Train Simulator - AP Class 700/707/717 Enhancement Pack Review (ft. ScoutZz)
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- čas přidán 4. 07. 2024
- At last, the long-awaited review on this abomination of a product is finally here. Sorry it was so late, but this time the video had help from an extra hand.
Thanks to ScoutZz for contributing his part in this review, and cheers to Zico Azeez for allowing me to share his new Desiro City models.
ScoutZz: / scoutzz
Zico: / @zicoazeez3060
___________________________________________________________________________
0:00 Class 700 Backstory/Intro
1:50 Model Review
3:52 Liveries Review (with ScoutZz)
9:05 Cab Review
11:45 Other Features (with ScoutZz)
12:44 Sounds Review
18:38 Conclusion
19:50 ScoutZz Conclusion
21:00 Outro
___________________________________________________________________________
Music used in order:
- Local Forecast (Kevin Macleod)
- The Elevator Bossanova (Bensound)
- Tidal Wave (Audio Library)
- One Sly Move (Kevin Macleod)
- The Builder (Kevin Macleod)
- Nintendo Wii Shop Theme
- Who Wants To be a Millionaire Theme
- Plucky Daisy (Kevin Macleod)
- Jazz Organ Trio Cool Blue (Audio Library)
- Result Theme (Sonic Unleashed)
- Kahoot 20 Seconds Theme
- On the Ground (Kevin Macleod)
- Morning Stroll (Audio Library)
___________________________________________________________________________
My socials:
Twitter: / yawwith
Discord: / discord
Instagram: / yr_trains
Thanks for watching! - Hry
Seem Accurate, this is what ArmBarn LawnMower is doing, very consistent. Im from the United States so I dont even have a point of reference for the sounds outside of YT videos, and I could tell that the DC sounds were nicked from the 444/450 EP. Also seriously, no GMSR or TMS, yet you can do it on models by the same person, and from DTG dating back as far as 2012/2013
700s sound like 444/450….
@@z-ulu6657 bet the TSW version will look cursed
It was vv fun to work on this Mr Yawwie Man, we should do it again sometime
Likewise my friend
@@Yawwie I thought he unsubscribe to you
For the motor sounds on DC I was meant to make recordings for AP (as I had on other projects), however things happened that stopped/prevented it and I believe that the recordings I made for the 444/450 were used (can't prove it unfortunately) and if this is the case I never gave permission for them to be used on this project and is a vast disappointment that they were and the pack, for the price it's put out has such poor features (or none really), poor sounds and small errors that aren't usually associated with an AP release. I do have my reasons and understanding for why but looking at previous AP releases it's been a state of steady decline on the quality of their products. I went through their back catalogue to list what we get for our money on each EP and you'll be surprised that we don't get much standardisation or consistency for the money with the features and liveries. When I get the chance I'll make a spread sheet/table to back it for all to see, but it does show how poor AP seems to have gotten of late.
Never knew you provided the recordings of the 444/450 motors. But yeah, such a shame they just went and reused them, especially without your permission. Utter violation. Plus I agree with AP's products steadily declining. I reckon it's literally because Richard has gotten into that mindset of thinking we won't notice all the details he deliberately misses out in packs, and then charging ridiculously high prices for them just to make the products still seem "high standard", or "professional". Will I see them potentially redeeming themselves in the future? Doubt it.
@@Yawwie yep the majority of the 444/450 sounds were recorded by myself, I think the only sounds that weren't were the horns, but even then there were a lot of sounds missed out from that pack that were recorded but left out. I also recorded a lot of stuff for the 455's (both volune 1 & 2) and the 3 different horns and MA sounds and I also provided a lot of technical insight into the operation of the units, how they handle etc and the EPs really disappointed me and from there I started to see the decline in quality especially when it came to the Vossloh Kiepe or AC motors (I know they aren't AC but that's how we know them as) those were a complete shambles and I said this to Richard pointing out the issues and concerns but unfortunately we still haven't see this fixed.
I have asked a lot of people do we as a community feel that AP still offer us "The Ultimate experience" with their products? I have my opinions and I'm sure there are plenty of people with their own and I think that it depends on how you are as a TS enthusiast. If like me you think it should be as close to the real thing as possible then going by the last few releases I feel that the answer is a resounding no (I would like to state that this is for EPs only and if the question was on their own scratch built rolling stock then I do think it's still a yes). However, if you just want to enhance the DTG library of rolling stock to make it closer to the real thing, drive better and you're not a die hard fan of realism then yes they can still make that claim as let's be honest there aren't many other developers out there that offer enhancements to other products.
Now I'm going to get a bit controversial here but hear me out! The 700/707/717 EP didn't need the 717 and if it was to be included then why not offer it later as a fully working train? Even if we take it as a bare 700 EP, other than slightly higher quality sound recordings what else does this pack offer that a certain 3rd party site doesn't offer (I won't name said site as I know many dislike it but I'm sure most know the one I mean). Their freeware EP that was put out shortly before the AP pack was produced I feel is better and i prefer this freeware pack over the payware one and like I say it offers the same upgrades to the core 700 that the AP one does just without the kick in the plums price tag, and for me the addition of the 707 & 717 do not warrant the cost of this pack.
I don't think Richard is in that mindset (or I would hope not) I think that with with how COVID-19 messed up things it's has meant that him and his team haven't been able to work as well as they have done in the past all being stuck in their various locations and my belief is that the packs are coming out as they are to get items out to keep his business going but they have the intentions of including these needed updates at a later date when they can fully get back together and work as before, Because one thing that AP does have going for them is they do (eventually) put out fixes and free updates to their packs and I would like to presume that in the future a working GSMR and HMI (TMS) will be included with this pack, if that is the case and the DC sounds get an update then I will retract my statement and say this pack would be worth the cost but as things stand for me it's just not worth it at all and of future EPs go the same way then for me I won't continue to buy anymore of their products. As things stand I've held back on most products, only buying them when they go on sale to make it feel I get value for money when getting them and that's quite sad since I used to always be a day one purchaser from them because I knew their quality was second to none!
Yeah, this is why I've noticed the pattern that they only perform well with older rolling stock, as they obviously have 10 times more interest in those type of trains, whereas with modern stock they just add in a few things and go "Here ya go. Give us money". It's like they want us not to care some much about the realism just because they never cared about that particular train in the first place, and as a result fanboys would gobble that rubbish up easily then go defending them.
The other additions to the EP were just a mess. The 707 is not even a 707 as it still has a bloody toilet and first class area, and the 717 just violates multiple railway laws. It's purpose is so shambolic that it simply shouldn't exist. I also find it funny how with the sounds, Richard literally took the same approach as what the guys working on the ATS freeware patch did. They recorded new AC sounds, but reused the same bloody 450 DC recordings, as I sort of rightly predicted would happen. Comical. Plus I'm aware how they also missed out some other core sounds within the 444/450 motors from your recordings, which was a shame, but most of us were too dumb to notice that at the time unfortunately.
It may be true that the pandemic might have heavily affected the way they work and their income, but now that it's almost over (for now I hope), I do think they are beginning to run out of excuses to justify why their lacklustre enhancement packs are still worth the price of a main dish in a restaurant, and I doubt they'll bother to make any drastic fixes/changes to them in the future, as much as I'd love to see it happen.
@@Yawwie Whilst I agree the older stock they do a lot better I think it's not because they lack the interest in it (Jordi did make the 700 model after all) I think it's a case of the modern items are a lot harder to get access too to make them authentic. I know that most TOCs do not want people to know how the trains work for security reasons, where as the older stuff is going so most people don't care or it's easier to get access to as it's heritage so unless you know someone on the I side that's willing to help out the modern stuff just won't be as good as you have to get recordings at stations rather than on depots etc which means poorer quality or missing things just because you cannot get them or you look suspect if you try too.
I don't have the EP so I can only go by what I've seen in reviews, streams or what other people tell me, but I agree the 707 is just that in name and the 717 is a pointless addition; making something AI only now just seems like a waste if time, I appreciate what they tried to do but because it is so different to the base model it just was a waste of their time and ours to make it. Again I hagebmy theory's as to why it was included but I won't bore people or include wibble without facts. I think the 444/450 motor sounds will do as an interim set of sounds if they have the intention of updating them later but with how they are currently I just cannot see that happening, but we can always hope! The missing sounds on the 444/450 EP are quite long and I might see if I can add them in a patch myself but from memory they are the exterior HSCB (it makes a loud bang/pop when switching on/off) the sound of the traction packages clicking and banging when taking power, cab relays for various systems, ideally the cab needs updating for the various missing switches, lights and buttons...there are more things but those are the ones that Incan immediately remember.
I think the pandemic was a reason for it and I do feel (at least for modern stock) it still is, as the railway is still working with a lot of restrictions from it. However when I last heard the AP team on a stream (talking about the 80x EP) I got the idea that Richard made the packs on his own without help from Nicholas and Jordi, as when asked what their favourite bit if the EP was one person said I didn't work on this pack so I don't know and Richard replied oh yes I just reused the scripting from previous EPs to make that. So from what I got from that is the more recent packs were made by Richard himself similar to how he used to make the early sound packs and he just copied and pasted the scripting from and older EP to add some of the more recent features we have, this would also explain why we don't have working GSMR or HMI as that's a bit more in-depth to create and include. I also think that Jordi isn't working much with TS anymore as his inclusion of credits seems to be dwindling and as he made the model of the 700 if he was working with AP on the 700/707/717 EP you know he would have tweaked the model to remove the toilets, first class areas and made the custom and subtle cab changes to make them their respective classes and the fact he didn't says to me that he just isn't working on TS at the moment. So I think a mix of the pandemic and Richard working on his own has meant we get lesser packs and again my hope is the intention is to upgrade them to the normal standard when everyone is able to assist him again, because it seems odd to me that for both the 700 and the 800 they were missing the exact same things (TMS/HMI and GSMR) but gained the same features (WSP, neutral sections functionality, power switching, destinations changing, updates sounds and physics). Again I could be wrong and most probably am but I'd like to think that there are plans in place to update these packs in the future but I guess we have to wait and see, but if they do then I will say that they are worthy of offering us the ultimate experience, if they don't then I think they have lost their way and are only interested in the money and not the quality of the product they put out and that will mean (for me anyway) that I will no longer be buying their packs, and as I have heavily reduced the amount of time I use TS anyway I think it will mean that I step away completely from it as if developers won't put the time into making a decent product then why should I invest my time and money into it?
You do bring some fair points there. It does make sense that Richard is working more alone nowadays, especially if you consider the amount of extra third-party devs helping him out lately, like with the 800EP. And yeah I understand providing access to more modern stock is much more difficult since they're still in service, but even then with some of the material that is already provided to them, like motor recordings, they still go and make those sounds seem even more distorted and low-quality in game than they are in real life. Hopefully we do see a switch in the overall quality of their future products, otherwise I agree that it's just another money-grab. I'll also look forward to your 450 sound patch... if you decide to make it ;-)
Your reviews are always spot on with what your saying, always enjoy your reviews
Really Enjoyed watching it, and really funny, I always enjoy your reviews, keep it up :)
Thanks for covering this add-on. I will buy the GE AC4400CW from Searchlight Simulations instead.
AP makes my self esteem skyrocket. Makes my BVE addons feel like gold in comparison to this what can only describe as "pezzo di merda" from Armwank powerfuck. Yes Im still salty they banned me for... no reason lmao. Wamna fight me about the electrostar still, richard?
Nice to be featured, i feel bad as i started a whole argument in the ATS Server cause i asked to see the cab lmao
Okay, sure, AP could have done some more on it, not that I care much as I despise the Desiro City. I personally have few issues with any of their packs.
And as you mentioned a couple of times, Richard really does prefer the older stock. No amount of complaining will get him to treat something modern with the same amount of care.
What AP really needs is a competitor. In sports like F1 you constantly have to develop and stay at the top of your game, or you fall behind the other teams. With no real competition, AP has probably got a little complacent here. The competition doesn't even have to be super amazing, anything that gets close to AP's quality (please don't say something like "that shouldn't hard") should get AP to buck up their ideas and take the time to make their packs to a better standard.
I imagine the pandemic didn't exactly help (like we saw with the diesel mode on the 800-803), but now that things have practically returned to normal, there should be no excuse for any missing features or sounds, even if it is just a missing cooling fan.
Bro i dont know a thing about trains and still your vid was mad fun to watch
When you review the
“Class 380 Enhancement Pack”
“Class 317/6/318 EMU pack”
Oh my… 😂
Oh god the thread of the 717 was amazing and light minded and clueless people were on me addressing my opinion on a product
When the world needed him most he came back
Epic crossover episode.
Awsome stuff it’s nice 👍🏾
YES! You've mentioned the door button issues with them all pressing them at the same time! We've been waiting for this for quite a while, and Yawwie mate, you did *not* disappoint us with this channel crossover.
Psst maybe I could do a voiceover for your next video to help out whenever you're busy :wink: :wink: (I am aware this is CZcams)
Yep the door button pisses me off.
1:43 He's quietly gone e..x..t..rEAMLY...cRiTiCaL 😈
could probably tell richard had to many drinks tbh when making this abomination
Class 700s are meant to sound like hotpoint washing machines at higher speeds. They don't really maintain the traction noise in game. Also, they are still a bit slow on DC compared to what they can really do in reality. You can't click the door close button to close the doors .it just opens them, the motor sounds cut out at speed In game .
I can’t wait for the day that AP run out of modern units to do, forcing them to FINALLY look at things like classes 08, 14, 24/25/26/27s, 35, 45, 47, 52, warships, the 140 and 143 pacers and bringing the 40 back with louder sounds!
As someone who lives with 700s and quite recently 707s, it’s quite honest to say this pack is a shambles of its own. I was expecting much better out of this, unfortunately this is not the case for this pack. Quite a massive let down, and it makes me disappointed to hear about such things like this. I couldn’t find much accurate stuff featured except of the exterior liveries. Majority of the stuff is incorrect and there’s a lot of missing things that weren’t picked up by DTG and AP. Do they even have beta testers for starters? I presume not…
On the good side of things, I’m really liking that 717 cab recreation.
Eagly waiting ur mk3 review
AP got roasted here, glad I didn’t get it
Return of the king!
Very epic
He’s back
great your back!
Nice he's uploaded
YESSSSSS,HE'S ALIVE
I had the ATS pack and I then bought the AP pack. The reason this AP pack is good is mainly because the DTG 700 was SO BAD. So, it's worth it from that point of view. If you want a working 700 or 707, then you basically have to buy this, but I agree with many of your points in the video that it feels a bit rushed and they left quite a few things out. I'm sure Richard would have liked to do more, but his hands may have been tied by a few factors. I'm hoping we get at least some sort of TMS and GSM-R in a future update. The ATS pack was brilliant for a free pack that came out in 48hrs, but let's be honest, the AP pack is much better and gives you a lot more. The sounds are improved, you get a 707 and the physics (which you didn't mention) are wayyyy better. The ATS pack doesn't really touch the physics and the DTG physics are god awful. My main gripes with this pack are the lack of 717 cab (understandable though) and the 707 has toilets and still has a pantograph. Also they didn't improve the interior very much. I do like the cab though, and I can live with the 450 motor sounds are they are pretty similar. I honestly don't feel ripped off, but it's no CEP.
0:15 Certified Richard Powerchair moment
FINALLY
4 minutes late. Damn. Anyway, great video, Yawwie.
YAAAAAAAAAAAY YAWWIE IS BACK!!!!!!!
Mr transport guy is a known modder in the TPF2 community, so you''ll be fine
The thing I’m hoping they make is a aventra pack for the geml, wcml etc I think that will be decent and as they are my local trains I actually can have an option. Yayyyyy!
720 sucks deal with it
I though this plum was dead...apparently not
If I saw the dtg 700, I would call the BTP because 'I saw something that didn't look right'
The first part made me laugh so hard ngl
Have you got a video to upload on the class 455 farewell tour?
finally yawwie is back from the dead --when's next yawwie news--
still awaiting to see of the 66 pack is good. Any chance on that becoming a video?
How do I visit the real thing when I am all the way in Asia and my school just finished with online classes?
SCOUTZZZZZZZZ
YAWWWWIEEEE
Yawwie we need a new episode of Yawwie News!
A Yawwie showed up
Edit: Oh look, I'm first here
Also, Yawwie, give gary a raise.
Pay me first
No I'm broke
Very good ep sounds and feels like a 700 much better than the dtg 700
Yesssssssssssss
2:35 no explanation needed
he likes the 700 dersio city what never new that
1:45 I can’t LMAO 😂
Class707 is now in train sim world3
1:09 Arm spray Dishwasher
OMG jaja ❤
Even roblox Stepford county railway did better that Amstrong powerhouse, eventhough no Thameslink livery. The modeling is better, The Right sound and the 717 looks and has the correct cab design, and if you will say no you plum, Then stay with DTG in Hell.
Was that scream and shatter gary?
We still waiting ur mk3 pack review
yeesssss
I am kinda hoping for a 73 Loco pack from Ap
Hey Yawwie, I wanted to ask, when will you post another Yawwie news vid, they are absolutely hilarious
5:10 Richmond Powerhouse
OMG SO FAR IT IS SO FUNNY
17:26 It does actually change at 28 though…
The most disappointing pack by far. For now. Brace yourself for if they ever make a 458! Also opinions on the 455s leaving on the Southern?
The 323 was worse , but they are both the worst packs to exits I agree
1:20 rip earphone users
3:46 who's the person working on those Desiro City models
I dont see any changes after they update this pack from the last week
@Yawwie ampower dishwasher released a mk3a/b pack
And the seats in the mk3a/b pack look like a mk2d
That class 365 has seen everything also the TMS and GSMR are important because that makes it realistic and you did it on lots of trains in the past and say No no no this is because of a fault ha lucky try you need to start doing it properly
For now, I am worrying if TSW2 got what we don't suppose to be like that...then...nothing to be seen here
hey yawwie gary will not stop asking me when will i make a feck off complimation
This is absolutely beautiful and funny. Yeah the Class 700 does sound like a Class 385. And the Class 707 and Class 717 are both identical. But the Class 700, Class 707 and Class 707 Desiro City are all manufactured by Siemens.
I will say alot of the motor sounds for AP products are decent, but they use the track run sounds to drown out the motor sounds at speed so they don't have to continue making the higher pitch sounds at higher speeds. Which is silly. The 365 and electrostars are a prime example where you can't hear consistent motor sounds after a certain speed. (365s and 465s don't have accurate motor sounds in game, only the GTO noise for 365s and 465s are accurate. The traction fan hum isnt audible for the 365 but is gor the 465)
You're not wrong at all regarding that fact. I've noticed it countless times with other packs, but it's just their laziness shining as usual.
@@Yawwie indeed, the only prominent motor sounds are the older dc motored stock, even then they recycled 319s motor sounds.
10:37 here we go again!
Where's that from 😂😂
When's yawwie news #7?
When is the new yawie news
Was you on the 455 tour yawwie people where shouting about yawwie news
1:04 lol
(Cue the torrent of angry fanboys).
Personally I don't think the sounds are too bad overall, though I did notice the inaccuracies mentioned in this video. Come on, AP. You can do so much better than this (just take the 150, 158, 205 and 321 for example).
For me the most laughably poor aspect of this pack is the 707 and 717. The latter because of just how half-arsed it looks (especially with no new cab model) and the former because AP didn't bother changing the interior at all, leaving it essentially as the unchanged 700 model disguised as a 707. If DTG can accurately model different Talent 2 variants in TSW, I don't see why AP couldn't do the same for the Desiro City units.
Now I'm kicking myself for buying this pack, especially at full price. At least there's still some use for these trains, even if predominantly as Ai.
Honestly, the reason it costs that much in the first place is just to make the product look advanced. It sucks but that's how they run their shoddy business now apparently.
Quite good, got no eardrums tho…
I think why these packs from AP and DTG is garbage is because they tightening the schedule, and pushing the due dates foward, because of that, some packs are rushed or buggy
What if they make a 701 after it enters service lol
Yawwie what’s your job?
even roblox SCR has a dedicated 717 cab
The sounds of the class 717 on scr is wrong
@@thisdude5854 ik tbh all the sounds in SCR are wrong
@@busspottb im not saying I hate them but interior is good
16:09 w i d e 377
YakYak
Here's my AP joke
Where is yawwie news
You know something funny? *ROBLOX* SCR made a better 717
ugh not the frecking 717
biffa bin man where
hey yawieeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee
The 707 and 717 do not have 1st class, there are no toilets on 707 and 717
Armspray pooper
I just love the fact that nobody else has the arse to talk about how literally shit the 717 front looks, and the fact that not even a new cab was even attempted nor mentioned for a future update. It's just disgusting
But as soon as you mention any of these obvious issues some oik will come along claiming to be some know-it-all and say the same usual crap because FB doesn't allow criticism...
11:51
5:12
This pack is just a scam to be honest, the price doesn’t reflect what you get at all. Reused sounds from the 444/450EP which is wrong and lazy (the recordings are good but wrong for the Desiro City), the interior looking crap still despite this meant to be an enhancement, the livery issues (god that SWT/SWR 707 one is haunting), it’s just awful. No TMS and GSM-R is also laughable, pure comedy gold
The only good thing/ about the pack is the AC sounds for the 700 and the SE 707 livery. That’s it. Everything else is mediocre to bad to deadly awful
The less said about the farce that is the 717, the better. What a rubbish excuse it was. May as well just omit it from the pack if they couldn’t be bothered to even try
So this EP is a slap in the face to everyone who was excited for it, pay more and get less in return is the 2022 trend it seems, I’ve lost all hope and excitement with any AP pack now, the 80X pack really was a sign of things to come
If I'm honest none of the included liveries look that great at all, and that's all down to the disgraceful 700 model which makes anything it wears look immediately bad by default.
That's fair enough there, the pack remains awful no matter what this time around though, love how AP have gone from good and great EPs to this current awful EP, almost like they don't care anymore and will just make packs to please the AP fanboys
jjjjj
The 321 is so inaccurate