And the worst part is, Palpatine told his own guards to leave, and he was being protected by an Imperial (Vader), until Vader died and Anakin returned. So basically, it's only Palpatine's fault the Empire couldn't protect him.
You really think they stand against Anakin skywalker in a rage. Yoda insta kills 2. Anakin embraced his last ounce of power to survive a lethal blast of electricity. Only thing that killed him was his injuries and letting go of the thing that kept him alive, Hatred and his life-support system.
No, the worst part is that Palpatine is didnt die in Return of the Jedi, but instead transferred to a cloned body. Making the Vader's sacrifice totally moot..
I mean... that's their whole deal. The Dark Side is meant to be a corruption, evil and the Sith with it. Star Wars is a very good vs evil story. I can appreciate the Sith aesthetic (who doesn't like to wear black now and again?) but their ideology is so messed up I ain't touching it with a 39 1/2ft pole.
The emperor fell down a shaft. Why is he blaming the empire for not protecting him. He was a sith lord. It's not like they're even close to being on Palpatine's level of unlimited power.
Because Star Wars can’t make logical sense anymore. I’ve got no problem believing Palpatine would want something like this to happen in the event of his death, but very few Imperials in a position of power would be willing to carry it out when Palpatine death would give them the opportunity to carve out their own private empire’s from what remains of the Galactic Empire. Battlefront would have been much better scripted of Operation Cinder was some kind of automated contingency plan meant to destroy key Imperial and New Republic worlds. Once the Imperial Remnants realised Cinder was ticking down to activation they could have formed a temporary alliance with the New Republic to stop it. That would have made a much campaign. (Particularly if Palp’s had spies in the New Republic as well)
Judging from his plans and actions, I don't think he was being spiteful or pissed. It was less about punishing his Empire for failing him, and more about engaging in Scorched Earth tactics against the New Republic. He didn't want the New Republic to gain territories and worlds of tactical, strategic, political, infrastructural, or agricultural value from the Imperial remnants, nor did he want them digging up imperial secrets or tech. So he had his loyal Imperials purge and scorch the worlds that still remained under their banner in order to prevent the New Republic from getting too much turf or getting too strong. The reason of him doing it to punish his Empire was just to confuse and distract the New Republic. The Contingency and Operation: Cinder also included having loyalist elements and Imperial assets flee to the outer rim and unknown regions so that they may help in rebuilding the Empire in the form of the First Order, later the Final order.
Well, if you build huge satellites in your own owned world's with your own tech, no one will bat an eye. Build huge satellites near rebellion planets and people are going to ask questions.
This is TOTALLY irrelevant but earlier I was just thinking about how Wookiee’s live to 400 years (At least) and then I looked up Chewbacca’s age at the time of episode 9. It says he was 243 years old. It made me upset when I realized he had to live 200 more years without his best friend..
It’s fair to say that in a life that long one would probably have multiple eat friends unless one of them was another long aged species and didn’t end up bantha fodder at some point...
@@lonewolf5054 it always has been canon even though the campaign was bad. I mean the idea was good the execution of the campaign was meh. But Anything from EA is canon.
I was wondering what this was. I sort of knew but this cleared up all my questions. No wonder Mayfeld had some PTSD from that. It sounds absolutely horrible!
Technically, he didn't break it since he and Mayfeld killed them all in the area. Din didn't kill him because he earned his trust and Mayfeld respected Din's beliefs by handing him over the helmet, didn't look at him afterwards and assumes that he didn't show his face.
Mando didn't break creed: he is coming around to the idea that 'Children of the Watch' are extremists. Mayfield wasn't tearing into Mando for fun; he saw that Mando was having a hard time reconciling his creed against the realities of life. "I never saw your face" as Mayfield gave Mando a helmet while looking away...if you didn't see him put it on, was it ever off? As time passes, the origins of 'never show your face' will become clear. My guess? "Never show your face to an enemy" was the real message. Children of the Watch consider everyone enemies, so there is that.
Agreed! Something I've often said about the empire under Disney Star Wars that their cartoonishly evil. Now some people might say something like the death Star is certainly cartoonishly evil but I'm more referring to things like the purge of mandalore. The way I look at it the empire wanted to break and abuse / use the galaxy. If you just destroy everything that doesn't leave you much of an opportunity. The whole point of the death star was that they would really only have to destroy one or two perhaps in an extreme case five at most worlds before pretty much everybody would get the idea but it was a last resort
@@RabidNemo That was the idea of the Death Star. To cause FEAR. Tarkin says it clearly, that the fear from that station is what will maintain order in the Empire. Despite it's massive capabilities it served a specific purpose, and the said purpose was not just let's destroy stuff randomly, because we are evil.
@@akuladoctor7355 exactly right! Which again is why I say things like the night of tears and nuking mandalore basically just seems so ridiculous. Initially what I thought Operation cinder would do would be to scoop up as much stuff as possible beneficial to what was left of the empire while perhaps weakening key worlds to make it more difficult for the new Republic to fight back
Not if you think like a Sith. Palpatine was hoping to return from death,but it would take a while. He wanted to make sure the Empire or what came after it was economically crippled and ripe for his return
Agreed. Sloppy Disney-era writing that I feel like was rushed to give something "cool" to do in Battlefront 2, while trying too hard to link it to the sequel trilogy.
Another parallel between the Empire and Nazi’s. Palpatine’s scheme echoes similar to what Hitler pulled with the “Nero Decree”. Albeit on a much grander scale, and with complete devastation.
So Palpatine wanted to destroy the empire just to rebuild it? Honestly, everything after RotJ, outside of Mandolorian, in canon feels forced together in order to build-up to the sequels.
Aye...as a fan and avid imperial the antics of Palpatine showed us that we were deceived. That he had decided to burn us all as the galaxy was without him. Any Imperial would wonder what the Empire really stood for.
@@royalanempire2965 I mean I support the idea of a galactic militaristic empire controlling the galaxy. I mean the republic literally abandoned most of the galaxy to fend for itself causing a massive rise of piracy slavary and technological degergation. I mean captian phasma used to be a cavewomen for pets sake.
@@Demicleas I fully agree the republic was becoming corrupt as times passed the problems of the outer rim was something the core worlds could care less for. The Republic needed a massive overhaul. But the creation of the empire could have avoid some things like racist tactics towards None human citizens and outer/midrim human citizens, the killing of the jedi/anyone that was a force user. And even they got corrupt in the long run as power hungry Imperials at times turned on one another or screwed anyone who didn't support them in some ways. As seen when Thrawn was first starting out in the empire and Eli Vanto couldn't even gain rank due to the antics of some Moff.
@@royalanempire2965 the republic was very corrupt, but the empire was just as bad in other areas, really there are the same thing expect the jedi have been replaced with the sith
@@lukedragan7859 any I fully agree. At least the Jedi weren't corrupt if anything just too distant from the public as they got more and more heat from the public for the clone wars.
When he said this scene I got so excited because it was Battlefront 2. I hope we get Cal in another future Star Wars installment. maybe he will be in the bad batch for a cameo, because that planet looked like Bracca
Operation Cinder makes no sense, unlike it's Legends counterpart The Imperial Mutiny. With Cinder Palpatine dies because of Vader, not because the Empire failed. Further unlike in Legends where it took Palpatine years to regain strength and reveal himself(by which time the Empire had devolved into Warlord states with power bases capable of challenging his rule) and he had to weaken the Warlords to the point they needed him again and so helped instigate and fuel an internecine holocaust the the Empire never recovered from. In canon, the Empire doesn't fragment initially and Palpatine destroying the Empire WHILE HE IS STILL ALIVE(as revealed in TRoS) is actively AGAINST his own interests. Palpatine absolutely would have burned everything to the ground rather than let anyone else have it if he was permanently dead, but since we know that is not the case Operation Cinder just comes off as nonsensical for him to do and doesn't take into account the vast swaths of Warlords and Imperials that would refuse to immolate their own holdings.
@@da-vidcargill4975 BULLLLLLSHIIIIIIIIIITTTTTT The jedi should have just all put their power on yoda back on Revenge of the Sith, and then Palpatine would die earlier. BULLLLLSHIIIIIT Deus Ex Machina, soooooo convenient. Why would Rey even need these jedi? Isn't she a MaRey sue with unlimited power?
I liked the shout to the game, but beginning to think the rumors of turning the Disney trilogy into legends and starting new are just rumors. BF2 leads up to the sequel trilogy and The First Order. Bringing Cinder up in Mandalorian feels like they're going to connect the best part of Disney Star Wars to the worst part of Star Wars in general.
The worst part of Star Wars... So the madmen are planning on connecting The Mandolorian with the original Holiday Special, is what you're saying. Their evil truly knows no bounds.
Okay someone please help me understand. I don't really get why the Emperor would do this. He says that if an Empire couldn't protect it's Emperor, than it should not outlive him. But why does he want some Imperials to survive and to rebuild the Empire again? Wouldn't it make more sense to not kill all these Imperials? He needs them to rebuild the empire right? Also it's strange to erase the empire, just to build it up again, with the same people. I have the feeling that I'm missing something.
Never was a fan of Operation Cinder, especially since the lore is relegated to books and comics and completely ignored in the ST. The idea always struck me as a gimmick to justify the creation of the First Order, considering TFA neglected to reveal their origins, and has become a joke since ROS inexplicably resurrected Palpatine. Sidious intended to rule the Empire for generations, so why would he plan for his death? And above all else, why would he trust such crucial details of his Contingency to some random Imp? He never even trusted Vader. Biggest of all, Sidious would never allow the Empire to "regroup" under anyone else but himself. Even more confusing, how does Snoke fit into this? Did he just randomly show up one day and say, "Welp, guess I'm in charge." This makes even less sense when you realize it was Palpatine the whole time. He somehow had secret control of the First Order, then inexplicably announced his return to the galaxy before ROS? Why would Palpatine ever announce himself, especially if he'd already controlled the FO for the past 30 years. Why did he need the Final Fleet if he initially had Starkiller Base at his disposal, and why didn't he utilize the Fleet much sooner - say, before Operation Cinder? See, I don't mean to complain, and I think the Mandalorian is some of the best content we've had in a while, but this is precisely why I'm afraid the show is heading towards ST content. "Disney" lore is an inconsistent mess, and I'd much rather prefer it if they left it alone or retconned it.
the misinformation from many websites just lie to you all...why believe in the first place that Disney is in trouble...CZcamsrs and websites have no clue what their saying ..its the info they say is putting their words on their mouths when they haven't say anything about it ...cause to me WHAT FAILURES...MOVIES WERE SUCCESS ..NOT SURE WHERE YOU GET YOUR NEWS NOW?? from CZcamsRS JUST ROB YOUR TIME IS HOW THEY MAKE MONEY BY DONATION TO MAKE YOU BLIND AND DEAF
Fascinating. Palpatine was able to prevent the civil war amongst the Imperial Remnants, then sent a loyal group of Imperials to rebuild the Empire without its most obvious flaws. Then for over thirty decades, he played the puppet master once again to ensure the Galaxy was weakened for the First Order to seize a large portion of the Galaxy then use the Final Order to be the final (no pun intended) nail in the coffin for all resistance. Just makes sense to me, what's how thoughts on it
Why not use the remnant to weaken the resistance instad? Or flee instantly? Also why not use all those resources at the first, and final order to make the Empire stronger to begin with? Sure make a contingency plan for his death, but if he were to reduce the resources of the galaxy for his grand return, then he should do it against his enemies first. This operation just wasted resources, and increased the strength of his enemies through defectors, and self destruction.
Anyone else think the first order could have used the weather satellite tech from operation cinder for their own super weapons in the sequel trilogy? I just think it’d be more unique that another Death Star 2.0
Well I honestly can say this is by far worse than all the executive orders the clones were bound to. This is basically Palpatine saying “Fu¢k all of you and your planets”. It reminds me of DBZ / DBZA Frieza being a sore loser.
I can't believe the car dealer from Lexington was a target for OP Cinder! *mindblown* (For those that don't get any joke : the advert is placed directly before the list's beginning and after the introduction of said list. Mine just so happened to work out where it meshed hilariously. )
you know with the mentions of cinder in the mandalorian along with the fact that there have been many mentions that mandalore had been either rendered uninhabitable or destroyed, i would guess that mandalore is one of the planets hit by operation cinder that hasnt been confirmed yet
Boba said in the Season 2 finale that Mandalore’s been reduced to glass (basically how the planet Reach ended up in the Halo games). If that wasn’t the result of the Purge, then it’s a fair bet that Mandalore was indeed another planet hit by Operation Cinder.
You know all this stuff sounds way more interesting than the stuff we got in the sequels. A desperate, dying Empire punishing it's own people for it's failures, versus it's another Death Star, but WAY bigger, and shoots like 5 beams at once!!!
Reminds me of a press junket that Abrams and Kennedy did, where they basically say that superweapons were a no-brainer, given the franchise’s history with them. Well, uh, not really. TPM was about a blockade, AOTC was about two grand armies and ROTS was entirely character driven. Starkiller Base was only a no-brainer if you have a complete lack of imagination.
I prefer the legends version of the post battle of Endor so much over the canon version. It makes more sense that the imperial admirals would turn into warlords and continue the war. It’s so dumb to think that the ENTIRE imperial navy was destroyed on one planet. They had 20 thousand star destroyers! unless that fact was wiped from canon as well.
Did anyone else think it was weird that Mando's facial scan was confirmed. Does that mean he worked for the Empire at a certain point and why he recognized Moff Gideon right away in s1? Unless his facial recognition was just confirmed because Mandalore used to be controlled by the Empire?
I took that as a face scan to prove you’re not wanted. Which is why everyone else balked on going in. They wouldn’t have his face until now as he always has his helmet on, like boba. The worry wasn’t that he worked for them it’s that he has the face of a Jango clone when they should all be dead by now...lol
Star wars is so convoluted and nonsensical now. Listening to the guys over at Half in the Bag makes you aware of so many inconsistencies in all the story elements that Star Wars really does survive through nostalgia and cool factor.
So Operation Cinder is quite literally Palpatine getting butthurt that he died so hes like, "well if i go down, then everyone that's stupid enough to blindly follow and listen to me is going down with me." This is solid proof that the Empire is an oppressive, evil regime and cant be reasoned with... All those worlds, all those people were completely loyal to the Empire. But when the balance of power changed and the tide of war shifted, the Empire quite literally ate itself alive and everyone and every world that followed them, suffered catastrophic damage as a result...
Gotta say, its a pretty boring motivation for a villain. Palpatine was pretty great in revenge on the sith. But the levels of Cartoonery in the 9th film were pretty insane.
the last shot of naboo we see in the movies is everybody celebrating the destruction of the 2nd death star. damn... this new canon sure crashed that party
One of the things I never really liked about the whole operation cinder thing I feel like Palpatine would have been arrogant enough to believe that once he had power fully solidified there was no way he could ever lose it
Disney really had some effed-up writing. I mean that's so irrational and doesn't have any logic to it at all. That is a pathetic way to explain how the first order formed and came into play
Come on guys it was so obvious from the very beginning that Palpatine would be that big of a sore loser that he would make his people suffer the greater consequences over him getting killed even if it was all his own doing.
That would make sense if he was actually dead but he’s still alive so it makes no sense why he would allow it to be carried out since it works against him. As well as it also makes no sense why most imperials go through with it since most of them joined the empire for power, so why would they go through with an order that destroys much of the power they hold. On top of that if palpatine was truly dead he wouldn’t have had the imperials retreat to the unknown regions after carrying out the operation since he wouldn’t want the empire to survive without him if he was actually dead, he would have ordered the imperial to commit suicide or fight to the death against the rebels.
What's even more messed up is that the empire actually followed through with it. Legends had its flaws too but I prefer the empire falling to infighting and division. Much more believable
I'd like to think that Operation Cinder could be considered canon, but does not lead to the creation of the First Order. It just ends with the Empire falling with maybe a little small group of remnants here and there, like Moff Gideon.
I wish they would have explained it better, it would have been another good way to connect why the new republic didn't have a powerful navy at the time. All the major shipyards that the New Republic could have gotten were destroyed.
THEY DESTROYED NABOO?! WHAT THE HELL?! DISNEY HAVE TRULY RUINED STAR WARS! Wait... If they're supposedly rewriting the sequels to make them better, would Naboo still be destroyed? I hope not
I wish we could see and empire civil war. Like thrawn tries to take control after palpatines death and also moff Gideon. 2 factions of the empire fighting for power would be cool The biggest mistake jj Abrahm did to star wars was the purposed destruction of the empire. Operation cinder plus wiping out the rest at jakku. It's stupid on every level. And doesn't make sense. It left no room to play around with after
I started thinking Cinder was idiotic, but then you have to think about this. If things happen naturally, the Imperial Remnants inevitably get assimilated by the New Republic in some way shape or form. This way the ideological purity of the Empire is maintained. No compromise or blurring of imperial principles with republican rule.
Everyone questioning why old Palps would do this and I'm like... this man is literally the Devil of Star Wars. One of the greatest Sith. The Empire was just another means to an end. A way he could obtain all the resources of the galaxy and scour it for any knowledge and power to further his own. If he 'died' before he found immortality than why should it exist? The Sith are selfish and he shows that in 'if I can't have it or control it than no one can.' Also, all the suffering, pain, misery and trauma of this Operation likely fed into the Dark Side and it's corruptive nature. So if he had any plans to survive death (yes I know TROS and Dark Empire are dumb but Legends alone has like a dozen other ways Sith try to avoid death so pick one), feeding the Dark Side might improve the success of those plans and give him a boost in power to return all the sooner. Anyway I loved how the show included this and used it to give a previously simple character more depth and tie in the worldbuilding was excellent. The acting was great and the scene set up so well I couldn't help but feel immense satisfaction when fascist piece of crap officer got what was coming to him. I tip my hat to Bill Burr for his acting and the writers that came up with this scene. Well done.
It was less about punishing his Empire for failing him, and more about engaging in Scorched Earth tactics against the New Republic. He didn't want the New Republic to gain territories and worlds of tactical, strategic, political, infrastructural, or agricultural value from the Imperial remnants, nor did he want them digging up imperial secrets or tech. So he had his loyal Imperials purge and scorch the worlds that still remained under their banner in order to prevent the New Republic from getting too much turf or getting too strong. The reason of him doing it to punish his Empire was just to confuse and distract the New Republic. The Contingency and Operation: Cinder also included having loyalist elements and Imperial assets flee to the outer rim and unknown regions so that they may help in rebuilding the Empire in the form of the First Order, later the Final order.
Operation Cinder makes very little sense to me-Particularly as Palpatine wasn't even dead (if the sequels are to be believed). I looked up when the first mention of this was made and it's from a comic in 2015. All of a sudden this makes more sense (or even less sense). Not canon IMO. It makes no sense logically or in terms of the characters or setting. It seems to me more like a story device created by the writers as they realised that the Empire wasn't evil enough and because they needed a reason for the Empire to collapse quickly (even with the destruction of the 2nd Death Star the power of the Impierial army and fleet was colosal).
The EU books published in the early '90s had another explanation for why the Imperial army failed. It said that Palpatine was influencing all of his troops to give The will and the skill to fight. But when he was gone then they acted like cadets. Without a leader to pull them together they were little more than regional warlords with a small group of planets loyal to the Empire. It's funny because when I was a kid watching ROTJ and there was no other Star Wars content it was just presumed the Empire failed at Endor and were routed. I think we all assumed that the majority of the Imperial forces were at Endor participating in the trap and therefore fell to the rebellion fleet. We didn't consider it more than that.
Playing battle front 2 right now. Kinda felt like the matrix 😎 watched this video while playing got the history while walking on some planet I am on lol
Every time they try to explain a throwaway remark like this and make a place for it in canon it just makes everything more ridiculous. So Operation Cinder happened a little after 4 ABY when the events of ROTJ took place. Migs and the officer had their conversation somewhere around 7 ABY when the events of Mando take place. "Now there's a man who knows his history". The history of max three years ago, you mean?
Operation Cinder is ridiculously. I feel like starwars has really been dumbed down over the last 10 years. These villians are cartoonishly evil and nothing the empire does makes any sense.
If you enjoyed the video, make sure you check out HOW JANGO FETT became a Mandalorian here: czcams.com/video/0jSgasJ5DLc/video.html
Don’t forget Grand Admiral Thrawn was in the unknown regions too.
And the worst part is, Palpatine told his own guards to leave, and he was being protected by an Imperial (Vader), until Vader died and Anakin returned. So basically, it's only Palpatine's fault the Empire couldn't protect him.
You really think they stand against Anakin skywalker in a rage.
Yoda insta kills 2.
Anakin embraced his last ounce of power to survive a lethal blast of electricity.
Only thing that killed him was his injuries and letting go of the thing that kept him alive, Hatred and his life-support system.
He told anakin to kill his apprentice, and tried to do the same to Luke on vader
Of course he doesn't care about them
No, the worst part is that Palpatine is didnt die in Return of the Jedi, but instead transferred to a cloned body.
Making the Vader's sacrifice totally moot..
@@Orcawhale1 he is basically rotting in his cloned body. A fate worse than death.
@@franciscogerardohernandezr4788 How utterly fitting to be in such a state and exiled to barren world like Exogol.
When Mayfield was losing it when his former C.O. mentioned the meaningless lives, I just wanted to put my hand on his shoulder
Same man.
I would’ve whispered to him...
Dew it.
"We all have to sleep at night"
I agree with you Isaac kim
Me too. Or squeeze his shoulder or hand.
So THIS is why Mayfield was pissed.
I love the continuity.
palpatine is the cruelest rage quitter lol
KENOBBIIII!!!!!!
Hello there!
At least he’s a master, of being a cruelest rage quitter
@@isaackim7675 That's more than we can say about Anakin
Ah! You're a bold one.
*let's have a toast to Operation Cinder*
*boom* straight through the chest
🥺PTSD......
Then
( -_ ・) ︻デ═一 ▸💥BOOM!
@Timothy Neumann 🤔
“Now that’s a man who knows history”
yes
I love how they tied this in with the battlefront 2 story mode
Great vid
Sith lords really have a thing for destroying and killing.
There was no point to Operation Cinder. The only thing Palpatine did was show how much of a sore loser he is.
Yet, quite a few people prefer the Sith over the Jedi, and the Dictatorship known as the Empire over the Republic.
I mean... that's their whole deal. The Dark Side is meant to be a corruption, evil and the Sith with it. Star Wars is a very good vs evil story. I can appreciate the Sith aesthetic (who doesn't like to wear black now and again?) but their ideology is so messed up I ain't touching it with a 39 1/2ft pole.
@@ramarblood7697 I don't like the Jedi or the Sith because of their extreme, one sided views towards/against one another.
@@dwnkaomwn3953 is he not an evil tyrannical sore loser?
The emperor fell down a shaft. Why is he blaming the empire for not protecting him. He was a sith lord. It's not like they're even close to being on Palpatine's level of unlimited power.
He was that petty
He also called his royal guards to leave so he got himself killed.
@@yienannchoo82 it was his fault
@@yienannchoo82 royal guard would have lost to Luke and Vader in a fight... shit yoda flicked a finger and took out 2 in RotS lol...
@@josephrobichaud2852 he has force user royal guards.
Instead of destroying their own worlds, why didn’t the empire use their weather tech against rebel worlds???
Because that’s not the point. He was pissed that his “loyal” subjects didn’t protect him.
Because Star Wars can’t make logical sense anymore. I’ve got no problem believing Palpatine would want something like this to happen in the event of his death, but very few Imperials in a position of power would be willing to carry it out when Palpatine death would give them the opportunity to carve out their own private empire’s from what remains of the Galactic Empire. Battlefront would have been much better scripted of Operation Cinder was some kind of automated contingency plan meant to destroy key Imperial and New Republic worlds. Once the Imperial Remnants realised Cinder was ticking down to activation they could have formed a temporary alliance with the New Republic to stop it. That would have made a much campaign. (Particularly if Palp’s had spies in the New Republic as well)
Judging from his plans and actions, I don't think he was being spiteful or pissed. It was less about punishing his Empire for failing him, and more about engaging in Scorched Earth tactics against the New Republic. He didn't want the New Republic to gain territories and worlds of tactical, strategic, political, infrastructural, or agricultural value from the Imperial remnants, nor did he want them digging up imperial secrets or tech. So he had his loyal Imperials purge and scorch the worlds that still remained under their banner in order to prevent the New Republic from getting too much turf or getting too strong. The reason of him doing it to punish his Empire was just to confuse and distract the New Republic. The Contingency and Operation: Cinder also included having loyalist elements and Imperial assets flee to the outer rim and unknown regions so that they may help in rebuilding the Empire in the form of the First Order, later the Final order.
Well, if you build huge satellites in your own owned world's with your own tech, no one will bat an eye. Build huge satellites near rebellion planets and people are going to ask questions.
I’m also wondering why tf would he need a Death Star when he already had tech that could destroy worlds in little time
This is TOTALLY irrelevant but earlier I was just thinking about how Wookiee’s live to 400 years (At least) and then I looked up Chewbacca’s age at the time of episode 9. It says he was 243 years old. It made me upset when I realized he had to live 200 more years without his best friend..
It’s fair to say that in a life that long one would probably have multiple eat friends unless one of them was another long aged species and didn’t end up bantha fodder at some point...
You should've seen the horrors he had to live through in Legends after the Empire was defeated
@@PositiviteaTheFirst *A U N I V E R S E I N A G O N Y*
Well han was pretty old at the time of his death chewie still would live without him for a long time
When he said operation cinder I remembered battlefront 2
Me too😁
Same
I didn’t even think about that, I forgot
When he said operation cinder I was like "fxck they made battlefront 2 canon" honestly battlefront 2 campaign shouldn't be canon
@@lonewolf5054 it always has been canon even though the campaign was bad. I mean the idea was good the execution of the campaign was meh. But Anything from EA is canon.
I was wondering what this was. I sort of knew but this cleared up all my questions. No wonder Mayfeld had some PTSD from that. It sounds absolutely horrible!
Mando broke the creed in this episode but he is still a Mandalorian one of be best episodes
He broke the creed for Grogu's sake. It was worth it.
I mean everyone who saw his face is now dead
Technically, he didn't break it since he and Mayfeld killed them all in the area. Din didn't kill him because he earned his trust and Mayfeld respected Din's beliefs by handing him over the helmet, didn't look at him afterwards and assumes that he didn't show his face.
Mando didn't break creed: he is coming around to the idea that 'Children of the Watch' are extremists.
Mayfield wasn't tearing into Mando for fun; he saw that Mando was having a hard time reconciling his creed against the realities of life.
"I never saw your face" as Mayfield gave Mando a helmet while looking away...if you didn't see him put it on, was it ever off?
As time passes, the origins of 'never show your face' will become clear.
My guess? "Never show your face to an enemy" was the real message.
Children of the Watch consider everyone enemies, so there is that.
To be honest this entire operation was just idiotic. A typical "we are evil, and we do evil stuff" situation to force the good guys to the good side.
Agreed! Something I've often said about the empire under Disney Star Wars that their cartoonishly evil. Now some people might say something like the death Star is certainly cartoonishly evil but I'm more referring to things like the purge of mandalore. The way I look at it the empire wanted to break and abuse / use the galaxy.
If you just destroy everything that doesn't leave you much of an opportunity. The whole point of the death star was that they would really only have to destroy one or two perhaps in an extreme case five at most worlds before pretty much everybody would get the idea but it was a last resort
@@RabidNemo That was the idea of the Death Star. To cause FEAR. Tarkin says it clearly, that the fear from that station is what will maintain order in the Empire. Despite it's massive capabilities it served a specific purpose, and the said purpose was not just let's destroy stuff randomly, because we are evil.
@@akuladoctor7355 exactly right! Which again is why I say things like the night of tears and nuking mandalore basically just seems so ridiculous.
Initially what I thought Operation cinder would do would be to scoop up as much stuff as possible beneficial to what was left of the empire while perhaps weakening key worlds to make it more difficult for the new Republic to fight back
Not if you think like a Sith.
Palpatine was hoping to return from death,but it would take a while.
He wanted to make sure the Empire or what came after it was economically crippled and ripe for his return
Agreed. Sloppy Disney-era writing that I feel like was rushed to give something "cool" to do in Battlefront 2, while trying too hard to link it to the sequel trilogy.
Another parallel between the Empire and Nazi’s. Palpatine’s scheme echoes similar to what Hitler pulled with the “Nero Decree”. Albeit on a much grander scale, and with complete devastation.
So Palpatine wanted to destroy the empire just to rebuild it? Honestly, everything after RotJ, outside of Mandolorian, in canon feels forced together in order to build-up to the sequels.
Yep that was pretty much his plan... 😔
its nice to know some imps, like mayfield have a conscious
Aye...as a fan and avid imperial the antics of Palpatine showed us that we were deceived. That he had decided to burn us all as the galaxy was without him. Any Imperial would wonder what the Empire really stood for.
@@royalanempire2965 I mean I support the idea of a galactic militaristic empire controlling the galaxy. I mean the republic literally abandoned most of the galaxy to fend for itself causing a massive rise of piracy slavary and technological degergation. I mean captian phasma used to be a cavewomen for pets sake.
@@Demicleas I fully agree the republic was becoming corrupt as times passed the problems of the outer rim was something the core worlds could care less for. The Republic needed a massive overhaul. But the creation of the empire could have avoid some things like racist tactics towards None human citizens and outer/midrim human citizens, the killing of the jedi/anyone that was a force user. And even they got corrupt in the long run as power hungry Imperials at times turned on one another or screwed anyone who didn't support them in some ways. As seen when Thrawn was first starting out in the empire and Eli Vanto couldn't even gain rank due to the antics of some Moff.
@@royalanempire2965 the republic was very corrupt, but the empire was just as bad in other areas, really there are the same thing expect the jedi have been replaced with the sith
@@lukedragan7859 any I fully agree. At least the Jedi weren't corrupt if anything just too distant from the public as they got more and more heat from the public for the clone wars.
When he said this scene I got so excited because it was Battlefront 2. I hope we get Cal in another future Star Wars installment. maybe he will be in the bad batch for a cameo, because that planet looked like Bracca
The bad batch does go to bracca in an episode to get salvage from an old cruiser
I only learned the Existence of Operation Cinder from Battlefront 2
Empire: *takes the destruction arrays to Ryloth then realizes there nothing to change bc the weather is already horrible*
Operation Cinder makes no sense, unlike it's Legends counterpart The Imperial Mutiny. With Cinder Palpatine dies because of Vader, not because the Empire failed. Further unlike in Legends where it took Palpatine years to regain strength and reveal himself(by which time the Empire had devolved into Warlord states with power bases capable of challenging his rule) and he had to weaken the Warlords to the point they needed him again and so helped instigate and fuel an internecine holocaust the the Empire never recovered from. In canon, the Empire doesn't fragment initially and Palpatine destroying the Empire WHILE HE IS STILL ALIVE(as revealed in TRoS) is actively AGAINST his own interests.
Palpatine absolutely would have burned everything to the ground rather than let anyone else have it if he was permanently dead, but since we know that is not the case Operation Cinder just comes off as nonsensical for him to do and doesn't take into account the vast swaths of Warlords and Imperials that would refuse to immolate their own holdings.
late but I think we're forgetting he DID die, this is a CLONE of palpatine, LIKE IN LEGENDS.
@@ZizzleTheKakapo and it was just as idiotic the first time. Instead of learning from past mistakes they made them again and even more insipidly.
But then 3 decades later he’s been Resurrected by being Cloned on Exegol
Let's just all collectively ignore that trilogy altogether please.
@@Kaipyro67ALT NEVERRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR then the jedi collectively defeated sidious and defetaed the final order , CRY BABIES CRYYYYYYYYYYYYYY
@@da-vidcargill4975 it will stay non canon in my mind😁
@@da-vidcargill4975 BULLLLLLSHIIIIIIIIIITTTTTT The jedi should have just all put their power on yoda back on Revenge of the Sith, and then Palpatine would die earlier. BULLLLLSHIIIIIT Deus Ex Machina, soooooo convenient. Why would Rey even need these jedi? Isn't she a MaRey sue with unlimited power?
@@Kaipyro67ALT Yes please. Someone here still has sanity.
I liked the shout to the game, but beginning to think the rumors of turning the Disney trilogy into legends and starting new are just rumors. BF2 leads up to the sequel trilogy and The First Order. Bringing Cinder up in Mandalorian feels like they're going to connect the best part of Disney Star Wars to the worst part of Star Wars in general.
The worst part of Star Wars... So the madmen are planning on connecting The Mandolorian with the original Holiday Special, is what you're saying. Their evil truly knows no bounds.
@@kamikazelemming1552 I enjoyed star wars holiday special over episode 8.
@@italianstallion389 you clearly had no childhood then
@@da-vidcargill4975 they ain't wrong
@@da-vidcargill4975 No it's called preference. Episode 8 was also so bad for me to the point that it's hard to imagine which is worse at this point.
Okay someone please help me understand. I don't really get why the Emperor would do this. He says that if an Empire couldn't protect it's Emperor, than it should not outlive him. But why does he want some Imperials to survive and to rebuild the Empire again? Wouldn't it make more sense to not kill all these Imperials? He needs them to rebuild the empire right? Also it's strange to erase the empire, just to build it up again, with the same people.
I have the feeling that I'm missing something.
The First Order is basically The Empire's alt account
Never was a fan of Operation Cinder, especially since the lore is relegated to books and comics and completely ignored in the ST.
The idea always struck me as a gimmick to justify the creation of the First Order, considering TFA neglected to reveal their origins, and has become a joke since ROS inexplicably resurrected Palpatine.
Sidious intended to rule the Empire for generations, so why would he plan for his death? And above all else, why would he trust such crucial details of his Contingency to some random Imp? He never even trusted Vader. Biggest of all, Sidious would never allow the Empire to "regroup" under anyone else but himself.
Even more confusing, how does Snoke fit into this? Did he just randomly show up one day and say, "Welp, guess I'm in charge."
This makes even less sense when you realize it was Palpatine the whole time. He somehow had secret control of the First Order, then inexplicably announced his return to the galaxy before ROS? Why would Palpatine ever announce himself, especially if he'd already controlled the FO for the past 30 years. Why did he need the Final Fleet if he initially had Starkiller Base at his disposal, and why didn't he utilize the Fleet much sooner - say, before Operation Cinder?
See, I don't mean to complain, and I think the Mandalorian is some of the best content we've had in a while, but this is precisely why I'm afraid the show is heading towards ST content. "Disney" lore is an inconsistent mess, and I'd much rather prefer it if they left it alone or retconned it.
the misinformation from many websites just lie to you all...why believe in the first place that Disney is in trouble...CZcamsrs and websites have no clue what their saying ..its the info they say is putting their words on their mouths when they haven't say anything about it ...cause to me WHAT FAILURES...MOVIES WERE SUCCESS ..NOT SURE WHERE YOU GET YOUR NEWS NOW?? from CZcamsRS JUST ROB YOUR TIME IS HOW THEY MAKE MONEY BY DONATION TO MAKE YOU BLIND AND DEAF
@@user78405 Did you even read my comment buddy?
This is a terrible addition to the lore. There's no way Palpatine's corrupt, self-interested officers would destroy their own powerbase.
“You saw the Empire’s weakness and refused to let it consume you” - Garrick Versio
Fascinating. Palpatine was able to prevent the civil war amongst the Imperial Remnants, then sent a loyal group of Imperials to rebuild the Empire without its most obvious flaws. Then for over thirty decades, he played the puppet master once again to ensure the Galaxy was weakened for the First Order to seize a large portion of the Galaxy then use the Final Order to be the final (no pun intended) nail in the coffin for all resistance. Just makes sense to me, what's how thoughts on it
Why not use the remnant to weaken the resistance instad? Or flee instantly? Also why not use all those resources at the first, and final order to make the Empire stronger to begin with? Sure make a contingency plan for his death, but if he were to reduce the resources of the galaxy for his grand return, then he should do it against his enemies first. This operation just wasted resources, and increased the strength of his enemies through defectors, and self destruction.
@@akuladoctor7355 it’s to ensure the rebels won’t gain any resources from Imperial worlds when they take them over
Anyone else think the first order could have used the weather satellite tech from operation cinder for their own super weapons in the sequel trilogy? I just think it’d be more unique that another Death Star 2.0
Yes but JJ Abrams doesn't have a unique bone in his body
Naboo?!? Oh no meesa liked episode 1.
Well I honestly can say this is by far worse than all the executive orders the clones were bound to. This is basically Palpatine saying “Fu¢k all of you and your planets”. It reminds me of DBZ / DBZA Frieza being a sore loser.
That scene in the mando was so tense !😰
Operation Cinder is the stupidest story plot in canon to date. There are others, but this one takes the cake.
I can't believe the car dealer from Lexington was a target for OP Cinder! *mindblown*
(For those that don't get any joke : the advert is placed directly before the list's beginning and after the introduction of said list. Mine just so happened to work out where it meshed hilariously. )
you know with the mentions of cinder in the mandalorian along with the fact that there have been many mentions that mandalore had been either rendered uninhabitable or destroyed, i would guess that mandalore is one of the planets hit by operation cinder that hasnt been confirmed yet
Boba said in the Season 2 finale that Mandalore’s been reduced to glass (basically how the planet Reach ended up in the Halo games).
If that wasn’t the result of the Purge, then it’s a fair bet that Mandalore was indeed another planet hit by Operation Cinder.
hey do you might want to do a watchparty for the last episode I would love to see that
This shit makes zero sense. Palpatine died because of his own overconfidence and stupidity.
You know all this stuff sounds way more interesting than the stuff we got in the sequels. A desperate, dying Empire punishing it's own people for it's failures, versus it's another Death Star, but WAY bigger, and shoots like 5 beams at once!!!
Reminds me of a press junket that Abrams and Kennedy did, where they basically say that superweapons were a no-brainer, given the franchise’s history with them. Well, uh, not really. TPM was about a blockade, AOTC was about two grand armies and ROTS was entirely character driven. Starkiller Base was only a no-brainer if you have a complete lack of imagination.
I prefer the legends version of the post battle of Endor so much over the canon version. It makes more sense that the imperial admirals would turn into warlords and continue the war. It’s so dumb to think that the ENTIRE imperial navy was destroyed on one planet. They had 20 thousand star destroyers! unless that fact was wiped from canon as well.
because Disney think the galaxy is the size of a planet. small world, smaller fleets, smaller armies, and brains the size of peas.
One of my favourite editions in canon
So cool that they mentioned Operation Cinder from Star Wars Battlefront II
Let’s hope they mention Cal Kestis from Jedi Fallen Order 🤞🏻
@@milesskillman256 we will never know
Poor Naboo
Did anyone else think it was weird that Mando's facial scan was confirmed. Does that mean he worked for the Empire at a certain point and why he recognized Moff Gideon right away in s1?
Unless his facial recognition was just confirmed because Mandalore used to be controlled by the Empire?
he's a bounty hunter, he most likely has been hired many times before the grogu mission.
It might just be the star wars version of "prove your not a robot
I took that as a face scan to prove you’re not wanted. Which is why everyone else balked on going in. They wouldn’t have his face until now as he always has his helmet on, like boba. The worry wasn’t that he worked for them it’s that he has the face of a Jango clone when they should all be dead by now...lol
We need A live action of this.
Star wars is so convoluted and nonsensical now. Listening to the guys over at Half in the Bag makes you aware of so many inconsistencies in all the story elements that Star Wars really does survive through nostalgia and cool factor.
Why would you follow the orders of a man who’s not even alive
Imperial Honor 🔥
I knew it, I just knew it haha! Last week I predicted a Tython video and this week I predicted this video lol
Maybe cuz they leaked it in previous episodes
Good job
Operation Cinder is most likely the spiritual successor to the Orbital Nightclocks used by Warlord Zsinj in the Legends timeline.
This took rage quitting a tad too far methinks....
ok
Damn, the guy Mayfeld shot got off easy.
So Operation Cinder is quite literally Palpatine getting butthurt that he died so hes like, "well if i go down, then everyone that's stupid enough to blindly follow and listen to me is going down with me." This is solid proof that the Empire is an oppressive, evil regime and cant be reasoned with... All those worlds, all those people were completely loyal to the Empire. But when the balance of power changed and the tide of war shifted, the Empire quite literally ate itself alive and everyone and every world that followed them, suffered catastrophic damage as a result...
Gotta say, its a pretty boring motivation for a villain. Palpatine was pretty great in revenge on the sith. But the levels of Cartoonery in the 9th film were pretty insane.
Palpatine: An Empire should not exist if it fails to protect it's Emperor!
Also Palpatine: *GLaDOS cosplaying and alive*
The 1st order coming from Cinder should have really been explained in the movies
the last shot of naboo we see in the movies is everybody celebrating the destruction of the 2nd death star. damn... this new canon sure crashed that party
One of the things I never really liked about the whole operation cinder thing I feel like Palpatine would have been arrogant enough to believe that once he had power fully solidified there was no way he could ever lose it
Disney really had some effed-up writing. I mean that's so irrational and doesn't have any logic to it at all. That is a pathetic way to explain how the first order formed and came into play
Come on guys it was so obvious from the very beginning that Palpatine would be that big of a sore loser that he would make his people suffer the greater consequences over him getting killed even if it was all his own doing.
That would make sense if he was actually dead but he’s still alive so it makes no sense why he would allow it to be carried out since it works against him. As well as it also makes no sense why most imperials go through with it since most of them joined the empire for power, so why would they go through with an order that destroys much of the power they hold. On top of that if palpatine was truly dead he wouldn’t have had the imperials retreat to the unknown regions after carrying out the operation since he wouldn’t want the empire to survive without him if he was actually dead, he would have ordered the imperial to commit suicide or fight to the death against the rebels.
Hi love ur Vids
Thank you :)
@@StarForceOne O my god I can't believe u replyed.
Its a really messed up operation so if Palpatine couldn't be in power no one could kinda extreme
What's even more messed up is that the empire actually followed through with it.
Legends had its flaws too but I prefer the empire falling to infighting and division. Much more believable
@@DillsyYourDaddy67 you surprised you mean the same ppl that celebrated the death of an order than has protected them for centuries
Is this the comics cleaning up Abram's plot holes again?
Battlefront 2 campaign mode.
It originated from the Aftermath series - which are some pretty mediocre books.
I'd like to think that Operation Cinder could be considered canon, but does not lead to the creation of the First Order. It just ends with the Empire falling with maybe a little small group of remnants here and there, like Moff Gideon.
I wish they would have explained it better, it would have been another good way to connect why the new republic didn't have a powerful navy at the time. All the major shipyards that the New Republic could have gotten were destroyed.
So, the Star Wars version of the Nero Decree.
The first order don't exist to me. Disney sequel trilogy is non Canon. However I do believe there is another.
Should be called Operation Makes No Sense.
Well it does cause palpatines a massive narcissist
@@omarbaba9892 Not really because he's not an idiot.
THEY DESTROYED NABOO?! WHAT THE HELL?! DISNEY HAVE TRULY RUINED STAR WARS! Wait... If they're supposedly rewriting the sequels to make them better, would Naboo still be destroyed? I hope not
Palpatine tried to destroy Naboo in Legends too.
The Empire were the architects of their own downfall.
So true. I think the same can be said about the Jedi too
You're my gran discover in the late 2020
I wish we could see and empire civil war. Like thrawn tries to take control after palpatines death and also moff Gideon. 2 factions of the empire fighting for power would be cool
The biggest mistake jj Abrahm did to star wars was the purposed destruction of the empire. Operation cinder plus wiping out the rest at jakku. It's stupid on every level. And doesn't make sense. It left no room to play around with after
Star wars should have mentioned this in the squeals. would have made them a tiny bit more bearable
I started thinking Cinder was idiotic, but then you have to think about this. If things happen naturally, the Imperial Remnants inevitably get assimilated by the New Republic in some way shape or form. This way the ideological purity of the Empire is maintained. No compromise or blurring of imperial principles with republican rule.
Everyone questioning why old Palps would do this and I'm like... this man is literally the Devil of Star Wars. One of the greatest Sith. The Empire was just another means to an end. A way he could obtain all the resources of the galaxy and scour it for any knowledge and power to further his own. If he 'died' before he found immortality than why should it exist? The Sith are selfish and he shows that in 'if I can't have it or control it than no one can.'
Also, all the suffering, pain, misery and trauma of this Operation likely fed into the Dark Side and it's corruptive nature. So if he had any plans to survive death (yes I know TROS and Dark Empire are dumb but Legends alone has like a dozen other ways Sith try to avoid death so pick one), feeding the Dark Side might improve the success of those plans and give him a boost in power to return all the sooner.
Anyway I loved how the show included this and used it to give a previously simple character more depth and tie in the worldbuilding was excellent. The acting was great and the scene set up so well I couldn't help but feel immense satisfaction when fascist piece of crap officer got what was coming to him. I tip my hat to Bill Burr for his acting and the writers that came up with this scene. Well done.
God I hated operation cinder. Kinda killed my hardcore fan vibe.
Bah! It's only a hurricane if it comes from the hurrican region of earth. Otherwise it's just a cyclone.
Some form of Operation Cinder should have been the first sequel movie.
Hope you are all feeling well. Love the content star force one
I think this operation is dumb anyway still loved that episode and Mayfields acting this is the way
It was less about punishing his Empire for failing him, and more about engaging in Scorched Earth tactics against the New Republic. He didn't want the New Republic to gain territories and worlds of tactical, strategic, political, infrastructural, or agricultural value from the Imperial remnants, nor did he want them digging up imperial secrets or tech. So he had his loyal Imperials purge and scorch the worlds that still remained under their banner in order to prevent the New Republic from getting too much turf or getting too strong. The reason of him doing it to punish his Empire was just to confuse and distract the New Republic. The Contingency and Operation: Cinder also included having loyalist elements and Imperial assets flee to the outer rim and unknown regions so that they may help in rebuilding the Empire in the form of the First Order, later the Final order.
Operation Cinder makes very little sense to me-Particularly as Palpatine wasn't even dead (if the sequels are to be believed). I looked up when the first mention of this was made and it's from a comic in 2015. All of a sudden this makes more sense (or even less sense).
Not canon IMO. It makes no sense logically or in terms of the characters or setting. It seems to me more like a story device created by the writers as they realised that the Empire wasn't evil enough and because they needed a reason for the Empire to collapse quickly (even with the destruction of the 2nd Death Star the power of the Impierial army and fleet was colosal).
The EU books published in the early '90s had another explanation for why the Imperial army failed. It said that Palpatine was influencing all of his troops to give The will and the skill to fight. But when he was gone then they acted like cadets. Without a leader to pull them together they were little more than regional warlords with a small group of planets loyal to the Empire.
It's funny because when I was a kid watching ROTJ and there was no other Star Wars content it was just presumed the Empire failed at Endor and were routed. I think we all assumed that the majority of the Imperial forces were at Endor participating in the trap and therefore fell to the rebellion fleet. We didn't consider it more than that.
I know about operation cinder just because of the battlefront 2 campaign.
Operation cinder is just stupid. No imperial would have followed it if the plot didnt demand it.
Playing battle front 2 right now. Kinda felt like the matrix 😎 watched this video while playing got the history while walking on some planet I am on lol
That's so awesome!! Glad you enjoyed
Yes
Long live the Empire!
Every time they try to explain a throwaway remark like this and make a place for it in canon it just makes everything more ridiculous. So Operation Cinder happened a little after 4 ABY when the events of ROTJ took place. Migs and the officer had their conversation somewhere around 7 ABY when the events of Mando take place. "Now there's a man who knows his history". The history of max three years ago, you mean?
Ah... Operation cinder. The operation that came before operation resurrection that was used to create the 1st order
Operation Cinder is ridiculously. I feel like starwars has really been dumbed down over the last 10 years. These villians are cartoonishly evil and nothing the empire does makes any sense.
Empire still strong with or without palpatine
Long live the empire!
I’m not going to put this in my head canon because it just takes from the point of the OT and the ending of ROTJ
You may hate BF2 campaign, but you cant deny that SOME of u were happy when Mandalorian mentioned Operation Cinder
Operation Sinder have no sence. Why to destroy planets?
i started the campaign in SW battlefront 2 the other day and a lot of the time i was thinking about what it actually is lol
The biggest ragequit ever
Hello there
General Kenobi you are a bold one cough cough
Sloane appears in the Star Wars Squadrons fame
Few, they saved the Gungans.
Operation Cinder sounds chilling
Actually, the opposite. ;)
Man battlefront 2 had such a good campaign
Epic Mayfeld moment
Cal is training grogu.
Operation Shadow Hand made more sense than this! I wish all of the events after the Battle of Endor in Legends was Canon.