John Brown: Hero? Villain? Martyr?: Civil War West Virginia
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- čas přidán 6. 11. 2020
- The capture, trial and hanging of John Brown thrust the nation one step closer to armed conflict. Garry Adelman is joined by former park ranger and Co-Founder of the American Battlefield Trust Dennis Frye to discuss the complicated legacy of John Brown at the site where he ultimately took his last breath.
Learn more about John Brown's Legacy in Frye's article: www.battlefields.org/learn/ar...
Look for our numerous videos on CZcams over the next week, and special thanks to all the donors who helped make this trip possible!
This guy is perfect for the job of explaining this!
Awesome!
Another terrific presentation Dennis.
What a great job telling this story. The whole story of Harper's Ferry and John Brown is key to understanding the Civil War.
Please include Dennis more often! He brings the past to life in a way few can.
Thank you.
Yes please include him more
Every guest historian that Garry has had in this series and including Garry himself has been phenomenal. Great job Dennis.
Alwsome true story of John Brown. Very interesting stuff. Thank you so much for preserving history.
It has never ceased to amaze me that John Brown has always gotten such minor notice in American History. Granted he was on the national stage for a short time but how pivotal he was. I wish they had covered how his action at Harper's Ferry was international news and read about around the world.
There is moving coming out, or would have been out earlier about John Brown. Ethan Hawke plays John Brown.
The Union has never been so divided as it was back in the mid 1850's as it is today. The USA is heading dead on with an existential crisis: mountains of Debt, demographics, Political & social graft.
@guy tech. We will be fine. We've had setbacks before. Were going to be okay though and your right about division. I blame the media for it. We will be okay.
Dennis Frye is one of our greatest historians. His presentations inspire me to read and look into this history - our history. Same for Garry Adelman; they are gifted presenters.
Thank you for the clarification on why Brown wasn't tried by the Federal court system!
They tried him for treason against Virginia, yet he had never lived in VA. John Wilkes Booth appropriated a VA military uniform and was also present at the hanging. Thanks Dennis, you're a real storytelling kinda guy.
@David Vazquez No. Check it out. Booth was definitely at Brown's hanging.
@David Vazquez Do I have to draw you a picture? Read a history book.
@David Vazquez Google: John Wilkes Booth attends hanging of John Brown. Booth was acting in Richmond at the time. He learned that the VA Militia was going to cordon off the
hanging site. He had contacts. He borrowed one of their uniforms and attended the hanging. He later expressed admiration for Brown, calling him a "brave old man.
Was just reading about him last week...perfect timing! Thank you for this video.
I could listen to this guy all day.
This is excellent. Makes me glad to be a contributing member.
As always Mr.Dennis, just amazing sir. Thank you so much!
Wonderful videos guys! Thanks for giving us the REAL history.
This is such a great channel, keep up the good work you do.
Brown's last words still ring ominously, especially in these turbulent times.
@Garrison Nichols It's not North versus South. In the world of our time it will be the "have" versus "have not" as the people rise up against the super-rich oligarchs who own everything (media, pharmaceuticals, technology, military industrial complex, lobbyists, politicians, big retail, universities, etc. etc.).
@Garrison Nichols That's your point of view and I respect it. But, it's not the point of view of many other Americans. We need to come together as a people and nation and put an end to this cancellation thinking and rhetoric on all sides of the political spectrum. Have a good day my friend... :)
@Garrison Nichols Seems like there is a bit of self-rightous loathing in your heart too. But as the great Carl Jung wrote, a man who sees no shadow inside will always see it in others... Please feel free to have the last word... :)
Rob brown-winner of debate
@@Hubcapdiamondstarhalo Let's try and get past the idea of winner and loser and cultivate what we can make of a nation and world in which we value cooperation and unity... We can do this if we focus upon the endeavor and think of what we leave as our legacy for those who come from us in time; our children, grandchildren and others. All the best to you in these difficult times. Have a healthy and happy holiday season... :)
Nice video! A few years back, the owners of that property, who know my brother, allowed us to come in and view the house inside and of course also the hanging site of John Brown that is over your right shoulder near the house.
You two guys are awesome. Thank you 🙏
These are great videos that really being history to life with passion and conviction.
John Wilkes Booth was also present and photographed at Harpers Ferry with the Virginia Militia.
As an actor?
@@allenschmitz9644 Apparently he "borrowed" a uniform. At least that's what I read.
Learning more on every video.. great presentation. Thank you
As the legendary and honorable Ed Bearss once said: "John Brown, John Brown...very important person in the war..." Loved Raymond Massey's portrayal of John Brown in the semi-fictional film "Santa Fe Trail".
Accurate history is so important. Great channel! Great videos.
Well done. Thank you.
Your the
Best Dennis
Best American Civil War History Teachers on CZcams -
Apparently John Brown is my Great Great Grandfather.
Thank you!
Great video, very interesting contents and hi level explanation. Love it.
The most important thing is that the trial was the OJ trial of its time. Reporters from around the country descended upon the city and filed nightly reports from the telegraph offices that would appear in the next edition of their newspapers. It was sensational, divisive, and ultimately framed the 1860 election, which resulted in Lincoln's victory less than a year later.
Dennis is fantastic!!!!!! Would love to be on a tour with him in person.
GREAT presentation, I wonder how accurate is the 1880's painting of a bound John Brown leaving the courthouse on his way to his hanging?
Heavy stuff. Thank you
Thanks for sharing.
Dennis is the man ...👌
Love the way you tell history!
Wow. That was very moving.
And his soul keeps marching on.
in hell
A good presentation of history!
Thank you so so much Dennis I enjoy your videos so much you have a gift a gift of teaching I can listen one time to your speech and I have it could one of you send me an email and show or tell me ,,us how we can help more would like to get involved Ed
Where is the house located in Charles Town? Address?
Those last words ring true still today.
I think Dennis should substitute "abolitionist" for "northern" in a few places in his talk. Not all those north of the Mason Dixon Line favored freeing the slaves; far from it!
Yep a bit Blue under the collar....is my take.
Unfortunately Gallup wasn't doing polling in those days. Certainly there was a wide range of opinion in the North, while the south went to war to preserve slavery, the north went to war to preserve the Union but as Lincoln said sooner or later the country will have to be all one thing or the other. While Lincoln opposed slavery he's generally not considered to be an "abolitionist" and I suspect the majority to be in that category, but as he evolved over time the country clearly did also.
@@emintey Evolution is a slow process, as is the formation of a more perfect union. I don't think we're there yet and unfortunately, there are no guarantees.
@@emintey I totally see what your saying. I’d add that the more loosely people use the word abolitionist, the more and more it diminishes the work and legacy of actual American abolitionists of the time. The stories are there so long as people don’t wash over them with lazy history.
@@nickybrown5019 Lincoln recognized that prior to the Civil War that slavery was constitutional and nothing could be done legally to end slavery in those states as long as majorities did not exist in congress and short of a constitutional amendment which again was off the table as far as political reality.
I see parallels now with the abortion issue. The Dred Scott decision said that free states were required to return escaped slaves to their owners. Some states are going to forbid abortion and they are already seeking to reach across state lines to keep their residents from seeking abortion services in "free" states by various means...they are going after the doctor who assisted that 10 yr. old girl from Ohio in obtaining her abortion in Indiana.
This man is wonderful. He is making this history alive, just wonderful.
This guy needs a statue in the Capitol area somewhere.
Reading Tony Horowitz book now about John Browns Raid.
Yes, I am rereading it. Horwitz was a gifted writer/historian.
@@christophersmall1261 I totally agree that Tony was a gifted writer and historian. he really makes you feel like you're actually there back in that time. I just finished Confederates in the attic and I also checked out of the library his book Spying on the south. Looking forward to reading that next
Reading Spying on the South by Tony Horwitz now. Fascinating book! I highly recommend all of Tony's books!
"...I flattered myself to think that without much bloodshed, it could be accomplished."
I was curious if someone might add that last line in John Brown's note. Does it add relevance to his previous words? I believe it does, for it adds a prophetic closing to just how bad the coming war would be. And how right he was.
I love this channel. I have a question. Does anyone know what happened to browns men? Did they all hang? If so was it on the same day? Or were they sent to jail or just freed
No mention made here that Harriet Tubman and John Brown worked together, and that she helped to recruit for those who he would need at Harper’s Ferry. John Brown referred to her as “General Tubman.”
Most of Tubman’s story is unverified
@@SR-zc6lk I’m discussing both individuals in which their collaboration has been verified.
Amazing how then and now the media can influence someone to think a certain way.
John Brown was a hard man in an age of hard men.
If only I could speak so elegantly of the truth.
The Free State Of Brown? What a thing that would be! Hopefully, President For Life Brown would address civic disorder a little less rabidly than he dispensed justice in Kansas.
The blood of the lamb
Cool!
Hero. Martyr.
Sync ?
God bless John Brown and all who fought with him.
"Some eighteen hundred years ago Christ was crucified; this morning, perchance, Captain Brown was hung. These are the two ends of a chain which is not without its links. He is not Old Brown any longer; he is an angel of light."
-Henry David Thoreau; 1859
This guy is good.
Powerful
do you get a lot of rick moranis comments?
Interesting video. What is the basis of your saying that the Virginia Militia was the National Guard?
As was the eventual case in all the states, the original "militia" system was placed under the "command" of the state governors, therefore, eventually the name would be changed to "National Guard." Still under command of the state governors, but may be called on by the President in times of crisis.
@@brendancripps8890 legal Fed. talk..dont dare succeed...or else.
@David Vazquez not the case in Massachusetts, where Ntl Guard units trace their heritage directly back to the town militia units from Lexington, Concord, Danvers, etc. things may be different in the Old Dominion, but the state militias from Mass, NY, NH, etc were, as I said, could be called out by the state governors. Since you brought up the CW, Lincoln had to request assistance from the state governors to send their state militia units to protect Washington in 1861, then after, the same with the state sponsored regiments. All done under autonomy of the governors.
For more evidence, as a good historian: (from Quora):
“I was an officer in the National Guards for 18 years. I am going to tell you what most National Guard officers would tell you.
Yes, absolutely yes, the National Guard is a militia. It does not matter what the laws say, but it is about tradition and what the conventionally understood definition of a militia is.
The National Guard units in various states work mainly within their state under state authority. Being federalized happens a lot, but is the exception to the rule.
The National Guards in various states take pride in their origins being in militia units that defended this country during the revolutionary war and proudly proclaim it.
When you are in a National Guard unit, it is made clear that you are primarily accountable to the governor of the state and there is a feeling among the men that you essentially serve as the military force of that state.”
@David Vazquez thank you for the clarification and explanation of some of the differences between the New England militia systems (which also predate the Revolution, going back to King Philip’s War, and before) and that of Old Virginia.
Also, thank you for your service and happy belated birthday! Semper Fi
@David Vazquez there is never a need to apologize for research as it adds to the greater common knowledge. I bid you the best of luck on your journeys! Cheers🍻
They should rename that street after Brown
True American hero!
The skeletons in the background where Brown was executed is inadvertently appropriate.
Congress argued for a solution to slavery for over 50 years and failed. Brown was the match that lit the fuse.
John Brown was indeed a prophet of Godly matters. God's time and our time are different. 1000 years to God is 3 days for humanity. And perhaps 3 days are 3 year's? Jesus said, "in 3 days, I will rebuild the temple"! No one really knew at the time what Our Lord meant by his parable and many laughed because they thought our Lord was referring to a physical building structure.
Here we are in the year 2020, some 400 years passed by from the time slavery was born in Jamestown Virginia.
There's a biblical prophecy about 400 years and judgements that would happen to the nation who bonded our darker skin brothers and sisters in chains of slavery.
2020, the year of judgements and still to this day both black and white people's of this once powerful nation, the ruling political parties have again bonded a nation in chains. These chains are symbolic in the form of debt slaves who are forced by the ruling class to wear masks and distance ourselves from the very people we love.
God have mercy on us for those of you who have the holy spirit of God, pray for this nation because each tax paying citizen whether you recognize it or not has indeed blood dripping from your bent swords and the innocent cries have reached as far as the heavens.
Peace to all brothers and sisters as we enter into the ruling class second civil war of 2020. Have mercy on us, O Lord God, Amen. Amen. And Amen
Dean's Nomadica, Harper's Ferry WV
wow
would have loved to be at the meeting between brown and jackson in heaven wow but i know now they are friends forever and as i have mentioned before in other post brown is and ancester of mine through my mother side and browns mother side
John Brown was unique. He was a devout and fundamentalist Calvinist in a world in which religious fundamentalism is usually linked with hatred and bigotry, but John Brown had universal Love for all, and accepted all races as being his equal. John Brown was a dogged idealist who held steadfast to his ideals, and even died for them, in a world in which all too many people are seduced by practical expediencies. The North and the South were trying to arrive at a compromise over slavery before the Civil War, but is any compromise really possible between freedom and slavery? The spiritual essence of the Civil War was that it was a war that was fought to see whether or not America could actually live up to the noble ideal enshrined in its Declaration of Independence - that all men are created equal - which John Brown said was essentially the same as the Golden Rule that his Bible taught him. My own research and personal life story has led me to believe that I may very well be the reincarnation of John Brown
And to this day he's considered a criminal. Where's his statue at Harper's Ferry? His family suffered grievously. Even the slaves' descendents couldn't care less.
@Garrison Nichols In no way can you compare those two, yes John brown did kill some civilians unnecessarily, but Stalin ordered the execution of tens of millions of innocent people. Also John Brown did it because he thought it was the right thing to do, Stalin did it because he was paranoid and power hungry.
@Garrison Nichols Kinda like a 'ME, MYSELF and I vote...call it UGANDA.
@@cadecarman6781
It was the right thing to do
he forgot to mention that this was where John Brown was murdered.
what do you think your self of john brown
Brown was a preacher and was honest about his plan to use violence and slaves to win emancipation. Lincoln was a politician and was a liar about his plan to use violence and slaves to win empanciation.
@@crimony3054
😂 his plan? They seceded and mustered an army before Lincoln was even inaugurated
Hero and Martyr. Sure thing.
John brown hero,
Americans had a lot of flair back then.
Y'all better have hit the casino lol good times
John Brown...sounds like my type of man. Especially now.
Yes...the same type of man as John Adams..who was a criminal for defying England...who said “once liberty is lost its lost forever” . men of convictions who pledged their fortunes..lives for causes that changed this world. So yes..they were criminals. Sometimes men need to be respected and admired for what they were willing to give for keyboard commandos to espouse what they want to say.
Well kind of depends on your definition of murder now doesn’t it.
@@sawboneiomc8809 If John Brown is a murderer than the word has no ethical merit.
The same way those who liberated Auschwitz are not murderers
The same way those who fought for freedom against the British are not murderers
The same way those who fought in the Civil War are not murderers
those who would say John Brown is a murderer to denigrate his character only accomplish one thing, and that is denigrate their own
John brown was violent in Missouri and Kansas before his actions in harpers ferry. I think you should do a bit more digging before deification of anyone. He views freedom right but much else very very wrong.
Holy sh÷t in the bush !😀so nice! Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha!😀
John Brown is the Michael Jordan of Abolitionist.
John Brown's obsession with the shedding of blood and founding his own country where he would rule makes him come across as a psychopath. At times I wonder if his radical abolitionism wasn't just a cover for these lusts. Regardless, a good video!
What like the hands of slave owners hands are clean? A man decides to fight for his fellow Americans freedom and you condem him. While completely silent on the sadistic depravity of the South?
@@greatsageequaltoheaven8115 Blacks weren't American citizens prior to the war so John Brown wasn't fighting to "free" his fellow Americans but fighting to "free" non-Americans by ruthlessly massacring Americans. His plan to create his own state was as insane as it was treasonous. Seriously, him and his dozen followers plus a wagonload of muskets wouldn't have ended slavery but merely, at best, incite an insurrection that would get dozens if not hundreds killed, most of those deaths would be blacks, while making emancipation even harder to sell. John Brown was either an idealistic fool, or a psychopath hellbent on spilling blood who wore the mask of an idealistic fool.
"...sadistic depravity of the South"? What are you referring to? If it's slavery, then I like to point out that Southerners had slavery thrust upon them by the English and New Englanders and freeing 3-4 million people who have been dependents their entire lives isn't exactly an easy task to accomplish, especially when there are people like John Brown running around trying to stir up a race war.
@@ZM7241994 I wish he killed more slave owners. The slavers were Americans all right lol, but that should tell you everything you need to know about the US.
@@ZM7241994 And slavery was never going to end peacefully. I would rather die then support the enslavement and torture of my fellow human beings
@@greatsageequaltoheaven8115 “whataboutism” is silly. I was a police detective for years, and never once did “But officer, you can’t arrest me for murder, because that other dude committed murder too!” work on me…
163 years later, and we still have yet to right the wrongs.
I've always thought of him as an overzealous psychopath
Southern slave owners were owning and selling their own sons and daughters. In some cases they even killed their own slave children. Psychopath seems relative in these circumstances.
@@FreshTea2411 You mean children they conceived with slaves? I'm sure you're right about that. It's awful, though I imagine it would be problematic to keep them around. Despite what I think about John Brown, I still think slavery was absolutely horrid. But the issue is more complicated than we make it out to be
"Overzealous psychopath" is indeed what most rational people think of John Brown.
@David Vazquez Not true. They are an excellent tool for pointing out societal double standards and contradicts. On the other hand people who try to ignore these double standards often employ the Whataboutism accusation to try and shut down discussion. The fact is the same standards people use to condemn Brown as a crazy murdering criminal could be used to condemn the white South as a bunch of crazy murdering criminals. If its Ok for them to do what they did then its Ok for Brown to do what he did because human empathy and compassion don't matter. If it is not ok for them then Brown is still the lesser evil by far.
@David Vazquez A Whataboutism is a rhetorical tool not the people you dummy. The Slavers Brown fought were the ones trying to use people as tools and they are the ones who are closer to Bin Landin since after the war they founded an actual terrorist organization that killed thousands and terrorized many more on American soil. I'll take Brown over them any day of the week and twice on Sunday.
Hero.
In America at John Browns time and even during the conflict. People both North and South couldn't stand abolishanists.He was way before his time.Only in America was slavery an issue.Most of the world could really care less.
Yeah most places moved past slavery without a civil war
I just shot a White Tail Buck an hour ago! I can use the tail and join the "Bucktail Brigade!"
Did the poet write anything about Brown's victims?
Maybe he listed the slaves they killed during their life span, who knows.
@@NKDuisburg02 Wut?
The Pottawatomie massacre during Brown's Bleeding kansas period; the slaughtering of men in front of their families, would kind of make him a villain to many
That's fine, don't own slaves then. And you're in the minority
Judging from his disastrous strategy at Harpers Ferry, his plan must have been to become a martyr. I don't think he ever intended to get away with it, or perhaps he did, then when he saw that the slave uprising wasn't going to happen, he switched plans. Only thing I don't like about it is he how took his young followers with him.
Abraham Lincoln called John Brown a villain. The south calls him a villain, because he’s the one that made the south leave
Nope the had a Legal right to leave the confederacy with the union.
@@allenschmitz9644 Yep
@@allenschmitz9644
They didn't but whatever. The right to secede is nowhere in the constitution.
@@dillonblair6491 (yes it is.)
@@allenschmitz9644
Where does it actually say states are allowed to secede or are you going to do a really BS reading of the constitution to arrive at whatever conclusion you want?
Dennis, I have some of your books and really admire your work, but I feel that you didn't really give the full picture here and gave a popularized and biased view of Brown. Much of the modern day perspective of John Brown being a terrorist and a villiain is centered around facts that I would hope that we can all agree on. While Brown wanted to free the slaves (which is the right way to feel by the standards of both that day and the current day), he murdered many innocent people to bring attention to this. While slavery is morally indefensible, so is the murder of innocent human beings. You also failed to mention that he murdered innocent people, including free people of color during his raid in Harpers Ferry. The first man that he killed when entering Harpers Ferry was a freed slave named Heyward Shepherd. John Brown, as many other people during this time period, has had his image used to further political purposes while leaving out many of the horrific, evil, and frankly insane things that he did to further his goal of liberating the slaves. As with everything in history, there are multiple sides to every story.
"Many?" Like who and how many were confirmed to die by his hand? Heyward Shepherd was a free man and born free. His death was basically an accident and he was not killed by Brown himself. The pro slavery supporters in Kansas were NOT innocent. They had sacked Lawrence and the death and violence against people like Minister Lovejoy were a recent memory.
On the night of May 24, 1856, the radical abolitionist John Brown, five of his sons, and three other associates murdered five proslavery men at three different cabins along the banks of Pottawatomie Creek, near present-day Lane, Kansas. Hero's don't murder people. Martyr's don't murder people.
Good people don't support slavery. John Brown did nothing wrong but fail in his attempt.
"Pro-slavery men" = slaver scum
Hero
Dude I'm going to have to break this off. If you refuse to believe history, that is your problem, not mine. Run the google I told you to. It lists several books dealing with this. Or you can pick up Professor James McPherson's books on the Civil War. Booth's sister, Asia, also wrote a book about his escapades.
John Brown had narcissistic tendency's at the time. He was wanting to start a country under rule of he himself. He tried to recruit free slaves and in slaved slaves. Very few followed. John Brown was in this for himself, he got what he deserved
Not one single text said he enslaved people enjoy your revisionist history johny Reb.
@@morugofuzuoku2369 I think he meant that Brown tried to recruit slaves that were still in bondage.
John Brown killed slavers. Idgaf about your revised history that the oppressors taught you
Ah, you knew him personally? Lucky you! Or was it just the story telling of some dude, who doesnt like JB because of state rights lol.
Hero
Hero.