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5 Ways to Capture Dialogue in the Car
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- čas přidán 14. 08. 2024
- Boston based Production Sound Mixer Jim Keaney demonstrates 5 ways to rig microphones to record dialogue in a car.
▸ 1. Schoeps 641 Mic: geni.us/y6QXU4t
▸ 1a. Dinkum Arm Mount: geni.us/07UwL
▸ 2. Peter Engh OmniGoose: geni.us/wk6T
▸ 3. Sanken Cub-01: geni.us/JhZX
▸ 4. Ursa WireRig Mount: geni.us/kEytS
▸ 5. Sanken CosD11 Lav Mic: geni.us/zmvI
▸ Sennheiser MKH50: geni.us/WEWP09u
▸ K-tek Coiled Boom Cable www.bhphotovid...
▸ Remote Audio HN-7506 Headphones www.bhphotovid...
Audio recorded on the highlighted microphones w/ Lectrosonics SMDWB and SMWB into a Sound Devices 688. Video shot on a Canon 70D. Edited in Adobe Premiere Pro. Music by me.
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Recorded with a Sound Devices Recorder geni.us/2eqzmO
Shot on Canon 70D geni.us/ZnV2W
Edited in Premiere Pro amzn.to/3aHb2We
Follow me on the ole / jimkeaney
Hire me at HubLocationSoun... (based in Boston)
Or via email: Jim.Keaney [at] Gmail.com
As an Amazon & B&H affiliate, I earn from qualifying purchases.
Your shovel collection is as impressive as your mic collection.
This is great, but I really wished you'd also done a test while driving. I've found that some mics sound great when parked and you really like the bass, but as soon as you start running an engine suddenly that nice bass pickup is too much and you lose some clarity in the voice. I've tended to prefer the COS11-Ds (visor mounted) for that reason as being a bit brighter cuts through. But I am open to trying other things. But also the ease of a wireless rig is very appealing, especially when doing quick changeovers.
Wow, super appreciative that you shared this knowledge, so a huge thank you, really. As a one man band docie maker, the amount of information I have to process is just overwhelming, so these tips mean the world to me. Really, thanks mate.
It's great to see another pro doing videos on CZcams. You speak my language and I like it. I've used every one of these mics as plants and you nailed the test and comparison. Well done. Subscribed!
Thanks, Allen! Big fan of your channel. I mostly mix, but do day-play as boom occasionally and I'm always trying to figure out how to be a better boom op. The boom op's role is so different than the mixer and utility on scripted projects. I like how you focus on the thought/etiquette/etc behind booming. Physical mechanics of course are important to learn, but all the other minutiae is so critical. Our community is lucky to have a working pro like yourself sharing so much priceless knowledge. Anyone else reading this: do yourself a favor and subscribe to Allen's "Sound Speeds" channel 👍
@@HubLocationSound Dude, thank you. I enjoyed your 5 plant video and completely agree... when the sun is blazing, it's great to be inside shooting a video.
Subscribing to@@SoundSpeeds just off you guy's back and forth.
Glad I stumbled on your content. Thanks for making this super informative video man!
Thanks Jim! Lots of great tips here.
This is the video I didn't know I absolutely needed. Thanks so much for this
great video! Will definitely be picking up the WireRig!!
Good job. I've used all of these methods. One thing I would say is that bodies tend to absorb more RF than anything, so I've found ankles wraps work better than having them worn in the small of the back, or worse yet, sat on in the back pocket. You should make a part two about planting in the back seat
Great and helpful video!!
Thank you so much for taking the time to do this. Very useful information. Try to keep antennas straight, and vertical if possible. If not, match the polarity of the antenna at the receiver. The radiation pattern is omnidirectional and perpendicular to the antenna, like a donut.
One of the best if not the best car mics video I’ve ever seen. Excellent info and audio demos. I’ve only ever had to get dialog in a car a couple times and did ok but was always anxious about the quality. This video has given me the confidence to mic a car rig no problem. Just bought a couple WireRigs and a few Bubblebee Concealers.
Thanks for the positive feedback. Let me know how you like the wirerigs and the bubblebees. The Cos11 Bumblebee Lav Concealer has become my go-to mount for months now.
Amazing video, so so helpful, I'm working on acquiring new ways to mount in cars and hearing how all these sound was exactly what I needed. Thank you!
This movie saved me, thank you!
Ready for the snow i see!
Wow learnt a lot from this video. Thank you! I have been wanting to set up a live streaming multi cameras inside a truck cab like carpool karaoke but audio capture and cabling have been hectic. This video gives me some ideas.
great tutorial. Just would've been nice to compare these while driving. maybe next time!
Best video on YT on this subject. Great job.
Dig it man supply and support musky clam as well. You're interior information has got me popping out my 72 ford van. ...yo turn off the blinker brah. Mice mice. I hear em
years ago i find myself into that situation. I only had a couple of cos11s and i taped 2 of them on the two visors in an attempt to develop a sort of boundary effect with the visor surface. The voice sound was ok but i had a lot of engine noise in my recording. Sadly the van was pretty old and noisly with nasty vibrations. Anyway i managed to get the job done.
Thanks for all these videos you make. Great tips that I learn a lot from!
In the next video, we'll be looking at a shootout between 7 awesome snow shovels.
Great video, watched first time 3 years ago and bought a few Wire Rigs. In two days I get to use them for the first time. Hopefully my COS-11’s will sound as good as it did in your video.
Thanks for the solid tips and giving several options for this kind of work.
great video
excellent, thanks
Thanks for the video.
Capsule + active cable (preamp) can do fine job in the car...eg.DPA MMC4018/MMP-ES
Dejan thanks for watching! I agree, I wish I owned the active preamp cable for the Schoeps cap. I imagine the proximity I would’ve gotten placing it overhead would hands-down be the winner. Putting it on my never ending shopping list ;)
@@HubLocationSound The Schoeps CMR is great as is the BLM. Dejan, the DPA MMP-GS with a 4018 capsule is brilliant! I love it!
Fantastic video - thank you! 👍🦘🇦🇺
Good explanation! Very usefull!!! Thank you.
p.s.
nice collections of snow shovels on the wall )))
Great video!
Great video. Subbed. I need more inputs on my recorder for car-pool karaoke.
Great video! Subscribed! If you can’t/don’t want to hide the tx up high, you can route the cable in the gap in the A-pillar panel or behind the rubber gasket thingy by the door.
Just a terrific bunch of tips here. Thanks so much.
thank you for the tips!
Thanks for watching, Carlos!
I love it! this has been a great review Thanks!!
Great content Jim. I use all of these techniques. I have resolved to ALWAYS using some sort of wind diffusion for any car plants. Never fails. Whenever I think, oh I definitely won’t need diffusion this time, I always do and have to be the asshole clumsily trying to snake past the camera mount and speed rail on the process trailer to tweak something. I’d rather just burn the expendables and have peace of mind.
Thanks for the demo, Jim. I normally just tuck a lav inside the visors in these situations and bag drop and have gotten great results, but I really like the sound of the omnigoose mics you're showing off. Might have to pick up a couple of those for myself.
Blaine thanks for watching. After listening back, I think I like the Omnigoose the best in this comparison. If I could get the Schoeps over head, I think that’d be the winner, but when mounted lower at the center console, I feel like the trade off with proximity puts the 641 in 2nd place.
@@HubLocationSound agreed. I've seen some rigs using a couple 4018c's in front of talent but the omnigoose seems like a better option for how quick and easy set up is and for how cheap those mics are in comparison
Great, thx so much
Great video. Thank you very much. Subbed.
The schoeps sounds really good
yep! 5X the money and even more times the size ;)
This was very informative. I have recorded sound in vehicles for nearly 25 years and there is always more to learn. I used to plant Sanken COS 11's but now use DPA 4071's, 6061's which I find more natural. I have a Sennheiser MKH-50 which only made it into a car once as I preferred to use a Schoeps CCM41s if I had time. Mostly it was radio mics tucked into the sun visors and on the people, for speed, as there is never enough time!
ive rigged a 50 at the cup holder with the flex mount on a sedan, got nothing but road noise. Ive also rigged lavs in the visor for back-up at the same time. 50 can be worthless depending on the vehicle and how sealed the cup holders are from road noise.
Yes, the Schoeps was a much better choice over the MKH-50 as it was tiny and had a high pass filter to lessen road noise. That’s why I only used the 50 once.
Dude, awesome video! I look forward to learning more.
Liked and subbed...and hit the bell.
Great and informative video. Thank you!
Awesome video!. Thanks!
You seriously helped me out like crazy. Thank you so much 🙏🏻
this is great
This is exactly the video I was looking for, thank you
Sanken Cos 11 with the "Ursa-thing" was far way better. Thanks for all the tips. Very usefull. I know directly when I could have used it in a truck during an interview. Next time ...
thanks!
OmniGoose sounds like the final boss in a really strange farm video game
I know this is an old video but I just bumped into it. I would love to know if you have a similar video but with cars in motion.
Loving the videos! Keep it up and thank you!
Nice job :)
Very helpful, thanks!
I’m looking to record high def pov driving videos and prefer to have the windows down so you can really hear exhaust noise etc. What do you think would be the best mic? I’ve tortured the DJI wireless mic along with a lav. I’ve also retired an h2n with a dead cat but with either setups, I’m getting a lot of toad noise and rushing air
Nice ! Thanks for sharing.
Thank you. very informative.
Great video.
well done
thanks jim
SUBSCRIBEDDDDD
great advice thank you...
9:35 - 9:38 You're fired! xD :D Just kidding.
What a great and informative video! Thank you!
huyked LOL I swear it couldn’t be seen in my Premiere Pro edit screen.
@@HubLocationSound
xD No worries. Adobe's fired! Trying to (Da Vinci) Resolve this issue right now. ;)
I use a lot the MK4 + KC cable on top on sun visor (+ cos11 / dpa 4060 lav) / And-Or, a MK41-MKH8050 clamp somewhere
But here, really impressive by Omnigoose (he need a HPF but sound very good)
Nice video. Any recommendations for when you’re driving?
I find that body worn lavs typically are best at rejecting/decoupling driving noise/vibrations. They can be tricky to find clean placements though (especially if seatbelts are worn).
@@HubLocationSound thank you kindly sir!✅
How do you deal with the tyre noise when driving? HPF or..? thanks for the content, subscribed.
Seems like you could also use floral wire with your lav to do the same thing as the WireRig!
Great video man! My friend and I are thinking of making podcasts while driving around and showing scenery. So we are thinking of putting a video camera on the grill (unless u have a better idea). So we want to capture good scenery and good conversations. What mic setup do you recommend for this? What has the best value? We aren't rich, but we'd like to get the best quality for money where it isn't shit.
Interesting video. I make quite a lot of CZcams videos in cars and it’s been a struggle to get clean audio. This was a useful video however you didn’t test any whilst underway. My biggest issue is that once driving at speed the noise there is a booming noise in the cabin.
In my experience, the winner in a loud/rumbly car is typically the body worn lav. It gets the mic decoupled from the car vibrations and in certain cases gets the mic closest to the mouth/chest. The hurdle then, is avoiding seat-belt rustle.
@@HubLocationSound Thanks for the tip.
@@eSysmanSuperYachts ps this is more of a post production trick but you can remove a lot of that unwanted low-end rumble with a Hi-Pass filter set somewhere between 80Hz to as high as 120Hz.
Ceiling ? It's the headliner in the UK :)
Gary Davies Headliner is the last band on the bill
This is great man!!! - btw have you done one on avoiding clothing noise.
Love this video! New subscriber
nice
Just ordered a bubblebee concealer, never heard of them before, looks awesome! Do you use there official tape, or do you make your own?
They come with some double sided tape pieces which fit the footprint of the concealer exactly. It's similar tape to Topstick in feel and stickiness, but I don't love/use their adhesive. It's tough to get off the concealers since it's very thin and often leaves a nasty residue. I prefer the Rycote Advanced Stickies Squares which are a very close fit to the same footprint. The Rycote squares have a thin layer of black foam between the double sided adhesives which I find decouples better and because it's softer, it isn't heard if the adhesive gets pulled on or if it starts to let go. The only thing I dislike about the Rycote Stickies are they cost about $.50 per piece!!!
Hub Location Sound awesome info. I thought about trying topstick, I’ll have to try some Rycote, everyone seems to love them but as you said the cost is a bit steep for $.50 a lav stick.
great stuff! thx
Are there any devices that connect this phone to car , do a designated person here' it?
At the end, when you're going through all the possible mics quickly, I think you swapped the CUB and the omnigoose. The CUB normally sounds pretty good, but yours had a strange squeal which made it really obvious.
Thanks G!
Nice video and tips! It would be great to listen to the mics with working engine and traffics, as it was a drive. In my experience, theres always a mess in low mid. Add to this pits and bumps. How good plant mics handle these kind of obstacles?
Awesome video! Thank you Jim :)
Good video. I recently bought the Peter Engh Omnigoose mic and a MKH-50. I’ve used booth in car rigging. I also bought a MKH-30 to use with my MKH-50 to record MS Stereo. What are your thoughts on using a bi-directional mic, such as the MKH-30, mounted between the driver and passenger for a vehicle setup. I haven’t recorded a car scene with two front seat actors talking since I’ve had my MKH-30, but I plan to give it a try the next time.
Unfortunately you have music in the background, it masks noise floor. Peter mic has 28 dB A noise floor by specs, it would by nice to hear how it sounds naturally without music or post processing.
Yeah, I agree - I wish I didn't have the music bed in this video. From my memory, the Cub did have slightly higher noisefloor than the others.
@@HubLocationSound Understood. Thanks for reply.
What's the sound like when the driver is actually driving and how do you silence car noises? For example we did an eng coverage of an electric car with gopro's mounted on the dashboard and into the headrest of the seat (aimed at the magnificent dashboard) and we capture "sound" with them (very low budget production). In case of electric cars, and new for that matter, they are quiet inside but still the audio capture is shit from a gopro, if we apply the same scenario on a combustion engine car, running on public roads, how would you capture clean audio on a budget?
Good question - lots of variables (Muscle car? Bumpy terrain? Windows down? Etc) but on a budget or fast moving production (like ENG/reality), body worn Lavs will typically get good results as long as the lav placements are ‘clean’ and don’t have a seatbelt landing right on top of a swishy coat. Gopros built-in mics (or any camera’s internal mics) are typically terrible sounding and used only for reference/syncing footage. Lavs are my starting point and if theres time I try some of these other approaches. As for silencing car noise, that’s somewhat impossible but a few things to consider: body worn lavs do a nice job of decoupling the mic from the vibrations caused by a moving car. The human body acts as a ‘shockmount’ absorbing bumps in the road. If you do use a mounted mic in a car, a traditional mic shockmount is highly recommended. Also consider proximity and rejection. Omni lavs pick up in every direction. Cardioid mics do better at rejecting the off axis sounds (undesirable ambience to the sides and back of the mic). Interference shotgun mics can sound strange in small spaces. Proximity is king in noisy environments. The closer you can get the mic to the speech, the less background noise it hears in relation - another reason that body worn Lavs are a good starting place.
@@HubLocationSound Thank you so much for this piece of information! As you say there are lots of variables and very little time to tackle them all as I've to do both sound and be the assistant of the camera Op so knowing ahead of time different tricks to get away with clean audio is something I like to learn on my free time. We usually employ sennheiser mke40 cardiod mics, so we declare them right away and that's ok with the medium we are working for. We also have a pair of sanken cos11D when they want a more "cinematic" kind of look, I'm not expert hiding them and have been considering different accessories to mount them correctly but it's hard to eliminate that noise from those winter jackets. Would sound blankets do anything if you put them on a dashboard? Just kind of curious about that one
@@POLARICED Sound blankets could help deaden reflections from the windshield but if you’re actually driving, I’d be weary of creating obstructions.
Great video, what camera were you using in car at the time of recording this video?
Canon 70D
@@HubLocationSound Thanks man, love your style, have been watching your videos back to back. Surely going to try the car setup for vlog style content
Nice
I wonder how the sanken sounds when the car is moving and getting all the vibration
In depth and greatly appreciated. Question: would you, or do you ever combine any of the aforementioned for whatever reason you needed to? Not sure of any scenarios where this would be necessary.
NIKONGUY1960 thanks for the comment. That usually depends how much time you have to rig the automobile also depends on the type of shoot. If it’s a commercial or film, you may want lavs + visors (nice to give Post options), if it’s a reality show you may just rely on lavs and if you have enough time - plant something overhead as a plan B. Lavs can get dicey especially in cars with seatbelts rubbing.
Great video and content. Just been watching a few of your videos and besides your intro and outro music being way way too loud compared to the rest of your audio it's been a pleasant experience.
Thanks for the comment. And I agree, it’s a balance I’ve been dialing in since these earlier videos. Apologies, if this one blew you away.
any suggestions on how to stay cool in the car without having to rely on AC with the engine running...?
keep the AC on with the fan speed as low as it will go, it might not be too loud..
Agreed. That's usually the way to go!
Hi Jim,
Even with these good sounding mics, won't they pick up car vibration sounds from the road and engine noises? How do you work through that?
Sean Farrell If the car is on the road and/or running, that will absolutely introduce ambient noise. Shockmounts and hi pass filters help to minimize rumble/vibrations. Body worn lavs will typically decouple most effectively. In films, picture cars are often turned off, sitting on a process trailer or ‘biscuit’ which reduces the unwanted noise. Sometimes they’re shot on stages which is the dream scenario. I think hearing some ambient noise is acceptable though especially when motivated by the location/action the viewer sees. Search for URSA Straps youtubechannel. They recently interviewed mixer Chris Howland and asked specifically how he mic’d a car scene in Tarantinos “Once Upon a Time in Hollywood”. It was shot on a biscuit on a (closed set) highway with the windows down. He used body lavs and visor mics and got usable audio. There is quite a bit of ambience, but I think our brains accept it as we see the windows down, how fast they’re driving, and wind blowing through their hair.
Hi Jim,
Thanks for the great reply. I'll search for URSA now.
Thanks,
Sean
Does the Omni goose come in 3pin Lemo for the wisycom and zaxcom folks?
The Omnigoose doesn't come terminated for anything other than TA5. If you contacted Engh, they might be willing to custom wire them that way, or perhaps even Gotham Sound in NYC... They have an in-house wiring dept that might be up to the challenge. The Omnigoose is a 3-wire lav, just like a cos11, so it has to be possible to wire it for lemo3... The tricky part would be getting the gooseneck casing to adhere firmly to the Lemo connector.
Sanken Cub 01 .... how could you say that its a could mic/lav. Its way to far that, bulky and thin at the same time. Like your aproach anyway.
Anybody can record sound in a car with the windows rolled up. The challenge is when all the windows are down, which is the way most car scenes are filmed. The in not too distant past almost every car scene was done in a convertible. When you had to shoot actual film you needed the daylight for exposure. Today the best way to do car scenes is in the studio with green screen. So much easier, after all the actors are paid to act, moving or not what's the difference.
Hi David, Thanks for taking the time to comment. The purpose of this video was to document the tone/reach of these mics placed in various positions. I actually feared this video might be too deep of a dive for many, but your comment does echo some others who specifically would've liked to hear the car running/driving as well. Looks like I may have to revisit this topic and approach it like more of a scientific test (shoot-out each mic: static, idling, driving, windows open, windows closed). I'd be interested to hear all that too. Truth be told the features I shot with we had the luxury of parked car scenes, process trailers and sound stages for most of the car scenes.
any chance you have a good car mic under $100 you can recommend?
$100 isn’t much to work with... Are you talking just for a mic or also a device to record it to? The closest thing in that price range I can think of is the Rode Wireless Go www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/1667739-REG/BI/21832/KBID/28200 you could clip it to your shirt or to your visor if you’re driving. The receiver module plugs into most DSLR cameras via an 1/8” jack. If you’re recording directly to an iPhone, Rode makes this proprietary cable that converts the receiver’s usb-c output into a Lightning port specifically for Apple products: www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/1602040-REG/BI/21832/KBID/28200
@@HubLocationSound just for the lav or mic. I am thinking of actually using a set of those rodes.. so two recievers but four tracks.. otherwise a zoom f6 but need some good lavs to pair it with... thoughts? the audio will be recorded when the car is moving and none of the mics will be clipped ONTO the passengers except myself
@@nickcbet I think the w.lav is the best you’ll do for $100 (I have a ‘best lavs’ shootout video where you can hear it). amzn.to/3m7rFQc this will go 1/8” into a Rode Go system. If you need to go XLR into something like the F6, you’ll need these adapters www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/1449007-REG/BI/21832/KBID/28200
Shure 183 is a great sound. Just too big
Höhöh cool :D
The biggest difficulty of filming in a car is how to isolate from car noise and vibration and I didn't see any comparison in this video :(
rabobravo A few other viewers echoed your desire to see/hear these placements while driving so perhaps I’ll have to do a part 2. There are just so many variables to consider (windows open/closed, wind, driving speed, is the environment busy, are we driving a monster truck or a quiet Tesla, the terrain, etc). This video highlights a handful of options/placements showing a baseline of what to expect regarding pickup patterns/reach/hidability. Will consider a followup... Since making this video I’ve got some different mics and mounts to try.
I think my car is bugged
All of these are over $300usd? Great but not great for us poor people haha
For someone who works professionally in the sound industry, it is damn strange that you can't pronounce Schoeps correctly. 🙄😖
Apparently this employee of Schoeps also can’t pronounce it correctly: czcams.com/video/Hzv2qUWAxZ4/video.htmlsi=0oFLCxnSMSQV08jk
great video