KEF KC92 Subwoofer Review with iBX
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- čas přidán 10. 09. 2024
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To be clear, I'm not sure if this does have a fan inside near the heatsink, but I was able to hear a whirring sound even when no sound was being played out of it. Hopefully, someone from KEF can chime in on this.
The more I think of it, it might just be audible hiss from the amp causing what I thought was a whirring sound. In that case, it could possibly be an air leak.
do a Noctua mod to it
Not sure but there may have been an issue with the unit? Was it a review unit? I have the KF-92 (seems identical to KC-92?) and it does not make that noise. 10:09
@@nikto34 I can't tell
There are no fans inside the cube - www.audioholics.com/subwoofer-reviews/kef-kc92/KC92xrayvision.jpg/image_large
It sounds like coil whine and it would make sense that if power is increased or degreased it will change.
Living in a condo I needed a compact yet capable subwoofer. I was able to purchase two of these subs and I couldn't be happier for both music and home theatre. It's nice to see a company like KEF take the compact subwoofer market seriously because not everyone is able to use a larger subwoofer never mind two. The max I have every driven my the two subs has been 105 decibels and thankfully the DSP didn't curtail the bottom most frequencies to gain the extra output. Thankfully my Anthem AVM 70 has dual subwoofer outputs and the ARC software did a great job ironing out my room problems.
Try 4 of them and be 4 times as happy!
@@michael-4k4000 In the future.
How is going with the neighbours?
Aren't these too noisy for a condo?
@@nicoloserri6071 Thankfully I haven't had any issues but I also make sure to run the system at times when I know people aren't sleeping or waking up.
Swear I thought the title said “IBS”. 😂
Good video, Joe!
That's because they hit so hard they rattle your innerds
Erin, we are excited to see your review on this hopefully. If you could include more comparisons in your video, that would be awesome too.
@@MrJhardencdj may be caused by Infrasonic Wave which is no good for helth
Had two of the older version without trigger input.
Sonically good subs, however, the missing trigger input sucked.
The sub output on my pre-pro had to be turned up to max. to wake up the sub.
Finally I replaced the KC92‘s by two B&W DB2D‘s. It was a huge step up!
I freaking love my KF92 subwoofer! No complaints so far. I have the first revision of this subwoofer paired with a B&W ASW610XP sub. Mine doesn't have the squeal noise yours does, but I've heard it before on a few D-Class amps... So I think it's to do with that. Also I've not heard any discernible delay between this sub and my B&W! I'm little jealous the new revision gets the P-Flex and USB-C Service port as the only way to 'Service' mine is via plugging it into another KEF speaker (I believe the LS50) but thankfully I've not needed to so far.
me much exp with audio but didnt had many big expensive subs, made total sense. thanks!
I was thinking that KEF would have ported all the tech in KC62 into the KC92, but not quite. Especially when it comes to an aluminum inclosure. I think it would have been more interesting product if KEF made a KC72 or 82 out of aluminum. Great review, btw.
Really Good Review @joentell I like the amount of detail information without making the video too long. It’s a really nice looking sub, great looking design. 11Hz is really something from such a small cube.
I needed to get the review done and tried not to overthink the talking part.
Solid review Joe!
Nice measurements, it’s a solid living room sub where people like things that are not obstructive and look nice whilst being able to perform. Had a couple of them and they rock. Also with wireless transmitter that’s probably one of the best on the market. But you can get better at lower price if size is not the issue. I’ve changed them for two Arendal 1723 s1 subs which are twice as big with greater extension and no “ibs” trickery. I didn’t like the idea that response curve will change depending on spl making room correction potentially useless
Another interesting fact for this sub.... Kef offers a kit that allows you to stack 2 or 3 of these subs on top of each other. Two subs stacked is equivalent to a Blade Meta 1 in output and distortion... Could you imagine making a psuedo-Blade using a stack of two or three of these subs DSP'd to integrate with a Reference 1 or even an R3 Meta? ORRR you can get even nuttier and stack two or three (depending on speaker height) under a Ci3160REFM or a Ci3160RLM? You'd have a full-range setup with near-zero SBIR that's also doubling as your LFE.
Yowza.
Great review!! It’s a shame about the delay. Does the KC62 have that same delay?
On a separate note, I also appreciate your guidelines. While they are common sense and should be the way everyone commenting behaves, it’s not always the case. 🍻
Wow! Excellent critical points....thanks❤!
Wow.... so basically for HT, just one sub has the ability to play at reference level.. For music, it may be limited depending on the multi-tone distortion. So dang cool.
Can you please do a comparison with B&W DB1D?
Please help me out. I want to buy the Best bookshelf speaker under 2000 US dollars.
Klipsch 9s , sonus Faber lumina 2, q acoustics 5020, kef r3 meta , warfdale linton 85 ?
We don't get arindal 1723 or 1961 in my country. Any other speaker that you would recommend under or a little over 2000 dollars ?
Interesting point is how smaller unit can deliver lower than 20Hz signal? and whether thoese infrasound part has helth concern?
great point with the delay for the high pass output. i would rather have the phase knob on a subwoofer to apply to the output instead, usually those need the delay.
by the way on the dynamic eq, it is perfect for multiple subwoofers. if you get four separate 10" subwoofers they will not play 11hz this kef one, especially at low volume.
Great video!
Nice overview. I like that you test the delay time. Question: which sub has the lowest delay? Is it the REL subs?
Probably REL because they don't have DSP. But that's also why they don't go as low.
Joe, does such configuration with two woofers firing to opposite directions help at all with the room modes?
Good question. Not really because they're pretty much operating as a single source. If the box spanned the length of a room, then yes, it could. In this case, consider that the size of the driver is not much different than the distance between the two drivers.
Oh and here's another question. Erin reviewed the older KF92. It appears to be the same as the KC92. The price hasn't even dropped for the older model yet. Any idea of what the differences are?
Comes in white color now lol
Did the KF92 have the P-flex surround and iBX feature?
@@joentell yes all the same - specification is the same, weight dimensions the same. I think they just wanted to unify code name rather than be different from kc62
@@whitecrowuk575 wow. Interesting
@@whitecrowuk575 no the kf92 don t have the pflex and the DSP is updated on the Kc92
Binaural demo? Those are always awesome.😅
This or the sb 3000 Micro? Price isn’t a factor for me it’s the size that’s the factor and the only ones are this and the sb 3000 Micro.
Sure does look cool.
Hey Joe. Do you know if Kef plans to have an phone App? Or if they plan up adding features to the sub through firmware? I havent been able to find any info on this.
I'm not in direct contact with them, so I don't know
I have KEF LS60 with KC92 - and there is KEF Connect APP
@@ninja777de with a compatible KEF product, does it allow you to do time alignment? What are some added features?
@@joentell No, it doesn't (the alignement) - but with KEF subwwofer maybe it is something automatic.
Personally, I don't see any problem in my medium-sized room. However, in the APP you can select different subs models from KEF or 'custom'. After I selected the KEF KF92 / KC92 model, I had even less output, so I discussed with KEF engineers. Finally for my room I had to increase the gain to 2 o'clock position and to put sub-gain in the app at 5.0 DB. There are also Polarity, Low-pass, High-Pass settings. These are in the Expert Mode. In the Normal Mode, there is the Speakers/Subwoofer balance and Subwoofer Volume - also with the Subwoofer Model choice. In both modes there are choices for the KEF speakers, too. And the integration with Tidal, Qobuz, Amazon, and others is beautifully made.
I was at AudioFest in Montreal, and I discussed with a KEF and SVS supplier and he told me to go for the KC92 or KC62 because I have the LS60 and KEF as an integrated system works better as speakers-subwoofer combo. I wanted to buy two SVS but the guy told me that they tested with KEF speakers and it's better to go for the KEF route for sub. He also told me about the sharing between the subs and the LS60 is better and that with other brands it will not be so good. I'm happy with the choice after I fine-tuned, not from the beginning. I feel also that the mid and highs benefit from the added sub (!?).
@@ninja777de thank you for the info. It makes sense that good bass improves the perception of the frequencies above it.
I have really high hopes for this size compact sub. What I liked about it specs wise since I haven’t heard it in person is how adjustable and many options it provides! Plus the dual 9” driver with 2x500 watt amps, this thing must sound amazing! One of my fave things is the room/placement switch! So cool to be able to move it around and it adjusts automatically. 🎉 can’t wait to see the cta2010 measurements! 🎉
From what I’ve read and seen on reviews so far, I’m ranking this as the ultimate number bedroom HT/music subwoofer paired to a soundbar/smaller HT system! :)
hmmm..... i may be wrong, but given the specs of its predecessor, then you might need to recheck the HPF being fixed as the dip switches do allow you to change the outputs at different frequencies......unless i misunderstood what you meant.
You might be right and I will update my pinned comment if I am in fact incorrect. I did look at the manual specifically for this, and it doesn't say anything about how to use the switches to adjust the high pass filter. It only shows that flipping all of the switches the other direction is what's required if you're daisy-chaining subs.
@@joentell You are still right regarding flipping of the switches for daisy chaining given that it turns off all the different HPF levels 🙂
I would love to see some overlay graphs with other subs that you've tested in the same room. What would be a comparable ported sub in terms of performance? 10", 12"?
The SVS SB3000 claims to be a 13", but probably more like a 12". I think that one is comparable. I have an SB1000 Pro with a 12" and I think it has more output simply because of the increased enclosure size. The RSL 12S I have is much larger as well as the Monolith THX 10". I think a lot of it isn't just the driver size, but the enclosure size as well. The smaller the enclosure, the more power you need to get the same output and the drivers need to be able to handle that extra power.
@@joentell Thank you. So the SB1000 has more output than both the KC92 and the SB3000?
Thanx for the review Joe. Delay on RCA? Should not the main speakers be delayed in stead of the KEF KC92. As you suggested I use a mini DSP, a SHD model, for that. You said the sub does play 12 Hz loud, but you did not mention how loud and at what distance, so I looked back in the review where you show the graph while showing the change in Frequency response when the volume is changed. The squealing noise you hear, could that not be the D-class amplifier? I have a subwoofer with a D-class amplifier who made an audible squealing noise. At first I thought it was my tinnitus but since my children noticed the noise as well I was convinced it was not my tinnitus it came from the subwoofer. It was in the frequency range somewhere just above 2000 Hz., and was not dependent of the power played. I contacted the manufacturer about this and he suggested to replace the amplifier and sent me one including a short and clear description of how to build the amp in the sub, which was very easy! The amp arrived three working days later. No money changed hands! With the replacement of the amp the squealy noise is gone. As you can understand; I'm a happy man.
Delay on the RCA output, not input. Regarding the 12Hz, I can't recall at the moment. I think somewhere in the 95dB range. Not reference level.
@@joentellhow did you messuret it? Is that in inroom response or freespace?
@@91DivineAngel With the mic no further than 2" from the woofer cone in-room. This allows me to get good measurements with less affects from room modes. I apply SPL compensation based on a typical listening distance of 9ft away. If I were to measure in-room from 9ft, room modes would make the measurement useless.
Bro I stopped the video and rewound as soon as you mentioned the $2k price. Is there gold behind that woofer?
I hear you! It's a big number. I guess if someone can afford some KEF Blade 2 Meta's, maybe it's a small number. :-)
What program do you use to produce the sine wave?
REW
@@joentell Thank you!
would it be fair to say that 2 SVS SB3000s would be a better buy than one of these? It comes out to about the same price; just a $100 difference.
I would take 2 of almost any decent sub over 1 of a better sub. A nasty room mode can take out huge chunks of the audible response. So that's a yes for me. It's too large of a price difference to get only a smaller footprint.
If one has the space for two SB3000's, why even consider the Kef? Many other capable options in that size range.
awesome in depth review... that wishling coil whine type of sound make it evil.. this is pure crap. Delay is also really bad.. nice to know
It could be a defective unit or damaged in shipping. I will give KEF the benefit of the doubt. Hopefully they chime in and offer some insight.
Are you planning on reviewing any of the MIE range?
I wouldn't mind
The MIE is a GameChanger
Oh my, look at the harmonic distortion at 8:23 when playing the 20hz sine wave. That's horrible.
FYI those other frequencies shouldn't be there or at least at MUCH lower levels
I have to say I don't fully agree on your opinion regarding the packaging. Yes, it is simple, but it fulfills it's purpose. The product arrives at your home umdamaged. Also, having a simple packing increases the chance for proper recycling. If we are honest, what do we do with the packing once it's opened? Either you keep somewhere or you throw it away. Also, the packing is quite consist with other KEF products, e.g. their packaging for the Q Series speakers.
Actually, I was a bit concerned with the packaging because all of the styrofoam was broken. There's no recycling styrofoam either.
how is this compare to elac varro rs700?
I would have to say the rs700 just has more raw capability. I would go ELAC. It's close. Https://bit.ly/subwooferleaderboard
@@joentell ok thank you! you mind if i ask what's your ethnicity?
@@viencarlodiego8842 Filipino
@@joentell eyyyy kuya! Lol
@@viencarlodiego8842 sup pare!
Woohoo new vid
It's been a while. I've been busy with my Magic Beans Audio app
Great review! I want to see a sub with around 120dB down at 20Hz so I can have a full experience 😊. I use a 10 cu ft quad 10” ported sub with a 1000w amp for my home theater. It’s just awesome. I can’t afford to buy an already made one that can get that loud haha! I use the Dayton reference HO DVC 10”.
I made a sub using those Dayton Reference before. It's an awesome driver. I would love to see the sub you made sometime.
Possibly coil whine you are hearing? Some PC Video cards have this issue.
I don't think I can stomach a sub that doesn't have app control.
Its air leaking sound my definitive tech supercube lll sound like that air leaking
That was my first thought, but I could swear I heard something whirring even with no signal.
$3100 USD £2500 GBP No replacement for displacement very expensive for a sub this size,l am kef fanbboy as I've had 4 set's of their speakers but l wouldn't buy their K range of subs.....their Reference 8b Sub ....but l would say any equivalent svs sub wouldn't come close to the KC92 ...why you all you Americans mention svs😊
I think objective measurements might suggest that they do match up well against each other. SVS is very popular here, maybe that's why. I know people will ask me to compare it.
Clearly Kef paid you to do this review and they definitely reviewed this video prior to you being legally allowed to release it. Thats exactly what you tell us by saying that in the video.
Nice.
It might be good for home cinema, but not certain it is musical
We have inside jokes about the term, "musical." What does that mean to you? What measurable aspects of a subwoofer would you say make it musical or not musical? If you mean how well it blends with your main speakers so that the transition to the sub is seamless, that has everything to do with calibration. Getting the delay and phase alignment right, and setting the correction curves so it matches the natural response of the room and your main speakers.
@@joentell it should follow the music and not go boom where there are non in the music.
That’s up to who sets it up. People tend to turn up the sub until they can hear it without thought to what their source media is. The proper way to do it without a microphone is to use a source with 20-30Hz content, turn it up until you hear bass and then back off until you can’t. That’s the layman’s way. The best way is to use a software solution like REW.
As to “boom” and “musical”, that’s up to the speed of the drivers. A light cone material allows for fast response, but it only goes so far. For the most part, any sealed sub is adequately quick to start and stop. Yeah, REL subs are the standard, but they are not twice as quick as another well-designed sub. Also, bass frequencies are inherently slow to propagate. It’s a non-issue.
@@Vidar.m what you've described is the purpose of good calibration.
@@billd9667 I agree with the first part of what you said. A 20hz tone is always the same speed and is based on the number of cycles per second. What I think most people are referring to when they talk about fast or slow subs is the inherent delay I mentioned in this video caused by DSP. REL subs aren't faster at producing the same frequencies, they simply don't have DSP which causes the delay. Once you add the same amount of delay to your main speakers, then you can have the benefit of DSP correction and the same "fast" bass because the relative delay between the sub and your main speakers is 0.