Which Primarch was the Emperor's ACTUAL Favourite? | Warhammer 40k Lore
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The Emperor has clear favourites amongst his Primarch sons, but which of them is actually his favourite?
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This is a very debatable topic since unfortunately, the Big E is never like "yeap he's the one, he's my Warhammer 40k" but I think there is more to it than just yelling about the "GLORIOUS GOLDEN HAWK BOY"
Ah well - 25% off Boxing Day Majorkill Merch Sale is Live here : www.majorkill.shop/
No salamander merch no sale
“There is more to it then yelling ‘ GLORIOUS GOLDEN HAWK BOY’.” There kind of isn’t. It’s pretty open and shut.
You should start asking us to message the people involved in producing the 40k show to have you consult as one of the biggest personalities in the Genre.
Hello Majorkill,
Would you kindly make some lore videos on the Imperial Truth, the Imperial Creed, the Ecclesiarchy? Pretty please? Thank you.
Please do my good sir majorkill, the imperial creed.
I miss Timmy.....
Me too man, me too...
Timmy had to be put down for legal reasons
I wish Timmy would come back
😂😂😂😂😂😂 that little b@#$&
Ironic that bullying timmy got major majorkill a channel strike so majorkill had to systematically hunt and purge all traces of timmy from his videos.
Honestly, thinking about it, it makes sense. Vulkan is definitely favourite son material.
He literally made him perpetual and the embodiment of all that is good about humanity. So that alone gives me the feeling that he is.
Big E has also said that vulkan is his greatest creation
Vulkan always gave the best hugs and would always boop the snoot when he could
😂😊🤗@@generaljimmies3429
@@luisesquedadealba6739 to be fair he is literally the greatest one when it comes to size.
You would think the Emperor would've liked Jaghatai more. After all, he was a lot like what the Emperor espoused about wanting humanity to become. He was caring and kind, albeit not to the same extent as Vulkan, and was pragmatic and thoughtful, thinking things through logically. Though I suppose being anti-authoritarian could've easily driven a wedge between Jaghatai and the biggest tyrant humanity had ever seen.
Jaghatai wasn't as personally loyal to E-money.
Yeah, Jaghatai lowkey HATED the Imperium. He had some big arguments with Malcador and Big E during his time on Terra and a lot of his legion’s isolation stemmed from not wanting to be part of the Imperium. He was happy to slaughter xenos, orks in particular, and make humanity safe, but a monolithic star-spanning tyranny? No way
He's the only character in the whole series that used his head
The Primarchs were made to accomplish the Big E's plans, and the Khan resisted being the Emperor's tool. Jaghatai wasn't particularly obedient. So he wasn't as useful a tool to the Emperor as he could be.
I think the emperor lowkey liked corvus
The Kahn has always been the most interesting to me. I love the respectful, but mutual and suspicious indifference they had for each other. I feel like the Kahn and big E are more similar to each other that either would like to admit.
Big E wouldn’t trust himself if he were in the Kahn’s shoes either. He was interested in useful tools not individuals who understood his true nature.
It seems like the main division between the two was the Imperial Truth and hiding the reality of the Warp.
He knows the big e is a dictator, but still better than an evil warp god. Khan has true common sense
The Khan is the most sane of the Primarchs.
People hate people just like them though.
Also remember the Emperor kept the Webway War going for longer than it needed to - sacrificing thousands more Custodes and Sisters in the process - just for the slightest of chance that Vulkan could reach him on Terra.
That says a lot about His opinion of Vulkan.
Huh I did not know that I’ll have to read into it.
Yeah he literally reopened the Webway for Vulkan despite the havoc everyone went through closing it after Magnus tore it up
The thing with Vulkan being the Big Es favourite makes more tragedy to Angron, who was as kind as Vulkan before the BN got implanted in his head.
Angron is what happens when the Paladin is surgically forced to be the Barbarian.
@@GhostBear3067 Class Trait: Constant Rage
You are always raging and can only act in initiative order. This applies during roleplay as well as combat.
@GhostBear3067 Shit good point!
If I had a guardsman for every extra "layer of tragedy" of Magnus I'd be able to field a regiment by now.
I think with the new Lore with the Lion, The Emperor might definitely see him in a better light too. Lion has been pretty compassionate to humans, even going so far as to have mere humans act as his "Bodyguards" to respect their honor. Lion definitely softened a bit in those long years and is trying to become better.
yes the lion has definitely matured and become more human I think he is the Emperors favourite son right now even though Guilliman is doing a lot the lion is definitely closer
@@ms.blackfire2927 Lion's outright admitted he made the wrong choice with how he treated Luthor. Being able to admit to your mistakes and learn from them is a huge bit of character growth.
@@brettwood1351 To be fair, unlike Guilliman, Lion pretty much was somewhat conscious during his big nap, so he could think on such matters. Now I wonder if Big E was able to do some introspective on himself during those 10 000 years.
@@combinecommando001most likely yes however that introspective being may not be the E we were left with
@@RevolverRho Likely a very melancholic E and yet still holds on for the sake of humanity. After all, only in death does duty truly end and he's not done yet.
Guilliman is pretty human too though, he doesnt consider himself above other humans and actively tries to save them.
That what having a caring foster mom and dad give you - a proper humane none-tarded upbringing.
It's probably why he'd look at a list like this and go. "I can live with that."
@@myself2noone true, as far as I can tell Guilliman didn't really seem to care much what others thought of him which has to be worth a few extra good primarch points
Robot Gorillaman is one of my favourites
@mikeoxmall69420 He is my only favourite considering I have only read his, horuses and the lions books and Robu is the nicest one of them all.
A “Which Space Marine were each of the Primarch’s favorite would be interesting.”
Not really, it would basically be a list of first captains.
That's way too easy. They tell us directly in some of the books.
@@borponoida9161 But you're forgetting, most people here asking for videos are too lazy to do any reading themselves. They basically want someone else to spend 10 hours reading a book and condense it down into easier to digest 10 minute videos.
We know Sanguinus’ favorite is Dante. 😊
@@cynreiusacari3163 And Robooty Glittyman's is Huron 🤣
I really like the "best employee of the company" for rogal dorn. It really sums up their relationship.
Never leaves the microwave dirty, always makes a fresh pot of mud...
I personally think Corvus is at least in the top 3. I always felt like his interactions with the Emperor were always way more personal than any of his brothers. He got way more details, had many of his questions answered, and also was allowed to proceed as he wanted during the heresy.
You could argue Sanguinius, Lion, or Corvus. But there’s nothing wrong with picking Vulkan. That’s why I love 40k though, cause you can have your own thoughts backed up by specific examples.
Their first meeting just comes off as so different from the others. Firstly, Corvus gets a glimpse at what could be argued is the Emperor's real body beneath all the glamour before he's overwhelmed by it like everyone else. And then they have such a personal conversation together, and the Emperor seems genuinely pleased to just hear what Corvus has to say, and even takes a drink of water from a glass he gave him, which is strangely the most mundane human thing I think he's done. He obviously saw some sort of balance in Corvus that touched his human side.
Corvus # 1
Well becasue of that I liked when Guilliman while talking to preacher(and being extremly angry) he denounced Emperor as his father telling that Konor Guilliman was the only person he see as his father
Yeahhh...except it is said that Fulgrim's speech to his 200 remaining legionnaries, legitimately made BigE shed a tear and that's why they could (officialy this time) be called the Emperor's Children, wear the Imperial purple and the Aquila. Okay Fulgrim might not have been his favorite, but he was very far above Mortarion, Curze and so on. Middle ground at the very least.
One custodes to another "Did you hear rumours that Vulcan lives?"
Emperor on Golden Throne with rests of his strength: stomp, stomp
those stomps are going to shake all of holy Terra if the emperor uses all his remaining strength
Corax- Goddammit! 😂
I think he trusted The Lion the most for sure; which is why he gave them essentially all the oldest and most crazy shit.
He was right to trust him; his loyalty is unquestionable and real. I REALLY love that he didn't tell on Russ about the Wulfen; something Russ remarks "He never did, even in anger."
Lion is the most loyal.
I could imagine the lion seeing the wulfen and thinking. "Dad gave leman secret werewolves. Fuckin sick but not as cool as the secret deathbots I got."
The first legion already had dark-age technology before the Lion was found
@silversurfer8818 and was able to keep them and got more stuff afterwards. The Lion was definitely up there as a favored and trusted son.
@@starhammer5247 Lion is the most loyal to the Emprah, Vulkan is the most loyal to the Imperium and its people
Sanguinius: *falls in battle to Horus*
Big E: "MY BABY BOY!!!"
Ollannius Pius: "Emperor, no!"
Big E: "EMPEROR YEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEESSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSS!!!" *fires a powerful golden blast at Horus and causes a massive explosion*
i think it also really says something about the emperor how the one son who is the most compassionate, is also the literal Immortal who can regenerate from almost complete annihilation. it's one small ray of Hope, that the best part of Humanity is the part that cannot Die.
Correct me if I'm wrong but I thought it was Malcador that was worried about Guilliman breaking away from the Imperium during the Heresy. The Emperor did know he was building an empire but it came off more as him being amused by it, saying "he's doing what he's doing best" or something along those lines. He didn't seem to suggest he thought Guilliman was breaking away from them.
Rogal Dorn was definitely one of The Emperor's favorites. Sure, they acted cold and professional with one another, but I think that has more to do with Rogal Dorn's personality than how The Emperor felt towards him.
Poor Omegon, daddy never addressed you properly.
Vulkan always gave the best hugs and would always boop the snoot when he could
A lot of authors have written scenes and dialog containing the emperor.
So, complete uniformity is literally impossible.
However, if you look at his relationship with each primarch, it is basically an exact reflection of their individual personalities.
In recent lore, very often he will be, do, appear, or say, whatever is necessary to achieve his goals. And, this is usually dependent upon the mind of the person he is dealing with.
One of the recent authors said, "Like any good ruler, he will appear in whatever form that best benefits him at that time." (Paraphrasing.)
I think the reason why Horus is The Emperor’s favorite son is the same as why Horus was always going to fall to Chaos. Horus is quite literally the only primarch with the same level of ambition as The Emperor. Only an ambition of godlike proportions could allow someone to believe their species are the rightful rulers of the galaxy and I think The Emperor found a lot of fortitude in Horus believing wholeheartedly in his plan. However, ambition of that level inevitably leads it’s wielder to believe they are the rightful ruler of the imperium. With 2 beings holding that same ambition within themselves, it was like a ticking time bomb. Horus was most likely The Emperor’s favorite because he was practically a mirror image of “The Emperor”, but not the true man underneath the mantle.
There was always going to be a heresy though the big E didn't know exactly how it would fall. This is written in the latter Horus Heresy or Siege of Terra books though I can't remember exact sources. The big delta that Chaos threw at it was that it happened way sooner than he anticipated.
I agree on the ambition front which inevitably would lead to chaos and a duel between the two because the Emperor only ever considered his children and the space marines tools for the protection and shepherding of humanity.
Didn't the Emperor tell Vulkan that he was his proudest creation? Imagine creating something that turned out to be a very good human being.
Emperor's favourite son was Constantine Valdor 😅
Magnus, originally. Big E didn't even order the razing of Prospero, Horus did to manipulate Magnus into joining his side.
The Emperor regarded Russ more favorably than that he gifted Leman the Dionysian spear which was the other half of Valdors own Apollonian spear. They were two sides of the same coin and the Emperor states to Malcador multiple times that he trusts them both the most that he knows they would never fall. He even backed his decision on the destruction of Prospero while even Malcador questioned the Wolf King.
punctuation is hard
Also Emperor always treated Russ and his legion favourably, like allowing him to keep using psykers.
@@jkgf4671 He was one of the few Primarchs the Emperor trusted with the knowledge of the warp, Russ knew about the Chaos gods in the Warp long before most of his other brothers even became aware of them.
Trust =/= love or favour. They can coincide, but they aren't directly linked.
The Emperor knew Russ would never betray him because he specifically made him so that he could never betray him. That's the reason for Russ and the Space Wolves having a bit of canine DNA. The Emperor took what made dogs the most loyal companions to humans throughout history and put it into one specific primarch. He was meant to be the Emperor's hound, and that's exactly what he was.
@@wolflordgio6320I'm not sure if he knew. Malcador said that one of the primarchs was told the entire truth about the warp. But it's not specified which one.
Sanguinius, Vulkan, Leman. Top 3 faves
Are there any interactions or anything that shows any affection towards Sanguinius? Cuz I don't recall anything. Seems more like meme lore to me.
Also why excatly your top 3 doesn't have Horus there?
Yeah I think you’re right on this one. His favorite “son”. Not warrior, not general, not friend, not tool. As a father son relationship is so human, it’s natural for him to default to the most human of his creations.
Hands down I fully believe Vulkan being the favorite for all the reasons you mentioned.
Love this take that Vulcan was the favorite. You're right that the if Big E entrusted the 7 hammers to Vulcan to build and bring to the Terra, that's a level of trust not given to any other Primarch.
I'm inclined to agree, you can add to that the meeting of the primarchs. Vulcan and Leman were the only 2 to defeat the emperor in contests. But only Vulcan was gracious in defeat and honorable in purpose. That kind of thing goes a long way in to a warrior.
Hasn’t it been said in lore that Vulcan and Corvus were the most compassionate primarchs?
I Believe You On Vulkan Because It Was Once Said That The Emperor Would Sacrifice An Entire World For His Custodes, The Emperor Knew The Webway Wars Were Gonna Fail Yet He Kept The Webway Gate Open As Long As He Could Cause He Knew Vulkan Was On His Way.
He kept it open because he still was thinking that Magnus would accept his offer and the webway project could be saved.
Is that you Captain Capslock?
@@jkgf4671that's an absolute lie, he rejected Magnus after the only uncorrupted shard of his soul was taken in and remade into Janus. Magnus lies to himself about it to justify attacking the Webway.
@@jkgf4671 Yeah But He Raged During Chess With Malcador.
@@matjov Indeed It Is.
You missed the big one, if you can only make 1 son a perpetual. . . That's your favorite.
Alpharius is actually the first found as he was directly located on Terra itself in the Urals area. They maintained that Horus was the first to keep Alpharius a secret until it was time for him to be revealed later.
Wasn’t the fact the Vulcan inherited the Big E’s perpetual status another huge reason why Vulcan was the emperors favourite?
I think it makes sense Vulkan is The Emperor's favorite son because he loved humanity his entire purpose in life was to protect humanity and help them evolve to prosper so it makes sense his favorite son would be the most human
The Emperor loved humanity, but he had to be efficient and cruel to save the species. Vulcan inherited the heart the Emperor wishes he still had, and it's one of the few things he still feels hope in for a future worth fighting for.
As much as I love the 1st legion and the lion the most, the big happy, hugging man who is more than a little war crimey is a great son. Who could hate such a likeable fellow?
“But Majorkill why haven’t you talked about Alpha Primis more? He’s actually really interesting and has some really cool lore….” Shut up Timmy! ……I miss Timmy🥺
I think modern Guilliman and the Lion would make the Emperor much more proud and happy. With how hard Guilliman is working to keep the Emperor's vision and Imperium alive, and how the Lion is actively becoming much nicer to regular humans. They definitely deserve the extra love imo
Rogal Dorn is the most love since he's the only one who ever got a bed time story from Big E.
Not saying it's Magnus, but it's Magnus. Strawberry and Big E got along so famously even before Magnus was found.
Not only favourite but I truly believe that the emperor would choose Vulcan to lead the imperium after the Great Crusade since humanity would no longer need a general or warmaster but instead a compassionate leader to truly lead them into a new golden age..... Until the Necrons and Tyranids show up.
I think the Emperor saw through the Lion too well to be close to him. After all, as opposed to Russ who was a man masquerading as an animal, the Lion was is an animal masquerading as a man.
This is an obnoxious meme take.
Lion was never pretending to be anything, he's just a hunter that rather not politic about anything.
@@warlordjr.jr. I don't see how it's obnoxious at all. If it weren't for his super human intelligence, he probably would have ended up something like forest Tarzan.
@@warlordjr.jr.after reading quite a few of the dark angels books its an accurate assessment of the lions personality
Ngl that reminds me of Godfrey from elden Ring
@warlordjr.jr. Only thing is. Russ of all people specifically mentions. How the Lion was well versed in court affairs and the politicking of the lords of Terra.
"The chocolate coloured pyro maniac" 💀
🤍⚪
New names for the I Legion, the XVI Legion and the XII Legion: Rock Angels (symbols of the Knights' Rock, the Knights' Winged Sword, Caliban's Earth Angel and Caliban's Lion-Wolf), (old) Luna Bulls and (old) War Wolves (symbol similar to the Space Wolves, but red and without fur).
🖤⚫
Using the Angels of Absolution as an example, isn't it cooler to give the Dark Angels (personal rename: the Rock Angels) the bone color and the Death Guard the green color?
Superb video as always @majorkill.
Could you make a video dedicated to the Navigators, the major houses, their politics, relation to the overall Imperium and factions, etc
Alpharius, only one to get homeschooled, Big E trusted him enough to be his hidden blade who practically did whatever he wanted. Even killed a Custode with no complaints.....well except for Constatine who was pretty mad bout losing that Custode
Salamanders are and have been by far my favorite legion. My first book was Helsreach and the small part they played made me look at them a lot more. Vulkan rocks, good to see that the Big E knows that shit.
It’s Sanguinius . Confirmed in end of death vol 1.
Rogal Dorns says so, not the Emperor himself.
Bestest son
And it’s been said dozens of times that Horus was the favorite. This confirms nothing.
@@N0TYALC your comment confirms you never read a single HH novel. You are just an average fanboi.
@@N0TYALC the thing is Horus himself confirms this .
Great video mate
Thanks for a great video once again💣, though I have to pair it with a request. Could you cover, in more detail, Sigismund adventures during siege of Terra? The old video about Sigi is awesome, but as I understand there's new lore about the siege covering alot of Sigismund.
Oi, Merry Christmas and Happy New Year to everyone, you somehow managed to live another year, good job 👏
Merry Christmas, Majorkill.
A video of the top ten community wholesome moments would be great
Do a video on the chief librarian from each legion.
Agreed shame we don’t get to see more of Ferrus and the emperor. I think he would be in the top 4
Majorkill the kinda guy to see his dad after he 'went out to grab milk' and immediately start spouting 40k lore till he turns around and leaves again.
Still patiently waiting for the video on which two pre-heresy legions would be the strongest if combined together
Dark Angeles + Blood Angeles = Dark Blood Angeles
Salamanders + White Scars
Iron Warriors + Imperial fists, best defence and best assault.
Youu should start asking us to message the people involved in producing the 40k show to have you consult as one of the biggest personalities in the Genre.
You need to do a revamp of when the emperor found the primarchs too many of the primarchs were contacted with before they said they were and some were contacted first before other brother i feel like deciphering this mystery is important because itll give us an insight on the emperor and his grand plan to protect the universe
Corvus, as always, is the underrated answer
Hello Majorkill,
Would you kindly make some lore videos on the Imperial Truth, the Imperial Creed, the Ecclesiarchy? Pretty please? Thank you.
Just got done listing my oo echos of eternity and so far from what I’ve learned from the Horus heresy, your 100% correct. Vulkan is legit his last and final defense and weapon against chaos in the end. If big E ever truly saw any of them as his true flesh and blood it was definitely vulkan
Idea for you, what was the imperium and everyone's reaction to the emperor being intured upon the golden throne. I love the custodes reaction to strip lol.
I’d argue he liked Guilliman more than said here. I don’t remember if it was Malcador or emps but during that same conversation they remarked that Guilliman doing what he was made to do when the Lion was going to visit him. He also took the time to talk to Guilliman and soothe his concerns about how the great crusade was being conducted. Add on to this he choose him and his legion for the job of monarchia. Even if it was somehow a concealed threat he still thought highly enough of them to trust them for the job and to serve as a good example for the word bearers.
I love Baldermorts shot at Majorkill in his Christmas Ork tale...."those who have nothing to offer on their patreon so they peddle hentai..."
It makes sense Vulkan's the emperor's favourite, but the LION HAD THE EMPEROR'S RESPECT
Vid Idea: Which Legions suit well with each other? Like which would have the best or perfect synergy?
As a space wolves fan, yeah Vulkan is the epitome of the best son
Video idea: what is the black rage?
Im already having one of the worst holidays Ive had in years and that intro just rubbed chili powder into the wound
I believe ur right with Vulcan on the part about keeping his humanity and don't forget big e traits/emotions were in a way turned up to the Max and his sons were the same
I think it’s Sanguinius mostly due to the book. Where Horus is explaining who his favourite son was and he was using his brothers as examples, with him has the Big E. Horus then describes Loken as his favourite son and refers to him as his ‘Sanguinius’.
I picked up one of the "Even a man with nothing to lose can still offer his life" shirt over christmas and I fucking love it. Super comfy.
Love from a Airier and Vaush fan!
At one point in the lore the Emporer even calls Vulkan "My perfect creation" or something to that effect. It's the only reason I already knew the answer before clicking the vid, so I was surprised you didn't include it until I tried to find it again to link it and couldn't. It's out there somewhere though, he straight up calls him "perfect".
@@lukeBryen2 I agree, and it follows the "road to hell is paved with good intentions" route. It's more compelling, interesting, and relatable than him just being a villain the whole time. It also makes more sense for the post Great Crusade plan that he seemed to be working towards where some of his sons had genuine purposes beyond just being warlords, a noble goal that he tried so hard to achieve that he would be willing to sacrifice the qualities he desired most. He wanted humanity to guide itself post Crusade, so it makes sense that he would basically use his sons as a backup to himself: all of his best qualities as a warlord in some of them, all of his best humanitarian qualities in others. And THAT is a 4d chess maneuver all it's own without it just being him secretly being greedy. He seemingly made sure that, regardless of the outcome of the many possible strands of future that lay before him, his sons would be there to pick up the slack in his absence. The fact that he also gave true immortality to the only one that actually gives a shit about humanity also says a lot about this: the Great Crusade was about uplifting humanity, not him. This decision made it so that, even if the Emporer lost sight of his goals or was removed from the picture entirely, his humanity would always remain in some form to impact the course of his race and would not be something that the other primarchs could get rid of because it gets in the way of space marines dominating the race.
I finally got the majorkills ad on a majorkills vod
... Well analyzed! 😎👍
Can I suggest as an idea for a video the ranking for fairness in how the big E treted the primarchs, such as lowest the one who was treated the worst and not deserving it and first the one who was treated exactly as how he deserved?
"Don't you talk shit about my fabulous fucking hawk boy." - Man Emperor of Mankind.
Just got the Big E miniature the day after Christmas. Guess it came just in time.
The emperor was never worried about Guilliman turning to caos during the Horus heresy... Malcador was the one who was worried about Guilliman creating a breakaway empire but the emperor reassured him otherwise.
The emperor had 2 favorites, Primarchs 2 and 11. The others were so jealouse they elimnated them and the Emperor and Malcador had to wipe their minds to make them forget their crime.
I got a few of the Fuckhead santa hats for friends of mine. The look on their faces when they got them. Only one is a 40k fan, but still, I figured I'd give them something from the best 40k loretuber.
Please cover what if clonegrim returned How'd it impact the setting? How'd the imperium/primarchs react?
Merry Christmas brothers and all
I no longer know where I got that info from but Vulcan was also Big E's pick for after the crusade, when the wars were over to rule a peaceful empire.
I was quite surprised when you said Vulkan, but the arguments you put forward for him being the favourite really do make sense and I cannot think of an argument against him not being. The Lion and Russ are unshakably loyal but like you said The Lion was the tool of choice for major campaigns that just needed to be fought with trumpets sounding and medals being awarded (rangdan) and Russ the tool of choice for the dirty work or to send a message to the other legions that there not doing there compliance well enough. Dorn and Guilliman are just a safe pair of hands for what needs to be done. Excellent conclusion.
Yo he definitely knows about that holiday spec. 😂
Once the big E orders are all done you oughta do a majorkill Vulkan; he’s gotta have his favorite boy with him 😆
Whoa... I get an update about my Big E model ... AND the man has guns out at Xmas?
Vulkan is also my favourite Primarch for the same reasons. And his Salamanders are just awesome.
There is one scene that I think is perfect. It is Konrad's finest hour, when he speaks to an aspect of the Big E. His flesh effigy coming to life as it seems like E-Money was trying to apologize to Konrad and give him some comfort. While Konrad was freaking out and didn't know how to handle the idea that Big E, at the very least pitied him like Perty. What really gets me is the ambiguity of that scene. Because we all know The Emperor can absolutely do that, but it is also equally possible that it's a hallucination. A figment of Konrad's twisted psyche.
What's Gulliman's reaction to the Lion's awakening?
The depressed blue boy must have been really lonely before the Lion arrived
Just picked up a couple singlets 🤙🤙
I think the emperor did like Fulgrim.
The speech fulgrim gave when meeting the 200 marines left after the geneseed incident make the big e cry because it was so inspiring.
He also was basically a package deal with horus, learning under him.