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The DUMBEST REALIGNMENT CONTROVERSY in College Football HISTORY
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- čas přidán 4. 10. 2022
- In 2000, the VMI Keydets were so bad at football that they requested to the Southern Conference to leave the conference and play as an independent on a temporary basis until they got good again. The proposal was received about as well as you'd expect. This is the story behind the bizarre conference realignment, if you can even call it that, between the Virginia Military Institute and the SoCon
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#ncaa #cfb #ncaafootball #cfbhighlights #football #sports #highlights #college #collegefootball #vmi #socon #southern #2000
You need to do one about Temple getting kicked out of the big east
As a Temple fan I agree.
They actually just beat Kentucky
College football history really is fascinating. Your channel is fantastic--Great stories and always told with such passion.
Before 1982, VMI had an annual Thanksgiving rivalry with Virginia Tech (VPI) in Roanoke
VMI's dalliance with the Big South was no better. They just got roasted by Liberty instead of Georgia Southern.
The fact VMI beat Liberty in 2002 the year before joining the Big South. And from then on only beat them once in the 10 years in the Big South (2005).
I knew that VMI was bad at football at that time, but not THAT bad. Also, in the case of West Point, it had been primarily a Patriot League member all along, but it put its football program into Conference USA (previously a then-Div. I-A independent) and it was an unmitigated disaster. The Black Knights went just 13-67 overall and 9-41 in conference play as a C-USA member. Four of those seasons saw Todd Berry try to make West Point's offense more pass-oriented and that was never gonna work. West Point bailed on C-USA and has been an FBS indy since. The Black Knights finally got into a groove as an indy and I'm relieved to see that VMI football is doing so much better now.
DIII Macalester College did exactly this in 2002, they left the MIAC (Minnesota Intercollegiate Athletic Conference) only in football and played as an Independent. Joined the Midwest Conference (only for football) starting in 2014 and played their through 2020 and the football program re-joined MIAC in 2021 re-aligning w/ all other sports who had stayed in the MIAC. Macalester also previously held the DIII losing streak record (50 games, which was broken in 2018 by Earlham College). In the five seasons before becoming a football independent the Scots went 3-42 in MIAC play.
Guess Southern Conference told VMI that I'll be there for you
👏 👏 👏 👏
The Keydets were terrible for a long time. Around 1990, East Tennessee was horrendous too, and they hit a low point when they couldn't even beat VMI for a few years. At least VMI had an excuse--they were a small military school. ETSU has a higher enrollment than many FBS schools.
Need to do a video on ETSU dropping their football program after 2003!!
VMI had a crazy good season recently but all of the good players transferred because VMI only offers an undergraduate education. It's tough for them to be competitive in the recruiting/transfer portal with no post-grad degrees.
I could've sworn not that long ago JG8 did a video about how this season Vandy would have their best team in years. Did I switch to an alternate timeline?
I think this might be the best season in years anyway. Vandy hasn't been good in literal decades
@@TheSonicsean Vandy got destroyed by Alabama again though.
They played well against ole miss until the 4 th quarter when they got crushed.
Back in 97 when Elon moved up to D1, Big South didn't have football, so we were an independent. We still used SoCon refs for our games since the goal was to join asap, eventually happening after I was done. Of course the conference fell from grace after Ga Southern and App went IA, hence recent VMI wins.
Georgia Southern beat Montana, not Montana State.
They did beat a Montana team
Points to you for having a Friends reference and a Billy Madison reference in the same video.
And a Spongebob reference with the "this is advanced bad"
there are more dumb realignment movies than VMI
Nebraska, Oklahoma, Texas, Missouri, Maryland, Rutgers, USC, UCLA, Colorado, I can go on
If you mean the current realignment it's not that dumb at all. Pfft Oklahoma and Texas need a better conference. Vandy on the other hand should be kicked out of the SEC. Move them to the ACC.
You forgot A&M-Texas Tech
@@donaldpaluga Texas Tech hasn't left the big 12, A&M I'd argue was in the middle of weird and ok
@@runrafarunthebestintheworld lol Oklahoma and Texas need to get better instead of chasing the SEC supermoney
Come on VMI, you’re supposed to be the Vanderbilt of SoCon!
I remember that the Key-dets were a team that were brought in as fodder to some 1-A schools... but never this bad. Thanks for sharing.
One year right after Mack Brown came to UNC for his first stint in the late 1980s, the Tar Heels went 1-10. They opened with a 49-7 win over VMI.
I grew up not too far from Lexington and attended James Madison in the mid-80s so I knew all about how rancid VMI football was, and remained for a long time. We weren't a hell of a lot better back then but we usually wobbled around .500 and at least we could go to the games to catch our awesome marching band and (for two years) watch Charles Haley singlehandedly shut down opposing offenses. VMI had a real bad case of wrong place, wrong time, wrong size trying to play football in the Socon, which has always been a very strong I-AA/FCS conference. That was about the time that Georgia Southern and then App State were building their FCS dynasties. Virginia always had strong I-AA/FCS football statewide, between JMU, Richmond, W&M, Radford...and, hell, UVa during their worst years might as well have been I-AA. So there was noplace in I-AA for the Keydets to go to get winnable games except lower divisions.
Now JMU is FBS and doing surprisingly well for our first year in the Sun Belt (5-3, 3-2 even though we're not eligible for championship or a bowl) along with Georgia Southern and App State, ironically enough. I'm not surprised VMI is hovering around .500 now, they probably have better recruits and their conference competition has thinned out. The center of power in FCS is in the Midwest/mountain West now.
As a Chattanooga fan we said thank god for vmi numerous times
Go Mocs Go!
even caltech basketball didnt try to pull that stunt and they were way worse than VMI
BAZINGA!-CalTech grad Sheldon Cooper
They did appear in the 1961 Rose Bowl (not really). They secretly replaced cards that the Washington Huskies were going to use in the game against Minnesota with ones that ended up reading "Cal Tech".
There was the time that the Big East kicked Temple out of the conference. You should look into that story for a future video
Alot of people may not know this. But the SoCon's charter members were Alabama, Auburn, Clemson, Georgia, Georgia Tech, Maryland, North Carolina, NC ST, Virginia, VA Tech, Kentucky, Tennessee, and Washington & Lee which formed in 1920, but didn't start competing until 1922. That year six more teams joined the league, which were LSU, Florida, Ole Miss, South Carolina, Tulane, and Vanderbilt. Other members that joined were Sewanee and VMI in 1924, with Duke joining in 1929. Of course we know what happened in 1932 when the SEC formed. Basically all the schools west of the Appalachian mountains formed the SEC and the rest was history. I just find that fascinating that there was a mega-conference before there were what we would call mega- conferences today. And for the Alabama haters out there. Bama has 28 SEC titles, and 4 SoCon titles.
Just an additional note the MEAC would have been a geographic fit with Norfolk State and Hampton. But it was a conference built on HBCUs.
Oh the York university of the United States. York is 7-73 in the OUA since 2010 and 83-283 in 45 years that Lions s have existed.
... 2 ideas... 1- the worst team in every conference drops down to a lower conference ,.. and the best team moves up . 2- create a conference consisting of teams that are losers...
A promotion/relegation system would never work because too much money is tied to the programs.
“The last time they won a game in the SEC, and the last time they won a game in conference play…”
That’s literally the same statement said twice in a single sentence. Nice script.
A contender is Pitt and WVU and took away the Backyard Brawl for a decade.
Grew up/lived near VMI and we would work consessions or pick up trash after games for financial assistance with our football team in the early/mid 2000s and it was always brutal seeing those scores
My dad works for the socon so he knew about this but it’s fun to hear about it again
I love college football history I find it more fascinating in the NFL at times
Going independent is actually a common practice at the high school level because there are numerous schools throughout the country where they are competitive/good in other sports but bad at football. This is usually down to not having enough players to field a competitive varsity team (a common problem at the high school level), poor facilities/coaching or combination of the two. When I was in high school 10 years ago, our high school had a competitive program that held its own among the best teams in our conference & even qualified for the state playoffs. Then 3 years after I graduated, they had to go independent in order to keep the football program alive because not enough kids were turning out & the school was unable to field a competitive team. This worked out because the roster got bigger during each of the 4 years they were independent & the coaching got much better. Now they are back in their conference & can compete again with the bigger schools.
I should point out that a school going independent only really works with football because of the number of regular season games (10). This allows teams to schedule opponents that are equal to them from a competitive standpoint even though they will have to travel. Going independent in any other sport like basketball would not work from a logistical standpoint because there are 16-20 regular season games in a basketball season and many conferences choose to do a round robin schedule where you play each team twice meaning you have to play teams that are in your geographic area.
How do you find the footage for these? 1980s VMI games sound difficult to find…
Vandy isn't in for football they are one of the best baseball programs in the country
Jaguar Gator Boy only cares about football. If you suck football, you suck at life according to him.
They are competitive in most everything except football, and occasionally they do have a decent football team. And they have never tried to do anything like this.
Football makes more money than baseball
The SEC has no men's soccer but 2 members Kentucky and South Carolina have men's soccer and play in conference USA.
Vanderbilt is also a founding member. The SEC will stick to tradition for as long as possible and will manipulate what they can to maintain it (look at the 2024 conference schedules for certain rivalry games being unaffected). Vandy has remained despite all the realignment. Outside of football, Vanderbilt has a competitive baseball team and basketball team. It's not always about football.
USC and UCLA moving to the Big 10: "y'all talking about being stupid with realignment?"
SoCon deez nuts
lmao
Note: Vanderbilt beat Kentucky on Nov 13, 2022
on the flip side st. Thomas (mn) was told to leave the conference for being to good.
So what you're saying is VMI was the IRL SCLSU Mud-dogs
What would the SoCon have done without their doormat?
VMI & The Citadel are Big South caliber teams. The ideal situation for Vanderbilt would be a Notre Dame-ACC deal where Notre Dame plays 3-5 FB games with conference opponents and a full member in other sports. The Vanderbilt-SEC affiliated independent includes games v. Kentucky, Tennessee, Ole Miss with new rivalries against Memphis, Tulane, UAB and Duke.
VMI belongs in the Big South, The Citadel not so much
Vmi is where my sister went
There band had to do the current point total in number of push-ups whenever Vmi scores.
Needless to say not many push-ups we’re done because of it
It’s almost like a relegation scheme… for one team. That would have to be an all or nothing prospect, and none of the other marginal teams would want anything to do with that.
Going independent for Vandy wouldn’t fix anything, they will not sacrifice academics requirements to recruit players for sports.
He didn't really expand upon it at the end, but also, it helped that during VMI's leave of absence, the SoCon and FCS in general lost most of its best programs to the FBS ranks.
In the SoCon alone, powerhouse Marshall left in 1996 and their place was taken by Georgia Southern in the late 90s-early 2000s, followed by App State's run from the mid-00s til their departure. Elon and Wofford also rose to prominence around that time with playoff teams.
VMI rejoined the SoCon after App and GS left for the Sun Belt, who at that time had placed a greater emphasis on growing their football program in preparation for such a move and had become conference outliers in this regard. You also had other departures across all I-AA to the Sun Belt during VMIs SoCon absence as well. Elon would eventually leave as well and ETSU dropped their program entirely, although like VMI they are currently back in.
The SoCon took the exit money from App, GS, and Elon and decided to use it to build up their basketball profile, and they've built a very respectable mid-major basketball brand. But no one has been able to fill the shoes to the level of App, GS, or Marshall in football and it's unlikely that will happen anytime soon as with JMU's departure FCS is now just NDSU and everyone else.
Tl;dr: fair play to VMI for getting things on track, but they've also been helped along by the SoCon and FCS becoming weaker as well.
Love the disparity between well run and poorly run triple option offenses in that background video
I remember when Northwestern stunk up the Big Ten in the '80s. This too shall pass.
Aaaand Vanderbilt won. Congrats to them!
I know this is gonna be a tough concept for some of ya'll to grasp, but the SEC isn't just football
Kenyon College left the NCAC in football for a year in the early 2000s, and Macalester left the MIAC for about a decade for the Midwest Conference.
So it's not unprecedented and for both programs it made sense.
And now every school wants to jump conferences... lol.
Vandy’s advantage over Alabama (& other SEC schools) in Baseball is Vandy applies Academic Scholarship’s (& a huge Donor monetary advantage) for potential athletes, where as Alabama is the only SEC that doesn’t. Nor does Alabama apply in state tuition for out of state athletes as other schools do. Plus Alabama doesn’t have Lottery money to apply towards Education.
lol, I don't think VMI is worried about athletics. They have bigger fish to fry
Nice video
5:30 LRU! Glad to hear my bears mentioned… ( I’m pretty sure we have more current NFL players than VMI now.)
That Spongebob reference though
VMI is back to their old ways.
You said "and may God have mercy on your soul"
I had this on my watch later for a year. Truly awful. Could have been a much shorter video.
That 77 team went a whole 2-0 in conference games that season.
VMI still very much sucks in football. 2020 was an anomaly. They're 1-6 right now.
7:36 you meant Montana, not Montana State
GO GRIZ!!
Temple getting kicked out of the big east
Imagine if this happened in nfl, looking at you cowboys and lions
Instead of 1A it was 1AA (1 double a), 1 a is what became the FBS.
I think the rest of the teams in the conference, when they brought this up, should have just voted to kick them out of the conference unless they bring something huge to the table in other sports.
"SoCon deez nuts"
-VMI
jinxed UF Vandy
friends was not funny
The intro aged like milk
5:10 JG8's pronunciation of Ted Cain's name led me to believe he was talking about Senator Tim Kaine. Work on your pronunciation skills buddy.
Hillary's VP was head coach
Ga Southern beat Montana in the finals. Not Montana State. GO GRIZ!!
If college football was a girl... Id marry her
#HowInsightfulReally!
I like the content, but their are to many ads. I stop watching this at 6 min mark with 5 ad brakes. Sorry if you keep this many ads on you cheanel I won't be watching your content anymore.
👍👍
as a Citadel grad I can sympathize with the Keydets plight, we have also struggled to stay competetive and many have called for us to either move to a weaker conference like the Big South or drop to Division II.