Hey guys, thank you so much for watching! Here are some important links, please check them out ❤ Daily click - all you have to do is select a cause you wish to support, and it registers as a donation: arab.org A detailed Linktree with information regarding Sudan, Congo, Palestine and the various ways you can help: linktr.ee/Rayray364 Donate feminine hygiene kits: piousprojects.org/campaign/2712 Donate eSims for Gaza, virtual SIM cards to allow people to connect to their families and share what's happening with the outside world - gazaesims.com Care for Gaza Gofundme - Supporting Displaced Families in Gaza: gofundme.com/f/careforgaza Gaza funds: gazafunds.com
I find it frustrating how so much energy is being put into jumping down people's throats for drinking starbucks or eating McDonald's and not even 1% of this energy is being given to calling up representatives and voting for politicians. At this point this extremely serious issue is being just used as a way to bully people online.
I'm also frustrated because Sbx is not funding Israel. It's misinformation, they have no stores in Israel, and the ppl have reached to find links to like the original creator who hasn't been involved in years after the initial supposed connection to being pro-Israel was revealed to be more about union-busting, instead of just admitting it was a misunderstanding. Also not defending Sbx, they suck in many ways lol, but this is just factually wrong. I'm proud of idols who have said something on principle of being supportive of ppl facing genocide, but annoyed it's based on misinfo, which is only going to hurt the idea of idols speaking out. Yet, if idols were able to speak up more on things, maybe people wouldn't be scrutinizing them looking for any sort of clue about what they actually think. Like, idols have to post heart emojis in certain colors or dance in front of rainbows to send a message during pride month instead of coming out even as an ally. Now people are looking for watermelon references. That tangentially-related boycotts (and the not-even-related Sbx in particular) are seen as a litmus test of what someone thinks on an issue and how they devote themselves to something is so... unintelligent, yet the culture of silence also doesn't give much other options. So on the one hand I'm sympathetic and on the other I also think it's a lack of critical thinking on fans' behalf. It's also frustrating that ppl claim they need to "educate" idols and while that may be true in some aspects, it's also possible they actually are more educated than fans on issues like Sbx and reached a different conclusion on whether that's productive or even logical--while still agreeing on the main principle of ending a genocide. Like, I've been active in Palestinian causes for over a decade, and in fact don't go to Starbucks but to local coffee shops on other principles (one of which is actually Palestinian-owned--and they're amazing), but because I have questions about the productivity of boycotts for this cause in general, and think this particular boycott for this reason is illogical, somehow that means I'm anti-Palestine? Which is just sad. I'm not the enemy (nor the victim). Instead of attacking idols for silence or whatnot, let's devote ourselves to going after politicians and weapons-dealers.
People are going to politicians your just not seeing it. Not everything you see on the Internet represents what's happening irl, your feed is just catered to what you want to see/believe.
this is very true. i’ve seen people join in on the bullying but they don’t actually contact or protest the politicians that could have actual material impact on the situation
I think Western K-pop “stans” forget the difference between Western celebrities and idols. In the west, part of being a celebrity is the expectation that they will speak up on current events. And unless said celebrity has a history of not speaking on anything, then it’s assumed that any event will be spoken about. Also, it feels like anyone and everyone can be a celebrity, especially since social media. There’s no training or preparation for a lot of people online today. If you look at the Korean celebrities, or idols, they have very rigid rules. And that doesn’t mean it’s bad (I actually think it has its benefits) but Western listeners don’t understand that. And I honestly think that idols are meant to be role models to Korean youth, which is not always something to be said about Western celebrities. K-pop idols are supposed to be perfect and American/ Western celebrities aren’t (and that’s okay, but if someone isn’t aware of that and then follows both celebrities, it can get mixed up). Also, as a side point, don’t ask celebrities to do your research for you. That’s halo-effecting to a max.
I believe in freedom of speech and the right to say what you want (though it’s not always the right thing to say). If it’s the idols personal prerogative to speak on such things and they have knowledge on it by all means go for it, but be prepared for any backlash you may receive, just like anybody else on the earth. However, the moment politics are brought up in anything, it shifts the dynamics of who will support you. You could release the best music in the world but if you don’t agree on a social matter that the majority does it will hinder your career. Idk. It’s a tough call but ultimately it’s not ours as fans to make. I also think it’s important to know WHO you are supporting as a person.
First of all, I think idols should be able to speak their minds. That being said, that doesn't mean we as an audience should demand them to speak up cause that reeks entitlement. Of course, I deeply respect the idols who do speak on issues, but I would never demand other idols to do the same. cause we don't know their personal circumstances and we are not entitled to dictate what they say or what they don't. It's the same as their companies not letting them to speak, we should not force anything into them. If they have an opinion and want to share it... good, but it has to come from their own will, not the company's and not the fans'. There's another issue here. I heard that in Korea is of poor taste to speak on political issues. Are we sure that people pressuring idols aren't imposing their own culture into idols? cause that would be cornering them to do something that could hurt them and put their country against them.
At the end of the day I think its just not fair to ask any figure of influence to comment on political matters especially idols because they aren’t qualified or meant to. I’d rather have these celebrities donate to causes than have empty activism posts because its a trend.
You have to be qualified to oppose to genocide? It’s a trend to think that burning people alive is wrong? They should speak up because they have influence: their voices reach more people. It’s not a political issue, this is about being a human first and foremost.
i completely disagree. 1. it’s not political it’s a human rights violation, anyone and everyone should speak up on it one way or another. 2. idols / anyone doesn’t need qualifications to speak up for those being silenced (e.g taeyong posted “boycott”, a member from the boyz talked about palestine, fatou has posted and spoken up too.) 3. donating is great however they should know why they’re donating AND they should also speak up (one way or another). it’s not about fairness, we should absolutely be telling these people with huge followings to speak up, using their platform to raise awareness for e.g ariana posted something and raised 800k (atleast from what i’ve been informed) which is a great example of why people with huge followings should speak up. this being said we shouldn’t force idols to speak up, we should remind them kindly and if the idol chooses to speak up that’s on them, they should want to speak up and not due to the fans or their companies’ pressure. :) also to anyone talking about palestine please refrain from using words like “situation”, “conflict”, “war” as it’s misleading and incorrect, it’s a genocide an intentional genocide. free pal3stine! 🍉
@@5166y i agee! however i think putting some pressure on someone with a huge following to speak about a gen0cide isn’t a crazy request- your ariana grande example illustrates the impact of someone with a huge bringing attention to the gen0cide! silence is complacency, but i understand that most idols are probably concerned with having their careers ruined. however, the idols that i’ve heard of that have spoken out about it havent been shunned by the industry from what i’ve seen. but that’s just a guess as to why most idols haven’t been speaking up on it. for all we know they don’t care at all that a gen0cide is occurring or care to get educated on it. all in all, this situation of not speaking out is not as black and white as people would like it or paint it out to be.
I think that there is a difference between, for example, BLM and Palestine. BLM was a US-centric issue in which the Korean government wasn’t involved, so idols felt more comfortable voicing their opinion. But the Palestine conflict is a different matter. While the Korean government has called for resolution and peace, it has been reticent about taking sides. And I think that is why idols are not as forthcoming on supporting Palestine. Historically, artists have been blacklisted by the Korean President (eg, Park Geun Hye), and the Korean government funds or is the main shareholder of public TV channels like KBS and MBC. Unlike the US, where entertainers often ridicule or criticize political leaders and the government, you don’t really see that in Korea. I think that is why idols are mostly staying mum on this issue.
i think that even though the kpop industry is trying to branch out internationally, they’re still very korea centered, so i’m not sure they’re even paying attention to conflicts and wars happening abroad that much. i still think there should be more pressure on american and western celebs to speak out though since their countries are the primary weapon suppliers to israel. korean celebs speaking out would be great but then there would be fans complaining that they’re not talking about sudan, the congo, bangladesh, etc. fans act very entitled to idols and what they choose to speak out on
see thats the issue nowadays .... freedom of speech is promoted by fans but they dont get the fact that everyone has their own perspective and opinion.so when they hear sth they dont like the kpop idol recieve hate.the only thinking we should nurture is acceptance towards differences in opinions and gravitate towards respecting others' opinion.this could bring a win-win situation as the kpop idol wont be a subject to hate and the fans wont feel personally attacked by the way such a great vid.u really covered all the issues respectfully.i hope there are more channels like yours 💗
Someone made this very good point but if idols shouldn’t be allowed to speak on world issues then why are they made into ambassadors for things such as the UN? Stans also love to go on about how their faves are activists for holding up pride flags, reading feminist books, and incorporating societal issues into their artistry. If they can do all of those things then why not speak on the palestinian genocide? At some point it will look performative.
1000% agree. It’s will just be seen as performative. If they cannot speak on a genocide why should they be allowed to be an ambassador for the UN? Why would these fans ever brag about their favs being progressive and speaking on issues if they are not speaking about such tragic events? These past 8 months I’ve seen these same fandoms that champion their favs for being progressive and “political”, be the same ones to say they shouldn’t speak up, nothing about them is political. I’ve never been more disgusted.
And the bar is so low, most stans will accept a simple instagram post with “🍉” in the description. That wouldn’t be enough for me, but at least I’d know they’re not ignorant to what’s happening in Palestine. (Edited for spelling)
I think in the short term it will be good if idols speak out on issues they believe in but in the long term it will become like the western music industry where fans pressure an artist to speak out on an issue they aren’t passionate about and or they will use activism as a marketing strategy instead of actual care. I forgot the secret number member but she spoke out in support of blm and the whole group lost their personal instagrams so there are real punishments for idols who speak out on social issues
Idk, even if Taylor swift for example didn’t actually care and it was just performative, just her posting about it could bring so many eyes to the issue
You really popped off with the "we won't be able to avoid idols being punished by fans for having an outlook on an issue" hoooooooooo. Anyway, I really liked this video and how plainly you laid it out. I think idols should be able to share their opinions if they want to, but the key part is "if they want to". If they don't want to share their thoughts, they are humans just like the rest of us and we can't force them to do anything. it kind of bothers me that some fandoms are trying to pressure their idols into speaking. in that case, it feels like the statement would be less genuine anyway. Especially in the case of wealthier idols, many of them already donate tens of thousands of dollars to charities they support. We can not expect them to donate to every single charity or speak out on every single issue just bc they have a big instagram following. Again if they WANT to, then let them do what they want. But we all know all of these idols face hate every day for their looks, their music, their dancing, or just existing. I'm sure they do have opinions on these issues, but i think we need to better respect the fact that they are human and maybe do not want to attract more hate. This is a complicated issue and there is no right answer. Anyway, thanks again for a great video.
i think anyone with a big platform should spread awareness about global issues, whether their fans choose to listen is their personal decision. if you don’t want idols speaking up about palestine ignore it like you do the genocide itself. everyone continuing to reinforce the idea that idols are ‘powerless’ and ‘slaves to their contract’ is just creating an environment that encourages companies to continue silencing and taking advantage of their idols, because they think we’re okay with it.
In my opinion, no entertainer should have to speak up on public issues if it's going to be insincere and just to get people off of their back without practicing what they preach. These kinds of things should always be sincere and as corny as it is, come from the heart. But in the same vein, fans can choose support them based on their views.
I honestly don't know 😅 I agree with some "yes" arguments and some "no" arguments, because it is so complicated. I think it's not a yes or no situation and at this end of the day I just want idol to be free. Like I dont want their contracts to shut them down, they should be free to choose if they want or don't want to be implicated in the world's problems. It should be their freedom. That's my opinion I guess 😭
I think in general it would be better if most people didn't loudly and righteously proclaim on issues they actualy know nothing about, they just think they do because they've read a Wikipedia article or just looked at a few TikToks. So I think most people not just K-Pop arists should not speak about these global issues. Because they have nothing to add other than raising the temperature of fiery arguments that go nowhere. Being emotionally involved in global issues just makes you unhappy, angry, frustrated & miserable. Spamming your Instagram with pro-Palestine memes saves not a single life in Gaza.
While in a perfect world I would love if idols could speak up on them without the company holding them back we don’t live in that world and that’s simply not always a possibility so we shouldn’t put hard pressure on them for not speaking up and just not assume the best but not assume the worst as we should always
Since they have an impressionable audience and probably won't even be fully up to date with the matter which may cause scandals, I would rather they not speak about such sensitive matters...
The real question is if the WANT to speak on those subjects. They shouldn't be forced to do so, if they don't want to comment. Imagine the damage on their careers if even one word is taken out of context. Don't cancel them if they don't speak up.
I agree with idols speaking out if they want to, because their influence can definitely help people. What I don't agree on is harrassing idols and sending them threats and sending dts to fans listening to them, because they don't speak out
i think idols shouldn't be faulted for using products from boycotted companies cuz we don't know if the idols bought it for themselves or if their company bought it and gave it to the idols. jyp has a partnership with coca cola, so the bottle felix drank was probably just in a fridge up for grabs somewhere in the jyp building. he most likely didn't give money to coca cola directly and definitely wasn't involved in the company decision to have a partnership with them, so why are we getting mad at felix instead of jyp?
To be honest I don't care and I'm here for music and performance not for political activism , its very annoying when these activists bullying my favourite idols for not voicing for palestine, brand deals or getting bullied for associating with people who voice for israel due to personal reasons like being jewish or something. album, concert, merch , streams boycotts are the last thing those activists must do to support palestine, first then they should boycott those so called brands not the group and donate some money to palestine victims, also there's no any evidence of kpop company directly supporting Isreal with financial aid since I always see the slogan "consume certain groups means giving money to zionists" which is far from truth , Also palestine activism has become a tool for anti fans of certain kpop groups or kpop companies to use against the idols,some fans will bash their rival group for using certain brands but when their favs also do it, they will be silent, so much hypocrisy and its becoming annoying for my mental health , hate train and this so called fake online bully activism will affect the real activism also negatively because they focus on unimportant stuff , not the real once ,lets say idol voice about palestine, people's opinons doesn't change because of that, because fans are very much politically opinionated alredy, they either gain or lose fans, lose-lose situation , If any idol geniunely wanted to really help palestine without getting into trouble, they might secretly donate money to the cause without public knowledge
The issue I see is that people jump on the bandwagon without really understanding the circumstances. Yes, the people in Gaza are suffering and we should sympathize and support. However, we should also remember that the suffering goes BOTH WAYS. Think about this. It is common practice in Israel for homes to have b*mb shelters. Why? Because they keep getting b*mbed from the other side of their border for decades now. Let's talk about the event in October 2023 that boycotters fail to mention. This is when Palestine's H*mas govt bombed Israel where thousands died or were wounded, including children and foreigners. They also kidnapped and tortured adults and children and have kept them hostage to this day. And yes, Israel did retaliate. You can google this to get more details. It is true that people in Gaza are suffering but let's ask the question why. Millions of donation dollars have poured in but why are they still starving in this region? Does Israel have the power to dictate where the donations are going? Or is it bec their own govt is failing to provide support and effective distribution of the funds they are receiving? Where is the money going??? It is their govt who have demonstrated the welfare of their own people is not the priority. Instead, the focus is on the annihilation of the Israel state and its people. And their protestors use the word gen*cide often when it is their goal to delete a whole people group? I wish that war did not exist but it does and we have to keep in mind that unspeakable suffering happens on BOTH SIDES. The idea that anyone or any business signaling any support for Israel should be harassed and canceled is simply inhumane. Is it bec the terrorist acts of one side are justified and the other side is painted as evil and deserves to be massacred? Lastly, do you notice that the side that's supposedly calling for peace and justice for Palestine are the only ones spreading hate towards those who don't agree with them? Think about these things before you get over zealous over what idols eat or drink or do business with.
I don't tend to be super educated on world matters like this but this has really been my concern all along. Everyone is discussing how Palestine deserves to be liberated and of course they do, but war is a complicated thing and it's not so easy to draw lines. Both sides have done terrible things, but because Palestine is smaller, none of their actions are viewed the same way as Israel's. The people of both nations deserve to happy, healthy, and safe. The people of Palestine don't deserve to be victims of what could potentially be genocide, but the people of Israel who have done nothing wrong also don't deserve to be the victims of the world's hate.
I personally believe an idol or artist should be free to speak on world or personal issues. But I do also see how that can be difficult with how the KPop corporate world works. In the end, they can also speak about charitable organizations and leave it at that without getting into too much detail of the politics of the issues. Thanks for always making these compelling debate videos, Fran. 💟🥰✌️
I think that people just don’t understand that there are so many situations where the opinion of their idol wouldn’t be the same with theirs. The cultures are so different, mindsets are so different, and most importantly - all people are different. They might not say anything not because they’re prohibited to do so but because they understand that their opinion is not a mainstream accented conventional wisdom. Kpop fans are so angry when it comes to idols not being able to express their thoughts but it’s only because they believe (for some reason) that their idol thinks exactly the same as they do. The moment an idol decides to express their opinion and this opinion happens to be the oppositional one to what their fans expected to hear this idol is gonna be torn to shreds and there would be those stupid protest trucks demanding this idol to be kicked out of the group. I myself have several opinions that go against the “only common truths that you won’t be cancelled for” promoted by the western media so i understand this feeling of people around you not understanding you and hearing this exact opinions that I don’t support coming out of my favourite artists’ mouths would definitely be something repulsive for me. I understand that they might not agree with what i believe in but at least there’s always this possibility that they are on my side. Going public would ruin it. I’d rather just understand that they might not agree with me and confirming it would be disappointing for me. And another point is that i find it pretty ridiculous when fans demand public display of opinions from people that time and time again proved that they have little to no knowledge in social controversies and topics. Fans don’t understand that their idol might not be Einstein - rather their dummy classmate Sam that is so stupid it’s actually surprising. Most of those idols don’t graduate high school, sometimes even middle school, live far from American media discourse- and you expect them to be educated on topics like military conflicts that have hundreds of years of history, political issues, etc? These people can’t even remember that saying the n-word is bad, do you really think that they’re all smart? The situation when an idol decides to go public with their opinion and it turns out to be TikTok research based surface conclusion is what you would get, not a phd level statement that is supported by proofs and statistics. Their influence in this situation would cause more harm than good because they might just spread misinformation and propaganda created “facts”. So, I’m agains idols speaking up, they can do it but then they should be prepared for the consequences and potential harm that they might cause. Idols just like us live in informational bubbles so it’s pretty dumb to demand these kids to speak up - Which is another major point - so many idols are just teens and a bit older, people this age might be smart and educated and have media literacy but not the ones who were skipping school since they just hit puberty. Do you really think that a person who was wearing a shirt with swastika can actually do at least a bare minimum research before coming up with a statement on a literal war between the countries that they probably never even heard of before all of this started? Or person who was mocking his bandmate for beings one tone darker that him thus uglier being able to say something genuine about BLM?
I don’t mind if they voice their opinions but then own the backlash if there is one. Sometimes it seems if backlash starts then idols tap out and let rabid fans deal with it. Even inciting fans in a direction. Then idols sit back and act like it wasn’t them. Pretty sick actually.
There's a big issue, what one says will be reflected on and/or be expected of the others in the group, and if you're the one (or few) that won't sing a similar tune, or say nothing at all, you may as well of said something because saying nothing will likely bring similar criticism. It's just better to say out of politics, it's a toxic cess pool, particularly western politics where there's a new _'cause'_ every week and the level of hypocrisy is off the charts.
Once Idols don't follow their company-given diets, they have no rights to speak out about more important things. Sounds harsh, but it's true. They keep passing out on stage, having severe dehydration and physical weakness. Why speak out against famine, when you follow your boss' given famine?
This will be bold. Kpop is an escapism to many. I came to kpop in 2005 to seek comfort, relaxation and joy. Let music be music. And separately let serious things be serious things. Imo they should not blend. Idols are not responsible for politics or serious matters. If you have an issue you need to talk to their entertainment/management. Plus: I firmly believe that so far every single idol who has spoken their free thoughts before, politics or casually, has ended up being bullied and silenced. Examples are BangChan and Sulli. Let's just not have this debate and energy here in kpop. I beg. This needs to stop.
this comment comes from an extreme place of privilege. how absurd it is to sit from the comfort of your own home and write a comment 'begging' for people to stop expecting idols to speak about a genocide. people in gaza are worrying about bombs getting dropped on them, or being shot by an israeli soldier, and we complain about comments on social media? music and art has always been political, theres no separating politics from any art form. its not unfair for celebs with huge followings and insane reach to speak about something that actually matters. yall care more about rich celebs than innocent children and adults dying in a genocide... crazy
@@eyeslockedhandslocked1039exactly, like idols shouldn’t be harassed to speak out but if they want to speak out they absoltuely should and people shouldn’t hate them for that
don't have time to watch the video but for me, I'd rather not be marketed towards. Do whatever you want with your music. You can make it Christian horse girl sounding or catholic revolting child sounding but I'm tired of seeing your damn opinions on shit. If you want to drink Starbucks, go ahead, that doesn't say anything about your stance on anything, you just want coffee. At the end of the day, it's us as observers getting wound up about someone buying something. If you want to make a real change, stop listening to famous people, help out at a local shelter or something and when you become an adult, start voting for people you believe will make changes in society. Societal change starts in our small communities, so being online all day being a keyboard warrior isn't gonna solve the issues you want solved. In fact, it just makes you look childish, especially to future employers.
Hey, my name is Anaelle I'm a 15 year old girl from Israel. I know that people get everything twisted and there is much lies online so I would like to correct little mistakes you made in the video and express my pov as it can be intresting. You said it's Israel-palestine war but it isn't. As the articles you have shown it's Israel-Hamas war. Our target aren't poor palestinians that are actually being used as human shields for Hanas (their goverment that should protect them) our target is Hamas itself that killed 1400 Israelis on October 7 and kidbapped more than 200 hostages. Our fight is agiant terror not innocent citizens. I'm sure not you and none of those idols who live so far away don't have enough knowledge about this conflict so they can't really express their true opinion as they just don't know what's going on. About Starbucks, never understood it honestly, we don't even have starbucks in Israel so it's really pointless. As a fan who have never been the same since the war started, kpop is an escape place for me and it's really upsets me when k-tubers and some of my favoutite idols supporting my life being ruined withoud even realizing that. I wish Palestine to be free from Hamas and have their own state without killing jews and עם ישראל חי I really enjoy your contant and thanks for being one of the ktubers i watch in the bomb shelter.
girl no one is buying this bs anymore. your country are war criminals stop embarassing yourself online. you are leaving a digital footprint defending genocide omg delete so future you doesn't feel as much shame
"About Starbucks, never understood it honestly, we don't even have starbucks in Israel so it's really pointless." Oh woah. This is very interesting. Also thank you for wishing for Palestine to be free!
@@soomi of course, I think no one should suffer from terror Israelis and Palestinians alike, actually no human should suffer from terror, but unfortunately this is our reality.
Hey guys, thank you so much for watching! Here are some important links, please check them out ❤
Daily click - all you have to do is select a cause you wish to support, and it registers as a donation: arab.org
A detailed Linktree with information regarding Sudan, Congo, Palestine and the various ways you can help: linktr.ee/Rayray364
Donate feminine hygiene kits: piousprojects.org/campaign/2712
Donate eSims for Gaza, virtual SIM cards to allow people to connect to their families and share what's happening with the outside world - gazaesims.com
Care for Gaza Gofundme - Supporting Displaced Families in Gaza: gofundme.com/f/careforgaza
Gaza funds: gazafunds.com
I find it frustrating how so much energy is being put into jumping down people's throats for drinking starbucks or eating McDonald's and not even 1% of this energy is being given to calling up representatives and voting for politicians. At this point this extremely serious issue is being just used as a way to bully people online.
I'm also frustrated because Sbx is not funding Israel. It's misinformation, they have no stores in Israel, and the ppl have reached to find links to like the original creator who hasn't been involved in years after the initial supposed connection to being pro-Israel was revealed to be more about union-busting, instead of just admitting it was a misunderstanding. Also not defending Sbx, they suck in many ways lol, but this is just factually wrong.
I'm proud of idols who have said something on principle of being supportive of ppl facing genocide, but annoyed it's based on misinfo, which is only going to hurt the idea of idols speaking out. Yet, if idols were able to speak up more on things, maybe people wouldn't be scrutinizing them looking for any sort of clue about what they actually think. Like, idols have to post heart emojis in certain colors or dance in front of rainbows to send a message during pride month instead of coming out even as an ally. Now people are looking for watermelon references.
That tangentially-related boycotts (and the not-even-related Sbx in particular) are seen as a litmus test of what someone thinks on an issue and how they devote themselves to something is so... unintelligent, yet the culture of silence also doesn't give much other options. So on the one hand I'm sympathetic and on the other I also think it's a lack of critical thinking on fans' behalf. It's also frustrating that ppl claim they need to "educate" idols and while that may be true in some aspects, it's also possible they actually are more educated than fans on issues like Sbx and reached a different conclusion on whether that's productive or even logical--while still agreeing on the main principle of ending a genocide.
Like, I've been active in Palestinian causes for over a decade, and in fact don't go to Starbucks but to local coffee shops on other principles (one of which is actually Palestinian-owned--and they're amazing), but because I have questions about the productivity of boycotts for this cause in general, and think this particular boycott for this reason is illogical, somehow that means I'm anti-Palestine? Which is just sad. I'm not the enemy (nor the victim). Instead of attacking idols for silence or whatnot, let's devote ourselves to going after politicians and weapons-dealers.
People are going to politicians your just not seeing it. Not everything you see on the Internet represents what's happening irl, your feed is just catered to what you want to see/believe.
this is very true. i’ve seen people join in on the bullying but they don’t actually contact or protest the politicians that could have actual material impact on the situation
I think Western K-pop “stans” forget the difference between Western celebrities and idols.
In the west, part of being a celebrity is the expectation that they will speak up on current events. And unless said celebrity has a history of not speaking on anything, then it’s assumed that any event will be spoken about. Also, it feels like anyone and everyone can be a celebrity, especially since social media. There’s no training or preparation for a lot of people online today.
If you look at the Korean celebrities, or idols, they have very rigid rules. And that doesn’t mean it’s bad (I actually think it has its benefits) but Western listeners don’t understand that. And I honestly think that idols are meant to be role models to Korean youth, which is not always something to be said about Western celebrities. K-pop idols are supposed to be perfect and American/ Western celebrities aren’t (and that’s okay, but if someone isn’t aware of that and then follows both celebrities, it can get mixed up).
Also, as a side point, don’t ask celebrities to do your research for you. That’s halo-effecting to a max.
I believe in freedom of speech and the right to say what you want (though it’s not always the right thing to say). If it’s the idols personal prerogative to speak on such things and they have knowledge on it by all means go for it, but be prepared for any backlash you may receive, just like anybody else on the earth. However, the moment politics are brought up in anything, it shifts the dynamics of who will support you. You could release the best music in the world but if you don’t agree on a social matter that the majority does it will hinder your career. Idk. It’s a tough call but ultimately it’s not ours as fans to make. I also think it’s important to know WHO you are supporting as a person.
First of all, I think idols should be able to speak their minds. That being said, that doesn't mean we as an audience should demand them to speak up cause that reeks entitlement.
Of course, I deeply respect the idols who do speak on issues, but I would never demand other idols to do the same. cause we don't know their personal circumstances and we are not entitled to dictate what they say or what they don't. It's the same as their companies not letting them to speak, we should not force anything into them. If they have an opinion and want to share it... good, but it has to come from their own will, not the company's and not the fans'.
There's another issue here. I heard that in Korea is of poor taste to speak on political issues. Are we sure that people pressuring idols aren't imposing their own culture into idols? cause that would be cornering them to do something that could hurt them and put their country against them.
At the end of the day I think its just not fair to ask any figure of influence to comment on political matters especially idols because they aren’t qualified or meant to. I’d rather have these celebrities donate to causes than have empty activism posts because its a trend.
You have to be qualified to oppose to genocide? It’s a trend to think that burning people alive is wrong? They should speak up because they have influence: their voices reach more people. It’s not a political issue, this is about being a human first and foremost.
i completely disagree. 1. it’s not political it’s a human rights violation, anyone and everyone should speak up on it one way or another. 2. idols / anyone doesn’t need qualifications to speak up for those being silenced (e.g taeyong posted “boycott”, a member from the boyz talked about palestine, fatou has posted and spoken up too.) 3. donating is great however they should know why they’re donating AND they should also speak up (one way or another). it’s not about fairness, we should absolutely be telling these people with huge followings to speak up, using their platform to raise awareness for e.g ariana posted something and raised 800k (atleast from what i’ve been informed) which is a great example of why people with huge followings should speak up. this being said we shouldn’t force idols to speak up, we should remind them kindly and if the idol chooses to speak up that’s on them, they should want to speak up and not due to the fans or their companies’ pressure. :) also to anyone talking about palestine please refrain from using words like “situation”, “conflict”, “war” as it’s misleading and incorrect, it’s a genocide an intentional genocide. free pal3stine! 🍉
I agree. It is not fair to ask them
@@5166y i agee! however i think putting some pressure on someone with a huge following to speak about a gen0cide isn’t a crazy request- your ariana grande example illustrates the impact of someone with a huge bringing attention to the gen0cide! silence is complacency, but i understand that most idols are probably concerned with having their careers ruined. however, the idols that i’ve heard of that have spoken out about it havent been shunned by the industry from what i’ve seen. but that’s just a guess as to why most idols haven’t been speaking up on it. for all we know they don’t care at all that a gen0cide is occurring or care to get educated on it. all in all, this situation of not speaking out is not as black and white as people would like it or paint it out to be.
@@5166yYES
I think that there is a difference between, for example, BLM and Palestine. BLM was a US-centric issue in which the Korean government wasn’t involved, so idols felt more comfortable voicing their opinion. But the Palestine conflict is a different matter. While the Korean government has called for resolution and peace, it has been reticent about taking sides. And I think that is why idols are not as forthcoming on supporting Palestine. Historically, artists have been blacklisted by the Korean President (eg, Park Geun Hye), and the Korean government funds or is the main shareholder of public TV channels like KBS and MBC. Unlike the US, where entertainers often ridicule or criticize political leaders and the government, you don’t really see that in Korea. I think that is why idols are mostly staying mum on this issue.
i think that even though the kpop industry is trying to branch out internationally, they’re still very korea centered, so i’m not sure they’re even paying attention to conflicts and wars happening abroad that much. i still think there should be more pressure on american and western celebs to speak out though since their countries are the primary weapon suppliers to israel. korean celebs speaking out would be great but then there would be fans complaining that they’re not talking about sudan, the congo, bangladesh, etc. fans act very entitled to idols and what they choose to speak out on
see thats the issue nowadays .... freedom of speech is promoted by fans but they dont get the fact that everyone has their own perspective and opinion.so when they hear sth they dont like the kpop idol recieve hate.the only thinking we should nurture is acceptance towards differences in opinions and gravitate towards respecting others' opinion.this could bring a win-win situation as the kpop idol wont be a subject to hate and the fans wont feel personally attacked
by the way such a great vid.u really covered all the issues respectfully.i hope there are more channels like yours 💗
Someone made this very good point but if idols shouldn’t be allowed to speak on world issues then why are they made into ambassadors for things such as the UN?
Stans also love to go on about how their faves are activists for holding up pride flags, reading feminist books, and incorporating societal issues into their artistry.
If they can do all of those things then why not speak on the palestinian genocide? At some point it will look performative.
1000% agree. It’s will just be seen as performative. If they cannot speak on a genocide why should they be allowed to be an ambassador for the UN? Why would these fans ever brag about their favs being progressive and speaking on issues if they are not speaking about such tragic events? These past 8 months I’ve seen these same fandoms that champion their favs for being progressive and “political”, be the same ones to say they shouldn’t speak up, nothing about them is political. I’ve never been more disgusted.
And the bar is so low, most stans will accept a simple instagram post with “🍉” in the description. That wouldn’t be enough for me, but at least I’d know they’re not ignorant to what’s happening in Palestine.
(Edited for spelling)
!!!!!
I think they’re ambassadors for the UN because of publicity.
@@San-ne2ic y'all r so weird .....so so weird
I think in the short term it will be good if idols speak out on issues they believe in but in the long term it will become like the western music industry where fans pressure an artist to speak out on an issue they aren’t passionate about and or they will use activism as a marketing strategy instead of actual care.
I forgot the secret number member but she spoke out in support of blm and the whole group lost their personal instagrams so there are real punishments for idols who speak out on social issues
Idk, even if Taylor swift for example didn’t actually care and it was just performative, just her posting about it could bring so many eyes to the issue
You really popped off with the "we won't be able to avoid idols being punished by fans for having an outlook on an issue" hoooooooooo.
Anyway, I really liked this video and how plainly you laid it out. I think idols should be able to share their opinions if they want to, but the key part is "if they want to". If they don't want to share their thoughts, they are humans just like the rest of us and we can't force them to do anything. it kind of bothers me that some fandoms are trying to pressure their idols into speaking. in that case, it feels like the statement would be less genuine anyway. Especially in the case of wealthier idols, many of them already donate tens of thousands of dollars to charities they support. We can not expect them to donate to every single charity or speak out on every single issue just bc they have a big instagram following. Again if they WANT to, then let them do what they want. But we all know all of these idols face hate every day for their looks, their music, their dancing, or just existing. I'm sure they do have opinions on these issues, but i think we need to better respect the fact that they are human and maybe do not want to attract more hate.
This is a complicated issue and there is no right answer. Anyway, thanks again for a great video.
i think anyone with a big platform should spread awareness about global issues, whether their fans choose to listen is their personal decision. if you don’t want idols speaking up about palestine ignore it like you do the genocide itself.
everyone continuing to reinforce the idea that idols are ‘powerless’ and ‘slaves to their contract’ is just creating an environment that encourages companies to continue silencing and taking advantage of their idols, because they think we’re okay with it.
In my opinion, no entertainer should have to speak up on public issues if it's going to be insincere and just to get people off of their back without practicing what they preach. These kinds of things should always be sincere and as corny as it is, come from the heart. But in the same vein, fans can choose support them based on their views.
I honestly don't know 😅
I agree with some "yes" arguments and some "no" arguments, because it is so complicated. I think it's not a yes or no situation and at this end of the day I just want idol to be free. Like I dont want their contracts to shut them down, they should be free to choose if they want or don't want to be implicated in the world's problems. It should be their freedom. That's my opinion I guess 😭
I think in general it would be better if most people didn't loudly and righteously proclaim on issues they actualy know nothing about, they just think they do because they've read a Wikipedia article or just looked at a few TikToks.
So I think most people not just K-Pop arists should not speak about these global issues. Because they have nothing to add other than raising the temperature of fiery arguments that go nowhere.
Being emotionally involved in global issues just makes you unhappy, angry, frustrated & miserable. Spamming your Instagram with pro-Palestine memes saves not a single life in Gaza.
Yeah I agree it’s been really hard on me mentally when people do this.
they should do what they want but people need to admit they do NOT want idols to "speak out," they want idols to be voices that AGREE with them
While in a perfect world I would love if idols could speak up on them without the company holding them back we don’t live in that world and that’s simply not always a possibility so we shouldn’t put hard pressure on them for not speaking up and just not assume the best but not assume the worst as we should always
Since they have an impressionable audience and probably won't even be fully up to date with the matter which may cause scandals, I would rather they not speak about such sensitive matters...
The real question is if the WANT to speak on those subjects. They shouldn't be forced to do so, if they don't want to comment. Imagine the damage on their careers if even one word is taken out of context. Don't cancel them if they don't speak up.
Thank you for the video and thank you so much for the donations links for Palestine (and the other ones) ❤
I agree with idols speaking out if they want to, because their influence can definitely help people. What I don't agree on is harrassing idols and sending them threats and sending dts to fans listening to them, because they don't speak out
Agree
i think idols shouldn't be faulted for using products from boycotted companies cuz we don't know if the idols bought it for themselves or if their company bought it and gave it to the idols. jyp has a partnership with coca cola, so the bottle felix drank was probably just in a fridge up for grabs somewhere in the jyp building. he most likely didn't give money to coca cola directly and definitely wasn't involved in the company decision to have a partnership with them, so why are we getting mad at felix instead of jyp?
Exactly!!
To be honest I don't care and I'm here for music and performance not for political activism , its very annoying when these activists bullying my favourite idols for not voicing for palestine, brand deals or getting bullied for associating with people who voice for israel due to personal reasons like being jewish or something. album, concert, merch , streams boycotts are the last thing those activists must do to support palestine, first then they should boycott those so called brands not the group and donate some money to palestine victims, also there's no any evidence of kpop company directly supporting Isreal with financial aid since I always see the slogan "consume certain groups means giving money to zionists" which is far from truth , Also palestine activism has become a tool for anti fans of certain kpop groups or kpop companies to use against the idols,some fans will bash their rival group for using certain brands but when their favs also do it, they will be silent, so much hypocrisy and its becoming annoying for my mental health , hate train and this so called fake online bully activism will affect the real activism also negatively because they focus on unimportant stuff , not the real once ,lets say idol voice about palestine, people's opinons doesn't change because of that, because fans are very much politically opinionated alredy, they either gain or lose fans, lose-lose situation , If any idol geniunely wanted to really help palestine without getting into trouble, they might secretly donate money to the cause without public knowledge
The issue I see is that people jump on the bandwagon without really understanding the circumstances. Yes, the people in Gaza are suffering and we should sympathize and support. However, we should also remember that the suffering goes BOTH WAYS. Think about this. It is common practice in Israel for homes to have b*mb shelters. Why? Because they keep getting b*mbed from the other side of their border for decades now. Let's talk about the event in October 2023 that boycotters fail to mention. This is when Palestine's H*mas govt bombed Israel where thousands died or were wounded, including children and foreigners. They also kidnapped and tortured adults and children and have kept them hostage to this day. And yes, Israel did retaliate. You can google this to get more details. It is true that people in Gaza are suffering but let's ask the question why. Millions of donation dollars have poured in but why are they still starving in this region? Does Israel have the power to dictate where the donations are going? Or is it bec their own govt is failing to provide support and effective distribution of the funds they are receiving? Where is the money going??? It is their govt who have demonstrated the welfare of their own people is not the priority. Instead, the focus is on the annihilation of the Israel state and its people. And their protestors use the word gen*cide often when it is their goal to delete a whole people group? I wish that war did not exist but it does and we have to keep in mind that unspeakable suffering happens on BOTH SIDES. The idea that anyone or any business signaling any support for Israel should be harassed and canceled is simply inhumane. Is it bec the terrorist acts of one side are justified and the other side is painted as evil and deserves to be massacred? Lastly, do you notice that the side that's supposedly calling for peace and justice for Palestine are the only ones spreading hate towards those who don't agree with them? Think about these things before you get over zealous over what idols eat or drink or do business with.
I don't tend to be super educated on world matters like this but this has really been my concern all along. Everyone is discussing how Palestine deserves to be liberated and of course they do, but war is a complicated thing and it's not so easy to draw lines. Both sides have done terrible things, but because Palestine is smaller, none of their actions are viewed the same way as Israel's. The people of both nations deserve to happy, healthy, and safe. The people of Palestine don't deserve to be victims of what could potentially be genocide, but the people of Israel who have done nothing wrong also don't deserve to be the victims of the world's hate.
Let artists be artists and focus on their craft. They don't need to be politician
another reason for the against is the ability to spread misinformation to such a large audience
I personally believe an idol or artist should be free to speak on world or personal issues. But I do also see how that can be difficult with how the KPop corporate world works. In the end, they can also speak about charitable organizations and leave it at that without getting into too much detail of the politics of the issues. Thanks for always making these compelling debate videos, Fran. 💟🥰✌️
I think that people just don’t understand that there are so many situations where the opinion of their idol wouldn’t be the same with theirs. The cultures are so different, mindsets are so different, and most importantly - all people are different. They might not say anything not because they’re prohibited to do so but because they understand that their opinion is not a mainstream accented conventional wisdom. Kpop fans are so angry when it comes to idols not being able to express their thoughts but it’s only because they believe (for some reason) that their idol thinks exactly the same as they do. The moment an idol decides to express their opinion and this opinion happens to be the oppositional one to what their fans expected to hear this idol is gonna be torn to shreds and there would be those stupid protest trucks demanding this idol to be kicked out of the group.
I myself have several opinions that go against the “only common truths that you won’t be cancelled for” promoted by the western media so i understand this feeling of people around you not understanding you and hearing this exact opinions that I don’t support coming out of my favourite artists’ mouths would definitely be something repulsive for me. I understand that they might not agree with what i believe in but at least there’s always this possibility that they are on my side. Going public would ruin it. I’d rather just understand that they might not agree with me and confirming it would be disappointing for me.
And another point is that i find it pretty ridiculous when fans demand public display of opinions from people that time and time again proved that they have little to no knowledge in social controversies and topics. Fans don’t understand that their idol might not be Einstein - rather their dummy classmate Sam that is so stupid it’s actually surprising. Most of those idols don’t graduate high school, sometimes even middle school, live far from American media discourse- and you expect them to be educated on topics like military conflicts that have hundreds of years of history, political issues, etc? These people can’t even remember that saying the n-word is bad, do you really think that they’re all smart? The situation when an idol decides to go public with their opinion and it turns out to be TikTok research based surface conclusion is what you would get, not a phd level statement that is supported by proofs and statistics. Their influence in this situation would cause more harm than good because they might just spread misinformation and propaganda created “facts”.
So, I’m agains idols speaking up, they can do it but then they should be prepared for the consequences and potential harm that they might cause. Idols just like us live in informational bubbles so it’s pretty dumb to demand these kids to speak up -
Which is another major point - so many idols are just teens and a bit older, people this age might be smart and educated and have media literacy but not the ones who were skipping school since they just hit puberty. Do you really think that a person who was wearing a shirt with swastika can actually do at least a bare minimum research before coming up with a statement on a literal war between the countries that they probably never even heard of before all of this started? Or person who was mocking his bandmate for beings one tone darker that him thus uglier being able to say something genuine about BLM?
I don’t mind if they voice their opinions but then own the backlash if there is one. Sometimes it seems if backlash starts then idols tap out and let rabid fans deal with it. Even inciting fans in a direction. Then idols sit back and act like it wasn’t them. Pretty sick actually.
6:55 it depends on the company most likely
There's a big issue, what one says will be reflected on and/or be expected of the others in the group, and if you're the one (or few) that won't sing a similar tune, or say nothing at all, you may as well of said something because saying nothing will likely bring similar criticism. It's just better to say out of politics, it's a toxic cess pool, particularly western politics where there's a new _'cause'_ every week and the level of hypocrisy is off the charts.
Once Idols don't follow their company-given diets, they have no rights to speak out about more important things. Sounds harsh, but it's true. They keep passing out on stage, having severe dehydration and physical weakness. Why speak out against famine, when you follow your boss' given famine?
This will be bold. Kpop is an escapism to many. I came to kpop in 2005 to seek comfort, relaxation and joy. Let music be music. And separately let serious things be serious things. Imo they should not blend. Idols are not responsible for politics or serious matters. If you have an issue you need to talk to their entertainment/management. Plus: I firmly believe that so far every single idol who has spoken their free thoughts before, politics or casually, has ended up being bullied and silenced. Examples are BangChan and Sulli. Let's just not have this debate and energy here in kpop. I beg. This needs to stop.
this comment comes from an extreme place of privilege. how absurd it is to sit from the comfort of your own home and write a comment 'begging' for people to stop expecting idols to speak about a genocide. people in gaza are worrying about bombs getting dropped on them, or being shot by an israeli soldier, and we complain about comments on social media? music and art has always been political, theres no separating politics from any art form. its not unfair for celebs with huge followings and insane reach to speak about something that actually matters. yall care more about rich celebs than innocent children and adults dying in a genocide... crazy
@@eyeslockedhandslocked1039exactly, like idols shouldn’t be harassed to speak out but if they want to speak out they absoltuely should and people shouldn’t hate them for that
Jonghyun!!!!
well it even speak your mind or live it hard
don't have time to watch the video but for me, I'd rather not be marketed towards. Do whatever you want with your music. You can make it Christian horse girl sounding or catholic revolting child sounding but I'm tired of seeing your damn opinions on shit. If you want to drink Starbucks, go ahead, that doesn't say anything about your stance on anything, you just want coffee. At the end of the day, it's us as observers getting wound up about someone buying something. If you want to make a real change, stop listening to famous people, help out at a local shelter or something and when you become an adult, start voting for people you believe will make changes in society. Societal change starts in our small communities, so being online all day being a keyboard warrior isn't gonna solve the issues you want solved. In fact, it just makes you look childish, especially to future employers.
Hey, my name is Anaelle I'm a 15 year old girl from Israel. I know that people get everything twisted and there is much lies online so I would like to correct little mistakes you made in the video and express my pov as it can be intresting. You said it's Israel-palestine war but it isn't. As the articles you have shown it's Israel-Hamas war. Our target aren't poor palestinians that are actually being used as human shields for Hanas (their goverment that should protect them) our target is Hamas itself that killed 1400 Israelis on October 7 and kidbapped more than 200 hostages. Our fight is agiant terror not innocent citizens. I'm sure not you and none of those idols who live so far away don't have enough knowledge about this conflict so they can't really express their true opinion as they just don't know what's going on. About Starbucks, never understood it honestly, we don't even have starbucks in Israel so it's really pointless. As a fan who have never been the same since the war started, kpop is an escape place for me and it's really upsets me when k-tubers and some of my favoutite idols supporting my life being ruined withoud even realizing that. I wish Palestine to be free from Hamas and have their own state without killing jews and עם ישראל חי I really enjoy your contant and thanks for being one of the ktubers i watch in the bomb shelter.
girl no one is buying this bs anymore. your country are war criminals stop embarassing yourself online. you are leaving a digital footprint defending genocide omg delete so future you doesn't feel as much shame
"About Starbucks, never understood it honestly, we don't even have starbucks in Israel so it's really pointless." Oh woah. This is very interesting. Also thank you for wishing for Palestine to be free!
And what about all the babies and children that have died and are still dying in this "not war"? Are they Hamas?
@@soomi of course, I think no one should suffer from terror Israelis and Palestinians alike, actually no human should suffer from terror, but unfortunately this is our reality.
Your fight is against Palestinian civilians and you are committing a genocide against them.
Yes they should. It will encourage others to follow in their footsteps and make a difference.