how Hwasa reminded me of everything I don't like about the self-love movement
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- čas přidán 15. 12. 2023
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Name: Cheryl
Age: adult
Pronouns: she/her
Race: Black (African)
Ult biases: Shownu (Monsta X), Onda (Everglow), Yujin (IVE), Huijun (MCND), Haram (Billlie), Heeseung (Enhypen), Cai Yubing( GP999), Ricky (ZeroBase1)
Stan List:
LOML: Kim Woojin
Ult of Ults (in order): Monsta x + wonho, Red Velvet, MCND, Everglow, Ateez
Ults (in order): IVE, Le Sserafim, FITFTY FIFTY, KARD, Billlie, Woo!Ah!, SHINee+Taemin, BTS, SKZ, PIXY
Semi Ults (in order): I_DLE, Dreamcatcher, Aespa, AOA, Seventeen, GWSN, Mamamoo, NCT127, CLC, WJSN, SuperM, Blackpink, Rocket Punch, StayC, Itzy, Cherry Bullet. - Zábava
People forget that "accept yourself the way you are" means to accept your qualities that you can't change about yourself, things you were born with, such as your race, sexuality, etc. But if it's something you have control over and it's a bad thing (your personality, unhealthy habits, etc.), hell yes you should change it.
Or for people who have slow metabolism like mine, believe me, I know people use it like an excuse, but my sister and I (almost same height) realize this, she is 40 pound less and eats more than me and moves less than me in a daily basis.
Also I have never being diagnosed but I feel like either autism or ADHD, since young age I have try to loss weight but is difficult because I lack self discipline.
I am just trying to survive this thing that we call life.
@@rowanjoy419 as a guy who has the complete opposite problem and tried to gain muscle mass.
The key to consistency is to go light and easy on yourself in the beginning. For example, your firsts time in the gym or anywhere else for losing weight, just do the most fun exercises and go a tiny bit harder and harder each and every day. And if u have days when you really don’t wanna exercise just go for at least five minutes or just show up ! This may seem unpractical to do that, but remember the goal is the make it a habit. And that’s what you should focus on at first, BUILDING A HABIT. The point is to get so used to it that you won’t even need discipline to maintain those habits
@@rowanjoy419i can loose some kg every week from just skip eating anything after dinner but then if i work out it makes me hungry and im really bad at eating healthy😉so for me only thing works to loose weight is not work to hard and eat no more then my body use per 24h then i slowly loose a little here and there
Mmm.... A little bit yes, but overall no. Life is about choices - some people have a few things that are "a bad thing" and some were dealt a bad hand by fate, and it's often not possible to "hell yes change it", or it's possible, but there's nothing left of the life to be lived while you conform to expectations. We should love ourselves, and pick the things that are the worst for us and we want to change them, or are hurting those around and therefore should be limiting our selfishness. ditto.
@@mohhhhhhhhgjghvcy on one hand these are good points, on the other hand HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
Sorry, that was just my ADHD as it thinks mansplaining can be cute.
I have a quite perfect body regardless of what and how much I eat or exercise, but if I had a problem with this and was not diagnosed and treated (or had a personal trainer and dietician like a rich baby) there would be no chance of that habit existing, and quite possibly it will then be possible to break even in one day without the PT around x)
A FYI :D
I feel it's a bit sad and ironic that idols sing about "self-love" and "being yourself" whilst the idols can't be themselves without being hated on by their own "fans".
My thoughts exactly.
Idk I never got that vibe with my ult group Dreamcatcher. To me it seems the fans love them for their weirdness. Maybe that’s more a thing for bigger groups who are more popular. Smaller fandom groups feels more like a tight knit family and the bigger the fandom the more toxic it gets. I have noticed that the past years as Dreamcatcher has gotten more
Popular there are more toxic fans. But I never noticed fans putting down the girls. I feel insomnia is pretty accepting of our idols.
@katelady1370 yeah, I agree. Somnies are pretty accepting of DC 😊
@@katelady1370 that totally makes sense though! the more exposure the group gets the more it will attract various types of people including the toxic what so-called "fans"
I don't want to compare this is just to tell confused people what unbothered actually means.
Wonyoung is an example of someone who is unbothered. She made ONE statement: "You are you, and I am me" And didn't speak about her getting hate by everyone ever again.
She just chose prettier outfits, didn't change her body and kept being her confident self.
You're totally allowed to say something against the hate you get. And I am a fan of Hwasa. But you guys need to stop with these labels you don't understand.
And it’s crazy that people try to depict Wonyoung as a pick me who’s insecure and cares about what others think because she wants attention.
@@Yoest.1 ikr, cause for me, Wonyoung is probably the one of the most unbothered kpop idols out there along with Lisa from bp. They both get immense hate, one for supposedly being a “pick me” and another one for performing at the Crazy Horse, yet they still don’t address such things and enjoy their lives so unbothered.
@@miraculoussimpson6785 lmaooo not Lisa
@@fyss7096yes Lisa . Let’s not act as if you guys didn’t body shame her for yearssssssss. She made one statement in pretty savage “born skinny bitch” and has never addressed the haters about her weight again! Just like wonyoung. So yeah, Lisa too.
@@fyss7096 she is included tho because regardless of what ur opinion is on BP or her, ya gotta admit she rlly stays unbothered about the slut shaming and weight comments about her
i think you mentioned it before but the issue with hwasa's stans post festival controversy is that they keep calling her "unbothered" at the haters because of "i love my body", but at the same time, they also say that she's "clapping back at the haters". she can't be doing the same thing at once. being "unbothered" would imply that she doesn't care, but she clearly does if she released a song about it. and that's okay, because she shouldn't have to stay quiet about hate. but her stans can't have it both ways
Okay why do K-pop stans do this so freaking much. Kind of unrelated but to take blackpink as another example, how can they be girlboss feminists but also be chronically ‘mistreated’… like make it make sense. Don’t get me wrong two opposing things can be true, but sometimes there’s just a total lack of common sense and blatant contradiction. It’s okay that your favourite artists aren’t everything everywhere all at once, they can just be one thing sometimes lmao.
THANK YOU, finally someone said it because that's what I've been thinking for a while now but never had a chance to say it because of the intense heat my comment can receive.
Maybe I don’t quite understand what unbothered means but the way I understand it right now, it feels fitting for what Hwasa is doing?
If you look “unbothered” up on Merriam-Webster, it means “not feeling or showing agitation, worry, or annoyance : not bothered”. If you go by that definition, you don’t need to actually BE unbothered but acting like you aren’t bothered still falls under that definition.
I feel like it’s similar to the word “brave”, where being brave doesn’t mean that a person feels no fear but that they act despite that feeling.
Translated to a situation like Hwasas: she still might feel bothered (e.g. feeling insecure) but will not let that stop her from being an artist and performing.
I’m really curious what people think about this because I am a bit confused about the semantics of it all :)
@@anniesilverfire You nailed it. These channels, knetz, netz and stans only see in black and white, no grey or varying shades of black or white.
It is not just kpop stans who do that, but many pop stans too. I keep on hearing artists like Nicki Minaj, Doja Cat and so on are unbothered by haters, but they keep on realising diss tracks. But honestly they could be just laughing at the haters and make diss tracks just as a joke. Diss tracks usually do well and have better lyrics then the boring love lyrics. I prefer diss lyrics then meaningless or standard love lyrics.
I've always loved Hwasa but I do agree with this. I also think we should talk about Jessi with this issue because she sometimes borderline sexually harasses people and her fans are like haha omg go queen so bold. I feel like she doesnt know the line between things that are okay to say to your friends and things that are okay to say to people you do not know but she receives no criticism for making people uncomfortable because her fans will murder you and say well she loves herself and DGAF and your favs are fake unlike bold queen Jessi.
exactly! jessi makes things sexual for no reason (even with young idols) and if she was a male idol/host, she would be cancelled straight away. people let it slide because shes "bold" and "provocative" like girl wtf just because shes american and westernized doesnt mean that her defying all korean etiquette and making people uncomfortable is okay.
I haven’t liked the self love movement since Megan Trainer came out with all about that bass. Like you can’t make a song about body positivity and call people with slim body types “Skinny Bitches” even if she was “just playing’. Theirs nothing wrong with appreciating a certain body type but putting others down in the process defeats the point.
Yess! Nicki minaj also did similar thing with the song 'anaconda'.
@@yanamarinova5172 yeah but the difference between Nicki is that megan song was an attempt for the body positivity movement. That’s the whole point of the song and what she’s trying to convey meanwhile nicki’s anaconda was not a body positivity song and that wasn’t the message she was trying to put out with the song .
OMG THIS!!
@@fatimasummaray784But she was appreciating one body type while putting others down. One thing that was mentioned in the original comment
It's okay to appreciate without putting down others
@@LovelyKissessthis is female rap. They diss other women every other week lmao.
A negative side to the self love movement is people thinking they are perfect the way they are and do not need to change or use self love as an excuse to treat people badly.
i think for an industry such as kpop where only one body type, skin shade, height, face shape, personality, etc. is considered "apart of the standard," it's definitely important for voices such as hwasa, jessi, soyeon and many more who have been called ugly, fat, or undesirable simply for existing. i think the western industry has definitely gotten to a point where it's less self love/ appreciation and more self settling and not striving to the best of your ability, but i do digress... because east asia is a bit more conservative, it's definitely more important for there to be a movement such as the one discussed!
THIS!! I feel like sometimes people forget that everything isn't black or white. There are always nuances in issues like this. We can't just say "She's right and everybody else is wrong" nor "We are right and she's wrong". There is context, the environment and so many more things to consider when discussing such a complex subject as self-love
I've heard that "I Love My Body" was a response to this controversy but I never understood why... I like the song but it had nothing to do with the premise of the issue. If she made a song talking about being sexually open or liberated that would make more sense...
Hello. I'm going to say this as part of the fandom. I personally didn't feel this song as a response, but a lot of the fandom promoted it as such.
In this interview, Hwasa explains more about her feelings towards the song:
1. As the piles of criticism and comments eventually affected her at a time she had no outlet for self-expression, Hwasa says she felt the repercussions mentally and physically
2. When they sent me the song, I first saw the title, “I Love My Body.” It was so funny that I burst into laughter-it’s so one-dimensional. “I love my body?” That’s so direct, but I think I fell in love with the title because seeing it automatically created a good vibe to listen [...] Well, first of all, I say that I love my body, but, in fact, what the message is is just that I love myself so much. I chose this song because even though the title is primarily one-dimensional, it talks about loving my whole body, my soul, and my everything. It’s really about the self-esteem inside of my body.
As far as I can remember, Hwasa never openly expressed that the song was a response to her controversy, but she did express that the song helped her to overcome the controversy.
Link: www.forbes.com/sites/jeffbenjamin/2023/11/30/hwasa-says-i-love-my-body-is-the-message-the-k-pop-diva-needed-now/?sh=9b840774fa79
Yeah i also never understood why she sang that song when it had nothing to do with the sue case. no one was criticizing her for her body but for her vulgar move. and she sings about i love my body while she has done boob jobs this year. she lies about loving her body.
She has never said it was a response to the event, actually 50/50. After the event during the mic on tour she was really down due to the negativity around the event, especially when the Parents of adult children decided to sue her for something a male idol could do in a normal choreography on national TV. Sorry off topic, anyways she was down PSY sent her the song when she was on tour and she laughed or felt positive when listening to the song as it uplifted her. You can see it in her interview with Bambam
Idk, it feels like you are projecting some twitter users who are moomoos or hwasa stans saying what they (imo wrongly) see her as vs who she actually is. Hwasa has never called herself unbothered, in fact quite the opposite, she has been DEEPLY bothered by comments and media surrounding her image, her body, and her acts. I think people see the surface level and don't intend to delve deeper, probably the more casual stans or younger stans trying to use it to one-up another fandom or whatever. They proclaim she's this idgaf queen when in every interview she says the opposite. ILMB was given to her by Psy right after the incident and the lawsuit was announced, it was the first stop of Mamamoo's US tour and she was standing in a parking lot in NYC crying by herself. Psy sent her the song to cheer her up, and it did. That's the story.
I've been a moomoo for years, I stay off twitter because its mostly younger stans who like to pick fights and I don't like how they represent the fandom. I love Mamamoo not because they don't care, but because they do and they aren't afraid of showing cracks in their masks or sharing their worries and being honest about their struggles with their fans. They aren't perfect but they try to be better people. They make mistakes but they learn from them. They work to accept themselves, but are open about the difficulties of that in the society they live in, so they make songs not only to encourage others but to encourage themselves, like Yes I Am. And they don't stand for people defining who they are or who they should be when it comes from a hateful or unfair place.
Is ILMB my favorite song? No, but I think calling it everything that is wrong with the self love movement is unfair because Hwasa herself explained clearly what the meaning behind that song was, it wasn't meant to be as personal as something like Maria, at least not lyrically. Hell, she didn't even write it. Some people have warped the intentions of that song, but she has been very clear about what the song meant to her from the start. To you it was shallow, to her it was a gift to lift her spirits at a time she really needed it.
I also think it is unfair that this is your third video on the same topic of Hwasa and you still got facts wrong in your video about the event. I had originally trusted things you stated as facts in previous videos on groups I don't know as well, but I will likely take both facts and opinion with a grain of salt from you from now on since I now know the level at which you do your research before forming an opinion. I hope you don't just use twitter to get all of your information because from your comments it really seems like you do.
Hi, I know this is an old comment but I do feel curious... Which part of the stage on campus event was wrongly explained here?
I did notice that the video didn't really dive into Hwasa's intention on releasing ILMB. But I think the video emphasized heavily on the fact that Hwasa did an inappropriate gesture in the wrong place, and how people supporting it claimed it as "self-love movement". I never heard of a behind story of THAT gesture, so maybe you can kindly give me an explanation or maybe a link (Hwasa's interview, maybe, where she explained about that particular event) to have more information on your claim?
@@TheAnimelover9899 @trudylive5829's comment explains the parts that were wrongly explained pretty well, they even go into who made the report (tldr it wasn't even a parent). As for Hwasa's intent on releasing ILMB, NME has a good article called "Hwasa says ‘I Love My Body’ is a response to her public indecency controversy" about how the song came to be. The youtube embed in the article is the full show where they got her quotes.
The article is mainly about the aftermath of the event and creation of ILMB, so if you're looking for an exact explanation of that gesture, idk if you're going to find it, but she was probably just feeding off the energy of the festival. Keep in mind, a student was literally humping the stage at this festival, her gesture wasn't exactly out of place, even if it could be considered indecent. I think whether its indecent or not is a matter of personal opinion. Hwasa herself said she understands the move was controversial, the problem lies in that people are spreading unnecessary hate as well as misinformation regarding who attended the event, who reported the gesture to the police, and the claim that the gesture was broadcasted when it wasn't.
@@brevisthecat2232 Thanks for responding to my question! I'll read the things you mentioned 😊
I'm a Mamamoo stan, but I'm also an OG and I feel that the overreacting fans don't really understand what the self-love message means. self-love means to love yourself just as you are but to also respect others choices and opinions. everytime I see those kind of comments I really do think that the person is just a blind fan, and I mean it for every fandom, I'm not talking just about Hwasa fans here. and stating that she's unbothered just makes me think that they don't follow what she says. several times she said she strugled with the bad comments, that the comments hurt her a lot, so how can said fans say she's unbothered? no matter how many international fans she has, her career is in SK, her main goal, and any other kpop group, is the general public in SK. personally, her gesture was not that bad for me cause I'm a westerner and we already fairly used to it, but for korean audiences it is way too much. another thing I wish international fans would take into account: korean culture. I blame more the blind fans for the situation we are now, but I also blame companies for fueling the selfish-love movement cause that way they make more money. as for Hwasa, ILMB was not something I would expect from her, I felt it had more P-Nation viral goals than actually her thoughts. I'm waiting to see what will come next.
Where your whole argument about Hwasa saying she is unbothered but she clearly is because she released I Love My Body falls on it's face because she was bothered and she didn't write the song. It was a gift to her from PSY who saw how the college performance controversy affected her in a negative way. It's a song not only for her but for everyone who has been criticized for the way they look.
little brother no one cares about people. they just want your impressions on the their product and popularity by farming social messaging. Its about time someone wakes you up from the dream.
To me hwasa's self love,showed best in maria, it talked about the hate and even acknowledged how it affected her,despite others being harsh to her she won't be harsh to herself, to me that screams self love.
Lately I'm not feeling her self love, I love me,image its just not doing it for me.
Edit. If you're coming here to tell me she didn't write I love my body kindly save it,I already know, it may seem like I'm dunking on it but my comment isn't directed at the song.
Same I loved MARIA and it was my most listened kpop solo song after BTBT lol, the way the song was put together made sense to me, the lyrics and all but I love my Body felt egocentric a little idk, like babe you are not the only one who loves your body, we love your body too but this has nothing to do with the comments she received. I do understand that some people hated her calling her the s & w word but I did not see many comments degrading her body, so I was confused about the whole song tbh.
hwasa wrote and composed maria herself while ilmb was actually a gift to her from psy, she said that she was having a difficult time due to the controversies and Psy sent her the song and it was the first thing that made her smile in a while, she's aware that it's not her usual style but she just wanted to do a fun positive song for once
Same. ILMB was really not it. Besides psy wrote it for her and she just took it maybe cznshe saw how self love music concept sells well. To me an artist loose their artistry when they think of selling well more Tyan music Quality
Maria felt more genuine because it was genuine, she composed the song and she participated in everything. Meanwhile ILMB wasn't even wrote by her, the song was send to her by PSY; she didn't participate in anything. She even said she released it because it was a long time since she released music and she wanted to give something fun to the fans, and that's why she released the song, because she liked it and wanted to release music for her fans.
She didn't participate in composition or writing this song
I heard a youtuber once say confidence is quiet where as ego is fake and loud and i personally think that this quote is applicable in the case of Hwasa and her fandom (im not calling her egotistical) . At first i too was in support of Hwasa but recently her activisim is mostly for show(marketing it to be more precise) . Now in no way am i juding her and calling her fake for simply loving herself but the fine line between being confident and vulgar is being blurred. If Blackpink gets hate for their vulgarity then what exception is Hwasa.
This is so unfair, so mean to say. I am shocked. Yall are making your own idea about Hwasa without getting to know her a single bit and then HATE her for YOUR MISCONCEPTION.
@@maidaalp what idea are we exactly making about her. Don't get me wrong I've mentioned this multiple times that I am not assuming anything about her but being in the public's eyes does not mean you're free from judgement and I simply just judged her recent actions. I myself have gotten so much confidence and hope from Hwasa as a fellow dark skinned Asian trying to fit in the beauty standards but just because she's my inspiration doesn't mean she is free from criticism .
@@law1piece You are literally assuming out of YOUR own idea that her activism is suddenly just for "show". Why because she talked too much about it. Hwasa sing about a lot of things, she released a LOT of song. SHe is very soft spoken and rarely express what she feels. Her music is her outlet. Of course she will talk abt important things for her such as self love among other things. Suddenly deeming these émotion FAKE and invaliding them is EXTREMELY UNFAIR. Just bc Self love is not trendy anymore for yall does it mean she is being fake and just for marketing
@@maidaalp majority of the activism in K-pop is for show because it equals money and companies will milk it so Hwasa is no exception. On one point she presents herself as this care free queen then all of a sudden releases a song that has no link with the controversy but presents it as "this incident inspired me" like what... You are milking your self love image and that controversy because these two have no link but are presented as if they have. Stop considering these idols as SAINTS because they're not. They are humans they make mistakes and so did Hwasa. I'm not calling her fake I'm just saying her activism recently feels so bland and fake.
@@law1piece These are all YOUR ASSUMPTIONS. Are you aware that humans are able of feeling several emotions ?? Of complexity of feelings ? This whole "idols are not honest and just do things for money" is NOT the smart take you think it is. It is deshumanizing and comes straight from that belief that asians are robot devoid of real emotions. Hwasa has released several songs this year abt many subject and one of it is about something that directly affected her. But yeah, its all fake and for money because YOU SAID SO
I think it's completely valid for you to feel that the gesture was gross, I did too (as a Hwasa stan), and acknowledge that it was not the right time or place especially since it was an educational institution
But the lawsuit was unnecessary, which is expected since these parents are the same type of ones who drove a teacher to suicide
As a rebuttal to your point about her song, Psy and Hwasa both stated that he gave the song to her, it was written for her by another songwriter and Hwasa was obviously unaware about the song for her comeback, so I do think your point is a bit unfair, since her persona conveyed through her music has always been the same and it wasn't a move on her part( only song of hers she doesn't have writing credits on if I'm not wrong)
Songs like Maria and I'm a B and even Twit showcased her vulnerability outside of her confident shell, and that feels like a genuine expression of love for oneself
It may come off as rude, but judging her entire persona based on the track for which she had no personal input makes a lot of your arguments seem cherry-picked, and since you did say that you listen to her music, it should have come across your mind while making the script for this video
Anyways, much love!
Edit: I forgot to mention this in the comment, but I 100% agree with you on the self love image in the kpop industry, its almost become a concept itself, which does irritate me, since a lot of the times, it's just hypocrisy.
I think mainly everyone in these comments strongly lacks media literacy and capacity to understand that a human is able to feel two emotion at the same time. I love My Body is not only a song about body positivity but owning your body and having the right to do with it whatever you want even if it doesnt please other. Why do people always think they have the right to talk about what women do with their body ?
Im also seeing a lot of comments about the fact that what she did was too "sexual" but at the same festival a man literally mimicked "sexual intercourse" on stage and got NO BACKLASH at all. So no, this is not just a question of Time and Place.
Hwasa has always preached about owning up to how the hate makes her suffer, made her have the worst thoughts, but how she refuse to let it change her. She is not perfect and its okay. No one is. AND THIS IS NOT ABOUT APPEARANCE. Its a very hard path she choose. She shows better than anyone the harshness of really loving yourself in this society. Please get to know more about her guys...
The way her stans love to talk about "loving yourself" and "being proud of your body" only to drag k-nets by saying, "You're just jealous of hwasa because she's thick and your man doesn't want to f*** a skeleton" 😑😑
Notice how all the fandoms that are "Feminist" have the most misogynist fans? 🤔🤔
It’s always these fans saying women should love themselves and be confident until their faced with someone prettier than them and actually confident.
@@Yoest.1 FACTS!!!
gurl what fandom are you talking about, have seen such comments by other fandoms quite a few times but this is the first time hearing about moomoos
@@rbwstanwhohatesrbw9493 Neverlands (I think that's what (G)I-DLE's fandom is called?), Blinks, Moomoos, Etc.
They love to talk about "Women Empowerment" while also being hateful towards GGs that don't fit their idea of what a Women should be. AND they love to be shady towards other GGs.
For Moomoos they tried to push this "Women Group" thing onto people and it was weird as heck because they only wanted to include groups with sexy concepts. As if the only way to be a "Women" is to act sexy... 😬(And they hate Cute idols with a passion.) Not to mention they always compare Female Idol's vocals/bodies to Mamamoo's.
Neverlands are the kpopified version of a "Pick-Me". They love to drag and degrade GGs for "following trends" and praise (G)I-dle for being different as if that's supposed to make them special. Like... Sorry my favs don't sing about how hot their boob and booty is? 😭 (Not to mention they always compare Female idols to Soyeon and drag them for not being as talented.)
...Do I even have to explain Blinks?
@@rbwstanwhohatesrbw9493 Also, These fandoms don't even think they're in the wrong 90% of the time. I don't care if your fav is more talented, I'm not just going to sit here and let you degrade them.
I appreciate tou reminding people that being an adult doesn't necessarily make you a sexual being, or okay with looking at people being sexual. This is especially true for younger people who have maybe not had a chance to explore that side of themselves or aren't ready yet. There are a lot of ways to he sexy and touching yourself doesn't have to be one of them, and certainly doesn't have to be one others are subjected to.
Like many of us have said, there's a time and place for certain behaviors, and the university incident was just not the place.
Ive noticed how fans especially Momoos like to preach about self love and confidence, they hype up anything Hwasa does then turn around and start bashing a female idol who meets a lot of the k beauty standards. These fans go on and on about loving yourself and being confident, for the sake of their faves because they think their faves are "not like other girls", but in the same breath they will have no problem attacking other female idols like Wonyoung, Jennie and Yuna just because they fit the Korean beauty standard.
Self love is not about doing too much or trying to hard to get people to notice you, there's no need to act vulgar or dress vulgar in order to be considered as someone who is confident in themselves and loves themselves because that was never the goal with the self-love movement
This is such a lie.
pls any blackpink praise atp gets a "but mamamoo does it better" comment, but then gg stans love to talk about blinks being annoying 🥴
what? 😅 most moomoos are always minding their own business, its others fandoms (specially bp fans) who are always sl*tshaming and bodyshaming the mamamoo member, specially hwasa; they always make fun of her appearance and make nasty viral hate tweets about her.
@@bluem0n0chrom3fr theres this mmm fan channel that makes shady titles on their shorts dragging other female groups and they get millions of views
I have no idea where you are seeing Moomoo's attacking idols, we may DEFEND if someone says Mamamoo is not talented or call them ugly, but in no way have I ever seen Moomoo's attack other idols. People, not fans, PEOPLE oftern compare Mamamoo to other idols so i can see where this comes from.
Also Hwasa dresses for herself, not for others, herself hunny. There are times where her outfits have been chosen due to marketing and to get eyes locked on her, but majority of the time she chooses the outfits + paired with her charisma people are bound to look at Hwasa
Part of the problem is that I think people don't realize there's more than one part to self love. It isn't always loud and bombastic. Think about the ways you love other people. Sometimes it's quiet. Think about the love languages. Showering doing skincare paying your bills cleaning your house doing your homework cutting out toxic people taking your medication etc could all be considered self love actions but they're not glamorous or glittery like most of the things you see celebrity do in public. This is why I think K-pop, in particular, needs to focus more on authenticity than it does embodying certain values and movements. Make songs about your insecurities and why you hate yourself, but you might also be able to love yourself in spite of it at the same time. Write songs about your fears of the future or how the past haunts you. Produce music about stuff that interests you or your romantic relationship and your relationship with the public and media.
??
All the stuff for which you said you love BTS are the same done by Hwasa in twit, maria, lmm, i am *** but all she needed to do was release " i love my body" for everyone to call her self love shallow ( like have you guys really listened to her songs?).
And lets be honest songs like ' i love my body' might be shallow but that doesn't mean it's not empowering. Like lets be honest when you are out and about with your friends in a club this kinda songs are good to throw it back sometimes and it can be empowering ( because sexy is also empowering).
I dont like the " but she is beautiful for westen standards" argument. All of mamamoo's career they have not been promoted well let alone to the west. Just because she is loved by westerners does not mean she gets same treatment from her home market. So i think this point is irrelevant.
Nobody can stay unbothered by the amount of hate this women gets lets be honest. But that doesn't mean she can't overcome it, now does it?. So i don't think its hypocritical at all.
I do think there is certain amount of misogyny attached to this situation because i have never seen or atleast remember this amount of backlash for any male idol ( like see enhypen the only reason they got hate for bite me choreo was because female dancers were included while looking at onlyonof they even got praised and called daring for their concept)
THANK YOU FOR SAYING IT and ppl are rlly undermining the amount of mistreatment she got for not fitting the beauty standard there were literal petitions to get her kicked out of the group at the beginning of her career, everyone just sees her in her girlboss moments but never take the time to understand how much she actually struggled
@@user-tb6km3ks9unah literally she was literally told straight to her face for years and years on end she was too ugly, fat, dark she would never make it etc and spent nights crying herself to sleep even still to this day she faces these comments but she still came out on top and didn’t let it stop her how is she out of all ppl not a good example of self love?
She lighten her skin and lost weight for a song all about loving yourself? Also, Why are we acting like Female idols never get praise by stans for being/acting sexy??? (Jennie, Momo, Etc.)
And misogyny 100% plays a role in this too. (Hwasa licking her hand then rubbing her crotch is nothing to sue over. You can be mad, sure, but sue??? 💀) But I think she does deserve some criticism.
true, these youtubers love making these kind of content to bait viewers and antis then top it off by saying they are a hwasa fan bs
oh so a human cant lose weight? is hwasa supposed to gain weight to follow the concept???@@Welchs-Fruit-Snacks
I love this video. Finally someone who is talking about this self-love masked selfishness.
Glad to see this topic being discussed.....
My therapist told me this once: "Your self-love starts being selfishness when you start making other ppl bad or uncorfortamble about the way you love yourself"
As much as i appreciate Hwasa messages, what she did was wrong, point blank period. And before anyone brings Lisa (bcuz i know someone will) this is why context and timing are important: Lisa was performing AT A CABARET SHOW where the audience IS ONLY ADULTS, Hwasa was performing AT A COLLEGE FESTIVAL.
Also can we talk about how every member (and Mamamoo as a whole) have had the message on their title tracks since 2019 and the only member who has deviated from that topic is Wheein? It could that RBW could be pushing the self love image and now has stuck with the members? I'm not syaing that the Mamamoo members don't believe on those messages, but that had me thinking since that incident....
Mamamoo literally have a title track in 2016 called Yes I am, which is about self-love and accepting your uniqueness, where each member talks about accepting and loving all their features in a company and industry that doesnt. So the narractive that you've just stated how "since 2019" is primarily false.
wait, when has moonbyul released anything about self-love? i guess lunatic kind of counts?? but it's still more of a love song than a song about confidence and self-love.
@@skyhideawayall I can think of is "Selfish" duet she has ;)
Wait. Isn't the university also where you find adults? XD
Plus what somebody already pointed out with them always being about it, even more so when they are in more control of their own releases.
Plus "Your self-love starts being selfishness when you start making other ppl bad or uncorfortamble about the way you love yourself" - kind of yes. But then again what with the 90% of Korea who feels uncomfortable with gay people openly saying they are gay, ladies wearing tshirts without a bra and god forbid not being at least 10 kilograms underweight or ladies who don't want to continue abusive relationships? It has to go both ways, and Korea is still far from the place where the Hwasa's of the country would be doing any walking.
@@katarzynazdrojewska4233 ah but selfish was released in 2018
I feel like selfishness disgused as self love has been a trend. Just like the wizardliz said "the selfish ones always wins" (no hate to liz, she helped me to rebuild my self esteem)
I'm glad i'm not alone with this opinion, when I first heard about that controversy, I thought it's just another funny and stupid hate against Hwasa but when I analyze it, I realized that they kinda do have a point. I wont do the same gesture as she did in the same event.
+ I think people who are defending Hwasa is because they see her as their self-insert, they take criticism against her as a personal attack on them because if other idols did the same thing at the same event like Blackpink for example, they'll get dragged through the mud. I'm surprised that people are defending Hwasa but calls Lisa a str*pper for that crazy horse performance.
Um that's knetz, not international fans. You do know Hwasa got sued for that performance right?? by parents of adult children. Adults who were drinking and doing who knows what at a UNIVERSITY festival. BE SO FO REAl
Gone through most of the comments and it seems most of this ‘issue’ stemmed from the song “I love my body” and not her past songs like “Maria” “LMM(loose my mind)” “Be calm” “I’m a B”
I think EVERYONE needs to keep in mind that I love my body wasn’t even written by Hwasa for Hwasa it was written by another writer for Hwasa. When Hwasa writes for herself she’s vulnerable she’s flawed and she accepts and sees herself for who she is and tries to be the better version of herself. If you listen to Hwasa you already know this.
Now “i love my body” the song which was given to Hwasa is a perfect example to me of how everyone looks at Hwasa from the outside a confident badass who doesn’t give two f*cos what anyone says so I’ll have to rewrite this again . Songs written by Hwasa are 100% vulnerable and show her flaws and her actual self appreciation.
NOT COMMENTING ON THE COLLEGE STUFF I DON’T KNOW ANYTHING ABOUT THE SITUATION.
For BTS, it's not just a concept because RM still mentioned it on his live recently. He still hasn't learned to love himself, but he's trying every day. What I love about BTS's love yourself concept is that they told you their stories without straight out saying I love myself like other songs. Also, it wasn't just a one time thing because it was like a trilogy with 3 albums.
"Loving myself is my whole life goal until my death. Who can define their own way method and the way of loving myself? It's our mission to define our way to love ourselves." Kim Namjun
I have always liked Hwasa, but this time I think she was in the wrong. You are right because it's inappropriate at this kind of event.
you couldnt have said it better.
Hwasa has talent..... yes but we cannot just ignore the fact that she fits the western beauty standard and that helps her to build an audience. If she did not fit the western beauty standards she would probably get torn to shreds. Also stop defending your faves over everything if they are wrong, they are wrong, ya'll need to get over the delusion that your faves are innocent. PLUS I LOVE MY BODY was trash sorry, I just couldn't bring myself to love it. MERRY CHRISTMAS
Sameee I hate the song so bad. I’m surprised she come out with this since her music is always my fav.
I love my body was a huge disappointment after bops like "twit" and "I'm a b" and "maria" . Her comeback disappointed me so bad
I don't understand how the argument "she fits the western beauty standards" is of any relevance for this topic.
All of their career they were barely promoted thanks to rbw 😑,let alone to the west. And their main market is SK.
Even if this point is not made , how does her being fit for Western standards dissolve away the hate she recieves form the home market?
Idk why everyone likes to make a point out of this?
@@jieun7574 because she rebels against beauty standards and all that while also being propped up as a "gorgeous queen" by western fans because she fits western beauty standards. so it points out the hypocrisy of the whole self love movement around her. if she was considered ugly by beauty standards all over the world, we all know that not even her immense talent or self love "idgaf" attitude would save her, so the internet self love movement is hypocritical.
@@alexandriaking8544 so what do you mean ? So self love is authentic only when the "ugliest" person does it , is that what you mean? So convenient for you to call others hypocrites when you yourself are. Just because a person is "beautiful for west and has fans because of it" you refuse to acknowledge that person still can have self doubt (specially when they have been told that they were ugly their while life).
Your kind of self love is what i will call fake not Hwasa's
I JUST REALISRD you are kim woojin fan skskskks
good taste gurl
Finally someone who is not afraid to share this idea publicly...Thank you so much! I totally agree...
its honestly wild to me that you read the comments on your unpopular opinions video and yet still didn't take the time to research the hwasa situation further and made the same false statement you did in the last video. The parents association was NOT comprised of parents of the students. It's an extremely conservative lobbyist group in SK and the rep who reported the incident not only has no connections to the school, as a parent or alumni, she also didn't even attend the event. She saw a video of it online (not in a broadcast because the broadcast censored the action before airing) and recognized Hwasa from Dancing Queens and decided to report it.
If you're going to continue to drag hwasa's name into your videos, get your facts right. To think I used to respect this channel for coming from a rather unbiased standpoint.
she didnt drag hwasas name xD, okay well if u did the so called research can u link it?
@@vvvoxen555 I said drag hwasa's name INTO her videos, which she did, the title literally has Hwasa's name in it lmao. CZcams doesn't allow links but the "parents association" is actually called the Student Parents And Human Rights Protection Solidarity. It's not a parents association and its not an organization of Sungkyunkwan University. The woman who reported is named Shin Minhyang, you are welcome to look her up.
@@trudylive5829 oh sry i just read "in ur vidoes"
she also said in her last video that the action was broadcasted on tv which it wasn't... they censored the action before airing so the only videos of it were fancams, there were a few misconstrued facts in the last vid
Please stop justifying SK being misogynistic to Hwasa's poor level of decorum. 🗑️🗑️🗑️Have several seats. Want a chair? 😢
I love how raw you are😂😂😂
I totally agree as well; sexual gestures are meant to for the bed room and not to be shoved in everyone’s face.
With the current state of the world being over sexualized, ppl have gone blind to the lack of respect this action truly is to those who do not wish to take part in that activity.
Sex is an intimate thing, and if you are committed to you spouse then you don’t wanna see someone else flaunting their private or making them a prominent feature in your face all the time; yet we wonder why ppl cheat on each other and lack commitment issues.
We also live in a world we’re self confidence has come into “I’m so fine I can take your man/woman” and that’s rude and disrespectful too; also showing the lack of self control that ppl embody as well as the lack of respect for that person and their partner; why by so selfish to take what’s not yours?💔
Not saying that all of this applies to Hwasa, but if the shoe is the same size you better hope she don’t wear it 👀
Anyways you spilled facts as usual we need to rent all the mics in the world at this point and still think won’t be enough because you keep on saying what needs to be said .
K-pop fans just don’t want to admit that the main reason why they’re letting hwasa slide is because they lowkey pity her because if any other idol did that … sorry conventionally attractive idol did what she did they will be calling her actions out for what it is tacky .
If IVE did a sexy concept they would change their tune so fast. “FEMINISM OUT THE WINDOW TIME TO HATE THE ‘PICK ME’ GROUP”
@@P1eceful_Tomorrow EXACTLY!!!! It's the hypocrisy for me.😒😒😒😒😒
Always a joy to hear what your take is on topics even if I don't completely agree.
Edit: I completely agreed with everything in this video. 😅
I think it’s so important people know their self-concept and check their self-esteem, some people are so unbothered they don’t bother to challenge those ideas for themselves and consider the world around them. Although I’m still learning more about these type of topics this video was very informative thank you 🧡
I will continue to believe that you are the wisest kpoper out there.
You can be confident and have self-love in many ways with boundaries.
Didn't PSY give Hwasa the song, and that's why she signed with him/P-nation?
Isn't the two events a little too close to each other to actually be considered connected?
Like for all we know, PSY made a song. It's reflects a lot with her time in the industry, so she accepted it and prepared for her comeback, and in the middle of it all, this happened??
I do think the setting made the moves inappropriate, but I also find it wild how they tried to sue her.
I remember Hwasa saying in an interview (with Bambam I think) that Psy gave her the song right after the incident and she felt like the song fit that situation. That's why I (and a lot of others) thought that the song was a response to the controversy.
I personally didn't feel this song as a response, but a lot of the fandom promoted it as such.
In this interview, Hwasa explains more about her feelings towards the song:
1. As the piles of criticism and comments eventually affected her at a time she had no outlet for self-expression, Hwasa says she felt the repercussions mentally and physically
2. When they sent me the song, I first saw the title, “I Love My Body.” It was so funny that I burst into laughter-it’s so one-dimensional. “I love my body?” That’s so direct, but I think I fell in love with the title because seeing it automatically created a good vibe to listen [...] Well, first of all, I say that I love my body, but, in fact, what the message is is just that I love myself so much. I chose this song because even though the title is primarily one-dimensional, it talks about loving my whole body, my soul, and my everything. It’s really about the self-esteem inside of my body.
As far as I can remember, Hwasa never openly expressed that the song was a response to her controversy, but she did express that the song helped her to overcome the controversy.
Link: www.forbes.com/sites/jeffbenjamin/2023/11/30/hwasa-says-i-love-my-body-is-the-message-the-k-pop-diva-needed-now/?sh=9b840774fa79
I like self love as a private practice in terms of mental health but it always feels very hollow and disingenuous when a pop star uses it as an aesthetic for their art.
See, the thing is, if you want to invite someone to YOUR event, YOU have to make sure you do your research on who you invite.
You can't expect to invite someone as controvertial as Madonna and then be appaled at what she does, which is why i believe the whole issue with Hwasa is stupid, especially considering that it was the parents and not the students that SUED her (over something so insignificant) and nobody spoke on how stupid of an overreaction it was.
As for the whole "unbothered" thing, i'm pretty sure i heard Hwasa talked about what happened and how she felt about it (which wasn't positive), so i don't know who came up with the "unbothered" label, but in any case, i personally believe there's levels to it, and in the aftermath i can see she decided to go with the "it bothered me but i didn't let it dictate who i am" route, which in her industry is basically telling all the haters that she does in fact not care when you compare her attitude to the one of whatever other idols being cancelled who crumble under the delusional criticism and negativity.
Unbothered for all intent and purpose may be the wrong word, but it's the one that comes to mind the easiest for us regular people who are no expert with the vocabulary, in this day and age anyone who is can easily come up and let us know what the best word is to apply here.
say what you want about the "self love movement" but for my part, i'm sick of people misrepresenting hwasa/ILMB. she's told the story already herself. regardless of your feelings on hwasa's performance, the controversy resulted in such hate that on the first stop of mmm's US tour she cried by herself in a hotel parking lot, with random new yorkers pausing to ask if she needed help. knowing how difficult this was for her, psy sent her the song as a gift to cheer her up, with no obligation between them. at that time, she didn't have any intention to sign with pnation, so it was just a kind gesture to make her happy. and it did make her happy--it was so bold and straightforward that it made her laugh, and she decided to release the song because it had had such a personal impact when she needed it most. it's a song that makes her happy, and a gift from somebody who cared enough to give it. so for that reason, i'll always like and defend it.
I still can't get over how when you talked about the thing with Hwasa originally and I explained my feelings on it, I had people calling me a prude and acting like I didn't need to be respected because I had different values and levels of comfort to them. When I explained that to them, their brains practically broke and they were desperate to invalidate my opinion, saying I must be religious. As if being religious is a reason to not respect someone 🙃 I'm not religious, but I'm still capable of respecting and understanding people that are.
You're absolutely right about saying self-love has made people selfish, cause they seriously couldn't comprehend living in a world where they should respect my opinion and me as a human being.
And don't even get me started on how they wanted to argue that consent only applies to physical sexual acts...
On sexy vs sexual, something my mum taught me when I was younger is that there's a fine line between sexy and slutty. She wasn't using slutty as an insult, wasn't saying its necessarily a bad thing to be. But whether you present yourself as sexy or slutty will effect the kind of attention you get and what people think of you. The reason she wanted me to understand this was mainly just that the kinds of guys that are interested in girls that present themselves as slutty are generally not good guys that you want to have anything to do with, so if you want to be slutty, stay away from those kinds of guys. But i think her point is relevant here, too. Hwasa has a sexy image. The gesture she did was not sexy, it was slutty. That's fine, but not appropriate for the venue, and not in line with her typical image.
Another problem is that people take self love to mean they don't know how to dress or behave for an occasion. I'm all for dressing or acting slutty but time and place please. You can challenge the norms without being disrespectful. 😊
✨️ CONTEXT MATTERS ✨️
Something I’d like to know about the university festival is whether or not she was giving a performance that not all students were required to attend or if it was a required event for all students to go to, because those to me are two very different ideas. Gestures such as this are pretty on-brand for Hwasa and it wouldn’t be too difficult for students to make themselves aware of that possibility before seeing her perform, in which case I might say what she did was okay. However if it were a required event, that is a different situation. I’m not sure if I think one gesture warrants something as drastic as a lawsuit (then again I am American and Korean culture probably has a different idea of what warrants a lawsuit) but I understand people being upset more if the event was required for all students.
(And great video as always btw)
University festivals in Korea are not mandatory and they’re usually open to the public. They’re basically like regular music festivals but the universities host them and sponsor them, plus there’s usually little booths and bars and things run by student groups. Source: I’ve been to one
personally I disagree, I don’t think it’s that big of a deal and i feel people are blowing things wayyyy out of proportion. so she made a gesture that annoyed others, move on
That's what I'm saying
Fr. I think this is being dragged on for far too long. Just don't invite her again and let this be the end of it. I hope Hwasa will learn something from this. It's important to love yourself but it is also important to understand social etiquette and be mindful of others.
Naf fr this whole situation has just been dragged and dragged and dragged like im sooo tired of hearing about it like it just feels like another unnecessary hate train like she ain’t kill nobody damn like weather u thought what she did was okay or not it’s truly not that deep never was
Especially since she said she was feeling down after her issue (the ahjumas reporting her to the police blah blah) and when PSY sent her the song she laughed because of the lyrics and thought it was fun so she picked it to do….Like it was a song that cheered her up so she recorded it full stop. That’s what she said. I saw the video (with subtitles so unless the translation was wrong). I don’t know why people attach their own interpretations and feelings to certain songs and fight with people on the internet. Yes she is all about promoting body confidence and loving yourself but don’t label everything she does as such.
but before moving on it's important to learn from it. It's important to discuss before moving on.
I agree that it has been dragged for long but I disagree that it's "no big deal". Being expose to crudeness can be a big deal for sensitive people. Good for you if it's no big deal for you, but be mindful of other people.
Personally my main issue with that topic is that people are harsher with Hwasa being inappropriate at the wrong place but not so harsh with male idols who also need to be called out when the place is inappropriate for such content.
It's weird how Cheryl releases content defending some idols getting too much hate, and then proceed to release videos encouraging people to hate even more on another idol (generally for tiny mistakes like with Hwasa and Bangchan, or just because with Tsuki).
I kind of have a love-dislike relationship with this channel lol
You’re so right I have felt the same way for a while now which is why I stopped watching her as much she always picks and chooses she doesn’t even try to hide her unfair bias towards some idols she will defend some idols to the end no matter what they did but with others it doesn’t matter how little they messed up shes make whole videos on them contributing to a unnecessary hate train to them ex the chan situation
💀💀 How is she "encouraging" the hate? She's just giving her opinion on the whole situation. It's the same as Hwasa's fandom.
And HOW on EARTH is what Bangchan did a, "tiny mistake"???
@@Welchs-Fruit-Snacksbecause this is her third video complaining about Hwasa. It’s not just a one time thing
The whole Self love does not even exist at this point
It's just a thing made up thing by people with low self esteem to feel good about themselves. Everyone says that they love themselves but they can't stop complaining about everything. If they truly loved themselves then why would they ever look for validation from others?Just like how how Hwasa who is considered an unbothered queen almost all her songs are about "idc who you are I love myself" (lmao spare the cringe lyrics)
Self love is a product of the delusional. The self love movement is all about boosting the self confidence of the weak. If you need to convince yourself that you are perfect just the way you are then you are probably far from perfect.
In the end self love is b*llsh*t asf especially the concept the kpop industry tries to promote
Scam
😂 Completely agree. If you have a healthy self-esteem your default setting is that you love yourself. There is no need to talk or sing about it.
@@user-xf2vf9wn5j thank you. Exactly. The type of people that go around telling everyone how much they love themselves are insecure. Why else would they feel the need to seek approval from others? If they truly loved themselves they wouldn't need validation from anyone lol
Damn you literally went for all points
I feel like idols in general act as manufactured entities. The kpop industry lacks any real intelligence and personality to it but somehow it is expected to have these things? People are only interested in favourable "controversial" opinions. Ones that are not explicitly in disregard of something are only allowed. Hwasa is the perfect example for this. She does not fit kpop body standards but her body by no means is ugly. It still fits western beauty standards. Her face isn't korean-esque pretty but she is still very attractive. I would like to see an ordinary woman with an ordinary body preach self-love. That takes a lot of courage and true self-love to do. It is very easy to put down one standard when you still reside in the safety of another. This safety net somehow allows people to stupidly and blindly defend the artists they like simply because they do not conform to one standard. The very concept of self-love is ironically very non-exclusive. If you're this you can't be this and if you're like that you can't be like this. Kpop stans need to learn critical thinking and get a life.
K-pop as a whole is only for entertainment and let our expectations be low because escaping the speed of light(escaping controlled industry) won't be happening. It's all about fame, good promotion, and money.
😅they compare to Meghan thee Stallion but on Butter she was appropriate despite having a sexual image
The argument about the school being a problem I don’t agree with because there is literally a video a student humping the floor and twerking and everyone is laughing and that was at the same event.
While I definitely think it’s an important conversation that being adult doesn’t mean you want to be constantly exposed to sexual things, I can’t help but think parents being upset by a sexual gesture at a University event is pretty pearl clutching. I think part of it is that women in Asian countries are often very sexually repressed due to misogyny. And her being openly sexual as an Asian woman is a statement in itself. I agree it was gross though.
I really appreciate how you say everything I’m thinking but just in a more concise and eloquent fashion.
I have a lot of respect for you, and what you do on this channel. It’s really nice to hear a kpop stan’s opinion from someone who’s in my age range and not a literal 13 year old. Thanks again ❤️
I don’t know what she is about to say, but if it is what I think it going to be then I agree, a lot of people think over-sexualization is self-love or/and empowering but is actually the opposite, so I completely would agree if that’s what she going to talk about.
And one more thing NO YOU DON’T LOVE YOURSELF IF YOU WEAR CLOSE TO NOTHING, SHAKE YOUR ASS AND THEN SELL TO WHOMEVER WILL BUY IT, no matter the reason you are failing into the same trap this time one put by yourself and free will intentionally to get attention, literally you are becoming everything that you supposedly say are against.
Omg you have said it all 🙌🏻
So true! And everywhere doesn't appreciate this act what Hwasa did. There is a place and time for everything. Just because it could have suited the western standard, it does not mean it is right or the whole world should adopt such.
Everthing you said is so true.
Tbh kpop is shallow as a whole? Like I don't really expect any of those idols to be saying a message that they truly are representing? It's like an industry with too much flaws and too much control to ever expect something that big znd genuine from it.
And I don't think it's bad. They are capitalizing over self-love concept? Yeah. We live in a capitalist world with shady businesses. Hwasa is just one part of the industry like a lot of idols and i don't particularly expect from her to define to me what's selflove.
We just need to be aware that a whole part is fake and a persona like how lesserafim Yunjin say she wants to change the industry, or itzy using selflove concept as well, or any other song talking about it. It has no point expecting from an idol something that genuine, even if a part of it is true. Selflove is something personal anyway 🤷
The issue is where hwasa did it which is quite disrespectful and shows how people lack consideration. I hate when kpop stans use the agreement that she is 'grown women' just shows how dumb they sound nobody is taking away her adulthood, however when you're adult you make choices and so therefore you are going to have consequences for your actions.
Y'all talk more about Hwasa than she talks about herself. I promise you it ain't that serious fr let her sing whatever she wants
the concept just made bts solidify themselves from all other kpop groups and the industry musically. what made the love yourself series intrinsically beautiful is that they focus on personal growth that resonate not only the young individuals and fans like myself but also the members themselves. namjoon's songwriting is indeed deep and poetic that he was able to use clever korean wordplay, book references, and personifications to dive on what it truly means on loving oneself (singularity and trivia: love are his best ones). i specifically mentioned him because he shared on his vlives to weverse lives to armys on his personal struggles and insecurities about himself that reflect on his works. other members also took parts in their solos lyrically that relate to them. their music throughout the years was a narrative about teenage boyhood (no more dream and dark and wild) navigating toward adulthood (wings and love yourself: series) so it was what made their love yourself concept genuine. i agree with everything on this video. i have yet to see that from other kpop groups, but it's all the redundant "i love myself" "don't care what other people say" catchphrase and shallow messages. it's not the idols' fault though but their fanbases that made the idols themselves the pinnacle of self-love revolution (mamamoo and g-idle stans lmaoo). "self-love" become their entire image that's hard to achieve in actuality from the patriarchal knetizens and toxic industry. nevertheless, i like some g-idle barbie feminism music and itzy's confident aura and it's okay to love unserious music. I also think that hwasa's older music is much better than her recent songs.
" i have yet to see that from other kpop groups"
There's like 20ish years of content, we'll wait. You can do it. Also maybe you'll be able to start differentiating Soyeon's pioneering work from some perfect bodied girlies singing what the CEO thinks sells best now for girl groups ;)
This is a very deep video. I’m blown away by your takes (in a good way). I agree so much! Thank you for sharing your thoughts on this touchy topic ❤
8:43 wait the comment on Hwasa fitting into the western beauty standards? FOR WHO? In a respectful way. Only K-pop fans. Only you me and other K-pop fans. I think we need to talk about WESTERN KPOP FANS BEAUTY STANDARDS, and actual WESTERN BEAUTY STANDARDS are so different.
Kpop fans western beauty standards is basically I-fans loving anyone that doesn’t fit the K-fans beauty ideal no more no less.
But the actual western beauty standards is and has been white/light skinned/ambiguous women and Hwasa is not an ambiguous woman at all.
First time at your channel and I have to say this sounds like you are fighting with immature kids with immature defensive opinions. Very petty. No on cares. Self love has nothing to do about your outside appearance. It means the physical you on the ourmtside does not define who you are on the inside. You love who you are, period. The reality of consciously changing yourself to a severe extent is hating yourself especially if you are doing so to fit a mold. Nothing wrong about doing losing weight for your "health", but the industry makes you do many physical alterations that make you lose the person you recognized in the mirror. Being rail thin, but your body fights you at every step. This choice is hate of self to go to an extreme to a point of starvation, not having normal menstrual cycles as most female idols suffer from on the diets they are put on by their companies. To do something intentionally sexual is a regular thing every year used to get free press. She won the moment. You talking about her was the whole point. Her mentions are up. She is getting access to all the music shows. It's men behind that, and they want what she is dishing, so this college stunt is always a stepping stone. The reality is all about business.
In the words of Conscious Lee ''Research over me search''. Your feelings about the gesture she made is valid, you are allowed to feel that the gesture Hwasa did was crude. The hate you got for stating your personal opinion is not okay but to dismiss the situation that arose due to the college controversy (months after the initial college event) and her releasing the song shows that you did not do any fact checking and then warping it into the mainstream concept of self love that you hate to justify why you feel the way you feel is hypocritical. After watching your video, it looks like you only went off what was trending on social media and ran with it. This is clearly seen in the video when you brush past people’s rebuttal regarding male performers at the same event. You said it yourself “I don't know how true that is, I didn't watch anyone else from that event”, this shows that you didn't go out of your way to check if it was true and just ran with your feelings. I don't appreciate how you call online kpop fans stupid and demean them based on how they react when you yourself act on the same feelings and are not impartial to what actually happened.You didn't go off of facts just feelings, the only time you were factual is when it benefited your argument. This whole controversy comes down to misogyny and idol/artist preferences in South Korea not the Western market. Because Hwasa doesn't fit the stereotypical South Korean standards (Mamamoo’s market is South Korea. Hwasa isn't trying to appeal to the Western market, the Western market supports her because she fits the Western market standards) she gets judged a lot by Koreans. Calling her selfish for saying that she is bothered then unbothered from the few posts you saw circulating on social media aint it. Hwasa’s body was picked apart due to the lawsuit, that is why she released the song. The song is about how she loves her body even when it's scrutinized and picked apart by Knetizens.She is telling us no matter how much body shaming and hate she gets, she loves her body the way it is. I also don't appreciate how you included BTS in a video criticizing Hwasa on the concept of self love. You praise BTS for having a realistic approach when it comes to self love in their discography yet you only utilize one song from Hwasa’s discography to criticize her views of self love. Make it make sense!
You ATE this, period.
Also about Knetz, I'm pretty sure at the time majority of them were defending Hwasa it was only the media blowing it out of proportion and then the parents of adult children suing Hwasa. Now international kpoppers are starting to find problems in a situation that has already been resolved.
You had me then you lost me. You people are all the same.
@@AA-ed6ek Go off queen, how did I loose you?
You're so real throughout this video omg
You avoided the word narcissism so well
😭😭
Eh. I wouldn’t say she’s narcissistic.
@@fatimasummaray784 I mean the whole love yourself movement and the kpop fans idk hwasa doesn't give much about herself
@@meagain7669 the difference is with narcissists,they lack the ability to care about others in the process of loving themselves or seeing themselves in a high position and most of the time it’s unreasonable. I don’t think that’s the case with hwasa.
This reminds me of my comment on your video on your shorts channel, I will copy and paste my comment here for the people who have no working braincells: I wish people will understand sexy and sexual AREN'T the same thing, Hwasa has a sexy image but she did not have to gesture licking her you-know-what. Sexy means sexually attractive and desirable, sexual means "the process of physical intimacy between consenting adults." KEEP READING!! "Physical manifestations of sexual desire in humans include licking, sucking etc. I hope the weird people get the idea.
(There's no hate to Hwasa❤, I still like her.)
Respectfully disagree with mint choc ice cream 😂
i love how this and the last video have been holiday themed :) happy holidays cheryl!!
Is it me or do you always have migraines? Hoping you feel better soon! I’m writing this off as proof of you using your brain more than most people.
Couldn’t be happier that this video finally is up! As always, it was absolutely worth the wait! Maybe you have a career in optometry cuz you’re always opening my eyes (to new opinions/perspectives)
I wished self love for women meant looking people in the eyes, speaking clearly, not using self-blaming language like "I'm sorry for asking, but...", and being efficient at whatever one does be it working, sports, studying, volunteering etc. But instead of that the "self love" that gets promoted to us is always either about our bodies or sexual acts...
This. I've never been able to form it in words so well but yes. It's almost like no better than internalized misogyny to be reduced to sexual liberation as self confidence. No no no!
Self blaming for saying sorry for asking? Men do this as well. It's not self blaming, but a, I hope I didn't offend you or get to personal thing
Worst outfit men do is wearing shorts, to me boys clothes is more comfortable
I think you were a little bit harsh. Not everyone has the same opinion on what constitutes decent behavior.
Even though South Korea is a conservative country, the youth seem to be somewhat fed up (in my opinion).
It seems that this type of behavior (not from everyone) triggers a positive reaction from them.They won't do it, but they enjoy seeing it.
It's probably a trend that may fade away, but who knows?
Hwasa's tendency to challenge conservative views made it inevitable that she would go that far.
I won't be surprised if she persists in doing "worse" until she reaches a point that everyone is uncomfortable with.But until then, she will view herself as a victim of her critics and won't question her actions.
However, I enjoyed your analysis even though I don't agree with everything.😊
This!! I hate the fact that those self love movements always hating on people who don’t agree with them such as lizzo type of supporters smh
I’m really happy you talked about this because as a low vision Kpop stan I knew about this but I couldn’t see what she did so now knowing what happen and you explaining it in your point of view was very helpful to understand. I kept quiet among my friends who mention what happen cause once again I couldn’t see literally the problem but now that I know I can form an opinion among my friends. I love hwasa so much regardless but I can understand the problem now. So once again thank you for your videos cause it does help people like me who are fans with low vision to understand what’s happening at times.
I aspire to articulate my thoughts like you💗
omgg cant waitt
I think two truths can be true at once that to some she may have lacked decorum but also I mean it’s sk a very partriatchal society, to say that there isn’t at least a small part that has to do with misogyny is just wrong. To you, you are being fair in saying the other male celebs also grossed you out, but that fact that you aren’t even sure that happened bc it hasn’t made noise but hwasa’s has…like come on obviously you know why. A women existing and her actions in a sexist society is always inherently politically bc the structure in which you exist in, it’s the same for a black person in America, or a gay person in an anti-LGBT community. It doesn’t absolve them of wrong doing but you know any wrong doing they do do is going to be even more over dramatized that’s just fact.
That being said I can see why people were uncomfortable tho I honestly didn’t find a problem with it, it honestly didn’t bother me. And yes there’s a difference between “sexual artists” and artists who are sexy, and yes hwasa isn’t like ice spice or Megan or cardi b her music itself isn’t inherently sexual but especially within the context of Korean society, she isn’t exactly a prude either. Nor is she 100% squeaky clean in the way she visually presents herself. So I do think her doing what she did was an always a possibility that they should’ve considered. She’s been controversial and still is. The sky is blue. They should pick artists with cleaner images if they do care about decorum which again nothing wrong in caring but manage your expectations
Thing is, This is not the first time Hwasa had to perform for students so she should have known what she was getting into.
I feel like sometimes people forget that everything isn't black or white. There are always nuances in issues like this. We can't just say "She's right and everybody else is wrong" nor "We are right and she's wrong". There is context, the environment and so many more things to consider when discussing such a complex subject as self-love
@@Welchs-Fruit-Snacks valid point
I love the editing bro its amazing
People are still talking about this "scandal"? Kpop really must have become super boring lately if this is the most interesting topic, I almost forgot about that already😂
nah everyone forgot about this, it's just cheryl still yapping about this and fighting ghosts instead of moving on 😭
Legit 💯
Love the Christmas intro❄️🎄
If you are educated, the point of critisizing those who sued Hwasa was not to tell them they are rude or old fashioned its about misogyny and just pure hate against her. This is because its a known fact that Hwasa is not the only artist that would perform in front of minors and do these "suggestive moves". But they called her out and sued her while turning a blind eye on other artists that do. It is clear that those who went after her had some malicious intent when they sued her.
As for the song I love my body, shallow minded people really just stop and dismiss the message the writer of the song and possibly even hwasa was trying to convey. They just settle with the idea of it being a "self-love anthem". Obviously you need to do more literary analysis because the song is clearly not a "short hair I don't care mentality".
I really hate "unpopular opinion" centered youtube channels because they really don't know how to do proper analysis. They say its unpopular opinion but creates a narrative trying to urge people to see the same thing. Like seriously, if you want to critisize someone do it properly. Go deeper and not just on your opinions.
It's a shame that you would waste so much energy to share your thoughts and not really intented to make a proper impact with your content. Please grow up and look for a better way to spend your time. Or better yet if you really want to make a better point cover more than just your own thought process...
Well...what can we expect from these types of channels? It's just petty clickbaitting sugar coated with the misuse of their right or freedom of speech. From one internet persona to another don't pretend that these contents are not just for clout/ attention grab/ or just unconscious hate train. Again please effen grow up!
Since you brought up BTS anyway, "Mic Drop" immediately came to mind as one of those incredible songs written to respond to haters.
god i missed your videos!!🎉🎉
About RV, in my social media world, I didn't see throwing hate at them. Their whole career now is on the individual side and they deserve the praise they get in terms of group activities because the company does not promote them now(at least they did justice with the music)
Agreed reveluvs are pretty silent I almost never see them throw hate
I Love Hwasa but I agree with you completely, this was a very good and informative video
13:51 I'm an adult on my country and even though I don't any problem with people doing that in their privacy, as an sex-repulsed ace person I not only don't engage in those activities at all, I would also be uncomfortable presencing that publicly, so you're absolutely right. Remember people, time, place and context DO matter in these situations
I haven't watched the video yet but i'd like to state my opinion first which is i really really really hate self-love concepts it's okay if it's a song every once in a while but making it your whole personality is NOT, in my opinion it's a very strong sign of insecurity. I've always thought of Hwasa as "Baddie" and "Slay unbothered queen" till Maria but then she kept repeating herself to the point of disrespecting her audience in a collage festival. Also she seems to be the kind of women who believe self-sexualization =empowerment .....
I don't know what's going on with Hwasa exactly but to me her actions don't speak neither self love nor confidence
I agree. Becuz of thise self love songs with a more aggressive approach and a subjective thinking. I developed a corrupt idea about self love. Now I am open to accepting my short comings and work on myself🥰
There are something funny about people who got preaching "self-love" or "unbothered" motto at the same time release a song about "loving yourself" or posting a vent about how people bringing them down because of this? I meant yeah, it's obvious you are bothered and indeed insecure by it right? Why i must tell everyone in the world that their mean comments affected me that much when i can just roll with it and call it a day? Though, no hate to Hwasa because "I Love My Body" was a pretty fun song. But, yeah. This is just a piece of my mind.
Hwasa was sued because of that gesture when male idols performing in that same event are topless whatsoever. But yes, let's use that argument. Hwasa won the case because even the police found it stupid. Like this video. You will never understand hwasa's concept of self-love when you're too biased to look where she came from. She talks about this all the time through her songs which inspires people who shares the same burden. But hey, you're talking about her, she's got other fandoms screaming her name, deals everywhere, she's got her people around her, she's winning this moment. And don't you think comparing a boy group to her is a bit biased? They may have their own struggle in this industry but they are not the same as males in this industry got their leashes a bit loose compared to female idols. Maybe use a different lense when you want to talk about this stuff. An unbiased one, may I suggest. Lastly, let's be real, you never like mamamoo in general and that says a lot about you and this video.
she won because she was lucky that they were young policy men and not older police men because older police men would have sued her a long time ago. she was really lucky because otherwise her career would be over. What she has done was really unnessary and vulgar. Im sorry but hwasa her self love movements is just for her to get attention. She has done multiple surgeries and this year boob jobs and she keeps talking about self love. Thats not how loving yourself means. loving yourself means staying the way you look and not changing anything about yourself. but she does change things about her so it is known that she does not like her own.
@@YouCant.FoolMe not saying that I agree, but a lot of people believe that plastic surgery is right if it allows you to love yourself more, that if a part of you is making you feel insecure, then you should change it. I say that because of the "that's not what loving yourself means" line, there are different views about it, I don't think you get to claim your own as the only truth. And I wonder where you got the information about the age of the policemen who worked on her case, was it published anywhere?
hey cheryl i love your videos so much and especially your voice to the point i can fall asleep peacefully to it (not mean btw) cuz i do it with old videos i have already viewed! i love your content so much and thanks for trying to ring some sense into some kpop fans :)
another banger
I havent watched the video yet but i got to say that i had a very different understanding of self love which was not right. I beleved to love myself how i am and i needed to do it cause i loved self confidence bit i started getting very rigid. When my mom told me that i had to change myslef i felt bad i thought "i was good the way i was " And i felt bad about what my mom said but shes right i wasnt.
Self love is about loving things u cannot change but true self love comes when u love ur self so much that u would work to better yourself. Its hard for me idk it sounds easy to say but idk how to start 😢😮
Isn't it pretty obvious who's using self-love as an aesthetic and who actually has something to say? If one is a functioning adult, they are expected to think for themselves and decide what they will accept and what they will reject. As someone who isn't from the west and sees half the things they fuss over as nothing more than propaganda, I wholeheartedly agree with what you said.
But I guess I missed the big calling out part. She is hypocritical, yes (who isn't to some degree). She isn't revolutionary (what else is new). Let me be clear on one thing though. I do not condone what she did. The thing I don't understand is that are people really realizing this just now? It's literally common knowledge that kpop idols are assigned personas that they act out on screen. Most of what you see is fake and should not be taken seriously. So I am not surprised at the fact that she isn't as unbothered as she tries to be. Most people aren't. People say they don't care but then go and care the most. That's hypocritical but it's not a crime. I see people crying over treating kpop idols like humans but when they slip everyone turns on them. Criticism for her actions at the university is 100% valid but criticism for her not being as unbothered as she claims to be isn't in my opinion. Isn't that what humans do? Be hypocritical? She isn't necessarily hurting anybody. Deluded fans will continue to be deluded no matter what so let's leave that out. You did say that idols have impressionable audiences and to that I say, well someone who lies about not caring is the last thing they should be worried about getting influenced by.
Preach
This brought up points about this situation that I hadn’t thought of before. I don’t personally agree with her action but I didn’t believe she should’ve been called out for it due to it being a college environment. But now I see the issue. Regarding the recent cb, yeah it’s hollow compared to I’m b and Maria.
I am a kpop fan that does not necessarily like sexy concepts. I get annoyed from those who always sexualize everything about an idol or when a group is only cared for when they act sexy, are less clothed, and produce sexy songs. Most kpop fans prefer that which I understand but it had come to a point where people consider it better than anything else a group had done and will not consume anything that is not sexy. I don't like overly cute things because that's where infantilation comes from and that is arguably more cringe. I'm in the middle between sexy and cute when it comes to kpop, it might be boring but I'd rather see kpop groups just be themselves or be "cool" rather than sexy or cute. My ults, nct gets praised for making "hoe/sexy anthems" when their soft/chill/meaningful music is just as good but many nctzens don't even care for those. I'd like to see an nct show but I'm afraid on how the western audience will react when "Love on the Floor" comes out, I'm just not into that and people call me crazy when I don't like that stuff. I wish people would be more considerate for when people do not prefer that. There has been too much "sexy content" where it is the desirable thing people wanna consume and anything else is considered irrelevant. I also do not partake in the that certain lifestyle so I'd prefer to not have everything be surrounded around sex/being sexy. So that's where I agree with this, however, I will disagree with where the intent/location, I don't think its that serious. It's a college campus with adults and it's hwasa. It should be her duty to alter her actions for an event but it wasn't a room with children, funeral, or a royal tea party or something so I don't see the big deal? Like in the sense where there werent major restricts where she shouldnt do that like the examples I mentioned so it's "okay", but would it still be appropriate, preferably not but she won't be jailed. Everything that I disagreed with had a response to where I agreed with so I'm not mad or anything. I do believe it was an overreaction but with a purpose that I can understand and in the end agreed with you know? But that is just me and I'm someone who can take someone with a different opinion.
The video was uploaded on my birthday 😭😭😭😭
Agree. If something doesn't bother you it is forgotten about within seconds. A man once commented on my outfit on a hot day. My response ... "Do I look like a child to you?" "Get the f*** out of my face" and "Your dealer's good". I actually thought it was funny. I'm not particularly the most confident person on earth, but even I am perplexed by why a stranger's view on my body should be my business.
We’re so glad too have you back, queen ❤❤❤❤
Also around 7:30 the cry about idols who profit and lie... Uh, that's like people going after Taylor Swift for things on her first album - misplaced.
And I still would argue later on that idols signing and being faces of the movement are mostly good and genuine, but they conform to things behind the scenes as they need to survive. The message needs to be louder, more widespread, and shake the system that is the whole Korean business. We owe it to the likes of Jonghyun and Sulli... Not sure what the 2ne1 comment was doing there, 2ne1, while also adding to the evolution of K-pop and one of my faves at the time, was heavily role-playing (Bommie always in dresses? She was so boring XD) and first primarily relying on "crazy' and graphic motifs - literal alien costumes, hair palms and punk jackets, while Hwasa's biggest strenght is those moments when she's just in a tee and jeans. And as for the last part talking about Hwasa at the event - if the parents (of university students, lolololol) were unhappy they should take it up with those who signed Hwasa for this. There's some general adjustment I'd expect when you are in different places, but I wouldn't invite Hwasa to perform at a church, or I would make sure the content was agreed upon. Still, it's mostly because I was raised to have too much decorum for my own good - I loved seeing how open e.g. a mediterranean or a US protestant church can be and if I had the money, time and patience then I would probably hire Hwasa to do a gig on every mass in this country xD Terrorizing the youth into "being proper" is exactly what removes any concern for their feelings about it from the itinerary. Booyah. And the fact that you're just too used to the oversexualized black rappers that stick to one schtick to realize that Hwasa's image is actually very sexual, open and unashamed by Korean standards. Oh well. "It only exposes the level of stupidity you posess". Also "unbothered queen" isn't really given to people who don't feel nothing, or don't respond in any way - it's a female idol that may have moments of such emotion, but refuse to dwell on it and cry about it a lot, like Hwasa, Lee Hyori or Jessi. They can give you the finger, they can cry one time in a bathroom, they can use it as an inspo for another opposite action - but they refuse to change their ways if they weren't really that bad, or to get on their knees and apologize to those who were theoretically hurt - I say theoretically, cause I find the thought of Korean boomers and GenXers panicking because their abusive control and imposition of standards onto the youth was shaken a bit in that moment. And to that I say yass!
And the finishing touch of praising BTS and slamming Hwasa again is just a cherry on top :D
It's not that I don't agree with some parts of the video - the overemphasis on looks and shallowness of kpop is a thing, as always was the craziness of some kpop stans and netizens in general...but that's 99% not any of these female idols' fault and most of what was argued was really narrowly considered or informed. Just made me stand on Hwasa's side and type some stuff first time since that incident happened, and definitely not supporting your message. Oops ^^;
I legit love a lot of your videos, but this is one of the worst takes I've ever seen from you.
Hwasa was invited to perform at a University consisting of adults old enough to drink. Hwasa has never painted an image of being PG 13, if they where uncomfortable with a performance expected of her, then they shouldn't have invited her. Nobody was forced to be there, if they didn't want to watch they could just go somewhere else or not pay attention.
Are we really going to pretend the only reason she got dragged wasn't because of misogyny?
Also, as long as the love yourself message isn't being done by dragging others or trying to state they make no mistakes, what's wrong with it?
Hwasa is talking about her body and how she struggles with the criticism but still fights to love it the way it is. Also, why are you trying to undermine the struggle she goes through in the Industry?
Sure she fits western standards, nobody ever denies that, but its interesting how kpop is trying it's best to win the western market over, yet still refuses to ever let girls who look like hwasa debut, even if they are much more talented.
For hwasa to succeed in an industry where looks have a very strict standard and importance while being the exact opposite of whats demanded, it really isn't a stretch to say it was against all odds.
Now about moo moo's being a bunch of pick mes, I kind of can't disagree lol. But it is true that mamamoo do a lot of things other groups dont dare to do and it's refreshing and empowering. But there's always those bad apples that completely miss mamamoos message and drag other groups.