Arcam SA10 & SA20 Compared to A19 | What Sounds Better?
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- čas přidán 1. 11. 2018
- Hi Everyone!
Today I listen and compare the New Arcam Integrated amplifiers to their previous generation Integrated amplifiers and try and determine any audible differences with the newer models.
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Good job !! Had the Arcam A 85 back in the 90's ! Great amp !
6:47 for the start of the comparison.
Thank you, really informative. Balanced with no bias. Well done
Thanks for that very helpful comparison, it helped me make a decision from the other side of the world.
Let me tell you I really enjoyed this review. You really went into a lot of that and a lot of work went into it. I know I’ve tried it before you’ve done a great job congratulations and you’ve proved to me what I already believed that an SACD directly to the amplifier from a player is the best streaming would be the second❤❤👍👍👌👏🏼
I could tell the difference all the way over here in Beaverton, Oregon - USA... Well, I think I liked the more powerful AMP because it was already in my mind that it would sound better. Of course I can't hear anywhere near what you do, and until I can experience it in person I'll just go by your words from experience , but your explanation made sense... And I will take the sound of a good quality CD over a streamed file 85% of the time. But you have to remember, there are a lot more variables to account for with a streamed file. Thanks James, It's great to hear from you again.
Ye, bro, I absolutely hear this magical different as well. You're not crazy. Also, try some pure silver cables with those to upgrade that 3D sound to 4D sound.
Brilliant video.
Thanks James, you've done a grand job in auditioning the CD player and amp (SA20) I've been eyeing off. I've a 3.5m x 3.5m man cave that will also need some speakers, I'm thinking bookshelf speakers, what would you suggest I audition? Music tastes are everything from ACDC to Warren Zevon with side orders of Richard Thompson and orchestral classical music. My previous system was Linn into B&W CDM 9NTs. Cheers!
Great review,tks
Great review, I listened back through my RXA3070 and Dali Ikons, could hear some differences through your mic. I used to own an A19 and sold it as went multichannel and it didn't have processor mode/HT bypass. I am now missing the smooth control it had on my floorstanders, my Yamaha AVR is good but wonder what dedicated amplification can bring. In the UK the price difference between the 10 and the 20 can be as low as £100. Think the 20 is 'worth it' at that price discrepancy?
James that was a very interesting comparison between all the 3 Arcam models.
Can you do a Comparison with NAD C 388 and C368 with a CD input also with the Bluos if you have MDC for that thanks.
Great review. Very helpful. Also good to hear I should keep my RPI 3 with DSD playing capabilities instead of getting a Bluesound Node :P
I am not familiar with the RPI 3 but if the only reason is for DSD playback, my question is where are the DSD files coming from? And since no one streams DSD, where are they being stored?
@@SoundlineAudioNewZealand raspberry pi 3 microcomputer. I only have one album in DSD that plays from usb stick but it sounds amazing. But you are right it is not important
Im back again ya'll. Im torn between the SVS Ultra Bookshelfs, klipsch RP600M and the Focal Aria 906s. Which one do you think would sound best with the Arcam SA20?
Thank you for your review. Your opinion, I have avr850 and I am playing on dynaudio emit M30. Is it a good match or not
I love Arcam. My A18 still rocking the house!!!
I have the A18 too, was thinking of swapping it for this SA10 but that could be a mistake. I could do with the internal DAC as I could use more digital inputs and a 3rd DAC output, the others being my Rega DAC and the Arcam CDS27 SACD streamer.
@@nocturnal1970
Go and get a demo to see how it sounds and maybe go back a few times. It will be the only way to know. Explain to them that you already have the a18 to see if they can better it.
@@bighands69 I did get the SA10 back in May for a ridiculously cheap price, sold the A18 and Rega DAC.
The SA10 sounds great with the CDS27 as source and DAC conversion, no surprises that the SA10's DAC digital inputs don't come close to the CDS27 but they are good for TV and other non critical listening.
I'm now into streaming internet radio through my CDS27 using my first smart phone, I love this SACD network streamer.
thanx man.
Thanks. I know that SACD version very well. It is fantastic. Sadly I now need to spend more money. Rats.
Just bought an ifi Zen Blue Bluetooth Player and a DH Labs Silver Coaz Cable and the difference is huge on my Arcam SA20👍😎 Great Video Mate😎
ITS SAD TO USE BLUETOOTH WITH SUCH A FINE EQUIPMENTS
@@altabriziyehya4735 what do you recommend I use it with. Can I connect it directly to my laptop?
@@edwinsprojects7039a Wiim Pro streamer
HELP!!! I have the Arcam SA20 and I use a logitech Bluetooth adapter to stream music througg my laptop. What is the best way to connect my laptop to allow me to use the built in DAC from the Arcam SA20. I am not using it and feel that I am missing out on the sound quality that I could be getting from the built in DAC. Thanks
Has the sa20 enough power to drive my xtz 99.36 flr ? Which is ur prefered stereo amp ? I want one to power my front speakers on my x3400h
Sa10 sounds drunk I preferred the A19 in this video, but even through CZcams compression I agree with your final assessment s20+cd player ✌️. Funny how that works.
I probably wouldn't base your opinion of how components or speakers sound over youtube videos.
Best to hear them for yourself or find a professional you trust who can tell you how they sound in real life.
I wish someone would compare the SA20 to Arcam‘s Solo Music MK2 since both have class-G 80wpc
Do you have the ability to use a Naim Unity for your source?
I have the sa 20 it’s great the bass is out standing the highs are better than with the Marantz I
The bass is ok at lower volumes and may become too much for more bass heavy speakers, the lack of tone controls seems odd to me?
I had this amp for 3 weeks and really wanted to like it but it sounds rubbish at louder volumes .
@@hclandscapes I was reading your comment there , is there any you guys would reccomend that sounds hi-fi and its excellent better sounding,even if it's a purist piece..G class, or A /AB, not into phono free best...with a tubish strong sound quality, integrated not a must, separates perfectly fine,if best... within 2-3k, please thanks, with all the hi-fi qualities..again thanks..which later I'll get and be able to place a dac/preamp any recommendations please thanks
What spdif cable are you using in this video ?
Now try it with the Bluesound note 2i and you will be amazed
Really looking to get the sa20, but my concern is that you say it sounds best connected through the digital input. I will be mainly playing my music through a turntable, so everything analogue. Will i be better off looking at something else?
Well the ohono stage is what makes a turntable sound good. The MM phono in this amp is pretty good for a basic setup, if you have a more high end turntable, I would recommend a separate phono stage with good RCA cables. When I said I thought the digital sounded better, that was only in regard to that CD player that I was using at the time.
Hi
What do you think about Arcam A29?
Thanks
Are Arcam SA20 and Monitor Audio Silver 300 a good association ? Using for Vinyl, streaming music (kind of music Pop, Rock, Hip-Hop, Electro ...)
Great Combo!
The 300s really sing on that Arcam Class G!
Let's be honest. Did we really expect a HiFi shop to say that the outgoing amp was equal or better than the new one? You can't expect us to believe that you are unbiased, even if you are.
They could tell you it is just as good which it probably would be but I suspect they believe it is better why else would they say it.
It is logical to assume that the company that makes the amplifier wants to make better amps each generation.
Exactly how anyone can consider this an unbiased and objective review I don't know. There were many questionable statements - like vinyl sounding better than CD. Nowadays that isn't the case.
@@mccririck01Depends on the mastering and playback equipment.
@@1jhnpenningtonwell obviously, but if you use any modern well designed DAC it will have better dynamic range and detail than a record.
Running the SA20 with the CDS50. I have an audioengine Bluetooth receiver hooked up to the optical input of the CD player but can't get the coaxial output to the amp to play through. Any suggestions on getting this to work?
Hard to say, but assuming theres nothing wrong with any of the equipment or cables, it could be that the sampling frequency on the optical output of your bluetooth receiver is too high for coax SPDIF to pass through.
I have the sa20 + CDS50 and before the A28 + cd17 , with Acoustic Energy AE 309 , is a very good association !!!!
I have the SA20 and the AE309 as well. It's a great combination that I can settle on for a while.
Great review bro. Fellow kiwi here I understood you well haha. I'm currently debating the Arcam sa20 VS a Marantz of similar price. Could you give any advice on the general difference between sound of Arcam VS Marantz?
Kia Ora mate
Personally at that price range I prefer the Arcam sound, it’s a bit meatier and natural sounding.
However when comparing the next level up, the SA30 vs the Marantz Model40n, I would say I prefer the Marantz.
@@SoundlineAudioNewZealand Hello. So I assume it is not a big deal to upgrade from SA20 to SA30. I refer to the amplifier section (apart from streamer, dirac etc)
The SA 20 is 90wpc and also reserves 20wpc of class A amplification, if you look on the Arcam specification manual it states this at the bottom .
Hi Harry.
Thanks for the info, you are right it does specify 90 watts per channel, but I cant find in the user manual where it specifies the 20 watts of class A?
I couldn't see anything about the class A part in the manual either but i have read several reviews stating that its uses a reserve of 20 class A watts for when its needed .
I have just bought this amp and waiting for it to be delivered, cant wait to set it up !
Arcam SA20 integrated amplifier builds on the performance level of the A29, The SA20 integrated amplifier uses proprietary Class G technology.
The SA20 is rated at 80wpc into 8 ohms (both channels driven). It delivers just under 20wpc in pure Class A, while allowing for huge extra power reserves for the most demanding of loudspeakers. This groundbreaking amplifier is an absolute must for those seeking true excellence in an amplifier at an incredibly affordable price.
Just found this information about the amplifier for sale at reputable dealer called HiFi corner based in the UK
@@hclandscapes how did the s 20 workout, what speakers..I have one on order, is it worth it
Waiting for a new Arcam cd player.
I actually heard the difference over CZcams going to spdif. Must have been night and day for. I just bought an sa30 so will def be using the digital inputs
How does the SA30 perform?
@@DigitalPhilosophers it’s got a very big sound, and a lot more of 3d sound field than when I had the Cyrus stereo 200 connected to my avr. I think tho the dac in the avr may have been the weak point however. Really pleased with sound as it is clearer but it leaves me wanting more. So I’m thinking of buying an luxman or Hegel and move the sa30 into my office (where it will be powering my kef ls50 black edition)
@@RLee-66 Thank you! Please keep us updated on how the SA30 compares to the Hegel or Luxman. Which Hegel do you have in mind?
@@DigitalPhilosophers it won’t be for a while yet as the missus has a stress everytime I buy new equipment.When I do it will either be Luxman 507ii or 509x or Hegel h390 or maybe h590 depending on budget at the end of the year.
Sorry to clarify the sa30 has good separation but could have more depth / 3d sound field. Hope that makes sense.
What are thoughts on the Arcam avr11, I haven't seen any detail reviews on utube ? 🤔
Why pay the extra to have the latest? If you're a gamer well it's quite understandable. If not and considering it's successor the arcam avr21 has now been released for a considerably amount of time, one can now purchase its predecessor the AVR20 for more than 30% off. Sounds amazing and bear in mind after auditioning a couple of mid-price AVRs I was starting to think an AVR is probably not going to be able to bring the best out of my sonus Faber speakers... that wasn't until I hooked it up to the arcam avr20.
I've just posted a video of what it sounds like. So if interested click on the red dragon twice.
amazing comparison, definitely got what you said about the sound differences. how do you think the rega elex and brio compare to the sa20 and sa10? thanks
The Regas apparently have better rhythm and timing. My Rega DAC has this over my Arcam CDS27, tighter with more attack and resolution but the CDS27 has a more holographic sound, more depth, wider soundstage with deeper bass and other differences.
Monitors audio gold line is great. I have gold 50
Can you connect a Bluesound Node to it and hook the tv up to the Bluesound Node via HDMI eArc? Does that make it possible to control the volume with just 1 remote control (the one of the tv) and will you see the volume go up and/or down on the display of the amplifier?
of coruse not .. how could that be physically possible ... get a receiver.
@@m0rianneit was just a question but thx for your wise reply.
Thanks for the review. So your conclusion was the built-in DAC inside the SA10 amplifier sounded better than the DAC inside the CDS50? The CDS50 has the higher specification ESS Sabre 9038 DAC over the SA10's ESS 9016K2M DAC. The CDS50 should perhaps sound better?
The SA20 amplifier with the higher class-G circuit also has the ESS Sabre 9038 built-in DAC, the same as the CDS50.
I have the older Arcam CDS27 SACD streamer and a simple portable 2.5" hard-drive connected by USB sounds the same as the CD or by network, high res files sound the same through the USB or network. I prefer simplicity and l just use it with discs and the hard drive operating the menu through the simple display on the CDS27 SACD streamer.
I use mine with an Arcam A18 amplifier and a Rega DAC.
Other reviews state the SA10 having looser bass than the A19 but I'd love to demo the SA10 as then I would have 3 different DACs to choose from. Although I'm not sure the SA10 would beat the A18 which is fabulous, I may have to compromise if I swapped this out for the SA10.
SA10 is a great price at the minute in the UK, around £450 which is amazing.
do arcam amps sound similar to naim amps?
Hello, please place subtitles
all is good,please dont move the camera too much shaky!
Hallo bosku, apa bisa di kasi tutorialnya pada am amplifer Arcam A38 muncul tulisan over time dan beberapa menit mati sendiri.🙏
What kind of AV rack is that?
Soul2sole Audio
Спасибо danke
Opinion starts at 9:50
I just bought the Arcam SA20. It hooked up to Polk Audio RTI9 towers.
I have not bumped the volume past 60 yet because I live in an apartment complex and the old lady living above me complaints. It sounds way better than the old A/V receiver I used to power my speakers with but there is mixed reviews on the amp. My listening room is about 14ft by 20ft. I paid $1,500US for it. Should I return it or can I get better sound quality for the money? I plan on buying SVS Ultra Towers in the future for it. Thank you all👍
I think the Arcam SA20 is a GREAT sounding amp for the money. That Class G technology is really smooth!
@@SoundlineAudioNewZealand thank you for your opinion on the amp.
The SA20 feels solid, it's very heavy. It sounds very well balanced. Has great bass, great mids and great highs in my opinion. Do you think I will get better sound out of the digital inputs? Or do the analog and digital inputs give you the same quality?
Edwinsprojects he says it sounds much better with digital coax.
Im torn between the Svs Ultras, Klipsch RP 600M and the Focal Aria 906s. Which one do you think is a better match for the Arcam SA20? Thanks again
The more power you have the better clarely at low volume .thru out the whole range
That’s not a thing. That’s hifi shop sales pitch
There’s no way you hear a tic at the crossover point in class AB...it’s just crossover distortion which affects the sound quality. Also isn’t class G pure class A at low watts output...?
does arcam sound flat ?? or is it something that will sound good with techno and hip hop music ??
I wouldn't use the word "flat" when describing its sound purely because people associate the adjective "flat" with a negative or less enjoyable sound.
I would use the term "natural".
It has exactly the right amount of bass and treble that the song was originally recorded with (similar levels to the mid range).
If you are after that 'lots of treble, lots of bass' type sound, you might be better suited to a NAD or other D-Class type amp which have a little bit of natural EQing going on inside them.
@@SoundlineAudioNewZealand thank you for reply. I really appreciate it. I am looking for an amp that will sound good with zensor 7 and zensor 3 speakers and music I listen to is techno and hip hop. I like this deep long bass and shakes your guts. I also have old kenwood subwoofer.
What do you think about azur 851a from CA or cxa80 from same company ??
Arcam prides itself in not putting their own spin on your music. Your music on an Arcam will sound the way that the artist intended.
Double blind testing, anyone? If you know what you're listening to, you'll hear what you think you should expect. (Dislcaimer: A19 owner.)
@behexen250 "Just because expectation bias can happen, doesn't mean it will always happen."
Even if that's true, the problem then is: how do you know if it's happening or not? You have no way of knowing if any "test" is free of unconscious bias or not.
"As for double blind testing, of all the claims I've heard from people preaching they must be used, not a single person can ever reference a well done dbt."
Just because it's hard to do, doesn't mean it's not important. Difficulty doesn't invalidate truth.
"If its that important, maybe you guys should actually do one."
It's not up to me (or whoever these "guys" are) to do it -- I'm not making any specific claim that one thing is definitively better than another that needs substantiating.
If people are happy with what they hear, and think one thing sounds better than another for whatever reason (real or imagined), that's absolutely fine - they've got to listen to whatever equipment they choose, after all. It's just better not to pretend it's 'universally' true.
Is class g comparable to class h
I haven’t heard of Class H, what brand is that from?
A19 much better
Mate, don’t tell me vinyl sounds objectively better than CD. You might like it better and many do, but vinyl will never have the accuracy, bandwidth or resolution of CD. Subjectively, I have no problem with it but it is much more limited, even if it’s still enjoyable.
You'll be pleased to know that since making this video (quite a while ago) my opinion has swung back the other way. I now mostly listen to CDs and SACDs. Still love my turntable but it just doesn't get as much use as it used to. Sorry if I presented anything as an absolute truth, of course all of this stuff is completely subjective.
@@SoundlineAudioNewZealand I agree: it absolutely _is_ subjective because you’re only going to end up using what you like. Everyone has different tastes and expectations. One of my best mates now plays vinyl exclusively and while I’m never going to agree with his reasoning, it’s his choice and I totally get why. I quite like valve amps too but I’m unlikely to ever own one as part of a hifi system. On the other hand, I understand why others do.
You need better mic set up. Doesn't sound good.
Sounds “bitter” don’t think I should buy it
Lol you are nuts if you think you can hear anything worth judging out of a CZcams video
Hahaha!
Sorry your sound is not good and little confusing when switching
Can anyone really *hear* the class B "tick"???? I've never heard of anyone who can.
You need better mic
Оказывается малолетних придурков полно не только в России. Судя по видео, несчастный SA20 подключили к Monitor Audio Platinum PL200, а волею судьбы или случая мне очень хорошо известны эти АС. С точки зрения контроля над ними Arcam SA20, то это как в пластиковое ведро орать! Более того, колонки с гарантией 99,99% вообще не прогреты, а на моей памяти это одни из самых "тормознутых" АС и на номинал они выходят часов через 500-700, а до этого звучат зажато и весьма противно, словно им пасть подушкой заткнули. Максимум для SA20 это MA Silver300, с этими АС и отличный контроль и максимальная озвучиваемая площадь помещения (где-то метров до 26 квадратных) - если больше, они начинают звучать немного гулко, а если меньше 20 кв.м, то словно у них астма и они не в состоянии вдохнуть полной грудью. Для Platinum PL200 наоборот площадь помещения НАЧИНАЕТСЯ с 30 кв. м., но и усилитель для их контроля нужен совершенно другой. В свое время с ними не справлялся даже Arcam FMJ A39, куда уж там SA20. Какой-то больной и совершенно не показательный "эксперимент". В целом новая серия Arcam HDA откровенная говнокитайщина самого стремного пошиба, с серией FMJ не имеющая ничего общего. Шкрябающие в гнездах кнопки, кривая подгонка панелей, откровенные косяки обработки и покраски... Даже старая серия Альфа на две головы выглядела качественнее. А вот звучат (к удивлению) не настолько паскудно, хоть и похуже FMJ (скорее ближе к той-же Альфе). В любом случае, при сравнении впрямую тот-же Cambridge CXA-80 при схожей цене от SA20 не оставляет даже пепла как по качеству, так и по звуку.
Cambridge cxa80 звучит лучше arcam hda sa20? В чём это выражается конкретно? Детализация или сцена, можно поконкретнее
SA20 is notably better compared to the SA10. More sound control, better dynamics. SA20 is worth it for the price difference if it were up to 250 USD.
I'm not a fan of the Arcam laid back sound, it just isn't as engaging for my liking, but the they are both good amps for the money, especially with their decent integrated DAC, with a preference on the SA20 like I mentioned.
Sorry bro, sound is very bad. Its insult to arcam. Please use good mic.
Wouldn't matter what Mic I used, youtube audio compression would be the cause of the insult.
I would advise that when you listen to recorded audio on youtube you dont take that the sound you are hearing is how it sounded in real life.
The sound will be affected by the mic, the camera transcoding it, the editing software used to create the video, the format the video is exported in, youtube's compression, AND everything at your end (your computer, speakers, amp and internet connection)
Very reproducable... Not.... Hehehe
You might want to write a script next time, laying out your impressions and conclusions logically and concisely, rather than just rambling on incoherently for 28 minutes like a stoned lunatic
No need for nastiness...seems like a very decent dude.
Tell us you're unhappy and miserable without telling us you are unhappy and miserable lol 🤣
"Hear that tick" lol let's here you record it! By the way when you go digital out form a CD player there is ZERO sound quality difference between a $5000 player and a $100 one! Also to do A-Bs you need to STFU in between the plays not that really what we are hearing through your far from flat frequency response mic is remotely accurate.
"there is ZERO sound quality difference between a $5000 player and a $100 one"
You should be kidding !
@@xflnx756 Agreed, a CD playing in my budget blu-ray player outputted into my Rega DAC sounds crappy compared to a CD in my Arcam CDS27 SACD streamer outputted digitally to the same Rega DAC.