E10 - Aaron Boone Ejected After Lengthy Argument with Larry Vanover's Crew over Tito's Catch Review
Vložit
- čas přidán 11. 04. 2023
- 2B Umpire Larry Vanover ejected Yankees manager Aaron Boone during a Replay Review of 1B Umpire David Rackley's catch (out) call on New York CF Aaron Hicks' attempted catch of Josh Naylor's fly ball. Boone alleged that Cleveland manager Terry Francona didn't challenge the play before time ran out so the umpires shouldn't have allowed a review. Report: www.closecallsports.com/2023/...
Facebook: / closecallsports
Twitter: / closecallsports
Discord: / discord
Confusing on this play resulted from several points of miscommunication and misunderstanding.
First, upon Hicks' catch and subsequent inning-ending double play at second base (tag up appeal), replays indicate that Guardians manager Francona visually indicated to HP Umpire Chris Guccione that he wished to consider challenging the play (the "hold" signal). Upon this occurring, Guccione walked to the Yankees dugout to inform Boone that there may be a challenge/the inning might not be over.
Before Guccione finished his explanation, however, the in-stadium scoreboard showed video replay of the play indicating the fly ball had not been caught. Meanwhile, the umpires had chosen on their own to get together to discuss the play. Official Baseball Rule 8.02(c) allows for umpire conferences to discuss calls and potentially change a call that might have been erroneous.
The Cleveland ballpark video staff improperly interpreted their conference as a bona fide Replay Review-which it was NOT-and ran a graphic on the board saying the play was under review (when it wasn't).
This naturally confused Boone, as Francona had NOT formally challenged the play yet-he had just requested a "Hold" .... When the umpire conference ended, the crew opted NOT to change the call, so at that point Francona formally filed the manager's challenge on the catch/no catch call (on field ruling: catch/out).
Boone was ejected arguing Francona took too long to request the replay review, as a 15-second clock limits a manager's ability to communicate their intent to challenge or consider a challenge.
Again, though, replays indicate Francona DID signal "hold" to Guccione within the time limit, but due to the miscues that followed combined with the complications of an inning-ending play and an umpire-initiated crew consultation that had nothing to do with the Replay Review, Vanover ejected Boone for continuing to argue during the Replay Review itself. - Sport
The crew chief should’ve tossed Boonie the second the lineup card was turned in with Hicks in CF
He did! Boone was ejected from the game.
@@ScottysAiryou missed the joke lol.
This is the best comment on yourube
you stole my comment dammit
No way the crew chief was going to do that given, as we later learned, he is not a Yankee fan.
Also, I’m confused why no one‘s talking about Hicks dropping two fly balls in the same inning - though both were diving chances.
MLB really needs to increase their usage of the umpire microphone. In a situation like this a lot of confusion could be cleared up simply by making announcements about what is happening. Tell everyone that you are huddling to discuss the on field call. Tell everyone that Cleveland still has time to make ask for a review after the on field huddle is over. Tell people what is going on instead of making everyone guess
That's what Jimboy is for.
@@pdxbohica Jomboy
No confusion. It was a bad call and should have been overturned. If a manager gets mad at the ump for a player missing, then that is bad management and theatrics
There was plenty of confusion.
@@MrBrianboissellecleveland didn’t challenge in time. Thats what boone argued.
I was watching the Yankee feed for this game. The announcers were sure Francone never made any attempt to challenge. It was so strange I had to find a video to explain it to me today 😅
what is a "hold signal"? Don't you have to either challenge or not challenge in 15s? Why wouldn't you just "hold" on every play?
Hold is to ask the pitch clock not to start and gives you the time to get in one look to determine if you want to challenge. The umpires can deny a hold if its an obvious call (like asking for a potential fair foul review on a double in the gap, or a catch call on a routine fly ball).
I think this video explains it better of what happened then major League baseball did to Aaron Boone. I bet if they would have said this to Aaron Boone on the field when he was arguing. Then after the game when he was talking to MLB. This would have all cleared it up more.
MLB just did a poor job all around on this
Nooooo, the umps never poorly communicate. Never...
Bottom line is Hicks DROPPED not one but TWO fly balls in this inning.
I hope he moved in a step or two after this clip
Shut it, hicks is the goat
@@tabbstabbs6455 🤣🤣
Bottom line is umps blew the call in situation. As soon as his hand went up for hold the review process is in play. No huddle should've taken place until the manager makes a decision to review.
They need flags to throw or a buzzer that they can hit that goes directly to the ump (like the pitch clock)
How about a red baseball??
That's actually a really good idea. I remember an ejection where the manager (Tito I think) clearly signalled for a review but the umpires never looked over. Having a system like that would (a) get rid of the issue of umpires looking over, which also is nice since they have 50 other things to do, and (b) add a record of the timing.
Like Press Your Luck. Slap that button and a giant "Challenge Light" lights up over the dugout.
This whole situation looked worse by the crew running the jumbotron showing the play before the situation was settled…. I’m sure the league will look at this and make sure it doesn’t happen again ….. this puts the umpires in a bad spot and they can do that all on their own
The problem is that the umpires only conferenced after the replay was shown on the scoreboard. Home plate umpire was talking to Boone then conferenced with field umpires. Conference should have taken place right after the play, I am guessing it was 30 to 40 seconds after the play. A continuous shot of the home plate umpire would show the delay. Francona was do his review but the conference gave him extra time to look at replay. So what made the umpires decide to conference? Replay on scoreboard?
One additional point. You can’t point to them not changing the call to say they weren’t influenced by the scoreboard. How often do conferences lead to changed calls? Almost never. The whole reason we have replay.
They need to stop showing replays on the Jumbotron before a team elects to challenge.
LMAO clueless they got the call right
The moving parts are what makes this difficult. The reality is during a baseball game, it's difficult if not virtually impossible for the two dugouts to be 100% focused on what the other is doing at all times, so it's not out of the question that no one from the Yankees dugout saw Francona's initial "hold up a minute here!" - which would be easy to miss in all fairness, not like he's out there on the field making that gesture. (Not a criticism by any means - a visual indicator would help!) In the end it's less a question of whos right/wrong and more a question of why are we still catching snags in a system that's been in play for long enough, three buttons on the dugout, hold up, challenge, no challenge.
Long-time Yankee fan here. On the one hand, I wanted the catch and the double play to stand. However, on the other hand, they eventually got the call right, so I don't feel too bad. Plus of course, the Yankees did win the game!
Tito signaled that he wanted his (Guardians') replay guy to take a look. However, following that, the Guardians then are supposed to have 15 seconds to actually call for the umpires -- or I guess, the MLB people in New York -- to take an "official" look. There's no indication that Tito actually did that. That is, until several MINUTES later, when the umpires ASKED him if he wanted to request the replay challenge. That's clearly outside what's permitted by the new 15-second rule, or even the old (20-second) rule.
Undoubtedly sometime later this season, a similar situation will arise in a game at Yankee Stadium, where the shoe could be on the other foot. If there's a situation where Boone fails to challenge and the fans in the stands see a scoreboard replay showing an obvious bad call against the Yanks, it will be hard to imagine what the Yankee fans -- especially the bleacher creatures! -- will start throwing on the field. Will the umps then do the right thing and call for help to correct their bad call? I suspect -- we shall see!
All that said, I'm still waiting to read MLB's take on yesterday's play.
@@TruthSage1 While tito is still in the decision timeframe, the umps decide to confer, but first the HPU goes to explain what is happening to Boone.
@@danielplotkin1586 Still in WHAT "decision timeframe"? For the umps to make their call (they (the second-base ump) already had -- "OUT"!) or for Francona to decide whether to challenge?
@@TruthSage1 the problem and the main issue is that Tito was signaling that he was considering a challenge but then the Umpires wanted to get together which unfortunately pauses any challenge decisions regarding the previous play since they wanted to make sure on their final ruling meaning whether there was a catch or not and if there was a catch then did the runner from 3rd score in time? Tito can't challenge anything until the final ruling happens.
Following the game, MLB heard what happened and fully defended the Umpires so it's clear that they were happy with how it was handled if it wasn't by the book then someone would've gotten in trouble.
Damn, a change in words and we could've had money in the bank for getting your money's worth instead! 😂
Saw this happen live - it was definitely confusing. Not sure how Boone was permitted to come back on the field two-three times after he was already tossed tho.
Who was going to stop him? I bet he gets a fine from MLB
Really
@@James-py6kf The MLB could technically have suspended him for doing this. I remember in an earlier season Bryce Harper got a one game suspension for returning to the field after he was ejected.
In the comments: This call was incorrect because it was unfavorable to my team. Later in the season on the same situation: This call was correct because it was favorable for my team.
It's sports dude, logic isn't necessary
pretty much correct, fans rarely care about calls unless it's bad or good for their team.
It wasn't miscommunication, it was a coach being stupid that wanted his way.
correct, the Umpires have authority to decide on things that aren't covered by the rules, nothing says regarding what to do regarding replay challenges after a meeting of the Umpires, people can be upset about that all that they want to but it's not in the rules so the Umpires get to decide how to address it.
Great breakdown. You made it understandable!
BTW, the umpire is pronounced, Gu- Cho- Knee. He told me so and the umpires are on MLB video saying their names.
Prove it.
Gooch is a fine representative of Colorado. A great man.
GOOCH
Here's what I don't like though - if there is replay in use, don't confer together and give more time (or the appearance thereof) to make a decision about taking the replay. Yes I know he put his hand up to hold, but after they talk then Gooch finally asked Cleveland if they wanted to challenge. Just ask them during the 15 second window and be done with it. I know all the things they did were allowable under the rules, but it also in a round about way baited Boone into this ejection.
I get your line of reasoning, but then if the manager says yes, challenge, but the umps confer and change the call, then the other manager got extra time to look before deciding.
Seems like managers should be given a challenge flag to throw on field
That wouldn't have changed this situation at all though.
I'm surprised Boone knew the 15 second rule... because it's Boone.
If the Yankees had a better center fielder the inning would have been over and none of this would have happened.
If the ump admits his mistake or another ump says yeah he dropped it, can't the Umps just say we made a mistake? In the end the Umps did the right thing.
Yes, a crew conference can overturn a call. It’s the way it was done before replay.
In this case, there was only a conference to discuss it because of the reaction/replay… the umpire that made the call had the best view and it was so difficult to see the drop in real time that he had no idea it happened. Take the environment away, and the umps wouldn’t have convened and wouldn’t have given the Indians a lot more time to realize and challenge. The fact that they pointed to Francona putting his hand up is silly because that’s almost instinctual with any close play and they weren’t challenging in time
@@pidayrocks2235 They were literally explaining the conference to Boone when the crowd reacted.
The correct call should always be enforced. Why would you be mad about this?
Baseball is as crazy as a telenovela. This happened and that happened, but he did this, no they did that, etc.
Insane he got hit in the head after ejecting the skipper.
Why's there a 2-minute umpire consultation? To decide whether they missed the call? That doesn't take 2 minutes.
What did Boone not understand, Yankees booth the most biased booth in sports
Awful handling these calls and Boone wanted this ejection. Surprised that he didn't get tossed earlier this year
Raises the question: Was placing a 15 second time limit on manager's challenging a call a good rule? Is 15 seconds too much of a rush?
I preferred the original way when they had until the start of the next play. It almost never took longer than 30 seconds and the battery was almost never set before the challenge was requested.
Was at this game it was crazy how many times he went in and out of the dugout after getting tossed! The fans there including myself were going nuts when they showed the replay! Thanks Lindsey for a great explanation!
Again, know the rules. Boone was totally right.
@@bruceterhune3400 did u watch the video?
@@bruceterhune3400 You watch the vid?
Cool you were at the game. I’ve seen one game at the big ballpark in the Bronx. Yankees walked it off. I saw Rivera get 6 outs days before he retired. The captain was injured. I had my Red Sox shirt on. Beautiful Sunday afternoon. Went to Stan’s pub after the game. Great ballpark
@@rayray4192 Awesome! That must have been a blast getting to see Rivera do that before his career ended!
Who backhands that ball?
Thank you for a clear breakdown
CF move in 2 steps all 3 catches are made. How weird was the placement😂
He didnt even need to slide for the only actualy catch
Also, not being able to petition a game is bullshit.
Baboone’s antics are so old
Does the umpire conference freeze the replay clock? If it doesn't, then regardless of Cleveland signaling hold, I gotta side with Boone in that it's more than the 15-30 seconds. Another possible "solution" would be that the team has to call for a replay review, within the time limit, but if the umpire conference overturns the call of the field, then the team can "retract the challenge" and it's like they never tried to challenge it.
I'm also ignorant of the rule. Do you have to declare a review challenge in 15 secondsof the play happening, or just declare you are thinking about reviewing it in 15 seconds. The later was the explanation but seems against the spirit of the pace of play rules.
I don’t know what the rule says, but it makes sense that while the umps are conferencing then there is no actual ‘call’ to challenge until they are done conferencing.
The replay clock doesn’t start until the conference ends and they make a final call. Francona immediately challenged when informed of the final call. And the point of replay is to correct clear and obvious wrong calls. I’m not sure anyone can argue this didn’t meet the intent of replay. It was created for this exact situation.
Yes. The umpire conference is where the actual "call on the field" is decided. Only when the crew conference ends has the final call be decided, and the time allotted to challenge a play begins to tick. Tito's challenge was timely.
If you thought about it a different way, what if they did reverse the call? Does NY not get to challenge because they didn't know the call went against them until 2 minutes after the play?
That wouldn't make any sense, so Cleveland must get the same opportunity to challenge after the conference.
Watching in real time, it looked like a catch and a double play. Question: If the catch and therefore the double play had stood, but the runner from third (Steven Kwan) crossed the plate before the out was made at second base, would that run still count? I believe that the answer to that is "YES". Does anybody know for sure?
Yes. A tag up is not a force out. It is a live-ball appeal play. Appeal plays are time plays: if a run scores before the appeal is executed, the run counts.
The answer is yes, because a tag up out is not the same as a force out, even though the mechanic of obtaining the out (touching the base with ball in hand) is the same. In this case the runner did not score in time had the call be upheld.
Guconni is my sister in law cousin and a great guy and awesome ump.
2 things.....1) While I have to give them the benefit of the doubt, by only seeing the YES broadcast as all this was going on live, you would have. thought Boone was completely valid in his meltdown, but obviously, not so much! 2) Aaron Hicks is NOT a good major league CF....watch all 3 similar plays in that inning? He slows up for some reason, and the way he angles his glove looks soooo awkward.
3. Aaron Boone is not a good MLB Manager.
they should give managers a red flag to throw onto the field like they do in the NFL, so when they want to challenge everyone knows about it
so many people in these comments did not even watch this video 🤦♂
It appears that the umpires didn't want to flat out reverse the call, but most likely knew that it wasn't a catch, so when they went to Francona, they knew that he would go ahead with the challenge and the call would be reversed.
There's a lot to hash out for the on-field call. Catch or no catch first: if the covering umpire isn't 100% on the catch, are any of his partners 100% certain that they have a view of a no-catch? If so, and if they reverse their own call, where should they place runners? Next comes the live-ball appeal and the time play of the run scoring or not: do they rule that the run scored on the play or not? The crew decided to stick with the (incorrect) initial call of a catch and the (correct) call that the runner did not touch the plate before the live-ball appeal of a base left too soon at 2B.
When NY reversed the catch to no-catch, the play at 2B became nothing, and the run scores with 2 outs.
Man this is all so dumb. Just have a sky ref that can signal the field to overturn the play, none of this challenge nonsense.
Especially if “pace of play” is such an issue
So 1B has catch/no catch on that at :41. Tough sequence.
First base umpire out. His call.
@@rayray4192 It was going to be hard to make ground on that call but the angle of replay that showed the ball coming out was very similar to the 1st base umpires view. In lieu of distance, I feel he should have stopped in a set position, especially since it was a trouble ball. He is clearly jogging out while the catch/no catch occurs. I feel that's a teachable moment and hopefully T-Mac can cover something similar to that. There was a chance to get this call right during the play which would negate all of the replay tom foolery that followed.
@@joshnaudi you are so right.
@@joshnaudi you are right. Get set, make a call, and then move toward the fielder as you signal. Makes it look like you were closer than you were.
You should work for Major League baseball doing a great job❤
I love Aaron Boone.
It’s should be about getting the call right.
....and adherence to the rules.
Cool, but following the rules in place comes first. Always. 100% of the time.
@@frmrfr nooooo you cant get the call right because its not in the rules!!
this is why baseball is dying.
I agree but it needs to be done in a timely manner. We have the rules so they need to be followed. If Cleveland was not the home team they are not showing that replay on the jumbotron like that. The fact that a jumbotron operator gets to change umpires minds to help one team over the other is not fair. That might not have happened in this game because from both videos on this I have watched its hard to get an accurate timeline and watch the field of play. It sure seems like the replay could have caused them to have their meeting which gave the Guardians more time to challenge. Another game from a few days ago had something similar where the umps saw a replay and then did a huddle and fixed an obvious error. This is great because they got it right but when the priority is getting it right only when it helps the home team that is not fair. That and just for pace of play reasons it should be a quick decision to challenge or not so one team does not get to benefit from additional help.
I get it that the umpires conferred, but that allows the Guardians two extra minutes to decide if they want to challenge. The 15 second limit was suspended which violates the rule.
right? If you challenge and then they confer and change the call, then you should be allowed to "unchallenge" if needed, but the 15s should be from when they play ends.
The problem comes if they change, would you allow the others to challenge? Because I guarantee they'll already be looking at whether they should if the call changes.
For me, there are 3 'fair' options:
1) the timer starts once the final callis made, including after a conference. That's the interpretation here, the one I suspect will be the case going forward, and the one I personally like.
2) the 15 seconds from the end of the play is absolute, and no one can challenge a call like this, whether it's overturned or not.
3) before any conference the umpires need to consult both managers and get a commitment as to whether or not they intend to challenge for each potential result. That seems utterly fraught with danger, as well as completely unwieldy.
Any other option leads to a situation where one side is allowed to challenge after a longer period than the other. It's not perfect, but I believe this option is best.
Why didn't you arrange it in why do you get ejected from the game
Did the umpires call for a review?
basically what happened was the play happened, Tito held up his hand which is his signal that they're considering challenging a play, the umpiring crew got together to make sure the ruling was correct since there was a lot of moving parts to it, the Umpire went over to tell Tito this since the timer pauses if the Umpires have their own conference and to let him know that the rulings still stood so at that point the timer to challenge a play restarts so he went and asked Tito if he was going to challenge and Tito said he was going to.
Boone didn't understand that Umpires having a conference means that there's no ongoing timer because there's nothing to challenge until they have made a ruling.
I'm a bit confused by the reference to "all the missteps along the way" beginning at 5:18. Based on what you laid out in the video It doesn't look to me like the umpiring crew did anything wrong. Or are you talking about the Cleveland scoreboard operator(s)?
Yes, the scoreboard/visuals.
Yep , you can't listen to the scoreboard or the announcers! They have no idea what's happening. Cant trust the scoreboard for balls and strikes nor how many outs. Announcers trying to explain rules are stupid to.
The umpires are not allowed to make a ruling or change a ruling based on replays shown on the scoreboard
Yet here they conferenced up and changed the ruling after seeing the replay on the scoreboard then allowed Cleveland to challenge the play that is 2 separate violations of the rules by the umpires
@@griffenberg ...but they did not change the ruling on the play when they saw the replay. The call on the field after the conference was that the ball was caught, that's why CLE still had to review.
Great job with the breakdown of this. Aaron Boone, after the game, basically said that the crowd made this call. He’s one of my favorite people in the game and loved him as a player. But, in this case, he’s wrong.
He’s my favorite manager to hate. I couldn’t hate girardi because he looked too much like a doofus to get angry at. Boone is very arrogant so I love hating him.
You’re not allowed to signal to hold tho… they made a huge point of it all offseason as part of the rule changes that you can’t just hold your hand up to decide, and you have 20 seconds to do so… ridiculous take to say francona should ever have the right to challenge here, whether they convene or not. francona would have already have to have decide by then, and by a long shot
@@mpkid1 they called a conference instead of a review because clearly another ump saw that it was dropped. a conference is a time out. francona doesnt know if he even still needs to challenge until they finish their conference. if they overturned it during their conference, which they sometimes do, there would be no need to replay. they didn't overturn it during their timeout, so they allowed the challenge to take place. you sound dense
@@davruck1 a. umpires are not allowed to review a non home run before the 8th inning b. holding your hand up only affords you 15 seconds, no more, and that much is very clear. what the video above doesn’t show you is far more than 15 seconds transpire before even the umpires convene, so there’s no excuse of a “time out”. They made a huge point of it all offseason, and this frankly such a poor look on the umpires here who completely made a mess of this.
“Once the manager alerts the umpire to a potential challenge, the umpire will initiate a 15-second timer. The manager must then decide whether to challenge the call on the field before that timer reaches zero. Otherwise, any challenge request would be denied.”
@@mpkid1 umpires can call a conference to get help from other umpires or to discuss other issues at any time. That’s considered a time out. That means they hadn’t made an official ruling until the conference was over. The timer didn’t start until the conference was over because they never made a ruling until they consulted with each other. If a ump asks for help, or another ump thinks the call was blown, the call doesn’t count until they consult. You sound really dense. It was clearly explained. How are you this as slow?
I don't understand Cleveland's coach just putting up his hand to "hold" for a possible challenge? I thought they had 15 seconds to make up their mind? If that is the case, then they can not challenge this.
They do, but the conference means that until the end of it there isn't a decision to challenge. We know what the decision WAS, but not what it IS. If you think an overturned decision could have been challenged it's only fair to think an uphelp one can be - otherwise one team is getting extra time (which I guarantee they'll use the moment the umps get together) just because the original decision went their way.
Even by your standard, the 15 seconds hadn't expired before the conference. Also, the manager has to immediately signal first, that he's thinking bout challenging, then the 15 seconds start. The conference stop the replay time, when they're done they then go to get what Terry's decision was.
That's so the replay doesn't get put up on the board.
Is that a time play?
The catch would be a time play if it was caught.
Isn't the important part that they eventually got the call correct?
Yes, getting the call correct is top priority.
Yankees are cheap
@@rayray4192 I disagree… following the rules is most important, because there will be plenty of missed calls as a result of the rule that you only have 15 seconds to challenge… so for the umpires to pick and choose when to give teams more time to decide is unfair.
@@pidayrocks2235 you don’t understand what happened . Watch the video and listen. Was the ball caught in flight? Was the ultimate call correct? Getting the call correct is always the ultimate priority. Boone wanted an out on a fly ball not caught. He doesn’t care about rules. He wants to win at any cost. He has no honor.
@@pidayrocks2235 try watching the whole video next time.
I think you got this one wrong. As I understand it, the umpires’ conference was to discuss the timing play. Since at that point there was no issue as to the catch or the out at second base (and therefore the end of the inning), there was no reason for there to be an extension of the 15 seconds to allow that challenge. (The fact that the initial hand went up to say they were considering a challenge only gives you the 15 seconds to challenge.)
Richard my understanding is you are incorrect. Regardless of why the umpires conferenced, they were discussing the play. Once they make a decision, they tell the managers. At that point the manager can challenge anything that happened with that play. Up until that point, the manager can’t challenge because a final ruling hasn’t happened.
I can’t find support for your argument in the rules. Can you direct me?
Also, it seems like the 15 seconds ran long before the umpires decided to conference, and the Cleveland players were already taking the field, so there was no suggestion from their behavior that they were awaiting a ruling. And, if the umpires, had a cogent
explanation, such as your argument, it’s unlikely Boone would have got that angry, and it seems like the justification changed multiple times, and long after the fact.
The Yankees still won, and the ruling ultimately was correct, so this is a matter of rules, not Yankee hating.
@@richardlevine1646 im not saying this is in the rules, but the umpires did make this claim after the game, namely that the protest clock didnt start until after their huddle and after the huddle, the indians did timely protest.
Got it
@@johncaccamo That was my understanding as well. The 15 second challenge clock starts from the time the call is made which was after the conference. I don't see Lyndsey addressing that important part.
But WHY was he thrown out.
dunno what he said but could be ejected for any reason such as saying something inappropriate like insulting an Umpire or perhaps he kept arguing with them after he was warned to stop, it doesn't matter whether Boone thinks he's right or not, at the end of the day it's gonna be seen as his attempt to delay the continuation of the game hence why they generally let players and Managers argue but if they continue after being warned to stop then they're going to get ejected every single time.
Well explained!
Cleveland Announcers > Yankees Announcers
Lol. Announcers should know the rules. Its not like this is a second job for them....
Scoreboard operator should learn them!!!
@@bruceterhune3400 true. But think about it. They call a what four hr game five days a week. Throw in make up or whatever lets say an hour per game. That is a 25 hr work week. Id say a few hrs a week isnt too much to brush up and keep up with rule changes.
@@davemoody9868 , they really don't know any rules let alone the changes to them!
@@stevehamman4465 yes. Hence my statement that they Should know the rules.
Facts smh
It Actually wasn't a TRAP, it was a Dropped ball! A Trap is when the ball hits the GROUND FIRST then it enters the GLOVE!
Aaron Boone definitely got his money’s worth
ping!
🪙
It was horseshit!
I disagree with the statement that the umps managed this correctly. First of all, the "hold" sign doesn't mean anything; they should have waited until Francona either challenged or not. Instead, before waiting for the 15 seconds window to be over, the PU approached Boone "to explain" what just happened - there's no reason to explain anything: "it's a catch, runner's out at second, score this run, inning over." By not waiting for the challenge window to be over - for both managers - they just created this horribly looking mess, even if at the end they get the right call.
MLB agrees with what they did so obviously they have no issues and they will say something if an Umpire makes a mistake when it comes to applying the rules.
There is nothing wrong with the umpires getting together to discuss the call and make a final decision.
Should be like NFL. Have until next play to challenge
Nope
All the usual suspects are getting thrown out early. Wonder who'll be next.
You give Boone too much credit. He knew the ump conference stopped the timer because the on-field call was being discussed before it was finalized. He knew Francona was within his rights to initiate the challenge after the umps finished their conference. He was just pissed because it was a painful reversal of fortune, and frankly, it seems that Boone likes to tossed. However, it is unfair to the Yankees that, effectively, Francona got minutes to review the call instead of 15 seconds. He even got to see the visual evidence himself on the stadium scoreboard! Given the rules there's nothing the umps could have done but grant the review, but it certainly exploits a loophole that in this case benefited Cleveland.
Francona himself admitted he never challenged the catch/no-catch. He never did until he umpire asked him if he wanted to. They got the call right, but they broke their own rules doing so.
@@jeraldwilson8185 what rules? Show me in the books where it says that Umpires can't do reviews after they have a meeting of the Umpires, you are under an assumption that such a thing exists where in actuality, reality and actual factual information, MLB explicitly gives the Umpires the clear and absolute authority to rule on anything that is not covered by the rules.
I'm getting sick of replay for ALL SPORTS... it's creating more problems than it's solving. Same with that damn strike zone box on TV telecasts... get rid of them.. this sport was good for over a century without it.. we can go forward without it.. funny how since it's implimentation, viewership is down on all sports that use it.
you forgot to mention that Boone is a realy POC and doesnt know the rules.
YES Network need better angles..Boone on pace with Hyde for the most ejections
Then, later on in the game, Larry Vanover got hit in the head by a ball being thrown in from Center field. He left the game
Now Boone can go to the locker room and study up on his baseball rules. Ole 1/10 Boone. This guy is a total joke at this point! And I will bet anything he doesn't acknowledge the fact that he once again screwed up after seeing Francona ask for them to hold on video as we see here.
Watch Jomboy's breakdown and listen to Francona himself. You're so wrong....
@@jeraldwilson8185 If you want to learn rules and procedures, avoid Jomboy. Watch CCS.
@@jeraldwilson8185 Jomboy is only for entertainment purposes, he's someone who knows very little about the rules otherwise you would have the insight to know that despite how messy and confusing the situation is, what happened regarding Umpires consulting then allowing a replay review is guess what? NOT covered by the MLB rules so what does that mean? It means that the Umpires have absolute and FINAL authority to decide on anything that's not covered by the rules, something you and your God; Jomboy would know if either of you actually cared enough to read the rules instead of just favoring their home teams.
Once the Guardians coach puts up his hand like that the 15 seconds should start. I don't know how you think this was properly handled? Refs screwed up on the initial calls then screwed up on handling it. I think they went out of their way to handle things the way they did to bail themselves out. The only saving grace is that they got the play on the field correctly but did not follow procedure at all in achieving that.
So how do they do things by the book but also have so many missteps along the way? 🤔
The missteps weren't the umpires. She's talking about the scoreboard operators.
@@vonskyme9133 yea I don’t think so cap’n
@@brandonmurphy4840 well, I got that from her own explicit response where she clarifies in the comments. What was your source?
The reason for these challenges is to make sure that they get the call right. I don't think that 15 seconds is enough time to challenge. I get where Boone is furious but at the end of the day they correct call was made
Books go study the rules of baseball big guy!
Oh Jesus Christ 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣 this ejection is hilarious 😂😂😂😂😂😂
Jesus Christ is not a swear phrase.
@@rayray4192 so? I like saying it!
I don't like where this is headed. A video replay review of the legality of the video replay review?
It’s stupid, 15 seconds is arbitrary. Why not just review all scoring plays?
My favorite part was when the Yankess broadcast came back in the _following inning_ and insisted "WE HAVE REPLAY OF IT AND TITO NEVER SIGNALLED." That was complete lie lol
Tito -- or is it Terry? -- signaled that he wanted his (the Guardians') replay guy to take a look. However, following that, the Guardians then have 15 seconds to actually call for the umpires -- or, I guess, the MLB people in New York -- to take an "official" look. There's no indication that Tito actually did that. That is, until several MINUTES later, when the umpires ASKED him if he wanted to request the replay challenge. That's clearly outside what's permitted by the new rule, or even the old (20-second) rule.
@@TruthSage1 Watch the YES broadcast. They don't even show him holding his hand up at all and insist that never happened at all. It was like watching a split screen of different events between Bally and YES. I get that the argument is that he has 15 seconds to make a final decision but they claimed he never made ANY gesture.
@Mike Glass the 15 seconds is paused when ump walks away because you can't challenge a call until it is official
@@TruthSage1 While he was deciding to challenge or not, the umpires decided to conference about it. Also both Terry (actual name) and TIto (nickname) are fine. Cherry Francona is also acceptable.
It's not a lie. The replay they had was from the YES network, not the Cleveland broadcast, so they didn't see Tito's signal. They were wrong but didn't lie.
This is a great lesson of why you gotta look at all broadcasts and angles in this sort of thing.
I don't care how long it takes but managers should all the time in the world to challenge a play. GET THE CALL RIGHT. Remember that poor pitcher who lost a perfect game because of Jim Joyce screwing up.
Jim Joyce was the best umpire in baseball as ranked by the players. Back then there was no way an umpire crew was going to get together on a simple call at first base. Jim said,” I kicked the shit out of the call.” He said it was the best experience he had in baseball because the pitcher has class, and a great attitude. Boone has no class.
I thought MLB was all about speeding things up now? 😂
Man relax!!!! Umpires actually did something right that people have been complaining months for with especially with blown calls
Well the Yankees won the game, I think Boone will get over it pretty quickly haha
Boone wanted to win by cheating. He’s disgusting
@@rayray4192 Boone may be clueless, but to say he cheated here is a stretch.
@@priceright8963 you could be right. He has video. Didn’t he know his centerfielder didn’t catch the fly ball?
@@rayray4192 what did Boone do to cheat? I must have missed that part. Did you watch another feed?
So Francona’s “hold” hand signal was both timely and the correct signal to indicate a challenge?
This is what is missed by many reviewing this that I have seen today.
Yes because if the umpires changed the call after the conference would be no need to review it but Franconia did hold up his hold sign b4 15 seconds we're up
@@coltsjason Yankee fans disagree.
No, absolutely not. This video is not correct.
@@coltsjason the hold sign has no impact on the the 15 second clock, lol
Aaron boone, proof knowing 10% of the rules and you can still manage a big league club.
Franconia doesn't challenge, the umpires don't get together and then ask Francona would u like to challenge the play?
What you mean they don't get together its obvious that they did to make sure the call was correct on the field
Boone...wrong again.
Life ling Yankee fan here. I think I was more pissed off than Boone was. Love your videos but… Your timing on the actions are off.
Aaron Boone recently scored 1-out-of-10 in a MLB True/False rules quiz. Looks like he doesn't understand yet another rule.
Optics.
But more than 15 seconds pass before the umpires get together. The umps gave extra time because they allowed a challenge after.
Would you have allowed Boone to challenge if the decision was changed? If so, why would tgat be different?
@@vonskyme9133 I would have only allowed either team to challenge if a change was made or if they made any signal of call afterwards. For instance, if they said the run didn't score. I wouldn't have allowed Boone to challenge either if he saw something after the umps got together.
The reason why it's different is because a decision is being made if something different is called. 15 seconds goes by and neither team wants to challenge is signaling that they are both happy with the call or at least haven't seen enough to challenge. If a change is made afterwards, you need to allow the teams to say they don't agree again.
Same concept happens if you flipped it. Say a team called for a challenge, but then the umps changed a call. The team should be allowed to say they no longer want to challenge because they agree with the last call.
@@NYCFenrir the result there is that you are saying that, had they changed their mind, Boone had 2 more minutes to check. I guarantee he would not have waited until the huddle to start looking. That means the rules now have an in-built unfairness, in which any umpire considering correcting themselves has given one side an advantage over the other. You either give the additional time to both, or to neither... based on the huddle, not the decision that was initially or finally made.
Edit: there is an alternative - get commitments for the likely outcomes from both sides before any conference. Personally I think that's too unwieldy, but it's the 'fair' way to allow a conference to change a call but stick to the time limit.
Personally, I like the interpretation used here (neglecting the potential 'umpires huddled because they saw it' which I'll admit is quite probably the case). As long as its consistently applied.
@@vonskyme9133 I am saying it's based off the last time a call was made. In this case neither team wanted to challenge and then after 15 seconds, the huddle happened. No change happened and therefore neither team should be able to challenge since they had their chance already. A chance should only be given if a new call happens or if the umps huddle before giving both teams enough time to challenge.
@@NYCFenrir if they change the call then New York would have had 2 extra minutes, having been distinctly advantaged by the initial call going against them, a situation where the rules have allowed one side additional time than the other after the play, simply because the call was changed (not the play itself). If the call is under enough debate for the umpires to consult on it, then it should be the same for both sides, in my opinion.
Boone the Goon is how he comes out looking in 95% of these arguements/ejections.
Who won???
@@bruceterhune3400 Not Boone. He lost the argument because he didn't know the rule....again. He's earned the nickname 10% Boone.
No that’s confusing play by umpire not careful
He still took longer than 15 seconds. Plus they saw the replay on the big screen.
Who did?
This might be a loophole, because you can hold the challenge clock watch the replay and then make the decision to challenge or not to challenge. They shouldn't show the replay till the challenge is made.
TV's and DVRs exist, so there's no point to such a rule. Teams will just have an intern watch the broadcast and tell the managers when to challenge.
That’s what most teams do. You see them on the phone and they tell the manager to challenge or not.
It's not a loophole its just the rule
They shouldn't stop the mangers' challenge clock just because the umpires are huddling.
@@TruthSage1 There's a lot to hash out for the on-field call. Catch or no catch first: if the covering umpire isn't 100% on the catch, are any of his partners 100% certain that they have a view of a no-catch? If so, and if they reverse their own call, where should they place runners? Next comes the live-ball appeal and the time play of the run scoring or not: do they rule that the run scored on the play or not? The crew decided to stick with the (incorrect) initial call of a catch and the (correct) call that the runner did not touch the plate before the live-ball appeal of a base left too soon at 2B.
The umpire conference is where the actual "call on the field" is decided. Only when the crew conference ends has the final call be decided, and the time allotted to challenge a play begins to tick. Tito's challenge was timely.
Flipping the situation around makes it crystal clear why the time allowed to challenge a call does not begin until the final call is made after the crew gets together. What if they did reverse the call? Does NY not get to challenge because they didn't know the call went against them until 2 minutes after the play? That would be ridiculous.
Lol, such a horrible take. Home field advantage is the only reason this played out how it did. Good job noting the replay board but that's literally what put the thought in this crew's head to conference. Challenge within 15seconds and play by the rules
Really, if they saw it on the board, wouldn't they have gotten it right?
The Umpires should have waited 15 seconds before initiating their conference to let the Guardian's Challange Clear. That would allow that part of the process to be set and the Umpires could meet. This whole debacle would have been avoided.
@@brandon737 You def want the officials to get the call correct however in this instance you can't allow one manager to have an additional 2 minutes (in this case) to review the play. Pause the balance of the 15 sec before the meeting ... that's nothing. It turned out to be obvious but if it weren't the extra time would have been even more advantageous to one side versus the other.
@@brandon737 yeah I actually gotta take the umps side they handle this right 👍
How about this? Even though Hicks dropped the ball, we'll still give the Yankees the inning ending double play. However, starting tomorrow, there's a reasonable salary cap so the Yankees don't get to buy a winner every season. Have fun losing half your team (you can keep Hicks).
Everything about Boone is irritating. It takes a lot of patience from these umpires to not eject him sooner than they do.
Thanks for the video. It was hard to believe that Francona didn’t want to challenge that in time. New York spun their crooked narrative.
They only have fifteen seconds, there is no time for thinking.
They were still well within before the the umpires decided to meet, which effectively resets the clock. Nice try though.
@@KWally if the game was in new York they wouldn't have huddled together. Nice try though.
@@felixrojas2575 and if they were playing cricket then the glove would make it illegal.
They weren't, and the umpires did huddle. That's what matters.
Great, since the Yankees broadcast made an error, now Yankees fans think they got screwed when it reality it was the right call
I thought it was the right call
Michael Kay looking stupid lol
My impression of every CloseCall Sports video "THE-UMPIRES-ARE-ALWAYS-RIGHT"
You must not watch CCS often. They often point out mistakes by umpires.
If you want to be entertained, go watch Jomboy. If you want to learn the rules and procedures, watch CCS.