Wing Chun MASTER Caught Making MASSIVE Mistake!
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- čas přidán 15. 11. 2023
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Dominick Izzo has been training Wing Chun since 1998 and has been teaching in the Chicago area since 2008. He was the first American Wing Chun instructor to be published and published in back to back issues in Wing Chun Illustrated.
He is known for his realistic, aggressive and combative approach to Wing Chun Kung Fu.
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Great breakdown sir! I am always finding better ways to improve my Wing Chun trainings to create less bad habits. Thank you for pointing this out! 🙏🏼
We ALL do it.
@@IzzoWingChun I sure have!
👍🏽
When can we start seeing training sessions with @KevinLeeVlog and @IzzoWingChun together?
@@LoFiSamurai308 💯😀👍🏽
The martial arts community needs more of this. Beautiful work.
I actually messaged Nima King about this concept and he confirmed, that even Chu Shong Tin agreed that there is no yielding in wing chun, so as far as I’m concerned, there should be no collapsing, no retreating, only educated violence
Has anyone been taught the ten steps from Sifu Swift lineage? In the drill we always went backwards then attacked.except the last .it was against an uppercut.
@@normanwalford9426 it's best to reposition without moving back, but atleast in my perspective, it's okay to maybe take one step/shift backwards in order to reposition to avoid or attack. But as far as actually moving backwards no , you should move any direction but backwards
We indeed do not yield as in we relax/give up the position and pull our arms back. However we do have Wu sau energy meaning having foreward pressure even when disseppating force. The reason for the foreward energy is so your arm springs foreward when contact is lost. You could apply the Wu sau energy to a Tan sau but then the more you pull back your arm, the further away your hand is from it's target.
@@florisvanlingen you should be training in a way that never leads to giving up the position. If you watch CST guys train they can use the mass in such a way that they are able to punch through incoming force etc. that should be the goal
It's all about the mass, alot of WC miss this concept..fo
Kevin's such a nice guy and 100% for him to have the balls to post up videos that we can all learn from. Kevin was already at a disadvantage form the get-go because of his reach; even more so, his backing out created room for Jesse's kicks (i.e., kicking range). Izzo, 100% you're correct. Notwithstanding his disadvantage, he would have been able to overcome it had he continued pressing, smothering and attacking as you've pointed out.
I'm 6' with long limbs. But I get into this situation with another dude in my gym who's 6'4".
What are the concepts is that water always seeks the leak. Meaning everything should be a removal of a barrier to strike. But correct we all get caught up in drill and kudos to Kevin for his humility. Is 100% a great guy and a great practitioner of Wing Chun and other Arts
The Karate guy looked like the Wing Chun guy. It is a learning experience.
As someone who started training in Wing Chun as a 15-year-old in 1968. before the Bruce Lee craze under Sifu Joseph Cheng, I have witnessed so many bullshit WC practitioners. I do not believe Kevin is one of them and I am really sure Sifu Izzo is not either! He approaches the art in a logical way and If I did not live in the UK I would attend his classes! Keep fighting to get legitimate WC out on the net sir, you are appreciated!
One more thing. Would love to see a video of you interviewing Kevin.
In my experience as a WC guy, I can't really pull off any proper strike anyway if I can't control the opponent's center in the moment of the strike.
Glad your back making videos Izzo,Keep It Up
many people train like they are afraid to get hit. You need to be able to take a hit, but you don't want to be taking hits. Wing Chun the way I train is looking for contact so that I know where to enter, my opponent dictates how I will enter and with what technique or weapon. The opponent decides his fate.
Intensity in training is everything
Leung Ting lineage here. Not sure jow much this matters. But, in this sequence our lop is more of a fook sao, with the forward punch crossing the bridge of the fook arm. The punch does look more like a backfist in other lineages. Which our sifu told us specifically not to do. We were taught, like you said, forward energy, forward intent, at all times. We definitely forget this as we roll, and get caught up in the sequence. That being said, what you say in this video is right on. Love your stuff, as always, Izzo! And i love Kevin's videos as well. We are all human beings, and need these reminders of how to train for what we're doing. Thank you!
Great CONSTRUCTIVE criticism... 1st time in your channel , sir... NGL, it very positively surprised me
In Kevin's defense, Jesse has alot more experience in his art than Kevin does in his.
Izzo vids are awesome. I regularly go back and watch the old vids too
This is why I combine boxing footwork with wing Chung
What a great Reaction!!! You are soooo right!
An other mistake in my opinion is, he keeps distance. He doesn't go forward. Kindly Regards from Germany, from Dom to Dom 🎉😊
Wonderful. Good catch, especially through that flurry.
I would debate with you whether or not there should be a gap in the bong lop drill (I say not). Yes, the punch must be forward, but it shouldn't really be backed off of the arm before the punch is executed. Forward pressure - always.
Well done.
I'm glad you're back !
Good eye great explanation!
Old clips of Izzo makes me feel old. 😂
Hey Dominick, kudos to you Jessie and Kevin. I usually don’t comment but I’m a fan of your channel. We’re all here to learn…except for the dilettantes and the users of mastered skills. Personally I also keep studying and take ownership of my mistakes, and there have been many. One big one requiring orthopedic surgery. Thirty years as a leo taught me: everything works sometimes but nothing works all the time. When putting your hands on people, your results may vary. It is through the Kung Fu Morphic resonance that the martial arts community as a whole improves.
My thoughts….
I completely agree all KF practitioners need to train with intent in mind. People forget I think, that Wing Chun teaches you to forge the tools before you actually learn to apply those tools in a semi/uncontrolled manner. This equals a slower learning curve towards actual combat application where your Kung Fu is “unleashed” rather than “applied” and yes, always with forward momentum. WC does not teach you how to fight right away. If that’s what you’re looking for, find another system.
In a systemized “Chi Sao program” you learn the higher levels of application. For example “We are the last to move but the first to arrive”, means move in, interrupt their attack by taking their space/structure/balance and hitting them first then phon sao (follow up hand replacement) while driving them back without let up. This is actually counter intuitive for most fighters, whose initial response might be to take a step back first when attacked.
The motto in WC is do the first best thing first, not second or third best thing first. WC is all about risk management. We don’t want to exchange blows we want to finish the fight quickly, go eat and talk BS.
There is a difference between collapsing a hand with no energy and retracing a hand while still maintaining a forward stick. Sometimes I need to bring the opponent to me to get a better position while actually opening them up.
WC has rear stepping footwork. The student is first introduced to this in “Battle Punches” where we punch from a deep horse stepping forward in repetition and then stepping backwards and punching in repetition. Retreating steps are then solidified in the Batt Jam Dao where practitioners learn how to chop, stab, cut and slice while simultaneously stepping backwards in sections of the knife form.
But you gotta hang around long enough to get all this stuff.
Boy I used to love the “lop and chop”! Looks good. Feels good. But it’s certainly not “first best” tool to whip out from the box. It does have its place as a finishing technique though when the opponent has been sufficiently tenderized.
The real gems of WC are not the physical Kung fu. It’s the concept of the “introduction”. The “little idea”. And understanding the “nature” of a person, place or thing. Grasp these and the universe is at your fingertips…
I'm glad wing chun still seems to be alive. I've been getting back to it, hopefully will have some content soon again.
Yo Dom, I always wondered what you thought of sifu Ed Cruzs wing chun because they seem to be in your area of the states. Wouldn't mind seeing a video or a collab on them one day.
Glad you are back into wing content. I gotta get my shit out there again so maybe we could link up one day. I'm in Tennessee though lol
Also i still find it funny that the karate guy actually does bong properly
Lok Sau is a great fighting and training platform. I personally don’t do a straight punch within the roll as it goes against the natural function of the joint. The rolling back fist to me is a better option but I respect the traditional roll.
This awesome izzo just learn something important as im student of wing chun
Thanks Marco
He was being polite, I agree. For 37 years of training and many many years as the uke, we do get used to the routine and not the real Bunkai or continuous motion, flow
What I would say is real or pressure sparring
Good eyes Sifu
Domo arigato gozaimasu
Walter san
We need the theory of how this SHOULD have been done to be put into practice so that we can feel confident that it is indeed possible to overcome these easily recognized weaknesses.
Just imagine Kevin not pulling back and instead driving forward.
@@levimaynard2237 Certainly, but we need to see situations where it actually happens.
Syne it was just one of those days that traffic was congested.
I saw the video. I just asked myself why is Kevin being nice? My WC mentality is to put forward pressure and make it dirty for the opponent. Much love to Kevin and Jesse too. WC wins when the practitions fights ruthless and dirty, not pretty. Forget the techniques and follow the flow and principles in a fight.
I've seen too many people on a few different videos trying to puff themselves up by bashing Kevin, who is a phenomenal martial artist. (I don't mean this video doing that. I mean a lot of comments across several vids.)
A couple observations on the video...
1) Jesse is much bigger.
2) Jesse looks like he's going harder. Probably because its his video on his channel and he wants his karate to look good.
3) Kevin is trying to present technique more than he's trying to fight. He's showing great hand speed and technique in the initial exchange, but there's not a lot of aggression to exploit the advantage he creates to seek a finish. Not a lot of forward pressure. He's not going after eyes and throat. He's not going into chain punch once he clears the line. He's not trying to fuk sao the neck and finish with elbows. etc. That's not because he doesn't know. You can him do it in a hundred other videos. Like you said, he's being a good partner and putting on a good show. If its a failing at all, then its a failing in that he didn't have a common understanding with Jesse on how hard to go. Its not a failing of his wing chun.
4) Even having said the above, lets talk about the fighting on its own merits. Kevin almost always gets the jump on the initial phase of the engagement (because his hands are so fucking fast), but he doesn't exploit the advantage to finish.
-- Round 1, he wins the initial hand exchange and he touches Jesse's chin when Jesse pushes him into the head kick. If Kevin had been "fighting" instead of "presenting", that chin touch is an eye or throat strike and that exchange proceeds very differently.
-- Rounds 2 and 5, Kevin just flat out beats him on hand speed and Jesse sort of acknowledges that he's been hit in the face.
-- Round 3 and 6 Jesse defers the trapping fight (which is not his game), steps back and fires a good kick. Kevin didn't do anything wrong really...he gets beat because Jesse is no scrub.
-- Round 4, Kevin wins the initial hand fight (again) and then Jesse kind of bodies him with size...Kevin's defense of the sweep is decent and maybe Kevin would have denied the sweep and clipped him on the jaw, maybe not because of the size difference. Thats not anything to do with his Wing Chun, its just size differential.
-- Round 7, Jesse actually wins the trapping fight and fires a kick that would have knocked anyone out. Thats just Jesse being really good -- incidentally, it also shows how Okinawan karate is a cousin of Wing Chun.
Would Kevin have done better in Rounds 3, 6, and 7 if he'd crashed the line? Maybe, maybe not. We can say "forward pressure" all we want, but if Kevin doesn't win that initial hand exchange on Jesse (like he did in Rounds 1, 2, 4, and 5) to seize the initiative, then his forward pressure is just running into a bigger dude and he's apt to get bodied and swept (because that's what Jesse's Okinawan Karate excels at). Point being, lets not exaggerate the degree to which Kevin "lost" in order to stir up inter-style drama -- he's doing a lot right in these exchanges too.
5) If you want to see a good example of kung fu techniques (including some wing chun) in a sparring exchange where both parties have a good consensus on what speed to go, then check out a video from a few years ago of Icy Mike sparring a kung fu practitioner named Sergio. Its a great showcase for practical kung fu in unscripted sparring (light to medium contact).
Yeah wing chun is the primary base of all Okinawan karate. And specifically Goju ryu came from wing Chun and it's cousin white crane.
And yes Jesse is just actually a really good martial artist. He's a better fighter than his brother although he doesn't make out to be. Jesse is actually really humble about how good he is tbh.
@@willtherealrustyschacklefo3812 I think you have that backwards. Wing Chun is a relatively young style of kung fu that derives from White Crane and Snake styles. Okinawan karate traces to White Crane kung fu as well. So Wing Chun and Okinawan karate (like Goju Ryu) are really more like cousins.
You're right about Jesse, he's an exceptional martial artist and -- even though he tries to hide it with a very nice guy persona -- he's a very good fighter.
@@gw1357 wing chun is older than white crane, and was around before the 1600s. Js.
@@gw1357 that "legend" is not accurate, wing Chun didn't even come from the Shaolin it was brought to them. Wing chun was created from tai chi and southern Chinese boxing. Prior to white crane even being created
@@gw1357 and Okinawan karate outside of Goju ryu, like ueichi ECT legitimately are just Okinawan wing Chun and has no resemblance to white crane outside of some training exercises.
I remember the first time I saw you talk about the intent with your WC techniques as strikes. It was very eye opening to someone looking at the art from the outside. In your hook punch defense video, I loved how you used the Kwan sau to crash in, such a great concept.
What happens when the other guy has been learning boxing for a year, is five inches taller with a good reach and refuses to play into your preferred distance? He just throws hard dedicated punches from a distance with no slappery engagement. It seems like wing chun is all about the near-clinch distance which you are not guaranteed to get to relative to your opponent's reach.
"what if" is something you need to figure out for yourself.
I suppose the emphasis is chee. Losing contact is counter to that. Francis Fong shows Kevin a lot of the same gaps in the application. Thanks.
Kevin is totally legit.
You’re right it’s poor practice to assume you can trap the rear guard after a Bong Lap Sau. Always go for the strike! Then if your partner raises their rear guard simply trap it. Lok Sau teaches these basic skills to strike and to recover the rear guard.
IZZO PLEASE TELL US WHAT YOU THINK ABOUT FRANCIS FONG SIFU! THANK YOU
😅 no filters
In EBMAS they don’t practice this as a bong/lop sao drill or at least I was never taught this and it’s not anywhere in the student program up to 1st technician. Although I’m aware of what it is from watching other lineages.
We practiced jut chuen sao. Instead of using a lop sao, they bong and jut sao. The jut has forward pressure. The fact is, if you grab with lop sao for one thing, you run the risk of pulling your opponent in towards you, allowing him to have forward pressure on you. Your also giving him the possibility to lock you down. Also, when you grab the opponent or training partner, if he bong saos when you grab, he can also come over your wrist with a collapsing elbow and break your grip whilst hitting you. By applying the jut sao instead of lap sao you can push his bong back into him and give him pressure without locking your own arm by tensing the muscles when you grab. The jut can give pressure just by structure without muscular force needing to be applied.
I’ve also seen people do this drill and the punch with a downward force, like a chop almost, instead of punching forward. Apparently Leung Ting once asked Ip Man why some of the students did this and he said it was because they were testing the bong sao structure of the partner, but it should predominantly be done with forward pressure not downward pressure. Some of the students didn’t understand and saw him testing and thought that’s how it was done and so they missed the point which is to go forward.
Concerning the first minutes: You are right, but there's a little more to this drill. 1st: People just "start" the drill, without input from your partner. Back in the 1990ies I learned that you only do that lap-fak when e. g. you try to punch and get blocked. Then you clear the path with the lap. 2nd: That's what you mentioned. Don't train with the thought in your back that there's a hand in your way. You hit right through. And only when his Wu is strong enough to stop you, you pull, again in order to clear the path (you could pak too).
So, in short: You need input. Or else you'd just punch through.
Jesse is the aggressor in this and keep pressing
He begins with an overly stretched stance, losing contact when he attacks, especially problematic given his shorter stature. Remaining stationary and merely flipping his arms during strikes, he commits significant errors. In contrast, the karate practitioner adopts an explosive stance, responding swiftly to Wing Chun movements.
Directly trapping and attacking someone anticipating backward movement is counterproductive. Instead, utilize feints and strategic retreats, forcing your opponent to punch into empty space. Inject unpredictability into your movements, making it difficult for them to anticipate your advances. This isn’t just about technique; it’s about sowing doubt in your opponent’s mind.
Yes, yes....I'm guilty of this also.....and still working hard on forward intent for twenty five years....😂...I still concern myself too much about the ability of my training partner if he gets blasted not defending properly 🤷🏿♂️...training never gets easier....guess it's not supposed to
Kevin lee I wouldn't consider a master.... he is really good, but still has a lot to learn. his teacher Francis Fong is a master for sure.
Sifu Francis Fong is awesome to watch.
he pulled his punch, not really a mistake.
Look at that Bong Lop Smh
Master? 😂
Ok, making a remark at round 5. Haven't seen any further in the video. He's not moving, period. No Yiu Ma, just trying to block. BLOCKS DON'T WORK. Move in to the opponent. Disrupt his balance as he's kicking. So sick of seeing bad Wing Chun.
Yielding is a misconstrued concept. Different lineages teach different methods. There is no collapsing elbow... It seems that way on video. Just because a force goes behind my arm doesn't mean I'm yielding for example. Yielding if one wants to see it that way is fundamental to learning the Wu wei concept. The art of non doing. Tsui Shung Tin utilised circular energy. A circle is multidimensional. Plus a circle usually works on 2.basic energies used in many combat systems. Incoming outgoing...
It has no particular trajectory depending on what you are using to activate the trajectory. In either case the arms cannot be fixed or else there's no chi sao there's no redirective abilities in combat you'll get to the point you're forcing your joints to drive your energy...
What appears as yielding is a softness quality. It has a duality when in contact... You can't be fixed with only one direction with your muscular structure because the body, muscles nerve system will work against itself.
You'll never get to point where you can deal comfortably chi saoing with guys 20 or 30 kilos heavier than you.. Unless you push weights... So..
Personally I'd look at the yielding concept deeper... Cos I repeat... It's a misconstrued and misunderstood concept... Yielding in reality when trained correctly makes your force more powerful
Last questiin to ask yourselves.. Where is your intent being focused at And from where?????
Furthermore.
What are you actually using to activate your intent...
Good points.. I made 5 videos to try and make one decent one in Kevin Lee. But seems you made some of the points clear...
If you want to understand better a different perspective to yielding, not yielding let me know.
I believe if you use your arrow keys you can step through a video
KEVIN IS NOT FULLY APPLYING WC PRINCIPLES. DISTANCE, PRESSURE, POSITION, STRIKING, AND THE KARATE JUST DOES WHAT HE WANTS.
Whaaat I aw the punch , he pulled back so he didn’t hurt the guy. Watch again you see hem snap back
Nope. Slow it down. There was ZERO extension.
@@IzzoWingChun It does look like the elbows clash, with Jessie’s hand extended, looks like he catches the elbow
and that is still wrong@@truthhurts1884
@@IzzoWingChun yup, should have still gone through with the punch.
Hey I’m thinking of opening a school here in Louisiana, I’ve just moved from the uk. Do you have any advice on how to get started?
Because someone invented a drill 150 years ago doesn't mean that new and better drills shouldn't be invented. Understand what the drill is supposed to do, & simply make better ones. There is also too much emphasis on defending wing chuin attacks when they are likely to never encounter them on the street.
or it should be done right.
@@IzzoWingChun agreed but the lop bong drill seems to have several deficits that could be taken out of it. Examples would be that anytime an attack is made to the head, a palm should be used instead of a fist. Take out the backfist & only use a straight line attack. Work only on removing an obstruction when an obstruction actually exists. When lopping go for a palm or a punch to the floating ribs instead of the head. In this last case the head is already highly protected so go for something that's not and is much harder to defend.
and still, no video of an actual serious fight in the dojo to prove any of this. There are so many people who would be willing to fight from so many styles.
Yet you’re still here, vid after vid. You love it. 😘
Yall are awesome @@IzzoWingChun
I've been thinking. With your physicality, I think you would be dangerous regardless of the art you train in. I don't feel your ability in Wing Chun speaks for Wing Chun in the way it should.@@IzzoWingChun
Should do less chi siao and more sparring.
I have seen this many times. Your commentary in the beginning does not resonate until it is watched to the very end. Your views made to enhance the art are no where covered in detail by anyone else. That said; everything you pointed out is true. Now what you have not brought to the training hall is this man is a Black Belt in combat striking arts. He has no less than hundreds of fights to earn that belt. He was actually being kind to Kevin, yet not letting anyone best him. It is the mind set of this fighting style this is one of the big reasons why Bruce Lee stepped away from Wing Chun against opponents. Kevin is in the Drill mode and his opponent is in the combat mode. So now I have pointed out Kevin's faults, what are his remedies? Kevin is not trained for that foot hitting him in the head, not trained for the disengage for setting up leg strikes, not trained for that push then strike. For that low body drop Gene LaBel take down. Kevin always in defense mode. From the go get Kevin should have pressed forward explosively closing off that leg distance done damage then do that two hop back to take him out of leg shot distance. That is where Bruce Lee created the "Beat and a half". Almost all martial arts and even Boxing strike then wait for the opponent to strike. Strike and wait for the opponent to strike.
Bruce cut that Strike time for his opponent in half and struck!
Just saying from a "Couch Potato" point of view.
I see your introduction starts with Psalm 144:1-2 which is a good Bible verse. Which causes me to not to question if Kevin's Wing Chun is legit, but rather if you are a legit Christian. Because if you are then I would be more concerned about the use of your foul language then Kevin's Wing Chun technique.
Ephesians 4:29
Don’t use foul or abusive language. Let everything you say be good and helpful, so that your words will be an encouragement to those who hear them.
James 1:26
If a person thinks that he is religious but can’t control his tongue, he is fooling himself. That person’s religion is worthless.
Proverbs 4:24
Remove perverse speech from your mouth; keep devious talk far from your lips.
Colossians 3:8
“But now you also put off all these things: anger, rage, malice, slander, foul language out of your mouth.”
Matthew 15:18-19
But whatever goes out of the mouth comes from within, and that’s what makes a person unclean. Evil thoughts, murder, adultery, [other] sexual sins, stealing, lying, and cursing come from within.
Psalm 141:3
“Set a guard, O LORD, over my mouth; Keep watch over the door of my lips [to keep me from speaking thoughtlessly].”
I’m not a Christian. Im a Christ follower.
@@IzzoWingChun That is good to hear. I too am a follower of Jesus Christ and His slave as well. If you are a true follower of Jesus Christ and slave to Him as your Master, then I would pray that you would follow Him in obedience. He died on the Cross to make us holy and separate from the world. I pray that in love you would heed my exortation and consider your conduct as a follower of Christ on this platform which reaches many. Our desire as Christ followers is to give a good testimony to the world 🙏
do you have any REAL fight against other Sifu or REAL sparring to show us instead of blablabla and chisao?
Wow. Mention scripture yet swearing all over the place. I'm not perfect but it takes some intent to live in sin like that. Have some conversations with Christ, or maybe don't mention scripture if you're not Christian? 🤔
I used to watch you a lot before I gave up Wing Chun. I won't get into that.