Dave Rat about his sound engineering for the Red Hot Chili Peppers live tour 2016
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- čas přidán 10. 11. 2016
- More about the Chili Peppers: Scott Holthaus on the lighting design of the 2016 tour: • Scott Holthaus and Lei...
tinyurl.com/pguhqkl - Zur kompletten Reportage auf EventElevator mit Bildergalerie und einem weiteren Video von Lichtdesigner Scott Holthaus
Eigentlich wollte Dave Rat nie Tontechniker für Bands sein und lieber Lautsprecher entwerfen und bauen - und steht nun doch die meiste Zeit am Pult: Neben den Red Hot Chili Peppers betreute er wegweisenden Bands wie Rage Against The Machine, Nirvana oder Offspring.
Zwei Dinge fallen sofort auf, wenn man den FoH von Dave Rat betritt: Die altehrwürdige analoge Midas Heritage 3000 ist das erste, das zweite ihre Position: Dave Rat mischt zur Seite hin, das Pult ist also um 90 Grad gedreht.
Er möchte möglichst nichts zwischen sich und der Band stehen haben, um seine ganz persönliche Jobdefinition so gut es geht zu erfüllen: Die Band mit dem Publikum zu verbinden. Auch kein Pult.
Das Beschallungssystem stammt von L-Acoustics. Dave Rat hat auch schon für EAW Lautsprecher entwickelt, ist also keineswegs mit einer Marke verheiratet. Am braunen Holz aus Frankreich schätzt er die weltweite Verfügbarkeit sowie die lautsprecherübergreifende Konsistenz des Materials.
Im Video bekommen wir einen ausführlichen Einblick in sein Siderack und seine generelle Arbeitsweise. Pultlampen beispielsweise hält er für überflüssig, weil er die Kanäle sowieso nicht beschriftet - „ein Gitarrist kann spielen, ohne auf sein Instrument zu schauen, wieso sollte ich nicht dasselbe am Pult können?“ - Věda a technologie
"Like the guitarist can play a song without looking at the hands, I can mix a show without looking at the board."
"The engineers get a little more excited about creating a mark on the band, and in turn create a distraction from the experience". Wise words indeed.
Very wise. It's easy to forget that WE are not the attraction. Especially when working with an act you find lackluster -- you can feel the need to add some color. Always that fine line between honestly trying to add a little something and just being an obnoxious interfering wanker.
Todd Corey - yep
@@ToddWCorey1 also, ime engineers are like critics: semi-failed musicians w/ ego issues (of course i'm being ridiculous, just to emphasize my point). if you meet/find an 'objective-sound-guy' who's also a great guy, don't let them leave no matter what it takes :}
rant:
traveling with bands i can count on one hand the number of times the resident* engineer was genuinely helpful. they all think of themselves as all-knowing and while that might be the case :}, someone who is familiar with the sound of a band will always do a better job than someone who's a 'genius' but never heard the band. while one is part of the band the other acts like being the artistic director.
a selfless collaboration between the resident engineer who knows the venue/equipment and the engineer who knows the band yields some truly godly results indeed.
*smaller bands don't have and don't carry a complete sound system everywhere they go. some venues come with existing sound systems and the band just adds their fav mics, effects, etc.
The 3D printed fader attachments on the graphic EQ is the sickest thing I've ever seen, and they glow in the dark, I'm dead!
Right I had to stop the video at that point and check the comments to make sure everyone else realized how genius that was
Why isn't this product on SoundTools???
Hell yeah! I was thinking the same thing.
I was stressing out when he said he doesn’t label or use any lights for the board. This guys mixes in the dark on an analog board. I’d be shitting my pants but this guys is in his element. Absolute amazing
That's the Rat for ya. Dave was already a legend when I was doing this twenty years ago.
As he said though, he doesn't even touch the board after the first couple shows because the sound from the stage stays the same, he only has to compensate for the room.
@@danieljensen2626 Indeed, and it's now easier to do that than ever, but this OG was doing is before digital was all the rage. He does some intense soundchecks with the band and/or their techs. He's heavily involved in the touring rehearsal as well.
This is not only a rare sound guy...this is a rare person. A person genuinely interested in performing the craft to the highest degree they can. We need more people like this...less lazyness...
hell yeah man.
Lmao there's probably 500 foh engineers max in a position like this.
@@stack3r The ethos is what's noteworthy here.
Sound guys is where I've seen the most stubborn and arrogant attitudes (I know because I was once one), I think some of it has to do with many are or were aspiring musicians themselves and they wish is was them playing up there instead.
@@Tgogatorsmy assumption is it is also a job that requires a giant amount of responsibility and often doesent pay very well in relation to how stressful it can be, and that stress causes general irritability, low patience, and arrogance. but idk im not a FOH engineer.
Sound 101 "Never clip"... Dave "Overload the front end and clip the snare"... I like this guy
He is working in analog domain, clipping is fairly normal, you can get very pleasing effects unlike in digital.
I don't label anything & I also don't remember where the channels are! Brilliant.
He knows it's something drums. it's enough, the rest he can do by ear.
Vinny Osborne lmfao! Well said!
Plus he can mix without looking at the board lol.
ThatFunkadelicMusic It’s easier than it sounds if you’re really familiar with the setup. Although this side setup thing he has going on seems weird to me... not sure I’d like that.
Dave is being VERY modest here. you don't need to prove your genius to the camera. he does his job incredibly. that's a problem with this youtube generation - they watch a lot but don't actually ever do anything, so it's a lot of talk. then you have people who do all the work, and can't necessarily put it into words or "prove" their knowledge. doing is more important.
Dave is one of the Greatest minds in live sound reinforcement.
Definitely
Truly result oriented as opposed to process oriented
👍🏻🤘🏻
I recall being surprised that the CP10 even existed. I can’t think of any other manufacturer making a parametric system EQ. It lives up to the surprise, being a very easy and effective equalizer, curves being just perfect.
One of the smartest, most genuine people I've ever met.
He's a deep thinking, simple genius. He comes up with solutions that are so basic yet so effective it blows my mind.
Every single aspect of the system has been thoroughly thought through and arranged in the most effective way possible.
I just wish he was based out of the East coast instead of CA.
This is fascinating. This is like watching a master chef at a 5 star restaurant explain how he makes a super complicated meal.
This is a great analogy.
Yes!! Rat Sound! I had the pleasure of playing through Rat Sound a few times in North Carolina 1991-92 with Animal Bag and my band Syrup. You had us so thick and will powerful sounding we made the ceiling collapse in Greensboro!! You inspired me to continue into sound engineering and I'm now studying further in the UK. Your tones and sound reinforcement and professionalism set the bar for me and I've never looked back! Thank you Sonic Sensei!!
His details about venues, stage bass cancelling, temperature and time delays are fascinating.
Incredibly down to earth guy. I could listen to him all day, such a relaxed way of explaining things , but I have 3 screaming kids creating some sort of riot upstairs..Many thanks Dave.
Turn the mids. and treble down then bro, simple solutions for stupid sounds
.
Indeed. I noticed him leaving the show in Tampa for the I'm With You show (walking to the bus though the street) I politely approached, I didn't know what to expect, but he gave me a warm smile and shook my hand.
I do believe he is the highest commitment ever to sound gigs.
Dave Rat has always been the least technically gifted yet most genuinely talented engineers I've ever heard. Dave gets away with saying the dumbest things as far as the science but then throws in the best nuggets of wisdom for the art.
@@ezion That's not true in general. A lot of people *do* get into audio engineering without serious electronics/signals/controls background, but at the upper echelons of the craft you absolutely do get people who have the degree and know the *exact* definition of "Transfer Function."
@@ezion For what it's worth, this front-of-house mixing is not all Mr. Rat is known for. As he mentions in the interview, he learned to mix to support his real passion: Design of sound systems and sound system components. Listen to him talk about setting up speaker arrays or designing subwoofer enclosures and it'll be clear he earned the "engineer" title - at least as much as most "mechanical" or "electrical" engineers have.
ezion really? Loser? Get real fella, the man knows his job inside out, he has a job most of us can only dream about.
@@ezion Lol, listen to him talk about sub arrangements some time. There's a huge amount of overlap between the design and layout of audio systems and phased arrays in radio frequency engineering. I agree that the live sound stuff he talks about here is not necessarily engineering, but he even says live mixing is not his true passion.
Professor, mad scientist, genius, artist. Thanks Dave, always fun watching and trying to gain some kernel of insight. You are THE man.
EQing for temperature reasons. Literally next level stuff.
Thanks for always taking time and creating these videos. Very inspiring and helpful.
Impressive!
As I see it he is a member of the band playing his instrument.
The way he talks makes this video worth seeing by any young professional from any field of work at all.
I learn so much every time I watch a Dave Rat Video!! Thank you Dave
A living legend, ive learned a lot from this guy, glad I found these videos thanks for posting man.
as I'm getting into running more live sound, I am loving this, thanks for the video Dave Rat
+EventElevator +Dave Rat
Thank you gentlemen for taking the time and energy to produce this excellent video interview. And Special thanks to Dave for doing this even though he seemed to be exhausted. It provided great insight as to why Dave works the way he does. 👍
His consistent passion for the craft always inspires me. Thank you for this.
Interesting concepts about bass management and stereo subs. Thanks for sharing your knowledge.
subtlety drops a flex on how he 3D printed some faders so he can control left and right side EQs. this guy is awesome
And this video was posted in 2016! I'm not sure how many people knew what a 3D printer was at that point. I didn't.
What a great interview, thanks for sharing. Lots of great insights and knowledge. Cheers
wow, that was really engaging and on point.
What a guy! He explains things so clearly too.
Thanks for the vid. Really enjoyed it.
It's funny to see people criticize the fact that the channels are not labeled or that Dave doesn't remember exactly what this or that compressor does. During a show, you can clearly see what every mic is doing, where the bass is or where the snare is. And if you look closely, you'll notice different colors for some faders or simple visual tricks like that.
And clearly, when you're doing 200+ show with a band, you KNOW where your channels are and how your setup is made, it becomes as instinct.
So Dave, thank you for taking time to explain all that, it was very instructive...
Arthur Lauth and not only that, he knows his instrument. Love that example he used.
I don't know anything about sound engineering but I still find this video very cool to watch.
Such a great vision of the work. Very cool to hear from the guys who make it all sound so good. Love the little rat stickers on your gear......
I love this guy. He does his thing with confidence and it ALWAYS makes so much sense. Thank you dave!
Saw RHCP live at the London O2, and on my way out found a dave rat sticker on the floor, such a great souvenir of the show :D
It took me sometime to get used to his style of explaining his thought process, but now I do like his approach very much and am gaining insight from his knowledge
Love Engineers who are on the analogue train. I am a young engineer myself, but love working analogue. That rack makes me drool.
the grass is always greener on the other side. and contrary to belief if you have done this work most of your life and your around 50 years old your body reminds you. there are also medical bills that may accompany you. It's a small few who don't have much labor to do before mixing a show or after.
I spent most of my life mixing analog also till the last 5 or 6 years. If I was touring with one act and did the same show everytime I would go back analog in a heart beat. But now days gigs where there is not much time to setup or tear down and can't pay for the extra man power digital makes the most sense.
And yes sometimes the other side is better.
i was scared of digital til i bought a UI12, now i cant imagine going back to analogue desks. when dave mentioned his spare graphic, i kinda scoffed and said 'nice if you can afford it' ...then i remembered ive the UI (which is now in my studio because of covid 19) and opened my aux sends to check and would you believe all outputs have their own graphic...well il be a shit sandwich...indeed, my UI's digital sims are like the trial versions of real deal analogue gear, but back when i used analogue desks i hadnt even the equivalent of a trial version for things like RTA, 6 graphic EQs, compression and limiting, amp modelling.
I did not know about Dave Rat. Now i know and i respect him a LOT. Amazing video, thank you for sharing it.
super rich interview.. thank you!!!
Thanks for sharing your knowledge Dave much appreciated!!
It was great to get to work with Dave in the 1980's. We just uploaded a mix from 1987 at the Embassy Hotel, with the Red Hot Chili Peppers. We mic'd the monitors as plan b, our set up had tech difficulties. This project was authorized by the bands management at the time (LGM). Rat Sound was there for some great shows.
Dave is the rare sound engineer who admittedly isn’t there to “make” you sound “good”. Rather, he’s trying to disappear from the process both audibly and even visually. I love everything about his approach, focused on, as he said, connecting the band to the audience. When I saw one Lexicon and one Eventide, I knew this was my kind of sound guy. It’s a shame this approach is rare; most live engineers seem to want to hype everything and are in love with their gear, especially their subs. The result is often smeared and wooly.
Amazing words from Dave. Thanks!
Dave Rat is so accessible to recognize his workflow and passion for creativity. I love it.
Dave is always inspiring great interview
Dave Rat is a genius. The way that his mixing philosophy translates into his gear selection is brilliant, and I love the way he’s not only adapted his gear to solve practical problems, but to remove distractions from making pure musical decisions in the moment.
Super helpful, practical, insightful. Great perspective, thanks!
His youtube channel is straight GOLD. This guy knows so much about audio, it's almost scary.
Dave is awesome Audio Crew Chief/Sound Engineer ! legendary! This is what you call perfection -"Primary focus is to connect the Artist with Audience " Take Console out .. No board lights, no labels on console, "I wrote the mic chart I know where things are .. "
I remember seeing Black Flag at Wabash hall in San Diego in 1985. The band started playing "Slip It In" as soon as the bass/ drums intro went in to the guitar part the whole building went dark and the amps went quiet. Rat sound blew the place up!
Great to see an all analog sound engineer. Awesome!! Pure rock and roll!!
This is exactly how I imagined the FOH engineer for RHCP, Ween, Primus, etc. would act. LOL
I like very much what he sais about being an audince member at around 3:48. I always advice FoH engeneers to step aside for couple of times, leave the console a couple of meters an be among the audiance. Most of the time they run back with on their face: "what the f have I done".
What a fantastic way to work ! Cheers Dave !
Under 2 minutes & I already like Dave. That's all it takes, thank you Dave =)
Great interview. I like hearing the method to his madness :)
This is a masterclass. This guy's the real deal. I love his youtube channel videos
Amazing interview!!!
I've never met Dave Rat but I feel like I know this guy already. I could listen to him talk about this stuff for hours. It's nice to see genuine people who know their craft and are passionate in this world.
Brilliant as ever. Thank you
I remember Dave as one of most friendly and talented FOH engineers around. That goes back to Belgium, summer of 1996... ;-)
I saw his last show with the chili peppers last weekend. I wonder why he left. Emotional performance.
He had been doing it for 20 years, and he was ready to get off the road life and spend time with his family.
He's still very active, does Coachella etc, but he quit doing world tours constantly.
you are incredible than the other sound engineer ive seen . damn so humble on interview but man life is continous learning swithching to electronic from analog nothing will dissapear in fact it makes life easier and improve your knowledge. god bless you man
Pinks Garage. Now there is a flashback. The sound company I worked for did quite a few gigs there including Nirvana.
I saw the bands first ever UK show in a small club in West London called the Mean Fiddler. I'd never heard of them, but a singer I was recording with had some kind of thing going with Flea when she was living back in LA & persuaded me to go. I remember a spectacular opening, then disaster half way through the second song as Hillel Slovak passes out & is carried off stage.
They carry on as a three piece, & it's still one of the most amazing live shows i've seen in my life. i don't know many bands that could have carried that off, but that rhythm section is all you need to get a groove on.
I could literally listen to this guy all day.
I agree with Dave, I like analogue mixing more than digital. although digital is way more compact in effects and cabling, the chance is bigger that you get lost in your table with the routing. With an analogue mixer every button from your vocal to the pa is 'touchable'. But I will definitely have to use digital desks in the future, so I better start working with them...
Dave Rat is a great guy, he knows so much about audio. for the ones who don't know his channel, you should really check it out. with every video that i've watched from Dave, I learned more. His way of thinking makes sense to me, because my way of thinking is exactly the same. Thanks!
love his humbleness and hes incredible
No labels ? F...ing genius! My respect!
great video... thanks for making it... :)
Awesome info...thanks Dave.
Hard to imagine that there would be any room for improvement, both from a sound design standpoint and his approach to mixing. Mighty good gear selections too. There's no substitute for years on the road.
Hopefully one day I’ll be able to meet you Dave you’re the best
graph's custom fader links are the bomb
This is so awesome, learning so much from him! I have a question related to the video specs, how did you guys captured his voice, I see a lav but how did you guys managed to get his voice so clean imagining the noice of the place? Thanks!
Absolute confidence in his output mix, makes most changes on the GEQ... Just how I used to do it!
at 4:01 .... this comment is legendary
Hi! Greetings Dave.. I have seen your videos for a long time, I love to learn from you all the time! I have mixed famous Mexican/Latin bands for some years now, and I can tell they have a different experience with me, because I wanted to bring the studio quality sound to the live shows, where the band sounds better then the CD, or the original Recorded mix! That is always my goal, I could never go back to analog, but sometimes I just mix a small 4-8 channel mixer and that is not how I started in this business!! I wanted to learn how to record my drums and a band, but I always loved audio(SPEAKERS) more then playing drums! And fixing computers was my job at the time, and I had to learn how to use all the ins and outs of the audio interfaces at the time, and most important how to use a VST properly! but I started Recording analog RCA out to LR in to a PC, I could already set up a full PA by my self, at that time as well, learning tones, and keys and harmonics, sub low and all kinds of frequencies, and that is what I ended up Mastering in any situation! its how to make it sound sonically and make that spiritual connection with music! Thanks for the video! I am happy to see this kind of content!
Very refreshing..... we all get to caught up these days on what the graphics/ numbers and values on our consoles are telling us. I think i liked it better when i just turned the knobs and couldn't see the numbers. Makes me want to have back my H3000 and external outboard gear,
The Chili Peppers are fortunate to have you on their team. You don't last that many years unless you get along with people. A sign of your skills and character. Hope to see the 'Rat' name on a set of concert speakers in the future.
Interesting approach with the desk sideways and unlabled or lit, must be doing something right if he's in the upper echelon of live sound engineering. Thank you for the analogue desk too... love it
Dave is to smart ! I love his videos
If you have a line of subs next to each other, you will create a broad wave front travelling through the room. It makes sense to sum all the bass into one mono bus, because this will actually minimize spatial interferences.
You have to have a continuous line all the way across the stage to do that though, and that doesn't give you good coverage if there are people to the side of the stage, which there often are in stadiums. Watch some of his other videos, he has definitely considered every setup.
Setting up sideways...brilliant! Also, I gave up on board lights years ago because I wanted to fade into the background and not be too obvious as a mixer.
I just can't agree more with the approach.(Maybe it's an age thing!) But /keeping instruments to set channel inputs/consistent signal chain flow/colour id/consistent sends for outboard and positioning of outboard gear, become inherent. Looking at the band as you alter faders/outboard fx without going through menu's/pages and the distraction from the focus on the band is something I think is severely overlooked.
I setup a karaoke machine to my surround sound so I can def relate to this guy.
If a guitar player can play without looking at their hands, I can play without looking at the board right?
Shxt I love this guy. I dont care what they call you, this is your instrument and you sir are a true musician!
Every time people ask me if I play an instrument I go well... I decided to concentrate on playing sound.
I was asked a few days ago what instrument I play, and I replied "all of them!" and then sent a picture of the sound board I had been running the day before lol
=="All this equipment is not why im here... the reason im here is to connect the artist with the audience"==
=="If a guitar player can play without looking at the guitar... i can mix without looking at the mixer"==
What an amazing in depth explanation of process, procedure and philosophy. (Get it dialed in, then dont fuck with it. Don't jump at every new toy that comes to market.) And dont think digital is better because its easier. That's just fucking lazier. Not better.
I love the simplistic, basic, mostly analog approach. Any band would be lucky to have this guy on the console.
bloody marvellous ! THX
Good information.
I dont know if Dave responds to these comments but I have a question do you also use different microphone types on your stereo paired stuff like guitar in reference to sending right and left different information to avoid comb filtering and other usual
Nice video! But what would Bob McCathy say to this PASystem-Rack? :-P
Salt of the Earth guy. Love it. And who needs to know all the knobs, That's awesome! Rock On Bro!!!
Dave, when using one effect for vocals and instruments, how do you handle the sub-group routing? Do you just route the effect straight to the LR bus? I find myself using multiple verbs just so I can route to the proper sub-group.
How he relates to the physicality and muscle memory of analogue, versus scrolling and searching for buried pages/windows in digital...I thought I was the only one who felt that way. I wonder if he still does it that way--or at least did it that way pre-covid.
He has his own channel and such, and he does a lot with digital now (including tearing apart digital consoles to see how well built they are inside lol), and as he said here, he used analog at this point because that's what he was used to, but now he uses digital because he runs different kinds of shows, festivals and such, and you need digital if you are running multiple bands etc.
So he had no issues with the transition, it just depends on the needs of the show.
I respect his decision to stay analog, it’s almost artistic in itself
Respect for using an analogue console without labels!
absolutely amazing Video. one question. does anybody know where to find this "slider" for the board? i have never find one
25:00 great commentary about L' but also about striving for a rubric night in and night out. Very interesting.
"Stereo round things of metal"
What did he mean when he said that?
@@daman7387 Literally every round metal piece of percussion. So cymbals mostly but they also have some weird auxillary stuff sometimes.
@@daman7387 Cymbals?
@@daman7387he divides drums into snare, toms, kick, and round things made of metal.
So snares, hi hat, etc.
Basically it's being funny, but also it defines the sound that they make.