POP CULTURE: Pop and Philosophy
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- čas přidán 22. 03. 2016
- Pop music and philosophy would seem, at first glance, to have little to say to one another. But in fact the latter has a lot to learn from the former.
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"If you want someone to believe your lies, set them to music." - Peter Goldsworthy, Maestro.
mm
damn :/
"If you want to sound smart, put some random quotes from random people." - tnt ntn
+Christopher Epperson
Could there be another version of this: if you want people to believe your truths, set them to music. Music intensifies the communication. It can be harnessed by liars or by truth tellers.
Do you mean the medium of which we espouse the lie or what do you mean, I'm just trying to clarify the question.
It's fucking impossible to focus, when there's music in the background!!!..... Do I have ADD?
+tomtebre I was doing okay until Katy Perry showed up, and then I was lost for the entire rest of the video.
+John Paul Hansen those were the two reasons that distracted me as well
+tomtebre I completely zoned out for 2 minutes til i relized that i zoned out!
+Carlos Luque LOL You know what's up XD
+tomtebre Had to rewind and close my eyes in order to focus on the words/thoughts. Goes to show how well those videos are made and what they're designed to do i.e. give me a temporary lobotomy
I'm worried this video won't stay up due to copyright claims.
+The School of Life We all know how often that doesnt work out
+The School of Life Lately that hasn't been respected.
+The School of Life KEK
And then someone claims it and it either goes down, get's banned in countries or you don't get money out of it, cause the system is broken.
+Randal Skefingtonidis
its n0t br0ken, it w0rks exactly h0w they want it t0... they can n0w take away the incentives 0f the c0ntent they d0n't want pe0ple t0 see... cenc0rship at its finest
calholli
IMO, it doesn't work, cause even "they" don't know how they want ti to work.
I like how you can just detect the smallest hint of disdain in his voice haha
+Liam Johnson
I hear it too ;-)
But maybe just because I kind of want it to to be there.
+The School of Life And, again, this is why you will never be as popular as any of the pop stars in your video.
+infovideo the moment when The School Of Life becomes as popular as the music videos in this video is probably the moment they start going downhill in actual quality
+Ossie N Their advice, not mine.
exactly.
Strange combination of music and that voice,i completely zoned out..
Dude the music is louder than your voice
+Alec Ramsey Good. I hate the narrators voice. He goes for "rather soothing and still engaging" only to end up with "condescendingly paternal and annoyingly over-enunciated".
+Alec Ramsey Which is VERY distracting.
Bro that's not true
napalmdreams haha 😂
That was the point, it proved something important about pop music
Oh man this guy has way too much faith in humanity, i do not see pop embracing deep philosophical ideas any time soon.
+Pheene Z My reaction too. Alain gives the benefit of the doubt to pop. But, actually, I don't think he believes it's going to happen.
Aside from exceptions like Pharrell Williams, I think this is giving the genre too much credit. Also, Alan Watts is the man
Alas, you have to bear in mind the purpose of this channel is to GIVE people faith, but there no reason to have faith in something that just wants your money, nothing more. These corporations will overthrow the government as soon as an apocalypse starts. They use high-paid lawyers to "technicalities" their way out of every scenario. If the wealthy have more power to escape justice, then the justice system is corrupt, and it is essentially owned by these people. How do you think Disney were able to get away with breaking their promuse to Robin Williams. Who do you think has the money to bribe editors of websites and Wikipedia to rewrite history to favour them and cover up their dirty deeds? *Cough, I mean sorry, I meant, uh- "technicalities"* 🤣😂 I wonder if they do something worse. Do you think that Disney, and other corporations got into power by playing by the rules? Aw School of Life I admire you but you overestimate the nobleness of here businesses. Many of the companies you love today used slavery back when it was legal. Do you think they'd hesitate to use whoever they saw fit if the government collapsed?
Trust me, there are some good people out there who managed to get into power without any dirty influence, but even we can't tell who these people are ant who were keeping rich. They only show us what they want to see, and that's the problem with how people are nowadays.
Some songs already do..
Have you ever noticed how many people came out of their closet since early 2010s and how much LGBTQ people easily express themselves to other people if you compare it to the old days
But what an accident ,Lady Gaga came with Born this way album in 2011 and since then nothing was same in pop culture, spreading the idea and message that being different and weird is okay😊
And many other artists who sacraficed their image and made themselves controversial because of ideas they were spreading in their music
Pop can truley be impowering and disspowering its on artist to chose
But why are you here? On youtube, a channel that gas 5Million subscribers... That is pop
Isn't the whole point of philosophy to rely on logic and good arguments alone to win people over? Isn't being bewitchingly charming in order to get your idea across seen as manipulative for philosophy or something?
+Acquavallo I think OPs video is way off base
+Acquavallo I think people would love to see a new Plato who twerks.
Acquavallo, I think the school of life is attempting to show that philosophers need to learn about transmitting their ideas through more channels. Although it can be seen as manipulative it is important that the public understand or at least hear the ideas of philosophers. When many members of the public hear "philosopher" they think old man with old ideas who sits around and wonders about life. However as you surely know philosophers are everywhere and each and everyone can be there own. The idea is to be bewitchingly charming to get the important ideas of philosophy into the public eye. In our modern day we suffer from an over crowded media with everything fighting for our attention, a person with some astonishing ideas is unlikely to win that fight. However music and more specifically pop always seems to find a way to win. So mixing the two might be our best chance at getting philosophical ideas to the kinds of the public.
+Acquavallo I think causing emotions inside someone is a form of manipulation but is it all "bad"? if you feel like its manipulating then it probably is. Also, look at any form of marketing its based on persuasion aka Manipulation. we live in a world of manipulation. Now the question is can manipulation be a good thing? I say yes but one needs a strong moral compass to stay the path.
+Acquavallo Think about it like this: Do you remember Schoolhouse Rock? The School of Life is basically proposing pop music should be The Schoolhouse Rock of Life (which would be an awesome band name.)
Sure, an idea's memorability is no sign of its truth value, an excellent fallacy to remember. However, shouldn't that be even more the reason to double check our stories and songs for their truth and write ones based on them?
"The highest goal of music is to connect one's soul to their Divine Nature, not entertainment"-Pythagoras
This was the most unintentionally depressing video i have ever seen
+Malakhi “Malaman” Reynolds
What is it in this video that you find depressing?
@@cimmik hopelessness
I avoid pop like the plague. It just makes me feel so dirty, especially corporately owned pop stars. It just doesn't have that personal feeling that I can find elsewhere
+pcakes maybe you haven't found the right song for you yet
Nha Phan Dinh no trust me I have found tons of songs that I absolutely love
Listen to some good psych folk
For example?
Yellow Jelly I'll list some of my favorite artists
Big Bad Voodoo Daddy, some Squirrel Nut Zippers,
I like Beastie Boys and Charizma and Peanutbutter Wolf, Sugarhill Gang, Salt n Pepa (well, like 2 of their songs),
Caravan Palace, DJ Yoda, Mariachi El Bronx, Caro Emerald, In-Grid, Brian Setzer, Nappy Roots...
If that's not enough and you want me to make a long list of specific songs say so
I dare say that Marina and the Diamonds is a great example of the way that pop can be infused with philosophy and the other way around. She is self-aware of the power of pop, and utilises it to express deep truths. Her songs have a multitude of meaning, and in her latest album she took on the endeavour of writing the whole thing herself (incredibly rare in the genre of pop), and worked with only 1 producer. Give her a listen if you're interested in pop/philosophy.
So basically, philosophy needs to learn marketing, crowdsourcing and the ability to summarise.
+Akira Lee (Kuro Lee) That's just what philosophy is not about
Paul J. Ruiz I'd rather not get into this argument of nostalgia-fueled romanticism vs ruthless practicality at the moment.
I'm guessing I'm nostalgia-fueled romanticism and you're ruthless practicality?
Paul J. Ruiz Perhaps? But I hope you're taking from the word "ruthless" that there is no right answer, because there isn't. I do perfectly understand the fear of losing the essence of the message, of corrupting it through simplification. Our only difference is that I see the fading of philosophy into obscurity through loss of interest and pure media saturation as a greater threat.
+Akira Lee (Kuro Lee) That's what philosophy is all about... understanding the complexity of the simpleness and the other way around
The song that's probably had the most widespread impact on Western Society is the alphabet song.
pop tends to attract people who I believe have many undesirable character traits. In fact, I look to philosophy as a refuge against it. I don't believe philosophy needs pop to survive. Dry, academic pastimes such as mathematics and science have continued to expand not by pandering to techniques used by pop culture, but because there's a need for them. There will always be a need for philosophy, however small.
I'm sure these words are heedless to those who feel the need to craft a brand and expand it to wider audiences, such as the school of life. I don't think I can blame them, however. Businesses thrive on profits, not integrity; they have every reason to take this viewpoint. I also have every reason to be against their viewpoint because I am a classical musician
+Greg Moberg What you say is right. I too, took refuge against pop. But at the same time , the school of life is doing exactly what the video suggests: Making philosophy charming and short to absorb. Looking at the result I'd say its a good thing.
what gets absorbed, though? Compare this video to an hour long lecture by a competent philosophy professor
+Greg Moberg I absolutely agree. Any attempt to explain complex philosophical ideas to the point where at least 90% would understand them necessarily will distort and dumb them down. I see no reason whatsoever to sacrifice the quality of philosophy to it's popularity? And what comes next? Bach? Mozart? Shakespeare? If the price of Bach's music is that it is understood by less people then Bieber or Katy Perry, I think it's a price we should be glad to pay.
+Greg Moberg To play devils advocate, science had figures like Carl Sagan, Bill Nye and Neil Tyson, while math has channels on youtube such as numberphile.
Though I would agree the idea that philosophy would die unless it amalgamates pop is quite off the mark, it's not like all other forms of music have just died off.
+Nika Zardiashvili But not at all. You don't need to dumb anything down, the idea is just to show the more attractive side of philosophy or science to a person and perhaps they will eventually find their way into it, as they become more and more interested. What you said about Bach's music is, by the way, pretty elitist.
sorry but the music is so loud 😐😕😓😓
I think that's the point , it's so powerful that it can take our attention even when we are trying to learn from the narrators teaching , like I'm struggling to write this message listening to both the background music and the narrator
+Erick Rothwell 😂
It is certainly an interesting concept and I am not inherently opposed to the idea. However I would ask the question, is pop music so popular and effective because it does not attempt to broach difficult subjects like philosophy does. Perhaps the limits of pop are that it can not deal with complex or difficult issues, instead being a means of expressing very simple and ultimately shallow things. In the same way one would not use a hammer to fell a tree perhaps pop is ill suited to deal with deep issues. Hopefully I am wrong .
Strong argument. Love seeing such reasonable comments on this site.
Maybe one day we'll get there man. Actually, we already have a few great songs which deal with lofty topics. For example, "Time in a bottle" by Jim Croce.
+Pranay K Doesn't the popularity of songs like "do they know it's christmas time" and "where is the love" demonstrate that pop listeners don't mind songs about real issues?
+Cherian Johny Thanks for the kind words. Like most things it will probably happen very slowly and gradually.
+Pranay K Pop is called pop because it's popular, unfortunately ideas like philosophy are not popular at the moment. The question becomes will pop music make philosophy popular or will philosophy make pop music unpopular. Perhaps if the ideas espoused by philosophy are gradually integrated into pop it will be more widely accepted, and eventually will be able to tackle more complex issues.
***** So you're saying that there's a sort of threshold- songs that say "poverty is bad" in a shallow way are fine but when they get in depth enough to be useful people will be turned off? You could be right- I don't think there's a way of knowing that without it happening.
On a side note I'm positive you've heard that song- it's the one about Africa that Live Aid wrote that gets played every christmas!
wow, i'm amazed by how many snobs there are in the comments. lighten up man. even if pop songs seem shallow, you can't deny the tremendous pull and influence they have.
+wynngoes my problem isn't necessarily that they endorse pop, its the way they speak disparagingly against "high" art near the end of the video. They describe it as pedantry and overly concerned with subtlety. Its hard to get on board with a message like that when you're depending on "high" art as your profession and something that plays a central role in your life.
+Greg Moberg well okay but why is it hard? jw
Marshall Lee lmao
Angus Pritchard Depends how you look at my comment I guess.
philosophy is the love of wisdom.. perhaps a finalized wise expression can expressed in a simple way.. while arriving to that wise thought took a lot of deep thinking.. and so one could argue that the reason for pop's success is precisely because it lacks any deep thoughts.. the music is easy to digest.. so even if the lyrics in pop songs were made up of wise sayings.. it is possible to have everyone in that society repeat all these wise expressions without actually understood why they are true or how they are true.. they may even claim to love wisdom but in actuality fail to understand the true nature of wisdom.. and when that generation has children and needs to pass down this wisdom.. and the children all ask "but.. why?" every parent will have to admit ignorance.. and reply "just because" the next generation would be suspicious of listening to wisdom.. and if such a generation would ever to exist.. whatever power they had deriving from democracy would quickly be taken away..
Right, so philosophy should take its cues from pop by being undemanding, intellectually vacant, and generally more commercial, charming the public with attractive faces who need not have actually written the stuff. What a novel idea, let's do with philosophy what Starbucks did with coffee: devise a brand/product for people who don't necessarily like the base product - coffee - but who somewhere in their little pea brains like the idea of coffee, sufficiently so to pay up to 10 bucks for a product so laden with sugar, chocolate, and whatnot as to be unable to taste the offensive coffee. It's called commodification, but I guess this is the niche The School of Life is hoping to fill. You do realise that 'pop' proper comprises actual artists like David Bowie, Morrissey, Kate Bush - to name a few of my favourites - and not just the Pharrell Wiliamses and Katy Perrys of this world, whose success has probably less to do with artistic merit than with marketing budgets.
+Arno Theadorno Philosophy should learn to convey messages in the way pop industry usually does. This is, transforming what could be considered a tedious to understand idea, into a concise, intuitive, enjoyable, easy to grasp, short (meaning available to the busy lives of the majority) message. In the same sense, POP should learn from philosophy the joy of the complex and important ideas for a better life, so it resorts less to the
superficially sensational but deeply empty ideas it usualy uses as cornerstones for its music/videos, that end up being attractive not because of the message, but because they are delivered alongside a beautiful and very persuasive explosion of music and images.
Your comment has me thinking of the 'too many notes' scene in Amadeus, where the Emperor lauds Mozart's work, even though he feels there are 'too many notes'. Do you have any particular works of philosophy in mind that could do with the 'tedious' ideas contained therein rephrased into an easy to grasp, intuitive and enjoyable form? Has it ever occurred to you that the difficulty of philosophical texts has to do with the philosophical undertaking - which far from offering readers simple ideas on a silver platter like some yummy bonbons, involves grappling with the fundamental substance of ideas, language, reality itself? Nothing wrong with making 5 minute videos 'explaining' Heidegger to a lay audience per se, but you don't seriously believe you're getting the same thing as you would from working through Being and Time, do you?
Arno Theadorno Indeed. Original works can not be substituted by videoclips, but for being interested in reading "tedious" philosophical texts, a little 5 minute video can make wonders to set your mood. Even AFTER reading those texts and understanding little to nothing, a 5 minute video can suddenly feel like the epiphany you needed to just grasp the concept. I hope you get my point.
Oto Kage I agree that simplification and reduction can serve as a gateway to further study, sure. Learning in general involves working from the general to the particular and just to be clear: I'm not some elitist who thinks we should revere the primary texts and dismiss all attempts at making these more accessible as a form of philosophical heresy.
HOWEVER, I don't think everything is necessarily for everyone and take issue with the assumption rampant in our consumer culture that everything 'should' be simple to understand, instantly fun like a video game, preferably not exceeding more than 400 words per unit. I mean I can understand if reading or actually thinking don't rank highly on your list of fun, enjoyable activities - but then why bother with philosophy?
The answer, of course, is that shrewd entrepreneurs like Alain de Botton and The School of Life have recognised the market potential in consumers who might be convinced 'wisdom' may be had for the price of a strawberry mochaccino.
Arno Theadorno Hahaha. Well, don't know about the marketing strategies of TSoLife. But as a teacher (biology, not philosophy :)) I can say students too often see philosophy as a tedious remote subject. They feel absolutely disconected from it. Of course, if they knew Taylor Swift is doing some Plato on her new videoclip, they would be more interesting in the subject and it would serve as an invaluable introduction to it. Why bother with philosophy? Well you don't get a chance to "bother" or "not bother", everyone is doing some philosophy in their dayaday without noticing, and that's why it is such a shame that people feel so disconected from philosophy. Not to mention that to truly know yourself, and by extension to be happy, you need a good dose of philosophy, don't you? :)
Yet another battle of dualistic ideas in my head- resolved. Yet another confusion about being born in this era- addressed. This channel not only helped me save my relationship with its rational videos on love, it also helped me to deal with depression by showing me how normal and understandable it is. You guys always manage to stay clear, respectful, compassionate towards human beings and draw in an audience with genuinely interesting content. Favourite channel ever.
Psychology -> Marketing -> Propaganda -> Pop
Historical Materialism in the 20th Century.
AKA PURE IDEOLOGY
+Randal Skefingtonidis HAHA YES
*sniff sniff*
Materiallism ?
What
will you ever do a video on the pros and cons of the underground and the mainstream?
+Jep Hep Yes, do this please
Cons of underground is that its going to be forgotten and nobody is going to remember because it didnt have big affect on mass like pop has
And tbh underground artist who hate pop artists are just jelaous because their words arent being heard and arent reaching mass like pop does
They all secretly wish to be admired to be hated to be pop
You cant escape it, once they make it from underground to certain popularity they just became part of pop culture
Same thing with young rebellious artist who started on soundcloud today just to become pop tommorow
Same applies for Billie Eilish,Avril Lavinge,David Guetta which were all underground artists at some point
What an irony, right
I dont know why people who listen to old school rock think they listen way better music and are more smart than us who listen to pop
I mean even Beatels songs in 60s were considered a pop music
Because they were popular but since years go people start to notice difference betwene 60s and 80s so they decided to call it rock
And good side of pop is it has more topics,lyrics,geners,artists,way better music video production and it is way more fluent ideas and experimental than rock
Thats why rock died
Simply you can call it natural selection in music
Pop is never the same and it is constantly shapeshifting thats why it survives and it is never boring to be amazed by something new
I'm not listening what the guy is saying with all these music in the background.
www.thebookoflife.org/philosophy-and-pop/ text form!
A few months ago I met a guy who was a PhD student in philosophy here in Germany. So I told him that the philosopher from whom I have learnt the most was Alain de Botton ( the founder of this channel.) This is what he said:
-Oh yes, that "pop philosopher"...
I see it as a compliment since it is a great achievement to get to that point as a philosopher, but of course he meant it in a very condescending way.
How interesting: as a musician, the more listeners you have, the more successful you are considered to be. But in the eyes of these academics, as a philosopher, the more lives you touch, the more people you help to live better, the less venerable you become. So if people "understand" what you are saying, it is already bad for you! May be you aren't all that brilliant in the end!
This is a very sick and dangerous mindset, but I could not explain it to that boy. Believe me I can have a conversation with anybody, because I love people, but these folks are very hard to communicate with. Arrogance is blinding. Both in Turkey and here I met some philosophers with their fancy degrees from top universities, and to put it mildly, they were not very inspiring people at all.
There is an excellent article about this on the The Book of Life ( the brain of this channel). Just search for:
"Why so Many Love the Philosophy of the East - and so Few That of the West"
Unfortunately we don't have many pop philosophers yet, but for now, at least we have great musicians who have the depth of a philosopher!
Brazilian genius Antonio Carlos Jobim for example, sings " Das Gerede" ( the chatter) and " Das Nichts" ( the nothing) that we know from Heidegger, in a wonderful Samba!!
"There's so many people who can talk and talk and talk
And just say nothing or nearly nothing
I have used up all the scale I know
and at the end I've come to nothing
I mean nothing"
When Doc Watson sings " And am I born to die", his words about death are not less profound than Seneca's:
And am I born to die?
To lay this body down?
And must my trembling spirit fly
Into a world unknown,
A land of deepest shade,
Unpierced by human thought,
The dreary regions of the dead,
Where all things are forgot?
I also wanted to add a little list of the "singing philosophers" I love the most. Their songs helped me just as much as the philosophers I have read:
Alkinoos Ioannidis ( Greece)
Atahualpa Yupanqui ( Argentina)
Lenine, Chico Buarque, Toquinho, Vinicius de Moraes, A.C. Jobim ( Brazil)
Victor Jara, Violetta Parra ( Chile )
Sezen Aksu, Asik Daimi, Asik Veysel ( Turkey )
Daniel Viglietti ( Uruguay)
Paco Ibanez ( He sings the poems by Garcia Lorca and many other great Spanish poets!)
Thank you very much for this very important lesson!
+Lua Veli
Here is the link for the article from The Book of Life, that I've mentioned:
www.thebookoflife.org/east-and-west-philosophy/
Nicely said! I understand the disdain for pop and popular things in general. I get that if you study dense texts for thousands of hours you want to feel that you know more than the average person. That you spent your time on more significant things while somebody else enjoyed the "pop" stuff. There's a petty sense of resentment!
I think to close the gap between high-philosophy and an everyday person is to consider what this video is saying. There should be an easier way to get at philosophy. One that might appeal to people less severe about philosophy and take it less seriously. Pop is a medium that definitely has a lot to offer in this aspect. It's zeroed in on what people naturally like.
If people learn philosophy through something they naturally like, I'm sure there'd be much less resentment. It'd be a much more positive force.
+Vincent Xi
Hello there Vincent! Thanks a lot for reading and for your message! I
think the way those people show off, has much to do with their
insecurities rather than their deep knowledge or wisdom. Indeed the more you know, the more humble you should become. A good teacher would show you that philosophy is extremely important, but he would find the way to explain it all to you, and he would make you feel that you have the capacity to grasp these ideas and to live by them. Have you watched Alain's documentaries on his other youtube channel? I am sure you would like them very much. Search for "Alain de Botton, Schopenhauer" for example.All the best!
Thank you so much for this very important comment ❤️
@@suryaprabhatpali3013 You are most welcome! Thanks a lotf or takiong the time to read
Amazing video guys! this is eye-opening. What I get from this is that, generally, people prefer emotions over messages, feeling is easier than thinking
In most instances (there are some exceptions) pop music is interested in nothing else than selling pop music to make money, which is pretty much the way of the world these days, the purpose behind everything, including the School of Life. You may have hopes and goals beyond the monetary, but first and foremost, you have to make money to continue your enterprise. This impetus for the creative act isn't, of course, new, even if it has greatly increased under capitalism. Shakespeare wrote his plays for monetary reasons. What sometimes happens along the way is that in the process of doing that, a few rare souls actually create something deep and profound, something that goes beyond mere profit. A great deal of what we revere today and study in school as a "classic" was the pop culture or folk culture of its era. For this reason I don't like distinctions between high culture and pop culture. Such a distinction isn't a valid one.
+Jan96106 You REALLY need to make your last 3 sentences a separate comment of their own. And shorten the last 2 sentences into one.
+Jan96106 Why are you assuming that making profits => not deep and profound?
And yes, of course 'popular' and 'classical' are time-dependent, or even, location dependent. So what is wrong with using them? It is as fine as using 'past', 'present' and 'future' terms.
I feel that you're making the mistake of assuming that everyone wants to be an intellectual and can think on a deeper level. People don't listen to pop to learn or gain something. They listen to be entertained, to forget about their lives, and to drown out the world around them. I get that you're saying that philosophy needs a simplicity to it to appeal to more individuals, but this really does not fit. If you look at pop from a musical standpoint, it is essentially more simplistic in structure, versus say a symphony. I applaud your attempt to try and hold pop up higher as something to learn from, but really any possible things you could pull from it we have already learned, like making something more exciting and visually appealing to drive a point home.
+Scumbagel Pop only wants our money. And it has gotten it, again and again all over again.
+Scumbagel This video confuses its argument by failing to define 'pop' which could taken either as chart-pop or popular music as a whole which would be anything that isn't classical or at a push jazz. If the latter definition is true there is a wide scope in which 'pop' can be used intellectually and many artists do. I think a lot of the problems with pop's intellectual laziness comes from a similar laziness on the part of academia and even cultural criticism to engage with it on a higher level, there can be transformation without a proper discourse.
"Lacking in ultimate ambition..." Cue hotline bling being played in the background😂😂😂
And then comes Nicki Minaj and this video becomes pointless
+XtrAMassivE Nonono, you misunderstand, Nicki is a TRUE feminist! If you don't agree you are racist!111!!!!!1
+Sugar Addict Right? xD Stupid and immature people wasting the good ideas of feminism and anti-racism! These words are thrown around too often that it's lost some value!
+XtrAMassivE I think Nicki Minaj is attractive.
BigD Obviously you have a right to do so.
I think that pop is more of a mirror, the minds behind it know their audience and what speaks to people and the core success of it is that it is what it is - a mirror of the social contemporary, no more and no less, therefore it is borderline impossible for pop music to say something beyond very basic ideas.
+Kobi Tzarfati 99% of the time i'd say you're right
Do yall even know what pop is?
Literally there have been many pop songs in the past that have complex ideas or that challenge the brain.
One inherent problem with this is that pop will deliberately shut down any songs that work against the current social moment of the time.
It is unable to communicate doubt or critical thought on "progress".
Look in the metal genre for examples of non popsicle lyrics.
I agree it's a very good point.
+HaydenHatTrick The reason Metal is not as accepted as pop is because pop strives to be appealing to everyone in its presentation in its presentation while metal doesn't care about presentation as much. There are a fair share of pop music that go against the current social moment. Some examples include Royals by Lorde, All my friends by Snakehips ft Tinashae & Chance the Rapper, Here by Alessia Cara.
+HaydenHatTrick Pop is alienation.
+HaydenHatTrick actually, there have been a lot of pop(ular) songs with critical messages about society, including songs from John Lennon, Michael Jackson and Jamiroquai.
As for the metal genre, to me it often seems like it's alternative for the sake of being alternative, like they look for what is popular or comfortable to listen to and deliberately do the opposite. But that's just my opinion.
+HaydenHatTrick Exactly! That's why heavy metal isn't popular. In fact it's demonised by the media. Anyone who listens to metal is labelled as a "devil-worshipper."
I just realized that Tyler the Creator is in the happy music video
+cali love Holy shit, how could I have missed that? Earl Sweatshirt too
+cali love racist
***** lol I think you need to look up the definition of "racist"
cali love I think you need to look up the definition of "satire", you racist.
Fidde B omg lol how could I have missed them
Pop + Philosophy = Pink Floyd
+Paul Staker pink floyd is rock not pop. No such thing as a philosophical pop band, its all cash grab
+Pixel Animation What a comically narrow world-view.
+Pixel Animation How about bands like Manic Street Preachers, Muse and Coldplay. Manic Street Preachers promote a socialist ideology in their music. But are class as "Brit Pop". While Muse play around with different ideologies in their music.
The Doors, Pink Floyd, Nick Drake, Radiohead, Depeche Mode, RUSH.. Those artists compose good music and at the same time challenge the listener with obscure, innovative, and philosophical lyrics.
so does justin bieber
Now let's see the video on the philosophy in death metal/slam
Pop becoming more profound is a nice hope. The problem is pop occurs because it's what people want: something that drowns out all of life's difficulties and tells us "everything is fine, dance to the cheery song and take a one dimensional view on everything". If all of us were really willing to endeavour for more depth in our lives, pop would be minority music...that and ofcourse because its an industry run by the lawyers rather than the artists...I will still always hope things change though, and in the meantime listen to the small time artists that can teach me something.
when your mind gets carried away with the pop music and supresses the narrator's voice ; that is the influence it possess.
I've subscribed to this channel and watched alot of your videos but I think by far that this has been your strongest and wisest video to date! Keep it up
Thanks! Schooloflife its one of the best and excellently integrated informative clip Ive ever seen , it changes my concerns about pop culture .
Another possibility for the popularity of pop is of course that it is inoffensive and shallow, so that you don't have to think much to consume it. And with philosophy, you actually have to use your brain a bit to understand it, so it will never reach the same appeal as pop.
+Tonton Madness cognitive fluency bias
+John Sykes With the majority of pop topics being constructed around vague, common things, it has a high appeal factor. Couple that with lyrical compositions built around "I, You, He, She, We, They" (simple pronouns, non-specific), then you've got a recipe for easy digestion. It becomes a template for your life that you can pick apart to appease the inarticulate emotions that are often seen every day. I don't know if it's so much a bias as it is a calculable relative specificity of content.
The music was too loud, couldn't really concentrate on what you were saying.
+KinderBueno Bueno
You have hearing damage or bad speakers that can't differentiate the tones & levels.
i have studio monitor headphones, ath-m50x. i'm commenting on the mixing
KinderBueno Bueno
Ok, so definitely not the speakers, but I had no problems differentiating the voice of the narrator from any of the background.
Then again I'm in my 30's and have led an active life of NOT going to concerts (4 in total) or playing music above 65 decibels.
I pride myself on being able to hear actors voices and immediately identifying them, especially in animated productions.
+KinderBueno Bueno I have the ATH-M40x and it's hard for me to concentrate. I'm not sure if it was because it was too loud, or because the familiarity of the songs made me want to sing along or hum to the beat.
One Pop culture that seems to get into some depth of the human condition would be some of mature cartoons (mostly adult swim). The Simpsons, South Park, Family Guy, Rick and Morty, and Venture Bros are some good examples. They are satire for the most part but they can get into some dark parts of of condition and ask some hard question while entertaining us.
Family Gay is just a wanna be Simpsons/SouthPark humour ;P
I am the biggest music fan I ever came across. Not in terms of fan mentality, but in the sense of being able to dig deep into what power music has on the human civilisation. From the Baroque period to the grandeur of classical, romantic and impressionistic music through the decades of popular music's diverse and fascinating development. This video just reinforced my full appreciation of the art of music! Brilliant video!
I'VE BEEN WAITING FOR THIS VIDEO!!!!! I LOVE IT!!!
Hey School of Life! I cherish this channel so much. It's brought me great insight on life and has helped me further progress in my own philosophy and how I look at life as a whole.
I have one BIG request however!! (And recommendation for a future video)
-Will you PLEASE look at how video games and philosophy coincide in meaningful ways. Specifically, there is one puzzle game called "THE TALOS PRINCIPLE" which is a puzzle game that combines philosophy in a very meaningful way. Would you please take a look at the game and video games as a broad or just specifically that one? That game changed how I looked at life too.
That is my main request for this channel, but if you don't oh well, at least I tried. Hopefully this will get liked enough if people agree. :)
This is perhaps the best video so far produced by this channel. Thank you again!
I knew it. A lot of the basic pretentious snobs in the comments section wouldn't get the point this video is trying to make. They deny the genius of pop, only because being anti-pop is sooo cool. This is why zombies are defeating you.
or they... disagree :o gasp what snobs!
you're fucking deluded, girl.
yesssss
Hey exactly was thinking the same. There is nothing wrong about learning from something that is working! I find the content in the video as one of its kind. Brilliant work. On the other hand people are operating with hate towards the truth here. SAD!
wap is sure smart
now *make a video about Black Metal*
Pop is too vapid and distracting to be of much philosophical value. It works as a tool to unite the human spirit on a universal level, but too much of it is throw away, or messages that get completely lost by attention to beat and inattention to the cohesive story of the lyrics (like the we are young song by FUN, which seems to possibly be initiated by referencing domestic abuse, while The Weekend's Can't Feel my Face is about cocaine).
+Danielle Balouise And this is where pop punk comes in where the message is consumable, more directed and hopes to achieve something (at least on the broader scale)
Not true, you people should read on Knaye west being a post modernist, Nicki Minaj being a progressive feminist and dmx being a pessimist. There is allot in pop, many philosophers realize that.
zev piro Ha, individuals that share philosophical musings outside of their music (and admittedly, I've never sat down and read or listened to the full albums of any of these individuals, but I am familiar with their pop releases) is not the same as using their music to spread and institute those ideas. Being a pop artist does not mean that they themselves are vapid. I would not say that at all.
Danielle Balouise Not true, I'd say those artists are all pretty systematic about their ideology. I agree not all pop artists are "philosophers" lol, but saying they don't spread philosophy isn't true. I also don't see how you can want pop to spread philosophy, like would they teach about particular philosophical schools? Heck no, go to college for that. They probably would just spread their dumb ideology, frankly that isn't different from the current pop artists.
zev piro Are you condensing calculated public personas to be all the human they are? Pop artists spread simple philosophy if you're not considering the usage of the word philosophy to mean ideological philosophy, but it's such basic animal instinct philosophy, like love yourself, love the world, heartbreak hurts, I will persist, I want sex, I want fame, here's my fame manifestations if you want what I have. They don't dispense lofty philosophy.
And philosophy absolutely is not and should not be contained to higher education. It's the basis of humanity growing and improving upon itself. These are evident by this channel alone. Philosophy also breeds curiousity, questioning, and critical thinking. Pop music does none of that.
The point isn't being made that pop artists should spread lofty ideological musings, but those that do want to spread lofty philosophy should perhaps take a cue from or even use the pop music medium.
I also don't understand you last sentence inference. Are you saying philosophy is stupid?
Top notch work yet again. This is such a great channel
The only pop artist I know is Bjork. Others like Beyonce, Taylor Swift or Katy Perry don't even write their own songs, they're just famous for their looks.
Bjork is love, Bjork is life
***** amen to that.
/r/lewronggeneration
Rammstein is also great!
Taylor writes her own songs
has the school of life listened to kendrick lamar?
So philosophy is all about the struggle needed to understand life, and it does so in a very personally, emotionally, and intellectually relevant way. Philosophy forces us to exercise our mental abilities, pop does exactly the opposite. Pop relies on flash and glamour, philosophy asks us to see beyond the exterior. I think this is a satirical video, because you're more intelligent than this.
+Omar Ismail Nah man you don't get it. They don't say their the same, thay say that philosophy can learn from pop culture to be more attractive and charming, and pop must learn from philosophy to make itself more deep. After all, it's a school of life
+Adrian Yefremov I understand what is meant, but point remains the majority of people don't like thinking. It's one of the main reasons politics this year is widely viewed by everyone. When politicians like Trump, who in my opinion is very amusing, push ratings up; its because people want to be entertained, not informed. The few of us who actually want to learn are subscribed to channels like this and Nerdwriter1 where there's both knowledge and entertainment. Pop establishes a world where information is not at the core of our interests as a society, and it's widely regarded by all individuals as the essence of what makes us who we are. Literature also took a hit, people are no longer interested in pushing themselves to think. Pop is fundamentally the foundation of today's society. Being a member of this society will, due to influences from childhood, push you towards it. That's dangerous, your abilities are undermined by its prevalence.
I think you define intelligence differently than I do which is why we come to different conclusions. I think we humans as a majority are generally equally intelligent but all creatively different in that we experience alternative perspectives throughout our lives.. why this video fascinates me is because the Internet is creating a "collective consciousness" in that we are now exponentially increasing the amount of similar experiences we all share and pop music just happens to be one of these collective experiences that is widely available and greatly appreciated. Beautiful really, def research "collective consciousness" as it is a magnificent theory =)
I also want to add that pop today is increasing becoming more about sharing ideology about the world, human emotion, and values.. something that is valuable to Philosophy.. the maker of this video probably made this video because he senses this coming to fruition
But then again, I'm just speculating.
I've been expecting this video and welcome it now with open arms.
I feel that in a sense, The School of Life has already learned a lot from pop culture. You make compressed, stylish and compelling films that can be almost as easily digested by a "hormonal teenager" (loved that btw) as a grown man with many years of experience on his back. You keep it simple, yet not stupid, and in my opinion that deserves a lot of praise :)
Never thought I'd see Lizzie McGuire and Drake in a SoL video.
It was hard to focus on the narrator with all the music and how the song changed every 10 seconds.
Indeed. Illustrates the point quite nicely I think.
good observation
** +The School of Life **Another great video, I like how you unflinchingly create a video on a topic and make something like philosophy so interesting and relevant not only in societies but in ourselves. I dreaded watching plato - the forms video because I dislike universals, I was amazed at how much I learned from that video. Again I clicked on this video with the idea. hmm wonder how pop culture has any value even compared to philosophy. Love the surprises and the interesting content.
When Justin Beiber said "You got dat yummy yummy yummy yummy", I felt THAT.
This is what Marina Diamandis represents to me lol
I am normally a very big fan of the School of Life (please keep making your great videos!) but I am a little troubled by the thesis of this one. "Pop" isn't really defined -- there is a vast gap between John Lennon's Imagine and Britney Spears' Hit Me Baby One More Time, both of which appear as examples of pop -- and so it seems that "pop" is interpreted as "something that appeals to a wide audience".
You'll get no argument from me that philosophy needs to reach more people, but I think it's dangerous to assume that we need to always meet people where they are. Sometimes we need to bring them to us. For example, the abolitionists denounced slavery wholeheartedly, despite its popularity. They didn't say "we know the negro is inferior, but that's no excuse to treat them that way" -- they said "all people are equal."
Similarly, I worry about the suggestion that philosophy can (and even should) be distilled to a three minute daily mantra as opposed to a three hour weekly pursuit. Some ideas (I would argue most) can not be easily synthesized into a short message. In fact, losing the nuance of an idea can lead to dangerous errors. For example, the Nazis' cursory reading (and frank misinterpretation) of Nietsche. They were masters of distorting philosophical ideas into catchy slogans and broadcasting them to a (sometimes literally) captive audience.
It's kind of ironic (or intentionally produced) how it was difficult to pay attention because of the music videos playing as the narrator was talking. I still enjoy the message in the video, as I do all of them, and felt like the school of life touch on some important details of human nature. Now only if we can harness the energy and influence that pop music has and flip it into something useful. The way I see it pop music, just like organized religion, distracts those towards the bottom of the social class ladder from real issues. Anyways I love all your videos. Whenever i feel low i know i can count on these videos to shed insight into my life. You guys are awesome.
I passionately love pop music. Thank you, I really appreciate this video.
"Everything popular is wrong"
-Oscar Wilde
I can understand that pop is something that drives people together and that these people share a 'collective euphoria' but let us remember that the element that it uses to bring people together is something ridiculously base, vulgar and, at its core, commercial.
Marcel Proust, Charles Dickens, and Lincoln were not followers of pop at all.
What they were espousing wasn't commercial and mediocre, but rather glorious, almost divine!
The worship of Britney Spears, Taylor Swift and all of these other American plastic dolls is
nothing to be seen as worthy.
Pop is a business that is all it is.
Rather than make philosophy more public
Why not make the public more philosophical?
The world follows the path of least resistance.
It’s easier to make philosophy more public than to try and incentivise the public to be more philosophical.
@@PkFrBrad97 Alas, in the past four years, I have learned this well..
I am sorry but if you are trying to argue, you need first to learn what pop is. Or that Pop isn't inherently Commercial.
Also what's wrong with being Commercial? And why say that Britney or Taylor are just American plastic dolls that don't need to be seen as worthy? Do you realize what this artist did for music and for pop culture in general?
@@Dojafish I was 20 when I wrote that, I have put that childish thinking behind me. Also, cool Björk profile
In the case of something like Daft Punk & Pharrell's "Get Lucky" I'd say this applies. It was a song that blended deep understanding of music with catchy repetition that made it profitable. It was made out of love for music. But then you just have repetitive, superficial pop that lacks that spine chilling depth you feel with certain works. Pop isn't so much about the music as it is the images and "acts" that they're selling.
Well made and well stated! Thank you for making this video! I am a musician with a passion for philosophy so this was a perfect merging of my two worlds. My musical background is an elitist one, "musician's" music if you will, but because I am in the car a great deal I have found myself listening to pop more often. At first I was completely prejudice against it, but then I decided to try and understand it. Because after all, it is what sells. This video helped me A GREAT deal thanks again :) I have started learning a couple of pop songs and it turns out they aren't as simple as one would think, they do a good job at disguising their sophistication. Also, hats off for the Max Martin reference, few people know about him. But, everyone knows him!
I really liked this a lot. Much appreciated.
This video just explains why pop music succeeds but barely shows a link between pop and philosophy
about 2 years ago; I stopped listening to mainstream music. Since then I became more pessimistic and less socially active. Not sure if this is related but my taste in music & movies is the only thing that changed through the past years
+caesar ali Same here, but except for a much longer time.
+caesar ali I was the same away until recently, when I rediscovered the joy of pop. Pop music is designed to make people feel good, and over the years people have gotten very good at it, this is why it's so popular. The same is true of movies. I use pop to make myself feel good, as a mood elevator and it helps me to relate to other people. That being said I recognize pop for what it is. A pop song will never have the impact of a symphony concerto to me but then again it doesn't need to.
+caesar ali well done, your smart again congratulations! but don't forget you still have the option to turn off your brain cells and enjoy mediocrity again :)
+caesar ali There might be something to this. I was very interested in every "top ten songs for this month" back when I had a vibrant social circle. Now that my peers are oceans away, I have little tolerance for pop.
Perhaps both pessimism and mainstream intolerance are products of a deprived social life.
Monosaccaride I think pessimism and pop can go hand in hand. Joy is an ephemeral thing and sometimes lasts no longer then the span of a catchy pop tune.
Absolutely love this channel
This was beautifully edited
This is a deep one man. I feel like philosophy under the postmodern time is doomed to oblivion, yet it becomes more essential to our lives in terms of finding the meaning of lives and searching for YOURSELF under an age of images and social media. I dont think pop can do much to spread DECENT ideas. It used to, John Lennon does so. But the meaning and idea within a cultural industry is overwhelmed by surface image. People are way more obsessed with surface images, singer's look, i love u&u love me lyrics.
I like the idea of philosophy must study pop in order to survive but it aint an easy task to present philosophy in a simple, charming way. Maybe philosophy is essentially a bitter subject inside.
And sensation. People love something superficial images, superficial beauties and superficial idea of love and emotions and most importantly, sensations. Sensation feels like a drug to escape from reality but that itself is devoid of meaning
I think this is a false equivalence...Pop is a culture, Philosophy is a way of looking and understanding things. Pop encompasses philosophical ideas (rarely). Philosophy can be seen as a sub-sub-culture of Pop (maybe)...
+baniaadam1 You accuse them of making a false equivalence yet make one right off the bat: "pop is culture." It's a subset of culture, just like philosophy can be, but to say it is culture is not exactly right.
Thanks for putting this together, really enjoyed it. Do you, or any commenters, know of anyone who has explored this topic at length?
Such a dense video. Apocalyptic. Well done. By the way, I feel Michael and Gaga have been the ultimate quality pop idols, resetting the game of pop art and using their power to mentally inspire and educate the mass.
I love this. Can u do one the evolution of hip hop and rap and how MCs act as street philosophers of today?!?!?! Please!!!!!!
please do this!!
Agreed.😍😍
+Ian Smart Very bad street philosophers. As a fan of rap I never look to them for anything other than entertainment. Leave the real philosophy to the real philosophers. Just read the ancient greek philosophers or even some of the asian and middle eastern philosophers and you will soon realize the best of the best in rap don't even stand on the first brick of the philosophical pyramid of higher thinking.
Start with a more modern philosopher like Stefan Molyneux. He runs intellectual circles around people like common, mos def, Immortal Technique, talib kweli etc etc.
These guys tell stories. I believe a more accurate term for what they do is poetic reflectionaries of song and lyric.
Not philosophy.
Drew Whittle Sure, they're not as scholarly as the people you've mentioned but many of the great ones (J. Cole, Kendrick Lamar, Drake, Outkast, Tribe Called Quest, Nas, Biggie) have deeper themes and messages that are very academic when analyzed well. There are bad ones ( i do think they have their place as well) but when it's great it's great. Also, I said "street" philosophers because regardless of how brilliant the ppl but they don't offer that insight of "street" philosophy like a great or even bad rapper does. These men's experience allow them to promote a philosophy that is completely Unique because of class, era, and experience. Also, when you think about songs like Bitch Don't Kill my Vibe, Power Trip, Gimme the Loot, or Worst Behavior, these songs don't tell traditional narratives, but they express a mindset or point of view that is unique to this type of culture and people. They explore a hip hop philosophy about Love, gangster life, bravado, ethics, loneliness, and Inadequacy which are themes that can be found in other music, but not with this "street" leaned point of view. That is why they are "street" philosophers as I had said.
Ian Smart I'll meet you half way. They delve often into philosophical idea's and arguments via the medium they have chosen to perform their art. However that is not pure philosophy. That is done through engagement of idea's in debate and further development in ways of thinking and approaching life and it's deeper meaning. Rap and hip hop go into the realms but haven't offered anything deep or new to the philosophical world or you would see them involved in it for their merit of argument and new school of philosophy.
The only argument I could make about this music and the connection to philosophy would be the promotion and idea of thug philosophy which would really just be something like the philosophy of satanism which promotes the self over everyone else and to gain wealth and status by means of using others to gain and attain it. But that is old school stuff that is even older than satanism as well.
I'm just trying to explain that they just haven't really offered anything new to the philosophical world. So I personally dub this as reflectionary poetry through song and lyric. It is truly and honestly better descriptive terminology for what most rappers and hip hop artists do.
I do not think that Pop and Philosophy can be fused together. Pop is too simple, too generic and in my opinion too stupid. It teaches people to be the same, most people who only hear it can not express their opinion or even have no solid one. I think the problem is that maybe Pop tries to give the people knowledge, but they only know this one perspective, most people just follow the masses from a young age on, therefore they only know the "Pop-Lifestyle" and can not accept the other points of view.
+SEEKER Exactly. As I mentioned in a separate comment, Pop focus on people's sentiments and desires whereas philosophy focus is on people's intellect. We can not learn anything from pop, expect that people prefers following their feelings and desires than intellect, which is known for a long time (Ancien greek Plato) as it requires much more effort
+SEEKER But pop in it's own right is extremely diverse in viewpoint. You can take one pop artist like beyonce, who has themes in uplifting women through powerful assertions of the self, usually avoiding or outright discarding feelings of dependency. You can take something pop like Taylor Swift who's focus is much more relationship based, there may be moments of self-love but the general focus is who they are when x person is involved. You can take something like Flo Rida, who's message can simply be boiled down to "party and spend money like you'll die tommorow."
I'd have to argue that there really isn't a pop lifestyle because pop encompasses too many lifestyles depending on the artist and the people listening to them. Even the artists I mentioned have a history of musical themes that shift as they themselves age. Beyonce is a great example, with her musical expression shifting from love and relationships, to independence and self-love.
very enlightening video, will definately be BS'ing to my mates about how pop and philosophy need each other. As always, great vid.
Is there any written academic equivalent I could use for my thesis which elaborates on the notions in this video? Thank you!
In most songs BTS touch upon deep topics such as science, thermodynamics, math, psychology, depression, society, history, self love, the environment, racism, empowering women, etc (even philosophy) and they are one of the rare gems in Pop to actually explore those topics. I suggest to go look at the lyrics of some songs (Ddaeng, Spine Breaker, Blood Sweat and Tears, Young Forever, 134340, Magic shop, Love Myself: Answer, UGH!, Spring Day, 21st Century Girl, Dionysus, DNA, Fake Love, etc.). Their discography is so one of the most rich and diverse and is complete GENUIS when it comes to word play and metaphors. I definitely recommend checking out BTS. Thank you for the video!💜
Popular culture has no place in philosophy nor will it ever. Pop is based upon popular thinking in what looks, sounds, or feels good in the now. It is almost like the artists and popular culture want to be as far away from reality as possible. Philosophy is based on unpopular thinking in the study of the nature of knowledge, reality, and existence. If anything, popular culture should embrace philosophy more than vice versa.
Yeah but you can't force popular culture to embrace philosophy as it is very hard to put numbers and stats into philosophical problems. By studying popular culture, it helps understands how philosophy can help the average joe. Besides philosophy needs a rebranding as many see it as "snobby rich people that needs a real job"
This is such a basic and wrong understanding of pop and philosophy.
What's the name of the last song (in black en white) ?
This is the first time I've seen so many of these clips.
"They know exactly how to wear away our defences"
I experienced this while watching the video, I found myself unconsciously focusing into the vocals of the songs playing rather than the narration taking place, haha! 😄
Pop songs... you love them or hate them, either way they're here to stay. You might as make the most of it and attempt to perhaps elevate the art-form to higher realms of consciousness out of the vapid materialistic/superficial puddle some of them currently inhabit.
Addressing those who are quick to dismiss the entirety of popular music, "Pop music is the worst!" Honestly, everything is a learning experience if you know how to shift your perspective and if you deprive yourself of something like popular music you are doing exactly that, depriving yourself. Everything has a lesson to learn once you know how to look for it and know how to keep an open mind, it doesn't mean you have to enjoy it but simply learn to restrain your emotional knee-jerk reaction and study it from a rational lens. There are no problems or obstacles only situations and again if you learn how to shift your perspective they have the potential to become learning steps that will inevitably lead you somewhere in life.
Apologies for the slight digression towards the end, my typing is characterised by stream-of-consciousness.
There were some interesting points in the video that I had never even considered, I have more respect for the art-form now and definitely see it in a brighter light. It has unforeseen potential and I feel the last pop musician to explore the atmospherical limits of the art-form was Michael Jackson and like you said he was touching upon some grand themes (Destruction of the natural environment, corruption and lack of empathy from higher ups, dissolution of racial barriers to name a few off the top of my head). Imagine if popular music could now be married with grand philosophical themes?
Perhaps this could be the future of popular music?
It's exciting to entertain the idea... 😜
You heard it here first from the School of Life.
Also I loved the timing of the edits,
"Pop currently touches upon the big themes but doesn't, as yet properly take up many of the opportunities that lie its way" *Cut to Drake - Hotline Bling*
This is probably one of, if not, my favourite channels that I have subscribed to in a while, thank you SoL team for creating insightful content, look forward to many more videos!
I enjoyed reading this ..
+Michelle Hernandez
Glad you enjoyed it! 😊
Interestingly, this brings up religious institutions that *have* begun to marry the ideas of Christian faith with popular culture. Hillsong Church has expanded across the world, using populist rhetoric and contemporary music (they have rock!) to promote their ideology. Perhaps you could do a video on them?
so you're proposing, if at all, that philosophical ideas too be conveyed via such contemporary media in order to reach out to the masses?
+Adikshith Ojha The key word is "Ideology"
Adikshith Ojha I was just trying to point out the similarities between the ideas articulated in the video and how Hillsong markets their beliefs, but that wouldn't necessarily be bad either, imo. As long as the message is ethical and not diluted to reach a mass audience, there are potential benefits for entire sections of society.
Adorno's 'The Culture Industry' would have been of more relevance here ;)
Brilliant discourse! Whoever makes these is a real spark!
successful artist with a good philosophy already exists, Kendrick lamar
+Phoenix x , one artist out of the many thousands. A whole lot more artists should care about how they can deeply influence society but most don't.
+Phoenix x at the end of this video, he was the only one i could think of , kendrick tha god
+Phoenix x HOLY FUCK! I WAS JUST THINKING ABOUT THIS. The social commentary of Good Kid Maad City and all the underlying themes of unity, the power of the self, and breaking free of one's inhibitions in TPAB. People complain about how Kendrick is popular and gets lots of attention, but I see it as a positive aspect because Kendrick has a message to deliver and due to his popularity he will get the attention he deserves.
Yeah because pop is likely to be a long-lasting medium and the people who listen mostly to pop are the thinkers...
less that it's built to last than it's accessiblity is it's greatest asset. even though it's not always used to it's fullest potential
+Connor Brown i think he was bing sarcastic...
I wanted to listen the first time watching this but ended up singing along to all the songs which really drives your point home
I don't know how, but this just inspired me ♥️
Philosophy never stalled, it just moved to twitter feeds.
Twitter is mostly mindless chirping from shallow minds, trying to get attention from other shallow minds.
+Lars Petersson No, Twitter is whatever you want it to be. The nature of your Twitter feed is entirely dependent on who you follow. If your Twitter feed is "mindless chirping from shallow minds,", this is entirely your fault
Still doesn't change the fact that twitter as a general social media platform isn't all about philosophy, far from it..
Well. I guess the moral of the video is that we must make philosophy more appealing to the common person. Like School of life does with these videos. The philosophy plane is staling because it needs a new engine.
+Lars Petersson OK, but Twitter is far more powerful than any CZcams channel could ever be. No, Twitter isn't ABOUT philosophy at all, but it will increasingly shape the philosophy of our cultures. The marketplace of Twitter will decide which ideas are mainstream and which will be discarded. The traditional gatekeepers of culture: professors, writers, TV and radio commissioners and editors, are already becoming redundant. We are on the edge of a hugely disruptive change. I think that Mr de Boton's ideas are correct for 10 years ago, but not now
Not sure why you're putting Twitter on a pedestal. But I do see the value in having platforms wherever you find them, where people can present public opinions. As long as everyone can rate, comment and critique it fully without censorship.
it does go back to revisit the basic core of our minds, but the thing is, pop is loved and carried through mostly by young people like myself, teenagers and young adults. the core of their minds is already simple and basic, almost immature, and pop culture does very little to assert or provide interest to the young in finding greater depth and complexity in art and in emotional intelligence. I feel it teaches them to remain basic or immature, rather than revisit it.
Thanks for the tremendous (yep, i know it is) work to make such high quality content!
About the topic of the video, I dont think pop and philosophy are comparable at all. Of course they share the same goal, as with any other communication medium, that is passing messages.
Pop messages are (almost) about feeling and desires.
Philosophy messages offer a set of tools to seek for truth.
Pop is answering people desires/sentiments.
Philosophy works on making people favor their intellect over emotions and physical desires. The later clearly demands a lot of effort than the former.
And, it's not new that people favor their sentiments and desires (pop) over their intellect (philosophy). Plato considered people who are dragged by their sentimental or appetitive selfs as not fully human.
So what do you think? Or did I missed the point of the video?
Is there a song list? What's the song starting 2:19?
So... Philosophy, which emphasizes the ability to think for oneself, should take cues from pop music, which captivates people in a cult-like trance through constant repetition... Makes sense to me!
Your truly ambitious.
Damn it! I was hoping this would be a video on pop Philosophy. You should do a video on the pitfalls and virtues of pop philosophy, I think about the difference reasons it is good and isn't good every time I watch one of your videos.
The Mad Adam Films URL or website is broken :(