"All I had was the tongue in my head" i think this is a sentiment that so many ENTPs can resonate with and im not sure why exactly, but from an early age language is a very important tool for them. Its nice to see ENTP examples on here, I'd love to see a wider rage of them depicted on here bc I don't think I've seen many.
ENTP here ... damn you figured it out. But yes it's true, language is what I would consider my most powerful tool. As a young kid I learned to read by myself. I think ? I only remember one day reading out loud the mustard brand name Amora to the amazement of my father, at the age of four. Then proceeding to read the words "Météo France" on the TV screen. It was like Christmas for my parents, I think they must have thought "We did it, we made an astronaut. *slow clap*" Little did they know they only made a hotel clerk... well, so far. I played video games and learned more complicated words and big numbers and basic calculations before I got to school by 6. There I had my first introduction to German and I LOVED it. I loved having to switch to another voice and accent in order to feel like I actually was speaking German. Years later I don't speak German too well, but the accent can still fool natives, but I focused mostly on English which I do speak perfectly, same in Spanish. In some ways I added to my own charisma by studying the Japanese language, which I don't understand too well, but whose "etiquette" in listening and actively interacting with another human being can really soften anyone's character. I bow when I greet and thank someone in a very non-asian way but I know people sense good intentions in my body language due to me doing it. I think it's not necesarily language or skills at language learning that drive us, but more a kind of attachment to the real meaning of symbols. That's what I was feeling when I heard Stephen talk about his Empyricism " a + a = 2a" yes but no. He MUST have been thinking "you're using symbols to simplify reality, but the addition of these symbols do not equate to something your human mind can actually comprehend. Hence I did not tell my own story in this post with numbers and facts but with ... feelings. Numbers and facts tell you I'm good at languages. My experience tells me I love language learning and finding the oldest meaning of a word or its root in order to narrow down to the most basic idea it can represent, which if done often enough just outline for you the basic human needs you need to tend to live meaningfully.
I'll add a bit more because I thought of it too late : What we see in both Stephen and jordan, and even in myself recalling my Si shit, is really the Ne -Ti trying to its thing : grabbing the idea via Ne, and try to do something with it via Ti. Ne-Ti is really about making tools. I found a thing, let's do something with it. Everything is a tool. And we're hellbent on proving everything can be.
@블랙나르시사 It's a tricky expression because it looka like an idiom but it isn't. It means pretty much literally "the voice in your head". Stephen meant : "I didn't feel confident enough to participate in playful fighting and physical games, so I had to show my value through my brains."
1. Human life is full of problems. 2. Language is important to ENTP in order to solve problems. Clarifying presuppositions and talking about how language does (not) work allows that. Also, language shapes the parameters of the realm of possibilities. It allows to synthetize particular issues in few words. 3. For example let's take : {etiology, soteriology ontology, axiology} 4. These 4 concepts are extremely valuable to analyze discourse. This comment is meta.
"Please describe Ne without saying the word 'Ne.'" He's really trying to embrace his inferior Si through his studies. But he has trouble narrowing down and focusing on each case. I need dramamine.
I'm an ENTP and I'd say my thinking is more aligned with empiricism. I'd love to understand why something is the way it is, but even if I never do, it seems silly to argue that something doesn't make sense just because I don't understand it. I do not dictate logic, I merely try to follow it. Idk if that's an Ne "so many options could be true" type of ideology, or if it's feminine intuition/masculine sensory accepts reality more readily, or if it's Ti vs Te deduction, or something else. I think the only way to find out is to study more ENTPs through the empiricist/rationalist lens. Edit: I had misspelled empiricist
I'm a physics student. The theoretical and the experimental sides are of equal importance as they are both parts of the scientific process. Without either, you wouldn't have physics. That being said I hate sports; with no exaggeration I would rather be physically ill and bedbound than playing in some sort of sporting tournament. Team sports involving balls are the worst offenders.
Guys, that's a *terrible* definition of rationalism vs empiricism. Rationalism = internal logical consistency. ie if all men are bald, and james is a man, then james must be bald. If all men are not bald, i dont know if james is bald or not. Empiricism = does it work out there practically. ie external logical consistency - all men i see are bald, james is a man, so james is probably bald. Rationalism is absolute in so far as the logic is absolute. Empiricism is always probabilistic. Most good science/philosophy/thought has both. For me this is more Ti vs Te, rather than N vs S, although i understand that by their nature rationalism is theoretical hence lending more to abstraction and N and empiricism requires practical experimentation lending more to S.
very good video, i see the rationalism vs empiricism as definitely being based on a different definition of intuition/sensory than personality theory (or perhaps devised at a time that is specific to that era and/or not inclusive of the "personality theory" use case). as an INTJ, i would say that i fall on the empirical side of the scale. i believe that the sensory (in the case of rationalism vs empiricism, meaning that which exists beyond myself) is certainly what informs knowledge, so i would be an empiricist as i agree that ppl do not innately have knowledge. but the sensory of personality theory is more tied to that which can be observed by the physical senses (sight, touch, etc). in this case, i'm more an intuitive because the concept beyond the sensory is what i concentrate on and value; and then apply elsewhere to replicate the same outcome (hopefully) in a different scenario. to some ppl, it may seem like i'm shooting in the dark, but i'm not (entirely). i am replicating the concept behind a very sensory observation i've seen before and, if i have fully understood the concept and placed the sensory properly in the new experiment, then i should experience the same outcome (although not always). in personality theory, i see Ni Te as a strong combination that enables me to willingly experiment and test my conceptual understanding to further solidify those concepts but i am testing it in empirical conditions
"unpacking three ideas" is NOT Ne. It's making sense of Ne. Which is Ni. Man you got JBP all wrong. But no wonder if your watch all videos at 2x speed, you'd think he's vomiting ideas onto you, when in reality, he's a very structural thinker, narrowing down on the meaning of the overflow of Ti (not necessarily Ne) ideas that he spent his entire life analyzing and juxtaposing.
Y'all, if you've never seen Stephen Fry vs Catholic Church debate from 2009, do yourself a favour and watch it. He's absolutely amazing. That debate put me on the path of becoming an atheist back then. I think he was there with another prominent atheist, the writer.... I'm blanking on his name.
@@arwuh Yes! Thank you! My favourite part that I semi-quote to this day is "it's like a criminal in court would say "You bring up the burglary, and the murder but you never mentioned the birthday present I gave to my father".
I love love LOVE both Jordan Peterson and Stephen Fry because they’re willing to explore other viewpoints if the ‘other’ can state their case clearly and logically enough. The interaction between them is so respectful to me as an ENTP, but, perhaps to others, it could possibly feel antagonistic. (I’m married to an ISFJ so this is the only reason I’m even slightly aware that this is possible 😂)
Their distinction between S and N is always confusing. I don't think they have the distinction properly pinned down. If Fry is N first, then why is he so comfortably listing so many details he hates about football and why does he have so many readily available facts like the germ discovery and the associated details? You might say he is widely read and has a good memory. But good memory is S as well. You might say his S must be masculine for good memory, but his N seems quite masculine to me - he will fight hard over a theory.
I don't agree that memory is associated with S. If people do think that S is associated with memory, then what does that imply of N dominants whose minds tend to be wrapped up in the metaphysical? For those types, I would think that their memories are filled with abstract information as opposed to sensory information which would explain why we can identify things that "most people" (the sensors) do not pay much attention to or would not think to associate/consider merely from a sensational standpoint. That doesn't mean that sensory perceptions cannot be recalled strongly or vividly by intuitives, it just takes up less storage in the mind of that type. It's not what preoccupies their mind most of the time.
You're probably trolling, but just in case. The reason this is a great line, is that by saying that line you imply you will get aroused if the bully touches you, that you are intimately interested in them. They, ofcourse, don't want any of that and leave you alone. The reason it's funny, is because of the erotic imagery it conjures.(put the word in a translation engine, deepl for example, and you'll see what it means in your own language)
Basically ST Empericism vs NT Rationalism. His current age may also be a contributing factor to his current perspective due to individuals naturally giving more attention to their Demon function(s) later in life (His Si, which is Empirical). Will need to research his ideas when he was a young man to explore this though.
I just feel like Jordan Peterson is not keeping up here with Fry 😅 They are not on the same wavelength, but at least JP is trying to understand and trying to get there...
Another thought 🤔 Wondering what types would love cobra kai... n understand their life now thru perspectives sooo much more on a deeper level... love those meaningful inspiring shows💞 n what types would love trailer park boys... what types just wants to shutt off that show its way tooo much for them... netflix hit shows
These videos are confusing when you watch them one after the other lol. By this example, I'm 100% Ne-Si like Stephen Fry. The way he talks, thought process and fast paced thinking. However, on the tool shed video, I was not Ne-Si at all and 100% related to the Ni-Se guy who's an INTJ. I could not relate to Si-Ne at all. Like I said conflicting results even with real life examples.
before Dave brought his wife on the channel it was less of a giggle fest but once he brought her on all they havebeen doing is incessantly giggling.......they need to objectively look at their giggling hyena approach on this channel and reevaluate.....long overdue......
@@motherofintuitives hm...:)) this also must sound funny to them as they think practical and not much moral on issues:) Tribal morality is very much subjective and naive as all other introverted approaches. She sounds high on something anyway....
"All I had was the tongue in my head" i think this is a sentiment that so many ENTPs can resonate with and im not sure why exactly, but from an early age language is a very important tool for them.
Its nice to see ENTP examples on here, I'd love to see a wider rage of them depicted on here bc I don't think I've seen many.
ENTP here ... damn you figured it out.
But yes it's true, language is what I would consider my most powerful tool. As a young kid I learned to read by myself. I think ? I only remember one day reading out loud the mustard brand name Amora to the amazement of my father, at the age of four. Then proceeding to read the words "Météo France" on the TV screen. It was like Christmas for my parents, I think they must have thought "We did it, we made an astronaut. *slow clap*" Little did they know they only made a hotel clerk... well, so far.
I played video games and learned more complicated words and big numbers and basic calculations before I got to school by 6.
There I had my first introduction to German and I LOVED it. I loved having to switch to another voice and accent in order to feel like I actually was speaking German.
Years later I don't speak German too well, but the accent can still fool natives, but I focused mostly on English which I do speak perfectly, same in Spanish.
In some ways I added to my own charisma by studying the Japanese language, which I don't understand too well, but whose "etiquette" in listening and actively interacting with another human being can really soften anyone's character. I bow when I greet and thank someone in a very non-asian way but I know people sense good intentions in my body language due to me doing it.
I think it's not necesarily language or skills at language learning that drive us, but more a kind of attachment to the real meaning of symbols.
That's what I was feeling when I heard Stephen talk about his Empyricism " a + a = 2a" yes but no. He MUST have been thinking "you're using symbols to simplify reality, but the addition of these symbols do not equate to something your human mind can actually comprehend.
Hence I did not tell my own story in this post with numbers and facts but with ... feelings. Numbers and facts tell you I'm good at languages. My experience tells me I love language learning and finding the oldest meaning of a word or its root in order to narrow down to the most basic idea it can represent, which if done often enough just outline for you the basic human needs you need to tend to live meaningfully.
I'll add a bit more because I thought of it too late :
What we see in both Stephen and jordan, and even in myself recalling my Si shit, is really the Ne -Ti trying to its thing : grabbing the idea via Ne, and try to do something with it via Ti.
Ne-Ti is really about making tools.
I found a thing, let's do something with it. Everything is a tool. And we're hellbent on proving everything can be.
@블랙나르시사 It's a tricky expression because it looka like an idiom but it isn't. It means pretty much literally "the voice in your head".
Stephen meant : "I didn't feel confident enough to participate in playful fighting and physical games, so I had to show my value through my brains."
1. Human life is full of problems.
2. Language is important to ENTP in order to solve problems. Clarifying presuppositions and talking about how language does (not) work allows that.
Also, language shapes the parameters of the realm of possibilities. It allows to synthetize particular issues in few words.
3. For example let's take :
{etiology, soteriology ontology, axiology}
4. These 4 concepts are extremely valuable to analyze discourse.
This comment is meta.
I'm an ENTP and Stephen Fry is my favourite person in the world.
My ENTP buddy absolutely loves him as well 😄
He’s not my favorite person in the world but I love him lol
"Please describe Ne without saying the word 'Ne.'"
He's really trying to embrace his inferior Si through his studies. But he has trouble narrowing down and focusing on each case.
I need dramamine.
Jordan is a drema queen
Stop making fun of the Canadian accent
STEPHEN FRY! I LOVE HIM
I'm an ENTP and I'd say my thinking is more aligned with empiricism. I'd love to understand why something is the way it is, but even if I never do, it seems silly to argue that something doesn't make sense just because I don't understand it. I do not dictate logic, I merely try to follow it. Idk if that's an Ne "so many options could be true" type of ideology, or if it's feminine intuition/masculine sensory accepts reality more readily, or if it's Ti vs Te deduction, or something else. I think the only way to find out is to study more ENTPs through the empiricist/rationalist lens.
Edit: I had misspelled empiricist
I'm a physics student. The theoretical and the experimental sides are of equal importance as they are both parts of the scientific process. Without either, you wouldn't have physics.
That being said I hate sports; with no exaggeration I would rather be physically ill and bedbound than playing in some sort of sporting tournament. Team sports involving balls are the worst offenders.
Try archery.
That second clip is a good example of keeping in mind: "what are they talking about VS what do they actually do".
Empiricism sounds like Si trial and error.
Guys, that's a *terrible* definition of rationalism vs empiricism.
Rationalism = internal logical consistency. ie if all men are bald, and james is a man, then james must be bald. If all men are not bald, i dont know if james is bald or not.
Empiricism = does it work out there practically. ie external logical consistency - all men i see are bald, james is a man, so james is probably bald.
Rationalism is absolute in so far as the logic is absolute. Empiricism is always probabilistic. Most good science/philosophy/thought has both.
For me this is more Ti vs Te, rather than N vs S, although i understand that by their nature rationalism is theoretical hence lending more to abstraction and N and empiricism requires practical experimentation lending more to S.
That's the definition I agree with
Please do Nassim Taleb! IMO heavy ENTP but also self identified skeptical empiricist. Love what you guys do!
The answer is both. To quote Confucius, "He who learns but does not think, is lost! He who thinks but does not learn is in great danger"
Ne saviour?
very good video, i see the rationalism vs empiricism as definitely being based on a different definition of intuition/sensory than personality theory (or perhaps devised at a time that is specific to that era and/or not inclusive of the "personality theory" use case). as an INTJ, i would say that i fall on the empirical side of the scale. i believe that the sensory (in the case of rationalism vs empiricism, meaning that which exists beyond myself) is certainly what informs knowledge, so i would be an empiricist as i agree that ppl do not innately have knowledge. but the sensory of personality theory is more tied to that which can be observed by the physical senses (sight, touch, etc). in this case, i'm more an intuitive because the concept beyond the sensory is what i concentrate on and value; and then apply elsewhere to replicate the same outcome (hopefully) in a different scenario. to some ppl, it may seem like i'm shooting in the dark, but i'm not (entirely). i am replicating the concept behind a very sensory observation i've seen before and, if i have fully understood the concept and placed the sensory properly in the new experiment, then i should experience the same outcome (although not always). in personality theory, i see Ni Te as a strong combination that enables me to willingly experiment and test my conceptual understanding to further solidify those concepts but i am testing it in empirical conditions
"unpacking three ideas" is NOT Ne. It's making sense of Ne. Which is Ni. Man you got JBP all wrong. But no wonder if your watch all videos at 2x speed, you'd think he's vomiting ideas onto you, when in reality, he's a very structural thinker, narrowing down on the meaning of the overflow of Ti (not necessarily Ne) ideas that he spent his entire life analyzing and juxtaposing.
Yes. Ni wants to stop the Ne train of expansion to process the ideas that came to them and deep dive into them further.
Y'all, if you've never seen Stephen Fry vs Catholic Church debate from 2009, do yourself a favour and watch it. He's absolutely amazing. That debate put me on the path of becoming an atheist back then. I think he was there with another prominent atheist, the writer.... I'm blanking on his name.
The other guy was Christopher Hitchens. I loved the bit when Fry yelled at Ann Widdecombe "Then what are you FOR?"
@@arwuh Yes! Thank you! My favourite part that I semi-quote to this day is "it's like a criminal in court would say "You bring up the burglary, and the murder but you never mentioned the birthday present I gave to my father".
If ur an atheist how do u think the world was created? If u say the big Bang then what caused that to happen..
I love love LOVE both Jordan Peterson and Stephen Fry because they’re willing to explore other viewpoints if the ‘other’ can state their case clearly and logically enough. The interaction between them is so respectful to me as an ENTP, but, perhaps to others, it could possibly feel antagonistic. (I’m married to an ISFJ so this is the only reason I’m even slightly aware that this is possible 😂)
The guy in white is actually a famous Norwegian comedian, more of a physical one compared to Fry, probably an ESFJ.
Their distinction between S and N is always confusing. I don't think they have the distinction properly pinned down. If Fry is N first, then why is he so comfortably listing so many details he hates about football and why does he have so many readily available facts like the germ discovery and the associated details? You might say he is widely read and has a good memory. But good memory is S as well. You might say his S must be masculine for good memory, but his N seems quite masculine to me - he will fight hard over a theory.
I don't agree that memory is associated with S. If people do think that S is associated with memory, then what does that imply of N dominants whose minds tend to be wrapped up in the metaphysical? For those types, I would think that their memories are filled with abstract information as opposed to sensory information which would explain why we can identify things that "most people" (the sensors) do not pay much attention to or would not think to associate/consider merely from a sensational standpoint. That doesn't mean that sensory perceptions cannot be recalled strongly or vividly by intuitives, it just takes up less storage in the mind of that type. It's not what preoccupies their mind most of the time.
Can anyone explain the "don't touch me I'll get a..."
English is my 2nd language but I have lead Ne so I really want to understand the joke 😄
You're probably trolling, but just in case. The reason this is a great line, is that by saying that line you imply you will get aroused if the bully touches you, that you are intimately interested in them. They, ofcourse, don't want any of that and leave you alone.
The reason it's funny, is because of the erotic imagery it conjures.(put the word in a translation engine, deepl for example, and you'll see what it means in your own language)
@@mieralunarlunishion omG the word is actually erection kekw
@블랙나르시사 ur taking it too seriously, Dave only said that to lead on the joke.
@@mwswm8944 That’s just Dave’s sarcasm
He is gay.
rationalism - Ti to Ne - intps,ex - Descartes
empiricism - Ne to Ti - entps, ex - Hume
Finally another ENTP vid !! More more more 🙂... yes I know i have plenty of growth to do. Any other ENTPs ??
Adam savage he's amazing
I like the term:
"Vetting."
Jordan Peterson is a caricature of a human.
Give Jordan Peterson some draaah-mah-mine.
Sometimes I wish there was a double thumbs up available.
Basically ST Empericism vs NT Rationalism.
His current age may also be a contributing factor to his current perspective due to individuals naturally giving more attention to their Demon function(s) later in life (His Si, which is Empirical).
Will need to research his ideas when he was a young man to explore this though.
The only reason anyone is “flushing ten times… fifteen times” is because Jordan Peterson just keeps circling the drain.
drehmah
I think it's a Canadian thing. They pronounce so many words "wrong" 😂
@@andreaholliday6845 woot u tookin aboot
Please excuse the cracked pottery. A big gust of hot wind came through here last night.
All MM ENTPs i've saw do all have this weird lizard like tick with their tongue.
What do you mean by a lizard like tick.
I just feel like Jordan Peterson is not keeping up here with Fry 😅 They are not on the same wavelength, but at least JP is trying to understand and trying to get there...
Another thought 🤔
Wondering what types would love cobra kai... n understand their life now thru perspectives sooo much more on a deeper level... love those meaningful inspiring shows💞
n what types would love trailer park boys... what types just wants to shutt off that show its way tooo much for them... netflix hit shows
Jordan Peterson rocks!!
No, I am an INTJ
These videos are confusing when you watch them one after the other lol. By this example, I'm 100% Ne-Si like Stephen Fry. The way he talks, thought process and fast paced thinking. However, on the tool shed video, I was not Ne-Si at all and 100% related to the Ni-Se guy who's an INTJ. I could not relate to Si-Ne at all. Like I said conflicting results even with real life examples.
OMG IM SO EARLY 😭😭😭❤️❤️❤️ Dave and Shan if you see this, I made an edit of you guys on my channel, I hope you see it, I love you guys 🤣🤣🤣❤️❤️❤️
I watched it, that's awesome ! I love how you're making OP an SF thing 😂
I thought Draaah-mah was a name
I feel funny about him and who hates football??? What the heck??
I don't get the funny part of any of their videos! do they think comedy is about the comedian just laughing at everything?
before Dave brought his wife on the channel it was less of a giggle fest but once he brought her on all they havebeen doing is incessantly giggling.......they need to objectively look at their giggling hyena approach on this channel and reevaluate.....long overdue......
@@motherofintuitives hm...:)) this also must sound funny to them as they think practical and not much moral on issues:) Tribal morality is very much subjective and naive as all other introverted approaches. She sounds high on something anyway....
finallyyyy ENTP