Dungeon Meshi is my Favorite Love Story
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- čas přidán 28. 06. 2024
- Dungeon Meshi is, I think, an amazing story about love, compassion and the value of good food. Join me for a dive into the characters and themes of my favorite food anime!
My Patreon:
/ writinrealslow
0:00 - Introduction
1:01 - A Story of Love
04:29 - Laios Touden - The man, the myth, the autistic dumbass
13:33 - Marcille Donato - The best character, fuckin' fite me
20:40 - Chilchuck Tims - Stressed dad energy
24:01 - Senshi - The dad that stepped up
27:45 - Izutsumi - Fukkin' KIMTY
31:34 - Namari and Shuro - Who are also here
33:21 - Kabru - Mansplain, manipulate, malewife, manslaughter
38:03 - Falin Touden - Doomed by the narrative. "Nuh-uh!"
42:34 - Criticism
46:15 - Conclusion and Credits
#dungeonmeshi #deliciousindungeon #anime - Krátké a kreslené filmy
I just want to mention, the author of Dungeon Meshi has written other works about autism. I don't know if she is autistic herself or maybe has an autistic close friend or family member, but she certainly understands what being autistic is like down to the minutia, of things that neurotypical people would never see but are huge for anyone autistic. Some of her doodles about Laios and Falin's fashion choices show they have problems with a lot of clothing textures, for example, and how they don't like to wear turtlenecks or shaped clothing because it makes them feel confined and itchy. I know we all have to hedge our bets on representation, but this is one where I really believe the autism is intentional here. It's okay to let your guard down about it. The protagonist of a super popular anime is canonically autistic and it shows sides to autism most shows never would. It's real! Rejoice!
Even if by some bizarre happenstance it wasnt intended, the material/real world quantifiers for autism are just so strong that you have to distinguish this as a logical substantiated read of the character instead of just an idealist headcanon
Im autistic and I would have never guess that this was the case.
@@Zane-It Does your autism manifest in a way that affects your social skills/awareness at all?
If it doesn't then I understand how you don't see Laios' social alienation in yourself. His dynamic and interactions in the Shuro episodes essentially confirm it. His only friend on the island and he misread the relationship!
I've lived that exact moment in my own life and I have word for word spoken the lines that Laios himself does in that scene. It was simply soul nourishing for me
@@bummedmachinist7483 I always saw the knight as a food enthusiast nothing more and his friends understandably unaccepting of eating unknown things.
@@Zane-ItSo a pretty straight forward and surface level read. Honestly, that actually makes sense for someone autistic, as someone who's also autistic myself. I remember sometimes not catching details or plot relevations in stories until being told in video essays later on and stuff. You know, it's actually kind of ironic that you didn't pick up on the signs that Laios is (most likely) autistic
the real romance of dungeon meshi is between every single person who watches the show and Senshi 👨🍳 ❤️
truth
Funniest thing is marcille didnt learn dark magic to save falin, she just happened to know necromancy
Yea, her story is she's a half elf so she outlived her father before she was a young adult, she's in her 50s, but won't live as long as an elf. So her desire is that everyone race lives the same amount of time as other race since she already watched her human side of her family die off already.
You got it backwards:
Elves live to 500, half-elves live to be 1000 (only reason they're not a global power is because half-elves are sterile)
I don't think it's fair to call Falin and Marcille's relationship queerbait - i think some people throw that word around pretty liberally. If anything, I see their relationship as being extremely queer coded and i'm pretty confident it's intentional to some level. There's no teasing aimed at the audience. They just have a very close and devoted relationship that DOES very easily read as romantic, but it works very well as a platonic one too.
Thank you, I appreciate your input ^_^
Yeah I actually appreciate this about the anime and manga. There's no canon ships, but the author has written close relationships so well that almost any ship can work without being forced. It gives the audience more freedom to imagine it how they want while still delivering on the close relationships they want.
Yeah I’m tired of people claiming something is bait when it’s not 😅
@@nevinmyers1245exactly
Arguably the living paintings sidequest was the most plot-important thing to happen before Falin’s rescue
Yeah, it just doesn't feel like that at first since we don't have a reason to see it as important (yet!).
That's true. In a show like this there's no such thing as "filler"
That tangent on the Laios infantilization was a real breath of fresh air, especially considering we do see Laios acknowledge attraction, and even proof that he experiences some of it. It's not usually the focus but it's there, even if it's mainly in one bonus chapter and another upcoming chapter that people misread A Lot. It's tiring and it' even worse when people argue that he's "too autistic for that" or "just a monsterfucker" when he expresses no sexual attraction to monsters.
Which bonus chapter was it again?
@@mypassport5436 monster tidbits 2 (orcs) where Zon asks him if he thinks his wives are attractive because tallmen have different beauty standards.
Also I think we can count the more recent bonus chapter about the ex party member who was trying to get special treatment. Laios didn't realize what she was doing but after the party talked to him, he's careful to not repeat that kind of situation, showing he understands how it works.
I believe that might be a reason for him being so hesitent to touch Marcille when learning healing magic, which Chilchack understands as well.
@@mypassport5436 also for the upcoming chapter, it's the one right after Izutsumi fights bugs (same monster different chapter)
I put the name below just in case to avoid spoilers
It's the "Winged Lion" chapter, right after "Succubus II" from memory.
I want to add Mr Tance (the grouchy gnome Namari now works for) as another example. If you pay careful attention, you'll notice his entire party is basically his wife and (adopted) kids, and his dour demeanor even breaks when they're the ones in danger (as opposed to himself or the "hired help"). He also declines to extract profit from rezzing Kabru's party, only charging the cost of materials despite how deep in the dungeon they were (as the corpse retrievers were pushing them deeper to increase rates).
The corpse retrievers and similar money-loving adventurers are another interesting ingredient to the setting, as we've recently learned how their greed and desire seems to stimulate the dungeon. In contrast to the orcs and Senshi, who can live relatively peaceful lives within the dungeon because they only wish for a place to exist.
Oh, and then there's the Golden Villagers, who "live" in a horrible state of apathy, devoid of love or any other strong emotion beyond a wish to escape... Which I only *now* realize (even as a manga reader) is probably significant.
All of this just goes to show how Ryoko Kui is a master of her craft.
Oh definitely, it's all seriously good stuff. I just wanted to focus on the main characters this time because I wasn't sure how well the video would be received and it was already pretty long. I'll probably make another video when the season's finished to talk about the secondary and tertiary characters and the themes of kindness in the show, since this was a lot of fun!
@@WritinRealSlow I would be delighted to see that video!
We find out in side content that Kabru is that way b/c he was raised by an elf who adopted short lived races as a hobby. He had to be on her good side to get what he wanted, so he learned very early how to manipulate his caregiver to be invested in him.
He learned early on to be whoever people wanted him to be as a survival tactic.
He was pretty much more of a pet than Izutzumi.
i think milsiril and kabru's relationship is way more complicated than just "pet and his owner". milsiril definitely sees kabru more than a pet, she got into situations she didnt want just to make kabru happy and milsiril's family also see kabru as a part of their family. i think whole pet stuff comes from them being elves, even marcile and falin's relationship is similar yet we know they care a lot about each other. like i said its very complicated and i think its beautiful
all of this is spoilers. his childhood is elaborated on in side chapters, but we abaolutely see it in main chapters that the anime hasn't gotten to yet. it's too soon to tell this stuff to anime fans. let people make their opinions on kabru and wait for season 2 to give them the rest of his story.
@nunyab- yeah especially when this video explicitly asked to avoid spoilers in the comments. 🤭
Izutsumi and Tade were absolutely slaves since Toshiro's dad bought them and they aren't allowed to leave. Though Maizuru also used the slave collar on Toshiro (re: Volume #6 Bonus Comic) so the actual hierarchy for the rest of Toshiro's servants is a bit blurry.
she used something SIMILAR to the slave collar on shuro. it's so funny that people endlessly try to soften the fact that maizuru would have happily murdered izustumi and shuro does not give a shit. like come on let characters have flaws.
@@johannesgutenburg9837 more like Shuro didn't know about the collar, since he wasn't even aware that Maizuru was the one that put the curse on him. He only knows that the paper hag scared the shit out of him as a child, he couldn't kill it or run away from it, and had to run to his dad to save him.
@@MirellaSnape the LENGTHS lmao. he is a slave owner honey.
I think for Shuro's attendants (that his father gave him), Maizuru is the leader, then Hien, then Benichidori, then Tade and Izutsumi.
43:00 Laios party was going at a fairly fast pace, getting to Falin at least a week before Shuro who was actually speedrunning the dungeon. Situation also didn't become dire, until they found out that Dragon isn't hibernating and hence digesting at a drastically reduced speed, but active, which happened only in the Orc village.
As for painting specifically, Laios does exactly the same, as he was doing thorough out the show - he tried to scavenge some supplies. Just because he failed, doesn't make it any different from them harvesting mandragoras for example.
Yeah, the reason they made it before Shuro was that they started first, and had Chilchuck's knowledge of all the shortcuts, the help and contacts of Senshi (the orcs gave them the map).
Kabru could represent a love of justice. He gives me mad paladin vibes
As a manga reader: you are *so* ready for season 2.
I'm so excited!
I would say that the "tonal whiplash" was one of my favorite thing about the series. Mostly because it feels like an in character attempt to lighten the mood with jokes or not being as tense as they might have to be rather than a random joke being thrown into a should be serious moment and ruined it
feels like a failing of the guy making the video not really understanding that
Funnily enough, there are a few bonus pages from the manga that were not adapted that easily answer the question of Laios understanding sex or not. It's when they are captured by the orcs and, after the feast, Laios and the orc chief talk about how each race view attraction, with the chief saying that they have very different tastes in relation to women while Laios disagrees and says how their tastes in the opposite sex are very similar, detailing both races' beauty standards and comparing it to one another. This implies that Laios is not "too autistic" for things such as sex and love, I mean come on the dude's a monster lover I'm pretty sure he KNOWS what the hell the bees and the flowers are.
I think I've seen the page you're talking about floating around tumblr, and you're right, it does prove the point fairly well. I just wanted to focus on the anime, since that's how I'm primarily experiencing the story, and I think it's how most new people will be introduced to it as well.
Very interesting thoughts, especially on Kabru lol. I really like him, especially because he actually reminds me of my sister and how her autism works- recognizing the threads and hierarchies that stretch between people and how they interact and intersect. Something that she complains a lot of people aren’t and don’t have to be aware of like she is.
I think one of the things I like most about Dungeon Meshi is how Kui treats pretty much every character seriously and with a ton of empathy- everyone from Thistle to Kabru I think!
Oh kabru is absolutely well done, and I love the role he plays in the overall narrative. I just wouldn't like him at all if I ever met him in person.
Pretty much everyone in Dungeon Meshi has autistic traits in one way or another. And the fact they're all still depicted as people with individual interests and personalities and not like charicatures or archetypes is *Cheff's Kiss~*
Kui is an amazing author.
Having said that... Kabru is a master manipulator (autism or not, justified or not, he is nonetheless). He molds himself into whatever he figures the people he interacts with want, and even his party members seem to just chalk his behavior up as "being really good with people". The only reason we anime watchers and manga readers know that he is like that so clearly, is because we're watching from an outside point of view and have access to a lot of inside info.
For someone meeting him Kabru person without having seen/watched the series beforehand, it would be hard to dislike Kabru (at least at first)... because we'd be facing the mask he'd craft specifically to talk to us.
I understand your dislike of Kabru's personality, but would like to plead his case, because he is, actually, my favorite character.
What I find interesting about Kabru is how you could read him as autistic, too, just on the opposite side of the spectrum from where Laios with. Where Laios is fascinated with monsters and knows how to interact with them, Kabru is fascinated with humans and knows what makes them tick. Laios struggles with communication, Kabru excels at it, but it's in a very calculating way. I dont see his behavior as manipulation as much as it feels to me like some heavy, heavy masking.
It's a reading that is admittedly very personal to me, as to a highly masking autistic person who is quite good at socializing and reading social cues. None of it came naturally to me. I play 5d chess in my head just to get by in every social interaction. I am hyper aware of how anything you do or say will influence a person in some way, and try to calculate my actions according to it, so that I'm accepted and liked. Is it manipulative? You could say so. I would say that it's necessary for survival in this world, and the fact that I do it intentionally doesn't make it worse than when neurotypical people do the same things without thinking. Being sware of social relationships and wanting people to like you is not, in fact, an evil thing.
And then there's the matter of trauma that influences a lot of Kabru's character. The "tragic backstory with a dead mum" is something that had happened to him and that did shape him as a person. He is the only survivor of terrible tragedy. He saw death and destruction when he was a child, and he came to a dungeon as an adult with the explicit goal of stopping the tragedy from happening again.
I would even say he, indeed, more than anything is driven by love and desire to protect others, even strangers he has no connection to, from having to see their life destroyed as his was.
Are his methods questionable? Sure. And I'm not even going to argue otherwise. He's got issues. Not liking him on a personal level is valid. Having said that, I, with all respect, vehemently disagree on your reading of him. But look forward to see if and how your thoughts change down the line, when the anime stops being so set on painting him as a villain.
(Which, the anime does do subtle things that seem to frame him more as an antagonist than manga does. In manga, we're given more insight into his thoughts, which are often played for laughs like in the moment with the omelette. But thats besides the point.)
Thank you for the great video!
Same, although in my case it was neurodivergency plus wanting to figure out how to make my mom stop hitting me for everything I said and did as a kid. And at this point in life I can't just turn off the part of my brain that's hyper aware of everything I say and do and how that affects other people.
And we all want love and affection, every single person on this planet. Difference is just from how many people and how hard we're willing to work to get it.
I just really love Kabru because he's the first character who I relate to in this way I've seen who wasn't portrayed as inherently evil.
Also, he drops the whole "wanting to prove the Toudens are evil" thing immediately after meeting Laios in the dungeon cause he correctly deduces that Laios isn't a bad guy, so I wouldn't say he was obsessed with it
Yeah, I also see Kabru as neurodivergent or an CPTSD / child abuse survivor, both really
While I do find myself more in Laios' side of the spectrum, I also went through traumatic experiences with my parents that made me hyper-aware of how my body language & tone should be delivered to prevent even worse abuse from happening; and Kabru has pretty much gone through it and back.
I see him as a foil of both Laios and Izuzumi's characters. He wants to preserve himself and survive, just as he did as a child; but he also loves those around him so much that he will do anything in his power to help preserve them, and the peaceful life he now has.
No wonder then why some of his most controlling thoughts and anxieties arise when Laios is nearby. He cannot figure him out. He doesn't understand him or get his goals because Laios's thoughtwave greatly differs from other explorers and members of society in general.
To imagine/see Laios become the Dungeon Master completely by chance when his one and only goal, apart from feeding his special interest, was saving his sister, and acting as if defeating Thistle was another Tuesday; while at the same time, in Kabru's eyes, being completely oblivious to how even retain any semblance of a "normal" relationship by society's standards can definitely be extremely jarring and something that could easily fuel the initial thought of the brothers "being evil".
I think that it actually gets addressed later on in the manga by Laios himself, and I think that it speaks volumes about the real depth of his character.
@@kjarakravik4837jeez, we seem really similar. Tiptoeing around my mom and doing everything to please her naturally made me do that with everyone. Which weirdly made me distant with most people because I'd hide how I actually felt so they'd like me😅. I understand Kabru on a visceral level...
Personally, I like the tone breaks between serious and silly; IMO it's part of the message of the series about how life always goes on and no matter what happens, we all need to stop and sit down and eat eventually. I've heard people say that it's better to watch this series one episode at a time, with long breaks to eat and/or sleep between then, instead of binging it all in one sitting.
Though you're right that early installments are less strong; the author was still finding her stride. (I will point out that they are weeks worth of travel away from Falin, so it's not like running now will make you arrive sooner; and Marcille was also probably in denial of the reality that there was slim hope; but those weren't really shown in the story at the time.)
There's similar reasoning for Marcille being the butt of jokes early on; author being too heavy-handed and perhaps worrying about being cancelled early if the manga wasn't funny enough. It did strongly establish Marcille's outward character before we got to see the stark contrast with her inner character, at least.
As fo Laios learning... Many times, many characters do point out to him what he's doing wrong, and tell him or the audience that he needs to improve, but there hasn't been any part in the story which focuses on it. He does slowly improve over time (idk if starting Laios could have figured out the Dopplegangers) but it's slow, and the story seems to be pushing a more middle ground message of "one's greatest weakness can also be one's greatest strength", since so many problems are also solved by Laios being the blunt monster-maniac he is. But that still causes problems, too, so I don't think it's saying you don't need to work on improving. Just that self-improvement and self-acceptance don't have to be exclusive.
Imo the comedy surrounding Marcille in the beginning never felt meanspirited.
For the most part, my husband and I watched this as it came out. We would watch it specially while eating dinner 😂 it just felt... fitting.
As a manga reader, there is not much I can say in terms of agreement or disagreement in your characterizations. I will say, though, while Marcille was also my favorite character in the story at the point you all are at, Laios managed to clutch my "Favorite Protagonist" position by the end. I have no idea if you will agree with the assessment or not later on, but I doubt you won't love the rest regardless.
I'm sure I will! I do love laios already, I hope I didn't come off as if I dislike him.
Well thereis a reason why at the start they aren't too rushed to get to Falin and why they are so relatively chill when reassembling her bones: they are very used to death
They all have been killed and resurrected while exploring the dungeon before and they know that so long as they get there under a month her body will probably be fine (since they didn't know that the dragon was still active has a dragon normally spend most of the time asleep), so it's a bad situation and they are worried but not freaking out. It's not "Oh no my sister is dead now i have to do everything to save her" freak out, but "oh her body is to far away to our usual resurrection method so better move as fast as possible"
It's part of the world building that adventures are very casual about death in the dungeon.
The painting episode is something that the character comments too! That was Laois curiosity and love of monsters that slow them down. It was intentional.
And they were so casual about the bones because *they had a solution* if you notice the ones that are more "cheerfull" in that scene are Laois and Marcille because they are so sure that it will work, so they can get their inner nerds out (because it's useful! Laois knowledge about canine skeletons helps has much as Marcille)
And much of the message of dungeon menshi is that life will always go on, no matter what happens, and life is often quite ridiculous. With dungeon meshi it's not a case of tonal whiplash but a intentional decision, this is very much a black comedy that also explore the emotional tool of what this characters go through. Like there is a scene later in the manga the made me bust a lung laughing so hard and immediately after there was one if the most heartbreaking panels ever.
Comedy and tragedy are very strongly related and dungeon menshi absolutely thrive in that.
As a manga reader- I have to be honest with you, I was not really expecting much when it comes to anime-only analysis on Dungeon Meshi- but your topic and angle really peek my interest. well sufice to say that you managed to BLOW MY MIND when you mention the 4 types of love (Or in this case 5) and attribute them to this character- Like IT FIT SO WELL
I do not like how most of the community depict Laois as this overly aloof bumbling idiot who only cares about eating moster and nothing else. I would argue that The kelpi episode really important to re-frame what he truly think about monster outside of morbid curiosity. its a harmful and dehumanizing take on a neurodivergent code and/or Canon character so thank you for calling that out
(also, I highly incorage you check out the already animated chapters of the manga because there are some little characterasion of Laios and other stuff that get skip like how he internally judge Marcile to think its ok to eat animal testical and not monster- in fact he even say that some how worst- Its not much but its something to look back on)
ALSO HOW DARE U USE BITTER WATER FOR FALINS PART AAAAAAAAAAAAA
I'm glad I could give you something good to watch!
As for the fanonization of laios, I think it stems from people really wanting to be able to group characters into easy to understand groups of tropes so they don't have to really unpack their relationship to a character and the work they're from. Grouping like things is human nature, but it's still important to really think about the media we consume, and a lot of people don't WANT to do that. They want simple, easily digestible characters they can project their headcanons onto, and if they'll do it by force if they have to, which I really don't think is a healthy attitude to have toward something you supposedly love.
Sorry for the ramble, I just really appreciate you taking the time to comment your thoughts and letting me know you enjoyed my video!
@@WritinRealSlowthank you for taking your time to read and responding to my comment! Expand on fandom flanderization, I need to emphasize that I do not demonize fandoms taking characters and upping their silly bones to 11- I too find it enjoyable to see the beloved goobers get extra goofy (plus its fandom- like it or not this things are bound to happen- in the worst case scenario I can just ignore or block). But sometimes I can’t help that many people in discussions will just straight up Mis-characterize and I have to be like “oh no thats not…Um…Ok they will not do or say that- moving on” for example people Calling Shiro an ableist (he is an asian man and grew up with different cultural norms that when he think of “something that most people would understand” is something clearly very different and other characters has put in to question his own behaviors), People think Namari is an Asshole for leaving the party (shes not- she obviously care she just don’t want to work for free which is understandable because shes a freelancer and in need of money), and Marcile having a mean spirited attitude towards Laios but crazy in love with Falin (while she cares for Falin a little bit more- Its obvious that she cares and love for both siblings and the rest of the party)
if you read ryoko kui's other work it becomes pretty clear that laios is intentionally autistic coded.
dungeon meshi my beloved
Edit: BREAD! BREAD! BREAD! BREAD!
I really don't see where people are getting "everyone shits on Marcille" in the early segments of the show.
Sure the show makes her the main butt of the joke but there's always a silver-lining to her role within these segments. I never see the actual part where the characters actually insult or shit on her one-sidedly unless you decide to put the story and the characters as the same thing which even then doesn't track.
I actually don't mind that much how Marcille is treated by the show in the beginning. IMO, it is a good lesson that despite being very competent at offensive magic and even having a very precious and rare skill in using dark magic, you have to know when your skills are overkill. Laios even mentions that her stronger skills WILL be needed later and she can't spend her mana for little things on the first floors.
On another note, she acts as a representation of the public with how she sees monster food. And it is also great to have newfound respect for her when she becomes indispensable around the dragon level.
And happy pride month! Can't wait for the video about ace representation!
Im a simple Toxtricity I see Dungeon meshi and Toxtricity I click.
One thing I love about Laios is that he gives this sense of being stupid, but turns out hes smarter than he seems, his knowledge on monsters has helped others, and his respect for his teammates has allowed them to survive in the dungeon, him seeming to not pay attention only for him to have caught on to everything, makes him a threat to anyone underestimating him.
greetings fellow toxtricity!
I honestly love how laios' niche knowledge and unique nature is depicted as his greatest strength.
I have quite literally never watched a single anime in my life, but I reallly really enjoyed this, as someone who doesn't even know who these characters are, I still wasn't even confused and thought everything you had to say about them was really interesting! Lately I feel like my attention span's been getting worse and worse, but I'm glad I could just sit down and watch this video in one go :)
I'm glad I could make something you enjoyed so much!
Lots of people online have been talking about how it's a really good anime for people who don't watch anime. It deliberately avoids a lot of the niche stereotypes and conventions which modern fantasy anime almost universally relies upon, so anyone with an interest in adventure and food can sit down and enjoy it.
As for "gay baiting"... I think that the world needs to have more works where two characters can share an intimate moment without it being sexualized or the story making a big deal about their relationship, instead leaving it open to interpretation. Not just for gay ships, but straight ones as well.
If such scenes get people riled up... That's a sign that the story did something right, since it's so deeply resonating with people. The author publically "picking a side" now would probably just kick up tons of hard feelings for everyone but the specific group that favored the canon outcome. So anyone hungry for more is free to enjoy the loads and loads of fanart and doujins that exist for every major ship in the series, instead!
As someone who is also abysmal with social cues, I love Kabru's character. It's rare to see someone with a similar skin tone to mine get importance in an anime.
With regards to ppl shipping him with Laios, no spoilers here but approximately 80% of their fan content is set post-canon. I myself didn't take the ship seriously until I read the post epilogue material, so keep in mind there's still a lot of twists and turns with the character development.
Also in a chapter extra they discuss genderbent alternate timelines (Laios' curiosity 😅) and it's implied that female!Kabru is Laios' girlfriend.
I don't think Kabru is actually all that murder happy- mind you, i have not watched the dub, and i do think the clips you showed emphasized that way more. The "killing Laois in his mind as a reaction to stress thing" is 1) intended as comedic and 2) not something that indicates his actual behavior, which is, admittedly, very complicated when it comes to someone who wears a mask like Kabru does. I dont consider the private thoughts of a character to be as important as their actions, even their nasty and violent thoughts, especially because i have random violent thoughts of my own, including in reaction to stress (which is probably related to my own autism). He saw horrible violence at a young age, so it's an instinctive reaction for him. He knows better than to act on it, which is why he never (spoilers) makes a serious attempt on Laois's life, though he ends up having his own Shuro moment. Hes also really not obsessed with proving the Toudens are bad- he knows theyre contenders for conquering the dungeon, and he wants to ensure whoever does that will actually be a good ruler. His thing about them giving money isnt that it makes them morally complicit, its that they arent interested in people enough to know what happened with that money and that's a really bad quality in a ruler. I would agree though, that Kabru is driven by hate more than love, though we do get the reveal that part of his constant attempts to talk to Laois before finally meeting him in the dungeon were because he wanted friendship with him and he desperately wants to understand him- as well as the implication that this interest is partly because of Backstory stuff that has Kabru secretly worried he is part monster.
As someone who’s finished the manga, that’s actually something that really compels me about Kabru - he’s so much The Manipulator tm on the surface, but he’s also from my perspective unfailingly kind. He doesn’t want anyone to suffer, from preventing disasters like what happened to his hometown to small stuff like how he adjusts himself to not disappoint his adopted mother. He’s almost selfless to a fault, which combines very nicely as a foil for Laois who takes care of himself so that he can have the energy to help others.
Very good video and definitely one of the most thorough DunMeshi reviews on yt that I've been searching for! I don't agree with every point since I'm a manga reader but I can see that you actually took your time to analyze and form your opinions as objectively as you can and acknowledge that there's more to the story that the anime adaptation simply hasn't reached yet. As someone who likes Kabru, I really appreciate that you acknowledge that he's a necessary addition to the narrative and don't immediately disregard him. I hope you're not getting attacked for simply not vibing with a character, even if you still don't after seeing his development, that's also okay. I wanna say that Dungeon Meshi is probably my favourite piece of media as of right now. It's not a perfect story, but it really just have everything that I want. I'm glad that DunMeshi is gaining the traction that it deserves. It may not be the number one most popular or most hyped, but I love seeing people loving this series as much as I do.
I really like your connections with the different classifications of love (something I didn’t know about but I’m very intrigued by), it’s a way of viewing this story that I hadn’t really thought about. I finished the manga recently and i think an interesting way to look at the story is that, fundamentally, Dungeon Meshi is about eating, or rather the concept is used allegorically a lot. Why we eat, the purpose behind it, why it’s so important. I think you’re really going to love season 2, especially since, assuming Trigger gives it 24 episodes again, it’ll cover the rest of the manga
I don't think people should use autism as an excuse to be an ass, but I also think society could throw us a bone or 2 so my life could be a little less exhausting.
trust me, I'm right there with you.
You killed me playing bitter water with Fallin- my favorite band The oh hello’s in a video on my new special interest!? Hats off man
It just felt like the right song for her.
I wanted to share my take on the criticism of Laios presented in this video. I want to say that I agree with the idea that Laios does need to learn to be better, and also that the show has yet to really address it, however I do think there is a narrative reason for him as of yet not recognizing or have been told this. Between Laios being told by the dungeon residents that he is prophecized to take control of the dungeon from the dungeon lord and Kabru's analysis of the Touden siblings (which as mentioned his logic is flawed in, but some of his analysis of Laios's personality not based on specific facts does seem somewhat accurate) the show is creating conflict in whether or not Laios would make the right decision.
As you mentioned, Laios's driving motivations are love of his sister, his friends, and monsters. None of these motivations require him to make the right choice of prioritizing people over monsters when/if he gets control, but his interest in monsters does make it plausible that he would make the wrong decision (as Kabru suspects). I think there is an intentional narrative tension over whether or not Laios would make decisions catering to the general good of people, and by showing him actively working to better his relations with other people at this time the tension would be lessened: If he's trying to make himself better for people, it would logically follow that he would make the world better for other people. I do think he should be being called out a bit more than he is, and that could be done better, but the fact he has yet to try to learn I think is an intentional part of the narrative tension. And since I think it is intentional, I do think it will be addressed.
I do want to say that I loved your video and your analysis of the characters. I haven't spent much time analyzing the story as it is and I hadn't even noticed the focus on love at this point, and I think you made a lot of good and compelling analysis of the show. I'm only arguing with one of your points because I think I have a different perspective, and I don't think you are wrong or that the problems you addressed aren't there, I just wanted to add my thoughts since I didn't think it was a complete look at that particular issue. I look forward to see your thoughts on the show as it goes on!
Great video, never knew the diferent types of love had names!
On the autistic people need to grow part. I fully agree that autism can be used as an excuse to not grow as a person. However, it's important to distinguish between harmful and unconventional behaviour. Laios wanting to count itzutsumis nippels is absolutely harmful behaviour. When he's infodumping, stimming etc hes being unconventional, and people might be uncomfortable with it, but it's (in most cases) not harmful.
I'm not implying that you said or believe that he should mask away his autism, just a take i see depressingly often.
yep, there are 7 different types, though I think I missed one in the video.
And trust me, I get it. As an autistic person, I'm really tired of seeing autistic characters depicted as being nothing but massively weird nuisances, and overall I think Laios is a really good depiction. It's just with the things like "how many nipples does she have" that he crosses the line, which is why I said he needs to grow, because we all cross the line sometimes, autistic or no. What matters is that we try to be better.
i think another great thing about it is the english voice actor who plays laios is actually autistic and talks about it frequently and his struggles and how they relate to laios. just makes me happy to see representation
yeah, his VA is really cool!
I say the tonal shifts are better in the manga where the in episode sudden swings mostly is a new chapter, resetting the reader tonely. Other people have mentioned the tonal whiplash is a purposeful and that is true but for the most part its better facilitated by the chapter divide
Hell yea Farcille supporter
hell yea!
Finale spoiler (kinda)
Elf Senshi is the jesus elfs want you to belive existed
Dwarf Senshi is the actual Jesus
This is the best comment I've seen so far XD
The series plays with a lot of ships in it's time, but hard confirms none of them and hard rejects only one. (Falin rejects Shuro explicitly), but there is unmistakably intent behind all of the romantic scenes, particularly the scenes between Marcille and one of the Touden siblings. (Both of them, just separately and at different points in the story lol. Wording that clearly is hard lol.)
These people are all adults and the attraction and potentially romance is there, but they all just have bigger shit to deal with right now.
Laios is the type of dude to get “adopted” as a bf and not realize it until a month into the relationship.
YOU. YOU'RE THE ONLY PERSON THAT GETS IZUTSUMI. GOOD JOB. i do think her attitude is exacerbated by being a teen but gosh so many people gloss over her trauma!! there's some more stuff about her backstory that i can't recall if it's from the manga or from side comics so i will say nothing.
as for Kabru, i started not liking him either but ended up finding him really funny. im not sure if i'd say he goes through character development later, or rather the story explores how his 5D chess mentality works and fails. considering you said it reminded you of someone you dislike i wouldn't blame you if he's just not your cup of tea. HOWEVER. one thing i will point out is that he doesn't really think the Touden siblings are "bad people", he just thinks they aren't trustworthy because they were easily taken advantage of. he wants to avoid the Dungeon collapsing like it did in his hometown, so his ultimate goal is to take control of it- or failing that, since he's not strong enough, to be close to whoever does. and the idea of someone like Laois (feckless + monster loving) taking that place is... well, unironically triggering. in a way that is love for humans i guess?
(also A+ song choices)
theres an episode by episode animation breakdown from Swamp jawn that i can't recommend highly enough. great watch especially if you are bad at noticing the small details that get snuck in every episode :)
thanks for the recommendation
Thinking about it... You're right, and I can't wait for Season 2 to happen and complete, because I realized there are more themes of love yet to come.
Also, fyi the Liver is primarily a storage for vitamins and minerals, which is why it's such a healthy food. But it can accumulate certain toxins (I think heavy metals like lead and mercury) if the animal lived in a polluted environment, so it isn't entirely irrational to be hesitant.
I absolutely love this video, I've had some great laughs and the titles per chapter was freaking perfect! Cheers mate
I suspected the autism too, and it makes me love him even more. My oldest son is autistic, and he’s done much to grow, but it’s noticeable. I love his pure heart and how caring he is. I love this show and all the forms of love it shows.
I so deeply love that Laios & Falin are like, basically the same person. It's such a reasonable take, and yet feels so subversive.
As someone who had read the manga. I can guarantee you the second season gonna be fire. I swear on my dead grandpa's name, the story is great. Keep the hype up, fellow Dungeon Meshi enjoyer!
I absolutely believe you, I can't wait!
amazing analysis!! I really appreciate that your feelings match closely to my own while reading the manga. You really put words to things in a way that really opened my eyes to the inner working of this amazing story!
I'm so happy I could help you enjoy it even more!
great video essay!! hahaha I personally find kabru a lot of fun and enjoy him as a character, and that's why I also really enjoy labru- its a very silly ship and ppl tend to view it as one sided enemies to lovers, stemming from how laois thinks "wow this guy is so cool!" whilst kabru has an obsession with laois and simultaneously is all "aaaa this guy is the worst!!!!" lol
Thanks for this. I really love this show, and fantasy isn't even my usual genre.
I've been seeing that sentiment around a lot lately. I wonder what it is about dunmeshi that has that effect
The Kabru roast was so funny man... Great video!
Thank you! ^_^
Phenomenal essay but HOLY BASED GOOD KID SOUNDTRACK
oh boy i really don't think you will really end up liking kabru by the end of the story, we keep learning about him but is not so much as development tbh, but i love the guy, is interesting seeing a backstabber scheming character that is one of the good guys whole heartly
I mean, I like him as a character and his narrative role just fine, I just couldn't be friends with him IRL.
I love how Laios and Marcille have that classic sibling dynamic. with all their fighting and disagreements. But they still fundamentally trust and feel safe around each other. It’s really funny to see how the party kind of has to deal with both their conflicting proclivities.
Kabru is weird because I get how unappealing his personality and attitude towards people are but I really liked him when that part of him got revealed. I know he was against Laios but that's because he's focusing on the greater good and humanity as a whole. Kabru knows how people work and says or does what he thinks is best but he never seems to be doing it to hurt other people specifically. The fact his team heard him talk about how easy humans are to kill and just nodded like "Yeah that's him" and commented on him eating monster with "he'll do anything to get someone to like him" proves they know him, even this seemingly psychopathic side that's fake and people pleasing. That's a big deal because without his team's perspective of him you'd assume he was a Dexter like serial killer who never revealed his true thoughts or feelings. With that insight you realize it's just a big part of who he is and he utilizes it as a tool. Yeah, he might over indulge in his passion (reading people/their connections and making them like him) but that just feels like a human thing to me. If he was doing it to be a bully or just being nice to someone's face to talk crap about them later is totally different from what he's doing.
I know there's people who talk about his manga development and stuff but just strictly from his anime portrayal I was a big fan of his and really enjoyed his character
Great video and very much on point.
While I may disagree with the tonal issue I think it is largely relegated to personal preference (and having Dorohedoro tied with it as my 2nd favourite manga shows how I am quite used to the whiplash), the other are fairly solid.
Like I said, the tone of the show doesn't bother me, but it's still something that would bother a decent number of people less used to it.
When i saw the bath scene my brain immediately thought, "yeeaahh they definitely gay"
No way that scene wasn't gay bait XD
"Something about here that they've seen that we just haven't yet.-" "WOAH HEY!" 😂
Love your take on this show! I agree with many points (also noticed the part where the show seems to revel upon Marcille’s abuse). Great vid 🙏🏼
As someone who is autistic, I would like to be appreciated for who I am, not someone I am pretending to be.
I know I have tried to learn social cues, but although I have learned to spot certain flags, I still cannot keep up with others despite my efforts.
Everyone is different and everyone changes, and I just can't keep up to date with everything and everyone.
So instead of always being five steps behind in every conversation, why aren't we just allowed to be autistic in peace?...
We could be so much more productive, if people could just stop being vague about things they don't even mean and give clear instructions instead.
I really enjoyed your takes on the characters and your criticisms.
thanks!
i'm autistic too. when you talked people not telling their problems with you and exploding that hit me. also, good analysis!
im a little late, but the background music was such a vibe. I love good kid and discovered them sometime before covid as youtube just recommended me music semi-adjacent to anime music.
It's such a lovely, yet serious show
Lol @ the bathing scene, in the succubus chapter it shows marceline is 100% straight but into edgy men. Where as Laios is infact in love with marceline, but would never bring it up for the sake of the party.
I think it is important to say that the scene where Laios wants to see Izutsumi's biology is not in the manga, but then again he is still blinded ,so take it as you want. He just doesn't go rabid.
I love Kabru ;_; ..
But y'know, your feelings are legit. Especially when you mentioned the former-friend bit. I've also hated characters in other series because of similar bad memories.
I really loved your points and I can't wait for s2 so everything you think may happen or occur shows itself and watch what you think, while not perfect i think s2 would give a nice development and closure to a lot of things you bought up! And since this season did more than half the manga it'd be nice if we didn’t loose as much dialogue adaption to maybe understand motives better for the s2
Nice work!
Thank you, and I have very high hopes for season 2!
Great video, you really elaborate on the themes well as you see it, up to what the anime covers. I'm subscribing in the hopes that you may do a follow up vid in like a year or whenever s2 comes out and is complete, I respect your choice to cherish the watchalong with your friend, as someone who read the manga after episode three or four aired. However if this is the typical quality of your analyses, I'll be happy to stay subscribed even if you never make a video on Dungeon Meshi again.
oh trust me, I definitely will be. I was a little worried that netflix would decide to axe it, since they've done that with plenty of beloved shows in the past, but with season 2 confirmed I'm absolutely ecstatic for the rest of the story! ^_^
Ngl I kind of love how the tone shifts so easily. Really kind of highlights how kinda deranged and desensitized these people kind of are, but it actually helps them a lot in their journey since they were way ahead of Shuro and still able to eat and sleep. Like everyone gets so caught up in all the monster eating and Dungeonology they forget a lot, Laios is the most guilty of this even though he likely has the biggest reason to save Falin.
Actually I think Falin is a more apt description of Agape. She is capable of incredible empathy and understanding which is why she’s so good at warding spirits and doesn’t want to hurt them. Senshi isn’t as close to agape but he does feel a responsibility for these people. Much more parental than Agape.
Great video.
It took me surprisingly long to realise Laios was autistic coded, and like a couple weeks longer to realise I was so similar as an autistic person heavily interested in monsters, and that playing D&D also had me reciting knowledge from monster manuals like he does. Really gave me a moment of though that I would be the Laios, and reactions I saw of other people misinterpreting him as lacking empathy or something.
2:43 to be fair the living paintings episode introduced us to the mad mage and the ancient history of the golden country.
aaaah i think i loved this video in all possible forms of love
Super video ! I realy like your take on the story !
I agree with you about Toshiro, people are shitting on him a lot. I don't think he's that bad although the slave thing kinda irk me about his character.
In regard to your critisism, for Laios I don't think you need to worry. With the talk he had with the orcs, what senshi mentions to him when they are in the golden kingdom and the part with his parents in his dream, the story seems to go with Laios having to think about people more, him improving himself on that. At least I think, I didn't read the manga yet I want to read it after I watch the anime.
As for the the clash in tone, I think it's intentional. The story juggles between dark humor, silliness and serious and emotional, that's seems to be a core identity of the show. The biggest problem for me is the timing of these tone shifts. There are sometimes where it's not great, in my opinion.
As for the abuse of Marcille . . . I am gonna disagree with you on that one. I honestly don't see it. I mean, it never felt too much to me and it kinda endeared her to me in the begining. I also think it goes with the just out of school top student who's still inexperienced with the real world. Like, it's getting better because she's getting better at exploring the dungeon. I feel like Laios is getting yelled at as much or more than her ? Idk . . . Maybe I am too used to anime sexualised woman suffering so this doesn't strike me as bad.
PS: Sorry for the long rambling. I don't know if what I'm trying to say is clear and sorry for any mistakes, english isn't my first language.
No don't worry, I appreciate the time and effort you put into your comment!
People keep trying to explain away the tone issues, and I feel like I have to reiterate that I personally didn't have any problem with it, but some people might, and that's why I brought it up, because even if it's intentional, in execution it can still damage people's overall enjoyment.
As for the marcille thing, it's mostly that she's the main recipient of physical abuse for the first few episodes, especially in episodes 1 and 2. While it's definitely a lot better than how most anime would do it and I really appreciate how her abuse isn't sexualized at all (which is it's own problem), some people are more sensitive to these kinds of things, and even if a problem could be worse, it should still be pointed out so we can do better in the future.
For the record, I mostly ascribe the early physical abuse of marcille as Ryoko Kui still finding her footing, I don't read any malicious intent into it.
@@WritinRealSlow Thank you for the response. Yeah I agree there is an issue in the execution of the tone shift. I really think the timing of some of those could've been better. I wonder if it's an adaptation problem or if there's also tone issues in the manga ?
And yeah for the Marcille thing, it is worth pointing it out. I admit I was mostly surprised with that critism. I can see the others two but that one confused me at first. I guess it made sense to me why Marcille would have a difficult time at first, the jokes never felt degrating to me but I can see that would it have persisted on all the episodes it would've felt mean spirited. I need to re-watch the show with the problem in mind and think about it. Regardless it is good to talk about it.
And I didn't talk about the queerbaiting in my first comment and I don't think my input is gonna be all that useful because I am not really sure either if it is indeed queerbaiting. It feels more like an author restraining themself on making it gay rather than queerbaiting buuut I don't really know.
@@lentilledecontact "I wonder if it's an adaptation problem or if there are also tone issues in the manga ?"
I would say it's not too apparent in the manga. The anime usually adapts 2 or 3 chapters of the manga in a single episode. Putting a serious chapter and a goofy chapter in one episode can definitely amplify the tonal whiplash. For example the Senshi backstory episode, it was two chapters with massively different vibe to each other and it shows. Not to mention if you're reading one chapter a month like the way it was serialized in the magazine, the tonal shift wouldn't be too noticeable either. Also, the anime cuts a lot of little details like interactions and dialogues that might seem irrelevant but actually serves as important context and characterization.
I think that's an issue that all adaptations have to deal with. When transferring a property from one medium to another, it's always necessary to leave pieces behind. The mark of a good adaptation is, I think, that it uses the strengths of the new medium to make up for what's been lost in the transferal. And dungeon meshi is a very good adaptation.
I think you will get what you are asking for as the story progresses. I liked the manga and I am very glad it has gotten an anime
Awesome video❤❤❤
Thank you! ^_^
Dungeon Meshi is GOAT.
I resonate deeply with Laios, Falin, Senshi and Kabru. I love to learn as much as I can about things that I find fascinating to the point of obssession, I'm not really interested in the things I am suppossed to be interested in, although I can be nice to people I also use it as a form of manipulation at times and although I have yet to be tested by an actual doctor, I did score within the you maybe autistic range in two short tests that my sister sent me because for the longest time she had a hunch that I had something going on.
I will say watching Dungeon Meshi's German dub is the best choice ive ever made. I find the voices match their personalities more to how i imagined them in the manga. It's perfect
I haven't watched the german dub, but I HAVE seen the meme of only marcille being dubbed in german, and that was pretty funny.
@WritinRealSlow that meme is what got us to watch in German but it's basically perfect. I agree with all the voices which is cool for a change
@@yaboi3955 cool
using bitter water for falin fits so well 😭💖 i was on a diff site so i thought i accidentally pressed smth when it played 😭😭
It’s funny how our own life experiences make us love or hate certain characters. You don’t like Kabru for obvious reasons and I despise Izutsumi because she reminds me of a former friend who treated everyone badly because of her trauma and to top it off she had another friend who justified this and kept saying she’d never get better if everyone abandoned her, except she never got better no matter how many times she was told she hurt people and while I left that relationship behind her other friend is still putting up with abuse and constant abandonment and reunion with her. Izutsumi is going to change because she’s a character in a story but right now I’m having a visceral dislike of her.
And that's completely fair, your relationship to a character is a complicated and personal journey.
@@WritinRealSlow hope it didn’t come off as anger at you for not liking Kabru because I have zero feeling about him. I keep forgetting he’s even part of the show. It was meant as way of agreeing with you that it’s weird and unpleasant to see so many people go crazy for a character or a ship you fundamentally cannot like because of your own experiences. Unlike you at least liking Kabru as a character in a story I have yet to find anything to like about Izutsumi unfortunately. So far she has just been an upsetting addition to a group of characters I really love. Seeing them constantly be upset because of her actions and her not caring brings back some very bad memories for me. If she had at least been a temporary presence like Kabru I would have been okay with her but imagine what it would do to the show if Kabru joined the group permanently and kept manipulating and using them. It has unfortunately lowered my enjoyment of the show somewhat.
@@dingdud6602 you didn't, don't worry. Trust me, plenty of other people have come across as a lot angrier over kabru and my criticisms.
Haha! Kabru is probably the biggest miss if you don't know the whole story xD
As a manga reader, i ship kabru and mithrun more..l
Well damn, I can't wait to see their dynamic then!
This elf is Italian
I’m honestly suprised no one has pointed out that Kabru is very likely also neurodivergent, but in a different part of the spectrum
I've seen people talk about it before, but I don't really see it.
Is the background music in the intro to this an I Fight Dragon's song? it really stuck out to me!
Nope, it's the 8-bit version of the Good Kid song "Nomu." Here, give the original a listen, they're one of my favorite bands!
czcams.com/video/cJvJOsSfVcg/video.html
CZcams told me to give a review to this video, i did but why do they need reviews ?
I have no earthly idea.
When Falin ate the dragon meat... Was that cannibalism?
From a certain point of view, I suppose
@@WritinRealSlow just watched the new episode... And is their plan? Is that?
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@@freazeezy It makes more sense when you see the finale.
I'm on the same page as you with Kabru. Something very messed up about that guy and his party. The way they killed the bandits I was shocked but rationalized it became they can be revived. But then they dumped the bodies so they wouldn't be found. And they did it casually! That's not normal Kabru.
However I do like Kabru as a character still. Hes manipulative but he is also a people pleaser. He ate the monster meal even though he was getting traumatic childhood flashbacks. He really didn't need to eat it even if it was for a longer game. I wonder if some of his behavior comes from being raised by elves? Id like to learn more about Kabru. But the dude is a creep!
Izutsumi its... Complicated ans kabru and Mithrun are very interesting characters and somehow are right...
I'm seee...
Livers fine flavor wise. Cooked correctly it tastes like a very VERY dry iron rich steak. Common cooked with onions to remove the blood smell but it adds a more sour bitter taste to the meal that it doesn’t need.
The texture on the other hand is pretty terrible. That’s why it’s commonly used for pâté in which it’s mashed into paste then mixed with mayo or some other ingredient to remove the overall negative experience.
Animals livers flavor is diet also dependent. Cows being the most common taste sorta grassy.
I would eat liver if I’m feeling anemic (such as after donating blood) and once you hit a curtain age your body will crave it if your blood is thin. That’s why it’s popular with seniors citizens who aren’t allowed to eat much salt but need a zinc and iron rich meal.
yeah, the texture was a big problem for me.
kabru my beloved I love manipulative characters
when i was reading the manga i also didn't like kabru at all! I hated his he thought so highly of himself when honestly he didn't have the skills to back it up, and acts as holier than thou while murdering other people and letting one of his party members have a slave. What made me like his character (VAGUE SPOILERS) was when he was put in his place by people even more manipulative than him and was forced to interact with someone else i didn't trust, which ended up making me understand and appreciate both of them better. Can't wait for season two!
45:43
this is how I understand this scene
in this scene I know that Laois in the moment sees Izutsumi as more monster than person, and as such, Is a novelty that must be analysed and understood, his passion for monsters clouding his judgment of what is harmful to her more than anything.
and I feel like this might play an important part for Laois narratively as a starting point for him to get better from.
or at least I hope.
It would be an understatement to say that if Laios and Izutsumi don't get more character development together or apart, it would kinda suck.
Thank you! I cannot stand Kabru either. Love him as a character, but I can't stand him. He feels like a politician, manipulative, slimy and self interested. He's a perfect foil. I'm excited to see what happens in the show with him and Shuro and the elves.
Laios is best boy and very relatable as a character. I love all of the character though, they all work so well together
yass marcille best character. i really really like her and by the end of the manga she had become of my favorite anime characters period. i dont fully agree on the criticisms but i think the pace pre-falin-revival is truly a bit weird, and i always thought of it in the terms that kui probably didn't had the story figured out by that point.
also thank you for your coment about people with autism needing to learn to relate and act around other people. i grew up around an autistic person who is really adamant on getting things his way and not abiding by others people's feelings or manners so while i think it's important that we are better understood as people that can struggle in some areas i appreciate that someone talks about how that traits also can hurt people sometimes and it's something that needs to be worked on
I will fight you on that, cause Izutsumi is the best character. They are all amazing though.
I'll see you in the Denny's parking lot at dusk then. Prepare to be vanquished!
I’m here for the good kid music-
Glad I could provide then
@@WritinRealSlow lmfao, good video btw ^^
Thanks! ^_^