Why Palpatine Ignored Thrawn and Vader's Warning About the Death Star
Vložit
- čas přidán 26. 06. 2024
- Help support Star Wars Reading Club by purchasing items through Amazon: amzn.to/2qba0ZG
Twitch: / swrcgaming
Twitter: @SWReadingClub
Star Wars Gaming Channel: / @starwarsgamingclub2526
The Non-Canon Expert describes the reasons why Palpatine ignored the warnings from Grand Admiral Thrawn and Darth Vader concerning the Death Star. - Zábava
Thrawn: Your Majesty, I don't think it's wise to direct all our resources int..
Palpatine: ssshss!
Vader: Master, the imperial commanders are beginning...
Palpatine: shsss guys, just two words, "Giant Superlaser"
TheAllegiantTraitor "Even better sharks with fecking laser beams on there heads!"🤣
that's actually three :V
TheAllegiantTraitor best comment
TheAllegiantTraitor
Palpatine: "Build me something to blow stuff up, blow-w-w stu-u-uff up-p-p
Thrawn:Or we just build more Star Destroyers and put a massive cannon on it?
Palpatine:Noooo, I want a massive, unnecessarily large station that someone can mistake for a moon, and then say,"That's no moon,it's a space station."
Thrawn:Fine
LMAO
Darth Vader: Don’t be too proud of this technological terror you’ve constructed.
He should have said it to Sidious directly so he could say after the destruction "I told you so"
Maybe he did
Kemot300 remember, team evil. Zzzzzzzzap!!!!!!
Luke Baker and likely got a very "Shocking" retort from Palpatine for his trouble.
I did not get as far as I have by refusing to consider the advice of my subordinates.
It's hard to get good advice when Vader keeps Force-choking your subordinates.
Ironically, Vader ended up being the manifestation of the Force striking back at Palpatine.
Even more ironic is that of Death Star itself was the first step toward that.
*_I R O N I C_*
The only force that struck back at Palpatine was gravity.
@@AlphaQHard 😆😆😆😆😆🤣🤣🤣😂😂
Always had been.
Thrawn & Vader: Come on Papa Palpy, please don't...
Sidious: Dewit.
Only true fans read that in palpatines voice
Riksta 09 that's what I did I read it in his voice
DOING IT!
When making the 2nd death star: REnewit
In that voice where he sounds like he forgot to clear his throat before speaking.
If the Empire would have fallen to Vader and Thrawn to control I imagine no one would have ever been able to stop it. Between the two of them they had the greatest minds in aspects of war, battle and controlling populations.
Plus neither of them is as sadistic as the emperor so they would have been more focused.
i wonder how they would work together
Vader is just an attack dog, not a great strategic thinker. Thrawn would have had to kill Vader before Vader killed him.
+Commanderziff im sure vader is a competent commander, considering he was one throughout the clone wars
Honestly just Thrawn would be enough, with those resources no one would stand a chance.
"Vader is just an attack dog, not a great strategic thinker"
Go rewatch the first episode of season 2 of Rebels "Siege of Lothal" where Vader outsmarts entire Ghost crew and crushes their small fleet.
Thrawn's thoughts on super weapons
Malevolence: Strategically useful.
Death Star: Waste of resources.
Death Star II: Why?
Starkiller base: sTOP!!!
randumpotato What about Snoke's mega class dreadnought
@@Enderman54430 just another waste of money
@@morris9974 mobile shipyard and government equipped with heavy weapons. Nothing more then a battleship that expects the destroyers that surround it to swat flys while it deals the damage
-Fleet Sweeper
-The Planet Buster
-The Planet Busters Younger Brother
-The Spawn of the Planet Buster
If there is one Star killer Base II "Suit yourself. I am out of here." while flipping the finger.
It is not hinted to in the book, but given Thrawn's actual background - trying to avoid spoilers here - I would argue he was secretly also concerned that such a weapon could have eventualy been used against his own people, the Chiss.
Even though Vader seemed like the one more worried about the Death Star potentially being used against the empire and divide it in future power struggles for it, it´s not impossible that thrawn also had similar like thoughts but choose to shut his mouth about them at the time, for not knowing full well about the Death star at the time.
True
@@lkvideos7181 it directly hinten, when he talked to nightspawn at the end of the book. He said about the station, that it could alter his evaluation of his loyality to the empire.
@@Presbiter You're right. I kinda forgot about that part.
It's also possible, that sense it's implied that the death star is ment to stop a enternal threat from forming rather then being effective (stopping rebelling before it begins) that it does not matter if it's a effective actual weapon. However thrawn Knows of a external threat to everyone, the people his own race are at war with, which could be why he opts for more effective methods of weapons he knows a greater threat is out there
This is why Vader LET ONE REBEL SOLDIER GET AWAY with the plans. He hated the Death Star and was secretly hoping it would fail!!! IT'S OBVIOUS, how come no one has said that yet???
trkoby that is actually a really interesting idea
trkoby I was wondering why Vader took forever to force choke the last rebel instead of just skewering him.
trkoby
Interesting thought but that reasoning can be explained reasonably. The nameless rebel that had the plans that ran really couldn't be choked because Vader was under a decent amount of fire to begin with
Corporal Xander And maybe the force protected that rebel?
Juan Carlos Henng Guel Yep, the Force, plot armour, same thing. The Empire never stood a chance against a power that can just write killer teddy bears in to defeat it whenever it wants to.
I should have taken Thrawn's advice
If vader did not needed his suit he would have killed you as fast as he know he has a son
Papa Palpatine b-but...giant super lazer XD
Papa Palpatine yeah you should have listened
Papa Palpatine I guess you should it "do it"
Sebastian L. it's treason, then
There is certainly evidence of this is the book Tarkin. At one point in the book Palpatine is interrupted from his sith meditation in order to be informed about rebel activity and he is clearly very angry at the people who interrupted him saying "Must I attend to every trivial matter!"
Goes to show that Luke was right about him through and through, his arrogance was his weakness.
I thought Luke said his overconfidence was his weakness, not arrogance
Adam Fowler over confidence is arrogance
my faith in my overconfidance is my friend.
Adam Fowler stfuu
Palpatine was planning on making it the first space Circuit City but the rebellion was a bunch of die hard Best Buy fans. That's my Theory.
luckydog1351 this comment gave me life
luckydog1351 So, I guess the Second Death Star is HH Gregg?
haha! I believe so
Is Circut City even alive still? I haven't seen those since I was a kid lol
tpsu129 nah microcenter
In the Legends canon, Palpatine was also aware of the Yuuzhan Vong and was making preparations against them. Among the many ships of the Vong were massive 100 kilometers ships (by comparison, the Executor was 19 kilometers). A death star would be very useful to blast those apart.
I imagine a meeting between the Emperor, Thrawn, Krennic and some other high rankings imperial officers. Thrawn is trying to persuade Krennic and the emperor to not go ahead with the death star, after he finishes speaking, Krennic says how he believes the death star is a great symbol of power, however some other imperials have a skeptical expression and start to believe Thrawn. The room falls silent as The Emperor says:
DO IT!
Thanks for reading ☺️
Dew it.
Lord Dim 1 blew it
Do it. Build him...
Bailey Glyde I
Bailey Glyde DEW IT!!!
Darth Sideous was also willfully arrogant.
Darth Sidious NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!
Darth Sidious NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!
I am a Jedi
one does not simply ignore Thrawn
James Kennedy Commence order 66
Luke: Your over confidence is your weakness
thats why palpatine didnt listen. he was over confident in it.
man you would think he would have learned two lessons
not to be over confident and not to build another death star
itsko orihara Second one was a trap, and it almost worked. But Palpy was REALLY overconfident and arrogant.
itsko orihara
"And your faith in your friends is yours"
Lesson don't be over confident and don't rely on anyone lol
Know what I find odd? Anakin/Vader was always more in-tune with technology than Palpatine, yet Palpatine had such high hopes for the Death Star while Vader dismissed it.
Anakin loved technology. Vader likely grew to hate it because his suit made him miserable.
The fact that he was more in tune with tech is likely a big part of why he was able to look past the impressive display of power and just be like 'you know, in the long run this will probably be more trouble than its worth'
@@OsnosisBones and Vader was right, too bad the Emperor tried again with the second Death Star and was met with much the same results.
Things would have worked out if there hadn't been that one exhaust port
if it had no exhaust ports then the station would blow itself up. the fact it was the size of a womp rat was impressive. and the only reason that thing worked was cause goddamn magic space wizards.
Only one of those exhaust ports was a problem though. If I remember correctly, there were actually multiple options to deal with the reactor heat (or radiation?) but Galen Erso wanted the exhaust port for sabotage reasons and Krennic was all for it (according to the RO novelization)
but the exhaust port wasnt for exhaust galen erso put it there for the rebellion
I thought it was really the reactor system design itself that was the real problem. Galen Erso designed it so that any pressurized explosion in any part of the system would result in an uncontrollable chain reaction that would destroy the station. Had it not been for this, it's likely that firing down the exhaust port would have only resulted in knocking out a subsystem or a single reactor. A problem, yes, but not a catastrophe. Theoretically, a commando team and a block of C-4 placed in any part of the reactor system would have achieved the same result
You are right, Sadow. The reactor design was the problem, not the exhaust port. Besides, the "Galen Erso purposefully installed the exhaust port so that the Rebellion could blow up the Death Star" explanation was a bullshit retcon created as a middle finger to the fans.
"Don’t be too proud of this technological terror you’ve constructed. The ability to destroy a planet is insignificant next to the power of the Force." - Lord Vader.
and I'm inclined to agree, all those credits should have been used on the Imperial Navy and the Imperial Army.
Palpatine just had to...
dewit
Jew it
Juan Carlos Henng Guel lol
blew it
Hey Palpatine, what are we gonna do with this day old meat?
*Stew It*
@@unlimitedduckgamer lmao
So that's what went wrong with the Death Star. The Empire put too many eggs in one basket, and gambled most of it's enforcing terror on just one giant weapon. Nope, even the US Navy knows that doesn't work anymore.
The reason the death star failed was that the pilot who fired the shot that blew it up was force sensitive, something that no one would be expecting when designing the Death Star. A weak point is something that anyone can exploit, not just someone who can use the force to manipulate proton torpedoes in a way that defies physics.
Frank G Galen Eros would disagree :P
Halpin2006 yup and the fact that empire blew up Alderaan
Sideous really enjoyed plaent destroyers.
“Long time ago in a galaxy far far way”
Imperial officer: Emperor, Ive just come from Yavin 4. The rebels destroyed the death star we have lost.
Emperor: No. No. No you have lost (force lightening x 1000).
*turns and sits down*
Emperor: Lets build another death star :)
Thrawn and Vader: (facepalms -_-)
The officers:(Big face palm )
Well, he did kinda sorta build the second one just to lure the Rebels in his trap. Not very cost effective, but I guess the money ceases to be an issue when you rule the whole galaxy and your primary concern is to make yourself immortal through Force.
@@Kissamiess i wonder. depending on your point of view regarding continuity, it was said the super star destroyer that served as vader's flagship nearly bankrupted the empire.
This is why Vader and Thrawn should have been in charge
Vader has the good position he has, thrawn should be emperor
Bart Bouwman Thrawn is more a front line strategist.Not that is incopentent, but still idk how much experience has in managing an empire. Still, he probably would do a better job than palatine who had an "deceive,corrupt, and destroy from the shadows" tactic.
in the legends he created his own lil Empire, the Empire of the Hand, in the unknown regions
undertakernumberone1 how much organised was however? was it based on continuous war?
"The Empire of the Hand was an autocratic government secretly established in the Unknown Regions by Grand Admiral Thrawn of the Galactic Empire. With the support of Emperor Palpatine, Thrawn organized an expedition to explore and pacify the Unknown Regions while the Empire consolidated its rule over the known galaxy. Though the Hand was created as an extension of the Empire, its ideology was an amalgamation of Imperial ideals and Chiss principles. As a result, non-Human aliens were permitted to enter military service. The main objective of the Hand was to defend the galaxy from various threats within the Unknown Regions, including extra-galactic invaders."
starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Empire_of_the_Hand
The entire point to building such large forces overall was that Palpatine desired maximum death toll on both sides, it fed his dark side power... He didn't care about the destruction, it cost him nothing.
nothing but his life
Ol saint lit that was his arrogance not any type of death toll or military loss
Khorne care's not from where the blood flow's only that the blood flow's.
You're saying the destruction of the 1st death star made him more powerful, and that he may have willed it himself?
You don't need to blow up a planet to genocide it.
I can feel that hate flowing through you
I get ignoring the warnings about the first Death Star but why the f*ck would you try that shit again?
Also why does Palpatine not realise that the Imperial Navy could use the Death Star to try to take over the Empire?!
Well the second Death Star was used as a trap, and it did work brilliantly, the Rebel Alliance was almost wiped out. If Vader hadn't been so obsessed with Luke and just destroyed/or captured the shuttle carrying the strike team while it was in space the plan probably would have succeeded.
What I was gonna say, though it perhaps could of been better. Like having the ENTIRE IMPERIAL FLEET waiting for them like they did in the Infinity series.
PS: I know it wasn't the entire fleet.
“Don’t be too proud of this technological terror you have constructed. The ability to destroy a planet is insignificant next to the power of the force.”
Vader
The Emperor's views of the Death Star is VERY similar to Hitler's view of bigger weapons are automatically better. His defeat at Endor is similar to Hitler's in Berlin
dragonweyr44 Lucas did get a lot of inspiration from WO ll, even most weapons are built on WO ll designs, aswell as the uniforms, racism etc
Fuck... What is WO II ? I know just WW II
mapafius Sorry make that mistake all the time. It's WO ll in my native language and I always forget to adapt it.... whoops
You haven't heard of WO II? It was the bloodiest war in human history.
It began a fairly recent time ago in the galaxy we reside in...
Qantas Boeing 747-438
It does not sound realistic to me. I see the point you want to have with empire-nazi and umbara-vietnam but first order-north Korea? Where is any paralel? Even the Rogue one rebels look much more to me as some middle east soldiers with that "Saint city of Jedha (Jerusalem, Mekka) and their visage, but first order-north Korea i dont see it... Country that North Korea is way smaller than Allies but is First Order that small with comparision to new republic? I dont think so.
You forgot about General Tagge who hated the Death Star because he saw it as a waste of resources.
Trying to make something bigger costs more resources.
Vader and Thrawn: This is a bad Idea.
Papaltine: BEGONE THOTS
That left a mark💫
Had the Empire simply improved the efficiency of Base Delta Zero or orbital bombardment methods by making something similar to the Virus Bomb from Warhammer 40k, they could achieve a similar objective that the Death Star war originally designed for (instilling mass fear of annihilation into the galactic populous). I think the DS does make a little more sense if you listened to the old EU theories that Palpatine wanted massive superweapons in preparation for the Vong invasion, but since that is no-longer canon (which I think is better anyway) the Death Stars seem unnecessary. Then again, Palpatine wasn't exactly a real "empire builder," otherwise he wouldn't have relied on a man that thought blowing up planets would keep the other 60+ million docile.
too complicated.
Giant Laser.
simple... perfect.
it was not the only reason shev knew about other galaxies and he had outer galactic enemies and he built it to defend the galaxy against when the time came like with the vorg
MrImperatorRoma you don't appreciate simplicity my friend. Two words: GIANT SUPERLASER
didn't palps wipe out a planet with a virus in the republic commando novels? Not quite a virus bomb, but getting there.
MrImperatorRoma Helghast. I feel old now.
in hindsight, They should've had a few meetings on the cost effectiveness of the Death Star versus making super star destroyers, determined what was practical and economical, and which had quicker results
Destroy planets? You could do that with stardestroyers there was an order for it
@@jeannebouwman1970 plus the way ISD’s did it didn’t completely destroy a planet which means at the very least you could harvest raw material from what’s left.
Whadda yah mean they "blew up the Death Star"? Who's "they"!? What the hell is an Aluminum Falcon!? That thing wasn't even fully paid off yet! Do you have any idea what this is gonna do to my credit!?
Oh, just rebuild it?! Real fcking orginal!
Well where are you? Wait a sec, you've been flying around for two weeks trying to get a signal? Oh, you must smell like... feet wrapped in leathery... burnt bacon. Oh, I'm sorry, I thought my DARK LORD of the SITH could protect a SMALL THERMAL EXHAUST PORT that's only TWO METERS wide!
@Christine Taggart These are all quotes. Look up the emperor's phone call robot chicken.
Funny, he was trying to assure the force would never strike back, yet the force found a way by destroying his Death Star at the perceived day of victory, through a single pilot's precise shot.
The moment you believe you have total control is the moment you lose it all.
there is no thing as total control, when you think you have then it is an illusion that will blind you.
I always had a feeling Vader never really liked the Death Star just from watching Rogue One and A New Hope. Nice video.
Death star was made because Thrawn warned the Emperor of the Vong. The Death star would of one shot the Vong planet ship if not, two tap the sucker
+Gage Star That's legends not Canon.
you are so funny (⊙ω⊙)
No it was not. It was made because Tarkin wanted the ultimate weapon.
Gage Star Thanks for the explanation. Don't think I remember a lore channel bring that up. I forgotten about the Vong planet ship.
Could be Tarkins motives, but Palps ulterior motives were ever more great then just an ultimate weapon
- The Sith have a tendency to put all their eggs into one basket.
"Two there should be; no more, no less. One to embody power, the other to crave it."
~ Darth Bane
There's the theory that Sidius was preparing for the Yuuzhan Vong invasion -- was the death star also meant to be used against worldships?
Another Reason from the old Extended Universe.
The Yuuzhan Vong Worldships.
The Eclipse and the Death Star were designed to fight them.
The Emperor knew of the Yuuzhan Vong thread comming to the Galaxy 10-20 years ahead,
and he knew that he needed a Superweapon to fight the Worldships.
One of the Reason why Thrawn was not present at the Battle of Endor was that he was on a long range
probing mission against the Yuuzhan Vong.
But with the "Force Awaken" this alternate Timeline is putt aside.
Thank goodness it was put aside, too. The original explanation from the movies was so much better, anyway. Palpatine was an Emperor who didn't want to share power with the Senate, so he decided to replace loyalty to the Senate and the Republic with fear of the Death Star as a means of control to rule the galaxy. This is consistent with someone under the influence of the Dark Side, wanting power for its own sake, not wanting to share, and basking in the fear of others.
The stupid Yuuzhan Vong make it look like the Emperor wanted to protect the galaxy, as though there was some altruism in his intentions, which is not consistent with the Dark Side of the Force.
As a leader of a galactic empire myself (Stellaris) I know all to well what the Emperor was dealing with, dissension, and rebellion constantly taking your focus away from your main goal. Its important to squash that out ASAP. Very annoying. Classic example of over confidence. Lesson learned here ppl.
Thrawn: "Your majesty, we should consider splitting up our resources to.." Palpatine: "Shhh." After Destruction of 1st Death Star : "Yeah guys lets just build a little outpost to protect the Death Star from and guard it with 20 clone troopers, surely this cant go wrong"
That was "A legion of his finest troops". And he *let* the Rebels learn of the 2nd Death Star. He was so certain in his victory, he placed himself on the Bridge of the damn thing.
The only thing he didn't count on, which decided the victory for the Rebellion was the Teddy Bears Chuck Norris made at Build-A-Bear.
While this will be rather quite off-topic....
How much do you want to bet that if Disney had Michael Bay make a Star-Wars Anthology spin-off movie, it would feature four things: Super weapons that cause massive explosions, large Droids (think Dark Trooper models), a promotional beer tie-in with a Star-Wars inspired Cantina brew, and an Over-sexualized, supermodel/pornstar as a Twi'lek as the main character, trying to free Ryloth alongside a bunch of other babes running about alongside her in her freedom-fighter team?
(Yes, for those who read it before, I am reposting my own comment, but I just wanted this community of subscribers to see it)
Firestarter I'm all for it. I wanna see more hot twileks
FLufy As I said on another video's comments section, many people would flock over to see the hot mess, but that's just it: It'd be a hot action movie that would have a plot so bad, that would probably even make God himself cry....
Firestarter Dark troopers and hot twiileks may be a strong push factor for people thinking about watching it
***** I mean, they would be the most logical troops to deploy on a planet like Ryloth, so that the local populace doesn't try to seduce or distract their way past the organics such as Stormtroopers....
That and droids/robots are the only levels of character deph Michael Bay could write....
Firestarter lol burn!
I wounder how Thrawn would have responded towards the destruction of Alderan?
Maxwell Punick Probably disgusted and disappointed for a loss of artistic value, and would've foreseen that destroying one of the symbols of the Old Republic would've only stirred more uprisings instead of scaring people away.
Cybernik The Hedgehog Yes a certain response. I have always enjoyed Thrawn for his values that can't be simply seen by anyone else so it seems.
If he was in the same room as tarkin at the exact moment he gave the order he would most likely bitchslap him, for his stupidity.
Sebas G I would have to agree that in a mannor. Thrawn being in the position he was in couldn't simply hit Tarkin but I feel he would certainly like to. Thrawn would proably leave then go into his quarter's and flip a table or two.
All that lost art.
your videos are all great. I watch them all
keep it up
Superb analysis of the personal and military aspects of the Death Star.
Another example of Vader speaking illy of the deathstar is in episode 4, a new hope, he says "the power to destroy a planet is insignificant compared to the power of the force" Essentially meaning this battle station is not viable, I always thought Vader was displeased with the deathstar, and after rouge one that almost confirmed he resented the deastar.
Palpatine is still a fool
"Ironic."
Nice shoulder you have there
Would be a shame
If someone blasted it
dead by daylight person
"Sire, would you at least consider adding a few steel bars over the exhaust ports?"
- Darth Vader
Brilliant channel, this is so interesting! Cheers man!
“Don’t be too proud of this technological terror that you have created. . The ability to destroy a planet is insignificant next to the power of the force”.
When your two best advisors warn you against a decision like the Death Star it is best to listen to them they may be helping you out.
I love the little thing you do at the end of your videos. "If not for me, for ____" It kills me everytime.
As always, great video!!! 👍👍👍
My Alternative Theory: Remember when Obi_wan felt the destruction of Alderaan? Massive Death can then be seen as a signal generator. wrt the recent movies, Palpatine is searching for something in the outer unexplored territories. Events force his hand to try and cause Massive Death on Jakku, which fails. Was Palpatine trying to communicate with whatever is out there using Massive Death? Any why are those territories unexplored after many thousands of years worth of easy interstellar travel? (my hypothesis is that the thing he is trying to communicate with can damage Hyperspace routes.)
Louis Brown did u forget the video was why palpy ignored blue guy and black robot? (lol names r on purpose) Go back to your Old Republic roots, you little shit. Massive Death? you sure your not watching Star Trek?
I subed to this channel and I love it! :)
In Legends; the Death Star was part of a long-term plan against the threat of the 'Far Outsiders' that Thrawn informed him the Chiss Ascendency was aware of. With how much Legends material is being brought back into canon, only time will tell if the same holds true in Disney canon.
Vader and Thrawn: Palpatine, no.
Sidious: Palpatine YES.
He wanted the death star for the same reason every politician does stuff.
Imperial Credits.
Yeah I somewhat agree. The point of the Death Star wasn't to fight rebellion, it was to stop them from even starting in the first place. There were quite a few reasons Sidious decided to keep building it but I think there is 1 reason that gets insanely overlooked. We need to look at the political reasoning behind it as well. Sidious had to watch first hand as Galactic Senators smiled to his face and plotted behind his back. We see the huge number of ex-Republic and/or Imperial Senators who were a part of the rebellion. Sidious really wasn't a true Emperor. The Imperial Senate held a LOT of power and they could have easily removed Sidious from power if they wanted to and if they had banned together. We get a first hand view of this in the Saw/Geonosis episodes of Rebels. They tried to get evidence of Empire forces using chemical weapons to kill the entire population of Geonosis and bring that evidence to the Imperial Senate. I think this gives us some great insight into the true power structure of the Empire. Sidious was at the top but together the Imperial Senate was significantly more powerful than him. They would have never tried to get those bombs and bring them to the Senate if Palpatine truly "was the Senate" or if he was all powerful. If Sidious was truly was untouchable then they wouldn't have even thought about bringing those canisters/bombs before the senate In the early days of the Empire, the Senate was Sidious' biggest weakness. To remove that weakness he needed to remove the power the Senate had, disband them and find a way to ensure they didn't rise up against him afterward.
Maybe you're saying "well why did he have to make the Death Star, why couldn't he just disband the Senate" or "couldn't the Imperial Navy have handled any potential rebellions if he disbanded the senate." Let's look at the founding of the US. Taxation without representation was a MASSIVE factor. I think that gives us a really good idea into how these planets would react if they no longer had a voice in the Senate/Government. During the time of the US Revolution, their armed forces were nothing more than a rebellion against the most powerful Armed Forces on the planet. The British Army and Navy were superior in terms of numbers, funding, supplies, equipment, training and almost every other thing that's important to a good military. The US still ended up winning their independence. Now imagine if England had to worry about countless territories just like the American Colonies rebelling at the exact same time. Let's say they had exactly 100 and all of those were identical to the US. Now let's say 75% of them rebelled at the same time. Even with the 25 who stayed they still would have had no hope of winning. Now had the British have had a weapon that could destroy entire states....or even just entire cities, and showed that they would use said weapon, then the 75 would have never rebelled.
Anyway I think there is a few other reasons but the reason I mentioned above, at least IMO, is the biggest reason Sidious built the Death Star, why he ignored Thrawn and Vader and why he tried to build a second one after the first was destroyed. Again in order for him to truly say "I am the senate" he'd have to completely remove any and all power that the senate actually had.
Lastly I think there might have been some ulterior motives behind both Vader and Thrawn's reasoning as to why they didn't support the building of the Death Star, aside from those mentioned in the video. Both had incredibly big egos. Thrawn was a military genius and he knew it. Not only would a weapon like the Death Star make him expendable but he also would have thought he could build a fleet using significantly less resources and be far more effective at getting the job done. I believe Vader on the other hand saw the importance of soldiers. From his time as a Jedi up until his death, he saw what good soldiers could accomplish. He accomplished victories against overwhelming odds, time and time again, due to the force and because of the skilled soldiers fighting beside him. He himself was told time and again that something was impossible only for him and the 501st to accomplishing it. He saw the Death Star as nothing more than a machine and machines could be broken. In his mind it he probably saw it as nothing but a suped up Battle Droid. He destroyed the Malevolence with a handful of pilots and by simply changing a navicomputer, he broke an impenetrable blockades by making guided missiles hit the ship they were fired from and by crashing a Republic Star Destroyer into a separatist command ship, he broke in and broke out of an "impenetrable" prison that was built to house fallen Jedi and he either accomplished or saw first hand what could be done with the force and/or with skilled soldiers.
Charles S I think you forgot that the Senate answers to the Emperor, and that the emperor is capable of disbanding it.
+Salty Seagull Actually I think that is debatable and I'd even argue that isn't/wasn't true. There is a reason why the Emperor didn't instantly disband the Imperial Senate. It's because together they were more powerful than he could ever have been. It's why he wanted to build the Death Star in the first place and why he waited for the Death Star to be fully operational before disbanding the Senate.
It's even mentioned in A New Hope. It's why they're talking about how the Imperial Senate will never go along with them taking a member of the Senate captive. I believe right after capturing Leia an officer tells Vader that the Imperial Senate will NEVER go along with this. It's why Vader kills everyone and sends out a fake distress call and why he tells them to inform the Imperial Senate that they responded to the "distress call" but found no survivors. It's also why the officer that Vader talks to is so scared of the Senate finding out about their actions.
It's also why the officers on the Death Star are completely shocked to find out that the Emperor disbanded the Imperial Senate in the first place. They knew it would be impossible to hold the galaxy together without the Senate. That's when it is explained that each system will fall in line and accept it because of the Death Star. He couldn't disband the Senate for fear of rebellion from those systems but his answer was "after they see the power of this space station (the Death Star) they will have to fall in line and accept it."
Anyway if you rewatch a few episodes of Rebels and the first half of A New Hope you can kind of see that the Emperor wasn't all powerful. The Imperial Senate held a lot of power and it's why Sidious wanted to disband them but couldn't until after the creation of the Death Star. The fear of the Death Star was what was suppose to hold all the different systems in line and make them stay loyal to the Emperor.
(Edit:) It's also why in episodes of Rebels there are mentions of Rebel sympathizers. Minister Tua mentions a list of Rebel sympathizers. She offers to trade the list along with the true reason behind the Imperial operations on Lothal to the rebels if they can help her flee from the Empire. When asked why haven't the Rebel sympathizers been arrested she states "the Empire cant arrest them. These sympathizers have powerful friends in the Imperial Senate so the Empire can't do anything, all they can do is have them watched." It's also why the Empire had long suspected Leia Organa of being part of the Rebellion but could do nothing about it. It's even mentioned that "your ships have a strange way of being stolen by rebels and being used to launch attacks against Imperial targets." They knew she was giving ships to the rebellion but because they couldn't prove anything the could do nothing about it. They couldn't arrest her for treason or have her killed because the Imperial Senate would have never have gone along with it. The Imperial Senate held a LOT of power and it's why Sidious waited for the Death Star to be complete before disbanding it. Sadly for him the Death Star was destroyed and because of it the Rebellion grew in terms of both support and enlistment due to a number of planets losing their representation and their voice.
Thanks for the content.
Very good channel I hope more lore videos comes.
Johan Olsson Check out his crap ton of other great lore videos
That's how you know the dark side is shit. When the Force itself strikes back at you for perverting its gift.
We're gonna build the Death Star and we're gonna make the Rebellion pay for it! It's gonna be the biggest Death Star you've ever seen, it's gonna be huge! We're gonna make the Empire great again!
M.E.G.A.
xD
May the Trump be with you.
And we only need 5 quintillion imperial dollars to do it Bigly!!!😂
Going to build a Hyperspace barrier around the galaxy, and make the Mnggal-Mnggal pay for it
Yea ok calm down liberal.
8:06 “10 thousand years” that’s such a specific number
I remember back when I was really into Star Wars, it is easy to come up with a much simpler theory based on simple observation of the Death Star blowing up Alderaan - for a brief fraction of a second (of a strike only about a second long), what looked very much like a shield around Alderaan *blocked* the Death Star's superlaser. It stands to reason that a lesser attack would simply have bounced, and the Empire cannot threaten Alderaan with ordinary weapons.
I still don't get how tens of thousands of ISDs are an inferior way of policing the galaxy compared to a single Death Star. Granted people would be freaked out by the Death Star but the Imperial Navy could perform a Base Delta Zero with just three ISDs and, as such, could glass multiple planets at the same time.
Deamon93IT
You can't BDZ a shielded planet quickly.
Don't recall how fast a BDZ can be but that depends on how many ISDs you have at your disposal. With tens of thousands more ISDs around you might not be able to nuke a planet instantly but you can possibly glass ten or more planets at the same time in a matter of a few hours at most.
The Death Star galvanized the Rebellion, but it's easy to see how someone might think it would have the opposite effect. Understand that fear is an emotion, and because of this, it does not operate in a logical way. Cardiovascular disease kills more people than cancer, and cancer kills more people than terrorism, yet most people are more scared of terrorism than cancer, and more scared of cancer than heart disease. Mosquitoes kill more people than dogs, and dogs kill more people than sharks, but again, people fear sharks more than dogs and dogs more than mosquitoes. And it's not like the people killed by terrorists or sharks are somehow more dead than any other dead people. Dead is dead is dead. Fear is just not logical.
It is easy to imagine that people would be more scared of a Death Star than a fleet of Star Destroyers, even if the Star Destroyers are more efficient. It turned out that the Death Star ticked people off instead of scaring them, but it wasn't the worst idea.
"The ability to destroy a planet is insignificant next to the power of the Force."
The irony that the very weapon that Darth Sidious sought to use to keep the Force from back lashing against him was the very back lash he feared.
I love your profile pic.😎 Really suits this particular video.
Oh boy I bet those two really wanted to say "I told you so!"
This raises the question of why Palpatine became Emperor, if his goal was to learn the secretes of the Dark side to rule for 10,000 why not step down as Chancellor after he eliminated the Jedi learn those secrets and then assume full control once you have all the pieces lined up?
Because anyone else would either have screwed up those 20 years even worse. Or would have tried to backstab/kill him.
Also a lot of Empires Legitimacy came from it being the successor of the Republic and Sidious being the last elected Chancelor.
Not only did he ignore their concerns but he also chose to build a second one
I like this. Brilliant vid
So Thrawns policy was" size dosent matter its how you handle it"
i just noticed that in RotS the deathstar laser is already atached to the deathstar, but in rogue on it isn't
Haiko Brechters They probably took it off to finish the superlaser on the inside
yea i mean i don't have a problem with it, just noticed it haha
Until Rouge One it was built into the superstructure, not some plug and play accessory. It was my biggest gripe from the moment I saw it. Let's face it, when building something that scale you're not going to install something that big, requiring that much precision then just shove it in a slot like that at high speed. You fuck that up and you'll not only have to rebuild the superlaser but half the damn station too!
Haiko Brechters I don't think that's the super laser itself just the frame and probably the housing that it sits in.
Haiko Brechters The director of Rogue One explained that it's basically a frame or "cap" and that the Empire was trying to find the perfect one to be able to fire. That's why the first DS took 20 years, majority of it was finding a capable cap. When we saw the cap being placed, it was like the 100th model. Second DS took around 4 years because they already knew the cap they needed.
A Sith once said 'if the Force demands balance, then evil can never die'
Well I guess that means hope can never die, either. No matter how many Death Stars you build.
Love this!!
I can deffently agree with Vader and Thrawn about the Death Star
5:49 - Either I'm seeing a poor shadowing effect, or - looking closely at Palpatine's right-side wrist (just around where the wrist meets the robe) it appears that Ian McDiarmid is wearing white gloves over his hands (because it looks like you can see normal skin color at the base of the wrist)...
Though I admit I could (a. Be wrong, and/or (b. Overthinking things. Lol.
This is how I view it going down:
Thrawn: "Your majesty, Perhaps the building of this station is inefficient. We could spend these rsources much more effectively and strategically on a massive and undefeatable fleet --"
Palpatine: "Oh, really good there, Papa Smurf. Let's build thousands of smaller ships that CAN'T DESTROY PLANETS, after we've already spent quadrillions of credits on this humdinger that... Oh, I don't know, ACTUALLY CAN. Great. Just great. Did looking really hard at a Picasso tell you that one, Blue Man Group?"
Vader: "Perhaps as much as it pains me to say it, My Master, but Thrawn may have--"
Palpatine: "Ububububub... If the words "a point" are coming like a runaway locomotive to your grill, Vader, save it. I'm not taking advice from someone who can't even gain the high ground against Ewan McGregor."
"Aspirations" with that picture of Darth Vader... LOL
the amount of star destroyers the empire could have built
Is it me or is Palpatine at 6:54 looking with his left eye up and his right eye down?
Robin Janssen yes, I've noticed that in the past.
BREH! 😂
in the book "extragalactic flight project" i think it was called where Thrawn was introduced for the first time it was told that palpatine had a vision of a threat he wanted to be prepared for. This unknown threat of the unknown areas outside the outer rim turned out to be the Yuzhan Vong
To use Palpatine's words against him, "your arrogance blinds you" So, Palpatine's arrogance blinded him, thinking nothing would be able to destroy it
Palpatine was probably also high on the idea of raw power and dominance
I hate when ads freeze. I don't want to skip them in case you get the revenue!
HaloModder555 same
Palatine knew about the Yuuzhan Vong invasion, therefore needed a superweapon defend the Galaxy
I read the title to this video and got an image of Palpatine cackling, then the Death Star exploding with Palpatine having 😳 face, while Vader and Thrawn facepalm behind him.
in 0:25 Takin looks a little bit like Tywin Lannister :3
TheCaptainSwiss lol Ikr
GREAT VIDEO
Rule the Galaxy for 10,000 yrs??? Could the Emperor live that long? I guess, in the comics he did have clone bodies. Hmm... 10,000 yrs though. 🤔
oh yeah... hitler said the nazi reich would rule for a thousand years.
"Coincidence? I think NOT!"
Are you supposed to be Thrawn, is that why you show his photo In every video? Is it also why you speak monotone (I'm assuming you guessed that was his voice from reading the novel before he premiered on Rebels)?
It's his style and I like it. More unique and more interesting.
brandon lindsey
Thrawn is originally a Legends character.
Thrawn did not premiere in Rebels. Your ignorance about the SW universe is pretty impressive if you believed this, Thrawn has been around since forever, and is a highly beloved character.
And yeah, that's why the video maker use his image.
brandon lindsey guys, he knows about the books. He literally mentioned them in this comment! He meant primeried canonicly😒
Darth Revan
I assumed he meant the recently released Thrawn Novel, not the Legends ones.
I mean Palpatine wanted to build the death star since around the time of The Phantom Menace and the only reason it got destroyed so easily was because of the fail safe the Jyn Erso's dad built in. #canon
Gotta love how two Death Stars failed, and then Palpatine secretly runs the first order and one of his first projects let’s build an even bigger version of the Death Star that still has one major weakness just like last time and also once he wised up and finally mixed thrawn and Vaders idea with his own he decided to reveal himself before he scattered out his new ships and revealed them all in one place to the enemy, I mean it’s annoying the guy was a genius before and during the prequels and then once he was in control in the open he just was a complete imbecile, I mean half of his stupidity can be blamed on the sequels writing, but even Lucas had him make the mistake twice in the OT
“Ever since I was a little boy, all I wanted was my own planetary super weapon. Is that so much to ask?”
Because he was the senate.
Palpatin was afraid of a threat from the unexplored space....what was that threat????Is it possible he made the death star only because he wanted to have a strong weapon again that threat??
Dingaling Vong!
Yuuzan Vhong are what he was fearing
They where powerful and could easily invade the galaxy also he just wanted to have a large super weapon at his fingers and a good excuse
the Death Star was in the works ever since the start of the Clone Wars (and possibly a little earlier too), when the Separatists used to work on it. Palpatine learned of the Vong after he met Thrawn, which was way after the Clone Wars. Plus with Eclipse dreadnoughts, the Death Star would eventually become redundant.
Palpatine was, in the end, a politician, and thought like a politician. He was enamored with the symbolism of a superweapon. In that sense there are clear parallels between Palpatine and certain real world dictators with no (or very limited) military experience. Also, like Luke said, Palpatine's overconfidence was his weakness.
Palpatine - "This hyuge laser will be just... just beautiful. Wait and see. I'm telling you it will be perfect, and that's because I've built many great buildings. I know. Hyuge."
thrawn was right tbh xD you could've built dozens super star destroyers and cruisers to further the influence of the empire across multiple systems but noooo palpatine wanted to make a super laser