Ice and soreness | Ask Rip #43
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- čas přidán 27. 02. 2017
- In this seminar Q and A edition, Mark Rippetoe answers questions about heart rate training, using ice for DOMS and injuries, and keeping clients motivated.
Recorded at the Starting Strength Seminar at Gig Harbor Strength and Fitness in January 2017.
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We've officially run out of interesting questions to ask this man.
Found the salty climate changer
I don't know why, but I enjoy his crankiness
Man Rip allways got the coolest t-shirts. He obviously loves Alien. I've been thinking about buying that t-shirt for months.
reanimated6 what’s the shirt
Romance thing was awesome! :)
Rip's answers are pure wisdom.
2:02 "but did you die???"
Lol
awesome job
I pity the fool who asked the heart rate question.
But that prompted the most hilarious response from Rip
The tanning part had me rolling 😂😂
No such thing as a dumb question if the person asking is legitimately ignorant
He doesn't deserve your pity because he is only looking for an excuse to avoid hard training and to change the goal from increasing strength to decreasing (the presumably dangerous) heart rate. This question is the equivalent of "What about stretchin'?" (What about it; who cares?)
He is just asking question that people generally ask. I have meet a lot of people that are very concerned with there heart rate. Rip is not one of them clearly.
Rip points his pointer finger to address a question like he's billy the kid.
Tendonitis is an old term for tendinopathy. Tendinopathy means pain in the presence of maladaptive structural changes (including increased tendon cell numbers, disorganisation of collagen and localised vascular growth) seen with an MRI. The source of tendinopathy is not associated with inflammatory markers (thus 'itis' is an incorrect suffix) but, importantly current studies have not determined the cause of the pain symptoms. However, it has been proposed that increased localised cell metabolism may produce the nociceptive/pain response. Isometric holds seem to be the gold standard for treatment before integrating concentric and then eccentric strength training. Additionally, the former exercise also produces an analgesic/pain relieving effect, which permits a person to continue with regular training.
"Give them meth."
So true.
Pour it on thick! I love Mark.
rips shirt is epic
colt45irish yes!
I think with ice baths is more of a mental thing both making soreness feel better and mentally preparing you to go through uncomfortable situations etc.
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I cant imagine spending 500 dollars to go to this thing and asking about heart rates during workouts
Weyland Yuttani top good one
Mr Rippletoe what's your tanning 1RM?
The first guy may be misinformed, but the question isn't that crazy. There is a lot of medical advice for both the elderly and obese (really, anyone statistically at risk of heart trouble) about a "safe heart rate" to not exceed, so this question seems inevitable.
Easy answer would be, heart monitor training is for cardio athletes.
Yeah, I thought the same thing. Heart monitoring is useful for cardio exercising (aerobic) intended to work the heart rate to X for Y time.
For lifting, which is short anaerobic movements, it's not useful at all. The heart isn't being intentionally stressed to X for Y time.
Yeah but I don’t think you go to Valhalla if you use a heart rate monitor
That really only applies to jogging and other long cardio. Your heart does not really need exercise it just gets worn out by running, but a high heart rate for short bursts is good for you.
I think the first question regarding heart monitering can be insightful.. I have a friend that has Hypertrophic cardiomyopathy (HCM) and he has long been wondering if he can even do strength training. Now he does isolated movements, but sometimes I wonder if it would be possible for him to train strength even though he has this limitation
Dino Perzon of course he can do this! In this case of course you would monitor the trainees heart rate. Hell ya he can squat press and deadlift. There is a weight for him today, doesn't have to be heavy. If you do it right he might not even get too sore. Little aches n pains here or there but nothing out of the ordinary.
Work as hard as you can given within programmed parameters and eat a ton of good food. The benefits will out weight the negatives.
Yes, dredge up an example from the depths of the minority so that you can play contrarian. Sad!
He can reverse it with some fasting
shit... my heavy sets of 5 or so have had my HR at 180 at times. on leg day.
Know Rip before you ask a question!
The latest research shows ice on injuries slows recovery. We put ice on damaged tissue only because that's what we've always done.
Exactly. He said it causes vasoconstriction for a muscle belly tear....which it does, but why would you want that? You need the inflammation for healing to occur
@@kw12784 only use cold therapy on a muscle tear as bleeding management and allow the clotting cascade to catch up. Beyond that there's some use of it in cardiac arrest, but that's even as of this writing experimental. There's no reason to use ice any other time.
@@oliverallen5324 agreed
i really enjoyed this video and you did a nice job....
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bull on the icing comment Rip makes here. I had/have sinus tarsi syndrome in my left ankle and I experience lots of inflammation pain. Ice is the only thing that knocks the inflammation and the pain way down. And btw, sinus tarsi syndrome is a deep injury where the area it occurs gets minimal blood flow in general.
It might make you feel better, probably mostly because you think it does. But it does not help with the recovery from the injury, inflammation is an important part of healing the injury.
It's just numbing it. Do some red light/NIR and it will actually heal.
this comment I made 3 years ago. The sinus tarsi syndrome in my left ankle turned out to be a misdiagnosis. I have a fracture, bones spurs and an impingement. I'm having surgery done to correct it in Jan 2022.
Start at 12:30 everything before that is a waste of time...
God bless you
Thank you thank you
the hero we've been waiting for
"We build walls."
#StartingTrump ;)
"And ice our balls."
A set of 5 is supposed to take 30-45 seconds? My squat sets take for sure atleast a minute, if not more. Do I need to drop down in weight?
Maybe you shouldn't wait so long between the reps.
Should be aiming to do them fast as you can, breathe brace squat. if your finding yourself fighting the weight all the way up then possibly lowering the weight will help or, warm up with some box jumps or jumping squats or even just some fast body weight squats
ROFL What about the chinese olympic weight lifting teams coach's ice on the nuts trick?!
Urban Survivalcraft )
Who goes to a Rip seminar and asks about heart rate?
Instead of ice do red light/near infrared
What's up with the orange theory guy at a starting strength seminar.
Everybody's Hart rate will be different.
Rip tore the first dude up
Question for Rip which relates to content in this video: If Ice does not work for tendinitis in the knees (and trust me - I know it doesn't) what does? I've been on a prescription of bodyweight exercises for my patellar tendinitis and have made no success in fixing the issue. Ideas? It would be appreciated thanks.
Travis Caruana low bar squats fixed my tendonitis in the knee. and the stance adjustment. widened my stance a bit and made sure to open the hips-turn the whole leg out to follow the toes, not just the knee- even before the descent. let me know if it helped
Fixing form or lowering stress usually help. If you are training more than your bodies ability to recover can handle you will usually start to get some tendonitis as well. I usually start to get bicep tendonitis when i get close to my deloads/low stress weeks.
red light/NIR. Submaximal work in lots of low volume sets like he talks about in his tennis elbow article.
"Do you think your body's response to injury is wrong?" -Gary Reinl, author of _Iced! The Illusionary Treatment Option_
Oh geez why is that kids even in the class room?
Just get stronger.
Mr. Rippetoe what do you currently squat for 3 x 5? I'm just curious.
Ben Martin he squatted about 335 for 11
Ice is good for reducing inflammation and has other benefits too
"Let em smoke meth!" 😂😂😂
"[how can you motivate people to CONTINUE doing the program long term?] This program should appeal to the broad general population, it SHOULD though, but it won't.... The average IQ in this population (gym people) is 100-- those people are not gonna be swayed by reason, logic and analysis, the threshold for that is about 120 IQ, andddd, well, you can't make people smarter, this program works EVERY TIME IS TRIED, because it's arithmetic, it works every time [if you see progress in the results]...this is perceived by most people as boring, so you squat today and tomorrow they come and What are we doing today? squat, but we squatted yesterday, sure but we are doing that today again except we will squat 5 MORE pounds today, most people don't see the excitement in that; there are a lot more romantic programs out there than the one we got here..."
A guy told me recently at the gym, What are you gonna work today? I said Everything, I am gonna squat. He says, Again, you always DO LEGS!! Why don't eer do anything else, [I do actually, but this is my primary exercise for the day, or DL] so he tells me this in spite of the fact that I lift more than anyone else in the gym and I am considerably stronger and bigger physically than most guys there, except for the ones taller [can't do a thing about that] or naturally bigger boned, but even those guys can't lift more than I can nor are they more solid than me, they look and you can see they are soft as they move around; those guys are always talking about a mythical pump and how great if feels, Rip is right that those guys will never VOLUNTARY make strong great efforts, they refer to tell their buddies that they lifted 135 halfway for 15 reps than say they did 4 or 5 reps with 350 --- to them they did more BENEFICIAL work. So they have been in the gym a lot longer than me and still lift the EXACT same weight. Rip just answered my question as to Why they don't accept or adopt this Strength Method.
same thing happens to me, I´m so tired of being asked "what are you doing today?" and then receiving blank stares upon replying "compound lifts" or "its intensity day" or "volume day". What i find strange is that even though I outlift everyone at my gym, no one ever approaches me with programming questions or "why compounds" etc. They all just go back to doing their usual routines making no progess at all, either aesthetically or in strength. Rip is right, this isn´t a mass appeal method of training, because the masses (sadly) cannot think very far ahead (sounds arrogant but it just true - i honestly wish it were different)
Can you ice your liver? Lol
I wish
Hi guys, got a question to all starting strength coaches:
Why to so many pro powerlifters like ray williams or malanichev squat with eyes looking forward if your method is the most efficient with eyes on the floor as you say?
Rip is very clear his audience is the general public. Power lifting is a whole different issue.
He’s trying to get people who have never squared before, have tight hips and weak glutes to do a squat.
Because when you have done a movement for years you can personalize the technique.
its just a cue to help novices maintain posture during the lift
Holly shit he sounds condescending
There are alot of gyms that do all kinds of stupid shit lol
I disagree Rip. I think walls are very romantic, especially when built on our southern border.
shit rip, u old
but i still mirin'
This is why icing should occur for 20mins so as the coolness can penetrate deep enough. 20mins for each hour of the 1st 48hrs.
GREAT FUCKING SHIRT!
that heart rate questions are stupid..
14:25 If everybody was a genius the average IQ would still be 100. Roasted.
what
@@AcceleratingUniverse IQ is a bell curve, 100 is the average. No matter how smart or dumb people are, 100 will always be the average.
I'm a former "cardio athlete" and Rip's guesstimates on heart rate are COMPLETELY off for my experience. If you are going even close to failure (which is the 1RM or 5RM or whatever RM you want, or the final set of five) then your heart rate is at max. That's the very reason you've failed - your heart can't get the required blood through the muscle to keep it going. Your lungs can't supply enough oxygen to exchange the CO2 and O2. That said - he's completely completely correct about the RELEVANCE of heart rate. You aren't training your heart. It is simply expressing the difficulty of the task. I wouldn't stop squatting because I was at 95% heart rate. I would stop when my body dropped the weight, or I just survived the rep. You perceive this quite easily once you've been lifting for only 3-4 weeks.
Xplora213 I'm not sure he meant 5rm, since this is a SS seminar and he's probably talking about a set of 3x5 which is not a 5rm.
Crim what was your experience of the 3rd set across as you got 1 month from the end of your novice linear progression? I found it completely soul crushing as I struggled to overcome the weight. Breathless means 95+ % heart rate for me.
Xplora213 Honestly I can't remember, but nothing really compares with the prowler at this point in my training. V day on TM sucked too.
Simply incorrect.
Short-duration, high-intensity exercise such as 5rm uses anaerobic energy systems (e.g ATP+CP) and failure has nothing to do with insufficient gas exchange. Failure in this example is caused by depletion of stored energy and accumulation of fatigue metabolites which all reduce/prevent further muscle contraction.
Heart rate peaks *AFTER* a 5rm due to something called EPOC, google it
Nah. I am still a cardio 'athlete' & have been lifting 90% 1RM x5 for quite a while during the novice progression & my HR gets nowhere near max even at the end of my last set of 5. With a 1RM my HR barely gets going until after the bar is back on the rack. I do use HR as a means of determining of I'm recovered between sets though & will increase my rest period of HR is still significantly elevated.
Just getting stronger isn't very functional. I went that route and your body is basically only good at lifting really heavy things very few times. In daily life I just fatigued quickly and were stiff and immobile by carrying around useless body mass. That's one reason why so few people want to train that way. Another factor is of course esthetics. A powerlifter doesn't look good period.
Your muscle is where your BMR comes from and makes you more insulin sensitive. If you become a giant fat power lifter it is not healthy but if you are strong and reasonably lean then it is the healthiest thing you can do for your body.
First guy's accent is so annoying. Can he decide where he's from?