AFDD Regulations in BS7671, Other Information (Part 3)
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- čas přidán 15. 02. 2019
- Which regulations in BS7671 refer to AFDDs, a look at various information from manufacturers of these devices, and another attempt at creating arcs to trip the device.
Part 1: • AFDD - Arc Fault Detec...
Part 2: • AFDD Arc Fault Detecti...
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JW you have absolutely nailed this. Is it that the people that write such regs actually just sit around a table without the first inclination of practicality or even any concrete evidence that their ideas actually work???? It’s sadly a case of idiots coming up with nonsense which gives manufacturers license to then go and exploit and scaremonger both contractors and customers alike.
Watched all 3 and I have to agree. I was expecting the device to actually trip under the arc condition test, let alone shooting 280v+ down it and nothing happening in part 2
The whole series from JW is a masterclass in clear and concise teaching JW's handling of AFDDs has the added advantage of pointing out that AFDDs are a solution looking for a problem in the vast majority of use cases and his "triangle of doom" is brilliant.
I think the fire resulting from a electrical fault will have been well in progress by the time that AFDD trips. Waste of time and money.
Very informative series John. What I've learned here about this (But probably most) AFDD(s) is: They are expensive to buy, they are expensive to install (bigger box), they are expensive to run, they are little more than a comfort blanket.
Sounds like a manufacturer trying to create a market.
Well, when you've invented a "solution" you need to persuade the public (and regulators) that there is a matching problem that needs fixing.
Next step:- lobby to have fitting AFDD's made mandatory. :(
Very much so. Manufacturers create problem which doesn't exist and IET blow it out of proportion just to create market for those manufacturers.
Wow! JW.
Another cracking public service video.
Great breakdown and final test.
These devices appear to be not fit for public use. Looking forward to additional testing of other devices.
Worth noting arc fault devices are referenced in the 17th edition. And3 so these were planned. Also that when afdd was introduced in America fire statistics went up and. It down.
This smells of the old RCDs protect against fire rhetoric and yet now it appears we have been fitting wrong types and they only protect against earth leakage..! Not l-n faults.
Thanks for the efforts... tempted to do a video a separate video on the subject myself...luckily we have always told people at our lectures do not go near afdd until proven to work and you can independently test!
R. D. It’s not hard if you know where to go, who to ask and have the time and money. Test can be independently verified using a independent Laboratory, or the old fashioned real world simulator. Or just go to the people who make it as proof read the evidence against standards... always a task in itself
R. D. Errrr no, we have crossed wires it appears. There is no means of on site testing the devices. If you wish to test as in verify against the standard then you could ask to see manufacturers data or have it independently tested
R. D. Also they are only sample tested under the standard, which means many will have never been tested and yet leave the factory.... #research
Excellent video, thank you. It makes you wonder how this device conforms to the British Standard. Would be interesting to hear what BSI and the manufacturer have to say on the subject!
Great vid John, good demo at the end. Thanks for taking the time and effort, much appreciated.
So the information I gather from another extremely useful JW video is that AFDDs are complete bollocks.
@@r.h.8754 Of course it would, L-N fault / a short circuit would trip the CB [Circuit Breaker] / the over-current part of the RCBO (combination of a CB & RCD) RCD monitors your current imbalance; identifying a Live to Earth current.
L-N fault is an Over Current: a severe over current.
I agree with JW these AFDD units are not sensitive enough be a safety feature.
@@johnking1812 And if they made them even slightly more sensitive they would be a massive nuisance. There are multiple comments by people from the US (where this is mandatory) in the first part of this series saying these devices trip with any sort of power tools, sewing machines, laser printers, etc. They're apparently fitted just for inspection and replaced soon after with a regular MCB.
I'm with you JW.. Pile of crap! ☹️ Thanks for the extra load test. I can't imagine how they can get away with selling these things. £200 plus each! Lol.. Won't be recommended to any of my customers I'm afraid.
Out of curiosity I priced up a wylex board for a "small house" and it was well over £1200 for the consumers unit alone, that's just rediculous
These are really useful videos John. You’ve really opened my eyes here. I fell for it for a while and got sucked into the whole issue. I feel stupid and disappointed. Thanks John!
_John Ward And The Triangle Of Doom_
Great film.
Great video. Good to have an engineer do practical tests and unbiased analysis.
I am about to have my CU replaced and your videos have proven an oasis of solid, insightful practical analysis to assist me in selecting the upgrade options. Thank you.
thanks again for all the information. really useful.
I have an idea for an improved device. The AFDDGTD.
Arc Fault Detection Gremlin Throwing Dices. It consists of a tiny gremlin in a box with a current meter,a switch and a dice. Any time he sees the current change he rolls a dice. When he rolls a 20 the Gremlin shuts of the power.
Maybe it is a timing issue so many per millisecond then resets, as every plug / switch will arc momentarily at switch on or when pushed into a socket. These things would trip every time a plug was put in or a switch thrown. They must surely have some smart way of ignoring the type of arcing you were doing which is similar to a bunch of things being plugged into a strip for example. A vibrator circuit with variable speed might be interesting.
Brilliant video as usual.
I would guess adding the good old JW arc welder to the circuit might actually trip the device instead of the heater. Big inductor to get a nice arc on the "sample broken wire" would be the trick, plus the Boing as the arc makes and breaks will be good as well.
Yes I think possibly it needs to be a sustained arc to trip as they are the more dangerous ones that will heat things up. Momentary arcs are going to happen all the time during switching, etc, so would be a big nuisance if it tripped with those.
Thanks John for the info.
Thanks for the info. Great video.
the TRIANGLE OF DOOM, great video!
Thanks for the video
Thanks once again John 🇮🇪
Thanks for the video John......
Can't wait to install a three foot wide ten way AFDD+ RCBO or RCD unit, equiped board...in a nice tiny cupboard under someones stairs...Ha.. Like in your video, the eight way board...each AFDD takes up a minimum of two or three ways plus the main switch.
Great Video John. perhaps we should plug one into an welder and see what sort of current will make it trip!
I wonder if i had one of these afdd's fitted i would ever be able to use my welder
Hi John thanks for your great video - We have these specified on a job (the AFDDs you reviewed) but I can't figure out how to incorporate them onto a single phase or 3 phase busbar? Looking for Eaton ones in particular.. Can you help please?
The Eaton ones are intended to fit onto a specific Eaton busbar, which has both L&N prongs in it and then a gap.
@@jwflame thank you John that's what I thought.. Will contact Eaton to find out which ones as I can't find them anywhere!!
All the best I subscribed today!!
perhaps the "replace with 6000°C" originally read "the surface of the sun" i.e. more scaremongering?
Just this weekend tested an ABB AFDD and it tripped just fine, was using a vacuum cleaner as load though. Maybe yours is crappy, or broken? You should definetly ask the manufacturer for a statement. Last time I took one of these apart I noticed that the test button only tested the ability to disconnect, not the ability to detect high frequency current. Do you have a scope? Maybe have a look at the currents and try to filter out
The VDE Standard in Germany has required the AFDD also nearly everywhere, but due to the many problems with wood house manufacturing companies the standard is currently not in use. The VDE Standard regarding AFDD will be redefined in 2019.
BS 7671 19th regs
Definitions . Consumer unit. A self extinguishing computer controlled system that is linked to the fire alarm system that’s linked to the fire suppression system that sometimes provides power to an installation if it decides there is no risks detected through heat , arc, earth leakages, overloading,thermal sensors , hart monitors of the occupancy’s It also incorporates emergency lights and back up self fire suppression system that must be tested at least every quarter that we will change to six months later on if we decide. It will also have 20 unused ways left to be added to at the whims of any other invention or whimsical ideas we can think of. It will also accompanied with a consumer-interface to explain everything and be complete with battery back up .
christastic100 oh my that is hysterical and sadly poignant
Did Roald Dhal used to write for BEAMA, a warning not to read late at night is required!.
Or did an estate agent write this?.
I assume a Carbon Arc lamp would trip it, ref rectification of the AC?.
Great video Mr J.W, thanks for sharing.
There is no overvoltage protection mentioned or recommended or taking in account, only overcurrrent at 2:06 on the mark 532.6 so that should be a extra feature on the DUT but didn't triggerred at all .
Great video john. David Savery Electrical Services did a good video using a Lego device to cause to trip a crabtree version.
Yes, have seen that. The problem there is that it only tripped after the addition of some salt water to create an arc that the device would detect - and salt water being added to damaged cables is not a realistic situation that would occur in someones house or other building.
The video is here if anyone want's to see it: czcams.com/video/JRXFZHKGaXg/video.html
@@jwflame I was glad to see you had similar trouble getting the bally thing to trip in a lab environment - I think I was at it for about two hours with a 1500W heater on a hot July day in a 30C office trying to create and sustain an arc on that daft Lego contraption without success! The saltwater, while unrealistic, was the only way to create the signature arc to demonstrate the thing operating on camera! I put my failed efforts down to pure doofusness, but if you can't demonstrate it doing its thang either, then it rather raises a question mark over the effectiveness of the technology!
So conclusion is at 23:56 czcams.com/video/JRXFZHKGaXg/video.html
John could you make a future video opening one up and seeing exactly how they operate. Obviously only when its worth it financially i.e when they have dropped in price considerably!
Any plans on doing a run through on spd units and how they fit/wire into boards ? Cheers John
Yes.
The pdf talks about the high rated ones are for higher loads, yours I think is 16A - perhaps try running an even higher load - or perhaps spring for the 6a version and see if it can discriminate better.
It would not surprise me if the arc detection bit was the same across the range...
A great exposé of the device JW.
How often is the Voltage in your house going to be over 230v. I believe that the incoming voltage to households is going to swing between 220 and 245v depending on who else is using what equipment on the leg from the sub-station. If the voltage is liable to go over 230V - does this mean therefore that they should not be installed.
The overvoltage function is intended to disconnect if a fault occurs and the voltage exceeds 270V. This could happen if the neutral link was damaged (or stolen) from the supply transformer, or could also happen with a lost neutral to a 3 phase board supplying single phase circuits.
Maximum voltage allowed in the UK is 253V, so the overvoltage part should never trip in normal use.
Did you say "deception devices" ? Right at the beginning.
It would be interesting test the affd connected to a very old television etc, but without a simulated fault.
Why is the neutral more likely to burn out in shower isolator sw if its ac ? Cheers.. another descriptive vid john.
Electrically there is no difference. May be because people don't tighten the neutral properly.
@@jwflame it just seems i remember far more neutrals burning out in pull cords and have always wondered why if its ac.....cheers jw
Arc are a USA NEC requirement for most all outlets in a home and GFCI/AFCI is required for kitchens and bathrooms and garage/outdoor wet locations
8:46 - "The 32/40 A types are intended for branches with high loads ONLY (e.g. electrical radiators)."
This would presumeably exclude use on a ring where the load is dependent on the number of items plugged in and switched on...
Q - INDUSTRY: "How do we make more money on those who do not understand the matter?"
A - INDUSTRY to itself: "Let's sell them something that looks like it may protect them..."
Hi John, thank you for your recent reviews of AFDDs. Having reviewed the videos, we are really keen to provide additional information for you and online electrical communities.
As you briefly mention in your video AFDDs are relatively new for the UK market, however the technology has been in place for some period of time and is supported by a number of major international brands. As the technology is new, we have over the past months (and continue to) supported learning on the operation of AFDDs (how they work) and their application in the UK.
AFDDs are manufactured to IEC/EN 62606 which sets out requirements to detect arc faults in controlled conditions which are designed to simulate where an arc fault could introduce danger within an installation. The test laid within the standard is based broadly on the size (power concerned) and the duration of the arc to define the tripping point. This is to ensure that arc faults which could introduce a fire are detected, whilst avoiding nuisance tripping from naturally occurring arcs (e.g. light switches or rotating machinery).
We passionately believe in AFDD technology and have spoken to many installers at regional events, national events and via webinars since Summer 2018 to help to improve understanding. For those that I have spoken with directly at these events, the feedback has been really positive in that we provide a balanced view on both the technology itself and recent regulations/guidance contained within the 18th edition of the IET Wiring Regulations.
As per my email to you we would be delighted to try and find other forums to improve understanding of the technology and application and hope that you and other members of electrical communities including #e5 can help us to identify the best platforms to do this during 2019.
Marc Gaunt - Marketing Manager - Eaton Electric
Marc Gaunt What a load of drivel.
You essentially just admitted these are designed to detect a made up fault simulator rather than detecting actual danger.
You brag about your ability to make convincing sales pitches (thus lowering your actual credibility).
And then you refer to a secret message that you have chosen to hide from public scrutiny, indicating an underhanded attempt to silence criticism.
None of what you wrote addresses the extensive list of flaws in an actual Eton product and Eton marketing materials publicly demonstrated in this video.
Hi John,
Somewhere no doubt hidden within that vast boolean algebra map there lies a good idea,
Unfortunately as you pointed out it's far too convoluted and doubtful in its current form additionally I happen to think by the time you factor in capacitances mov's and other circuit elements that the mains is connected to which all will act to soak up these kind of arc's i'm left wondering whether it'll be effective much at all!
Nice format to your video, is the brick wall background here to stay?
Ok
Very good aa
I'd love to know how AFDD manufacturers test these things on the prod. line - what kind of wacky arc fault setup do they use? - you've given it a flippin' good chance to work as far as I can see :o)
Did the manufacturers hand out perks for this stuff to get mentioned in the Regs.
Consider these:
1. No manufacturer should have any influence over what goes into BS7671, and certainly not due to any commercial interests such as selling a whole range of new shiny things.
2. Many of the JPEL/64 committee members (which are responsible for what's in BS7671) work for or represent manufacturers, or for organisations which do the same.
3. The exact details of what's in a new version of BS7671 should remain secret until it's published.
4. Certain manufacturers have had new products to meet new requirements in BS7671 ready for sale on the same day that BS7671 is published.
Do the manufacturers give advice on testing these devices....for EICR's etc..?
No, the only 'test' is the button on the device.
I wonder whether the IET people tested these AFDD`s to see if they actually work.
Hello . So Eaton AFDD doesn t work but there are other manufactures .
This device gives me a lot of confidence, if I hear/see sparking in wiring/switches/devices I shall run to the consumer unit and look if the indicator is green. If it is green I can be confident it was just my imagination... and not some sparks that weren't detected.
I'd be interested in to see samples either from the same manufacturer or from others, I'm curious if they are just as bad as this eaton one. However given the cost per AFDD you showed probably not worth buying at that cost and somehow I think after these videos that other manufacturers aren't going to be too interested in sending a sample (and Eaton even less likely).
so it doesn't protect against series faults on either the line or neutral, only parallel faults between line and neutral which MCBs and RCDs already protect against.
Going to be a big CCU if all circuits are to be covered and expensive too! Definitely not consumer friendly- other than if it does actually prevent a fire, which appears a bit hit and miss.
trying to do a board change! :') board changes are hard enough without adding these poxy things !
421.1.7 goes on to say
If used, an AFDD shall be placed at the origin of the circuit to be protected. NOTE: Examples of where such devices can be used include:
Premises with sleeping accommodation
Locations with a risk of fire due to the nature of processed or stored materials, i.e. BE2 locations (e.g. barns, woodworking shops, stores of combustible materials)
Locations with combustible constructional materials, i.e. CA2 locations (e.g. wooden buildings)
Fire propagating structures, i.e. CB2 locations
Locations with endangering of irreplaceable goods.
Yes, I didn't scan that part for the beginning of the video. Is covered later on in the other documents, AFDDs recommended pretty much everywhere.
You may want to try a larger load device (designed for hairdryers, kettles, heaters) but setup to ignore sparking old vacuum cleaners. Try running a circuit large load with a single strand dead short between live and neutral but insufficient to trip the circuit breaker max value. Keep adjusting your load and dead short load to be under the circuit breaker max using different wire gauges.
The case is the spouse or kids pulling the plug by the wire and not the plug which causes heat buildup and metal fatigue in the conductors. I don't know by UK plugs if 90 degree or straight plugs are more common but in North America straight plugs tend to be used on portable electrical appliances.
Serial arc faults...only detectable by AFDD+...according to Eaton!
Is that an AFDD+?
This device is as much use as an ashtray on a motorbike. great vid JW
I'll raise you a chocolate fire guard.
I think you tested a defective AFDD... it was ok if you have another AFDD to try same tests
I think it's worth pointing out that with all your arcing, you didn't produce much heat. In other words, that type of arc isn't that much of a danger. I think you're going to have to come up with a different kind of fault - the bad connection that causes a lot of heat. Something more restive without being a fixed resistor.
UK voltage always seems to be on the high side even above 240 volts !!
Crabtree are already making addon units that marry up with their starbreaker mini RCBOs
Another case of FUD - a well known marketing and propaganda technique - Feat caused by Uncertainty and Doubt.
Also a _(manufactured)_ problem leading to a reaction, then a solution is offered at a cost.
.
Idaho Jack and the Triangle of Doom!
Idie brushes his chin with his hand, flips the switch, and explodes!
JW must buy one these devices,I don't know what for ,but then nobody else does! Ps not quite sure how they fit into consumer unit,as regards to end user checking these devices ,they usually don't check rcd's.
These ones require a special twin busbar which is configured L prong, N prong, space - repeat. Some of the others have a L connection to the busbar and a flying lead for the neutral in the same style as RCBOs.
@@jwflame JW thanks for that,its a pity they don't concentrate more on teaching proper installation practices and not on testing it to death after installation.
The pricing for AFDD/RCBOs in your video is insane. The US equivalent "dual-function" AFCI/GFCI circuit breakers are around $50, which is still a lot, but much closer to plausible.
As to whether AFDDs (or AFCIs) are actually useful, there's certainly been a lot of controversy in the US over whether AFCIs are effective.
In the US, AFCIs have been required by the NEC in some locations since 1999, and in most locations since 2008.
As I understood it, the device monitors patterns, if something is not normal then it operates. Well, if you liven up a faulty circuit, then I guess it will be learning that's normal, so it won't trip. I think you need to come up with a test where the line is attached with a low resistance connection which then becomes very high / arc, after a day. Bet my money it will trip then.
So... Your testing (having now watched all 3 videos) confirms prisoners will still be able to light their cigarettes in their cells, even if the prison service waste their money on these devices...
I did think they'd be a pointless waste of cash when I was doing the 18th back in November '18.
Is it possible that the AFDD you have is defective? As in it's meant to perform better and others of the same type *do* perform better but you got a Monday-morning hangover unit.
I certainly hope you have a one-off dud. That means the quality assurance isn't as good as it ought to be, but that's better than the alternative. The alternative is that they know their design is crap but market it far beyond its capabilities. If that's the case then none of their products can be trusted.
Well as an electrician I am VERY sceptical about these AFDD devices, and there is no chance customers of mine are going to pay out £2000 plus labour to have them installed. It's just another cash cow for the big wigs imo and once again regulations brought in by the 'suits' sat in offices who have absolutely no idea or even stepped in a working environment where these will be used. They are better off putting their efforts into making EICR's for domestic properties mandatory so electrical installations are tested regularly and made much much safer in the first place, so faults like these don't get chance to appear! Thanks, John for the video, I enjoy watching them.
In view of the ease of detecting electrical interference as RF at the end of a cable, surely the RFDD demonstrated must be regarded as a miserable, incompetent failure?
It won't be long before insurance companies are including a clause in their policies whereby, if you have a re-wire, you will have to install these, and if you decline the electricians offer to install them, they'll not pay out in the event of an electrical fire. Anything that gives them an excuse to not pay you.
I think we all know these will be introduced in the 1st amendment of the 18th edition, July 2019.
Have seen that experiment (it´s german - but can be understood without much language) czcams.com/video/CWqVVDEvd0Q/video.html
He says, that the temperature carbonizes the isolator and this leads to a stable arc which then triggers the AFDD (in the second trial instantly). He states that that is the error condition the AFDD should actually trigger, nothing else.
The idea seems to be that only in that very case, much energy is set free in the arc.
Eaton is not providing real arc protection.
Three amps of random current should be enough to cause a trip.
If a home owner complains about nuisance tripping, the electrician can confidently
replace the (whatever-brand) AFDD with an Eaton unit. ==> Happy customer.
great videos, £2000!!!!
Can you make a continuous arc, or at least make the arc last longer?
A few sparks will not generate that much heat, but if the arc is sustained for longer it will get really hot and dangerous. Maybe the arc detector needs to see a continuous arc for a few seconds before it trips?
Not easily - it's very difficult to create a sustained arc on AC, because the current is reducing to zero and changing direction 100 times a second. It's easier with much higher currents - but these devices are specifically marketed as being for arc prevention on lower power circuits, such as the examples of the appliance flex damaged in the door and the flex trapped underneath a lamp.
I have once had it happen on a mains outlet, I noticed it due to the sound and fixed it fairly fast.
The outlet was used for a 2kW heater and it looked like it had been rather hot inside the outlet (Not very surprisingly).
I am generally not scared by mains voltage (but very careful), the exception is loose connections, they can be extremely dangerous due to the fire risk.
Maybe using something with a fine pitch screw to adjust the distance would work better to create a sustained arc?
I would like to test a ARC detection device myself, but they are not common around here and mostly I work at lower voltages, except when checking isolation with a couple of kV.
@@jwflame I'm not sure if the following paper would help or not but it does appear to have some details about how they are tested.
search.abb.com/library/Download.aspx?DocumentID=9AKK107045A8938&LanguageCode=en&DocumentPartId=PDF&Action=Launch
joe smith Nice read, much better than the comment from Eaton sales. So it seems the main benefit is tripping on a continuously buzzing loose connection where the arcing actually creates a carbon residue.
Also the ABB user instructions have been reduced to a much smaller sticker, and they specify that the arc test button works by having one part of the internal circuit feed a fake arc waveform to another.
Unlike the British marketing, they suggest AFDD protection only for a much smaller subset of locations, such as infirmary sleeping accommodations and wooden buildings.
I haven't checked their prices but they do offer 2-width (36mm) models for use with whole-house RCD protection elsewhere in the consumer unit, conveniently fitting the same space as traditional fuse holders + RCD setups. Lightning strike overvoltage protection is not included in their device, only long-term overvoltage protection.
@@johnfrancisdoe1563 I found a few other papers that go into detail. I checked to see if I could find the exact part that was used in this video but it seems they are not sold in the US. It may be interesting to try and replicate the tests with a second unit.
Maybe the reason it didn`t trip is the current was very low and also intermittent. But ideally, it should have tripped.
From my experience, the worst culprit in domestic units is the 13A socket outlet fuse/holder and also its abuse. I have seen too many burned 13A plugs and sockets. The plugs` fuse holders are prone to loose connections, thus fire starting takes place. If these AFDDs do not detect this, then they are practically useless.
You've been sold a kipper!
RCBOs great, but this just seems a pointless product to cost us more money - and probably something else to go wrong...
This all sounds like a scam to me. With MCB/RCD and RCBO, there are technical specifications for the fault conditions they are meant to protect against. For example, how quickly they trip for particular levels of over-current, what level of residual current causes a trip, and how quickly and so on. The conformance with those specifications can be tested with the right equipment.
Given the complete lack of technical specification for the arc fault conditions they are meant to protect again, this is all a complete matter of trust that they do anything useful at all.
Then there's the practical matter is the space that's going to be required to put one of these things on every circuit.
It's clearly not going to protect against (say) a dishwasher or washing machine fire, which are the two appliances causing me most concern operating unattended. Thanks.
Most of the recent fires were caused by faulty white goods catching fire, fridges, tumble dryers and washing machines.
Highly perceptive. AFDDs today, appear to be BS. And I don't mean British Standard. The commonest "in wire" arcing I've seen, is in flexible cables where they enter a small appliance grommet, or at the other end, at the plug entry. The user would bring these in for repair and I suppose he might be considered the "arc detector", although his perception was simply of failure. This type of failure was by far the most common in comparison with failures internal to the appliance. The sinister fixed wiring arc fault must surely be much more infrequent.
Lasted 20mins watching the video. Perhaps a bit of editing would benefit the points you are putting across. The Regulations are vague until one of us unfortunately ends up in court for not/improperly installing a vaguely identified problem.
Thanks for tackling the issue. Hope some clarity comes with the 19th edition in 10 yrs time 😂
Beware of the Triangle of Doom - otherwise known as PR-Marketing-Advertising. It's a silent killer.
"Should not be installed in AC single-phase circuits exceeding 230 V""
I thought the electricity in this country is advertised as 240 V!
Voltage is defined as 230V, +10%, -6% so can be between 216 and 253 volts.
In reality it's still nearer to 240V in most places.
Hi John, awesome, if the unit wasn't faulty then they are not worth a light ooooops sorry no pun intended, they must have done their tests? your tests were pretty conclusive as far as I'm concerned so as far as I can see they could NOT have tested them, total c**p, are they made of chocolate like the teapot :-)
Somebody took the edit note "replace with 6000°C" a little too literally...
Insurance companies are pushing these devices.
Fault finding can be a nightmare.
Consumer just reset faults.
Phone chargers and lithium batteries are typical fire starters but AFDs wont stop these blowing up.
Not a very practical circuit breaker, a good idea from the manufacturer's and insurance companies point of view.
I am informed these devices only detect an arc if the load is > 2.5 amps - so a broken heating
element in an electric blanket arcing and setting fire to your bed is OK !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Ok, why are these appsrently useless things even mentioned in the wiring regs? Does the IEE not check before drafting? Circuit Redundant Anodyne Protection. BobUK.
Triangle of doom 😂
this device it saves lifes in iraq
Really? Or do you mean RCD/GFCI which detect if the electricity takes the wrong path?
These Arc fault detection devices are snakeoil (as seen here) and too expensive. For comparison, a simple circuit breaker is round about 4€ here. RCD is round about 20€, RCBO round about 25 to 30€. These arc fault detection devices are round about 100€ per piece.
we use rcd but what about fire that made by arc fault so this device save life .
@@ahmedelectricianofiraq5550
The cables inside of the walls normally don't have contact to combustable materials, they lay inside or below plaster. The plastic material of the outlets and switches is self-extinguishing. If there are conduits for the cables, these are self-extinguishing, the old ones from the 1950s and before are made of sheet metal, the outside is lead plated to prevent corrosion caused by the plaster.
You'll find RCDs only in more modern installations here in Germany. There are still installations out there from the 1950s or 1960s which don't have RCDs. In 1984 the regulation was introduced that "rooms which contain a bathtub and/or a shower" must have RCD-protection. But this is not retroactive, so if the rooms and the installations are older you're not required to retrofit them. Only if the installation no longer fulfills the requirements and regulations which were in state during the errection, or is damaged or unsafe at all you need to replace/retrofit the installation.
RCDs are now mandatory to all circuits which contain outlets. Arc-fault protection is recommended but not a must-have.
thanks about the information but we have in iraq mass of wrong wiring so the fault of arc happend allway so for that this kind of interrupter work so good in our country
interesting, hmm, yeh, I see, interesting, hmm 20:16 HOLY FUCK !!!
Would be interesting to see if another manufacturer is as useless...
I get the distinct impression that you are pretty underwhelmed by this device, I know I am.
So, in conclusion, it turns out to be the other BS! :D
Honestly your videos seem to be proving AFDD's are useless. Perhaps your unit is faulty somehow. Maybe it's worth raising this with EATON and showing them your videos
No, it’s because AFDDs ARE useless.
So its protection against crappy electrical appliances and phone chargers from china, now i get it.