Zwift VS The Sufferfest (What's Best for Indoor Cycling?)
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- čas přidán 3. 02. 2021
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Zwift VS The Sufferest, which one is best for indoor cycling? In this video, I will share my 4 top points on this subject including the biggest mistake cyclists make with indoor training. We'll also be discussing Zwift racing and Suff workouts and plans for improving cycling performance.
Julian's story: vimeo.com/469400918
#Zwift #sufferfest #cycling #indoor - Sport
Details to get your 30 day free Wahoo SUF Code:
Download The Wahoo SUF Training App for iOS, macOS or Windows.
Create your account to start your 14-day free trial.
Go to Manage Account and select the monthly option.
Enter the promo code CAMSUF30 to get a free month in addition to your 14-day free trial. (Note: You’ll have to add payment information for the code to activate but you won’t be charged if you cancel before the end of the promotional period.)
Just some extra information: you can not use the extra free trial when I pay via apple payments.
I’m running into the same problem. What do we do then?
@@regilfrias63 You just can't use the code and free trial. It is what it is.
@@psnSupergrobi10 You have to cancel through apple and resubscribe through sufferfest website.
It seems CAMSUF30 coupon code no longer works
Hey Cam, a fan from Italy here! I've been typing "zwift vs SUF" on YT for a month now, I was quite pleased when I read the title of you last upload!! Thank you very much, great and useful content!
Haha nice one thanks for sharing mate and also supporting my work
Came here for the review title, but got excellent coaching material as well. Thank you!
Regarding the focus on high intensity with Sufferfest, they've taken a huge leap forward last month with the introduction of the 'inspiration' workouts, which are about 30 cycling docu's for recovery and zone 2 workouts. A normal week for me has 2 HIIT and 2/3 recovery/zone2 workouts. So I'd say, they've fixed their problem of having to prescribe workouts at reduced intensity or putting the focus too much on HIIT.
And the addition of strength and yoga in the plans is a huge plus!
I was going to comment on this. Lengths go from approximately 20 minutes to two hours. Lots of external video added. Two videos I would like to point out are "Half The Road" which is about the disparity in Women's Professional Cycling (watch the intro for HHNF and as where are the buses) and "I Want To Ride" which is a documentary on Lael Wilcox's attempt to set a new FKT for Tour Divide in 2019.
Awesome review Cam.👍🏻 I was only thinking about SUF last week. Thank you sharing your thoughts.
Cheers mate, enjoy!
Mate, great video! Couldn‘t agree more. I just recently bought an indoor trainer and while comparing Zwift and SUF, the trainings + the added value of off bike training in SUF did win me over. Additional, may be because I’m in my mid forties, this whole game character was pretty annoying to me, since I like being in the zone while riding blending out the daily struggles. Anyway, I do enjoy your content a lot. Keep the good work! Best wishes from Switzerland ✌️
Cheers mate, I am with you on the game character. Good for racing but not training.
I also subscribe to both, Cam, for pretty much the same reasons. One thing you didnt mention is the 4DP element of Wahoo Suf, which after doing the Full Frontal workout, shows your strengths and weaknesses. Then recommends appropriate workouts to work on. It feels like having my own personal cycling coach. Love the channel 👍
I used both before going onto one of your training plans. Following that, I cancelled my Zwift subscription and purchased a yearly SUF. I think that settles the score. Great video as always Cam.
Nice one Matthew, thanks for sharing
Thanks Cam, love your channels. Just gave The SUF a crack based on this video and I LOVE IT! I’ve been Zwifting for about a year and got serious about training in Zwift recently. The SUF is a totally different ball game. I just did The Attacker and just love the platform. I still love Zwift but I find I get too caught up in the bunch rides, rather than focusing on my training. I’ve got a technical hiccup, which I’m sure I will sort out. That said, Zwift just worked out of the box with the Magene, there seems to be an issue with my ANT+ dongle and cadence sensor. Not asking for tech support here, just providing feedback. Thanks again and keep up the great work.
Awesome Glen, thanks for sharing on the thread mate!
Thanks for this. I am just now considering this very issue.
I only train in GTA V, helps me get my inner-city FTP up.
🤣🤣🤣
I find GTA V is the cheapest option, but has some limitations, + i find the GTA mod buggy at the moment - eg it didn't save my 50k loop on the weekend. I have used zwift for over year, (level 30). I did the zwift 12 week build me up program which definitely worked, but i don't know if that was the program or just more time on the bike. the program def. challenged me. Group rides with the bots is good as well. The gameplay of zwift is lots of fun and engaging. OTOH, GTA V has guns....
I've seen a much bigger progression in FTP using Sufferfest. Zwift gave me motion sicknes. Great video thanks.
Great comparison review!!! 🙌🏽🍻
Cheers mate 👍
I'm a long time sufferfest user. I love how the workouts get every last bit of power out of you. Two upgrades I hope they make are 1) being able to do the same workout with friends and b) a better workout builder. But it's a great product and the videos are great.
Nice one Doug, thanks for sharing
I agree, they really know how to push you past what you thought possible and just before you collapse off the bike.
trick question, the answer is TrainerRoad
Good app, I agree.
I agree - swift workouts are odd. I use TrainerRoad because 1) workouts/plans are challenging, and 2) I can export the workouts outdoors so I can use it all-year round (can’t ride outdoors in winter in Canada)
Wow. What an amazing video. I have abandoned zwift and re-signed with TR. Agree with you on the boring/dull interface but have attained great progress through it.
Cheers Juan
I agree with you Cam, Zwfit is good for the racing's social aspect, but the training plans are tricky. I heard of Sufferfest last year on this channel and tried it out... i'm addicted to it now, and have just started the Mile Century training today.
I also like the 4DP Test on the Suf, it is deadly, but you get that satisfaction that you did your best.
For a runner like myself, Suf has made my transition to a tri-athlete mych easier. Sometimes I go out on the weekend to just have a long ride, end up making a very long ride but don't feel awful afterwards
Nice one mate, thanks for sharing on the thread.
Thank you Cam for a very good video. I train a lot indoor and have used both zwift and SUF for Training. I agree an find the training structure better on SUF. What I didn`t like are the often very old videos in the SUF app. I find they could keep the videos up to date.
For a newcomer these videos can look outdated, but for a user that have been using the sufferfest pre-app (while they were just videos), they are are magic!
@@davidmcquillen555 I might try SUF again because the zwift trainings are structured a bit bizarr. And as Cam said a bit boring.
I have been a Sufferfest supporter since before they had UCI sanctioned videos. I loved the video workouts as they developed and still used them when I was traveling before Covid . For a while I was also hooked on riding with TrainerRoad and Sufferfest videos integrated. It was super as you could integrate your FTP into the sufferfest intervals. I switched over to Zwift as I enjoyed the social aspect of it and as I wasn't training with a objective in mind. It was more interesting. While I have never tried the new Sufferfest Wahoo interface it sounds like it is great. Much more holistic in terms of building a training program. I'll have to give it a try.
Nice one Shawn, thanks for sharing on the thread.
It's been a while since I used Suf, great platform and good to see they are still building on the great platform. Surprised you did not really mention the 4DP, but I guess that really is allot going on with that in itself. For all those Zwift video game players out there, you can run both at once on the same PC and still accumulate XP etc whilst doing Suferfest. Just use 2 ant dongles to the 1 computer and run both apps (best to download Suf videos though).
I use two computers but otherwise same idea. Really like the footage and music in The SUF, even though I have seen many of the workouts many, many times. Also, everyone occasionally needs a good flogging from The Minions and GvA.
Me too. Except I use ant on PC and Bluetooth on phone for Zwift companion.
Really good episode Cam... I use both Zwift & SUF.... :)
Cheers Andy
I used to have suffer fest back in 2014, back when you needed to , er, torrent the videos and drag and drop them into the window to play. I did tour sufferlandria 2014 and 15. When they introduced the monthly cost I changed to zwift and was a founder member of that. Been thinking more and more about trying SUF again and your code will help with my decision, thanks cam!
Wow, you have been there from the start! They have an AWESOME new workout coming next week. Stay tuned.
I thought I would hate the SUF subscription model, but it's great with all the new content. I do miss Rubber Glove. It was a great workout, not just a test (and I liked racing Tommy V, too).
Ok ok, I'm back. Just did goat tonight. Baaaaa
Great comparison. I haven’t been on Sufferfest since they stopped working with TrainerRoad. Also haven’t been serious about racing for a few years either. May have to pause the Zwift and go back to the ‘fest for 44 days....
Thank you Sir David.. I may need to dig out my Sufferlandrian Darkside National Kit and check it all out...
IWBMATTKYT
Great vid and well presented. I'm with a lot of the other posters on here. I looked at Zwift and The Sufferfest, but found Trainerroad just worked best for me by far. Great plans and amazing for building fitness faster than I expected. Maybe I'm lucky that I don't find the interface boring. I get really into listening to music or watching random videos while doing a longer workout and TR notifications come up non-intrusively when needed.
Obviously, it's a personal thing. If TR wasn't around, SUF would probably be the way I'd go.
I was down here looking for the TR comment haha. I’ve never gotten to use Sufferfest but TR is a game changer.
@@loganmcpherson9047 Yes indeed. I just did McAdie +1 this morning and it kicked my ass all over. I nearly bombed a bunch of times, but struggled through to the end and feel great about it. 90 minutes of proper hard work that I know for sure will pay off on the road.
Love TR. Netflix, youtube, music, whatever. Get your head down and work hard
Thanks for sharing on the thread mate
Great video as always. I agree that cycling in Suf keeps you focused and frankly more challenging. Zwift becomes a competition even in training mode. Both have great benefits but for serious improvement a structured plan on the SuF is best.
Nice one Zane thanks for sharing mate 👍
I don't care less about indoor training because I ride outdoors in Sydney, no matter what the weather, but I watched this simply for the presentation skills. No 'umms, no ahhs', just perfectly delivered content
Thanks Paolo, much appreciated. Cam
Hey Cam, great vid mate but if you are talking with your SUF mates please ask them to spend some of their Wahoo money on building the Apple TV app! Many of the guys I know that train inside use Apple TV (cost effective, works, 4K and no sweat on the laptop). So for me to use Suf in addition to the extra subscription I need to change my set-up...
Very good point Anthony, I know they are working on it.
Great videos! I think I’ll get the Whahoo system. I think you touched on the Z2 as being 65% of your FTP if your conditioned, but while showing us all the workouts they were intervals. The Z2 stuff you talked about should be long 1+ hour steady state efforts? I keep hearing about people needing to do more Z2 less interval stuff. Thanks for your help. I’ll try searching your videos for more info as well. Thanks
At the end, Zwift is a game and SUF is a gym. As a former basketball player, the analogy would be scrimmage vs practice. Zwift is where you play with the opportunity for improvement. SUF is for focused workouts
Great way to put in Jon!
no, zwift has training plans too, not just free ride, group rides, and races
@@clydea.hutchisoniv5742 Yes, but its not the focus sellling point and the pre-made training plans are not made too nicely compared to suf.
@@geisslersonMC you can make your own or import plans too
My kickr came with a year free of suf. Currently doing couch to crusher work out plan. It is great during the NA winter.
Thanks for sharing mate interesting to hear
5:02 I like how the dog is enjoying this :D
Just got my first trainer and looking forward to suffering!
Awesome, enjoy Vincent
Well said Cam.
I agree wholeheartedly about the video. I've initially tried a Zwift FTP builder series and didn't like it after 2 workouts. The SufferFest is much better in structured workouts.
Incorporating Zwift for group rides and some of the outdoor ones make it interesting.
Agree Ray!
I love the way you checked how many fingers you were holding up at the start - better safe than sorry eh?! 👌😉😂
Haha
Great video mate, thank you for the info for sure. Does it matter if any of your clients are based in the states?
Cheers James! About 30% of RCA members are US based. That's why the pricing is in USD. For contact, our mornings / your evenings work best typically. We also have an RCA coach in the UK now, so truly 24/7. Love to have you onboard. Cam
Hi Cam. First time I visit your page and found the content pretty useful. Quick question, when I tried to enter the code it did not allow me to do it. Any thoughts? Cheers
Been using SF for a couple months now and seeing some real results. Another big plus of SF, which I don't think you mentioned, is that the SF workouts can be downloaded and therefore don't require constant internet streaming. This is ideal for training in those secluded 'pain-caves' (like mine) with no internet.
Good pint Stuart, thanks for sharing on the thread
Supposedly an all new SUFFERFEST will be released on 28-Sep. Will also run on Android. Looking forward to your review of it.
For zwift, I've been making my own workouts, and been doing it for quite some time now.
Great part of the functionality for sure
@@CamNicholls ive even started writing the programming within the files.
Good comparison, what I missed is the 'power' of the 4DP-testing. In all other training platforms but XERT all power zones are estimated from CP20 power.
For me: Training on SUF during late autumn, winter and early spring, racing/having fun outside :-)
Thanks for sharing mate. As a coach I am not a huge fan of their 4DP. I find many people are quite intimidated by it. Yes, they may do it once, but it's not practical to maintain for many.
@@CamNicholls i agree its unpleasant and you feel really used afterwards, but a 'real' CP30 or CP20 with preloading as defined by Hunter/Coggan is rather ugly as well.
Imho all those not too demanding ramptests are more pleasant but less accurate.
Could not agree more. SUF is the way to go. Previously the workouts were all basically 100% but a lot of their new no vid workouts are much more reasonable for building base or higher volume weeks with some non-murderous intensity
Cam - can you review and possibly compare Rouvy too? I'm an older rider and have found your regimes very useful. Three of us ride in Rouvy and find ourselves over competing a lot despite agreeing to ride Z2 to improve aerobic capacity. GReat channel - thanks
Cheers Norman I’ll have a good look into it 👍
Hey Cam, Great review Vid! Will your CAMSUF30 work on the new SYSTM training app? As I am looking to go with your suggestion of running both Zwift & SYSTM. look forward to your reply. :)
It’s expired, sorry mate.
I do agree with you like Supperfest better
Trainerroad + Zwift
I find trainer road boring personally. Great interface and plans though
Agree with both of you. I use zwift for the entertainment, but TR for the plans.
Interesting Cam .
I’ve had better success in fitness from downloading workouts from Training Peaks, Zwift is okay but I do find myself feeling board. Will give this a try was looking at trainer road. Thanks for your input will give it a try 👌🏻
Nice one Gary, good luck with the training
Wow I don't know what to think. I just started back cycling last June after 20 years off. Am 66 now and did the 4DP test and ftp was 164watts. 12 weeks later following sufferfest did another 4DP test and ftp was 184watts. 8 weeks latter did the half Monty and ftp was 202 watts. And that is where I am currently. I hear you say an ucconditioned rider starting off at 250watts. Damn I must be awful.
Thank you for the code! I'm a pretty novice recreational road rider. I've tried SUF and Zwift... and I'm sticking with SUF!
Thanks for this! How does Sufferfest compare with Today's Plan's workout/plans?
Today’s Plan is not interactive with videos, music etc. it’s only workout structures that you can use outside or import into Zwift or something like that.
The answer as always is... it depends. I raced on Zwift way back before it became trendy. Those in the bike club at the time deemed it a waste of time, but of course, they were all used to mag trainers, not these new fangled computer controlled gadgets. Find a good crew on Zwift and the racing can be epic. (Cof, Team ODZ, cof...). I've done eFondo series and all those things too. It's good fun when you can't get out on the road. Zwift workouts are meh from where I stand because for training Sufferfest rocks the house. I've got on the floor halfway through the Omnium and couldn't get back up. There's been no hurling, but may have come close once or twice. You can't workout like that on the road and Zwift fails to motivate like Sufferfest.
But wait, there's more. Veloreality for those times the weather sucks or you've broken your hand and you want to ride your favourite training hill, maybe Alpe D'Huez. or any of the classic climbs. I got very strong doing repeats of virtual Alpe D'Huez that time I broke my hand. And unlike the road, the trainer is relentless, you can't dive off onto the not so steep part of the road. You must maintain cadence. You must control your effort. As soon as you get sloppy, you get punished. So it's good for drumming in discipline and technique.
Horses for courses. Whichever way you go, its all win I tells ya.
the weight mistake HAHAHAH... Great way to start the vid HAHAHA
haha, cheers
What is your opinion of FULGAZ?
I personally prefer it to Zwift, just because of the reality of the video footage. Training programs are good and they now have Bunch rides you can join as well. On a personal note I would rather support Aussie businesses. It’s just me.
Nice one Ken, thanks for sharing. I have not used it in depth. I gave it a go some time ago and quickly transitioned to The Suf. Who by the way are HQ'd in Tasmania! I may need to give it another shot.
My question to you is if you had to live with only 1 app which one would you choose and why? For me, I will never be a racer as I just want to get faster on the bike so I am a little confused on which app will give the best experience.
Thank you and I love your channel!!
Thanks for the channel support, Matthew...I would go The Suff because I mainly like indoor riding for getting stronger for outdoor riding! If I loved eRacing, that may be a different story.
Matthew, I was in a similar position to you. I tried the free trials on both SUF & Zwift. It very quickly became obvious that for me at least SUF was way way better than Zwift. Been on SUF for a few months now and love it.
@@johnkemp3592 I am leaning that way my friend. The only thing that makes me want to not go with SUF is that 4DP test. I have done it once and has nightmares since 😂
@@Raptors0524 Ha Ha, yes understandable. Half Monty is far less intimidating if you can't face Full Frontal and still gives three important numbers plus estimates of the others. If you haven't already, check out Joyride and Team Scream - they are so much fun and awesome workouts. At the other end of the scale, Recharger is terrific at reminding you why you love cycling.
I started of Suffer fest, made big gains, though I'd give Zwift racing a go, loved it and gave up Suff, now find it's all I want to do. Fatigue has set in, I'm out of condition so I'm going back to Suff to realign my riding, I agree, training on Zwift is no fun.
Totally agree, if you want to get fitter..... use sufferfest if you want something for races, use zwift. I use sufferfest and think it's brilliant and good value. I don't think you mentioned the rider profile and strengths and weaknesses? I found the latter very useful.
Yes, that is a good pointer. So many things to mention in both apps. Both great tools.
Cam...you need to look into Veleton. Best race sim I've ever experienced. Two to three races a week some of the best training I've ever had indoors
Will do 👍
@@CamNicholls I might hit up the dev team for you too. It's not a training program but it feels just like racing in my opinion. I use it primarily for threshold sessions though.
Hi there, would have been great if you would have mentioned Tacx (Garmin) and the training programme they have vs SUF
I’ll look into it
Cheers for the extra 30 day code👍
👍
Interesting that Cam didn’t mention, nor recommend. the SF Full Frontal. I did the 14-days trial training program, which concluded with the Half-Monty. I then followed up with the 6-weeks Kickstarter training program. That ends with the Full Frontal 4DP assessment workout, which I did recently. That workout uses the 4DP results from the Half-Monty as a guideline but it was absolutely horribly BRUTAL to me!!! I don’t know if I did it wrong (wrong pacing) or it was a bad day or I’m just too chicken but it was so deadly to me that I waved the white flag half-way through. 😂 Gonna retry after another workout program. (The 4DP results from the half- monty seem to work just fine for me for now.)
And by the way, thanks for promo code, Cam! 👍
I don’t recommend it mate because of what you said. It’s not practical to do ongoing and test improvements. Half Monty is your way forward.
@@CamNicholls Thanks Cam, I also had been wondering why you only mentioned the ramp test and Half Monty. I agree with D L , Full Frontal is a brutal test.
The thing I like about Zwift is that I can get a training plan from my coach / club / whatever and transfer them into custom workouts. I can then choose to do them indoor or outdoor, with or without friends, etc.
Yes that is a good feature for external plans
Living in a country with a seemingly never-ending lockdown & poor weather conditions Zwift is an invaluable tool as it allows us to ride/race and interact with others.
The Suff is a fantastic training tool but for me its tough to train long term without putting all that training towards something.
Yes it’s a good point. That’s how I conclude kinda
@@CamNicholls I did catch the Suff would complement E racing etc totally agree. Let's face it both are fantastic as they both motivate people to stay fit and active :)
Team Scream is one of the best indoor rides ever! The bat will destroy you. Hell Hath no Fury is deplorably old school Sufferfest and will crush your soul. Long time user of Sufferfest, now Wahoo Suf. The advances of training has helped me understand that not every session should destroy you, but still fun to see how big a puddle you can get.
Haha well said Ken
I think SUF is for if you want off the shelf pre-made programs. But if you have a coach giving you detailed plans, then you just import it into Zwift
Yes, that is a good point. Although it does get a little boring with the imported programs I find.
@@CamNicholls I’d only import what my coach gives me on TrainingPeaks
Can you do casual rides on Wahoo like you can Zwift or is Wahoo training plans only?
Thank you for the video. I'm surprised you didn't mention the 4DP that SF use to set the levels for their workouts, in my opinion, far superior to using an FTP value.
I find that test too daunting for most and not practical to maintain long term. Well done on getting through it.
@@CamNicholls that’s the reason why I said I was moving back to Zwift. That test will give you nightmares 😂🤣
4DP in my calendar for tomorrow :) end of 6w PowerBuild plan - having done the 4DP once already, sweating a bit in advance :) hope for some improved numbers at the end of it. Greetings from Europe
True, 4DP is a beast, but that is what sets SUF apart. Especially true if you have a power profile skewed towards 20 min efforts, or strongly skewed in another direction. Really makes the workouts more personalized.
Hi Cam, I did reach a plateau ( and legs were done) as well on SUF after 2x 12 was program back to back. Any advice how to adapt training program ? Could that that be the topic of a new video...👍🍀
I would be assessing your aerobic fitness first and taking it from there. Too much trainer work also impacts variation which is key to getting stronger.
Can different question from different video
Which sqlab saddle are you using
612 carbon?
Can’t recall off the cuff. Video will go live on the Road Cycling Academy channel on Wed regarding this.
I have been of Suf for 6 weeks. FTP started at 245 its now at 282.
However I have now moved across to Zwift as its just more fun.
There are plenty of workouts in Zwift to get you fitter and stronger but you can also just ride and have fun.
Suf works but gets a bit boring
Yes I hear, using them both is ideal
Oh and also lost 7kg so far.
W/kg was 2.45 is now 3.16.
More weight to lose..... Maybe 3.5 is possible
Sufferfest looks interesting, but it seems there is no integration with Garmin to enable you to ride a workout outside, which is possible on trainerroad. Bit of dealer beaker for me, as when the weather permits, its good to get out into the real world.
Thanks for sharing Mel, makes sense
Do you think the usefulness of the apps like Zwift and Sufferfest are diminished if you are using a spin bike that doesn't automatically adjust to the terrain of the virtual course? I don't have a regular bike, so getting a smart trainer doesn't make sense to me and those smart indoor cycles are out of my league, price-wise. I'm considering a Schwinn IC4.
Nope, you get the structure the intervals. Perfect!
I ended up going with suf as I don't need an internet connection to do the workouts
That’s a good point
So, is the annual tour of Sufferlandria done? Kind of a grassroots big deal many have sweated toward. Asking from USA to AUSTRALIA back to USA as well... that’s how the information loop works this way.
It's approaching mate. Starting in Feb I believe.
Yep, starts Feb 14th with a lovely Joyride+Cobbler double header 🙂
I have a question regarding Zone 2 Endurance ride. If my heartrate is now strong for a Zone 2 Endurance ride at 65% of Ftp with little drift after 2 hours ride. Should I increase the level of ftp, to may be 70%?
I would retest your FTP first, but yes, no harm going to 70%. I was just sharing a general rule.
@@CamNicholls thank you.
What do you think about trainer road in comparison for training?
Boring. Don’t mean to be harsh because the interface is great and so are the workouts but Suf is far superior
"This guy's a dickhead!" always cracks me up.
Well that made me feel awesome. 250 watt ftp for an uncondionted rider? My ftp is 200 and I thought I was in pretty decent shape for 56 years old. I guess not. I know it's just an example, and that 200 watts is pretty low for an ftp, but still, a bit demoralizing. Anyway, thanks for the 30 day code. I've been using Zwift for a little while now and have been curious about Suf, so I'll give them a try.
Sorry mate, didn’t mean to offend. As an FYI - I had a 60 year old go from 199 to 251 watt FTP in 8 weeks just recently! So there’s plenty of time post 50 to have massive improvements. Good luck.
@@CamNicholls You didn't offend me Cam, no worries. I guess I just need to put in some hard work and see what happens. Maybe a few months of Suf will do the trick, we'll see.
@@jshepard5840 Good to hear mate...don't forget - you can always try my program too. Over 50% of the RCA athletes in Uplevel are 50 + / male so I know the blend of rest, recovery, and HIT well for your demographic! Cheers, Cam
@@CamNicholls I've seen other coaches take on cyclists as projects to promote their coaching methods or certain training products. I'd be up for being a guinea pig for that kind of thing. I used to be 350 pounds, right now I'm 220 with a goal of 190 or maybe a little less. We could do a project to get me to my goal weight while increaing my ftp. I'm sure you're really busy, but it's an idea.
What's your thoughts on the 4DP test Mr Nicholls?
Too extreme. Not sustainable long term to assess progression. Half Monty is a better option for that.
@@CamNicholls Interesting! Did the 4DP at the start of my Sufferfest journey and am scheduled to do the half Monty on Friday. Very curious to see what the result will be.
For the guy you showed who's z2 had massively improved: is that just a result of doing loads of z2 rides?
Mostly Z2 work on the trainer, consistent pedal stroke. Some sub threshold and tempo work too. Cheers, Cam
Have you tried trainerroad ?
Yes, personally found it boring. Amazing interface and plans but couldn’t get into it
Have you looked at Trainerroad as an alternative?
Yes I have used it. Great plans and interface but found it quite boring
I like to embrace the active meditation, focus on the numbers and be in the moment
What 4 parts? That must have been hard for you;)
Cheers from Germany
haha, yes, although this one was a bit more of a presentation!
@@CamNicholls thanks mate I apriciate your videos a lot! As a video idea for indoor training maybe you can comment on the cheaper bike trainers one can get from Amazon. To use Zwift or Suff, i can't affort investing in a silent but expensive indor trainer... just as an idea. Nice weekend and happy rides
@@davidalhoff7190 Cheers mate, appreciate the suggestion. I have a couple of bikes to build first but if an opportunity arrises I'll go for it.
Possible to get an updated code?
Sorry mate, the Suff made it expire. Nothing I can do from my end.
This would be much more useful if you also compared to TrainerRoad.
I find that app boring. Sorry to say. Great interface and plans but boring
Yes it is boring but you just need to work out your own entertainment and then it’s great.
Does this still work now they have changed to what they call system?
Code expired earlier this year. Sorry Andrew.
@@CamNicholls No probs. Do you still stand by the sufferfest plans over the zwift plans
I subscribe to Sufferfest, Zwift, and TrainerRoad (don't tell my wife), and if I had to choose just one, TR has my vote. Zwift is great for races and group rides, but the plans are for crap and their workouts are sketchy and hard to select/navigate. Sufferfest has good workouts and videos, and their plans are solid. TR, while being "boring" because you are just staring at numbers, has more workouts than you can use in a lifetime and excellent plans.
Honestly, if I am doing a hard workout in Zwift or Sufferfest, I'm just staring at the numbers anyway and could give a damn about the videos or graphics.
haha, thanks for sharing Robert. Cam
Why calculate z2 at all.. just ride to feel. I'm told by many people to ride at a pace where you feel like you're working kinda hardish but could go all day if you had to.
I just posted a video on my ftp gains from TrainerRoad doing Sweet Spot Base Low Vol 1, only 3.5 hours a week. I wonder how it compares to Sufferest?
I also use Zwift but just for an occasional free ride, Zone 2, and for the RACING. Love races.
Interesting to hear, thanks for sharing mate.
250 ftp for an unconditioned rider?
I was just pulling a number out of a hat. Didn’t mean to offend
@@CamNicholls not at all, just making a dick head comment, love your videos thank you!
Cool, but where ‘a Neill? 😆
Road Cycling Academy channel
Is trainerroad chopped liver?
Nah, great interface and training plans but quite boring I find
Answer: Rouvy
Have tried sufferfest twice now and must say the guy’s that programmed has no idea what they doing when navigation around in it it’s just make you crazy
Interesting to hear that feedback, I personally find it easy to use.
You missed the best one of all.. trainerroad
Yes, I have used it. I find it quite boring all round, personally. Plans are good and interface is amazing, but too boring for my personal liking.
@@CamNicholls it misses the interaction of zwift or sufferfest; but for some people what detracts you from the focus on the workout, is exactly why some people like that focus and avoid distraction of watching a virtual world / video. Personally, I liked that TR mostly focuses on 1 particular training zone per workout, rather than kitchen sink workouts from zwift.
@@MichaelBoogerd exactly why I love it. Personalities, I guess. Never get bored with TR
SUF user here, tried Zwift and it is more of a game for me - yes you can create the workout in zwift but it was quite boring to be honest and not engaging. I used Zwift mainly for racing and after a while I just stopped it completely as for me, I get more out of SUF.
Right about the "game" thought, but the virtual racing has been great. I got hooked up with a team, and have been able to get in work I never would have outdoors. Now I really have a reason to do the SUF workouts1
Hopefully you can notice me and maybe you can help me build my own bike please
250 Watt FTP as an unconditioned rider? Huh? Has that actually ever happened before?
Sorry it was just an example
@@CamNicholls I know...I was kidding. I can register 200 on the ramp test - but my conditioning is nowhere near good enough to maintain that for an hour.
Riding with extra kg........welcome to my world!! Haha
Haha 👍
I want to meet these unconditioned riders who have a 250 watt ftp.