bulky. That could explain the differences in how easy it is for them to go super saiyan, plus just having someone who is already a super saiyan help you would speed up the process, as we saw with Gohan (though it was much faster for U6 saiyans)

  • @Alienldr
    @Alienldr Před 2 lety +106

    What I liked about the super saiyan transformation is accomplished at first was it wasn't just about grief and rage, but desperation also. It wasn't just that Krillin died. It's that Goku has already given it his all to Frieza and isn't even close to stopping him, and Frieza is now killing his family and friends, and Goku knows he can't stop it, but he desperately wants to.
    For Trunks, it's because he desperately wants to stop the androids, but he knows he can't. Vegeta, he's desperate to catch up to Goku and Trunks.
    If it's only grief and rage, wouldn't you think Goku or Gohan could transformed earlier? Krillin died from Tamborine before, but nothing told Goku he couldn't stop Tamborine, so that desperation wasn't there. Gohan would rage boost all the time, but he would stall for Goku to clean up the mess, where Goku, Vegeta, and Trunks didn't have someone else to deal with their problems for them.

    • @creativename1673
      @creativename1673 Před 2 lety +25

      That same principle could be applied to Gohan as well. His first awakening - the one in the Time Chamber - happened because he was, to put it simply, desparate to get strong enough to protect himself and others. I mean, he literally asked Goku to basically try to kill him to get him to transform, so if that's not desperation, I don't know what is.

    • @russellmarch4983
      @russellmarch4983 Před 2 lety +4

      @@creativename1673 he couldn’t dodge

    • @michaelpugmire4533
      @michaelpugmire4533 Před 2 lety +10

      Just like Goku said: "The power come in response of a need, not a desire. You have to create that need."

    • @rikusauske
      @rikusauske Před 2 lety +13

      The reason why a Saiyan hadn't transformed in thousands of years is because truw hatred and rage has to be born from love. If you lack meaningful connections to people you can't experience the powerful emotions from loss. Bardock was weird for having a wife and loving his children, which is why he was able to transform first. Goku, living on earth, found those connections. The half Saiyans with their human DNA and upbringing were more inclined to those feelings from the rip

    • @sibellagenis3942
      @sibellagenis3942 Před rokem +3

      This is incredibly valid.
      It sort of reminds me of Super Man who also feels like he can’t count on others to fight his battles. There is no one else, it’s just him.

  • @ColdBlazze
    @ColdBlazze Před 2 lety +45

    What i really liked bout the all "how to become Super Sayan" thingie is when Vegeta becomes one, how he was so frustrated despite all the effort he put into training and his anger towards him pushed him enough to break his limits.

  • @MakeVarahHappen
    @MakeVarahHappen Před 2 lety +584

    52:36 That's 100% true. The super saiyan isn't like something told by an Oracle but a power of the ancient past Saiyans lost *because* they became ruthless.

    • @MakeVarahHappen
      @MakeVarahHappen Před 2 lety +26

      @Brandon Quist well even before that it was established with the pure heart thing got modern Saiyans were too evil to go super.

    • @damkylan3
      @damkylan3 Před 2 lety +25

      ​@@MakeVarahHappen Established, and then invalidated very soon after when Vegeta became one. Which makes sense, because the "pure heart" thing has never made any sense. Goku's not even supposed to understand what a Super Saiyan is in that moment, but he suddenly starts talking like he does as if he actually has become some kind of messianic figure. It's a cool moment, but loses all logic the more you think about it.

    • @MakeVarahHappen
      @MakeVarahHappen Před 2 lety +44

      @@damkylan3 I think you're perceiving Goku's comment about needing a pure heart as being too literal and attempt to invalidate it. Like the amount of hardship and brutality a Saiyan is almost universally proportional to how easy it is for them to go Super Saiyan. This is pretty well articulated in the plot. Goten in trunks have never seen combat a day in their life so it's mad easy for them to go Super Saiyan meanwhile Future Trunks has lived in apocalyptic wasteland forever and can only have it be ignited by his only mentor dying. Trauma actively stunts growth so ruthless sayings will never achieve it. It fits with what Goku was saying about him being special.

    • @798jeremy
      @798jeremy Před 2 lety +3

      That's DBS U6 version...and it sucks. It sucks and it stinks hot puking shit garbage 🤢🤮💩

    • @MakeVarahHappen
      @MakeVarahHappen Před 2 lety +8

      @@798jeremy as you can see in previous comments I made that specific element isn't just a universe 6 thing. You can just look at the original manga and come to that conclusion. Well, maybe not the Future Trunks bit because in the manga he can already go Super Saiyan before the story starts IIRC.

  • @FCHenchy
    @FCHenchy Před 2 lety +361

    I haven't seen the new Broly movie, but there was an interesting possibility from the old movie that the gold-hair transformation isn't actually THE LEGENDARY super sayan. It could be that Broly's ability is the actual state that got passed down in the legends and what Goku found has a hidden achievement that no one had managed to unlock before. Vegeta could have been right about the prophesied LSS being merciless, and Frieza actually got taken out by an over-leveled peasant of no particular destiny.

    • @coldermusic2729
      @coldermusic2729 Před 2 lety +38

      Is this canon? I remember this being stated… while also not being stated?
      It makes sense though. When he fights broly at levels far beyond the ss (in the newest film) he still doesn’t stand a chance by himself. Meaning broly, with only one transformation, was able to match ss blue, which matches gods.
      We also see other people reach this level and boost from being weak as fudge… to being as strong as goku after he has train intensely for YEARS.

    • @MasaokaKun
      @MasaokaKun Před 2 lety +64

      @@coldermusic2729 It's not canon. All the old Brolly stuff, like old the movies, were never canon. The Super Brolly movie, on the other hand, is totally canon.

    • @brookerickettson4950
      @brookerickettson4950 Před 2 lety +69

      You need to watch the new movie. Once the fight against Broly starts proper, it just keeps getting more and more peak of awesome.
      Its true (as far as in movie stating) in any Broly medium that his wild, uncontrollable, ever increasing power that is green-gold is what the LSS actually is, and what Goku first discovered is a diluted version.

    • @coldermusic2729
      @coldermusic2729 Před 2 lety +10

      @@MasaokaKun yeah, but I thought the concept of Bodly being the actual legendary super Saiyan is canon in the super broly film.

    • @Priceluked
      @Priceluked Před 2 lety +1

      Not really canon anyway though since Toriyama didn't write it.

  • @cale0176
    @cale0176 Před 4 měsíci +11

    Came back to watch this again after Toriyama's passing. That he could barely remember his own plot points but strung together such a fantastic example of a prophecy over years is proof that he was a true savant when it came to manga. Watching him free hand a Goku drawing was always magic.

  • @Amy-yq4lk
    @Amy-yq4lk Před 2 lety +30

    I feel you, Blue. Sporadically watching DBZ not only didn't prepare me for the constant whiplash incurred from watching the King Piccolo arc in the original series, it made some bits MORE whiplash-y as the exact opposite thing I expected to happen would end up happening, which my best friend found very funny.
    "How did you not know Piccolo and Piccolo Junior are different people?!"
    "Well, no one calls him Piccolo Junior, do they?! They call him Piccolo!"

  • @TapdotWater
    @TapdotWater Před 2 lety +247

    "That's right, Frieza. You're not dealing with the AVERAGE Saiyan Warrior anymore!" - Vegeta, every Namek Saga episode of DBZA

    • @JuFated
      @JuFated Před 2 lety +38

      Red mentioning how often Vegeta says it in the original made me realize that DBZA didnt exaggerate his prattling at all. Making Frieza's growing annoyance of him very reasonable 8D

    • @Zalgardis
      @Zalgardis Před 2 lety +7

      Haven't we been here before?

    • @johnnygyro2295
      @johnnygyro2295 Před 2 lety +13

      Freeza: *having seen Goku dodge all his death beams* "What happened? What the hell are you?!"
      Goku: "Don't you get it Freeza? It's just like Vegeta said."
      Freeza: "No you ******* don't..."

    • @treyhelms5282
      @treyhelms5282 Před 2 lety +1

      @@Zalgardis I feel like we have been here before....

    • @affsteak3530
      @affsteak3530 Před 2 lety +5

      "Oh, my Gooooooood!!!!"

  • @broncos435
    @broncos435 Před 2 lety +657

    44:18 i'm not sure i'd call that look one of "immediate regret". i always saw it as more of a disappointment/sadness. i don't think he regrets killing frieza, but he certainly didn't want to. it seemed more of a melancholically contemplative look, where he's thinking about his whole policy of mercy and second chances. like, maybe some guys are just so evil that second chances aren't even useful for them, and that probably clashes with goku's whole viewpoint on people and their capacity for change

    • @Daiyuki117
      @Daiyuki117 Před 2 lety +136

      It's a look of "Why did you make me do this?"

    • @Bandit_King_YT
      @Bandit_King_YT Před 2 lety +37

      And this even pays off in the Cell saga with the death of Cell, but also in Gohan's attempts at getting 18 back.

    • @fieryphoenix82
      @fieryphoenix82 Před 2 lety +40

      I always took it as a look of regret, but at the fact that Frieza would not change when the others he had shown mercy did. Almost all of Goku's friends had tried to kill him at one time, and this was a time he went above and beyond to offer the same chance but Frieza wouldn't take it.

    • @dirt007
      @dirt007 Před 2 lety +8

      I think it was really a look of well damn. Now I can't fight him again later.

    • @798jeremy
      @798jeremy Před 2 lety +4

      @@Bandit_King_YT I don't really see what paid off in the Cell saga that has something to do about this topic, actually...and Gohan never attempted to get 18 back. He didn't f**king care about 18 until she officially became Krillin's wife, basically. It was purely coincidental that he made Cell puking her out of him, as absolutely nobody, including Cell himself, expected this to happen the way it did. It seemed totally impossible to free 17 or 18 from Cell once he got them inside him. It merely happened like an accident. No one barely imagined it physically conceivable, in fact ! Pretty much like Dr. Brief with the muffin button in DBZA actually...¯\_( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)_/¯

  • @Just_Some_Guy_with_a_Mustache

    I still get chills every time I think about Goku's "I am" speech. It's so powerful.
    "I am the hope of the omniverse! I am the lightbulb in the darkness! I am the bacon in the fridge for all living things that cry out in hunger! I am the Alpha and the Amiga! I am the terror that flaps in the night! I am Son Goku and I am a Super... _Saiyan."_

    • @DParkerNunya
      @DParkerNunya Před 2 lety +20

      Ah, the true translation.

    • @judeconnor-macintyre9874
      @judeconnor-macintyre9874 Před 2 lety +21

      "I'm going to break you"
      "what?"
      "like a kit-kat bar"
      "WHAT?"

    • @paulsus914
      @paulsus914 Před rokem +7

      Correction: He is the terror that **quacks** in the night, not the one that **flaps**.

    • @puer4787
      @puer4787 Před rokem

      i'm sorry but this is insanely cringe and doesn't fit at all with goku and who he is as a person, the entire speech is a fabrication by funimation that completely misrepresents everything. goku is not a super hero and you probably know deep down that after this he doesn't act like a hero in any way, see during the cell games where he was more interested in his son's potential than making sure cell is beaten or the buu saga where his primary goal was to groom a successor or the end of z where he just fucks off with uub never to be seen again.

    • @paulsus914
      @paulsus914 Před rokem +11

      @@puer4787 Bro, that isn't even the original speech, it's just a joke version done by the DBZA team. Have you even watched the original?

  • @raixira27
    @raixira27 Před 2 lety +6

    6:47 "So Piccolo just became a good guy almost immediately"
    DBZ Kai Abridged, on the way to fight Raditz
    Goku "Are we friends?"
    Piccolo "NOBODY WATCHED DRAGON BALL LET'S GO"

  • @connorwalters9223
    @connorwalters9223 Před 2 lety +462

    All of this stuff about how Dragon Ball was originally a comedy and the importance of comedy to the original story makes me understand why the Dragon Ball Abridged series has become so compelling to so many people, to the point of being regarded almost as a fan-dub rather than a parody

    • @representativejoints1188
      @representativejoints1188 Před 2 lety +44

      Right! They see the authors vibes and ride it through because it feels right.

    • @ILiekFishes
      @ILiekFishes Před 2 lety +54

      it absolutely starts as parody, but somewhere in the namek saga it gets great

    • @Jake9066
      @Jake9066 Před 2 lety +48

      All I have to say is "All these squares make a circle"

    • @deinnydoes5356
      @deinnydoes5356 Před 2 lety +44

      It paid off to have the source material at their fingertips to thread everything together in a way that the originals couldn't while having their cake too. It's my favorite fan work.

    • @representativejoints1188
      @representativejoints1188 Před 2 lety +28

      "Super Saiyan? What even is that" I'm pretty sure tfs and Red came to a lot of the same conclusions as well

  • @thetardisisblue1110
    @thetardisisblue1110 Před 2 lety +532

    Wow the whole "everyone can go super saiyan now" is a lot like what happened in Kingdom Hearts. Sora was supposed to be the only Keyblade wielder, like there was originally only one Keyblade and Sora was the only one who could use it, and now almost every single one of his friends has one.
    Edit: I meant in the original game. I'm aware there were other Keyblades and wielders at the time/ before but when there was only the first game no one knew this. The series retcons itelf all the time anyway.

    • @pikapuffin368
      @pikapuffin368 Před 2 lety +90

      It's the fate of every "special power" in a series that runs long enough, unless it's some villains' powers because they only ever show up once early on and are ignored because the writers don't think to go back to them until later when they actually, y'know, need more material.
      ...no that's not the voice of experience, i don't know what you mean. *whistles*

    • @gratuitouslurking8610
      @gratuitouslurking8610 Před 2 lety +7

      @@pikapuffin368 **COHAMONUGH**

    • @UnreasonableOpinions
      @UnreasonableOpinions Před 2 lety +29

      It's one thing in a shounen series, especially manga, where you have one week to make an entire instalment and you need to toss whatever first draft you have to the illustrators with enough time for them to ink it. It's worse in something like a game or adapted series, where you have months or years of writing time to fine-tune the plot, and yet somehow manage to do no better.

    • @proudspartan313
      @proudspartan313 Před 2 lety +41

      Well King Mickey and Riku already had there own keyblades in that game. Sora story is more of a "anyone can wield the or a keyblade if thier heart is righteous and formed connections with others." Riku is actually suppose to be the only one to use it but because he only relied on his own strength for increasingly selfish means leads to him losing his right to wield that keyblade and he switches to another keyblade from ansem.
      So it's not really that weird or against the themes of the franchise for others to wield one, whether they be good or evil, so long as thier resolve was strong, a connection is formed or just thier own strength of heart.
      Also the game never really went into depth what exactly made the Kingdom Key special. Like it is but it's mostly spoken about it being important than going into the why or how its important. So KH1 more inverts the chosen one story both with the user and kind of with the special sword. It be like if King Arthur was suppose to wield Excalibur but then some peasant guy was chosen by the sword because he's shown more chivalry and heroism.

    • @ginoclaves
      @ginoclaves Před 2 lety +11

      *"You either die a hero, or live long enough to see all your accomplishments plagiarized"*

  • @danielquinlan2457
    @danielquinlan2457 Před 2 lety +101

    27:37 It's worth noting that in the Japanese version, Kaio has the same voice actor as the narrator, and has more of a wise grandfatherly vibe to him, compared to Sean Schemmel in the dub doing his best to sound as cartoonishly obnoxious as possible.

  • @supermarioblacktiger
    @supermarioblacktiger Před 2 lety +6

    "No one remembers nappa"
    Dbza - "I am hilarious and you will quote everything i say"

  • @jeremy1860
    @jeremy1860 Před 2 lety +621

    Having Goku turn Super Saiyan was probably the coolest thing I'd seen on TV back when it first happened 😊

    • @000Krim
      @000Krim Před 2 lety +4

      Same

    • @Ryuondo
      @Ryuondo Před 2 lety +9

      All the transformation scenes were cool, but the original is juat so simple and iconic.

    • @minatodroger7890
      @minatodroger7890 Před 2 lety +3

      Man down right culturally relevant it was that awesome.

    • @woaddragon
      @woaddragon Před 2 lety

      Same. As must of people used to complain about it, i also love SS3 first time transformation.

    • @supC_
      @supC_ Před 2 lety +2

      @@woaddragon I agree. The way it was handled narratively may have been lacking, but the animation, music, and the scene itself were fucking incredible.

  • @TheSonicShoe
    @TheSonicShoe Před 2 lety +305

    One thing that I think could have been brought up is just how much Sean Schemmel's voice work adds to the "this is a different person" feeling of the transformation in the English dubs. His base Goku voice and super saiyan voice sound like two different characters. Goku straight up goes from a tenor to a baritone a soon as his hair starts glowing, and it's real uncanny the first time you hear it, like a friend you've known for years all of a sudden has been replaced with someone who only *sort of* looks and sounds like them.

    • @spoonybard2380
      @spoonybard2380 Před 2 lety +35

      i would argue this also applies to masako nozawa's performance too.
      she takes a noticeably more deep and almost sinister tone for his super form, which does a good job at conveying just how much goku's mental state shifted during the transformation.

    • @Artista_Frustrado
      @Artista_Frustrado Před 2 lety +5

      honestly they all do it well Mario Castañeda also sounds very different in the Latino dub

    • @rockwoodzapper
      @rockwoodzapper Před 2 lety +19

      Fits how Goku was feeling when that happened, too. Turning SS1 against Frieza is the only time Goku ever goes so far as to say that he will make his opponent SUFFER. Not that he won't forgive them, like the LAST time someone killed Krillin. Not even that he's going to kill him. But that he's going to make him suffer. GOKU said that.

    • @TheSunGamer101
      @TheSunGamer101 Před 2 lety +2

      It’s my favourite thing about SSB KaoKen Goku in Super, the dub has Goku sound like he’s on the verge of exploding from the strain of the technique

    • @anjetto1
      @anjetto1 Před 2 lety +8

      There's a lot of subtle changes about super saiyan. Beyond the hair. Goku had open eyes. They close fully. Goku had floppy hair. It's spiked. In the Manga, goku had round text boxes like all the heroes. When he turns they become square like all the villains

  • @livingcorpse5664
    @livingcorpse5664 Před 2 lety +14

    Another reason we had to be worried about Goku transforming into a Super Saiyan is that we've seen him and Gohan turn into the giant ape form and they were out of control killers.

  • @emperorjoker9240
    @emperorjoker9240 Před 2 lety +36

    This is probably the best rundown of DBZ I have ever heard. Normally I hear it from fanboys or/and “overly enthusiastic” content creators.

  • @MrBigrod77
    @MrBigrod77 Před 2 lety +194

    I think Gohan's Super Saiyan 2 transformation is the last truly emotional transformation. Since it still follows pure heart being pushed with rage.

    • @dee2273
      @dee2273 Před rokem +7

      Super saiyin 3 is spectacle. "This to go beyond that" *screams breaking space and time*

    • @jagnestormskull3178
      @jagnestormskull3178 Před rokem +1

      I somewhat agree, but I think the Battle of Gods ritual, as the last hope for the Earth and the revelation of Pan (chronologically, I mean anyone who watched the end of Z and/or GT knows that she'd eventually be there), was also pretty emotional. And also Vegeta's transformation during the Tournament of Power. It's not only a rejection of Ultra Instinct, but also a reflection on how far Vegeta has come, and on what he's fighting for - honor and love, rather than barbarism and hate.

    • @maxentirunos
      @maxentirunos Před rokem

      No. It's for me the worse transformation. The others are more apathetic than bad, which by default make them better.
      This one is full on narrative feel manipulation and constant contriveness to justify changing completely a character. Gohan doesn't transform because someone actually important to him die and he feel guilt for not saving him, instead they take a whole ass chapter of having the important characters getting dunked on and tortured by somehow stronger than semi-perfect cell plot devices and only let go once a non character that have 7 lines of dialogue in the entire saga, only 2 of them shared with Gohan, is killed a second time.
      Gohan, you know, the kid that constantly go into rage mode in every single fight over any grievous injury of a friend, doesn't move over said friend being tortured, but the death of a nobody that he already though to be dead at this point do it ?

    • @SuperSaiyanD48
      @SuperSaiyanD48 Před rokem +1

      Broly too.

    • @cosmictitan2166
      @cosmictitan2166 Před rokem +5

      @@maxentirunos To be fair in regards to Gohan's rage, think about how old he was in every rage moment until he went Super Saiyan 2. Only 3-5, which likely makes his rage more equivalent to that of a "tantrum", but by the time of the Cell saga he's truly growing into a person with his own ideology he wishes more than anything he can stand by. He snapped when 16 died, because maybe he was at the end of the day, in the eyes of Gohan, a bystander that he could have saved had he not been so stubborn against letting everything out.
      Also, keep in mind, Gohan was holding back because he was afraid he might lose control and hurt someone himself. He knows about his explosive temper; how he attacks in a blind rage. Besides, remember Goku's words to Gohan when he first unlocked the new stage of power? "Get out of here before I lose any sense of reasoning I have left!" (At least in the dub), which could have engrained a sense of fear towards what he could do if even his own father had been so uncertain and angry at the time.

  • @gadgetpatch9975
    @gadgetpatch9975 Před 2 lety +359

    I do like how, in the post-toriyama era, they did push the "this transformation makes our goofy fighty monkey-boy scary" button, with the way Ultra Instinct left Goku silent and grim and purely focused on fighting. But it didn't quite hit with the same emotional underpinning as OG super saiyan.

    • @twaggytheatricks4960
      @twaggytheatricks4960 Před 2 lety +46

      Well, not quite.
      ...Wait, shit, sorry- I should start by stating that I actually agree with your point, because it's- it's good stuff. They did manage to do Ultra Instinct justice in more than one ways.
      What I meant to say was: the point of UI was never to be _like_ Super Saiyan, and therefore the emotional impact is much _different._ Like, when Goku turned into a Super Saiyan for the first time and acted the way he did, shock, concern and hype for the cathartic beatdown that was sure to follow are sure to come by.
      But it's not like the moment where Goku masters UI and then _all the gods of Destruction just get up from their seat in sheer respect for having seen a mortal step in their realm for the very first time_ by mastering their state of mind didn't bring some well-done emotional underpinning. Especially when Beerus smiles a hungry, prideful smile at realizing that the dude he hung out with did what wasn't supposed to be really possible.
      It's just... different. Definitely comparable, but they can be equally impactful - they just don't bring the same kind of fun to the Dragon Ball's long-running fight-based hype table, so, they'll affect people differently.

    • @marcvandermeyden8000
      @marcvandermeyden8000 Před 2 lety +6

      i think that says more about what people like to see then about the transformations,if people rather see emotional rage moment then a calm collected fighter wel thats an issue in the psychology of these people,i rather like UI its actualy more interesting to me then ssj.

    • @AlexanderDraconis
      @AlexanderDraconis Před 2 lety +10

      On an emotional level, I wasmost similarly impacted during Goku's Rage-Out when Zamasu and Goku Black told him about murdering Chichi and Goten. The transformation is a great representation of the mental snap, but the mental snap is what hit me most, so seeing Goku assumingly ready to merc these two gleeful genocidal murderers with prejudice is I think the clearest analogue.
      Which they foiled afterwards in a good way common in Super by Not having Goku solve every villain problem.

    • @poly_g6068
      @poly_g6068 Před 2 lety +8

      Ultra Instinct is lame. It's just a deathless cheat that rewards losing. It also makes the years of training and developing techniques seem pointless because ALL of that failed in order to activate it. No input needed from the user who is literally unconscious, it does the all the fighting for them. Rather than let Goku lose, or force him to learn his opponent or train some more, it just hands him the win after clearly losing. Like that's super cheap to me.
      You could give this transformation to any character and make them the strongest character in the series.

    • @athingamagoothingy1381
      @athingamagoothingy1381 Před 2 lety +4

      @@poly_g6068 you say it doesn't reward training as if the very first arc in Super isn't about them using the dragon balls to learn a ritual to become stronger

  • @sram5949
    @sram5949 Před rokem +11

    Red's King Kai impression is incredible and had me crying with laughter

  • @ChesireWaltz
    @ChesireWaltz Před 2 lety +59

    I love how genuinely interested and excited Red always sounds to talk about this sort of thing. She reminds me of people I know when she talks, and of myself a little, and I just love listening to her talk about just about anything. Which is funny because I feel the same about Blue but for very different reasons, like the energy and style is different but 100% of the enthusiasm. This is awesome also you are so right on this.

  • @andrewbidwell6421
    @andrewbidwell6421 Před 2 lety +654

    The most hilarious part of it is Toriyam did this so he wouldn’t have to color Goku’s hair every frame 😂

    • @Roznon
      @Roznon Před 2 lety +86

      You think the only reason Vegeta was killed was so Toriyama wouldn’t have to color his hair either 😂

    • @ashikjaman1940
      @ashikjaman1940 Před 2 lety +77

      The best changes are ones made of practicality lol
      Like Naruto's headband

    • @afrothekobold
      @afrothekobold Před 2 lety +123

      Goku also permanently lost his tail near the end of DragonBall because Toriyama didn't wanna draw it anymore

    • @LilypadPanda
      @LilypadPanda Před 2 lety +19

      @@ashikjaman1940 Or Mario's entire design.

    • @timothymclean
      @timothymclean Před 2 lety +40

      Technically so his _assistant_ wouldn't have to color his hair every frame.

  • @Vgamer311
    @Vgamer311 Před 2 lety +420

    “You see, Frieza, you’re not dealing with the average Saiyan warrior any more.”

    • @babybalrog
      @babybalrog Před 2 lety +71

      FRIEZA: Oh, my God, this IS happening again!

    • @NoHandle44
      @NoHandle44 Před 2 lety +48

      "I am hilarious, and you will quote everything that I say."

    • @Snorlax_il
      @Snorlax_il Před 2 lety +45

      Oh lord I traded Vegeta for this!

    • @treyhelms5282
      @treyhelms5282 Před 2 lety +24

      @@Snorlax_il Arguably, one of Goku's greatest feats at that point was making Freeza miss Vegeta.

    • @MASHo1992
      @MASHo1992 Před 2 lety +1

      @@treyhelms5282 And make him miss Sabon too xD

  • @s.p.d.magentaranger1822
    @s.p.d.magentaranger1822 Před 4 měsíci +6

    Who's here after Toriyama's passing....RIP

  • @SixthAllicard
    @SixthAllicard Před 2 lety +17

    It's so refreshing to come from the other side of the internet where it's just frustrated lonely virginal power scalers who care way too much about what fictional character can beat another fictional character to seeing real authentic analysis and appreciation of a series from it's small to grand innovations without it being centered around who could punch the other the hardest.

    • @SlasherDex
      @SlasherDex Před měsícem

      If you want more of this type of stuff you should check out totallynotmark's review of dragon ball z

  • @SeanGokuu
    @SeanGokuu Před 2 lety +79

    The most telling thing to add on the tonal shift was when he tells Gohan essentially, "leave this area right now before I lose all sense of reason/go in to a blind rage," kind of akin to when Goku transformed in to a giant monkey back then. This time being more like when the Wolfman begins to transform and is telling his loved ones to run away.
    Also part and parcel the reason the "5 minutes" was as long as it was is because back then Toriyama was still working on the manga and Toei was like,"Sheit!! Stall for time! Stall for time!!"

    • @razkable
      @razkable Před 2 lety

      I don't think goku cared about losing himself or gohan safety...he just wanted to proved himself and fight freeza one on one to the end for his people..he wanted to humiliate him and show him mercy prove he was wrong about saiyans and prove why he was the fated chosen one son of his people and rewarded the ssj transformation ...he was also ok losing...he wanted gohan to leave to continue the fight on earth just in case he loses and freeza attacks earth....

  • @quartzintherough
    @quartzintherough Před 2 lety +193

    I love how much Super Saiyan is the epitome of Toriyama's most frequent and prominent advice in storytelling: Less is more.
    He just stuck his hair up and made him blonde, and this is the most iconic transformation in the entire franchise, to the point that 2 out of the 3 series' climactic finales ended with him in this form

    • @jacks1368
      @jacks1368 Před 2 lety +37

      And he did it so he wouldn't have to color in Goku's hair. Crazy lazy bastard.

    • @quartzintherough
      @quartzintherough Před 2 lety +36

      @@jacks1368 Hey, don't go slandering this man like that, he did it so his assistants wouldn't have to color in Goku's hair. He was lazy, but that ain't an example

    • @LeavanDragon
      @LeavanDragon Před 2 lety +30

      @@jacks1368 Mam really plotted out a whole transformation just cut corners. He may be lazy but he's also crafty.

    • @neardarkroad1347
      @neardarkroad1347 Před 2 lety +23

      That stuck up hair also become a staple in anime and manga when the character become stronger in a critical moment.

    • @infinite683
      @infinite683 Před 2 lety +15

      Not even of just the entire franchise. Super Saiyan might be the most iconic power-up/transformation in all of media.

  • @Megabuster919
    @Megabuster919 Před 2 lety +34

    Coming back to this, I now really want to hear Red’s thoughts on Gohan’s arc through the Cell Saga and about the friendship between Hercule and Buu. I think those are two more really strong formative points in DBZ.

  • @FlashX212
    @FlashX212 Před 2 lety +24

    I threw around this idea with a friend, but it would have been cool if Super Sayain kept it's personality shift, "evil" factor like how it did when it hit Goku and Gohan (when he turned Super sayain 2). Imagine if the super sayain system worked like how The Satsui No hadou does from Street Fighter. The higher tier levels of Super Sayain are fully entralled in combat and destruction and take a lot of experience, skill and self control to keep ones self from going berserk. Imagine if Gohan went Berserk in the Cell Saga, kills Cell and it takes a group effort from the Z Fighters to incapacitate him and calm him down. What if characters like Goku, Trunks and Gohan are more wary about using Super sayain while Vegeta is the only one who revels in it. Super Sayain 4 would be the equivalent of Akuma's Oni form, fully embracing the monster and become destruction itself, While the God forms (which kinda does have lore of its own) are the equivalent to Ryu's "nothingness" state, focusing more on peace of mind and power.

  • @rycolligan
    @rycolligan Před 2 lety +45

    “I hope you’re prepared to hear me talk about Dragonball for 40 minutes”
    At last. After all these years.

  • @rashkavar
    @rashkavar Před 2 lety +166

    Vegeta's motivated about the destruction of his home planet, "not because he liked the other Saiyans, it's more the Prince-iple of the thing."
    I see what you did there

  • @benpeterson4673
    @benpeterson4673 Před 4 měsíci +3

    Coming back to appreciate one of the storytelling GOATs.

  • @AlexT7916
    @AlexT7916 Před 4 měsíci +7

    Rest in peace Akira Toriyama, your work has meant so much to so many people

  • @kylemull842
    @kylemull842 Před 2 lety +396

    This video could just be an hour of red and blue charging up their ki and yelling, and I would still watch it at least five times.

    • @liamwhite3522
      @liamwhite3522 Před 2 lety +27

      And they would insist it was only 5 minutes

    • @earnestbrown6524
      @earnestbrown6524 Před 2 lety +6

      A three episode powerup, weak sauce.

    • @Healermain15
      @Healermain15 Před 2 lety +3

      @@earnestbrown6524 It's only the first training arc, give it a few mutual kills and resurrections.

  • @docterfantazmo
    @docterfantazmo Před 2 lety +374

    *Vageta:* "I hate the idea of having a child who could surpass me."
    *Bulma:* "Sounds cringe, bro."

  • @dickle9604
    @dickle9604 Před 2 lety +12

    11:08
    Everybody would’ve forgotten about Nappa if it weren’t for:
    “I am hilarious and you will quote everything I say”

  • @xlixity
    @xlixity Před 2 lety +6

    1) Picolo does bring up his past in passing every now and then.
    The most notable example is when he enters the martial arts tournament during the Boo arc under a pseudonym, much to Goku's puzzlement. Picolo replies that entering by his real name would probably cause panic and histeria, given what happened the last time a Namek named Picolo entered the tournament some 20 or so years ago.
    2) No one in my school had any puzzlement what the Super Saiyan was. They weren't subtle about it given how they showed it proudly in the intro from episode 1.

  • @broEye1
    @broEye1 Před 2 lety +289

    There was one other thing Frieza did that I thought pretty important: right after he killed Krillin, he said "now for the boy" or something like that. This was important to me because until Trunks and Goten showed up, I felt like there was a bit of a pattern to the transformations. Just about every time it happened, there was an element of desperation to it. I was it as less a matter of rage than of need. A need so overwhelmingly powerful that everything else disappears and all that's left is having enough power to do what must be done. For Goku, sure avenging Krillin might be able to do this, but stopping his son's murder (even with the way he sees his kids) seems like it at least played a part in pushing him over that edge. And then Trunks and Goten did it just by copying the big kids, and Cabba was able to teach Kale and Caulifla to just focus on a spot on their backs. Seriously, I had no problem with crazy badass Saiyan women, but nerfing the transformation to that level was just wrong.

    • @MB-hc9we
      @MB-hc9we Před 2 lety +39

      "The Super Saiyan transformation comes from a need, not a desire"
      -Somewhere on the dragon ball wiki

    • @Damianweibler
      @Damianweibler Před 2 lety +34

      The U6 Saiyans were supposed to be smart. How much better would it have been if theyd achieved the transformation using technology rather than nerfing it?

    • @absolutelynotgriffith1954
      @absolutelynotgriffith1954 Před 2 lety +22

      @@Damianweibler Like using some machine like the Blutz wave from GT? that would have been awesome, like a stronger, but much more limited super saiyan as a throwback to SS4 to contrast the godly powers of Blue.

    • @broEye1
      @broEye1 Před 2 lety +11

      @@Damianweibler Now that might've been interesting. But then the bar is low; there's not much that'd feel dumber than "just focus your energy on your back".

    • @broEye1
      @broEye1 Před 2 lety +13

      @@MB-hc9we Yeah, I think that line to Gohan was what led to me taking that theory. And it does fit for most of them. In most cases more than rage the core seemed to be desperation. Gohan didn't even have anything to be mad about when he achieved it.

  • @area52ron
    @area52ron Před 2 lety +447

    “Only Frieza can be that stupid to provoke Goku”
    There’s a saying that said “Don’t poke the bear”

    • @Duiker36
      @Duiker36 Před 2 lety +34

      Turns out you shouldn't poke the monkey, either.

    • @FS_Scott
      @FS_Scott Před 2 lety +28

      Oh No Brolly, a stray energy blast has killed your father.

    • @Direwolf1166
      @Direwolf1166 Před 2 lety +9

      I saw a video not long ago of a guy kicking a wild bear. It goes like you think, bear looks around confused and then mauls the guy.

    • @shinobi-no-bueno
      @shinobi-no-bueno Před 2 lety +4

      *100 ft space monkey

    • @justmutantjed
      @justmutantjed Před 2 lety +11

      There's also one that says "When you find yourself in a hole, it's time to stop digging." Frieza ignored that one too.

  • @pietroopendragon
    @pietroopendragon Před 2 lety +24

    I didn't remember that the Super Saiyan had this amount of build up back in the day, and seeing this way now gives me some ideas of how to reveal a secret power that changes the game the right way

  • @nicobones9608
    @nicobones9608 Před rokem +10

    I LOVE this review. What I remember about Goku's motive for wanting to defeat Frieza at his best was that he wants to leave no doubt in Frieza's mind that he could have won. He wants to defeat Frieza in such a way that he will be humbled and finally give up. Kai tries to warn him this won't happen, but Goku wants to give him that chance. Even then, he's trying to save Frieza too.

  • @ChronoShadow69
    @ChronoShadow69 Před 2 lety +249

    51:21 I love that he brings this up, because even Bardock shinanigans aside, there IS some creedence to the idea that Vegeta was right about the Legendary Super Saiyan. Brolly fits the prophesy as well, but he ALSO squeezes in the 'bloodthirsty and incapable of mercy' thing that Vegeta alluded to. And, to cap it all off, he falls more under the traditional prophesy mold that was discussed, in that he just IS that way, no training required.
    ...and he was also non-cannon for decades.

    • @andrewsuryali8540
      @andrewsuryali8540 Před 2 lety +36

      The canonical Legendary Super Saiyan from 1000 years ago blew up the original Saiyan homeworld. That's why Vegeta and the rest of the Saiyans remember him as an utterly merciless scourge of worlds. Planet Vegeta, the second Saiyan homeworld, was named that because it was conquered by King Vegeta.
      Also, Toriyama didn't just canonize Broly. He canonized Bardock in the same movie, and this Bardock is very different from Z's Bardock. He's basically a sneaky and smarter Goku now.

    • @carso1500
      @carso1500 Před 2 lety +14

      The Saiyans actually have a bunch of prophesies like the super saiyan god for example

    • @johnnygyro2295
      @johnnygyro2295 Před 2 lety +11

      @@andrewsuryali8540
      I like the theory that Yamoshi and Cumber were the first two Super Saiyans and fought on opposing sides of the civil war on Planet Sadala. Yamoshi almost won by using the Super Saiyan God ritual, but the time limit ran out, allowing Cumber to kill him. That victory was short lived though, since Sadala pulled a Namek and exploded, leading to the surviving Saiyans having to move elsewhere and with the historical war between Super Saiyans possibly being degraded into a legend that there was only one who accidentally destroyed their planet.

    • @smrutismarak9503
      @smrutismarak9503 Před 2 lety +2

      @@carso1500 no... When did they have a prophecy for that?

    • @carso1500
      @carso1500 Před 2 lety +6

      @@smrutismarak9503 its mentioned in both the movie and the tv series by shenron

  • @LilyArlatto
    @LilyArlatto Před 2 lety +417

    It's funny how the "4 saiyans left" thing was a reference to Journey but then later on was retconned to be 7 saiyans, if you include Tarble, Broly, and Paragus

    • @thekenyonsquad5672
      @thekenyonsquad5672 Před 2 lety +38

      If I remember correctly, the super broly movie had a scene showing vegeta, nappa, and raditz reacting to the news of their planet exploding and there were 1 or 2 other saiyans shown with them.

    • @carso1500
      @carso1500 Před 2 lety +35

      @@thekenyonsquad5672 we can supose that those died in the like 20 years between the explosion of planet Vegeta and the Saiyan saga

    • @jacobhealy8376
      @jacobhealy8376 Před 2 lety +4

      Tables not cannon

    • @patrickwamono7672
      @patrickwamono7672 Před 2 lety +37

      @@jacobhealy8376 he’s referenced in super. not by name but bulma asks vegeta if he could call his brother to help with the ssj god ritual.

    • @jarrettodom3943
      @jarrettodom3943 Před 2 lety +28

      @@jacobhealy8376 He is in fact cannon now, during the event's of the battle of gods ark when Beerus shows up. all the saiyans need to pool their energy into Goku so he can become the saiyan god. But they need six saiyans to do this and only have five, which prompts Bulma to ask Vegeta what if they asked his brother Tarble.

  • @anonymousperson4214
    @anonymousperson4214 Před 2 lety +14

    As someone who managed to miss the pop culture osmosis on this one, THIS WAS FANTASTIC!

  • @MASHo1992
    @MASHo1992 Před 2 lety +30

    57:50 Really? In Latin America, we had such a great voice acting it became a benchmark of voice acting for us. There are some other gems like Kung Fu Panda but every discussion about voice acting goes back to DBZ.