Hope you enjoyed! If you want my bonus videos, including the two hours of me yelling about Avatar on which this video is based, here's my Patreon! www.patreon.com/bigjoel
The opening action scene with Sozen has a really important point actually: to show us how hardcore the show is. “Did you see how he just burned that guy alive? Like on-screen?” *You can’t do that on Nickelodeon.* But we CAN do that. because we’re on Netflix. It’s different. Please watch it. Please.”
Which is made worse by the fact that they had an adult man burn a child’s face off just barely out of frame on Nickelodeon. They made it less dark by making it more dark
It's like a child's idea of an adult show. "All the characters are no fun and don't play because that's what adults do and fight scenes are cool and flashy and the most important part. Who cares if they make sense?"
@@IAmNotAWoodenDuckThis will never not be the weirdest thing about adult media to me. Why are writers absolutely convinced that adults either hate jokes and fun, or only enjoy excessively vulgar jokes. There is literally no inbetween.
I'm honestly flabbergasted that they found an actor that perfectly captured Bumi's appearance, voice and mannerisms and then went ahead and changed his character to be boring and miserable.
Yeah the actor killed it as Bumi. And the actor is a very guy in the roles he plays. But instead of playing to the actor’s strengths and keeping Bumi as he should be, they made him into this traumatized, angry and bitter old man which is character assassination.
He's the reason I gave up on the show. When he was mad at aang for "Playing games and not focusing on being a better avatar" when HE'S THE ONE TRAPPING HIM AND KEEPING HIM FROM MOVING ON. Made even worse when sokka and katara are in the... cave of lovers... 😩
What makes me so viscerally irritated about the "we have to appeal to people who like Game of Thrones" is that it perfectly encapsulates how to throughly misunderstand the entire point of ATLA. They have politics, good character psychology, and violence in common. That's it. The true tragedy of Avatar is that it's centered on the point of view of CHILDREN. Children seeing the results of colonization, war, and genocide. That is ESSENTIAL to the emotional pathos of the entire show. Aang is a child. Katara is a child who got parentified. Sokka too to a similar extent. Zuko is an abused and brainwashed child. Azula is a product of abusive grooming. The most powerful moments of the show emphasize small moments of human connection, and the fact that. They. Are. CHILDREN.
To be fair though that's also the position the stark kids find themselves in the first season, though some of them are aged up from the book. And also Daenerys which is a teenager
Additionally, I find this take "we have to appeal to people who like Game of Thrones" super jarring as an Asian. ATLA took huge inspiration from (mostly) Asian cultures--cultures that are rich and amazing on their own right. GoT on the other hand was set during the medieval ages. Why do the showrunners have to make it appealing to Western audiences? Why was there a need to pander to them? Are the Asian cultures the original series inspired from not enough to make it great? I can go on and on about how Western powers invaded most Asian countries and brought colonial mentality and how I can personally see it influencing their decision to pander to GoT fans (like ONLY through pandering to the West would make the show successful, not great storytelling in itself) but that would be a tl;dr moment. My point is that Asian culture, MY culture, is beautiful, rich, and amazing enough to be a great backdrop to an amazing story. There wasn't a need to please them. Just make it a great adaptation and it will be successful.
Also it just completely fails at appealing to "mature" audiences, no? I'm at the part of the video featuring bumi, and this dude is completely ridiculous in every way.
@@jankbunky4279 it's amazing how they swapped it around, since Aang is defying Bumi and Kyoshi in the adaptation and teaches the adults. There really is no point at all of Aang being a child in the adaptation. None.
This is the moment I knew it was going to be bad and stopped watching as a fan of the OG, and started watching as a critic of yet a other piece of crap made in netflix... ( glad I did because the OG fan would have had its hope crushed hundred of times though the season, now I feel nothing and just roll my eyes each time I see something bad ) Changing such a important point plot, event the movie didn't dare do it and on this aspect was better than the show...
The crazy thing is doing that and then doubling down on making characters blame Aang for running away. The show seems to be written as if every character is interacting not with the actual versions of the characters that appear on screen but a half remembered caricature of the original.
@@TheNotshauna its wild how the show that was made for kids did a better job of tackling adult topics than a show made for adults. i know exactly what you mean about caricatures, it feels like netflix atla was made because someone tried to get their adult friend to watch avatar and their friend said "no way, thats for kids" so netflix made a version of avatar with the "adult highlights" to sort of tl;dr the original.
They probably removed Sokka’s sexism because they couldn’t find a way to portray it as a bad thing without having to ask themselves a bunch of uncomfortable questions about how they write female characters lol
Lmao right? The point of sokka's initial sexism was to prove that he wasn't in the right. But they can't do that here when the writing is actually sexist (aka he's right in-verse).
the earth soldier: you burned 100s of people alive until there was nothing left of them but ash, you monster! *slaps Iroh* Iroh: Ah, but you just slapped me. Who's the real monster here, hmmmm?
the line about hakoda not caring about "stuff like that" was soooooo annoying. hakoda is also an inventor and sokka clearly gets that from his dad. sokka does feel insecure in the cartoon, but hakoda never looks down on his son and always feels proud of him. hakoda is a minor side character all considered, but i absolutely hate what they did with him.
@@TriforceWisdom64 RIGHT??? I immediately thought that and went uuum did these people actually watch the show lol? It seems like they were trying to maybe set up a false dichotomy between being a warrior and being an inventor with the intent of having Sokka come to the conclusion he can be both simultaneously, but it was very shoddily done.
love how they felt the need to give daddy issues to sokka when there were already two characters from the gaang who had pretty shitty fathers. cant let the water tribe have shit.
What they did to Hakoda fucking infuriated me. He was supposed to be the foil to Ozai. Whereas his love for his children was unconditional, Ozai’s was not. You are NEVER going to convince me that Hakoda wouldn’t be anything but loving and proud to both of his kids, even at their lowest points. And fucking Albert Kim and his team turned this character with a heart of gold into the disappointed father stereotype which is so out of character for Hakoda, it is comical.
It’s actually insane how the director evoked literally ZERO natural feeling scenes - the scenes where the characters just talk to each other are the dullest, most visually barren thing I’ve seen in some time. No hand motions, no kid like movements, and such awkward eye contact and vocal pauses. It’s actually nauseating.
@@vultdylanI wouldn’t say zero. Zhao was absolutely delightful, and I’m like 90% sure he was ad libbing. And Zuko had some cute teenage angst squeals. Bumi was performed extremely well despite how poorly he was written. The rest though… yeah, nah, they ain’t it.
@@thevioletbee5879 I think that means those actors are the exception. Able to take the director's poor input and embody their characters in a meaningful way. Honestly, it makes me curious about their past and future work if they were able to withstand the director and maintain some semblance of quality.
It's so insane how they removed Sokka's character flaws because the "misogyny was outdated" but then stripped Katara of all of her agency by making Aang basically spoonfeed her everything she knows. Like all she needed was a boy to explain to her how to do anything at all. Thanks for removing the misogyny, netflix!
Not to mention Sokka's sexism was there specifically so he could grow from it and learn it's wrong. They removed blatant anti misogyny and replaced it with subtle misogyny. Thanks Netflix
Just for the sake of the story it also turns so many plot threats into being about absolutely nothing. These scenes only make sense in relation the original show but they're still in this Live Action one pretending that they've done the actual character work. It's just going from taking anti sexist stance to not doing that.
replaced anti-sexism with: A passive, man-dependent Katara and a Suki that had to coddle Sokka's sense of pride. They couldn't have inverted these themes more if they tried.
What upset me most about the change to Bumi was Aang never getting to have that touching reunion with his old friend. In the animated show after Aang finds out Bumi's identity, he jumps in for a hug and you can see the tears welling up in his eyes. It really helped to heighten how, even though he lost so much in those 100 years, he still had his old friend who still cared for him. Now, changing it wouldn't have been bad except for the reasons you said in the video: he is now seemingly angry at Aang for not taking the war seriously despite A) Aang not meaning to be gone for those 100 years and B) After coming back, Aang is very aware of the stakes and isn't fooling around at all. Now it just feels we lost a touching moment for one that makes no sense.
Not just an old friend who cared for him, an old friend whose personality is identical to when he knew him as a kid. For Aang, only Appa remained from before he was frozen, everything else was gone, so it hits so hard that Bumi was still around and didn't change one bit.
It makes more sense for Bumi to assume Aang dead Also I got an idea of what if some boomer or gen x got forzen or something like feird form Futurama and wake up in 2002 or 2016 andhoe that affect him or her and seeing their freind as elder or in their 50s while they're still 8 I got that idea form avatar lol
And ok, aang becoming katara’s “teacher” isn’t just misogynist and insulting, their whole dynamic is that Katara had to grow up too fast and aang hasn’t fully grown into his own role as the avatar so katara helps him mature as a bender and a person but aang helps her remember that she’s a kid who deserves to be a kid
Yeah, in the beginning of season one Aang was better at water bending than Katara, but that was only because she hadn't been properly trained in bending like Aang had. And when he was, unknowingly, being inconsiderate in how he taught her she didn't just take and let him know it annoyed her
and ultimately even if Aang is a natural doesn't mean that is superior to Katara. She learns to work hard and smartly in a way that Aang sometimes is incapable. Aang is explosive, Katara is careful and throughout. Sometimes we're impressed with quick results and not see the whole picture and how people have different necessities, capabilities and expressions of ability in the same things. I guess is part of the Iroh teachings of lightning reflection techniques to Zuko, only made narratively coherent in the story.
I felt so hard, in the original, the way she kind of defaults to mothering both Aang and Sokka, and the way the original show makes it really clear that being a sister is different from being a mom? Losing the sexist origins of that dynamic seems to throw off that whole thing and leave them all in a weird place.
Lol I love the fact the show creators gloated about fact it removed the intentional sexism to just make the one major female lead a damsel in distress that is useless without pep talks of the men around her.
Pisses me off so bad bc there's SO MANY EPISODES (especially after they lose Appa) where Katara keeps the group together and is the motivating force behind everyone. And they stripped her of all her strength. One of the best female characters in animation and they just ripped up everything that made her cool
they decided to make the world sexist instead of making characters sexist. seen this many times, with racism too. kind of a devil's trick. also reminds me of many centrist/liberal ppl, who can't see much of sexism/racism bc they think of it as a purely individual flaw.
The way Katara needed Sokka to tell her to fight Master Paku... did they not even understand the point of that entire sequence of events and how that was important in the original for her to... y'know... tell a sexist asshole off on her own?
Aang telling the water bender soldier guy "Sorry, I can't do anything about the imminent fire nation invasion because airbending is all about evading and avoiding conflict" just betrays how little the writers understand or care about the original material. The phrase "evade and avoid" is lifted directly from the episode of the cartoon where Bumi and Aang fight, and Bumi says it to Aang specifically because Aang keeps dodging his attacks without going on the offensive. It's a dig. It's a taunt. It's not meant to be a good-faith observation about the air nomads' cultural ethos. The fact that the writers of the Netflix adaptation took it that way is really frustrating.
And we see in Korra and the kyoshi novels that a master airbender is insanely strong and literally like a force of nature… kyoshis air bending master has a moniker of the ‘the living typhoon’ because he used his air bending to completely destroy an entire fleet of pirate ships
So much of what people have to say about Netflix Avatar is “Yeah, it might be bad, but at least it’s not as bad as M. Night’s Avatar”, so I’m finally satisfied by hearing someone make the argument that it actually might be conceptually worse 💀
The "it's not as bad as M Night's version" is an immediate losing argument, because it's pretty hard to be worse than one of the most notoriously bad adaptations ever made.
I love how people make that argument as if making something better than M Night's unspeakable movie isn't an insanely low bar to meet, Netflix focused primarily on staying head above the surface and not much else
This is a problem in everything. Even The VVitch, which is a great movie with an incredible eye for period detail made the family look like they had a washer-dryer in the back.
@born2hula325 the v vitch is a perfect example. The costuming *is* accurate for the period. But it, like pretty much every period show/movie, makes the clothes look brand new. Off the top of my head the only times I've seen well worn costumes was LOTR and game of thrones. Especially the hobbit's cloaks, and the starks' clothes. The Hobbit's cloaks look like they've been worn many dozens of times. There is bobbling and tattered edges, the colour looks like it's been faded from the sun or washing them too much. Similarly in game of thrones, you can notice the difference in wealth by not only the type of clothes characters wear (eg Lannistars VS Starks) but also how worn they are. Rich characters have shirts and blouses that look ironed. Poorer characters have clothes with stains, rips, and fading colours. Not to mention the difference in style. The Starks for instance are still nobles of the north, but wear clothes that are more utilitarian
This is actually one of the few shows where there's actually a really easy explanation for clean clothes -- waterbending. Too bad they never show Katara bending water out of wet clothes and leaving the characters clean like they do in the OG.
I’m so glad you commented exactly what I was going to comment in defense of your critique style *drinks booze to get me through this supportive comment reply*
I sorta hate the twist that the battalion Zuko defended ended up being assigned as his crew because it's so nonsensical. It seems like a reward, like Zuko got his way in that war planning meeting. That Ozai begrudgingly gave him what he wanted after Zuko had done enough penance and it weirdly frames Zuko's abuse as heroic??? In cannon that battalion dies, and Zuko is burned for daring to even question the decision, and that shows you exactly who Ozai is. This show seems so weirdly uncomfortable with making its male characters anything less than the coolest most heroic noble motherfuckers on earth, such to the point it can't even really allow them vulnerability and genuine pain.
Like it would have been one thing if it was framed with Ozai being just a cruel obsessive bastard then it could be him taking out his anger on soldiers who know nothing about what Zuko did. This show just can’t decide what it wants its characters to be.
i actually hate that aang meets gyatso in the spirit world and he just forgives him for everything and they hug and smile. it takes away from aangs journey as a character- his grief over losing his people and his guilt over not being there when it happened. it felt like shallow fan service...and don't get me started on that scene of gyatso staring at the camera telling aang he'll "always be his friend"...oh brother !! they gave gyatso the "wife that dies in the beginning of the movie" treatment 😭
I found it REAL weird that Aang, who is supposed to learn water-bending, talks to Kitara like she's a second-grader, when he SHOULD be asking HER how the hell she's doing what she's already capable of. He needs to learn from HER, not the other way around.
In fact, that’s an entire character arc in the show! That’s why Katara stole the water bending scroll from those pirates, because she was supposed to be Aang’s teacher but Aang, being the avatar, learned basically everything she had to teach him very quickly. It feels LUDICROUS that Katara would ever take a condescending compliment from that “twelve-year-old schmendrick”.
This show is unironically more sexist than the original, even though they removed Sokka's sexism specifically because people were saying having a main character be sexist is bad (even though his arc involves outgrowing that mindset)
Aang’s whole thing is that he hasn’t grown into being the avatar yet and katara’s whole thing is that she had to grow up too quickly! This version really just infantilizes her and denies aang his arc and it sucks
@@spongecakes1986correction: absolutely no one thought the original show was sexist for having Sokka be sexist. The lazy people in charge of rewriting this show only said that because they lack basic comprehension
@@theshire9173 there were definitely some people who had a problem with it, but it wasn't the majority (for obvious reasons), and was mainly just people who never got over the 2010's pop feminism that also said Cinderella was problematic because she didn't just pull herself up by her bootstraps and leave her abusive family. They also likely never actually watched the show.
They want to appeal to the GoT audience with an adaptation of a kid's show (yes I know it's not JUST for kids but you get what I mean) that has like a PG rating I'm pretty sure. You have fundamentally messed up.
That struck me as PR speak for "Netflix needs every show to appeal to a wide a demographic as possible." It's an absurd take on its' face as the two series have almost nothing in common, besides being "fantasy." GoT=Fantasy to corporate suits, and fantasy is a monolith to milk and market for the executive soulless ghouls who likely don't even understand speculative fiction.
@@fy8798 I would disagree. At least, from the perspective of the people making that decision. GoT became a powerhouse cultural phenomenon, reaching massively beyond the typical niche for fantasy. As much as we like ATLA and it is culturally prominent, it is still more niche as a "kids show" than GoT. And kids are not the ones paying for Netflix, and I would guess internal numbers show kids shows don't do so well on streaming in the age of CZcams and TIkTok. I think it is a mistake, both in terms of audience reach and artistic integrity, but you and I and Joel aren't the ones making these stupid decisions. This kind of "replicate the reach of GoT" thing is just how corporate suits think.
right? what a weird statement to begin with, why do they want to appeal to that audience? why not appeal to the audience who .. fell in love with the original show? lol
i’m sad they removed katara stealing the waterbending scroll from pirates that stole it first… netflix thinks this is a remove all of katara’s agency, nuance, spunk, maturity, and personality challenge (they’re winning)
Wolf Cove? Dont they mean Polar Wolfbear Cove? Are you sure they didnt live in Leopard Wolfseal Cove? Or maybe it was Moosewolf Cove? Nope... just Wolf Cove. Weird.
It's one of those details that shows the writers just didn't care about worldbuilding beyond when they literally took readymade chunks of it from the original. Wolves are not shown as a prominent part of the fauna, and the flora doesn't suggest wolves being around at all (they'd massacre the penguins, but then IIRC they aren't actually shown in the Netflix CG version?). Call it Sixflippered Penguin Town, it would be funny, and that is missing from this adaptation anyway, the fun!
I noticed that Netflix Avatar is so scared of having the main characters be flawed that they have nowhere to develop. Sokka isn't sexist, so there's nothing interesting about his interactions with Suki. Aang didn't run away from his responsibilities, so everyone else just seems unnecessarily cruel to this child who did nothing wrong. Katara isn't jealous of Aang's bending prowess, so there's no interesting emotional development as she learns bending. Zuko doesn't burn down Kyoshi's village, so he never feels as much like an antagonist who gets redeemed; he's treated like he was never villainous in the first place. Azula isn't maniacal; her introductory scene shows her being nervous and unsure as Ozai burns a man, which contrasts with her first appearance in the animation where she's gleeful and proud of her father for burning Zuko. Her downfall can't hit as hard when she's already introduced as a sympathetic character from the get-go.
100%. I don't think the writers understand that perfect characters are incredibly boring. let them be flawed and grow with the story! it's far more realistic AND makes you more invested in the show.
The only reason they should've made those changes is if they had the skills to explore a deeper theme. For instance, the idea of Azula finding the need to be evil in order to serve her father and her nation while hiding the fact that she's just a scared/nervous teen is such an interesting idea...too bad the writers are so untalented they took Katara's character back to the 1950s in terms of femininity. "Thank you for teaching dumb 'ol me, Mister Smart and Strong Man."
I have a feeling they want to make her sympathetic straight from the get go, like Zuko...execpt that's Zuko's arc NOT Azula's. And her possible redemption won't hit as hard if she's just standing by while her father is cruel, she may not take part like in the animated one but she's still there? She won't have her fall from grace before getting back up again, and even then we never really see her get back up again unless you read the graphic novels.
The way they did Katara so dirty but glorified Sokka was insane. The fact that a show ran in 2005!!! Did gender deconstruction and girlhood representation than a show in 2023 WITH THE SAME SOURCE MATERIAL is honestly so demoralizing. This whole series is that pathetic nostalgia driven project we see everywhere. OH BOY CAN'T WAIT TO UPDATE THAT THE PLACE KATARA AND SOKKA GREW UP IN IS CALLED WOLF COVE ON THE AVATAR WIKI and feel nothing about it
We are removing Sokka's sexism because sexism bad. But also... We are removing Katara's character and bending skills while propping up our male characters as just the best guys around
@@spongecakes1986 I don't mind Sokka's sexism getting removed. A dude having a "girls are actually people!!" arc is one of the few things that dates the original Avatar as a show clearly made in 2005. But! They needed to replace the sibling conflict with something else. I'm flabbergasted they didn't replace it with Sokka having bending-envy, since that was barely explored in the original series. It's a *much* stronger conflict.
"that's why I need to master all the bending disciplines? to become strong?" I distinctly remember Aang wanting his first firebending master to teach him how to blast fire and was deeply disappointed when they started with breathing techniques. He's often quite impatient to learn how to do cool, creative and powerful things with bending...like a kid.
More than that, it causes him to act out and he ends up badly burning Katara. That in itself becomes a huge boulder that needs to be moved in the future when he is literally scared of firebending because he might hurt someone he loves.
It's been a while since I've seen the episode, but I seem to remember that also being his attitude during his first earthbending lesson, he wanted to do something cooler than just moving a big rock.
Its something a lot of people can relate to, people want to be great at something without understanding that to get there you need to master the fundamentals. Its non negotiable to build a strong foundation first.
aang had much difficulty learning earth bending with toph, being unable to learn how to move the earth because earth bending is the opposite to air bending, and toph brings out the deep seated feelings of aang and his power, him being unafraid to change the earth itself@@Sugarman96
I think I realized why the way Netflix handles teaching bending feels so hollow. In the original, when Aang or other characters learn how to bend, their masters usually tie bending to a life lesson that The character needs to learn as well. One of the best examples of this is Aang learning earth bending from Toph. As an air bender, Aang is used to deftly avoiding attacks when fighting. However, in order to learn earthbending, he literally has to plant his feet and face his enemies head on. This idea is tied to the fact that Aang also needs to learn how to face his problems head on, as he has been running away from his problems from a while. Learning earth bending therefore doesn’t just make him a stronger avatar, but a more healthy person as well, as he learns how to better confront his problems in life. The original goes great lengths to show that the Avatar isn’t just strong because they have all 4 bending techniques, but because they are an extremely studied individual who knows and lives by a mixture of all nations’ cultures and life philosophies. Uncle Iroh even points out that non-Avatars can benefit both strength wise and mentally from learning about the other cultures in the world. The bending is much more than just a power system in the original, it’s a way of life and the way it works ties heavily into the philosophy the corresponding nations live by. Netflix doesn’t give a shit about any of this, so they treat it like some shallow way to make the fights look cool, so they just throw words like “energy” and “balance” to seem profound.
Agree for all of this Also ironically this kind of reasoning is one of the reason why i don't mind the "avatar's elemental opposite became personality opposite" retcon in korra compared to other retcon's in that shows even though i would like that they explore more on that concept
I don't think it was a tetcon. I remember the original talking about balance between the avaters personality. Kurok was too lax so kyoshi was too stern which lead to Roku who lead to Aang.
I think it's possible the reason "Wolf Cove" sounds stupid is because wolves don't... exist... in the Avatar universe.... every animal is a hybrid of two or more normal animals. Like they repeatedly talk about how weird it is the Earth King just has a BEAR, not a platypus bear or something
it makes it feel like they wanted every interaction to be clipped for a tiktok or reel so we can comment some iteration of “wow… that was so deep/profound/etc.” :/ not good when by the end of this video i could predict “tastes like…… home” in the exact same strained, dramatic tone
its so juvenile, and im saying this as a teenager. they want to sound profound but they have no idea how, so theyre just bullshitting the whole way through. and its SO obvious when you pay attention. the whole energy and balance thing aang was going on about in the beginning sounded so much like an actual 12 year old trying to sound cool it cracked me up.
@@charadefae Yeah I think this is at the core of it. You can tell when writers are focused more on writing quotable lines than they are on writing dialogue that's meaningful in the context of the work. The last couple seasons of Game of Thrones were like that too
I cannot for the life of me get over how they made Zuko’s scar look. The original scar is literally one of the most recognisable pieces of character designs there is, it’s so severe that it partially blinded and deafened him and overall completely changed his face. It’s such a great symbol of how brutal the fire nation is. Live action Zuko looks like he’s got a rash.
Like people have birthmarks that look like that, it doesn't look like a scar at all, and it's almost insulting they act like it's some big deal in the show when it's so unnoticeable
which makes it ten times funnier when the scene where they reveal the scar is so dramatic. “Look at how normal this one side of his face is! Bet you expect the other side to be normal too!! But oh boy just wait til we show you!!” and it just sorta looks like zuko got into the poison ivy a couple days ago. like yeesh someone get this kid some calamine lotion stat
I'm not disagreeing with your point about the brutality of th scar being important, but... did it actually impact his vision or hearing? I've heard fans say that, but I can't recall any instance of the show saying that.
@@vanessaweber5965 as far as i know, its just a popular head canon everyone kind of collectively agreed on. because while it may not be canon, im not sure its possible to have fire that close to such important things like your eyes or ears without damaging them at all.
@@vanessaweber5965 it’s implied in the visuals more than the dialogue. Zuko’s burn is most severe over his eye, causing it to be slightly closed, and his ear is withered up from the flames. Those kinds of physical injuries are very likely to limit his ability to see and hear as they completely change how his sensory organs are structured Iirc there’s also a detail that Zuko usually sleeps with his scarred ear to the ground but when he’s with Iroh he sleeps on the other side, which would make him a lot more vulnerable as he wouldn’t be able to hear people coming as well
Netflix: Look we’re killing people on screen!!! We’re the adult show!!!! That would never happen in cartoons!!!!!! Nickelodeon with Legend of Korra, several years ago: Hey what if an airbender sucked all the air out of someone’s lungs
Wait wait wait, the two people who walk through the tunnel of love, a tunnel made by lovers, for lovers, is Katara and... Sokka? The siblings? What? Huh?
I cant believe what they did with Iroh; he doesnt start questioning the Fire Nation when he realizes the Avatar is a child, he completely lost his faith in the Fire Nation when his son died in Ba Sing Se. Not because "Im sad my kid died," but because he realized that every solider of the Earth Kingdom he has killed was someones son/daughter, brother/sister, and that completely breaks his will. He doesnt even start teaching Zuko his true Fire Bending skills until he realizes he hates the Fire Nation and what it has come to stand for as much as he does
Honestly this comment highlights my only (minor) issue with this video so far in that Joel of unusual size kinda reduces season one Iroh (in the original show) to a character perfectly fine with the fire nation and so down for some evil when in reality he’s trying to help Zuko come to a realization that hunting the Avatar and trying to impress his dad may not be the right path essentially from day one-only he doesn’t do this by directly telling Zuko to stop because he correctly recognizes that if he leaned into that from the start Zuko would ditch him I dunno, I just don’t think that summary of his character was completely fair to his true motivations
He was a member of the White Lotus from the very beginning in the original, so he definitely wasn't loyal to the current Fire Nation. However, he really loved Zuko and taught him well enough to best Xiao. He wanted Zuko to switch sides, but never intentionally held back techniques or anything like that. True unconditional love.
@@unrighteous8745also zuko wouldn't be ready to accept that the fire Nation was the bad guys. He cannot outwardly share his disdain because he has to slowly convince zuko.
@@puffena9013 He is lightning bending Zuko. He's channeling his rage from one location to another. He knows Zuko is too concentrated on proving himself that he wouldn't listen so redirection is the best bet.
@@MegaEliteAwesome lmao I just got done posting a long rant about this! I read Iroh the same way. White Lotus from day one, emotional supports and guides Zuko unconditionally, but it's precisely because Zuko doesn't listen to him (not to enough to unlearn his nationalistic upbringing) that Iroh can't just "show him this isn't the way." The show and this video kind of hit the nuance of Iroh and Zuko's dynamic. Iroh loves and supports Zuko, but desperately wants him to change course and knows Zuko has to come to that conclusion in his own time. His uncle can't just tell him to stop it 😅
It's crazy how they managed to make Katara saying Aang is her family feel so soulless and fake, when they had so much more time to build to it. I love that scene in the original show, because I see an extra layer to it, which comes precisely from the fact that it happens so early. With the way that line is delivered, it feels like Katara is deciding in that moment that Aang is her family now. Yes, she cares about him already and has embarked on a whole journey across the world with him, but as she's seeing him experience this immense pain and loss, she's deciding that she will step up and be there for him. It speaks not only to their relationship, but her character as well.
Can we talk about how GOOD the original was at hitting a different mood each episode? tons of inconsequential scenes in a town, forest, a river or a cave just burned into my retina because of the particular time of day or weather on top of the world design and shot composition. Amazing Shots on CZcams did an incredible compilation.
There’s one minor detail that I’m *very* annoyed they left out, Katara’s line “it’s not magic, it’s waterbending”. Because that’s a *crucial* piece of info that tells the audience early on how people in this world view the act of bending. It’s a martial art with well-understood rules and boundaries, not this wishy-washy ethereal thing that changes depending on what the plot needs.
Cutting sokka’s response to this and the fact that aang teaches katara water bending flattens away the culturally significant impact of bending to the lore too imo
Honestly I still think the line is kinda silly because, Like, Yeah no it actually is magic, Though. Just because it has rules, And constraints as to what it can do, Doesn't make it not magic. Although I suppose "Magic" itself isn't a clearly defined term, The fact that I can write these words on a piece of glass, And then people across the world can read them on their own pieces of glass, To someone say 1000 years ago could only be explained as magic, Even if you tell them the mechanics of how it works, How electricity works, How the signals are transmitted, Et cetera, They would likely still see it as magic. So I suppose in that way we could say bending isn't magic, Because it's known about and explained to the characters in the universe, But the way I see it, If bending isn't magic, Then magic in most any other fictional universe which features widespread magic _also_ isn't magic, Because they know what it is, How it works, Its explainable.
@@dynawesomeHowso? The Lion Turtles established that they were energy benders capable of giving and taking bending at the end of ATLA. Them being the origins is pretty obvious in hindsight.
They took away Sokka's sexism at the expense of character development to water down his flaws, and in turn made the show a million times more sexist by having Suki and Katara, two of the strongest female characters ever written, only react and change as characters thanks to the actions of the male characters. Absolute insanity. Talk about missing the mark completely.
They removed Sokka's sexism because it made them uncomfortable and required them to give screentime to the women who prove him wrong. It was a mirror to their own biases and they didn't like what they saw.
@@spongecakes1986They seem to be pretty uncurious people based on their incredibly shallow grasp of the source material. Never attribute to malice what could equally be explained by stupidity.
When they announced that Sokka's sexism was gonna be left out of the show, (and also after it dropped) its defenders tried to make the point that it was only a tiny part of the first season anyway and that it was resolved in episode 4 of the cartoon. That's just wrong. Sokka learns a lesson, yes. But it's an integral part of a larger character arc and also part of the worldbuilding. The watertribes are sexist. The southern one a little less than the northern one but that's probably due to all the men leaving to fight in the war so the women are left with a bit more authority. And Sokka, who is the closest thing to a grown man the village has, tied his ego to this supposed superiority. Once he learns about sexism as a flaw, he tries to fill that sense of specialness he felt about being a man with other things. To the point where he feels like he's useless in season 3. He is searching and searching for his selfworth and it takes him just as long as it takes Aang to master all of the elements to finally find it and to be okay with not being superior.
Yeah, that’s ultimately Sokka’s greatest character trait: he is teachable. So to have him start the show with all his greatest lessons already learned does a severe disservice to his character.
That arc doesn't require Sokka to be an out and proud misogynist though. I agree that Sokka's portrayal in the Netflix show is bad, since he lacks a character at all, but they could still give him a character while not making him such an explicitly sexist idiot like he was in the original show. Sokka could be petty and jealous of Katara's water bending, causing him to belittle her and be antagonistic towards her when she uses it. He could be a sore loser, unwilling to admit defeat when overpowered by the better coordinated Kyoshi warriors, claiming they used underhanded tactics or cheated to avoid admitting they're better than him. He could be easily seduced by the sexism of the Northern Water Tribe when the NWT leaders respect him as a fighter, so he refuses to support Katara when she complains about how they mistreat her. He could learn in each case that his attitude is wrong, and even learn to recognize how he is in fact being sexist in each case. None of this requires the cartoonish sexism he displays in season 1 of ATLA, where he is an out and proud misogynist. I think, in 2024, it could have been great to show the far more common subtler ways sexism presents itself in people and societies. Basically I think I would prefer to see a more Season 1 Mako-esque version of Sokka.
@@wirelessbaguette8997 All of these a re good points, and just goes to show that it's definitely not a bad thing that they retconned Sokka's misogeny. What is problematic is they didn't replace it with any negative character flaws, and he became the surface-level comic relief his character was designed to subvert. I don't think Sokka's sexism has to be part of the show, but the flaws he _does_ have are too important to drop.
It’s also a commentary on how colonialism pushes people towards harmful ideals. Would the sexism and rigid gendered roles in the southern water tribe be as prevalent if they hadn’t been at war for the past hundred years? (Which is beautifully contrasted with the institutional sexism of the northern water tribe.)
The actor playing Aang keeps delivering bewildered lines with the same confused inflection as Dewey from Malcom in the Middle. I know a part of it is the fact that it's hard to emote properly in a big, empty green-colored room. But it also feels like the directors gave him NOTHING.
Very true, the kid seems like a genuinely talented actor, and the casting is the only reason I kept watching (my roommate was watching it regardless so why not), but the whole show has this cardboard vibe that kinda infects it, which I can only assume is the writers and directors decision, they (the actors) did what they could with what they had, it’s such a shame
Fam the direction let him down so hard. I forget what it was but there was another line delivered by a completely different character with like exactly the same tone and inflection as aang displays all season and it really just made me realize how much they were coaching aang's actor into giving this exact performance. It's truly a baffling decision.
Yeah that was my first thought. When he's laughing and playing, he genuinely looks like a kid. Then when he talks it's like I'm overly aware that I'm watching a kid do his best to "act".
SO true, the moment where Katara says plums remind her of home and he looks... awkwardly thoughtful I guess. I'm pretty sure he was directed to look sad about how his own home has been reduced to ash. But I'm willing to bet the actor is capable of more obvious emoting; he's done great in some other scenes. I fully believe he's being directed to do this incredibly subtle, adult, repressed style of acting which A) is harder to do well, B) doesn't fit the tone of the show, no, not even the Netflix adapted version,, and C) makes NO DAMN SENSE FOR HIS CHARACTER. I get they're doing a "dark avatar" where aang is traumatized, in denial, self-loathing, blah blah blah. It just SUCKS and isn't even convincing imo. It's more fun to watch characters be emotive, like Zhao being loudly deranged or Zuko burning with rage. They could at least show Aang struggle to withhold his emotions if he's supposed to be covering up his internal feelings. Or have him lash out in annoyance at Katara for bringing it up because it triggered awful buried feelings. The show is just sad and boring to watch except when the Zuko, Zhao, or Ozai is on screen...... I don't believe Aang's depiction at all. Traumatized children of Aang's age still have plenty of moments of child-like innocence, they're still capable of having fun, in many ways children adapt to trauma more flexibly than adults do. Tragic that the idea of "children with trauma" exists and is even well-understood, but it's true. Without fuller adult understanding of justice, self-compassion, grief etc., many people compartmentalize and largely ignore or forget traumatic experiences in order to cope. I'm not saying there will be 0 differences from a child who did not experience any trauma. But in daily life, there will be plenty of moments where they are indistinguishable from one another. It's often rather difficult to identify children who have suffered trauma without physical signs, sadly.
" delivering bewildered lines": Unfortunately the problem with this show is that everyone is talking way to much, especially Aang and Sokka. It get's so annoying and it ruins the things that are great in this show.
The main character of "The World Ends With You" attempts to murder his partner character in the first 30 minutes of the game. He only stops because the circumstances literally _require_ people to operate in pairs and he's just dead if he goes it alone. That's how selfish he is.
But by the end of the game he's willing to carry the whole frigging world on his shoulders to save one person, and it's not because he's just naturally good. He had to learn to care about people and it makes the whole thing feel fresh and earned. Flaws are cool. We love monsters and bullies and villains because they wear their desires openly. Let main characters be flawed about stuff and then fix them (or their circumstances) and we'll howl for *moar.*
I feel like the original iroh would've never said the "but we were at war" line. I feel like he'd have just said he's sorry and can't turn things back. Like that was demonstrated pretty well in the episode he tries to help the mugger and cries about his son. He feels sad about having been unable to help his son. Like he was able to do with the mugger.
Removing Sokka's sexism would be like if Disney remaked Emperor's New Groove and made Kuzco less of an a-hole, despite the whole point of the original is that HE'S SUPPOSE TO BE ONE. Oh Geez, if they remake that movie.... man, why am I suggesting more ideas to Disney?! NOOO!!!!
@@osmanyousif7849 Kuzco is a stand-up guy who gives the peasants everything they want and more, and Yzma is a villain who has a tragic backstory centering loosely around Kuzco's father killing her parents to become king or something. The movie begins with a 15-minute sequence of Kuzco's father doing so
People now seem to be afraid of getting "cancelled" for just *depicting* sexism, abuse, etc. But I don't know if they're wrong to worry about it--didn't a Furiosa actor get a bunch of backlash just for playing a terrible character? Seems potentially related to how quick Netflix is to actually cancel shows--they've all gotten risk-averse, and that's resulting in shows that are literally more conservative.
Netflix copyrighted little Joel's cinema sins style video on avatar remake, so big Joel responded with 2 and half video essay as a revenge for little Joel... we need more CZcamsrs who stand up for smaller channels like this.
Mostly, I agree with your points, there are a few things I don't agree with. But thank you, THANK YOU for bringing up Iroh's jerky response to the crew. I had exactly the same impression. The original Iroh was so nice, gentle to the crew. He never criticized them for being mad at Zuko. He acted like "yeah, I know, I'm sorry for him but let me explain". This Iroh is an asshole to the people who are basically abused by their boss. And Iroh thinks it's fine and they should just shut up and suck it up because that boss once defended them and indirectly saved their lives. So few people get it. Thank you once more.
wolf cove feels weird because it is the most insiginificant piece of lore they could have added. The name changes absolutely nothing. The way it is shown reminds me of a 2000s action movie.
A big note on them wanting it to be like games of thrones… the teens in game of thrones act like teens? They goof off, they tease and bully one another. Removing these doesn’t make it more mature.
Not to mention that GRRM himself said that all his stories including ASOIAF, thus including GoT when it was good, are "about the human heart in conflict with itself". That's exactly what Avatar was about as well! These two things were already appealing to the same goddamned audience! It's like the people behind this haven't watched either show.
Re: the child actors, Katara's performance is the biggest indicator to me that the director is at fault, because I've seen this actress, Kiawentiio, turn in some absolutely incredible performances. Seriously, check her out in Anne With An E or Beans - she is extremely talented. The performances here are not indicative of the actors' actual abilities.
I’m sure it would be overwhelming for anyone let alone young actors to act in a green screen with no visual input for hours on end, top that with bad direction, yeah it’s really not the child actors fault
Funny enough, a CZcamsr named Bryan Seeker, does casting for future movie/TV projects. He did one for The Last Airbender and picked Kiawentiio as his first choice. AND THIS WAS TWO YEARS BEFORE THE NETFLIX SERIES WAS RELEASED. Honestly, I’d recommend you go check out his videos as a lot of his castings are pretty swell. If only Hollywood could listen to CZcamsrs.
This is probably overthinking it but Big Joel incorporating the whole drinking alcohol bit on its own without really conveying the same meaning of what he's imitating feels like meta commentary on this adaptation
The deeper analysis is that Joel's entire video essay persona is just the updated version of these jokes. The constant eye rolling, the disinterested voice, the body language, and the holding of the mic to show that production value is below him. This character and the alcohol bit(and the angry reviewer persona at large) communicate the exact same thing: "this is below me". The troubling and even eerie thing is that back in the day it was done as an obvious character. But this breadtuber persona is meant to be accepted by the audience as organic. Joel is unironically doing the modern version of this bit at all times, and it will be similarly lampooned in the near future. If you want another example of this character, watch Leadhead's most recent video. They do it much less convincingly. Once you notice it, it may be distracting.
nearly all of the dialogue and acting from what I can see here reads to me 100% like a Dharr Mann video. it's that same hollow, emotionally flat, uncanny, unnecessarily repeating things that were just said vibe and I can't stop seeing it
Sokka being sexist was not some incidental part of his character. He was a young boy when the men of his tribe left, and as the oldest male left in the tribe, he felt obligated to take the role of defender. It makes sense that a boy that age being forced into a position like that would internalize the traditional gender role he had been assigned, it added depth and realism to his character. Moreover it showed what kind of person he really was when he had his sexism challenged by Suki, and instead of becoming bitter or obstinate, actually grew as a person. Without that arc, Sokka isnt Sokka.
Also! It shows that good people can still and do have biases, and that they can also work to overcome them! And he isn't proven wrong by someone saying "hey that's bad" he's proven wrong through experience. Basic show don't tell
I don't necessarily hate that kind of change. The problem is that they still want to do the story arcs that revolve around his sexism which then become completely aimless.
@@PauLtus_B I was trying to think of a way to articulate this. Basically, it's fine if they wanted to take away that arc - it diminishes Sokka's growth in my eyes, but that's just because I like how well it was handled. What they needed to do, which they completely and utterly failed at, was give him some other kind of meaningful arc to follow.
And it’s so important to his character that he is that young. If we saw an adult man acting the way he does we’d just dislike him, but coming from a 15 year old boy all his flaws are much more empathetic. We understand that he’s not a bad person, he’s just immature and we’re invested in seeing him grow. This actor is 22 and that completely changes the nature of the character
In the end the new writers didn't want sokka to be sexist and learn how to not be because they were too afraid to talk about sexism in nuanced ways like the og show. Almost like they themselves are.... sexist
It really just shows how much care was taken in the original to make a well thought out and intelligent show that treats children as people who can process nuance.
It feels like the producers had a marketing informed checklist of everything they thought would be needed for this show to be a hit. Darker and more realistic tone to capture new adult fans, don’t stray too far from source material so as to not upset original fans, flashy bending scenes, don’t make anything too child centric as to not alienate adults, etc. It feels like they made sure all of these things were true about the show but didn’t bother to think about whether all of these things could come together in a nuanced and artful and satisfying way. Critiquing this show with the assumption that it exists with the primary goal of being a good tv show first and foremost is bound to fail. It primarily exists as a product and was created with this in mind. I know that all shows are products but ideally you would have producers who think the best way to make a financially successful product is to make a truly high quality product. If the creators had any artistic integrity and wanted to make a darker and more gritty take on ATLA they would have aged up the characters and altered the way the plot progresses and the various emotional beats and character arcs to fit with this. They didn’t do this because they probably didn’t want to alienate original fans. What we get then is this weird Frankenstein’s monster of a show where the main characters are still kids but any themes or character development related to childhood, growing up, loss of innocence, immaturity, etc is removed. Literally no reason for the characters in this show to be kids other than continuity with the original show which was either a marketing decision and/or a clear sign that the producers of this show have absolutely no understanding of how the original series functions as a piece of art and entertainment.
It won't stop baffling me that the original ATLA, a brand new IP made for actual kids had enough respect for its audience (of kids) to not just fill the script with exposition and informed attributes. It knew when to show and not to tell and respected the audience enough to know they'll figure stuff out and it knew how to drip feed relevant info about the lore. While the Netflix version which wants to be for grownups, constantly spews lore dumps, even for things we've seen. It's not enough to see Gyatso's skeleton to figure out that he was killed by the Fire Nation, adults watching the show need to be told he was killed as well as being shown him dying.
@@ojgsk8ternow that you put it that way, "dont have things too child centric to not alienate adults," i just realized, is stripping all the whimsy from the show even a sensible way to do that? Because thinking about the characters of both shows, ATLA's cast is like the same age as them in Stranger Things. And i feel like they have the same type of energy, mix of drama and light hearted, child like banter with each other as in Stranger things, and that obviously didnt have any problems with its success. So man, that sucks, it just makes that shitty change in Netflix Avatar seem even less necessary
I agree. In the Netflix version, Aang basically left temporarily because he was stressed and needed some time alone to clear his head. That's actually a very mature thing for a child to do. In the original, he had to learn that despite attempting to run from his responsibility, he was still a child, and the destruction of the air tribe was not his fault, but it was something he needed to prevent from ever happening again. In the Netflix version, people really want him to think it's his fault, even though that makes even less sense than in the original.
I really appreciate you pointing out that Katara is ambitious, determined and passionate, not to mention the point of view character for the whole series. I feel like people tend to forget that, reduce her to a bleeding heart Team Mom. It doesn't help that the show's writing shifts after Toph is introduced, and Katara becomes the wet blanket to Toph's feral child. In Sokka's Master, Katara is pathologically incapable of telling a joke, where in Book 1 she's dishing out quips like "I'd rather eat fireballs than nuts" and is the feisty irresponsible one to Sokka's grumpy straight man. She's willing to steal from pirates and is more likely to take risks like talking to Haru and going to a Fire Nation festival. Sokka's shift to carrying more of the comic relief is another reason for her shift in characterization. I don't think her characterization gets too far off the rails, especially since you can tell that the weight of the war is changing her outlook and priorities, but I do think that people remember her in a reductive way.
What are you talking about? Katara wasn't quippy in Sokka's Master because her brother is gone and she's doing nothing but sitting around all day in the hot sun. Katara and Sokka always quip because they are used to that sibling dynamic, so with him gone and her bored out of her mind, I doubt she'll be quippy when the rest of the group feels incomplete without Sokka there. plus Sokka wasn't "reduced to comic relief", he's always been comedic, but it was never his sole trait. that doesn't affect him as a character, but continues to solidify his personality. plus, Katara has always been a parentified child, taking up "motherly" responsibilities since her mom died and her father left, so she'll obviously act motherly when faced with people like Toph who insist they are independent to show how much she isn't a burden. Katara never saw Toph as a burden, but rather as an extra hand, something Toph didn't register right away given how she was hidden away and coddled her whole life. lastly, Katara's culture is community oriented, meaning the individual is proactive for the good of others. you could almost say her mantra is what she said to the earthbenders to encourage them to escape the fire nation prison: "your fate is in your own hands". that proactive thinking drives Katara from the moment she naively steps out to greet Haru to the moment she seeks revenge for her mother's killer. She is decisive about what actions she takes because she believes her destiny is in her own hands.
It's really wild that for 10+ years a criticism that you could lay at every Netflix adaptation is "They cut stuff out, stretched it out, and replaced it with nothing."
Because filming scenes where things happen is expensive, so we'll just have the characters say all the things we could show, and blow all the budget on CGI fight scenes instead.
I never watched both Avatar, but I wrote a deep and lengthy review of Cowboy Bebop Netflix adaptation and the faults are surprisingly similar. "Replace it with nothing" is about right. How soulless could you be to create these things twice (and more times, presumably).
yeah and even though other ppl dont see it, the one piece LA had this problem too. i personally think it wasnt criticized nearly as much as it shouldve been.
@@worshipthecomedygodseoeunk4010 Liked OPLA. I liked it a lot even. It felt like One Piece. But it is imperfect and it has a lot of those problems. I honestly think the amount of creative control Oda retained was huge to keeping it from becoming another live action casualty
22:36 I always interpreted Zuko being banished unless he found the Avatar as a particularly cruel joke on Ozai's part - "Sure you can come home ... when pigs fly!" When Zuko does come back, his father isn't particularly warm towards him either - Azula is the one who really pushes for his reintroduction at court, mainly so she can use him as a scapegoat if things go wrong.
That was exactly it. Ozai never really expected Aang to reappear and even less so for his son to find and kill him. Seemed like an excuse to not have him around anymore and torture him with false hope. His reaction to Zuko actually succeeding was basically a mild "oh, really now".
I think you're missing the point though, Ozai did treat Zuko nicely when he returned. Welcomed him back and everything. That's why Zuko was so frustrated, cause he DID get everything he ever wanted only to find that he didn't feel fulfilled by it.
@@kaialone I'd argue it can be both. those aren't mutually exclusive ideas. Ozai was disappointed in his son from the get go and banished him at a time when the idea of the avatar returning was so far out. he had no reason to believe the avatar would ever return so yes, Ozai did intentionally banish him in a state where the presumed notion would be that Zuko would search forever and never be allowed back home, not to mention that the fire nation perceived Zuko as the weaker less willed sibling who, even if the avatar returned, would never truly capture him anyways. but when the avatar DOES return to the world, when his presence IS made known, and when Zuko "kills" him, when Azula gives Zuko that credit, of course Ozai treats him with respect and gives him the time of day! logically he'd do roughly the same for a different solider who captured the avatar. the point is that it wouldn't have actually mattered whether Zuko was his son or not, because Ozai doesn't respect Zuko as his kin, only as the formerly banished solider who happened to have completed what was thought to have been an impossible task.
@@null_doesnothing2487 I didnt say they were mutually exclusive Yeah Ozai never expected Zuko to pull it off, it was just a way to be rid of him- but when Zuko came back sucessfully, he DID welcome him back and treat him how Zuko wanted to be treated, which was the point of Zuko's conflict in early Season 3
@@kaialoneI don't know...I think Zuko's conflict early on Season 3 did have to do, at least in part, with his father. Ozai did welcome him, and told him he was proud, but he did so quite coldly, like a general addressing a soldier, not a father addressing his son. I think it was a very deliberate choice to have the scene of Ozai welcoming Zuko back juxtaposed with the scene with Hakoda and Katara. Hakoda hugged his daughter, he told her that he had missed her and thought every day about her...Ozai didn't do any of that. A part of Zuko's final push towards redemption was him realizing that his father wasn't who he thought he was, both as a parent and human being.
Tbh i think the biggest crime was the lack of “silent” moments in the show. I feel like its constantly trying to keep moving and going super fast to be more interesting to the audience… Where as in the original having calm moments with the cast or just the scenery really made the show feel immersive and have more depth as u could rlly sit and process the atmosphere or what was occurring. Some of my favorite moments r literally just of like momo eating fucking fruit while the music played quietly the background. It made the show feel so tranquil and this new one lacks that imop.
1:13:51 Exploring Iroh in the original series is an interesting topic. So, the first time we see the storyline, we're shown things that could plausibly explain his behavior and how it changes--his dedication to his nephew, his opposition to Zhao's destructiveness, etc. But they drop a hint in the first season that only takes fruition later--when he stalls the entire crew to go look for his white lotus paisho piece. From that, I think we're supposed to piece together with the later seasons that he's been a spy for the White Lotus, secretly working against the bad guys, for a very long time. The Iroh we see in Season 1 is an Iroh carefully keeping his cover, and when he appears to change, part of that is simply him beginning to put the mask down. I think what you can't attribute to the hidden loyalties, you can attribute to his open loyalties and how they conflict with those hidden ones. He cares about Zuko, even when that pits him against his own morals. It's a moral conflict he carries throughout the series and eventually has to face, leading to his imprisonment. And/but also, throughout the series, he knows that if he stops being there for Zuko, very bad things are going to happen to Zuko and possibly also to the Avatar.
My biggest issue with the Agni Kai scene is that it seems like the writers forgot that the whole reason it ended like it did originally, with Ozai burning and banishing him, was because he refused to fight. His punishment for talking out of turn was a public Angi Kai against the Fire Lord. and having Zuko fight back, but more importantly also *almost win* makes Ozai come off so goddamn weak writing wise. There's a reason we don't see him fight until the end of the cartoon and it's cause he's supposed to be The Final Boss Antagonist for a reason? Zuko was *13* (and not a prodigy in the cartoon at least)
Exactly, like the whole reason the first agni kai we see Zuko do is with Zhang in the original is to teach that "hey, Zuko is pretty competent at fighting watch him beat this grown ass man". The point of the second is that it teaches us that Zuko is empathetic and that his father and sister hate that, and despite how competent he is, he will never be as inherently powerful with fire bending as them.
Also, making it a badass fight is even more counterintuitive to the whole "maturity" circlejerk the writers had going on. It reads more like "this talented fighter is doubling down and squaring up with his dad" and not "this dad is permanently disfiguring his 13 year old's face after he refused to fight" A stark contrast from that haunting pan of Zuko slowly looking up at his dad, with tears in his eyes, after begging not to fight
Not only that, but it takes away a lot of the agency and tragedy of Zuko. It's made abundantly clear in the og show that (one) Zuko is terrified of Ozai and begs not to fight, but (two) that Zuko is incredibly strong for straight-up *refusing* to fight Ozai. He could've buckled to the pressure by feeling forced to fight, but Zuko *chose not to.* That's what makes Ozai such a monster, *he burned his son's face* because (while yes, Zuko "disrespected" him) Zuko actively made the choice to not fight him because *that's his dad, and he LOVES him.* By choosing not to fight, Zuko shows Ozai that he's not a threat to him and gives the choice back to Ozai, begging his dad for mercy. He's not even going to *try* to defend himself. But to Ozai, Zuko refusing to fight is weak and speaking up to protect the new soldiers undermines the Fire Lord's authority. Is Ozai going to show mercy to Zuko? Not for a second! If anything, he's *insulted* that his son is choosing pacifism over violence. In Ozai's mind, he's thinking, "How could I have raised such a coward?" That's what makes Zuko's backstory so tragic in the first place. His dad is an abusive pos who punished his son by burning and permanently scarring his face because Zuko tried to do the right thing, not just by the soldiers but also by his dad.
I don't know why they made katara's nan so evil, not just telling aang that everyone he knew died like that, but also it implies that she was holding onto the resources katara needed to learn water bending the whole time and kept it from her until she left. they also made her harsh and weird in general
and then even weirder cause of how quickly she then encouraged her. Originally she was just concerned and stubborn so the switch up wasn't that jarring. But here she was so against it that it felt out of left field how quickly she came around.
I actually sort of get that part. After Kya was murdered for calling herself the last Waterbender, she was probably worried that encouraging Katara to learn Waterbending would eventually lead to the Fire Nation learning of her and returning to kill her. But once she leaves with Aang, Gran-Gran knows that Katara will be in danger regardless and will need to learn Waterbending to protect herself. That being said, I absolutely despise Gran-Gran in the new live-action show. Just not for that specific reason.
I was blown away that she could look at that tiny child and really just "your people are all dead, they died a hundred years ago, which was the start of the war we're still in. And *you* have to fix it, good morning." I get he's the avatar, but a little more tact, Gran Gran, please
50:18 - That joke could've been totally fine if they didn't add him repeating the "I never listened" part. Just have him say. "The monks said I never listened.... at least, I think that's what they said." Because it implies that he doesn't listen without him being evidently aware and uncaring of this flaw.
My heart sank when Aang went to 'clear his head' with Appa. It's an entirely different starting point for him as a character. There's a world of difference between hearing huge news and wanting to clear your head and hearing huge news and deliberately running away to avoid the burden of said news. It's the difference between oh that sucks something bad happened while you were out on a joyride, and something terrible happened because you actively chose to run away from your responsibilities. So much of the cartoon is him grappling with that, and the show did not replace it with an equally impactful character arc.
My biggest pet peeve has to be the fact they NEVER refer to the nations. ONLY the benders. "The fire benders are doing this!" "We must protect the water benders!" Like the fuck? Is Netflix suggesting everyone in this world is a bender?
Honestly good setup for the conflict in LoK season one. Non benders feeling oppressed and all that. Saying "benders" instead of "nation" implies that anyone who is not a bender is not of the nation, not a real citizen, an other. It would actually be REALLY clever if that's where they were going, but unfortunately I know better than to have hope in these sorts of shows
Aang: ”I’m just a silly lil goofball🤪” Also Aang: *proceeds to be the most serious un-childlike character despite being 12 yo who only care about serious business like the war throughout the whole show*
Every version of Katara outside of the original show is just the Ember Island Players version. Like they literally made an episode poking fun at Flanderizations and mischaracterizations and everyone adapting the show just went "OH HERP DERP SO _THAT'S_ WHAT THE CHARACTERS ARE!!"
It really irritates me that almost all of the genuine thoughts, advice, and impressions the main trio have almost always come from somebody else. "Monk Gyatso used to say", "Grandma always said", "Remember what dad told us" - these characters have no will of their own, the showrunners decided the best way to have them engage with the world and even each other is by proxy. Nice job doing your own "Game of Thrones" here, guys!
((((((Spoilers for Cruella Movie)))))) Same energy as the Cruella movie having damlations be responsible for her mom’s death. She didn’t need a said reason to hate Dalmatians… we accepted that she just is a weirdo who wants dog coats. These live action sequels and remakes feel the need to have characters have no original thoughts everything needs to be directly inspired by something else.
"It's rare in life, to get to be the biggest hater. To not just hate something, but hate it more, perhaps, than anyone else on the planet. And when that opportunity does present itself to you, you need to express yourself, to share your evil opinions." Biggest Joel
The scene that broke me was when gran started reciting the opening monologue off rip, unprompted, CORRECTLY, after the actual opening changed so much of the original.
I always loved Bumi in the cartoon. He went 100 years thinking Aang was dead, but he still stood strong like a true Earthbender, and became the king and kept Omashu protected for a long time! The moment I loved the most with him was when Aang realized who he was. Bumi knew more than anyone that Aang had a MASSIVE responsibility and difficult journey ahead of him, but he didn't guilt trip him or lay it on too thick. Not only was Aang one of his best friends, but he also understood that Aang was still a child, and if he were to put too much stress on him, he knew it'd only make things more difficult for him. He just told him plainly, its gonna be tough, but you have your friends, and as long as you think outside the box, you'll be just fine!🥲
I feel this more as I get older, I'm realizing. We can't interact with kids the same as a peer would, but also we don't stop being those kids just because we develop back pain or whatever. You can choose to ignore the kid part of you until it withers and is forgotten, or you can remember it and be a better adult for the kids in your life.
@@Nassifeh exactly. Especially when you compare Bumi's conversation with General Fongs. Fong heard of what Aang did in the Siege Of The North and thought he was ready to take on the entire nation. When he disagreed, Fong just guilt tripped him by showing him all the wounded soldiers, and made it seem like the only reason they were hurt and all their families back home destroyed, was solely Aangs fault. Bumi could've done the same, but that would've been the wrong choice. Aang needed to see the world as it was for himself, not have others sway his decision and make him do something rash.
Like, I'm sure Bumi went through a period of hating Aang for vanishing, but he is over 110 years old, he has had plenty of time to let go of his grudge and become the kooky *SUPER JACKED* chaos gremlin we know and love. They could gave gine that route instead of turning him into a petty jackass.
I stopped watching after two episodes and it is STARTLING how bad they made Bumi. Its not even poorly written, its like psychotic. They took a fun idea about a friendship lasting a lifetime and seeing the world from new perspectives and made Bumi a vindictive asshole thats actually insane, the people who wrote this are like, evil humans
Katara is a character ahead of her time. She’s a girl of color in touch with her emotions, embraces femininity, is headstrong, mean, impulsive, self-reliant, and we ADORE her. I wish the animated Katara could pull the live action Katara into a hug and tell her that she doesn’t need these boys telling her how to bend and she can scream and cry and run around just like someone her age should be able to!
i hate that aang is a Very Special Boy because one of the reasons that the original was so heartbreaking is that aang is just a kid with the avatar role thrusted upon him. yes he is skilled, but he isnt the most skilled airbender. hes just a kid
Yeah. Remember when he first tried to learn fire and earth? Absolute disasters. Sure he was an amazing airbender, inventing that little air scooter technique, and sure he was a pretty quick learner with water, but that's only half of it. I wish we got the episode with the firebending master, so we can actually see this kid mess up for once, and have someone mad at him for a good reason. It's so important to show how much he has to learn. He's still childish and impatient, and he's not a prodigy at everything he does. I'd have certainly preferred that to them shoving things from the next season in this one for no reason. You already have so much material to shove into eight episodes, why the hell would you shove MORE into it!?
@@spongecakes1986 the air scooter is perfect little moment when we first see it; it's inventive, daring and skillful.... and he smacks right into a boulder using it lol. That's Aang.
this is also what makes it so hard to watch when bad stuff is happening to Gon in Hunter x Hunter or Steven in Steven Universe. Because, despite how “special” they might be, at their heart they’re children going through horrifying levels of trauma that no child should have to go through.
Remember that one scene where after he learns he's the avatar, his peers doesn't want to play with him anymore because they think he has an unfair advantage? It's such an important scene to me because it shows Aang as still a kid who wants to play with his friend, and insisting he can still play but being a "Very Special Boy" in the netflix adaptation feels so... bland
You are honestly pretty generous with your take on Bumi. I thought the entire episode with Bumi was atrocious and offensive to such a great character. It also completely betrays his role as a member of the white lotus.
36:00 - I saw this comment on other people's videos from when the show first aired. "They took the sexism out of Sokka's storyline, and then just put it into the rest of the writing."
I think the reason they start with the earthbender chase is because they desperately want to establish, more than anything else, that they're not M. Night Shyamalan. That they can move The Big Rock.
Listening to this while gaming, looking back at the screen after hearing what sounds like a stream of piss to see Big Joel smiling over a miniature toilet full of what looks like piss was a very bewildering experience
Even in that terrible 2010 movie they still understood how important it was that aang didn't know, and to an extent didn't believe that the air nomads were dead
That, the costumes looked better, and the fighting (ignore the floating earth bender pebbles) actually were better. Like the fighting in the Netflix version is just them throwing Kamehamehas at each other. The movie at least had some martial arts incorporated to the actual bending.
Fun fact: Katara didn’t know that Aang was sacrificing himself when she gave that speech. She specifically wasn’t there when Yue said he would be sacrificing himself if he merged with the spirit.
i have to wonder why they chose Kyoshi for the opening narration. Obviously you covered why Katara was better in the original, but if you're going to change it...why Kyoshi? She wasn't the last avatar, she has no real connection either to the current events, having died a century prior, or to any of the immediate players, since her story was centred mostly in the earth kingdom. Surely Roku would have been the more obvious choice, lamenting over his own failure to prevent the war, and hoping that his successor might accomplish what he couldn't. It feels like they only picked Kyoshi because she's popular.
It’s literally this, they’re pandering to the fandom bc they know we love a girlboss (kill me). The crazy thing about all this is that Netflix’s “girlboss agenda” has largely disempowered Katara, the OG atla girlboss
I almost wonder if in a very, very early version of the pitch, it was going to be about Kyoshi. It would be very interesting to see something set in a different time in the same universe, and if you were going to pick an avatar to fit the "look, we can do R rated stuff" tone, she's probably the best choice a casual fan would recognize.
mannn roku narrating the opening could've fucked. changing 'when the world needed him most, he vanished' roku could say 'and when the world needed me most... i failed.'
@@Conflict-ff5pi also the winter solstice two parter in the original show was all about going on an insane mission into the fire nation just to talk to Roku for like 3 seconds, and in this show Aang just like, has a leisurely chat with Kyoshi in the second episode because…. People like that Kyoshi is tall and badass?
About "Wolf Cove", I think the issue with giving the southern water tribe a name is that it takes away the implication that this is the ENTIRE southern water tribe. Wolf Cove makes it sound like it's one of many villages in the south, instead of the entire thing. It's also painfully generic and sounds like something a 14 year old would come up with
There is no way that is the entire southern water tribe, they have existed there for centuries, they should have a population greater than 500 or whatever it was in Hama’s Time
@@mranima748They did go through somewhat of a genocide when the fire nations came and got rid of all the benders, I feel like they probably took out a generous portion of the non benders as well, because non soldiers always get caught in the crossfire. Watching the show I was under the impression that all the different groups probably had to unite under one leader because they had suffered so many casualties that having a bunch of tiny villages wasn't sustainable.
@@mranima748 I'm confused, are you critiquing the original show? The southern water tribes population slowly dwindled over the hundred year war because of raids, the water benders being killed off, and the men leaving to fight.
I definitely didn't get the feeling that it was the only village in the south, but I do think it may as well have been. There may well have been dozens of small, isolated villages, but clearly Katara didn't know of any large enough to find a waterbending master. But there must have _been_ other villages, since the South had a large new capital city by the time of Korra. Some of that population (including Korra's father) was said to have come there from the North, but there was clearly enough of a southern population to maintain a distinct cultural identity, and Sokka and Katara's village wasn't big enough for that. Nor was it large enough to explain the size of the Southern fleet.
Hope you enjoyed! If you want my bonus videos, including the two hours of me yelling about Avatar on which this video is based, here's my Patreon! www.patreon.com/bigjoel
Hey, can you please provide a timestamp?
That'd really help for those of us busy with work and uni.
@@silverXnoise They did. It's called Stranger Things.
what is all this centrist bullcrap? I want more leftist content!!!
@@june4135 Same, now that I think about it.
Hearing a moron cry about a show he clearly knows nothing about? I'll pass.
What I can't get over is that Aang delivers all of his lines like he's fucking young sheldon
The vocal fry KILLED me
@@mike8315normally I Dont mind vocal fry but it was INTENSE from him
Honestly his voice kind of wigs me out. He speaks with slight vocal fry, like a kardashian, and it's super weird to hear that from a young kid.
I said THE SAME THING when watching this with my girlfriend, so we must be on to something here
I couldn't really put my feelings into words but you actually did it LMAO
The opening action scene with Sozen has a really important point actually: to show us how hardcore the show is. “Did you see how he just burned that guy alive? Like on-screen?” *You can’t do that on Nickelodeon.* But we CAN do that. because we’re on Netflix. It’s different. Please watch it. Please.”
Which is made worse by the fact that they had an adult man burn a child’s face off just barely out of frame on Nickelodeon. They made it less dark by making it more dark
Hey, don't I know you from somewhere?
It's like a child's idea of an adult show. "All the characters are no fun and don't play because that's what adults do and fight scenes are cool and flashy and the most important part. Who cares if they make sense?"
@@IAmNotAWoodenDuckThis will never not be the weirdest thing about adult media to me. Why are writers absolutely convinced that adults either hate jokes and fun, or only enjoy excessively vulgar jokes. There is literally no inbetween.
@@RevyaAeinsett according to these writers, being adult means you can never have fun anymore ig 🤷🏾♂️
I'm honestly flabbergasted that they found an actor that perfectly captured Bumi's appearance, voice and mannerisms and then went ahead and changed his character to be boring and miserable.
the casting department popped off, the writers not so much
Yeah the actor killed it as Bumi. And the actor is a very guy in the roles he plays. But instead of playing to the actor’s strengths and keeping Bumi as he should be, they made him into this traumatized, angry and bitter old man which is character assassination.
He's the reason I gave up on the show. When he was mad at aang for "Playing games and not focusing on being a better avatar" when HE'S THE ONE TRAPPING HIM AND KEEPING HIM FROM MOVING ON. Made even worse when sokka and katara are in the... cave of lovers... 😩
What makes me so viscerally irritated about the "we have to appeal to people who like Game of Thrones" is that it perfectly encapsulates how to throughly misunderstand the entire point of ATLA. They have politics, good character psychology, and violence in common. That's it. The true tragedy of Avatar is that it's centered on the point of view of CHILDREN. Children seeing the results of colonization, war, and genocide. That is ESSENTIAL to the emotional pathos of the entire show. Aang is a child. Katara is a child who got parentified. Sokka too to a similar extent. Zuko is an abused and brainwashed child. Azula is a product of abusive grooming. The most powerful moments of the show emphasize small moments of human connection, and the fact that. They. Are. CHILDREN.
To be fair though that's also the position the stark kids find themselves in the first season, though some of them are aged up from the book. And also Daenerys which is a teenager
I thi k if they leaned into the fact that these are kids in an awful situation, then it would have been better
Additionally, I find this take "we have to appeal to people who like Game of Thrones" super jarring as an Asian. ATLA took huge inspiration from (mostly) Asian cultures--cultures that are rich and amazing on their own right. GoT on the other hand was set during the medieval ages.
Why do the showrunners have to make it appealing to Western audiences? Why was there a need to pander to them? Are the Asian cultures the original series inspired from not enough to make it great?
I can go on and on about how Western powers invaded most Asian countries and brought colonial mentality and how I can personally see it influencing their decision to pander to GoT fans (like ONLY through pandering to the West would make the show successful, not great storytelling in itself) but that would be a tl;dr moment. My point is that Asian culture, MY culture, is beautiful, rich, and amazing enough to be a great backdrop to an amazing story. There wasn't a need to please them. Just make it a great adaptation and it will be successful.
Also it just completely fails at appealing to "mature" audiences, no? I'm at the part of the video featuring bumi, and this dude is completely ridiculous in every way.
@@jankbunky4279 it's amazing how they swapped it around, since Aang is defying Bumi and Kyoshi in the adaptation and teaches the adults. There really is no point at all of Aang being a child in the adaptation. None.
Them changing Aang running away to just going on a joy ride to clear his head destroys the reason of intense guilt he felt in the original
This is the moment I knew it was going to be bad and stopped watching as a fan of the OG, and started watching as a critic of yet a other piece of crap made in netflix... ( glad I did because the OG fan would have had its hope crushed hundred of times though the season, now I feel nothing and just roll my eyes each time I see something bad )
Changing such a important point plot, event the movie didn't dare do it and on this aspect was better than the show...
Gotta grind out all those rough edges. Even if those rough edges are a central part of the character and one of the main themes of the show.
Should not have watched their legit well done Live Action One Piece, that got my hopes up. @@Alice.59
The crazy thing is doing that and then doubling down on making characters blame Aang for running away. The show seems to be written as if every character is interacting not with the actual versions of the characters that appear on screen but a half remembered caricature of the original.
@@TheNotshauna its wild how the show that was made for kids did a better job of tackling adult topics than a show made for adults. i know exactly what you mean about caricatures, it feels like netflix atla was made because someone tried to get their adult friend to watch avatar and their friend said "no way, thats for kids" so netflix made a version of avatar with the "adult highlights" to sort of tl;dr the original.
They probably removed Sokka’s sexism because they couldn’t find a way to portray it as a bad thing without having to ask themselves a bunch of uncomfortable questions about how they write female characters lol
PREACH!
that’s… actually a really good point. you might be on to something here lmao
*points at everything Netflix Katara*
You're damn right.
Lmao right? The point of sokka's initial sexism was to prove that he wasn't in the right. But they can't do that here when the writing is actually sexist (aka he's right in-verse).
This is hilarious and concise and true.
the earth soldier: you burned 100s of people alive until there was nothing left of them but ash, you monster! *slaps Iroh*
Iroh: Ah, but you just slapped me. Who's the real monster here, hmmmm?
Certified Israel moment
@@BartlebyScrivener-oz6mk so real omg
You see, Dr. Jones, by punching me, YOU are the Nazi
The politics of this show are sooooo American
the line about hakoda not caring about "stuff like that" was soooooo annoying. hakoda is also an inventor and sokka clearly gets that from his dad. sokka does feel insecure in the cartoon, but hakoda never looks down on his son and always feels proud of him. hakoda is a minor side character all considered, but i absolutely hate what they did with him.
I wanted to shake the writers and yell "Hakoda invented the Stink-and-Sink!"
Reminds me of the "all of Hollywood has daddy issues" bit from IHateEverything's Live Action Lion King review. Maybe there's something to it...
@@TriforceWisdom64 RIGHT??? I immediately thought that and went uuum did these people actually watch the show lol? It seems like they were trying to maybe set up a false dichotomy between being a warrior and being an inventor with the intent of having Sokka come to the conclusion he can be both simultaneously, but it was very shoddily done.
love how they felt the need to give daddy issues to sokka when there were already two characters from the gaang who had pretty shitty fathers. cant let the water tribe have shit.
What they did to Hakoda fucking infuriated me. He was supposed to be the foil to Ozai. Whereas his love for his children was unconditional, Ozai’s was not.
You are NEVER going to convince me that Hakoda wouldn’t be anything but loving and proud to both of his kids, even at their lowest points. And fucking Albert Kim and his team turned this character with a heart of gold into the disappointed father stereotype which is so out of character for Hakoda, it is comical.
If one character is poorly acted in a show, you have a bad actor.
If every character is poorly acted in a show, you have a bad director.
This is true, yes, but not only from the direction given to the actors by the director - but also by the director deciding who to cast.
It’s actually insane how the director evoked literally ZERO natural feeling scenes - the scenes where the characters just talk to each other are the dullest, most visually barren thing I’ve seen in some time. No hand motions, no kid like movements, and such awkward eye contact and vocal pauses. It’s actually nauseating.
@@vultdylanI wouldn’t say zero. Zhao was absolutely delightful, and I’m like 90% sure he was ad libbing. And Zuko had some cute teenage angst squeals. Bumi was performed extremely well despite how poorly he was written. The rest though… yeah, nah, they ain’t it.
@@thevioletbee5879 I think that means those actors are the exception. Able to take the director's poor input and embody their characters in a meaningful way. Honestly, it makes me curious about their past and future work if they were able to withstand the director and maintain some semblance of quality.
In this case, bad direction is heavily compounded by bad writing.
It's so insane how they removed Sokka's character flaws because the "misogyny was outdated" but then stripped Katara of all of her agency by making Aang basically spoonfeed her everything she knows. Like all she needed was a boy to explain to her how to do anything at all. Thanks for removing the misogyny, netflix!
Not to mention Sokka's sexism was there specifically so he could grow from it and learn it's wrong. They removed blatant anti misogyny and replaced it with subtle misogyny. Thanks Netflix
@@spongecakes1986 idk if i'd even call it "subtle" tbh
Just for the sake of the story it also turns so many plot threats into being about absolutely nothing. These scenes only make sense in relation the original show but they're still in this Live Action one pretending that they've done the actual character work.
It's just going from taking anti sexist stance to not doing that.
replaced anti-sexism with: A passive, man-dependent Katara and a Suki that had to coddle Sokka's sense of pride. They couldn't have inverted these themes more if they tried.
Its the most liberal way to view social issues
What upset me most about the change to Bumi was Aang never getting to have that touching reunion with his old friend. In the animated show after Aang finds out Bumi's identity, he jumps in for a hug and you can see the tears welling up in his eyes. It really helped to heighten how, even though he lost so much in those 100 years, he still had his old friend who still cared for him.
Now, changing it wouldn't have been bad except for the reasons you said in the video: he is now seemingly angry at Aang for not taking the war seriously despite A) Aang not meaning to be gone for those 100 years and B) After coming back, Aang is very aware of the stakes and isn't fooling around at all. Now it just feels we lost a touching moment for one that makes no sense.
Not just an old friend who cared for him, an old friend whose personality is identical to when he knew him as a kid. For Aang, only Appa remained from before he was frozen, everything else was gone, so it hits so hard that Bumi was still around and didn't change one bit.
It makes more sense for Bumi to assume Aang dead
Also I got an idea of what if some boomer or gen x got forzen or something like feird form Futurama and wake up in 2002 or 2016 andhoe that affect him or her and seeing their freind as elder or in their 50s while they're still 8
I got that idea form avatar lol
The Bumi episode is where I stopped watching. I saw what they did to him and just couldn’t bring myself to watch more
It's so weird how they made the misogyny worse by essentially reducing it to microaggressions that the narrative agrees with.
And ok, aang becoming katara’s “teacher” isn’t just misogynist and insulting, their whole dynamic is that Katara had to grow up too fast and aang hasn’t fully grown into his own role as the avatar so katara helps him mature as a bender and a person but aang helps her remember that she’s a kid who deserves to be a kid
Yeah, in the beginning of season one Aang was better at water bending than Katara, but that was only because she hadn't been properly trained in bending like Aang had. And when he was, unknowingly, being inconsiderate in how he taught her she didn't just take and let him know it annoyed her
Turns out they kept the sexism after all
and ultimately even if Aang is a natural doesn't mean that is superior to Katara. She learns to work hard and smartly in a way that Aang sometimes is incapable. Aang is explosive, Katara is careful and throughout. Sometimes we're impressed with quick results and not see the whole picture and how people have different necessities, capabilities and expressions of ability in the same things. I guess is part of the Iroh teachings of lightning reflection techniques to Zuko, only made narratively coherent in the story.
I felt so hard, in the original, the way she kind of defaults to mothering both Aang and Sokka, and the way the original show makes it really clear that being a sister is different from being a mom? Losing the sexist origins of that dynamic seems to throw off that whole thing and leave them all in a weird place.
@@Farencio exactly this!! Aang is the gifted kid who’s naturally talented but has no work ethic and katara’s the hard worker
Lol I love the fact the show creators gloated about fact it removed the intentional sexism to just make the one major female lead a damsel in distress that is useless without pep talks of the men around her.
Pisses me off so bad bc there's SO MANY EPISODES (especially after they lose Appa) where Katara keeps the group together and is the motivating force behind everyone. And they stripped her of all her strength. One of the best female characters in animation and they just ripped up everything that made her cool
They got rid of Sokka's sexism cause they realised they had enough for the whole show
It's what happens when u take a sort of... the way people who say "I don't see color" handle race-type approach
they decided to make the world sexist instead of making characters sexist. seen this many times, with racism too.
kind of a devil's trick.
also reminds me of many centrist/liberal ppl, who can't see much of sexism/racism bc they think of it as a purely individual flaw.
The way Katara needed Sokka to tell her to fight Master Paku... did they not even understand the point of that entire sequence of events and how that was important in the original for her to... y'know... tell a sexist asshole off on her own?
Aang telling the water bender soldier guy "Sorry, I can't do anything about the imminent fire nation invasion because airbending is all about evading and avoiding conflict" just betrays how little the writers understand or care about the original material. The phrase "evade and avoid" is lifted directly from the episode of the cartoon where Bumi and Aang fight, and Bumi says it to Aang specifically because Aang keeps dodging his attacks without going on the offensive. It's a dig. It's a taunt. It's not meant to be a good-faith observation about the air nomads' cultural ethos. The fact that the writers of the Netflix adaptation took it that way is really frustrating.
And we see in Korra and the kyoshi novels that a master airbender is insanely strong and literally like a force of nature… kyoshis air bending master has a moniker of the ‘the living typhoon’ because he used his air bending to completely destroy an entire fleet of pirate ships
So much of what people have to say about Netflix Avatar is “Yeah, it might be bad, but at least it’s not as bad as M. Night’s Avatar”, so I’m finally satisfied by hearing someone make the argument that it actually might be conceptually worse 💀
The "it's not as bad as M Night's version" is an immediate losing argument, because it's pretty hard to be worse than one of the most notoriously bad adaptations ever made.
I honestly hate this show more than the movie. Every episode had more time to fuck up and make me mad 😂
I've told people that at least the movie was over in less than two hours where the series was a constant crawl through ankle high sewer water.
Would you rather have a 90 minute migraine or an 8 hour migraine?
I love how people make that argument as if making something better than M Night's unspeakable movie isn't an insanely low bar to meet, Netflix focused primarily on staying head above the surface and not much else
My biggest annoyance with the show is how it looks like a dry cleaning company follows them around everyday. Makes it feel like cosplay
Costuming in mainstream productions has been shit for about a decade now. Hollywood hates unions!
This is a problem in everything. Even The VVitch, which is a great movie with an incredible eye for period detail made the family look like they had a washer-dryer in the back.
@born2hula325 the v vitch is a perfect example. The costuming *is* accurate for the period.
But it, like pretty much every period show/movie, makes the clothes look brand new.
Off the top of my head the only times I've seen well worn costumes was LOTR and game of thrones. Especially the hobbit's cloaks, and the starks' clothes.
The Hobbit's cloaks look like they've been worn many dozens of times. There is bobbling and tattered edges, the colour looks like it's been faded from the sun or washing them too much.
Similarly in game of thrones, you can notice the difference in wealth by not only the type of clothes characters wear (eg Lannistars VS Starks) but also how worn they are. Rich characters have shirts and blouses that look ironed. Poorer characters have clothes with stains, rips, and fading colours. Not to mention the difference in style. The Starks for instance are still nobles of the north, but wear clothes that are more utilitarian
@@user-uv2cp1qd1j Pride and Prejudice (2004) had phenomenal costuming and set design
This is actually one of the few shows where there's actually a really easy explanation for clean clothes -- waterbending. Too bad they never show Katara bending water out of wet clothes and leaving the characters clean like they do in the OG.
how many enemies do you need to make on this day *drinks booze to get me through this comment*
hey where have i seen you before
@@hustle_rose
Oh hey, I think that’s the Oko Yono lady. Very neat.
omg it's the author of the acts of the apostles
I’m so glad you commented exactly what I was going to comment in defense of your critique style
*drinks booze to get me through this supportive comment reply*
Ill never forgive the internet for robbing me of even the possibility of a lindsay ellis atla video.
I sorta hate the twist that the battalion Zuko defended ended up being assigned as his crew because it's so nonsensical. It seems like a reward, like Zuko got his way in that war planning meeting. That Ozai begrudgingly gave him what he wanted after Zuko had done enough penance and it weirdly frames Zuko's abuse as heroic??? In cannon that battalion dies, and Zuko is burned for daring to even question the decision, and that shows you exactly who Ozai is. This show seems so weirdly uncomfortable with making its male characters anything less than the coolest most heroic noble motherfuckers on earth, such to the point it can't even really allow them vulnerability and genuine pain.
Like it would have been one thing if it was framed with Ozai being just a cruel obsessive bastard then it could be him taking out his anger on soldiers who know nothing about what Zuko did. This show just can’t decide what it wants its characters to be.
i actually hate that aang meets gyatso in the spirit world and he just forgives him for everything and they hug and smile. it takes away from aangs journey as a character- his grief over losing his people and his guilt over not being there when it happened.
it felt like shallow fan service...and don't get me started on that scene of gyatso staring at the camera telling aang he'll "always be his friend"...oh brother !!
they gave gyatso the "wife that dies in the beginning of the movie" treatment 😭
I found it REAL weird that Aang, who is supposed to learn water-bending, talks to Kitara like she's a second-grader, when he SHOULD be asking HER how the hell she's doing what she's already capable of. He needs to learn from HER, not the other way around.
In fact, that’s an entire character arc in the show!
That’s why Katara stole the water bending scroll from those pirates, because she was supposed to be Aang’s teacher but Aang, being the avatar, learned basically everything she had to teach him very quickly.
It feels LUDICROUS that Katara would ever take a condescending compliment from that “twelve-year-old schmendrick”.
This show is unironically more sexist than the original, even though they removed Sokka's sexism specifically because people were saying having a main character be sexist is bad (even though his arc involves outgrowing that mindset)
Aang’s whole thing is that he hasn’t grown into being the avatar yet and katara’s whole thing is that she had to grow up too quickly! This version really just infantilizes her and denies aang his arc and it sucks
@@spongecakes1986correction: absolutely no one thought the original show was sexist for having Sokka be sexist. The lazy people in charge of rewriting this show only said that because they lack basic comprehension
@@theshire9173 there were definitely some people who had a problem with it, but it wasn't the majority (for obvious reasons), and was mainly just people who never got over the 2010's pop feminism that also said Cinderella was problematic because she didn't just pull herself up by her bootstraps and leave her abusive family. They also likely never actually watched the show.
"We wanted to appeal to the Game of Thrones audience"???? Then, I dunno, maybe this isn't the show to do it with?
They want to appeal to the GoT audience with an adaptation of a kid's show (yes I know it's not JUST for kids but you get what I mean) that has like a PG rating I'm pretty sure. You have fundamentally messed up.
That struck me as PR speak for "Netflix needs every show to appeal to a wide a demographic as possible." It's an absurd take on its' face as the two series have almost nothing in common, besides being "fantasy." GoT=Fantasy to corporate suits, and fantasy is a monolith to milk and market for the executive soulless ghouls who likely don't even understand speculative fiction.
@@cyclic_infinity but that pr response makes no sense. More like GOT reduces the width of demographic appeal.
@@fy8798 I would disagree. At least, from the perspective of the people making that decision. GoT became a powerhouse cultural phenomenon, reaching massively beyond the typical niche for fantasy. As much as we like ATLA and it is culturally prominent, it is still more niche as a "kids show" than GoT. And kids are not the ones paying for Netflix, and I would guess internal numbers show kids shows don't do so well on streaming in the age of CZcams and TIkTok.
I think it is a mistake, both in terms of audience reach and artistic integrity, but you and I and Joel aren't the ones making these stupid decisions. This kind of "replicate the reach of GoT" thing is just how corporate suits think.
right? what a weird statement to begin with, why do they want to appeal to that audience? why not appeal to the audience who .. fell in love with the original show? lol
i’m sad they removed katara stealing the waterbending scroll from pirates that stole it first… netflix thinks this is a remove all of katara’s agency, nuance, spunk, maturity, and personality challenge (they’re winning)
Wolf Cove? Dont they mean Polar Wolfbear Cove? Are you sure they didnt live in Leopard Wolfseal Cove? Or maybe it was Moosewolf Cove?
Nope... just Wolf Cove.
Weird.
THANK YOU! I was looking for someone to bring this up. "Wtf is a wolf?"
It's one of those details that shows the writers just didn't care about worldbuilding beyond when they literally took readymade chunks of it from the original. Wolves are not shown as a prominent part of the fauna, and the flora doesn't suggest wolves being around at all (they'd massacre the penguins, but then IIRC they aren't actually shown in the Netflix CG version?).
Call it Sixflippered Penguin Town, it would be funny, and that is missing from this adaptation anyway, the fun!
Genuinely laughed so hard at this
I noticed that Netflix Avatar is so scared of having the main characters be flawed that they have nowhere to develop. Sokka isn't sexist, so there's nothing interesting about his interactions with Suki. Aang didn't run away from his responsibilities, so everyone else just seems unnecessarily cruel to this child who did nothing wrong. Katara isn't jealous of Aang's bending prowess, so there's no interesting emotional development as she learns bending. Zuko doesn't burn down Kyoshi's village, so he never feels as much like an antagonist who gets redeemed; he's treated like he was never villainous in the first place. Azula isn't maniacal; her introductory scene shows her being nervous and unsure as Ozai burns a man, which contrasts with her first appearance in the animation where she's gleeful and proud of her father for burning Zuko. Her downfall can't hit as hard when she's already introduced as a sympathetic character from the get-go.
100%
Perfectly said!!
100%. I don't think the writers understand that perfect characters are incredibly boring. let them be flawed and grow with the story! it's far more realistic AND makes you more invested in the show.
The only reason they should've made those changes is if they had the skills to explore a deeper theme. For instance, the idea of Azula finding the need to be evil in order to serve her father and her nation while hiding the fact that she's just a scared/nervous teen is such an interesting idea...too bad the writers are so untalented they took Katara's character back to the 1950s in terms of femininity. "Thank you for teaching dumb 'ol me, Mister Smart and Strong Man."
I have a feeling they want to make her sympathetic straight from the get go, like Zuko...execpt that's Zuko's arc NOT Azula's. And her possible redemption won't hit as hard if she's just standing by while her father is cruel, she may not take part like in the animated one but she's still there? She won't have her fall from grace before getting back up again, and even then we never really see her get back up again unless you read the graphic novels.
The way they did Katara so dirty but glorified Sokka was insane. The fact that a show ran in 2005!!! Did gender deconstruction and girlhood representation than a show in 2023 WITH THE SAME SOURCE MATERIAL is honestly so demoralizing.
This whole series is that pathetic nostalgia driven project we see everywhere. OH BOY CAN'T WAIT TO UPDATE THAT THE PLACE KATARA AND SOKKA GREW UP IN IS CALLED WOLF COVE ON THE AVATAR WIKI and feel nothing about it
We are removing Sokka's sexism because sexism bad.
But also...
We are removing Katara's character and bending skills while propping up our male characters as just the best guys around
@@spongecakes1986yeah and katara can't learn on her own, she has be propped up by all the other guys around :(
The misogyny of it all
@@mysticwater9056 it's not misogyny! Because... Because... **Looks at PR team**
@@spongecakes1986 I don't mind Sokka's sexism getting removed. A dude having a "girls are actually people!!" arc is one of the few things that dates the original Avatar as a show clearly made in 2005. But! They needed to replace the sibling conflict with something else.
I'm flabbergasted they didn't replace it with Sokka having bending-envy, since that was barely explored in the original series. It's a *much* stronger conflict.
Iroh going full Prager U Kids Slavery mode
"I didn't INVENT sieging Ba Sing Se for 600 days"
The next time someone asks me not to eat their food, I’m going to stare wistfully into the distance and say, “if only it was that simple…”
"that's why I need to master all the bending disciplines? to become strong?"
I distinctly remember Aang wanting his first firebending master to teach him how to blast fire and was deeply disappointed when they started with breathing techniques. He's often quite impatient to learn how to do cool, creative and powerful things with bending...like a kid.
More than that, it causes him to act out and he ends up badly burning Katara. That in itself becomes a huge boulder that needs to be moved in the future when he is literally scared of firebending because he might hurt someone he loves.
It's been a while since I've seen the episode, but I seem to remember that also being his attitude during his first earthbending lesson, he wanted to do something cooler than just moving a big rock.
Its something a lot of people can relate to, people want to be great at something without understanding that to get there you need to master the fundamentals. Its non negotiable to build a strong foundation first.
@@KerythDraws it's also a much better way to portray him as a kid who wants to play around than him turning to the camera and saying it lmao
aang had much difficulty learning earth bending with toph, being unable to learn how to move the earth because earth bending is the opposite to air bending, and toph brings out the deep seated feelings of aang and his power, him being unafraid to change the earth itself@@Sugarman96
I think I realized why the way Netflix handles teaching bending feels so hollow. In the original, when Aang or other characters learn how to bend, their masters usually tie bending to a life lesson that The character needs to learn as well. One of the best examples of this is Aang learning earth bending from Toph. As an air bender, Aang is used to deftly avoiding attacks when fighting. However, in order to learn earthbending, he literally has to plant his feet and face his enemies head on. This idea is tied to the fact that Aang also needs to learn how to face his problems head on, as he has been running away from his problems from a while. Learning earth bending therefore doesn’t just make him a stronger avatar, but a more healthy person as well, as he learns how to better confront his problems in life. The original goes great lengths to show that the Avatar isn’t just strong because they have all 4 bending techniques, but because they are an extremely studied individual who knows and lives by a mixture of all nations’ cultures and life philosophies. Uncle Iroh even points out that non-Avatars can benefit both strength wise and mentally from learning about the other cultures in the world. The bending is much more than just a power system in the original, it’s a way of life and the way it works ties heavily into the philosophy the corresponding nations live by. Netflix doesn’t give a shit about any of this, so they treat it like some shallow way to make the fights look cool, so they just throw words like “energy” and “balance” to seem profound.
But you're talking about actually being deep
Yup
Agree for all of this
Also ironically this kind of reasoning is one of the reason why i don't mind the "avatar's elemental opposite became personality opposite" retcon in korra compared to other retcon's in that shows even though i would like that they explore more on that concept
I don't think it was a tetcon. I remember the original talking about balance between the avaters personality. Kurok was too lax so kyoshi was too stern which lead to Roku who lead to Aang.
Ooh well said
I think it's possible the reason "Wolf Cove" sounds stupid is because wolves don't... exist... in the Avatar universe.... every animal is a hybrid of two or more normal animals. Like they repeatedly talk about how weird it is the Earth King just has a BEAR, not a platypus bear or something
Exactly!
12:20 "why dont they show him goofing off with his friends" because then they would've had to hire the actors for that scene
every line delivered like it's the most important thing that has ever been said by anyone in history
it makes it feel like they wanted every interaction to be clipped for a tiktok or reel so we can comment some iteration of “wow… that was so deep/profound/etc.” :/ not good when by the end of this video i could predict “tastes like…… home” in the exact same strained, dramatic tone
its so juvenile, and im saying this as a teenager. they want to sound profound but they have no idea how, so theyre just bullshitting the whole way through. and its SO obvious when you pay attention. the whole energy and balance thing aang was going on about in the beginning sounded so much like an actual 12 year old trying to sound cool it cracked me up.
@@charadefae Yeah I think this is at the core of it. You can tell when writers are focused more on writing quotable lines than they are on writing dialogue that's meaningful in the context of the work. The last couple seasons of Game of Thrones were like that too
This is what happens when people revere source material too much
I cannot for the life of me get over how they made Zuko’s scar look. The original scar is literally one of the most recognisable pieces of character designs there is, it’s so severe that it partially blinded and deafened him and overall completely changed his face. It’s such a great symbol of how brutal the fire nation is. Live action Zuko looks like he’s got a rash.
Like people have birthmarks that look like that, it doesn't look like a scar at all, and it's almost insulting they act like it's some big deal in the show when it's so unnoticeable
which makes it ten times funnier when the scene where they reveal the scar is so dramatic. “Look at how normal this one side of his face is! Bet you expect the other side to be normal too!! But oh boy just wait til we show you!!” and it just sorta looks like zuko got into the poison ivy a couple days ago. like yeesh someone get this kid some calamine lotion stat
I'm not disagreeing with your point about the brutality of th scar being important, but... did it actually impact his vision or hearing? I've heard fans say that, but I can't recall any instance of the show saying that.
@@vanessaweber5965 as far as i know, its just a popular head canon everyone kind of collectively agreed on. because while it may not be canon, im not sure its possible to have fire that close to such important things like your eyes or ears without damaging them at all.
@@vanessaweber5965 it’s implied in the visuals more than the dialogue. Zuko’s burn is most severe over his eye, causing it to be slightly closed, and his ear is withered up from the flames. Those kinds of physical injuries are very likely to limit his ability to see and hear as they completely change how his sensory organs are structured
Iirc there’s also a detail that Zuko usually sleeps with his scarred ear to the ground but when he’s with Iroh he sleeps on the other side, which would make him a lot more vulnerable as he wouldn’t be able to hear people coming as well
I think aang literally agreeing with paaku took years off my life
Netflix: Look we’re killing people on screen!!! We’re the adult show!!!! That would never happen in cartoons!!!!!!
Nickelodeon with Legend of Korra, several years ago: Hey what if an airbender sucked all the air out of someone’s lungs
Wait wait wait, the two people who walk through the tunnel of love, a tunnel made by lovers, for lovers, is Katara and... Sokka? The siblings? What? Huh?
@@jessip8654 someone played to much The Coffin.
@@hisnitch Something just fit in it earlier
They were trying to appeal to the Game of Thrones audience, remember? 😂
@@grandmabea6471LMAO that's what I said
They have to be going for Zutara, I don't understand the change at all other wise
I cant believe what they did with Iroh; he doesnt start questioning the Fire Nation when he realizes the Avatar is a child, he completely lost his faith in the Fire Nation when his son died in Ba Sing Se. Not because "Im sad my kid died," but because he realized that every solider of the Earth Kingdom he has killed was someones son/daughter, brother/sister, and that completely breaks his will.
He doesnt even start teaching Zuko his true Fire Bending skills until he realizes he hates the Fire Nation and what it has come to stand for as much as he does
Honestly this comment highlights my only (minor) issue with this video so far in that Joel of unusual size kinda reduces season one Iroh (in the original show) to a character perfectly fine with the fire nation and so down for some evil when in reality he’s trying to help Zuko come to a realization that hunting the Avatar and trying to impress his dad may not be the right path essentially from day one-only he doesn’t do this by directly telling Zuko to stop because he correctly recognizes that if he leaned into that from the start Zuko would ditch him
I dunno, I just don’t think that summary of his character was completely fair to his true motivations
He was a member of the White Lotus from the very beginning in the original, so he definitely wasn't loyal to the current Fire Nation. However, he really loved Zuko and taught him well enough to best Xiao. He wanted Zuko to switch sides, but never intentionally held back techniques or anything like that. True unconditional love.
@@unrighteous8745also zuko wouldn't be ready to accept that the fire Nation was the bad guys. He cannot outwardly share his disdain because he has to slowly convince zuko.
@@puffena9013 He is lightning bending Zuko. He's channeling his rage from one location to another. He knows Zuko is too concentrated on proving himself that he wouldn't listen so redirection is the best bet.
@@MegaEliteAwesome lmao I just got done posting a long rant about this! I read Iroh the same way.
White Lotus from day one, emotional supports and guides Zuko unconditionally, but it's precisely because Zuko doesn't listen to him (not to enough to unlearn his nationalistic upbringing) that Iroh can't just "show him this isn't the way."
The show and this video kind of hit the nuance of Iroh and Zuko's dynamic. Iroh loves and supports Zuko, but desperately wants him to change course and knows Zuko has to come to that conclusion in his own time.
His uncle can't just tell him to stop it 😅
It's crazy how they managed to make Katara saying Aang is her family feel so soulless and fake, when they had so much more time to build to it. I love that scene in the original show, because I see an extra layer to it, which comes precisely from the fact that it happens so early. With the way that line is delivered, it feels like Katara is deciding in that moment that Aang is her family now. Yes, she cares about him already and has embarked on a whole journey across the world with him, but as she's seeing him experience this immense pain and loss, she's deciding that she will step up and be there for him. It speaks not only to their relationship, but her character as well.
Can we talk about how GOOD the original was at hitting a different mood each episode? tons of inconsequential scenes in a town, forest, a river or a cave just burned into my retina because of the particular time of day or weather on top of the world design and shot composition. Amazing Shots on CZcams did an incredible compilation.
There’s one minor detail that I’m *very* annoyed they left out, Katara’s line “it’s not magic, it’s waterbending”. Because that’s a *crucial* piece of info that tells the audience early on how people in this world view the act of bending. It’s a martial art with well-understood rules and boundaries, not this wishy-washy ethereal thing that changes depending on what the plot needs.
YES, I've been repeating this too
Cutting sokka’s response to this and the fact that aang teaches katara water bending flattens away the culturally significant impact of bending to the lore too imo
And then in Korra season 2 we find out that it is indeed magic
Honestly I still think the line is kinda silly because, Like, Yeah no it actually is magic, Though. Just because it has rules, And constraints as to what it can do, Doesn't make it not magic. Although I suppose "Magic" itself isn't a clearly defined term, The fact that I can write these words on a piece of glass, And then people across the world can read them on their own pieces of glass, To someone say 1000 years ago could only be explained as magic, Even if you tell them the mechanics of how it works, How electricity works, How the signals are transmitted, Et cetera, They would likely still see it as magic. So I suppose in that way we could say bending isn't magic, Because it's known about and explained to the characters in the universe, But the way I see it, If bending isn't magic, Then magic in most any other fictional universe which features widespread magic _also_ isn't magic, Because they know what it is, How it works, Its explainable.
@@dynawesomeHowso? The Lion Turtles established that they were energy benders capable of giving and taking bending at the end of ATLA. Them being the origins is pretty obvious in hindsight.
They took away Sokka's sexism at the expense of character development to water down his flaws, and in turn made the show a million times more sexist by having Suki and Katara, two of the strongest female characters ever written, only react and change as characters thanks to the actions of the male characters. Absolute insanity. Talk about missing the mark completely.
They removed Sokka's sexism because it made them uncomfortable and required them to give screentime to the women who prove him wrong.
It was a mirror to their own biases and they didn't like what they saw.
@@Primalintent oooooooh preach
Now the question is whether the writers/showrunners actually realize this. I don't know which answer I'd prefer
@@spongecakes1986They seem to be pretty uncurious people based on their incredibly shallow grasp of the source material. Never attribute to malice what could equally be explained by stupidity.
Yeah, but they made Katara a waterbending master. She's a badassᵀᴹ now, so you can't call the show sexist.
"The scroll that was stored safely in our home could never have made its way to us if we stayed home!"
saying “team avatar” and not “gaang” fills me with rage
When they announced that Sokka's sexism was gonna be left out of the show, (and also after it dropped) its defenders tried to make the point that it was only a tiny part of the first season anyway and that it was resolved in episode 4 of the cartoon. That's just wrong. Sokka learns a lesson, yes. But it's an integral part of a larger character arc and also part of the worldbuilding. The watertribes are sexist. The southern one a little less than the northern one but that's probably due to all the men leaving to fight in the war so the women are left with a bit more authority. And Sokka, who is the closest thing to a grown man the village has, tied his ego to this supposed superiority. Once he learns about sexism as a flaw, he tries to fill that sense of specialness he felt about being a man with other things. To the point where he feels like he's useless in season 3. He is searching and searching for his selfworth and it takes him just as long as it takes Aang to master all of the elements to finally find it and to be okay with not being superior.
Yeah, that’s ultimately Sokka’s greatest character trait: he is teachable.
So to have him start the show with all his greatest lessons already learned does a severe disservice to his character.
That arc doesn't require Sokka to be an out and proud misogynist though. I agree that Sokka's portrayal in the Netflix show is bad, since he lacks a character at all, but they could still give him a character while not making him such an explicitly sexist idiot like he was in the original show.
Sokka could be petty and jealous of Katara's water bending, causing him to belittle her and be antagonistic towards her when she uses it. He could be a sore loser, unwilling to admit defeat when overpowered by the better coordinated Kyoshi warriors, claiming they used underhanded tactics or cheated to avoid admitting they're better than him. He could be easily seduced by the sexism of the Northern Water Tribe when the NWT leaders respect him as a fighter, so he refuses to support Katara when she complains about how they mistreat her. He could learn in each case that his attitude is wrong, and even learn to recognize how he is in fact being sexist in each case.
None of this requires the cartoonish sexism he displays in season 1 of ATLA, where he is an out and proud misogynist. I think, in 2024, it could have been great to show the far more common subtler ways sexism presents itself in people and societies. Basically I think I would prefer to see a more Season 1 Mako-esque version of Sokka.
@@wirelessbaguette8997idk if youve ever been around teenage boys before but that is in fact how they behave towards women especially girls their age
@@wirelessbaguette8997 All of these a re good points, and just goes to show that it's definitely not a bad thing that they retconned Sokka's misogeny. What is problematic is they didn't replace it with any negative character flaws, and he became the surface-level comic relief his character was designed to subvert. I don't think Sokka's sexism has to be part of the show, but the flaws he _does_ have are too important to drop.
It’s also a commentary on how colonialism pushes people towards harmful ideals. Would the sexism and rigid gendered roles in the southern water tribe be as prevalent if they hadn’t been at war for the past hundred years? (Which is beautifully contrasted with the institutional sexism of the northern water tribe.)
The actor playing Aang keeps delivering bewildered lines with the same confused inflection as Dewey from Malcom in the Middle. I know a part of it is the fact that it's hard to emote properly in a big, empty green-colored room. But it also feels like the directors gave him NOTHING.
Very true, the kid seems like a genuinely talented actor, and the casting is the only reason I kept watching (my roommate was watching it regardless so why not), but the whole show has this cardboard vibe that kinda infects it, which I can only assume is the writers and directors decision, they (the actors) did what they could with what they had, it’s such a shame
Fam the direction let him down so hard. I forget what it was but there was another line delivered by a completely different character with like exactly the same tone and inflection as aang displays all season and it really just made me realize how much they were coaching aang's actor into giving this exact performance. It's truly a baffling decision.
Yeah that was my first thought. When he's laughing and playing, he genuinely looks like a kid. Then when he talks it's like I'm overly aware that I'm watching a kid do his best to "act".
SO true, the moment where Katara says plums remind her of home and he looks... awkwardly thoughtful I guess. I'm pretty sure he was directed to look sad about how his own home has been reduced to ash. But I'm willing to bet the actor is capable of more obvious emoting; he's done great in some other scenes.
I fully believe he's being directed to do this incredibly subtle, adult, repressed style of acting which A) is harder to do well, B) doesn't fit the tone of the show, no, not even the Netflix adapted version,, and C) makes NO DAMN SENSE FOR HIS CHARACTER. I get they're doing a "dark avatar" where aang is traumatized, in denial, self-loathing, blah blah blah. It just SUCKS and isn't even convincing imo. It's more fun to watch characters be emotive, like Zhao being loudly deranged or Zuko burning with rage. They could at least show Aang struggle to withhold his emotions if he's supposed to be covering up his internal feelings. Or have him lash out in annoyance at Katara for bringing it up because it triggered awful buried feelings. The show is just sad and boring to watch except when the Zuko, Zhao, or Ozai is on screen......
I don't believe Aang's depiction at all. Traumatized children of Aang's age still have plenty of moments of child-like innocence, they're still capable of having fun, in many ways children adapt to trauma more flexibly than adults do. Tragic that the idea of "children with trauma" exists and is even well-understood, but it's true. Without fuller adult understanding of justice, self-compassion, grief etc., many people compartmentalize and largely ignore or forget traumatic experiences in order to cope. I'm not saying there will be 0 differences from a child who did not experience any trauma. But in daily life, there will be plenty of moments where they are indistinguishable from one another. It's often rather difficult to identify children who have suffered trauma without physical signs, sadly.
" delivering bewildered lines": Unfortunately the problem with this show is that everyone is talking way to much, especially Aang and Sokka. It get's so annoying and it ruins the things that are great in this show.
The main character of "The World Ends With You" attempts to murder his partner character in the first 30 minutes of the game. He only stops because the circumstances literally _require_ people to operate in pairs and he's just dead if he goes it alone. That's how selfish he is.
But by the end of the game he's willing to carry the whole frigging world on his shoulders to save one person, and it's not because he's just naturally good. He had to learn to care about people and it makes the whole thing feel fresh and earned.
Flaws are cool. We love monsters and bullies and villains because they wear their desires openly. Let main characters be flawed about stuff and then fix them (or their circumstances) and we'll howl for *moar.*
I feel like the original iroh would've never said the "but we were at war" line. I feel like he'd have just said he's sorry and can't turn things back. Like that was demonstrated pretty well in the episode he tries to help the mugger and cries about his son.
He feels sad about having been unable to help his son. Like he was able to do with the mugger.
Love that they removed Sokkas sexism and just severely reduced Kataras character in every single way to compensate.
severely reduced every female character honestly
Removing Sokka's sexism would be like if Disney remaked Emperor's New Groove and made Kuzco less of an a-hole, despite the whole point of the original is that HE'S SUPPOSE TO BE ONE.
Oh Geez, if they remake that movie.... man, why am I suggesting more ideas to Disney?! NOOO!!!!
@@osmanyousif7849 Kuzco is a stand-up guy who gives the peasants everything they want and more, and Yzma is a villain who has a tragic backstory centering loosely around Kuzco's father killing her parents to become king or something. The movie begins with a 15-minute sequence of Kuzco's father doing so
@@namename9194 , NO!!! NOOO!!! SHUT UP!!!! DISNEY'S WATCHING AND READING!!!!
People now seem to be afraid of getting "cancelled" for just *depicting* sexism, abuse, etc. But I don't know if they're wrong to worry about it--didn't a Furiosa actor get a bunch of backlash just for playing a terrible character? Seems potentially related to how quick Netflix is to actually cancel shows--they've all gotten risk-averse, and that's resulting in shows that are literally more conservative.
Netflix copyrighted little Joel's cinema sins style video on avatar remake, so big Joel responded with 2 and half video essay as a revenge for little Joel... we need more CZcamsrs who stand up for smaller channels like this.
Thank you for this comment because I was sure I've seen him talk about this already and was wondering if it was a re-upload or something
@@nitzansthere’s also a video on each episode on nebula
@@FlyingSchweeniesawesome! I'll go watch it there
I don’t know why they’re mad about free promotion for a show this lame. LMAO
Mostly, I agree with your points, there are a few things I don't agree with. But thank you, THANK YOU for bringing up Iroh's jerky response to the crew. I had exactly the same impression. The original Iroh was so nice, gentle to the crew. He never criticized them for being mad at Zuko. He acted like "yeah, I know, I'm sorry for him but let me explain". This Iroh is an asshole to the people who are basically abused by their boss. And Iroh thinks it's fine and they should just shut up and suck it up because that boss once defended them and indirectly saved their lives. So few people get it. Thank you once more.
wolf cove feels weird because it is the most insiginificant piece of lore they could have added. The name changes absolutely nothing. The way it is shown reminds me of a 2000s action movie.
I was confused because I thought in the avatar world we only had hybrid animals.
A big note on them wanting it to be like games of thrones… the teens in game of thrones act like teens? They goof off, they tease and bully one another. Removing these doesn’t make it more mature.
Hell even the adults in GOT banter and do fun shit in between all the violence and political kiniving and fucking. They were allowed to have jokes
@@janjanbinks1710 Sometimes they even bully and tease _during_ the politics
"Is he a ham?"
What a burn
Maturity isn't a lack of fun, it's understanding nuance and emotional complexity.
Not to mention that GRRM himself said that all his stories including ASOIAF, thus including GoT when it was good, are "about the human heart in conflict with itself".
That's exactly what Avatar was about as well! These two things were already appealing to the same goddamned audience! It's like the people behind this haven't watched either show.
Even the king on HOTD had little figurines!
Re: the child actors, Katara's performance is the biggest indicator to me that the director is at fault, because I've seen this actress, Kiawentiio, turn in some absolutely incredible performances. Seriously, check her out in Anne With An E or Beans - she is extremely talented. The performances here are not indicative of the actors' actual abilities.
I’m sure it would be overwhelming for anyone let alone young actors to act in a green screen with no visual input for hours on end, top that with bad direction, yeah it’s really not the child actors fault
i also think that chemistry reads would’ve aided the performances as well.
the fact the adults act just as stiffly as the children SHOULD be the biggest indicator of the problem here
Funny enough, a CZcamsr named Bryan Seeker, does casting for future movie/TV projects. He did one for The Last Airbender and picked Kiawentiio as his first choice. AND THIS WAS TWO YEARS BEFORE THE NETFLIX SERIES WAS RELEASED.
Honestly, I’d recommend you go check out his videos as a lot of his castings are pretty swell. If only Hollywood could listen to CZcamsrs.
if one of the actors suck, that's a bad performance. if most/ all of the actors suck, that's bad directing
This is probably overthinking it but Big Joel incorporating the whole drinking alcohol bit on its own without really conveying the same meaning of what he's imitating feels like meta commentary on this adaptation
it started as kind of a empty gesture evoking the AVGN, that's why the green bottle and some phrases throughout.
The deeper analysis is that Joel's entire video essay persona is just the updated version of these jokes. The constant eye rolling, the disinterested voice, the body language, and the holding of the mic to show that production value is below him. This character and the alcohol bit(and the angry reviewer persona at large) communicate the exact same thing: "this is below me". The troubling and even eerie thing is that back in the day it was done as an obvious character. But this breadtuber persona is meant to be accepted by the audience as organic. Joel is unironically doing the modern version of this bit at all times, and it will be similarly lampooned in the near future. If you want another example of this character, watch Leadhead's most recent video. They do it much less convincingly. Once you notice it, it may be distracting.
@@jacksobrooks You lost me at breadtuber
@@purplecobra52 well, I didn't want to use any slurs
@@jacksobrooks and you shouldn't!!!
nearly all of the dialogue and acting from what I can see here reads to me 100% like a Dharr Mann video. it's that same hollow, emotionally flat, uncanny, unnecessarily repeating things that were just said vibe and I can't stop seeing it
This Aang is just Charlie Brown, a depressed middle-aged man in the body of a child
omfg he is
that works really well because you could replace gran-gran's speech with trombone sounds and nothing would change
No, he’s just a goof ball guys.🥸
Good grief
dont disrespect my boy charlie brown wtf
Sokka being sexist was not some incidental part of his character. He was a young boy when the men of his tribe left, and as the oldest male left in the tribe, he felt obligated to take the role of defender. It makes sense that a boy that age being forced into a position like that would internalize the traditional gender role he had been assigned, it added depth and realism to his character. Moreover it showed what kind of person he really was when he had his sexism challenged by Suki, and instead of becoming bitter or obstinate, actually grew as a person. Without that arc, Sokka isnt Sokka.
Also! It shows that good people can still and do have biases, and that they can also work to overcome them! And he isn't proven wrong by someone saying "hey that's bad" he's proven wrong through experience. Basic show don't tell
Besides, it's not like the show made his sexism some kind of admirable trait, he gets it beat out of him in the fourth episode.
I don't necessarily hate that kind of change.
The problem is that they still want to do the story arcs that revolve around his sexism which then become completely aimless.
@@PauLtus_B I was trying to think of a way to articulate this. Basically, it's fine if they wanted to take away that arc - it diminishes Sokka's growth in my eyes, but that's just because I like how well it was handled. What they needed to do, which they completely and utterly failed at, was give him some other kind of meaningful arc to follow.
And it’s so important to his character that he is that young. If we saw an adult man acting the way he does we’d just dislike him, but coming from a 15 year old boy all his flaws are much more empathetic. We understand that he’s not a bad person, he’s just immature and we’re invested in seeing him grow. This actor is 22 and that completely changes the nature of the character
In the end the new writers didn't want sokka to be sexist and learn how to not be because they were too afraid to talk about sexism in nuanced ways like the og show. Almost like they themselves are.... sexist
It really just shows how much care was taken in the original to make a well thought out and intelligent show that treats children as people who can process nuance.
the live action "more mature" version treats its audience with way less respect than the animated version
The usual with Hollywood „adult“ shows
Underrated comment! (well, it was at the time, lol
It feels like the producers had a marketing informed checklist of everything they thought would be needed for this show to be a hit. Darker and more realistic tone to capture new adult fans, don’t stray too far from source material so as to not upset original fans, flashy bending scenes, don’t make anything too child centric as to not alienate adults, etc. It feels like they made sure all of these things were true about the show but didn’t bother to think about whether all of these things could come together in a nuanced and artful and satisfying way. Critiquing this show with the assumption that it exists with the primary goal of being a good tv show first and foremost is bound to fail. It primarily exists as a product and was created with this in mind. I know that all shows are products but ideally you would have producers who think the best way to make a financially successful product is to make a truly high quality product. If the creators had any artistic integrity and wanted to make a darker and more gritty take on ATLA they would have aged up the characters and altered the way the plot progresses and the various emotional beats and character arcs to fit with this. They didn’t do this because they probably didn’t want to alienate original fans. What we get then is this weird Frankenstein’s monster of a show where the main characters are still kids but any themes or character development related to childhood, growing up, loss of innocence, immaturity, etc is removed. Literally no reason for the characters in this show to be kids other than continuity with the original show which was either a marketing decision and/or a clear sign that the producers of this show have absolutely no understanding of how the original series functions as a piece of art and entertainment.
It won't stop baffling me that the original ATLA, a brand new IP made for actual kids had enough respect for its audience (of kids) to not just fill the script with exposition and informed attributes. It knew when to show and not to tell and respected the audience enough to know they'll figure stuff out and it knew how to drip feed relevant info about the lore.
While the Netflix version which wants to be for grownups, constantly spews lore dumps, even for things we've seen. It's not enough to see Gyatso's skeleton to figure out that he was killed by the Fire Nation, adults watching the show need to be told he was killed as well as being shown him dying.
@@ojgsk8ternow that you put it that way, "dont have things too child centric to not alienate adults," i just realized, is stripping all the whimsy from the show even a sensible way to do that? Because thinking about the characters of both shows, ATLA's cast is like the same age as them in Stranger Things. And i feel like they have the same type of energy, mix of drama and light hearted, child like banter with each other as in Stranger things, and that obviously didnt have any problems with its success. So man, that sucks, it just makes that shitty change in Netflix Avatar seem even less necessary
"You ran away from your responsibilities!!"
Except he didn't run away. He basically left to get a pint of milk.
Yea. Plus he’s not a Dad yet so he wasn’t planning to not return. You can count on him to actually get the milk.
I agree. In the Netflix version, Aang basically left temporarily because he was stressed and needed some time alone to clear his head. That's actually a very mature thing for a child to do. In the original, he had to learn that despite attempting to run from his responsibility, he was still a child, and the destruction of the air tribe was not his fault, but it was something he needed to prevent from ever happening again. In the Netflix version, people really want him to think it's his fault, even though that makes even less sense than in the original.
Airbender version of a 5 minute smoke break
"No one has ever fought for me before" Aang you were raised by pacifist monks...
I really appreciate you pointing out that Katara is ambitious, determined and passionate, not to mention the point of view character for the whole series. I feel like people tend to forget that, reduce her to a bleeding heart Team Mom. It doesn't help that the show's writing shifts after Toph is introduced, and Katara becomes the wet blanket to Toph's feral child. In Sokka's Master, Katara is pathologically incapable of telling a joke, where in Book 1 she's dishing out quips like "I'd rather eat fireballs than nuts" and is the feisty irresponsible one to Sokka's grumpy straight man. She's willing to steal from pirates and is more likely to take risks like talking to Haru and going to a Fire Nation festival. Sokka's shift to carrying more of the comic relief is another reason for her shift in characterization. I don't think her characterization gets too far off the rails, especially since you can tell that the weight of the war is changing her outlook and priorities, but I do think that people remember her in a reductive way.
What are you talking about? Katara wasn't quippy in Sokka's Master because her brother is gone and she's doing nothing but sitting around all day in the hot sun. Katara and Sokka always quip because they are used to that sibling dynamic, so with him gone and her bored out of her mind, I doubt she'll be quippy when the rest of the group feels incomplete without Sokka there. plus Sokka wasn't "reduced to comic relief", he's always been comedic, but it was never his sole trait. that doesn't affect him as a character, but continues to solidify his personality. plus, Katara has always been a parentified child, taking up "motherly" responsibilities since her mom died and her father left, so she'll obviously act motherly when faced with people like Toph who insist they are independent to show how much she isn't a burden. Katara never saw Toph as a burden, but rather as an extra hand, something Toph didn't register right away given how she was hidden away and coddled her whole life. lastly, Katara's culture is community oriented, meaning the individual is proactive for the good of others. you could almost say her mantra is what she said to the earthbenders to encourage them to escape the fire nation prison: "your fate is in your own hands". that proactive thinking drives Katara from the moment she naively steps out to greet Haru to the moment she seeks revenge for her mother's killer. She is decisive about what actions she takes because she believes her destiny is in her own hands.
It's really wild that for 10+ years a criticism that you could lay at every Netflix adaptation is "They cut stuff out, stretched it out, and replaced it with nothing."
Because filming scenes where things happen is expensive, so we'll just have the characters say all the things we could show, and blow all the budget on CGI fight scenes instead.
I never watched both Avatar, but I wrote a deep and lengthy review of Cowboy Bebop Netflix adaptation and the faults are surprisingly similar. "Replace it with nothing" is about right. How soulless could you be to create these things twice (and more times, presumably).
yeah and even though other ppl dont see it, the one piece LA had this problem too. i personally think it wasnt criticized nearly as much as it shouldve been.
Except for One Piece.
@@worshipthecomedygodseoeunk4010 Liked OPLA. I liked it a lot even. It felt like One Piece. But it is imperfect and it has a lot of those problems. I honestly think the amount of creative control Oda retained was huge to keeping it from becoming another live action casualty
22:36 I always interpreted Zuko being banished unless he found the Avatar as a particularly cruel joke on Ozai's part - "Sure you can come home ... when pigs fly!"
When Zuko does come back, his father isn't particularly warm towards him either - Azula is the one who really pushes for his reintroduction at court, mainly so she can use him as a scapegoat if things go wrong.
That was exactly it. Ozai never really expected Aang to reappear and even less so for his son to find and kill him. Seemed like an excuse to not have him around anymore and torture him with false hope. His reaction to Zuko actually succeeding was basically a mild "oh, really now".
I think you're missing the point though, Ozai did treat Zuko nicely when he returned. Welcomed him back and everything. That's why Zuko was so frustrated, cause he DID get everything he ever wanted only to find that he didn't feel fulfilled by it.
@@kaialone I'd argue it can be both. those aren't mutually exclusive ideas. Ozai was disappointed in his son from the get go and banished him at a time when the idea of the avatar returning was so far out. he had no reason to believe the avatar would ever return so yes, Ozai did intentionally banish him in a state where the presumed notion would be that Zuko would search forever and never be allowed back home, not to mention that the fire nation perceived Zuko as the weaker less willed sibling who, even if the avatar returned, would never truly capture him anyways. but when the avatar DOES return to the world, when his presence IS made known, and when Zuko "kills" him, when Azula gives Zuko that credit, of course Ozai treats him with respect and gives him the time of day! logically he'd do roughly the same for a different solider who captured the avatar. the point is that it wouldn't have actually mattered whether Zuko was his son or not, because Ozai doesn't respect Zuko as his kin, only as the formerly banished solider who happened to have completed what was thought to have been an impossible task.
@@null_doesnothing2487 I didnt say they were mutually exclusive
Yeah Ozai never expected Zuko to pull it off, it was just a way to be rid of him- but when Zuko came back sucessfully, he DID welcome him back and treat him how Zuko wanted to be treated, which was the point of Zuko's conflict in early Season 3
@@kaialoneI don't know...I think Zuko's conflict early on Season 3 did have to do, at least in part, with his father. Ozai did welcome him, and told him he was proud, but he did so quite coldly, like a general addressing a soldier, not a father addressing his son. I think it was a very deliberate choice to have the scene of Ozai welcoming Zuko back juxtaposed with the scene with Hakoda and Katara. Hakoda hugged his daughter, he told her that he had missed her and thought every day about her...Ozai didn't do any of that. A part of Zuko's final push towards redemption was him realizing that his father wasn't who he thought he was, both as a parent and human being.
Tbh i think the biggest crime was the lack of “silent” moments in the show. I feel like its constantly trying to keep moving and going super fast to be more interesting to the audience… Where as in the original having calm moments with the cast or just the scenery really made the show feel immersive and have more depth as u could rlly sit and process the atmosphere or what was occurring. Some of my favorite moments r literally just of like momo eating fucking fruit while the music played quietly the background. It made the show feel so tranquil and this new one lacks that imop.
1:13:51 Exploring Iroh in the original series is an interesting topic. So, the first time we see the storyline, we're shown things that could plausibly explain his behavior and how it changes--his dedication to his nephew, his opposition to Zhao's destructiveness, etc. But they drop a hint in the first season that only takes fruition later--when he stalls the entire crew to go look for his white lotus paisho piece. From that, I think we're supposed to piece together with the later seasons that he's been a spy for the White Lotus, secretly working against the bad guys, for a very long time. The Iroh we see in Season 1 is an Iroh carefully keeping his cover, and when he appears to change, part of that is simply him beginning to put the mask down.
I think what you can't attribute to the hidden loyalties, you can attribute to his open loyalties and how they conflict with those hidden ones. He cares about Zuko, even when that pits him against his own morals. It's a moral conflict he carries throughout the series and eventually has to face, leading to his imprisonment. And/but also, throughout the series, he knows that if he stops being there for Zuko, very bad things are going to happen to Zuko and possibly also to the Avatar.
My biggest issue with the Agni Kai scene is that it seems like the writers forgot that the whole reason it ended like it did originally, with Ozai burning and banishing him, was because he refused to fight. His punishment for talking out of turn was a public Angi Kai against the Fire Lord.
and having Zuko fight back, but more importantly also *almost win* makes Ozai come off so goddamn weak writing wise. There's a reason we don't see him fight until the end of the cartoon and it's cause he's supposed to be The Final Boss Antagonist for a reason? Zuko was *13* (and not a prodigy in the cartoon at least)
Exactly, like the whole reason the first agni kai we see Zuko do is with Zhang in the original is to teach that "hey, Zuko is pretty competent at fighting watch him beat this grown ass man". The point of the second is that it teaches us that Zuko is empathetic and that his father and sister hate that, and despite how competent he is, he will never be as inherently powerful with fire bending as them.
Pretty sure Zuko was 15? Azula is his younger sister and shes 14 🤔
@gRinchY-op5vr Zuko is 16 in the show, got banished 3 years prior, therfore 13 when he got burned
Also, making it a badass fight is even more counterintuitive to the whole "maturity" circlejerk the writers had going on.
It reads more like "this talented fighter is doubling down and squaring up with his dad" and not "this dad is permanently disfiguring his 13 year old's face after he refused to fight"
A stark contrast from that haunting pan of Zuko slowly looking up at his dad, with tears in his eyes, after begging not to fight
Not only that, but it takes away a lot of the agency and tragedy of Zuko. It's made abundantly clear in the og show that (one) Zuko is terrified of Ozai and begs not to fight, but (two) that Zuko is incredibly strong for straight-up *refusing* to fight Ozai.
He could've buckled to the pressure by feeling forced to fight, but Zuko *chose not to.* That's what makes Ozai such a monster, *he burned his son's face* because (while yes, Zuko "disrespected" him) Zuko actively made the choice to not fight him because *that's his dad, and he LOVES him.*
By choosing not to fight, Zuko shows Ozai that he's not a threat to him and gives the choice back to Ozai, begging his dad for mercy. He's not even going to *try* to defend himself.
But to Ozai, Zuko refusing to fight is weak and speaking up to protect the new soldiers undermines the Fire Lord's authority. Is Ozai going to show mercy to Zuko? Not for a second! If anything, he's *insulted* that his son is choosing pacifism over violence. In Ozai's mind, he's thinking, "How could I have raised such a coward?"
That's what makes Zuko's backstory so tragic in the first place. His dad is an abusive pos who punished his son by burning and permanently scarring his face because Zuko tried to do the right thing, not just by the soldiers but also by his dad.
I don't know why they made katara's nan so evil, not just telling aang that everyone he knew died like that, but also it implies that she was holding onto the resources katara needed to learn water bending the whole time and kept it from her until she left. they also made her harsh and weird in general
and then even weirder cause of how quickly she then encouraged her. Originally she was just concerned and stubborn so the switch up wasn't that jarring. But here she was so against it that it felt out of left field how quickly she came around.
I actually sort of get that part. After Kya was murdered for calling herself the last Waterbender, she was probably worried that encouraging Katara to learn Waterbending would eventually lead to the Fire Nation learning of her and returning to kill her. But once she leaves with Aang, Gran-Gran knows that Katara will be in danger regardless and will need to learn Waterbending to protect herself.
That being said, I absolutely despise Gran-Gran in the new live-action show. Just not for that specific reason.
I was blown away that she could look at that tiny child and really just "your people are all dead, they died a hundred years ago, which was the start of the war we're still in. And *you* have to fix it, good morning." I get he's the avatar, but a little more tact, Gran Gran, please
Maybe she got dementia and she has no filter any more. Her odd, vacant, wooden style of expression certainly tracks with that.
@@RidleyJones"Aang, it's been 100 years...and we finally beat medicaire."
50:18 - That joke could've been totally fine if they didn't add him repeating the "I never listened" part. Just have him say. "The monks said I never listened.... at least, I think that's what they said." Because it implies that he doesn't listen without him being evidently aware and uncaring of this flaw.
My heart sank when Aang went to 'clear his head' with Appa. It's an entirely different starting point for him as a character. There's a world of difference between hearing huge news and wanting to clear your head and hearing huge news and deliberately running away to avoid the burden of said news. It's the difference between oh that sucks something bad happened while you were out on a joyride, and something terrible happened because you actively chose to run away from your responsibilities. So much of the cartoon is him grappling with that, and the show did not replace it with an equally impactful character arc.
My biggest pet peeve has to be the fact they NEVER refer to the nations. ONLY the benders. "The fire benders are doing this!" "We must protect the water benders!" Like the fuck? Is Netflix suggesting everyone in this world is a bender?
Honestly good setup for the conflict in LoK season one. Non benders feeling oppressed and all that. Saying "benders" instead of "nation" implies that anyone who is not a bender is not of the nation, not a real citizen, an other. It would actually be REALLY clever if that's where they were going, but unfortunately I know better than to have hope in these sorts of shows
@@spongecakes1986 Yeah cause they totally intended this :/
@@imtotallyarealperson8121 I literally said I know better than to think that was their intention
Aang: ”I’m just a silly lil goofball🤪”
Also Aang: *proceeds to be the most serious un-childlike character despite being 12 yo who only care about serious business like the war throughout the whole show*
It’s like no one learned from shyamalan
who got tim burton involved?
Every version of Katara outside of the original show is just the Ember Island Players version. Like they literally made an episode poking fun at Flanderizations and mischaracterizations and everyone adapting the show just went "OH HERP DERP SO _THAT'S_ WHAT THE CHARACTERS ARE!!"
I love how Aang exists only to bluntly state what the show is trying to say. "You're wrong. You CAN rely on your friends!"
Joel, I'm disappointed by this. You absolutely failed to mention how Netflix's avatar is very bad actually.
True, but I did enjoy the two straight hours of dancing cats. The people that didn't watch really missed out.
@@DriscolDevil i only saw 2 hours of just white static
@@SuperCatfire you need to tune in your monitor.
It's a television! I like television.
"Netflix's Avatar is garbage and here's why"
It really irritates me that almost all of the genuine thoughts, advice, and impressions the main trio have almost always come from somebody else. "Monk Gyatso used to say", "Grandma always said", "Remember what dad told us" - these characters have no will of their own, the showrunners decided the best way to have them engage with the world and even each other is by proxy. Nice job doing your own "Game of Thrones" here, guys!
"this is how kids talk right?"
Maybe they only caught the last season
((((((Spoilers for Cruella Movie)))))) Same energy as the Cruella movie having damlations be responsible for her mom’s death. She didn’t need a said reason to hate Dalmatians… we accepted that she just is a weirdo who wants dog coats. These live action sequels and remakes feel the need to have characters have no original thoughts everything needs to be directly inspired by something else.
I WAS THINKING THIS TOO
"It's rare in life, to get to be the biggest hater. To not just hate something, but hate it more, perhaps, than anyone else on the planet. And when that opportunity does present itself to you, you need to express yourself, to share your evil opinions."
Biggest Joel
The scene that broke me was when gran started reciting the opening monologue off rip, unprompted, CORRECTLY, after the actual opening changed so much of the original.
2 HOUR VIDEO WHILE IM IN BED WITH A TUMMY ACHE? YIPPE!!!
HOW COOL IS THAT? NOW I GET REST AND WATCH VIDEO! YIPEEE
we are truly eating well. nutritious. fulfilling. mmm yumyumyum
Same! Glad it’s on a Sunday, too!
Are you liking it so far
same same! ive been sick for like 7 days and all thats keeping me company is youtube and video games without much movement
I always loved Bumi in the cartoon.
He went 100 years thinking Aang was dead, but he still stood strong like a true Earthbender, and became the king and kept Omashu protected for a long time!
The moment I loved the most with him was when Aang realized who he was. Bumi knew more than anyone that Aang had a MASSIVE responsibility and difficult journey ahead of him, but he didn't guilt trip him or lay it on too thick. Not only was Aang one of his best friends, but he also understood that Aang was still a child, and if he were to put too much stress on him, he knew it'd only make things more difficult for him. He just told him plainly, its gonna be tough, but you have your friends, and as long as you think outside the box, you'll be just fine!🥲
I feel this more as I get older, I'm realizing. We can't interact with kids the same as a peer would, but also we don't stop being those kids just because we develop back pain or whatever. You can choose to ignore the kid part of you until it withers and is forgotten, or you can remember it and be a better adult for the kids in your life.
@@Nassifehbeautifully said
@@Nassifeh exactly. Especially when you compare Bumi's conversation with General Fongs. Fong heard of what Aang did in the Siege Of The North and thought he was ready to take on the entire nation. When he disagreed, Fong just guilt tripped him by showing him all the wounded soldiers, and made it seem like the only reason they were hurt and all their families back home destroyed, was solely Aangs fault. Bumi could've done the same, but that would've been the wrong choice. Aang needed to see the world as it was for himself, not have others sway his decision and make him do something rash.
Like, I'm sure Bumi went through a period of hating Aang for vanishing, but he is over 110 years old, he has had plenty of time to let go of his grudge and become the kooky *SUPER JACKED* chaos gremlin we know and love. They could gave gine that route instead of turning him into a petty jackass.
I stopped watching after two episodes and it is STARTLING how bad they made Bumi. Its not even poorly written, its like psychotic. They took a fun idea about a friendship lasting a lifetime and seeing the world from new perspectives and made Bumi a vindictive asshole
thats actually insane, the people who wrote this are like, evil humans
Approaching Jenny Nicholson runtime with this one
after watching four hours of Star Wars hotel dissection, two and a half hours feels like a light lunch 😂
Katara is a character ahead of her time. She’s a girl of color in touch with her emotions, embraces femininity, is headstrong, mean, impulsive, self-reliant, and we ADORE her.
I wish the animated Katara could pull the live action Katara into a hug and tell her that she doesn’t need these boys telling her how to bend and she can scream and cry and run around just like someone her age should be able to!
i hate that aang is a Very Special Boy because one of the reasons that the original was so heartbreaking is that aang is just a kid with the avatar role thrusted upon him. yes he is skilled, but he isnt the most skilled airbender. hes just a kid
Yeah. Remember when he first tried to learn fire and earth? Absolute disasters. Sure he was an amazing airbender, inventing that little air scooter technique, and sure he was a pretty quick learner with water, but that's only half of it. I wish we got the episode with the firebending master, so we can actually see this kid mess up for once, and have someone mad at him for a good reason. It's so important to show how much he has to learn. He's still childish and impatient, and he's not a prodigy at everything he does. I'd have certainly preferred that to them shoving things from the next season in this one for no reason. You already have so much material to shove into eight episodes, why the hell would you shove MORE into it!?
@@spongecakes1986 the air scooter is perfect little moment when we first see it; it's inventive, daring and skillful.... and he smacks right into a boulder using it lol. That's Aang.
this is also what makes it so hard to watch when bad stuff is happening to Gon in Hunter x Hunter or Steven in Steven Universe. Because, despite how “special” they might be, at their heart they’re children going through horrifying levels of trauma that no child should have to go through.
@@bloodywilliam3083 Gon breaks me bro he's just a kid 😭😭
Remember that one scene where after he learns he's the avatar, his peers doesn't want to play with him anymore because they think he has an unfair advantage? It's such an important scene to me because it shows Aang as still a kid who wants to play with his friend, and insisting he can still play but being a "Very Special Boy" in the netflix adaptation feels so... bland
They tried to silence him, but Big Joel grew bigger than his enemies…
Especially his forehead.
You are honestly pretty generous with your take on Bumi. I thought the entire episode with Bumi was atrocious and offensive to such a great character. It also completely betrays his role as a member of the white lotus.
Avatar: Shadow of the Writer's Strike
36:00 - I saw this comment on other people's videos from when the show first aired.
"They took the sexism out of Sokka's storyline, and then just put it into the rest of the writing."
that comment hits like a wrestling move
Why do they always do this to Katara's character?! Both this series and the movie made her so dull and lifeless
O O F
I think the reason they start with the earthbender chase is because they desperately want to establish, more than anything else, that they're not M. Night Shyamalan. That they can move The Big Rock.
Ironically this show angers me more than his movie
Listening to this while gaming, looking back at the screen after hearing what sounds like a stream of piss to see Big Joel smiling over a miniature toilet full of what looks like piss was a very bewildering experience
It shouldn’t be called wolf cove cuz it’s avatar. It should be called bearwolf cove or wolfseal cove or something
I can't believe Aang's teacher was just one day away from retirement
LMAOOOOOO
Even in that terrible 2010 movie they still understood how important it was that aang didn't know, and to an extent didn't believe that the air nomads were dead
That, the costumes looked better, and the fighting (ignore the floating earth bender pebbles) actually were better. Like the fighting in the Netflix version is just them throwing Kamehamehas at each other. The movie at least had some martial arts incorporated to the actual bending.
Fun fact: Katara didn’t know that Aang was sacrificing himself when she gave that speech. She specifically wasn’t there when Yue said he would be sacrificing himself if he merged with the spirit.
“Schmendrick” is one of my favorite words, and I was so happy to hear it.
i have to wonder why they chose Kyoshi for the opening narration. Obviously you covered why Katara was better in the original, but if you're going to change it...why Kyoshi? She wasn't the last avatar, she has no real connection either to the current events, having died a century prior, or to any of the immediate players, since her story was centred mostly in the earth kingdom. Surely Roku would have been the more obvious choice, lamenting over his own failure to prevent the war, and hoping that his successor might accomplish what he couldn't. It feels like they only picked Kyoshi because she's popular.
To please the kyoshi fans, even though I love Kyoshi and think she’s the best avatar, I hated it, also they fucked up kyoshis character so bad
It’s literally this, they’re pandering to the fandom bc they know we love a girlboss (kill me). The crazy thing about all this is that Netflix’s “girlboss agenda” has largely disempowered Katara, the OG atla girlboss
I almost wonder if in a very, very early version of the pitch, it was going to be about Kyoshi. It would be very interesting to see something set in a different time in the same universe, and if you were going to pick an avatar to fit the "look, we can do R rated stuff" tone, she's probably the best choice a casual fan would recognize.
mannn roku narrating the opening could've fucked. changing 'when the world needed him most, he vanished' roku could say 'and when the world needed me most... i failed.'
@@Conflict-ff5pi also the winter solstice two parter in the original show was all about going on an insane mission into the fire nation just to talk to Roku for like 3 seconds, and in this show Aang just like, has a leisurely chat with Kyoshi in the second episode because…. People like that Kyoshi is tall and badass?
About "Wolf Cove",
I think the issue with giving the southern water tribe a name is that it takes away the implication that this is the ENTIRE southern water tribe. Wolf Cove makes it sound like it's one of many villages in the south, instead of the entire thing.
It's also painfully generic and sounds like something a 14 year old would come up with
There is no way that is the entire southern water tribe, they have existed there for centuries, they should have a population greater than 500 or whatever it was in Hama’s Time
@@mranima748They did go through somewhat of a genocide when the fire nations came and got rid of all the benders, I feel like they probably took out a generous portion of the non benders as well, because non soldiers always get caught in the crossfire. Watching the show I was under the impression that all the different groups probably had to unite under one leader because they had suffered so many casualties that having a bunch of tiny villages wasn't sustainable.
@@mranima748 I'm confused, are you critiquing the original show?
The southern water tribes population slowly dwindled over the hundred year war because of raids, the water benders being killed off, and the men leaving to fight.
I definitely didn't get the feeling that it was the only village in the south, but I do think it may as well have been. There may well have been dozens of small, isolated villages, but clearly Katara didn't know of any large enough to find a waterbending master.
But there must have _been_ other villages, since the South had a large new capital city by the time of Korra. Some of that population (including Korra's father) was said to have come there from the North, but there was clearly enough of a southern population to maintain a distinct cultural identity, and Sokka and Katara's village wasn't big enough for that. Nor was it large enough to explain the size of the Southern fleet.
In the comics the northern water tribe travels to the South Pole to help rebuild the town, implying that a lot of them stayed on.
Wish you would've not blinked the entire video. It would've fit the vibe so well I can't explain