The Best Civil War Movie from the Southern Perspective
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- čas přidán 4. 05. 2020
- The Outlaw Josey Wales, directed by Clint Eastwood and based on a novel by Forrest Carter, is an awesome western - and beyond that, does an amazing job at presenting a sympathetic view of Southerners during the Civil War without resorting to Lost Cause revisionism. In this video, I discuss what makes this movie so good, and dunk on Gods and Generals again, because I know y'all dig that.
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>wants to run away from his past
>invents a new identity
>changes way of life
>forgets to change last name
Maybe that's just a way for him to remind that something you cant just run away and forget
Or he was still proud of his old glory days
Reminds me of:
Obi-Wan Kenobi --> Ben Kenobi
@@felixsantosa3815 Hah!
@@felixsantosa3815
>Hides Luke with Owen and Beru to hide him from the empire
>Doesn’t even change his last name
>wither skeletons lmao
Last names are sacred to a lot of people, he would probably have rather died than abandon the name of his father.
Honestly "Gods and Generals" sounds like a mobile game.
And a bad one too
fricking 8% on rotten tomatos
Actually there is a Gods and Generals videogame, but it was made for PC in the early 2000s. It is really bad. Like, Big Rigs levels of bad.
"Kings and Generals" which has nothing to do with the confederacy is actually a pretty solid history channel XD I would also like to know his thoughts on "Hell on Wheels" even though it isnt a civil war show it had quite a few characters earlier on in the show that were directly linked to the war
ONLY 9999% CAN BEAT THIS LEVEL
My favorite thing about that movie is that all the tragedy comes from him _letting go_ of the Cause. He doesn't really go looking for revenge - he just wants to live his life. It's the Jayhawkers who can't let go of _THEIR_ cause because it's the only thing that could possibly justify the things they've done. All the drama in the story comes from the fact that he is hunted by evil men and he simply can't give in.
The myth of the righteous cause hits fanatics hard---because doing Right ain't Got no End.
Last of Us 2
I had a realization last time I watched this movie that Captain Tyrell, the leader of the Redlegs, most likely started out just like Josey, a humble farmer just trying to live his life until everything was taken from him only in his case by pro-slavery guerrillas. Really the only difference between him and Josey is Josey learned to let go of his hate
@@magmapixel8627 terrible game
"But Gods and Generals is from the Southern perspective"
Yeah, All Quiet on the Western Front is also from the German/losing perspective (in WW I). But it doesn't envolve the stab-in-the-back myth. (the German equivalent to the Lost Cause myth)
Crazy how sometimes people on the losing side of a war can write great stories about that war without rewriting history.
It helps when all's quiet on the western front was written by a veteran who also deeply ran into conflict with the Nazi regime
@@williampanagopoulos656 Remarque combatió muy poco en el frente. "Tormenta de acero" de Ernst Jünger es mucho más preciso y escrito por un auténtico veterano que vivió casi toda la guerra en el frente.
@@williampanagopoulos656Bro's book was BANNED by the Nazis. That's an honor equivalent to winning the Nobel Prize!
Also WW1 Germany did not enter the war to defend slavery, it had the same despicable colonial imperialist intentions as the rest of the great powers involved.
Downfall would be a better example, it helps humanize the Nazis without glorifying them
"Clint Eastwood plays the biggest badass who has ever lived"
Literally every Clint Eastwood character is the biggest badass who has ever lived.
Michael Terrell II Eh, hardly comparable
Michael Terrell II he’s a racist coddled black actor with a bad attitude and it shows
John Wayne Clint Eastwood Charlton Heston, no one can replace these tough American actors, or their tough patriotic generation now gone!
@@fbnflaviusbroadcastingnetw6786 A bunch of overly masculine, archaic Hollywood actors who've been lionized for playing the exact same carbon-copied chauvinists for decades? Did I mention they're all racists? They represent a "tough patriotic generation"? Nah, that ain't it chief.
It's all bulshit Hollywood what do you expect...
So basically an ex KKK member made a novel about the Confederacy that had less propoganda than gods and generals. That is impressive
osp80
Are you trying to disagree with facts? Many Confederates did not agree with the KKK. The KKK was made up off butt hurt racists and fanatics who wanted to “enact revenge”. They hated yanks, Jews, blacks, natives, Irishman, the whole lot.
osp80
That’s really not true. If you know anything, you would know that the vast majority of southerners were self employed farmers who didn’t own slaves. Many fought either because they were whipped up by the southern press, wanted to go off to war (war was glorified), or were simply like Lee and were fighting for their state.
osp80
That’s real nice.
@@maticstudios Most of the Southerners were manipulated by propaganda, while the Southern leadership was clearly made of pro-slavery people and slave owners. However, it's wrong to think that there wasn't something wrong in the Southern thinking and Southern culture by then. Most Southern men didn't own slaves, but most of those dreamed of doing just that. Because owning slaves was a sign of status and wealth.
Ares99999
You have to understand that the papers were less propaganda as we know it today and more just repeating the written reasons for secession and also many political cartoons.
I think the movie also touches on a thing that really gets forgotten these days. That good people (be it through circumstance and/or manipulation) can end up supporting bad causes and bad people often co-opt good causes to do evil. Doesn't mean they souldn't be called out on it and face the cosecuences of their actions of course, but It does seem to be a thing people often seem to forget.
i think even more that it teacher there are no good or bad people, just people who think the thongs they do are justified w
by the things that have been done to them, and that no matter how righteous the reason, those things can still be used for evil
As a mixed Indigenous American kid growing up in a place with no other Indigenous people (outside of my mom and siblings) and Indigenous history that I knew to be inaccurate being preached at us in school, 'The Education of Little Tree' was a required reading that meant the absolute world to me. Especially since I am a southeastern woodland Native, like Forrest said he was. Finally, someone who's experiences I saw as a mirror instead of a window facing a brick wall. And my peers had to sit in my truth for once! So learning that Forrest Carter was a fraud here, in this video, and that my teachers had me read that book in 2008- LONG after Asa Carter was exposed as who he was- is... heartbreakingly status quo. It's just another betrayal, in a sea of 600 years of betrayals. But both personal wrongs- done by my teacher and by Asa- still sting. I will always love that book for what it gave baby me, but I have nothing but rage for the social and political system that allowed it's creation.
Custard had it coming
@@rumblebird9888 there’s a great book by a deceased indigenous scholar named Vine Deloria Jr called “Custer Died For Your Sins” that echoes this sentiment. He wrote it during the civil rights era and it’s dripping with sarcastic attacks on the state of American society at the time, and it’s pretty relevant to today
I don't care about the author, the south or the myths, it's a movie, a great movie that celebrates individual freedom over corrupt men.
If forced to categorize it, I'd have to say it was more Libertarian than southern sympathetic.
Which makes it AMERICAN in the strongest sense of the word.
You're welcome, by the way. I assume you don't currently live with your people on independent native American land, and instead reap the benefits of my ancestors who sacrificed so much build your modern world. So sorry 😂
@@mr.president4672, invading them and taking their land is no great gift. I might not care when Indians bellyache about how they lost, but you are even worse. You are like a rapist expecting thanks after not killing his victim.
Go choke on your 'sacrifices' and 'benefits'.
Carter didn't even change his last name he just put on a hat? that's Clark Kent level hiding lol.
MrCoolwolf123 and it seemed to work before a TV interview
Obi Wan Kenobi? Oh you mean Old Ben Kenobi?
@@maximk9964 "No way he could be that old jedi! He is just a man named Ben hiding in thr desert!'
@@maximk9964 Dude changed just 4 letters of his name, and kept the same last name.
@GOLDSTEIN maybe he likes his family or something
To be fair, TOJW doesn’t give us the *Southern* perspective of the war. It gives us the *protagonist’s* view.
I like that
It’s how many southerners felt dipshit
Many southerners were racist and pro slavery. The protagonist is relatable because that ideology isn’t his driving motivation. Not all confederates were in Missouri so not all confederate had gone through similar atrocities that our protagonist went through
@@outrun7455 Maybe so, maybe not. The film makes no attempt to speak for all Southerners. That's the point ... dipshit.
@Thatdolphinsfan Wow. Welcome to my original point from 1 month ago. "TOJW doesn't give us the Southern perspective of the war. It gives us the protagonist's view." Congratulations, you're arguing against the very thing you just agreed with.
Haven't seen Gods and Generals, but The Outlaw Josey Wales is one of the greatest films I've ever seen in my life
Don't listen to this fraud Atun-Shei. Gods and Generals is great. Atun-Shei is a white guilt ridden idiot who acts like he single handedly won the war.
Agreed! It's an absolute classic.
"Are you gonna pull those pistols or whistle Dixie?" is such a badass line
Confederate propaganda is not badass
@@jaxsienplays9884 its not confederate propaganda but ok
@@jaxsienplays9884Gods and generals has Neo-confederate propaganda all over its face
@@suburbansocialist The video literally describes how it is but ok
@GPantazis No, it doesn't.
Josey Wales is the closest thing we can get to a Red Dead Redemption 2 movie
Except for the fact that Arthur Morgan is not a slimy confederate sympathizer.
@@gummybear8719 Well Arthur can encounter and befriend a former confederate solider in the game
@@GrandTemplarVigilant he also helps a former slave owner reclaim his property but upon finding out he’s a former slave owner throws his stuff in a fire and receives honor for killing him
@@gummybear8719 Read the comment again
@@GrandTemplarVigilant who? Hamish?
I'm 62 years old and I've seen countless movies. When the movie "The Outlaw Josie Wales" was released in the summer of 1976, I watched it at a theater in Montgomery, Alabama. There were very few empty seats by the time the picture began. When it ended, the large audience spontaneously stood and gave the film a standing ovation. I've never seen anything like that before at a motion picture theater, and I've never seen anything like it since. It truly struck a chord with Southerners.
@@teller121 you still got it good, go travel and see how other people live and remember, the billionaires got richer during this pandemic... non white people are not your enemy and not keeping you down, it’s the corporate system and how billionaires can buy elections and control the media to get you to resent your brothers and sisters who look different from you, to keep you distracted and unaware while they pick your pocket... but a lot of them look like you so you think you’re one of them. Wake up. Also, the name change doesn’t change your memories... your mementos are keepsakes and might be more interesting historically now. You’re not a victim don’t fall into that trap, it’s a hole with no way out.
@@teller121 Yale University was named for a slave trader. Brown University was named for the 4 Brown brothers who were its benefactors, and they too were slave traders. Georgetown University sold hundreds of slaves it owned to make money for that university. Many other universities benefited from slavery. But Washington and Lee must change its name while those others can keep their names? The hypocrisy is galling. No statues of Lee or Jackson allowed, but there is nothing wrong with having statues to honor Sherman, Sheridan, and Grant, all of whom prosecuted a genocidal war of extermination against the Native Americans of the Plains, murdering and starving to death 40,000 Natives Americans, most of whom were women and children, and all done to steal their lands for white people. Obviously, African American lives matter while Native American lives do not. No statues for slaveholders, but all you like for genocidal mass murderers. This is the America we live in now.
@@teller121 u wrong buddy
@Rocky Croods Omg why do every one want to take shots at white people all the time every race has in slave other people it was a common thing in history sad but true and as far as racist people go yes there is racist in every race now why when white people are pro there race they are a racist but when someone of color it is not makes know sense also I’m not white
@@teller121 so who do you think are the masters and slaves now?
The ending of Josie Wales is an astounding display of understated, stark simplicity that conveys, in just a few words, a mountain of emotion. Those few final minutes are a masterclass in film making. Clint and John Ford pretty much made all the great westerns. Josie Wales is a near masterpiece of the genre and looking at it today, it seems timeless. Hard to believe it was released in 1976. As for Gods and Generals…I am a Civil War buff but could never bring myself to watching a movie with such a presumptuous title.
Dont give short shrift to Sergio Leonne. Once Upon a Time in the West and the Good, the Bad and the Ugly are absolutely two of the best Westerns ever made.
@@thecocktailian2091The Great Silence is better then any Leone western🤷🏻♂️
@@mr.melendez3872loser
@@mr.melendez3872 ahh a man of Sergio Corbucci culture I see
@@thekotabear3262 it’s fitting that you comment this today, because just last night I rewatched Corbuccis Django and I now I may love it even more then The Great Silence
In the past few months I've been fascinated by the US civil war. Given I live on the other side of the planet, and we have our own history, I'm not surprised I never learnt about it at school. Today I fortuitously read a short story by Richard Matheson (the guy who wrote I Am Legend) called "The Conqueror", which was published in 1954. The narrator is a southerner, returning to Texas after visiting his sons' graves at Gettysburg. And that discussion of shame, of bitterness - which is only really overcome because he's an old man who sees in the northern protagonist something of his younger son - is very present. It was fascinating, not knowing anything about Matheson's politics or history, to find it being brought up without apology. There's no mention the narrator's sons might have fought for a terrible cause, no attempt to put the narrator on the right side of history. Just the themes of shame, the futility of violence, and the way that legends are sanitised. It's actually made more heartbreaking that the narrator's attempt to find redemption fails because of this - that with what he lost he could have gone to his grave without even thinking about forgiving the north, and any reader would have understood why. For a Civil War noob, completely fascinating.
The American Civil War was started by eleven southern American states who wanted to perpetuate SLAVERY. THAT is the ONLY reason for the Civil War, from the south's perspective: TO SUSTAIN SLAVERY.
.
Sherman's march to the sea did not cut nearly as deep a gash through the south as it could have, should have.
What country are you from? I remember being surprised how many nations got involved even lightly in the US Civil in one way or another. Like Australians nearly rioting when Lincoln was killed, or Russia sending its fleet to San Francisco as a sign of support towards the union against Britian and France, or even coming upon a Japanese children's book about the war.
Asa Carter's attempt at redemption makes for such a fascinating story. It doesn't really matter anymore (now that he's dead) whether his heart truly changed or not, the fact that we can discuss it is what's really interesting.
I like to think he did
I think he was not hiding from anti-KKK people.
If he had a change of heart, he was probably more scared of his violent ex-buddies in the KKK.
Hence the false identity.
@@11Survivor It's not like he would have been in much danger had he just stayed in the south and remained overtly racist, so you're probably right
@@freakymoejoe2 I know, it's just a theory.
It could have just as easily been that he was too ashamed of his past.
Literally anything with Eastwood in there is good. That is just a given.
Yep
I've adamantly defended Gran Torino over the years as being one of the most progressive and non-biased portrayal of learning common respect for your fellow man that has ever came out in my lifetime. You know who I never had to defend the film from? My Vietnamese friends and peers.
He has to be one of the most influential actor/director in cinema history.
@@christraymer3727 gran toreno gives Asian America cinema spotlight which is great
*City Heat has entered the chat*
"...generationel humiliation is a powerful and dangerous thing."
Yeah man as a german I can releat to that.
You are not responsible for the actions of your fellow Germans in the past
@Time Well Spent I don't feel responsible.
My country was humiliated after WW1, and it led to even more death and horror.
If the treaty of versailles wouldn't have been that brutal and unfair, we could have avoided Hitler and WW2 and all the horrible shit after that.
@@jop8019 I agree, cool German guy👍
hey at least we got the movie "das boot" out of it@@jop8019
@@jop8019 I fully agree on that,
The Versailles treaty is what caused so much resentment and outrage
I bought a copy of the DVD version of The Outlaw Josey Wales and in the extra content the producer said that the book had sold very few copies prior to the movie, less than 100. A friend recommended it and he said when he read it he thought it would be a perfect movie for Clint Eastwood. Westerns were on the way out but Clint loved the story and fought for it. It is my favorite Clint Eastwood movie by far and one of my top-five favorite westerns. That scene where he tells the bounty hunter: "Dyin ain't much of a livin boy" goes down as one the greatest "yeah I'm a badass" moments in cinematic history, right up there with Robert De Niro giving Morrie the death stare in Goodfellas while "Sunshine of your Love" plays in the background."
Clint insisted on using Native Americans to play Native Americans, something not as common as common sense would dictate and the actors he chose all took pride in the fact it was the first time Native Americans were treated respectfully in a western. That was by design. The back and forth between Clint and Chief Dan George is a great example. The Chief has some of the best lines in the film and he is the perfect sidekick for Josey. My personal favorite is when Josey tells him people he likes don't stick around long. His retort, "I notice when you get to disliking someone, they aren't around long neither," is pure gold. That and the bit about how he wouldn't surrender to the Union but they made his horse surrender: "I bet they've got him pulling a cart up in Kansas." So many individual moments. And his final showdown with Captain Red Legs is pure Clint.
Thanks for the review. Such a great film, one worthy of a Missouri boat ride. 👍👍
I've always thought one of Clint's greatest skills is to use almost No dialogue to say SO much in his movies.
It’s the mark of truly great storytelling. Just look at that montage at the beginning of “UP”
@@509Gman Oh my god. Right!? That is by FAR some of the greatest story telling I have ever seen in an animated film. Gets me every time.
Clint Eastwood does not write the script of the movies he acts in or directs. As an actor, he speaks the lines he has memorized from a script written by a screenplay writer and makes the gestures and expressions demanded of him by the movie's director. As a director, his skills at storytelling through acting can be seen in the performances of the actors he is directing.
are we related
My favorite Clint Eastwood scene was from the opening of Firefox, where his character has a PTSD episode after hearing a helicopter.
So "The Outlaw Josey Wales" was essentially more of a memoir than "The Education of Little Tree"
In the opinion of the guy who posted this video. All one has to do to change things, is find a few similarities with something bad.
@@muppet7665 Thank you. If they would play is straight instead of opining? Then this would have been a pretty good video. It's just like the guy by the name of Tompkin as in Tonkin Gulf Club-ranting about John Wayne, when he didn't know "Diddley Squat" (Hat tip to the store granny in Josey Wales) and what really irritated me, was that he was passing himself off as a Vet. Sorry about straying from topic. Have a good evening ;-00
@@carlevans5760 What on gods Green earth are you blabbering about?
I grew up with the Josey Wales movie. We watched it over and over. My brother and I still quote it randomly to this day with lines like, "You drink it."
This has made me think: “why hasn’t Atun-Shei ever done a video on Glory or what the best Union movie is?”
I’ve always wondered what the best one really is, and for me it’s Glory
Mine's Gettysburg
Glory is the best for the union and field of lost shoes for the confederacy
The best part of Glory was the end. Kaboom!
@David Rutledge what're you trying to imply here 🤨
*Red Badge of Courage.*
"You gonna pull those pistols or whistle Dixie?"
Dyin' ain't much of a livin' boy
This line is amazing 😂
Your Asa Carter reveal was a huge plot twist, you seriously blew my mind. I am going to watch the Outlaw Josey Wales again. Thanks.
I'm NEVER watching it again! NEVER!
@@michaelodonnell824 Why?
@@michaelodonnell824 I think it's understandable
100%
Doesn't even look like the same guy
My dad would have loved this video if he were still alive. He raised me on Clint Eastwood movies, and Clint was such a huge part of my life that my Gaming, CZcams (Gaming CZcams, not this one), and Twitch Identity is Clint2018. The man is a legend, and I will be devastated when he finally passes away. I definitely have to thank my dad for raising me with such legendary films and such a legendary actor. Also, even the last part of it that talks about Asa Carter being the author of the book my dad would have found interesting because he was such a huge history buff.
Asa Carter never atoned for his sins, but if The Rebel Outlaw: Josey Wales/Gone to Texas is anything to go on I think it's safe to say that he might have been remorseful for his past life even though he never faced it. It probably explains why he died at 53 that sort of shame and the stress of running and hiding from it would probably eat away at you.
Remorseful or not, he was a monster
@@JamesSmith-ny2gb
Maybe it’s the Christian-upbringing in me, but I think almost anyone is capable of redemption; one can never undo the evils they’ve done, but they can at least attempt to put good back into the world. However, Carter never truly earned redemption-he merely made the first step in that process by his apparent change of heart…
It’s like that of line Stannis Baratheon, “A good act does not wipe away the bad. Nor the bad the good.”
@@warlordofbritannia I don’t, wether he changed or not, his past doesn’t go away, or the experiences of the people he hurt.
If he saw wrong in himself afterwards good, but it doesn’t excuse you from punishment
@@JamesSmith-ny2gb
Oh, I wouldn’t disagree with that - no good deed ought to go unpunished, and vice versa
@@warlordofbritannia And how would you have punished him?
There are movies that reflect the culture of the times they were made in. "The Outlaw Josie Wales" was made in the bitter aftermath of the Vietnam War. That sentiment is found, not just throughout the movie, but especially in the last line, where Josie says; "We all died a little in that damn war." Powerful.
True and very well said. Thank you.
' tell him ...
Tell him the Wars over "
The damndest thing about the War in Vietnam is that to my understanding Vietnam under communism is doing just fine, unlike pretty much every other communist state, which has has a struggling economy, or has been forced to adopt a sort of "state-capitalism" system like China. Not only did Vietnam going red not cause a domino effect throughout all of Asia, but Vietnam was better off with peace and communism than with War. Which is why the communists won in Vietnam in my reckoning. Ho Chi Minh was Vietnamese, he was Popular, he fought the Japanese in WWII. The Americans in South Vietnam staged a coup to make an incredibly unpopular and apparently incompetent man the President of South Vietnam, and most people saw South Vietnamese government and U.S. involvement as an extension of French Colonialism. Most Vietnamese just wanted the fighting to end so they could go back to their farms.
Vietnamese: more than most. Cambodians, Laotians: not so good also.
The guy who made this video-seems to have forgot about that.
I just watched Josey Wales. And I was blown away. I think anyone can love that movie. It’s really intense but also very funny
I watched Josey Wales for the first time with my father when I was about 12 in a hotel room shortly after a house fire and it totally changed my life in regards to my love of film, still rocks my world.
"Reckon so.....I guess we all died a little in that damn war".
Had this on my office wall during W's excursion into Iraq. Still carry it in my heart.
@@jafo766 Brother I'm in the Corps so if you're saying you fought I respect it but people are confused because what you typed is hard to follow, especially for a glue eating devil like me, and it just sounds like you're trying to insult veterans of wars after Vietnam.
@@jafo766 Nobody can understand anything you're saying.
@@jafo766 if you are trying to use military jargon you missed it by a mile.
@@LonelyKnightess - He's saying he was a kid in Buffalo during Vietnam and was too young to know anything about it except what he saw on TV. The rest is just the drugs talking.
I was about to watch the cinematic masterpiece “Space Cop” when I got this notification.
I hope you’re satisfied with the sacrifices I made.
Space Cop is the best movie told from a southern perspective. It effortlessly shows the complex nature of law and order in the Reconstruction era. Not to mention Jay Baumann’s impressive cinematography and the incredible acting of Ellen co-host Rich Evans as the titular character. It gives Citizen Kane a run for it’s money
Personally I thought the portrayal of Abraham Lincoln as a brain in a jar was completely insulting to his memory. Blatant Lost Cause propaganda. Mike Stoklasa is worse than Hitler.
Did you catch the Behind-the-Scenes of 'Space Cop' they posted today too? Legit, just finished it a little while ago while eating lunch.
Dan Terle
Yeah, same here. That’s when this video popped up.
@@TheDansonT Just finished watching it and loved it. It was better than the movie itself.
"don't piss down my back and tell me it's rainin' " is my new favourite quote.
Eastwood is a treasure, especially his later filmography and films that are not his typical westerns... Kelly's Heroes is also among his best, and shows a more grounded view of WWII from the perspective of people that could as well have been fighting it.
Kelly's Heroes is a hippy-comedy and should never be considered any sort of historical reference.
@@Heathcoatman Well We're all nuts or we wouldn't be here...
@@Carbon8edmilk I love that movie, still cracks me up. It's a slapstick comedy.
@@Heathcoatmanyou gotta cut it out with them negative waves, man!
I still remember when my Dad brought the VHS home and told me "Son, you gotta to see this, this is the best Western movie ever done." It is true even today, it has not been equaled. The combination of drama, comedie and action....Leone's western are more "artistic", it is like Lord of the ring, a fantas. Josey Wales is gritty, real and a masterpiece.
Keep historical accuracy to books. Movies is for enjoyment.
And in the end also Confederate propaganda.
@@jjt1881 I suppose "Little Big Man" is Native American propaganda as well.
I think Unforgiven is the best western
It's not your typical Western, but Jeremiah Johnson tops my list.
TLDW:
Josey Wales is a badass
People are complex
And an Ex KKK member can still write a less propogandistic story than Gods and Generals
"an Ex KKK member can still write a less propogandistic story than Gods and Generals" should be a line on a Josey Wales blue ray cover. Or even a Gods and Generals cover, why not?.
@@Targisvear that would be perfect
Nah, the book is deeply propagandistic.
It is just that Clint Eastwood is a good filmmaker
What about a ex confederate outlaw and a former Black Unionist outlaw? Both running from their past and reuniting to fight a common enemy.
@uncletigger Maybe they let the war be in the past while they tried to create a future for themselves. Mutual respect for once enemies turn friends even thou they fought against each others interest. Johnny Reb fighting on the side of the pro slavery south and the Black Union soldier fighting to keep the south in the Union and for the ending of slavery. Anyhow they both learn to understand each other and the guilt of the war especially from the former Reb comes back to haunt them. Matter of fact the only common enemy is themselves and the leaders who put them in the center of the bloodshed. Love and respect conquers all among former enemies.
Do you think Carter heard about the terrible torture those 6 men did and suddenly realized the true consequences of his rhetoric and was so horrified by it that he changed?? I actually find that believable, at least in part.
What's somehow even more disturbing... George Wallace pardoned the people who did it, except for the two who testified against the other four.
These sets are absolutely incredible! It's insane how far Atun-Shei has come!
The genius of setting such a story in Kansas or Missouri is that you could make a story where either Unionists or Southerners are the heroes or the villains. Because BOTH sides did many terrible things there. Josey Wales could have easily been a northern guy who's family was butchered by Confederate guerrillas and the story could have still worked.
It would work during the war, but not after. If Josey had been a Unionist guerilla he wouldn't have had any reason to be on the run after the war.
I almost want to make a movie about that and never actually reveal which side is which. Just make a movie about the horrors of war and watch the audience fight it out over which side was the evil band of looters and which side was the poor hapless farm folk who just wanted to live their lives. Make a statement about preconceptions or something.
Bruce Tucker
Except the fact that he would be declared an outlaw... oop.
@@maticstudios For being on the winning side? It generally doesn't work like that.
Bruce Tucker
It does when your state has the ability to declare outlaws aside from the Feds, and separate counties can too, It doesn’t have to come from the top, as it usually didn’t. It was assumed that each states and its assorted counties would deal with it themselves and that the Federal government would have to stick their hand in it. This is also a time where if you pissed someone off, you would either get shot, or they would beat you to a pulp, and if you were ther instigator or were antagonistic, then most people would just shrug and say: “he had it coming”. So law at this time was very much kept by people just not pissing each other off, because almost everyone is armed, and nobody wants to get shot, hence nobody steps out of line (unless for whatever reason history grants them the absurd amount of luck, such as that of the 2nd Pacific Squadron)
If I were a more poetic man, I'd say that Asa Carter's story could be a symbolic story of his own: fighting the battles of discrimination and prejudice within himself, and showing it in literal sense within his book. I hope he found his redemption, even if he will always be remembered for that vile quote.
I think given how little effort he put into hiding you may be giving him too much credit
I get the feeling that Carter thought he'd found redemption, as much as I can tell from this super limited information I have on him. But by that same information...I don't think he did enough to make up for the harm he perpetrated and enabled.
@@cannibalbunnygirl To be fair, I don't think he considered it low effort. He kept using "Carter," but that's a common surname. He lost weight, adopted a charming and inclusive public persona, and pretended his sons weren't actually his sons. One writer (Allen Barra) met Forrest and wrote, "As a student in Birmingham I had watched him on TV when he ran for governor, but I wouldn't have recognized him as Asa if he had been pointed out to me." If it hadn't been for his former associates and critics in Alabama tuning in to Barbara Walters' interview, he'd possibly have lived the remainder of his life without scrutiny.
At the same time, Barra's article ("The education of Little Fraud," which can be freely read online) points out that Carter was still in favor of the Confederacy and that his books' politics didn't represent a 100% conversion from his days as Asa.
@@IsmailofeRegime Sometimes a throwaway comment made in jest doesn't require a wordy answer.
@@cannibalbunnygirl Maybe, but your comment has a bunch of upvotes and there are other commenters on this video expressing surprise that a guy living before the Internet and who was only known in one state didn't "put in more effort" to become a novelist under a different identity. So I chose your comment to reply to.
It’s more of a Native American time piece then a southern civil war movie but the Chickasaw rancher does a real good job at displaying how the natives often sided with the confederacy voluntarily since the union broke every treaty they made with the natives and treated them like shit and scum of the earth throughout the movie.
Excellent video, never knew Josey Wales book had such a crazy rabbit hole
Watching gods and generals is like taking someone on a 4 mile hike just to show them a dog turd
XD that is a beautiful analogy, and I haven’t even seen the movie
I love going hiking, but i won’t look at a dog turd at the end of the road.
@@matthewchapman6305 well in other words it’s a buildup of disappointment
Yea it doesn’t fit the Narrative of what they try to brainwash people with this day and time anything base on facts or taboo in this day and age regardless of what history says.
@@jimmyanderson2988 yeehaw brother
The term you use, "generational humiliation" reminds me of the wave of resentment that adolf hitler rode to power.
Good job on your research!
Hitler did not "ride a wave of resentment to power". He and his thugs intimidated and beat and yelled and lied their way into power. And utilized the economic despair that existed.
@@ClearOutSamskaras He most certainly did ride a wave of resentment to power. The onerous Treaty of Versailles after WWI, primarily put in place by the French, over the objection of the US and other nations, made the German people paupers for many years. They could barely afford to pay for food. They resented the unfair Treaty and were ready for a leader to take them out of their poverty.
@@thomassnapp1341 He most certainly did only AFTER his band of thugs had intimidated the everloving piss out of pre war germans. Please do not confuse hitlers terror and abuse of german citizens for them supporting the nazi movement. As a german myself i find your point disgusting. German citizens were indoctrinated by propaganda and constant censorship.
@@saintofall8527 So are you saying that the effects of the Treaty of Versailles on the German people had nothing to do with the rise to power of the Nazi "movement?" Perhaps you, yourself, have been "indoctrinated" to some extent.
@@thomassnapp1341 my grandparents lived through the german depression that was harsher than any other the world has known. My family denounced his racism and actively resisted hitler and the s.s. hitler piggy backed off of the depression to rise to power which is true but his intimidation tactics were the main factor. You are a nazi sympathizer. People like you need to educate yourselves.
The revelation about Forrest Carter/Asa Carter is wild! Thanks for the informative and fun video.
Since I first saw it as a teenager The Outlaw Josie Wales has always been one of my favorite movies yet I never knew about its background, but it is just such a great story.
I also have studied the civil war since I was about 9 years old and always found the lost cause abhorrent in every respect. I am now 60 and have now just discovered that I have much more reflection in my future. I have been shaken by your video.
I wonder if any film story has been done like this with a German soldier after World War II. Think about it: he's fought on the wrong side, has had Hitler as his leader, HATED by much of Europe and the West for who he is, how does he deal with his past? I've seen a few German perspective films, but many come across as awkward or leave these crucial questions unanswered. A film like I described could be a masterpiece if done well.
This video is a great explanation of what separating an artist from their art actually means. Appreciating a piece of film for it’s message while simultaneously understanding the flaws of the man who created it.
What does it mean?
@@pedrochanganaqui1623 appreciating a piece of art for it’s message while simultaneously understanding and accepting the flaws of who created it
@@monkeychife it works here but for other case, it maybe not
@@jurtra9090 It does not work. This movie is a wet dream of racists and completly neglects the fact that the prime reason for the war was about slavery. The euphemistic "Southern way of life" is nothing else but a paraphrase of slave holding.
@@Peter-vf3dl but Josey Wales wasn't a slaveowner and he didn't even show some of that typical racism that Confederate had
"There is iron in your words of death for all commanche to see, and so there is iron in your words of life." One of my favourite movie scenes of all time, when racial adversaries Josey Wales and Ten Bears find common ground, was written by a racist member of the Klan. Fascinating. Thanks for sharing.
LoL, damn I love that line! Best dialogue EVER!
it's possible he had changed his views. Granted he never took responsibility for his actions, but that doesn't proclude change of character
@@freakymoejoe2 ditto that
The world has moved on and most people have forgotten Asa Carter.
But I remember the movie "The Outlaw Josey Wales," based on a book by Forrest Carter.
Btw, my favourite side character was that old Native American, one of the 'civilized tribes'
who couldn't sneak up on Josey because...
he was civilized.
@@freakymoejoe2 yeah I head he was an EX KKK member.
In short, Clint Eastwood makes movies that he wants to watch and would be happy to rewatch. He wants his movies to be entertaining to a mass audience. He succeeded in this with most of his movies. As for the novel it is based on I had no idea it had such an interesting backstory involving one Asa Carter.
Honestly, I totally forgot that Wales was a soldier as I was watching it. I just saw a man trying to get away from all the BS and pain. As you said, he was a good man no matter the colors of the uniform he may have worn and it was more about why he did a thing than the thing he did, IMO.
Now, I have to watch it. ✌️✊💛
I really did love that movie, and I never found myself rooting for the confederacy. It was the story of a man, mistreated and abused, his friends gunned down in front of him. Getting his revenge, and on this journey finding a better life with a diverse group. It was just so good
It shows that war is grey. There's good people on both sides at the individual level.
Maybe it's not that difficult to understand. Asa Carter was defeated thrice: as a Confederate nostalgic, as a supremacist anti-civil rights agitator, and as a candidate to governor. Then he changed his name to Forrest Carter and found a new life, and his novels were his way to imagine himself as the hero of his own imagined past. That's why they resonate so strongly: because many of us can recognize defeat and yet yearn for a good finale to our own story. Josey Wales fits a fantasy (a myth, of course) of a middle-age man that had been defeated many times but liked to imagine himself as the hero.
@George Pickett Great. Now, if you answer my message instead trying a strawman argument maybe we can discuss meaningfully. Otherwise, we have nothing to debate
So, I'm going to mildly disagree with you here, in that I could read Carter as a coward who did have changed views, but was so ashamed of his past he didn't want to address it. And through his works, Carter could say the things he wished he could say publicly, but due to the aforementioned cowardice, couldn't bring himself to say. At least that's how I see it. Carter is dead and gone and we will never know his true self.
@@LtBob38 Very good, and plausible, observations.
@George Pickett you could argue that battle flag in your pfp is not racist because its a battle flag (of which in that regard i agree), this does not change the fact that even neo-confederates use it as confederate symbols and is racist in that regard.
@GamerKat'71 When the second Klan came to be, in the 1915-25 marches,the only flags l've seen in old film footage are The Stars and Stripes!
I'd kinda wanna see a movie based on the guerilla war in Missouri. We always think of the Grey vs Blue armies fighting big battles for their causes. But the guerilla war was brutal, harsh and saw some of the worst war crimes of the whole war. It'd be hard to do since the morality would be dark grey on all sides but it's a part of the war that never gets any attention.
This is one of my favorite CZcams videos of all time, the way you tell this story is just incredible
Germany after WWI is eerily similar to the South after the CW in regards to generational hate, humiliation, and bitterness. It is why wars sometimes don’t end when the shooting stops.
Well put.
Well it goes full circle, a lot of wars begin with similar or oposing/mirror reasons.
Germany wishes they were treated as well as the South. Ultimately the South got most of what wanted for the next 100 years. The South suffered generational hate because they allowed the myth of the Lost Cause to mislead them and poison their souls. The CSA was never popular in its own time and never had majority support. And it is notable that the grievance only truly took off after the actual Civil War generation had mostly died off because they knew the truth of what happened.
Ironically, Hitler's Nazis tried very hard to promote Nazism in the American South in the 1930s and early 40s (as they believed the internal strife and bitterness would make it ripe for spreading it). It failed however, because there was lingering anti-German sentiment (from WWI) and the southerners were generally of Anglo descent. Also, the antisemitism of the Third Reich was apparently considered very controversial, even in those states.
Germany overall atoned and turned from Nazism. There are still parts of the South that embrace the Klan and segregation only because they know they can't get slavery back.
I grew up watching Clint Eastwood, love the spaghetti westerns,
I even ran around with my cap pistol playing the man with no name.
My 2 favorites were, Pale Rider, and Unforgiven.
" you just shot an unarmed man "
" well, he should have armed himself before he decided to decorate the front his saloon with my friend "
Haha, classic Clint.
I just came across this video, and , wow, this is a great summary and notion of both the movie (which is one of my favorites of all times) and the outcome of the war itself and its consequences in the south. Great video!!!
I had 2 ancestors who lived in the same county in SW Missouri in 1860: one came from IN, the other from TN. Both were lower middle class farmers. One fought for the CSA, the other for the USA and fought against each other and several major battles in the Trans-Mississippi Theater. I would love the see a movie that showed a similar tale of two neighbors fighting on opposite sides in this theater of the war.
I would also love to interview them to ask their reasoning for what side they fought for. I have nothing from my Confederate ancestor, but from a genealogy book there is a story where the unionist was asked by a grandchild why he wore the blue. His response was "they asked me to join first!".
Keep up the great videos. I really enjoy them. Would also love to hear from the perspective of Southerners who fought for the Union.
I guess you'll have to be the one to write that story.
I have an ancestor who was born in North Carolina. Moved to Indiana at the age of 18. 20 years later when the Civil War broke out with back to fight for North Carolina. After the war was over, he came back to Indiana. We have his journal. He did not own slaves, couldn't care one way or the other about slavery. He went and fought for the Confederacy because he considered himself and North Carolinian despite having lived longer in Indiana and he did in North Carolina. He wrote in his journal, "they have attacked my state, and I am Duty bound to defend her" . You have to remember that during that time the state you were born in was more important than the nation to most people. No I am by no means saying that this was true for everyone, but I think this was the same situation for more who fought in the Civil War on one side or the other than people like to think. It came down to where their state stood. Generals Lee and Longstreet both join the Confederacy under similar circumstances. The Southern States seceded over slavery. There is no question about that, they all said it in their Articles of succession. But that was an economical and political issue that did not affect the average person living in the south. History is a far more complex issue than people give it credit for, and the tendency to take a one-size-fits-all blanket approach to history does it a major de service.
There is an old tv series similar to that called North and South (1985)
about two friends, one southern and one northern trying to maintain friendship as the civil war escalates
A non American one is Michael Collins.
@@Muddfoot01 yes, much of the fighting was for 'southern pride' and 'protecting the home front' but it does the discussion a disservice to pretend that slavery wasn't, undoubtedly, the number 1 cause. Owning a single slave in the early 1860s meant you nearly didn't have to work a day in your life. No more manual labor of any kind- think about that in the context of the mostly rural south.
The economy was, is, and always will be the most important aspect of society. The amount of wealth someone has controls most behavior right down to biology. The hierarchical pyramid of human needs is based on the need for essentials such as food, water, and shelter; which are all dependant on the state of the economy. Slavery was an integral part of many economies, world-wide, for thousands of years.
As for politics, it has almost no shortage of relevance to the common man. It dictates almost very facet of almost everyone's lives.
Nibbling on a stale pop-tart in the bathroom of a gas station. Even your insults tell a story. My hat's off to you sir
I thought a better analogy would be that watching "The Outlaw Josey Wales" is eating at a small roadside diner which offers a surprisingly good quality and delicious meal.
"Gods and Generals" is like going to a posh restaurant with a Maitre d' leading the guests to their tables.
Everyone is bowing and very formally polite. But the atmoshpere is just not that good.
And the food is an utter disappointment.
@@AudieHolland
So, Gods and Generals is like going to a Trump restaurant?
@@eldorados_lost_searcher I would compare the Gods and Generals viewing experience to your boss knocking on your door and handing you what is supposed to be your Christmas bonus. You open the envelope to discover a membership to the jelly of the month club while your boss tells racist anecdotes and takes a dump on your kitchen floor.
@@seanmulcahy2897
I agree with everything except the racist jokes, since the movie only has one racial slur. More like making "observations" that get right up to the edge of propriety.
Wow, this video turned out a million times better than I first anticipated. Really cool man
I saw Gods and Generals in the theater, fell asleep, it was still going when I woke up, so I walked out. It’s the only movie I ever walked out of.
Josey Wales has Dean Wormer in it, so it’s automatically awesome.
My favorite Civil War era movie is the Good the Bad and the Ugly, when Blondie and Tuco get stuck in the rebel POW camp. Angel eyes is cruel as the northern lieutenant and the scene with the southern soldiers singing and crying during the beating is very heartfelt.
Also the scene with the canon fire and the two butts sticking up into the air is hilarious!
thats jsut a great movie full stop
italian proud
I've always wondered if there's some kind of Southern US - Southern Italy symbolism because the Union soldiers are portrayed far less sympathetically than the CSA soldiers, but it could just be coincidence.
@@pleasant_asymmetry Are you kidding? Angel Eyes is just pretending to be a Union officer. His commanding officer informs him he has found out about his stealing of prisoners and intends to court martial him. But he is unable because he is dying from gangrene.
The Union Captain at the bridge scene is very sympathetic. Most of the Union troops shown are just suffering.
Do not mistake Union soldiers for Angel Eyes' gang because they happen to wear Union uniforms.
I cannot recall much scenes showing sympathy for the Confederate soldiers other than pity, as the POWs in the camp and the dying Confederate soldier near bridge and the cemeterary. Ever think why his comrades left him behind? To die all alone?
Of course, that is why 'The Good,' Blondie has that alias. Amid all the death, violence and cruelty, he takes time to show humanity towards characters who are strangers to him and he doesn't owe them anything. The Union Captain at the bridge battle was also a dying man, remember?
The most realistic, plausible point of view comes from 'The Ugly,' Tuco, I think. He just wants to get his gold and get out of here, too bad all these idiots are in the way trying to kill each other.
At the start of the movie Tuco was an rather unlikeable character but he matures throughout the movie.
@@AudieHolland I was mainly thinking of the Union sergeant but I never realized he was from Angel Eye's gang
As a Swede I watched it for what it was to me - a Clint Eastwood movie avenging his family. As a person interested in History, and politics, I think I need to re-watch it with a different eye in mind.
Thanks for the history and the quarantine suggestion.
Ah the Swede, arent you Norwegian?
But keep an open mind BECAUSE, this piece above is another person's OPENION.
I don't know about the field of politics, but, if you are interested in history, movies are about the last place in the world you ought to go to further your knowledge of it. Other than documentaries that consist of film recordings of actual events, filmed as they happened, you are going to find a lot more fiction than fact in motion pictures. Even the documentaries are often presented from a point of view that fails to give an accurate recounting of the surrounding events. And some of them were nothing more than propaganda films designed to bolster support of a war in the "home front."
Adding to what Warren said, movies are also the last thing you should look at for politics. I can’t find a movie or show with politics that has presented it well. They are either super biased, or just super random, like in Lucifer, a show about the devil helping humans punish crime, they randomly, out of no where, just put a part about a black kid getting stopped for no reason, then you never hear about it again. I’ve watched the show twice, with my cousin, and we can’t find when they talk about it again
there is no history behind this film pure fiction.
I came to this video cautiously optimistic, attempting to inform my perspective and this was a very well articulated and thoughtful video. Thank you for this, I found your conclusion at the end especially impressive.
The only issue I have with this is that Eastwood simply takes the same character and puts it in different times / setting. The iconoclastic bad ass wondering how many bullets he has left.
Yeah. It's fun to watch, but I can see how it would get boring
Well I don't give a shit as long it's fun
I’d argue it still works because that character archetype works so well in so many situations
Show don’t tell a rule of filmmaking that has almost been lost in more modern films
*insert Michael Bay explosions montages*
Filmmakers today look at how George Lucas hinted at a wider universe with untold stories in _Star Wars,_ learned the wrong lesson and take it to the extreme of "We'll just _tell_ you what happened in the background and you can use your imagination to fill in how that looked!"
@@BogeyTheBear I agree
I take it he also didn't like Gettysburg, given Gods and Generals is a prequel.
@@Mathadar probably
Moonlight, the Native girl in the movie is played by Geraldine Keams and she speaks Navajo in a lot of her scenes.
Just something I thought was interesting.
@The Asylum Studios Official Woah are you actually the official Asylum Studios account? I love your stuff!
Also, the older indigenous man is played by Dan George, chief of the Tsleil-Waututh Nation, activist, poet, and all-around HUGE deal in Canada.
Dan George should have won the Oscar for his role in this movie.
wow - I love this film too, and this was quite a revelation. Incredible video.
Was real worried you weren't going to cover who "Forrest" Carter really was for a minute there. Glad I waited until the end of the video to post a comment.
I was waiting excited for the reveal when he went back to Carter being a hippie half-Indian and wondering what he would know of confederates. "Oh, here it comes!"
Glad you're one of the few people smart enough to watch a video in its entirety before commenting
Honestly I was surprised. I never knew.
Damn, Asa Carter was literally the lonely outlaw running from his past.
Considering that both the Klan and the FBI would want him dead, yes, I'd say so.
@@theknave1915 why fbi?
@@htoodoh5770 if Asa carter was involved in domestic terrorism. The fbi would have a warrant out on him. They would not have been kind.
A romantic description of a man with nasty views.
@@htoodoh5770 This man ordered several acts of violence against the black community, including castrating that judge.
I was gonna mention Cold Mountain, but that book/movie is very lenient when it comes to historical accuracy to elevate the drama of the events.
I love the plot twist from this video. Holds up really well on rewatch
Dude, I know this channel is going to blow up. As an English Atlantic history student, I'm learning so much about the American Civil War that I haven't already. Keep up the good work!
@Doug Bevins hey pal I agree fuck any neo Confederate but that's not what this guy was saying, just that this channel is very informative, which I'd agree with.
Anyway, long live the Union!
Doug Bevins am I allowed to learn from CZcams comments? Otherwise, I’ll have to feel good about skimming right over your comment, which itself represented a total misunderstanding of the comment to which you have here replied.
@@stanleyrogouski IIRC, Grant was a white supremacist until he saw the bravery shown by blacks in the civil war, then he gained a new respect for them and fought for civil rights while president (pushed the 15th amendment and dismantled the KKK)
Not denying Lincoln, Sherman or Wilson, just talking about what I know about Grant
@@stanleyrogouski That's right, I forgot about the antisemetic order. I think its safe to say though that there were flaws for nearly everyone from history, but we should weigh the good and bad things they've done to come to a conclusion on them. And no matter how great they were, we should never worship historical figures as they were only humans and have their flaws, such as racism.
And as for Grant's indian policies, I believe he tried to make peace with them but, unfortunately, something happened that led to Little Bighorn. I've heard he lied to them but also that he was against Little Bighorn, so I couldn't tell you tbh
@Stanley Rogouski I don't really think that's what he meant, maybe he was just introducing his relationship with America since that's where most of his accomplishments went towards. I don't believe he was real nationalistic or resentful towards other countries since he went on a diplomatic tour in 1878 to the UK, Germany, Japan, etc. But idk for sure though
The outlaw Josey Wales is one of my favorite movies of all times. Eastwood at his best.
He even had a name in that movie
I liked gone with the wind, watching it with my grandma I can see how much it means to her as she told me ‘a whole civilization gone with the wind’ makes me proud to be a southern boy
That is by far the most interesting take I have ever heard. Fascinating, disgusting, and thought provoking. Beautifully put.
I want to publicly denounce this man, Asa Carter, he does not represent Asa’s everywhere.
@AlphaChocolateTruffle Why thank you my good man.
More Asa Akira’s less asa carters
Call him Ass Carter
@@justinrolfe9134 I like your point of view my good man, why I might just look into this Asa Akira. For research purposes of course.
Like AlphaChocolateTruffle my name is not Asa, but I as well shall join your cause, if you can prove to use a lasso proficiently and wrangle a temperamental Mustang (the horse not the car).
It's crazy how volatile Missouri was during the Civil War. Where I grew up (Ava, MO) in southeast Missouri and there was a pro-Union sentiment down there to the point that Ava was called Militia Springs until the 20th century. This was mainly due to the Union military camp that was set up there. We've found Union buttons and unfired Miniballs and musket balls in the fields behind the Wal-Mart supercenter.
There were lots of small group guerrilla type actions all over Missouri during the civil war. I live in NE Missouri and am familiar with both the "Palmyra Massacre" and the "Battle of Monroe Station" (now Monroe City). Marion county has two separate courthouses, which is very rare for counties of this size. One of these has a confederate statue outside of it. This is less than 100 miles from Iowa...
Yeah Missouri is weird during the civil war. Just look at the camp Jackson affair happening just 5 days (and over a century) from now. It's just the perfect mix of America, Midwest and Southern with the progressive cities of St. Louis and Kansas City.
mocivilwarblog.com/2019/03/06/the-farewell-letter-of-a-victim-of-the-palmyra-massacre/?fbclid=IwAR1Hu2dH0yBtFwHytmhxuokI3_53By2CVJHhAtdkjdZENVwZkkZdcTkNcE4
Frank James was born in Nevada, Mo. There was back and forth fighting between pro North and pro South militias, finally pro North milita burned the town to the ground, save for 2 structures, after giving women and children 15 minutes to get out.
I have found tons of artifacts near Verona.
The Outlaw Josey Wales is the best western ever made, and one of the best films ever made.
Well made, good sir. JW is in my top 5 of fav westerns.
“Watching ‘Gods and Generals’ is like nibbling on a stale pop tart in a gas station restroom.” I haven’t enjoyed a comment like that for some time.
Wales is indeed a masterpiece.
Gods and gens was a poor follow up to Gettysburg, a great movie! I don't know what they were thinking other than character exploration.
@@rcstl8815
I liked God's and Generals, but it was only good for one watch. Gettysburg can be seen many times for how much quality is involved.
@@rcstl8815 The only good part of Gettysburg was Sam Eliot playing the Southern loyalist . The rest was just a bunch of fat old men running around backwoods Pennsylvania.
I have rewatched both Gettysburg and God's and Generals many times. As an amateur historian, it was like seeing history come alive. Its fine if you don't enjoy it. If you would rather see another film that handles the Civil War film, the movie "Glory!" Comes to mind.
It’s easy to forger how much Kansas suffered during the War. “Bleeding Kansas” could never be more true.
Correct me if I am wrong but bleeding Kansas happened before the war and it was pretty much over by 1861
@@james-97209 I think you’re right,.
Δημητρης Στεφανιδης As far as I know, Bleeding Kansas happened before the war, but during the war those blood feuds started up again.
@@ThejollyFrenchman All I can confirm is that there was a lot of death in Kansas during those years.
Lawrence, Kansas would like to disagree with you. There was a lot of raiding back and forth in both states during the war, but more in Missouri.
Brilliant analysis contrasting "Josey Wales" with the pompous and boring "Gods and Generals".
This channel is a gem
Post civil war , John Wayne portrayed a southerner in the movie "The Searchers"
You could also see the southern perspective in John Wayne's the undefeated
One of the greatest westerns of all time
The Searchers was his best film.
@@MaynardCrow it was also one of the best westerns of all time
Like Eastwood's "Josey Wales," Wayne also played a fictional Missouri Bushwacker: "True Grit's:" "Rooster Cogburn." Cogburn lost his eye fighting as a Confederate guerilla. Both the novel and its two film versions state he rode under both Quantrill and Bloody Bill Anderson (just like Josey).
Honestly what I want is a Downfall type movie but for the confederacy, maybe with Jeff Davis, maybe even with someone like Nathan Bedford Forrest, a slow burn type narrative, that actually displays the brutality of the Civil War, something like the opening scene to Lincoln.
GunslingerXXI
Forrest, Grant and Lee? Are those the three you consider bona fide military geniuses? Because if I had to pick three those are the ones I’d probably pick.
@GunslingerXXI
Or you could just swap out Sherman for Lincoln if you want to have an actual military officer.
Sherman essentially invented modern American warfare with the Atlanta campaign and later, his epic march to the sea. He avoided battles of attrition whenever possible, and would maneuver around strong Confederate defensive positions when given any alternative.
BTW. While Grant may have lost more men overall then Lee, those losses were offset by the larger
size of the AotP vs the ANV. Lee lost a far higher percentage of his forces over the course of the war
then Grant did and most of the time Lee was on the strategic defensive while suffering those losses.
@GunslingerXXI Your take on Grant is fair enough if you only look at the Overland campaign, but I don't think you give him enough credit for the Western theater.
Nathan forest was an extremely interesting general, and fully understood the deployment of cavalry, probably would have done well even over in Europe as a cavalry officer.
@@ViktoriousDead He won his battle against the Radicals.
This video didn’t go any way like I thought it would. Subscribed!
The only part I could never relate to with deep hearted southerners is the shame of reuniting with the union. If it is shameful or dishonorable to admit defeat over the mistake of secession or slavery then what honor was there to begin with? If they had succeeded and become the last bastion of legalized slavery in the free world, what pride is there to be had in that? I could never understand that perspective, the freedom of individuals and states I understood and relate to, but that part never makes sense to me.
Hot take: Gone With the Wind. While some elements of its production are dated and racist by current standards, it has progressive themes and was particularly woke for its time. It’s a deconstruction of lost cause mythology, not because it argues the confederacy was not a lost cause, but because it portrays southern elites as out of touch morons whose arrogance and delusion destroyed them. They picked a bad fight and got burned, and their delusions of aristocratic grandeur were exposed as fantasy.
Meanwhile Scarlet acts as a lens into the psyche of the South, Terra acts as a physical manifestation of the change in the South before and after the war, and the brutality of the war is depicted in jaw dropping (but accessible) fashion
Edit: I really like this movie but I understand it’s a complicated discussion… it’s definitely worth interrogating and if you disagree with me that’s ok
Oh yeah, there’s a way to reinterpret Gone With The Wind as an indictment of the Lost Cause mythos…I’m not sure I’d wholly buy it, as the film still tends to paint the South in overly romantic and tragic lights, but there is a surprisingly solid basis for such a view
@@warlordofbritannia I think the on-screen text is one of the things that throws people… it’s written entirely from the romanticized, “lost cause” perspective. The thing is, the characters who talk like that in the movie are the ones who turn out to be fools; we are shown that skeptics like Rhett Butler have a far better grasp of the tragedy unfolding than the people around them. That’s why I can’t help but think a lot of the framing is tongue in cheek…
Again, that doesn’t excuse elements of the production that are simply racist by today’s standards
Well they certainly didn't make Ashley Wilkes look a hero. Tomorrow is another day could be seen as 'The south will rise again' as pro-confederacy people mean it OR that while the south had been exposed it's people had the fortitude to rebuild after their problems had been exposed and would adapt to change
@@warlordofbritannia There is a fine line between Confederate Romanticism and Lost Cause Ideology.
Confederate Romanticism merely highlights the good stuff about the Confederacy, Lost Cause Ideology actively denies that there was anything bad about the Confederacy. They are not the same.
Confederate romantics are perfectly capable of admitting to the faults of the Confederacy while still appreciating the good aspects of it and celebrating it’s military accomplishments. Lost Cause believers either deny that those faults even existed or they try to justify them by saying that they weren’t that bad.
@@cannibalbunnygirl I like to see it as the south being able to bounce back from this and rebuild.
It's ironic to me that a movie based on a book by a militant segregationist and Klansmen turned out to be a pretty damn good story about a post-war Confederate. I feel like this is probably more a testament to the talents of Clint Eastwood as a director and story teller.
All the same, I'm glad to see you did a video one of my favorite westerns. Your channel is a joy, as always!
If you read the book , the movie followed to plot fairly closely .
I love the clear Mr Plinkett influence in this review. Brilliant stuff.
“A question settled by violence, or in disregard of law, must remain unsettled forever.” - Jefferson Davis
I remember watching this awhile ago but missed a particular scene. The scene where a store clerk shows Josey a postcard of a dead outlaw. That outlaw is a direct descendant of mine, Bill Doolin of the Wild Bunch. This film got a whole lot better for me.
P.S. that photo traveled 20+ years back in time to be shown to Josey Wales as that photo was taken in 1895
I think you meant to say you are a direct descendant of his. Interesting tidbit though!
ancestor?
@Noneof Yourbusiness he made a mistake chill out, tf is up with the internet being a bunch of assholes
@Noneof Yourbusiness its a small grammatical error dipshit, doesn't determine a person's intelligence
@Noneof Yourbusiness and btw talking about ending someones lineage for a small error isn't very chill
I learned the road agent’s spin from the outlaw Josey Wales(that move he pulled when faking surrender to the bounty hunters. It’s pretty fun but only with an unloaded gun.
Same!
this video was a rollercoaster dawg damn
I find it interesting how many folks find they can easily separate Roman Polanski the man from his work.
Woody Allen as well
Why is that interesting at all? Most people live in reality, where an artist and his work ARE separate; not a fantasy world where they are one and the same. ???
@Tom Ffrench dude he raped a 13 year old
@@quantum_immortal69 So just, readily ignoring the numerous instances where an artist will purposefully and explicitly tie themselves to their art as a means of spreading their views? Mkay.
@@grimnir2922 youre a sad person
My favorite movie of all time! Well done. It was interesting about Asa Carter.
This movie is humorous, action packed and respectful of all races and ethnicities all at once.
Exactly. Couldn't have said it better
I've enjoyed this very much. Just a couple of thinks.
The Home Guard in the south commited plenty of attrocities. In Madison Co, NC there was the infamous Shelton Laurel Massacre of a dozen unarmed Union prisoners (shhhhh, dont fisrupt the myth).
Josey Wales was as entertaining as Braveheart but somewhat more historically accurate. Braveheart got Scotland right and thats about it. Forrestt Carter was a fraud, but when he wasn't writing for George Wallace he sure could write.
Gods and Generals show us that Jeffery doesn’t have his fathers skill and seemingly could resist the call of the Lost Cause myth.
I appreciate this video very much.