COYOTE VS JUNKYARD LS-WHICH MAKES MORE HP? 5.0L YOTE VS 5.3L LS, STOCK, HCI MODIFIED AND HIGH RPM!
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- čas přidán 22. 10. 2023
- FORD VS CHEVY. IS THE 5.0L COYOTE BETTER THAN THE LS? WHICH ONE MAKES MORE POWER IN STOCK TRIM? WHICH ONE RESPONDS TO MODIFICATIONS BETTER? DOES A USED COYOTE COST MORE THAN A USED LS? HOW MUCH POWER ARE HEADS, CAM AND INTAKE WORTH ON A COYOTE. DOES A DOHC MOTOR MAKE GOOD TORQUE? HOW CAN A 5.0L 4V COYOTE MAKE MORE TORQUE THAN A 5.3L LS? HOW HIGH CAN YOU REV A COYOTE? HOW HIGH CAN YOU REV A JUNKYARD LS? CHECK OUT THIS VIDEO WHERE I COMPARED A STOCK 5.0L COYOTE TO A STOCK 5.3L LS, THE EQUIPPED EACH WITH PORTED HEADS, WILDER CAMS AND AFTER MARKET INTAKES. WHO WORE IT BEST?
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As a Chevy guy, I just looked at the title to the video and said, "Well, the Coyote. Of course."
I saw it as yet another pro-Chevy video. They alway put a limit on how much to spend and we all know the Chevy will always come out on top.
Same. Like we all know the coyote is the superior engine. LS is just cheap af
@@fredflintstone505 Eh, it's at least somewhat of a fair point, since most of us are on a budget. If we want to play the "unlimited budget" game, I'm not going to start with an LS *or* a Coyote.
@@jackcurrence263
Sure. But that's you. The point is if you set up a scenario where you have, say a $10,000 budget, and you pit an LS to a Coyote, you're letting the LS start at the 75-yard line in a 100-yard dash. Then acting surprised when the LS wins Then strutting around like it's superior when in fact they both have their strengths and weaknesses.
@@jackcurrence263hemi has entered chat😅
For the $ ... I don't know if anything can touch an LS dollar per horse.... maybe a K series. Simple, cheap, big power is hard to beat ! ... great video 👍
Putting the ford vs chevy thing aside. I think we all agree that it comes down to 2 things. Price and working on the engine yourself. I agree that the 5.0 is efficient and makes crazy power, no argument there. But to be honest the money aspect kills it for me. I gotta buy 4 cams, the heads are expensive as fk, I gotta buy twice as many valves and springs, timing chain kit more expensive, aftermarket parts in general are more $$$$ than the LS. In the other regard, I really love how simple the LS is to take apart/repair/keep alive over the 5.0. Humor me for a sec....Your at the track and you let's say " torch a head and have to repair to keep going rounds. Be honest an ask yourself which engine you'd rather remove the head off of in the given time frame ??? I really don't wanna add extra stuff in my way to do repair in the middle of an event ( 2 over head cams/Cam gears/ timing cover/Long ass chains etc etc ) to just remove a damn head man. But let me be clear as much as I love the LS platform the 5.0 yotes make insane power considering the displacement and efficiency of the platform.
I understand what you're saying but you also have to consider how worth it it is. A flathead engine would look at your LS and say how much more complex the LS is, I'll stick with my flathead so I can quickly swap heads and cut complexity. But obviously OHV is worth the upgrade. It's a similar step towards OHC. Even as Rich said, the 5.0 really just needs a blower and fuel management to make crazy power, buying aftermarket cams and heads or opening it up at all isn't really needed.
That said, I'm an old 302 guy, but I can admire the ingenuity put towards the coyote.
Nothing beats the cost per HP of a LS.
I'm still sticking to LS. Much cheaper to modify, less moving parts to go wrong, it's still a win. Also, LS fits in engine bays. Coyote is MASSIVE in comparison.
All ford engines are architecturally wayyyy bigger than they need/should be
Not its not😂 Supercharger/turbo, fuel system and opg= 1000hp on the Coyote try that with the Ls and see how much its gonna cost you
I’m always going for the Coyote!! Boost + RPM = Winning 🏆
@@Jimmyxsx yeah well that’s an old beat ass LSX that doesn’t have DI etc. put it against an LS3 different story, and the LS3 is old too & doesn’t have DI, the newest DI LTX GM V8s will crush a coyote mod for mod, nobody needs that many cams😜
@@MS-mr4zm the LTX😂 😆 Lund racing smoked all those big 406, 427 billet block engine cars last week at JPC imports vs domestics with a sleeved Coyote and you are telling me the POS LTX can crush the Coyote😆😆 u smoking some good meth🤣
The first thing I noticed when I first saw a Coyote in the flesh is how absolutely massive they are physically.
I had the same reaction when I saw a DOHC RB20, it was a not far from the size of as a L6 Mitshubishi diesel truck engine.
As someone who's only really had OHV engines, you forget how big 4 valve engines actually are.
People give me hell when I even bring that up. I love both engines but god damn and Ls can fit in almost anything 😅.
Great point... the coyote is the greatest engine that won't fit in anything... thats why they're dropping ls' in everything
@@user-qr7ee2cp4y part of being a cam in block motor the better packaging. Those yote are physically very massive but damn they do good under boost 😏
@@zethloveless7238 They are quite rare as a swap in in Aus, 2 reasons, the Mustang is a new thing for Aus, only after Ford went belly up in only 2018 I think? And the Barra are like 800 bucks from a wrecker and fit a lot of cars as a swap a lot easier. The LS is everywhere but other swaps are starting to gain popularity due to a junk LS motor costing 3k+ now, and a good running one typically 5-7K.
@@3800S1 Barra swap the world 😉
As a long time GM/chevy guy I know those coyotes are special. Chevy dabbled with DOHC with the LT5 and did well way back when but they never tried to really make it a high rpm killer. Ford has been doing it for years and now they have perfected it.
That was a lotus designed engine. GM used them to develop the lt5 after they took major share of the company. GM ohc passenger engines were and are somewhat shit, they couldn't make a high performance ohc engine until recently. If GM w/o lotus designed and produced the lt5 in the same fashion it would have been a mess.
@@zztop7306 True, the LT5 could have been even better if GM was not hung up on the stupid 5.7 thing. GM dumped the zr1 back then because they bought the engines from Mercury Marine. GM at the time could have never built that engine
THE LT5 WAS DESIGNED BY LOTUS. FORD OWNED LOTUS UNDER A SUBSIDIARY. IN THE LATE 1980'S, FORD SOLD 70% OF LOTUS TO GM. FORD KEPT 30% OF LOTUS BEING THE ENGINE DEVELOPMENT RESEARCH DIVISION. SINCE GM HELD 70% INTEREST IN LOTUS. IT ALSO GAVE THEM ACCESS TO THE ENGINE DEVELOPMENT DIVISION. FORD DEVELOPED THE LT5 ENGINE FOR THE ZR1 AND MERCURY MARINER BUILT IT. YOUR MAGNETIC SUSPENSION USED IN THE CAMARO TODAY IS OLD TECHNOLOGY THAT CAME FROM LOTUS WHEN GM BOUGHT 70% OF LOTUS. THAT'S' IS ALSO A FORD DEVELOPMENT. BACK IN THE LATE EIGHTIES WHEN DALE EARNHARDT WAS RACING HIS MR GOODWRENCH CAR. THE ENGINE UNDER THE HOOD WAS CALLED THE CHAPMAN LOTUS V-8. IT WAS A 4.6 L SINGLE OVERHEAD CAM ENGINE. IT CAME FROM ENGLAND IN A CRATE AND WAS PUT DIRECTLY INTO DALE EARNHARDT'S MR GOODWRENCH CAR. THIS MOTOR GAVE HIM THE WINNING EDGE AND HE WAS BEATING ALL THE FORDS, IRONICALLY WITH A FORD MOTOR THAT THE ENGINEERS AT LOTUS USED AS A TEST BED. WHICH LATER ON BECAME THE FORD MODULAR MOTOR WE KNOW OF TODAY. I COULD SEE THE FACES ON THE FORD ENGINEERS THAT LOTUS LAUGHING THERE HEADS OFF WHEN GM AND DALE EARNHARDT AND THAT MR GOODRICH CAR WAS WINNING. AFTER A CERTAIN AMOUNT OF HOURS IN OPERATION. THE CHAPMAN LOTUS V-8 WAS REMOVED AND SENT BACK TO ENGLAND FOR EXAMINATION.
@@wilsoncombat1341 GM dumped the LT5 because it was too big and costly to justify putting into the C5
Have a 13 gt track pack premium. I'm a Coyote guy but have tremendous respect for LS engines and the potential they have.
As a previous LS guy and now a coyote owner this makes me happy
As an S550 owner, I'm partial to the Coyote, although anyone with half a brain will admit that the LS is just way more available at yards for swaps. Waiting to see what the power graphs look like...
Looks like those of us that bought Coyote mustangs win, even being .3 liters down on displacement. If I had a big budget for a swap, and it fit, I'd go Coyote. I'm more likely to be on a 5.3 budget though 😅
Naturally...I like the screamer, but nothing a cheap good cam, intake ,& exhaust on LS can touch, but a lot simler...cheaper
even a Honda k24 engine swap is going to cost almost coyote money
@tturi2 those K24s are slick though. If I was doing a low weight build, I'd probably go turbo K24.
That’s a really big part of why the LS swap is so common. The engines are easy to find and are generally easy to fit in most things.
The extra complexity and physical size makes a coyote swap a little tougher.
I sort of wanted to buy a new-ish Camaro or Mustang. I decided to just put a turbo 5.3 in my single cab '90 sierra instead. Instant N/A car destroyer.
If your pockets are deep , coyote is Forsure the clear winner. If you’re balling on a budget it’s kinda hard to beat a Escalade 6.0. Diehard ford guy , and even I’ll admit I hate the price tag that comes with my blue oval rigs. But I’m not sacrilegious so it’s staying blue oval powered. 😂
Never seen so many feelings hurt by a simple comparison.
Not really. Everyone knew what would happen. The pushrod design is an 80 year old technology. But that is also why they are so damn reliable and cheap. GM has perfected them.
I own both, the coyote is better in my opinion but also much more expensive to build and get built properly. My yote is my daily and my 5.3 l33 vette is my fun toy.
Coyotes are great engines but you could probably build a big block for the price and make serious power.
Oh yah. Boosted big blocks are just absurd. Hell, a NA big block would whoop a Coyote and still probably be smaller. XD
The strength of the Coyote is it's efficiency.
but do a mustang v8 get better mpg then a v8 camaro. seems the answer is no
@@hotdog9262 well if you're trying to make more power, mpg doesn't really matter much.
It's very efficient in it's weight and handling, almost as good as the corvette. If i could test which one would get better mpg doing a lean burn, i would, but i can't. I'd still put it side by side with the camaro ss. But for mpg, weight, and handling, i would have to go with the corvette
@@hotdog9262Wrong, a mustang will get better mpg. Compare the 2010 ss to the 2011 mustang gt
@@acunit1639 Yeah can't fault you there, can never go wrong with a Vette. Personally I'd love a C5 with an LS7.
As always another great video. Love the comparison even if I’ll never hear the end of it from my buddy with his coyote!
I'm a Ford guy and I personally have always thought the coyote is just to big in size for what it is and way to many parts and I was so glad they finally come out with the 6.8 and 7.3 CIB design.
Ohv you mean
@@shadowopsairman1583 CIB-Cam in Block
@@brianpulley8652 OHV = CIB but nobody uses that in term, it's either ohv or pushrod motor in spoken language
@@pauranen just how old are you? OHV- over head valve which is ever engine built since the flathead V8.
YUP 😛, exactly what I imagined.
Given almost the same displacement, it's hard to beat the engine with VVT and 4v heads.
It's just the nature of the beast, proven time and again . . . and I'm not a Ford guy.
More of a Gen 2 LT1 and BBC guy.
Me too all I can afford are Dinosaurs
I mess with 500 Cadillac s too.
How can you compare and truck engine with 9.5.1 compression that makes 295hp from the factory to a engine that is 12.1 compression that makes 460hp from the factory? Change the pistons in the ls to 12.1 then compare them..with the swaps they made and the coyote only made a 100hp more than a low compression truck engine i would say that is a win for the LS! and the ls was a junkyard engine with a ton of miles on it..thats a no brainer!! LS all the way!!
@@cnewell1971it wasn't a 12:1 engine. It was a gen 1 coyote engine.....
@@pheonixfps9248 ok then..11.1..my bad vs a wore out 9.5.1 engine...ls still wins!! Lol
I’m just glad that Chevy finally decided to put a Coyote clone in their Halo Corvette, the new Z06. Awesome car, that.
There is no replacement for displacement.....BUT.......There's also no replacement for twice as many valves, each with only a fraction of the valve spring stiffness. I own a built LS7 in my C5 Corvette. But I also came from the motorcycle engine crowd, where 2-3 hp/cubic inch stock engines, with 4 valves a cylinder, are fairly common. Mighty hard to beat 9,500rpm capable Coyote engines with a pushrod engine. My company built leak test machines for the Coyote engine production line. As soon as I saw it, I knew Ford had finally gotten it right in regards to OHC engines, excluding the 427 of the 60's.
Cayote is an amazing motor. The issue is cost per HP. These things cost 2x-3x the price of a LS, and 4-5x the price to upgrade. I love these motors but they’re too dam expensive, they also sound amazing. Which is why almost everything I own has an LS.
When you say ls be specific because the LT1 2, and 3 are expensive asl to mod and to buy and still make less hp per dollar
Now let’s see the Big Bang Coyote 😁
Liter for liter the Coyote is unbeatable for power but Ford gave a big middle finger to all of us NA fans by limiting the Coyote to 5.0 liters. If Ford would offer a few larger cubic inch version (ie a 6.0 and 7.0 liter) they would be the undisputed king of performance. I’ve always wondered about the potential of a 7.0 liter Coyote screaming at 8k RPMs, it would be nasty!
I like the smaller packaging of the LS. Worked great for my 370z swap.
I'm 5.3 swapping a 370z rn
@@thewheelman1993 make sure you have a good rear diff. I blew mine out and had to rebuild my car after.
@@GregoryBrettin Thinking about doing a Ford 8.8 diff since I'm putting a tremec TKX 5 speed in it
Both great engines. LS fits in everything because of its compact size. Both very capable engines
So all the extra parts, complexity and chain length actually make a little more power with a similar displacement? I remember the Engine Labs Shootout where I almost felt sorry for the Coyote guys and Steve Brule summed it up: "When you take an (LS) engine that's 7/8ths the size of that (Coyote) package and you can make 75 more cubic inches in it and it probably weighs a bit less and t makes more power, it shows that it's the clear winner all the way around". Hard to argue.
Them 4 valve heads ,and higher tech cam timing rocked the ls.
Good stuff! Always look forward to your videos!
I reckon the next test should just be get a stock LS and stock Coyote and boost them with no head or cam change, see how far they can go as is.
depends on the generation of coyote block . otherwise they'll make as much as you can throw at them
No need for that. Everyone know the yote is the Kong of boost in stock trim
Yeah , until the oil pump gear cracks in half and takes out the whole damn engine , been there !
@@user-mm1se7gy7e they will!...what hp number was you at? Cause the Ls would leave the chat way before then.
@@user-mm1se7gy7eit's pretty much been proven that the opg's let go because people keep bouncing off the rev limiter. There's tons of 1000hp coyotes running around with stock opg's with no issues. Just stay off the rev limiter.
5.3: cheap and available, but needs A LOT to even match a coyote
5.0: more expensive, but gets better gas mileage, makes more power stock, likes boost
Gas mileage, lmao
Yeah a 5.3 will make as much power as a coyote for the same money. And 5.3 LOVES boost. Dumbest comment ever
A big bang test between these two would have been badass too!
FORD!! As a lifetime Ford guy (born into a blue oval family) Im happy with this comparison 😁
you really shouldn't be... theres a reason he left out the dollar amount per hp... once you factor that and invest what you paid for the coyote mods that LS engine blows it out of the water.... ford would be great if they didnt cost a metric ton for almost everything
@@joshvick6178 If you're broke just say so. I've been hear that price comparison BS my whole life. Who gives a shit. If you're pinching pennies find a new hobby because none of it's cheap
@@edjackson4389 next time lead with " im a dumb ahh and have feeling so im gonna speak through my ahh instead" XDDD clown
@@joshvick6178 Ok Scooter. Just remember who started this. You decided to chime in with your irrelevant bow tie feelings. Otherwise you never would have heard from this clown
Two great engines, use them as desired.
always been an LS/SBC guy, as pushrod engines they suffer from inefficient breathing, on the other hand the Coyote is a well rounded v8, breaths good, it can riv far higher, good internals, seen a few boosted 5.0 with 1xxx whp no issues whatsoever
Good to see someone who isn't blinded by their tribal alignments 👍🏻
@@michaelrodgers6559 Chevy is clearly better though. What they managed to do with a dead simple pushrod V8 is impressive. A gen V LS would make more power still. If we want to talk dual overhead cam, the LT6 shattered all records.
@@michaelrodgers6559 All right man, tell me all about valve curtain area, bore shrouding, valve/chamber shrouding, and how Pro-Stock racing engines make 3hp per cubic inch at over 10,000rpm without 4v DOHC heads.
@@jameswade2002 I don't need to talk about any of that. My point is that VE does actually matter. It's physics.
@@michaelrodgers6559 Okay, let me clarify. VE is cam size and head flow at RPMs. JPS Racing shows Coyote heads showing about 290cfm stock and their worked over ones come in around 340cfm at .650" lift, even though none of their cams lift over .515" so it's more like a 315cfm head. LS3 heads flow that stock and Gen3 Hemi Apache heads blow them out of the water with 340cfm, so with enough RPMs all three engine families will get there, but the Coyote can't rev high enough to make more power than a stock LS3 with giant cam and long tubes spinning to 7,000rpm. So a discussion about VE and cylinder head flow is moot because Ford ain't even got what the other guys have, hence VE doesn't matter here, or anywhere else when we are taking about racy small blocks or kickass big blocks. The heads and cams are out there so only displacement matters because all of them can rev to the moon with solid roller cams and good springs. This test had to be engineered to let the Coyote win by limiting the bore size and thus head flow of the LS down to where Richard knew the Coyote could win because that is what the Ford guy want to see. Displacement is king, and nothing else on modern engines matters.
The VK56VD eats both of them, stock for stock. The 5.6L makes the same peak power as the Coyote but does it at 6,200 rpm and has another 60 ft/lbs of torque down at 1,500 rpm.
You are missing the point. Comparison here is about modifications/aftermarket support and availability not about the output of a behemoth Japanese v8
I am a Chevy guy through-and-through not a big fan of the Ford Coyote but makes good power Sounds amazing The very simple fact is the LS is simple and cheap It's the way it's always been May not be hands down better True performance guy Knows that Ford cylinder heads for the most part always flowed better than the Chevy's But Chevy's are cheap simple and common That's why they win
Thanks Richard for telling it like it is 👍👍
You said it-when was the last time you found a coyote in the junk yard? There are millions of truck-type LSs. If the four-valve couldn’t out perform the pushrod two-valve design it would be pretty sad. I’ll stick to my 6.0, though. Thanks, Richard!
there everywhere in the junkyards. at least my area at least. F150's get wrecked every day.
@@andrewfitzgerald1174 BINGO! Coyote is no longer a Mustang Unicorn and Very available, also cheap considering you don't have to replace half the engine with VERY expensive parts. Plus tuned on OEM ECM
A natural aspirated coyote for me all day long. The LS has been swapped to death, why would i want to run what everyone else runs.
My idea is to make a killer Crown victoria prerunner with either a DOHC 4.6l or go big with a coyote making 5-600HP NA.
I would love to find a Ford V10 and swap into a Lincoln Town Car of sorts and make something unique and fun with that.
1st rule of engine building: It's not what you displace, but how you displace it.😉
I'd like to see the newer 5.3LT vs the Coyote.
The gen 3 coyote would crush a newer 5.3.
This is a no brainer, I am an LS guy through and through but any DOHC head will alway out perform a SINGLE CAM head or engine.
But the GM motors have always been easier to obtain, cheaper to build and cheaper to rebuild.
Once you get both motors to the same horsepower it only comes down to weight of the vehicles they are in and the skill of the driver.
The coyote as a whole,is a better engine then the ls.
It’s using modern methods of creating power. It has multiples records of hp on bone stock engines.
However the ls and soon to be lt will always have over the coyote is width and aftermarket.
And those two reason are the biggest driving force swaps.
Boosted coyotes are just on another level.
Both impressive being stock bottom end engines, it still amazes me that a 5.3 ohv is any where near a DOHC 5.0. Two ways of letting the eagles scream, one needs 4X the cams and valves one needs 1.2 more liters of displacement. I’ve seen a stock LT1 make 512 hp on an engine dyno, It might have been on this channel.
The Coyote is a great design, no denying that. However, if you look at the facts the LS is down 16 valves and 3 camshafts and isnt that far behind which imo speaks to the LS design and efficiency for a push rod engine. Now factor in things like costs, ease of modification, and size/difficulty of swap and availability and you begin to see why the LS is such a popular platform for guys of any brand favorite. For most average working men building a Coyote just isnt feasible.
A lot of people are diching the coyote swaps and going to the 7.3 godzilla. It's a lot easier to swap as it has a smaller footprint.
@@pastorofmuppets2349no idea why. More weight, less power.
I would think comparing the coyote to the ls3 makes sense since they were direct competitors in the mustangs and Camaros.
You see the LS in everything from the beetle to yes Mustangs. I'm old school and have the original 5.3. I have a 67 327 with AFR ported heads in a 84 El Camino. The LS is in the 2001 Silverado that pulls it to the track. Horsepower keeps the speed torque is what gets you the speed
One of my favorite n/a Coyotes: /watch?v=xowQK7vFd2A
744 rwhp and 10k rpm.
Both great engines but Coyote hard to keep up with.
Awesome video, I'm just happy my 5.0 still works after 30 years of beating on it lol the only thing I have ever changed on the engine are plugs and oil (but I have replaced everything else on the car lol) 🇺🇲
Its not s coyote
Go take your meds pumpkin 😘✌️
A Foxbody 5.0 Windsor is not a 5.0 coyote lol.
@@Swerzuhplease highlight at what point I said it was sweetie
Coyote is a whole different animal
Lol...Peace, Love!! As a pre-qualifier, I am a lousy shade-tree mechanic at best and don't pretend to enter the level of conversation here (and I'm an old to boot). I'm not really a "Ford" guy, but so far, I am getting great mileage and power out of my 23 F-150 Coyote (even at elevation). I thought I was going to do a whipple supercharge on it, but the mpg has given me pause.
After getting beat by one at the last event, our Boy Cleetus McFarland has taken a recent liking to the Coyote as well. 😮
Most people would go 6.2l ls or the bigger 7.0L Ls. The coyote, being a brand new crate purchase, voids this test for the most part. But does a good job showing the improvements the more advanced Coyote dual overhead cam and 4 valve setup gives. Also for anyone who knows anything when if you found a junkyard coyote that is in working condition it will cost upwards of 4 times the ls.
i like the newer LS 7 427 with 4 valve per cylinder dual over head cams 860 hp stock with out boost but i am a 454 bbc fan
Very 1st set of mods the heads on the LS was replaced with very expensive aftermarket.
@@jeffrey4547Someone made a document conversion for it? With that bore size and the 40 to 44mm intake valves those probably flow 400cfm without being touched up to 450cfm with porting. Or enough to make 1100 or so he naturally aspirated.
yeah. he said that @12:20
I think its a more relevant test for people that already have a coyote engine car, vs building a LS for it. Even though I am a LS fan, as the current Camaro sucks so bad at being a nice street car, I ended up buying a new mustang instead. It feels slow, but thats mostly because there are no sudden peaks of power, combined with the stupid traction control system keeping me from ever being near breaking the tires loose.
Most people do not go 6.2 LS or bigger. This is an incorrect statement. All the LS craze is from the cheap LS based 4.8 and 5.3 that boost is added to. Cheap, accessible...etc. It's ok to admit both platforms are good. ;)
I'd like to see a dollar to dollar comparison between the LS and Coyote. Im guessing you could get more power per dollar with the LS. The Coyote is a good engine. Just way too expensive. Also too complicated compared with the LS
Of course it's complicated an ls is. Just a reversed engineered Ford 60s engine
Enginemasters did it. They used a 2nd hand truck 5.0 too. So the baselines were actually close. But in the end the coyote is just way more money in every facet. You can say "but what if money is no object?" Then you wouldn't start with a junkyard 5.3 either.
Coyote cams are a lot easier to swap than LS.
I'm glad to see one of these tests is more like an 🍎 to 🍎 comparison. It's usually just the coyote vs 6 or 6.2 ls with obvious results.
Ford guy here all the way...but the LS is still best bang for the buck
Coyote is the choice for pure performance, the Gen 2/3 stuff has been well over 1000whp on stock motor and Joel Steele was making 1300whp on a stock Roadrunner that had ARP hardware. Brett Lasala just went 6.33 @ 225 with a stock crank and factory heads, and Joel broke the domestic stock record with ease. The LS has its place in the world, great engines and abundant as hell and cheap to make very very good power.
The biggest thing is that people do the wrong mods on these engines, the huge benefit of these is that all you need is boost, fuel, and a good tune and you’re done. You don’t need heads, cams, porting, manifolds (unless you have a Gen 1/2 Truck engine), or displacement changes.
BOOST JUST MULTIPLES THE NA POWER-MORE NA POWER EQUALS MORE POWER AT ANY BOOST LEVEL
@@richardholdener1727 true, and you’re much much wiser than I’ll ever be Mr Holdener, but I see people make the mistake of camming their coyote when stock cams make 1300whp and it’s just money you don’t need to spend if you have a car with the coyote already installed. If you’re building a motor on a stand though, I can understand using cams as it’s a “down the road” engine.
@@169abrexactly! You don't need much to make a stock unopened coyote hit 1000whp, unlike the LS...everything has to be upgraded!💯💯💯
I paid $1800 for a gen 2 coyote f150 engine from a junkyard and boosted it to 1000rwhp.
Coyote stuff is still slightly more expensive but you don’t have to do cams or beads for big power.
It’s a wash on price.
I think the direct injection gen 3 is a whole different scenario... Almost wish it had a different name or something to distinguish it more, most dont even know they went direct in 2018+. Changes the abilities and cost probably a solid 10-30%
Plus you get the extra RPM to play with
@@rocsti5402 the gen 2 is the best engine, when you get to big boy power they DI is deleted and you stick to port injection. Gen 3 is fantastic up to ~1200whp which is an insanely high ceiling for 5.0L and stock cams.
Amen brother!!
I know this is 5 months old, but the coyote has a good advantage over the 5.3 LM7 by the dual over cams and a standard 11.0.1 compression and Ford did an excellent job on balancing the rotating assembly from factory, so you can get that nice high rev out of it. And the LM7 has standard 9.5.1 compression and the L33 has 9.9.1 compression standard. But what makes the GM 5.3 beat the coyote is cost. The 5.3 is cheap to pick up at any U-Pull-It and trying to find a coyote out there is next impossible. They're usually already sold before they hit the yard 9 out of 10 times for a premium price. And performance parts for the 5.3 are reasonably priced unlike performance parts for the coyote. That's how the GM 5.3 beats the coyote for the budget swap.
LS is simply the better, cheaper, easier option for 90% of builds if not more. Cheap, easy power from a junkyard LS will wipe the floor with any coyote under $10,000
Based on this video obviously not.
I’d love to see Ford make a bigger displacement Coyote. Imagine a 7.0
They could call it King Kong or Zeus or something..
Look up Ford Godzilla
@@klyfhutto572 all i get is some nissan gtr thing , maybe they should have built it 10-20 years ago when mercedes & the rest of the world was wrapping up on it instead of waiting so long... All jokes aside is Ford original at literally anything? I can't think of a single thing that wasn't "borrowed" down to gt40 schemes lol... Maybe the mystichrome cobra, noone had balls for that but im sure im missing something. Only a matter of time before they offer an all aluminum bare body (not a cobra but more deloreon style, im surprised they haven't already lol.
@@klyfhutto572
Yeah…that’s a pushrod engine…not even close to the Coyote
@scottythebody0811 Glad you found it. You're correct. It's not as efficient as the coyote, but it would be interesting to compare it to the LS 7. The Coyote, naturally aspirated cubic inch to cubic inch, is an amazing engine. Mast Motorsports has made some aftermarket stuff for the Godzilla. Maybe some other companies also.
Coyote is an awesome engine. It's just physically bigger and won't fit as many applications and costly compared to the ls. Make a set of heads for the Coyote that uses solenoids to open and close valves instead of 4 big cams and Yeah, fitment won't be an issue just cost 💁♂️
@benkrom2737 physically the difference between the ls and coyote is only a inch or less in most cases Measurements H x W x L if the front of the ls not dressed with any accessories mounted it is 26"s wide 30" with accessories the coyote is 29" with accessories, the ls is 22"s tall where the coyote is only 20.5"s. The 5.0 coyote in not a piece of crap 4.6 mod motor it's a total ground up redesign.
Technology wise Ford has been ahead of GM for a long time. The LS as usual is just cheap displacement. Though I would be interested in seeing a test like this between Fords 7.3 gas job vs. GMs 7.0L LS.
I'm a coyote guy. But, I don't dish on ls. Run what you like and have some fun!
Both are solid platforms. The 5.3 LS is still going to be the popular option being it is a more affordable compact design that the average shade tree mechanic can work on. How many Coyote owners actually have done the mods in video themselves vs LS owners? The Coyote is an excellent platform either way. I said that it was going to be a force to reckon with back in 2010 when it was being revealed for the 2011 Mustang GT. This video proves that...however the DI LT engines tilted the tables back towards GM. You should do a comparison video of a Coyote vs a L83.
Corvette 5.7 LS6 made 420 flywheel Factory..i think..
Not really......the coyotes strength has always been boost. They make bigger power on boost than the GM or dodge motors especially when you compare stock sealed motors. Gen 3 coyotes can make 1200 hp no problem on a stock sealed motor with nothing but boost and the supporting mods for said boost. They can do all this without blowing up. The same cannot be said for LS or LT motors.
Also look at the valve surface area a DOHC starts with. It’s already close to maxed out on a cylinder that’s already up against its bore center limit. Stock cam duration is as wide or wider than OHC performance cams. Its variable timing will put the LSA and events where they need to be.
I guess I'm biased but I have owned both Ford and Chevy and I will keep my Chevy any day of the week over any Ford.
$ spend vs $ spend LS is the way. Nothing against Yote but get more for the $ and smaller package. Hard to beat the LS
I always hear about an ls is cheaper to mod than a coyote, but what people don't understand is you don't need to do anything extra with a coyote. Just pretty much boost, fuel system and oil pump gears if over 1,000 hp. Ad all the costs of heads, intake, headers, fuel system and others just to get the ls or lt on the same level as a coyote with boost and it's a wash with cost.
Would be interesting to see the cost difference HP/$$ between the Coyote and the 5.3 you tested. Honestly I see nothing new here. This situation has been the same since the 60's. Yes, Ford motors can make power but they are expensive to build and parts are sometimes hard to find. While Chevy motors make power for a lot less money, it's easy to find parts and in my experience they are more reliable and cheaper to own/repair. Ford builds some good motors, absolutely. But if it's a question of HP/$$ the GM motors have been coming out on top for decades and is the reason the LS is everywhere.
I agree with everything you said. If I had the money, I'd be a MoPar man, but I don't, so I'm a GM guy. Nothing against Ford, but they don't work as well for the most part and cost way more while being hard to find parts for. Coyote motors are probably going to make great power, but they're huge and expensive and 5.3s (even aluminum block ones like the two I own) are cheap, light, small, and really are just amazingly reliable and modifiable with a whole UNIVERSE of aftermarket support.
Excrement costs less than Steak !!! Say it's not so!
@@joeh6697 But LSs are fantastic motors. Most reliable 500 hp out there, and cheap.
@@joeh6697 filet vs ribeye. Ford Bois so stupid
RICHARD MAY HAVE TO USE POLITICAL CORRECTNESS AND KEEP HIS MOUTH SHUT ABOUT THE FORD VERSUS CHEVY CONTROVERSY, BECAUSE IF HE TELLS THE TRUTH. THE CHEVY GUYS WILL TAKE HIS HEAD OFF WITH A GUILLOTINE FOR TELLING THE TRUTH LIKE THEY DID TO JOHN THE BAPTIST.
NO POLITICAL CORRECTNESS HERE ON MY PART WHEN IT COMES TO TELLING THE TRUTH.
NONE OF YOU PEOPLE HERE, INCLUDING THE FORD GUYS HAVE NO IDEA WHY FORD MOTORS COST MORE TO BUILD AND WHY PARTS WERE HARD TO GET.
SO LET THE TRUTH BE TOLD. IT WAS ALL BASED ON CHEATING BY THE NHRA WHO ARE ANOTHER DIVISION FOR GM TO PROTECT THE PHONY CHEVY RACING DYNASTY. WHEN THE FORD 289 DEBUTED IN THE 60S. THEY WERE CONSTANTLY CHANGING THE RULE BOOK AND RULES BOTH WRITTEN ON UNWRITTEN TO DISCOURAGE ANYBODY FROM RUNNING IT. IT WAS A MAJOR THREAT TO THE SMALL CHEVY. IN THE COBRAS, THE SMALL BLOCK FORD WAS DESTROYING THE CORVETTES WITH THEIR 327'S. THE CORVETTES WERE NO COMPETITION. IN 1964, THE DAYTONA COUPE DESTROYED FERRARI AND WON LEMANS BY ALMOST 40 MINUTES AND WERE CLOCK AT OVER 200 MPH. SOMETHING THE CHEVY SMALL-BLOCK COULD ONLY DREAM OF DOING.
IT HELD A TOP SPEED RECORD AT BONNEVILLE AT 183 MPH RIGHT BEHIND THE CHEVY 396 BIG BLOCK CLOCKED AT 186 MPH. WITH THAT SMALL CUBIC INCH THE FORD WAS THREE MILES PER HOUR SLOWER THAN THE CHEVY 396 BIG BLOCK. EVERYWHERE THE COBRA SHOWED UP AT RACE TRACKS HERE IN AMERICA. THEY MAULED DOWN THE CORVETTES.
IN THE QUARTER MILE THE 289'S WERE FIERCE COMPETITORS. IF YOU SHOWED UP WITH A CERTAIN SETUP AND WON THE CLASS. THE NEXT TIME YOU CAME BACK TO THE RACETRACK. THE RULES ON THE MOTOR WERE CHANGE AND YOU COULDN'T RACE. OVERNIGHT THEY WERE CHANGING THE RULES ON THE SMALL BLOCK FORD. IT GOT SO BAD THAT THE SMALL BLOCK FORD DISAPPEARED OFF THE QUARTER MILE. BY THE EARLY SEVENTIES ONLY TWO GUYS WERE RUNNING THE SMALL BLOCK FORD 289. BUY CHANGING THE RULES ON THE SMALL BLOCK FORD, NEITHER WOULD FORD NOR ANY AFTERMARKET MANUFACTURER MAKE RACE PARTS IN VOLUME WHICH MADE PARTS AFFORDABLE AND CHEAP, FOR THE SMALL BLOCK FORD THAT WOULD BE OUTLAWED OVERNIGHT WHERE THEY WOULD GET STUCK WITH A WAREHOUSE FULL OF SCRAP METAL. NOT UNTIL 1987 WAS A RACE HEAD AVAILABLE FOR THE SMALL BLOCK FORD WHEN TRICKFLOW MADE THEM, "THAT IS RIDICULOUS" AND THE END RESULT OF THE NHRA DID, HENCHMEN FOR CHEVY OUTLAWING RACE PARTS FOR THE FORD'S. I REMEMBER TALKING TO A GUY WHO BUILT THE CAMARO BACK IN THE SIXTIES AND SAID HE WANTED TO BUILD A FORD SO BAD. BUT THE PARTS FOR THE SMALL BLOCK FORD WERE SO EXPENSIVE HE COULDN'T AFFORD THEM. HE SAID HE WORKED IN A DELI AND MADE PRETTY GOOD MONEY AND PUT LONG HOURS IN. AND EVERY PAYCHECK HE MADE WENT INTO HIS SMALL BLOCK CAMARO. HE SAID IMAGINE IF HE BUILT A FORD. HE WOULD HAVE TO HAVE THREE JOBS TO AFFORD TO BUILD A FORD. MOST OF YOUR ENGINES FROM PONTIAC, BUICK, OLDSMOBILE, CHRYSLER, AMC ARE OF A CONVENTIONAL ENGINE DESIGN THAT IS SIMILAR TO THE CHEVY SMALL BLOCK. THE CHRYSLER SMALL BLOCK IS A BETTER MOTOR BY DESIGN THAN THE CHEVY MOTOR. SO TELL ME WHY THE SMALL BLOCK CHRYSLER NEVER REACHED THE SUPREMACY IN RACING OF THE SMALL BLOCK CHEVY. TO ANSWER THIS QUESTION: THE NHRA DETERMINED THE SMALL BLOCK CHEVY TO WIN THAT'S WHY. IF THE CHEVY SMALL-BLOCK WAS BETTER THAN A SMALL BLOCK FORD. THEN WHY DID THEY SCRAP THE OLD SMALL BLOCK CHEVY AND REDESIGN A NEW SMALL BLOCK YOUR LS WHICH IS A MILLION PERCENT BASED ON ALL FORD DESIGN. IT'S A REGURGITATED FORD 427 HIGH RISER AKA RAISED PORT 351 WINDSOR. NOT ONE DESIGN ASPECT OF THE OLD SMALL BLOCK CHEVY LIVES IN THE LS. THE LS IS ALL FORD IN DESIGN. IN MY OPINION THE MOST CRIMINAL THING THAT HAS EVER HAPPENED IN RACING IS CHEVY/GM COPYING FORD AND MAKING THE LS MOTOR. IF ANY OF YOU CHEVY GUYS WOULD LIKE TO DISCUSS THE FORD CHEVY CONTROVERSY FEEL FREE TO DO SO.
Coyote is a monster of technology and efficiency. I feel like LS stuff is played out way too much
LS cost: $3000 crate engine, $3500 2x heads, $500 1x cam, $1500 intake.
Coyote cost: $12,000 crate engine, $5000 2x heads, $1500 4x cams.
Now port the stock LS heads with big valves to save $3000 on heads. Then add $13k in boost to the LS and that will match the NA coyote moded comparison. How is this even a comparison? LS is mechanic friendly too! Coyotes will bite the hand that feeds them 😂 I wish I could do this myself but I’m too rich in life 😅
the arguing is what’s makes this fun. It’s also why, being a Ford guy, hate that the Camaro is gone. McDonalds needs Burger King and Wendy’s, the Mustang needs the Camaro to keep the segment alive. The Challenger is decent for that reason also.
Those fast food places all suck
The coyote engines from trucks can be had pretty inexpensively. I think it would've been better to compare 2 truck engines. The coyote is more expensive to mod but really doesn't need it to compete with a basic ls engine. The same money into each and I think the coyote would still excell.
The truck coyote is almost identical aside from firing order.
@@Prestiged_peckcams
I'm a Ford Pushrod guy. But building my 363 engine is costing me over 10k. A reasonably low mile sealed gen 2/3 Coyote can be had for $6500 or less. It's hard to argue against their potential if you don't mind a mod motor.
Throw in the aftermarket support for a coyote swap, and it's fairly cheap when you calculate $/hp.
I have a 13 Tahoe with a 5.3 and a 17 f150 with a 5.0. Driving both back to back I can feel more low end torque in the tahoe but get that nice top end pull with the f150. Usually when I pull my seadoos I use the Tahoe. The truck pulls fine too just have to be a little higher in the rpm. I love both engines I need to race them for fun I know I can get out on the truck for a few but it’s going to go around the suv in the top. The Tahoe is quite a bit heavier than the f150 though like 1500 pounds
On a budget the 5.3 is better way to go and fits better for engine swaps. But of course if money is no object then coyote way to go. The 5.3 is actually more impressive my opinion because its a old school push rod engine. That being said coyote is definitely a impressive engine for sure.
Thanks for the comparison. I just recently bought a gen 2 coyote core from my work. Spun a main bearing. I have it torn down and the block and heads are good. But it’s gonna need a new rotating assembly. Most likely gonna boost it but this video helps give me an idea what I’ll need to do for the mean time.
call MMR. Modular Motorsport Racing. they probably have the best bang for the buck in terms of rotating assembly cost. 2,599.99 for a 1000rwhp crank rod pistons set up with rings and bearings. Even less if that crank is undamaged and you just need rods and pistons.
Assuming the crank got damaged where it rides on the main that was compromised, you'll want a new crank. I don't think they take as well to crank cutting and spinning 8000+ rpm on larger bearings, like LS's get away with when spinning them to 6500 in a mild truck or car build.
anyway back to MMR. great parts to buy, just questionable if they machine and assemble lol.
Just curious how someone managed to spin a main in a gen 2 coyote. Those are the most stout generation of the coyote so far. Unless the previous owner ran it with no oil for a while.
@@edmundnlemadim8480 the engine I got had the MMR timing chain guides MMR tensioners and secondary tensioner, MMR oil pump gear. Some trick stuff.
@@Swerzuh It had a big ol centrifugal super charger on it. The kids dad bought the mustang for him at the dealer I work at and a year later it came in with the engine knocking lol.
The four valves is where it makes up the any displacement. The same reason the Barra and the 4200 run so well. They are efficient as hell as air pumps. Ford spent years getting the mod motor right. Chevy used the LS for years without much R&D, which is nice for the salvage yard picks, but not much in future. Honestly, I dislike the kind of people that drive Coyotes. They're like the Camaro guys from highschool driving daddy's car stock with exception to a blower. They have no idea how to get a few hp here and there to win by a nose. With the exception of a smaller pulley.
Let’s see a Gen 2 Coyote test, and or use a 5.2 block, but not with the flat plane crank.
I honestly feel like the two engines change places based on goals. I think they both do ok until 800-1000hp depending on the very specific engine you get. But clearly the ls motors are cheaper from a junkyard. I think a max effort sleeved coyote goes further than a max effort stock block based ls motor. I think the ls is cheaper in the 1000-1500hp range.
Coyote certainly has more potential, but the LS does have a leg up in price and packaging.
@@BrendanCBreen yeah a coyote doesn’t fit in anything but mustangs, other fox and panther chassis cars and things that a big block hemi would fit in….
Incorrect $for $ more power from a ls all day . Don't matter if a 500 hp or 3k hp build cost is cost and just more bang per $ spent.
If it was other way around everything would have a coyote and not a ls 😂 sane goes for hemi
Big power / big $$ lol
@@Bill-flatplanefoolthey fit in a 62 falcon so if i can fit one in there they will fit in nearly any stock chassis especially mid sized chassis or unibody for the wordsmiths out there
@@roderickvinson3425 there is no reliable 3000 hp LS motor other than Steve Morris’s billet stuff and if you think you can get that anywhere near the price of Brett LaSalle’s sleeved coyote you can share proof any time
Be interesting to see the curve with the compression the same. Add another 6% at least to the 5.3 power curve everywhere. Kind of hard to compare the 2 when that particular LS is 10 years older and isnt even a gen IV which hurts the stock vs stock comparison. The aftermarket one really the only difference is the comp ratio.
Exactly
Well thats a gen 1 coyote. just admit the coyote is better.
@enigma9789 coyote is better at some things, LS is better at others. I'm not loyal to either, I'm just an engine guy. I'm just saying that personally it would be cool to see 2 identical builds and then look at the differences. The biggest difference between the 2 (besides architecture) is the compression, so be cool to see what that alone does to the 2 power curves.
@ryancompeau146 lol LS or LT tows better but even a tuned 6.2 struggles to keep up with just a tune gen 3 coyote. Mpg better and coyote is faster
@justingill5256 lol. Depends which 6.2 your talking about, and which Coyote your talking about. Truck engines? 6.2 has it beat in hp and tq. If the 5.0 is faster its because of the truck not the power. Talking Mustang 5.0 vs 6.2 LT2, again 6.2 has it beat in power. Displacement is a wonderful thing. Even if they had the same peak power, the 6.2 average power just eats it. Mpg you cant really debate because that is to driver dependent.
Something else to remember is the 5.3 is using a 102 mm throttle body. The coyote is making all of that power through the stock 85mm throttle body.
we used a bigger throttle body on the Boss
@@richardholdener1727 was it the 87mm from the boss 302?
Nice test, interesting results. Keep up the good work Richard! Personally, it's a 385 series Ford for me. I'm surprised there aren't more "But what torque do they make at 1197 RPM?" comments. :)
Did you do a 6.2L vs 5.0L yet? As a coyote fan they really love going catless with e-85. Simple but effective. In the n/a world it seems the 6.2 has the slight edge. However in the boosted game its a no brainer the coyote shines all day.
the Yote vs LS3 vid is up-but the motor that makes more na power-will make more under boost
@@richardholdener1727 Alot of variables there but in theory yes with assumptions. But in the real world those limitations start showing up quick near max effort.
@@richardholdener1727 if your sleeving the Lt/Ls and doing a rod piston swap then id say thats plausible. Im talking bolt ons and stock rotating assembly, bolt on power adder.
Nice comparison 👏
Thank you Richard.
Coyote FTW
Doesn’t the 5.3 have about 12 years in the coyote. Go ahead and compare it to the 4.6. I believe that would be more appropriate.
5.4 if you are talking truck motors.
@@jeremyjseifert ah yes, sorry 4.6 and 5.0 come to mind as mustang engines right off the bat. The 4.6 also came in truck. So how about a 4.6/4.8 and 5.3/5.4.
@@J2000Z71still too many variables.. 2v, 3v, 4v.. 4v had different heads depending, Mark V8, vs Mustang vs Truck/SUV.. there would still be someone crying "not fair" 🤷🏾♂️
Are you trying to prove something here !!? 🤔. The dual is between an ls and coyote. That it
Because quiet frankly the early modular ford motors are good but the ls platform was beating Ford until the coyotes came out.
Better than that LS vs coyote build challenge a few years ago where the Chevy guys came back with a 7 liter LS. I woulda been embarrassed to have to bring a 7 liter to beat the little yote. They both broke but obviously the 7 liter won.
they did not do a very good job on that test
Coyote is king. Plain and simple
It does it with less displacement, and is more efficient, and it outperforms the LS/LT in almost every measurable metric.
You don’t have to buy a kill the dolphins cam, big $$ heads, and stratosphere Hiram intakes to make big power with a Coyote like you do a LS/LT..
All you need is boost and fuel with a coyote, and countless examples of Gen2+ Coyotes w/15psi through TT’s making 1000rwhp with sealed unopened engines.
And note, he’s comparing a Gen 1 Coyote(weakest of the Coyote family)vs a bigger displacement engine the LS 5.3
The coyote engine is very impressive and one of/if not the best engine platforms out currently, in my humble opinion.
Look what happened at FL2K recently this year…
how do cams kill dolphins?
Im an Ls guy butt its not rocket science lots of Ls at the junkyard and you'd be lucky to find any coyotes at the junkyard butt at the end of the day 4 cams or gonna make more power than one just sayin..... both are great engines its all preference and how much $$$ you got to spend. 🤙🤙🤙
2018 5.3 might have been a little more comparable with VCT heads are better thought you ran one and it made like 425 or 450 go stock.
But 2018 gen3 coyote make to bigger power ...
The crazy thing is, that after modding the gap in performance closes greatly even though the coyote is a quad cam 32v variable timing masterpiece, the old tech LS is very close.
Definitely more motor for the money on the 5.3 thats why folks love them they are strong and there are a ton of them out there.
A pushrod is great for fitting a lot of displacement in a smaller package while being cheaper to tinker with solely due to less parts in total. There’s a reason only a handful of DOHC V8s over 5 liters exist. How big do you think a coyote capable of displacing 7ish liters would be? Both engine designs impress me in their own way. What a LS can do with less and what’s coyote or equivalent can adapt/optimize to across a wide range. Though a 8-9k rpm “small block” sounds pretty awesome.
That would be Ford's 7.3L Godzilla engine...
@@BobbyOfEarth Which is essentially a big LS with less aftermarket support. Would be fun to destroke one sleeve for the widest bore then run high rpm.
As someone who appreciates high revs _and_ big displacement (I alternate between a 900+ hp LS and a 500+ hp Honda when I'm not driving my SUV), this is a never ending debate. If you're looking at specific output and power potential, DOHC and VVT are always going to have an advantage. But when it comes to the kinds of builds most people here will consider, engine size, weight, cost and torque output in the lower half the of the rev range are at least as important, if not more so. Because its so easy to cram 7+ liters of LS into a space noticeably smaller than the Coyote (Coyote being several inches taller and wider) and the LS will probably weigh 40-50 lbs less, the pushrod becomes more attractive. Then you get all that juicy torque off the line on the street, which is much more enjoyable as well. If I had to pick the motor I wanted to win races with, I'd lean Coyote, but the motor I had to drive every day? It would be an LS with 20-30% more displacement.
agreed
Size is an issue with the Coyote but the weight isn't. They are pretty close when the block material is aluminum and even CG isn't that bad with the DOHC engine either (LS is right around the crank and Coyote is a little higher). The iron block engines of course are heavier than a Coyote obviously.
Coyote is like that perfect come back that you thought of after you left the party.
Always been more of a Ford guy but packaging and cost , the LS is the clear winner
Can you weigh the two engines? 😅
I’m pretty sure the coyote weighs in at ~430lbs